Pages: 1 [2] 3 4 :: one page |
|
Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 3 post(s) |
Iron Wolf Saber
Den of Swords
17028
|
Posted - 2014.10.03 02:10:00 -
[31] - Quote
Leanna I challenge you to provide proof then :D
CPM 1
Omni-Soldier, Forum Warrior
\\= Prototype Assault Rifles =// Unlocked
|
Leanna Boghin
Paradox Pride
473
|
Posted - 2014.10.03 02:12:00 -
[32] - Quote
Iron Wolf Saber wrote:Leanna I challenge you to provide proof then :D I already have in previous statements. Just read anything in this thread i typed about the subject and you will see the proof right before your very eyes. Not only that but like i said before gaming is a business. And like all businesses they are about making money. That in itself is proof enough.
I snipe in the redline because i know it pisses you off
|
Leanna Boghin
Paradox Pride
473
|
Posted - 2014.10.03 02:14:00 -
[33] - Quote
Logical Logi wrote:CCP Rattati wrote:Thank you for the feedback and since most of your points were non-ranty and written with good intentions, I can address most of them. That is not to say I agree with them, but I will explain why. 1) Statistics - You claim that we are just using usage data to warrant the change to the bolt pistol and I really don't like when people claim something without data to back it up. I have explained before that we use multiple methods, including Kills per Spawn per Weapon (per dropsuit), basically K/D per weapon. Where is your statement coming from, where are the facts? The CPM could tell you that we worked together on a detailed spreadsheet with all the sidearms, Zatara took lead on this one as the others had taken leads on different aspects of Delta. Together we collected community feedback, data and the CPM experience to rank all the sidearms into categories of needs buff/nerf, methods to do so and reasoning. 2) The final method of balancing the sidearms was also very clear, we established the weapon everyone knew, the SMG as the cornerstone of sidearms and created a range vs dps, and comparable dmg/clip and clips/ammo ratios based completely around the SMG. We did not nerf it even though it was the most used weapon, but based the whole strategy around getting all the sidearms to a similar efficiency, meaning most got buffed (a lot) and a few got nerfed slightly. By changing these efficiencies, we may later see that the usage goes up, but usage is only an indicator of UP/OP. 3) Just the fact that we immediately tweaked Hotfix Delta with a balancing hotfix a week later, should speak for itself. Our data showed that the BP was OP, so we reduced ROF and if that isn't enough, we will keep working on it. 4) Please send me data on broken Teambuilding to [email protected]. I have yet to see a concrete example of unwarranted 2 stacked squads on one side and newberries on the other, and my inbox is full of screenshots from players. Yes, stomps happen, but they happen everywhere, even in the EPL, NBA and the NFL. When a 6 man squad from the best PC corp hits its stride, very few aside from a similar squad will stand a chance. Other than that, I don't get your point about Teambuilding, are you against having more even teams or? You can go play FW if you want to to try your luck, that feature doesn't use the new Teambuilder. 5) To whomever said it, good luck on manipulating the Mu and have lots of fun AFKing to do so. To me, even contemplating it is unfathomable. 6) New Player experience, in the four hotfixes we haven't ben able to change the "early mission system", but we have granted better starter fits, created tons of militia weapons," assisted" with skill selection (in fact gave 3 times more ISK than before through Skillbooks), and made the Academy a more "fun" place, so extending it (twice, from 2400 to 5000 in Delta) has been done slowly and purposefully. Retention has never been higher than it is now. Consistently getting a 1000 WP per battle, means you completely get the game, fitting and progression. 7) Assault Rifles, again, are you referencing old ways, we can't change that, only how we work now. I think the 3 Tuning Rifles threads demonstrate that we are doing things differently. Again, the claim that we are using usage data or forum QQ to balance which is plainly not true. 8) V/AV, this is a longer standing issue. Let's just work together to make it fun for everyone. On your final assessment, I cannot agree with you more. DUST 514 is my favorite game and it keeps getting better. Thanks again for the feedback! I may have cried once or twice when Delta dropped but then I looked in the eyes of the CPM and the AV community and said "You may have won Delta, but when Echo comes CCP will follow the normal pattern of making Vehicles so OP". Although maybe after a couple Hotfixes they will destroy the Incubus, Python, Madrugar, Gunnlogi, Methana, Saga, Saga || and promise to remake them more balanced than ever. Then quit updating the game... Lol they do so love that pattern dont they.
I snipe in the redline because i know it pisses you off
|
Soraya Xel
Abandoned Privilege Top Men.
3907
|
Posted - 2014.10.03 02:19:00 -
[34] - Quote
Leanna Boghin wrote:Soraya Xel wrote:Leanna Boghin wrote:Soraya Xel wrote:Leanna Boghin wrote:The nerfs and buffs in this game arent just about "balancing" even though thats the only reason CCP will give anyone for nerfing and buffing weapons the way they do. They actually have an agenda (which i cant really blame them) See they sell weapons and gear in the market for Aurum and when a certain weapon isnt getting much use but they want to make money off of it they buff the weapon in such a way as to make it more powerful sothat more and more people will want to use it. This is complete and utter bull. Period. Please pick up your complimentary tin foil hat from CEOPyrex. He has many. Actually its not bull and it isnt a conspiracy its just simple business. And if i ran a game I would do the same thing they are doing. I dont blame them but it is sad to see thats how the gaming industry has moved since the days of mario and zelda. You can kiss the butts of every CCP employee all you want it wont change the fact that this is how gaming industry is in this day and age. And most people like yourself want to believe that the gaming companies actually want more than money but money is really the only thing that drives a game company anymore. Believe me if there wasnt money in gaming there would be no games. So yeah call it bullshit or a conspiracy all you want its simple business tactics and thats just how they do things. They also wont ever admit to it because of the bad PR they would gain. And CCP has enough bad PR circling the gaming community as it is to want to collect anymore. Yeah, your level of tin foil is really up there. Money has nothing to do with the balance changes, except perhaps that a better game generally makes more money. If you are going to comment and make wild accussations claiming that im some conspiracy theorist then how about you offer a reason as to why its bullshit of what im saying rather than being rude. Oh thats right because you dont have a reason -_- seriously until you can offer a reason as to why im sooo wrong your insults go on deaf ears (or eyes in this case)
I'm the one making "wild accusations"? Read your own posts. o_O
CPM1 Elect. Thanks for all your support. [email protected] for ideas, thoughts, and feedback.
|
Iron Wolf Saber
Den of Swords
17029
|
Posted - 2014.10.03 02:20:00 -
[35] - Quote
Leanna Boghin wrote:Iron Wolf Saber wrote:Leanna I challenge you to provide proof then :D I already have in previous statements. Just read anything in this thread i typed about the subject and you will see the proof right before your very eyes. Not only that but like i said before gaming is a business. And like all businesses they are about making money. That in itself is proof enough.
That's not proof.
That's Editorial.
CPM 1
Omni-Soldier, Forum Warrior
\\= Prototype Assault Rifles =// Unlocked
|
Xocoyol Zaraoul
Superior Genetics
2494
|
Posted - 2014.10.03 02:24:00 -
[36] - Quote
CCP Rattati wrote: ... FW ... doesn't use the new Teambuilder.
How unfortunate, though I understand why...
"You see those red dots over there?
Go and shoot them until you see a +50 on the screen" - Arkena Wyrnspire
|
Leanna Boghin
Paradox Pride
474
|
Posted - 2014.10.03 02:33:00 -
[37] - Quote
Iron Wolf Saber wrote:Leanna Boghin wrote:Iron Wolf Saber wrote:Leanna I challenge you to provide proof then :D I already have in previous statements. Just read anything in this thread i typed about the subject and you will see the proof right before your very eyes. Not only that but like i said before gaming is a business. And like all businesses they are about making money. That in itself is proof enough. That's not proof. That's Editorial. No its simple logic and common sense something people like you these days seem to be lacking. Its simple business tactics nothing more yet you all have your head so far up CCP's butt that you cant see the truth behind my words. Its fine though keep smelling those "roses" eventually the truth will bite you in the butt later on and you will be wishing i hadnt been right.
I snipe in the redline because i know it pisses you off
|
Second Cerberus
Tested In Production
145
|
Posted - 2014.10.03 02:43:00 -
[38] - Quote
Iron Wolf Saber wrote:Leanna Boghin wrote:Iron Wolf Saber wrote:Leanna I challenge you to provide proof then :D I already have in previous statements. Just read anything in this thread i typed about the subject and you will see the proof right before your very eyes. Not only that but like i said before gaming is a business. And like all businesses they are about making money. That in itself is proof enough. That's not proof. That's Editorial.
IWS, didn't you read?
Gaming = A business
All businesses are about making money
CCP is a business
= CCP is about making money
Therefore, CCP buffs weapons that you can buy with ISK to sell more AUR....
Um... never mind
"I don't always test my code, but when I do, I do it in production." - CCP
|
Vell0cet
Vengeance Unbound Dark Taboo
2324
|
Posted - 2014.10.03 02:56:00 -
[39] - Quote
Leanna Boghin wrote:Iron Wolf Saber wrote:Leanna Boghin wrote:Iron Wolf Saber wrote:Leanna I challenge you to provide proof then :D I already have in previous statements. Just read anything in this thread i typed about the subject and you will see the proof right before your very eyes. Not only that but like i said before gaming is a business. And like all businesses they are about making money. That in itself is proof enough. That's not proof. That's Editorial. No its simple logic and common sense something people like you these days seem to be lacking. Its simple business tactics nothing more yet you all have your head so far up CCP's butt that you cant see the truth behind my words. Its fine though keep smelling those "roses" eventually the truth will bite you in the butt later on and you will be wishing i hadnt been right. I completely agree that CCP is motivated by money. What you fail to grasp is that the amount of money they could generate by deliberately making things OP/UP is so insanely small than compared to building a balanced shooter that retains players and grows. The financial incentives are all aligned with making an awesome game that builds a huge following, not milking the tiny player base that currently exists for a little cash by deliberately messing with balance.
Best PvE idea ever!
|
Iron Wolf Saber
Den of Swords
17031
|
Posted - 2014.10.03 03:02:00 -
[40] - Quote
Second Cerberus wrote:Iron Wolf Saber wrote:Leanna Boghin wrote:Iron Wolf Saber wrote:Leanna I challenge you to provide proof then :D I already have in previous statements. Just read anything in this thread i typed about the subject and you will see the proof right before your very eyes. Not only that but like i said before gaming is a business. And like all businesses they are about making money. That in itself is proof enough. That's not proof. That's Editorial. IWS, didn't you read? Gaming = A business All businesses are about making money CCP is a business = CCP is about making money Therefore, CCP buffs weapons that you can buy with ISK to sell more AUR.... Um... never mind
Still an Editorial.
Negative Consumer Environment is a strategic plan that should be avoided at all costs. The long term effects implicitly impacts any future product or growth. The irrepressible offerings while seemingly good for sales those sales in the short run quickly dry up and ultimately drive away content providers. Target demographics are then out of disposable income while losing interest in other content providers or the lack there of because of the things the consumer bought drove them away. The volunteer content providers needs to have assurances their efforts are highly valued as any other customer by making sure their contributions are justly rewarded with a fair and varied stimulation. With content providers coming in all shapes forms and difficulties while the while potential target groups may be inclined to try to gain advantages. Disposable income is then metered in at an acceptable rates and is then seen and shown off in the field. This many even outside demographics to partake in the revenue streams as well resulting in a more positive consumer environment leading to more growth and loyalty of the product consumers and ultimately the product itself.
See? An Editorial.
CPM 1
Omni-Soldier, Forum Warrior
\\= Prototype Assault Rifles =// Unlocked
|
|
Leanna Boghin
Paradox Pride
475
|
Posted - 2014.10.03 03:02:00 -
[41] - Quote
Vell0cet wrote:Leanna Boghin wrote:Iron Wolf Saber wrote:Leanna Boghin wrote:Iron Wolf Saber wrote:Leanna I challenge you to provide proof then :D I already have in previous statements. Just read anything in this thread i typed about the subject and you will see the proof right before your very eyes. Not only that but like i said before gaming is a business. And like all businesses they are about making money. That in itself is proof enough. That's not proof. That's Editorial. No its simple logic and common sense something people like you these days seem to be lacking. Its simple business tactics nothing more yet you all have your head so far up CCP's butt that you cant see the truth behind my words. Its fine though keep smelling those "roses" eventually the truth will bite you in the butt later on and you will be wishing i hadnt been right. I completely agree that CCP is motivated by money. What you fail to grasp is that the amount of money they could generate by deliberately making things OP/UP is so insanely small than compared to building a balanced shooter that retains players and grows. The financial incentives are all aligned with making an awesome game that builds a huge following, not milking the tiny player base that currently exists for a little cash by deliberately messing with balance. I also stated the reason for the OP/UP issue that people seemed to overlook and that is beta testing for the Legion game they have been working on. And i will leave this discussion at that. No point in beating a dead horse people will either agree with me or they wont doesnt matter either way. At least when the truth comes out i wont be surprised or disappointed. Yeah i know im such a cynic but at least im honest about it.
I snipe in the redline because i know it pisses you off
|
Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p
Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance
2436
|
Posted - 2014.10.03 03:18:00 -
[42] - Quote
Leanna Boghin wrote:Iron Wolf Saber wrote:Leanna I challenge you to provide proof then :D I already have in previous statements. Just read anything in this thread i typed about the subject and you will see the proof right before your very eyes. Not only that but like i said before gaming is a business. And like all businesses they are about making money. That in itself is proof enough. So basically your "proof" is composed solely of vague, anecdotal statements?
While I think we all know that CCP, like every other company in the world, has net profits as the huber one thing in mind, I don't believe that they are balancing the game to get aurum sales by people chasing the FoTM.
Lets examine this from an unbiased, objective standpoint.
The total number of active players in Dust is about 10-20k.
Of those, I think its safe to say that 20% have actually spent money, so 2k-4k people.
Of those 2k-4k people, about 30% (give or take) would have regularly invested money in this game before legion, giving us 600-1.2k.
Legion affected players who would regularly spend money the most, and I think that its safe to say that >80% of them quit their regular spending following the announcement. This leaves us with, at most, 120-240 players left that would regularly pay money for the game. This seems a little high, but well work with it.
The game gets hot fixed every month, which means these people will pay once per month.
I will assume the average arum sale is 20$/person.
So, this gives use 2400-4800$ per month generated by CCP trying to balance their game. For a corporation, that is pocket change.
The real reason that CCP is balancing the game is so that they can get it right for Legion which will, in theory, provide exponentially more money for them than this game could.
If you have a problem with my numbers, feel free to post your own math on this issue.
"Minmitar Scout" and "Masochist" are synonyms.
FA's Shotgunning T-Dome Champ
Give the Minja active dampening!--By Bor
|
Second Cerberus
Tested In Production
146
|
Posted - 2014.10.03 03:59:00 -
[43] - Quote
Iron Wolf Saber wrote:Second Cerberus wrote:Iron Wolf Saber wrote:Leanna Boghin wrote:Iron Wolf Saber wrote:Leanna I challenge you to provide proof then :D I already have in previous statements. Just read anything in this thread i typed about the subject and you will see the proof right before your very eyes. Not only that but like i said before gaming is a business. And like all businesses they are about making money. That in itself is proof enough. That's not proof. That's Editorial. IWS, didn't you read? Gaming = A business All businesses are about making money CCP is a business = CCP is about making money Therefore, CCP buffs weapons that you can buy with ISK to sell more AUR.... Um... never mind Still an Editorial. Negative Consumer Environment is a strategic plan that should be avoided at all costs. The long term effects implicitly impacts any future product or growth. The irrepressible offerings while seemingly good for sales those sales in the short run quickly dry up and ultimately drive away content providers. Target demographics are then out of disposable income while losing interest in other content providers or the lack there of because of the things the consumer bought drove them away. The volunteer content providers needs to have assurances their efforts are highly valued as any other customer by making sure their contributions are justly rewarded with a fair and varied stimulation. With content providers coming in all shapes forms and difficulties while the while potential target groups may be inclined to try to gain advantages. Disposable income is then metered in at an acceptable rates and is then seen and shown off in the field. This many even outside demographics to partake in the revenue streams as well resulting in a more positive consumer environment leading to more growth and loyalty of the product consumers and ultimately the product itself. See? An Editorial.
You do know I was agreeing with you, right?
"I don't always test my code, but when I do, I do it in production." - CCP
|
CLONE ALPHA 001
Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance
36
|
Posted - 2014.10.03 04:29:00 -
[44] - Quote
im just gonna leave this here http://themittani.com/news/ccp-reveals-mediocre-2014-financials-layoffs |
Avinash Decker
Seykal Expeditionary Group Minmatar Republic
141
|
Posted - 2014.10.03 05:18:00 -
[45] - Quote
Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p wrote:Leanna Boghin wrote:Iron Wolf Saber wrote:Leanna I challenge you to provide proof then :D I already have in previous statements. Just read anything in this thread i typed about the subject and you will see the proof right before your very eyes. Not only that but like i said before gaming is a business. And like all businesses they are about making money. That in itself is proof enough. So basically your "proof" is composed solely of vague, anecdotal statements? While I think we all know that CCP, like every other company in the world, has net profits as the huber one thing in mind, I don't believe that they are balancing the game to get aurum sales by people chasing the FoTM. Lets examine this from an unbiased, objective standpoint. The total number of active players in Dust is about 10-20k. Of those, I think its safe to say that 20% have actually spent money, so 2k-4k people. Of those 2k-4k people, about 30% (give or take) would have regularly invested money in this game before legion, giving us 600-1.2k. Legion affected players who would regularly spend money the most, and I think that its safe to say that >80% of them quit their regular spending following the announcement. This leaves us with, at most, 120-240 players left that would regularly pay money for the game. This seems a little high, but well work with it. The game gets hot fixed every month, which means these people will pay once per month. I will assume the average arum sale is 20$/person. So, this gives use 2400-4800$ per month generated by CCP trying to balance their game. For a corporation, that is pocket change. The real reason that CCP is balancing the game is so that they can get it right for Legion which will, in theory, provide exponentially more money for them than this game could. If you have a problem with my numbers, feel free to post your own math on this issue.
There's less than 3k or 2,500-3k players playing last week and this week so the number that actually pay using your example is lower . Unless you meant unique players or was giving an example. To me they aren't doing this for legion mostly , they are doing it because they are trying to get some favor-ability back and keep the game running until further notice. Legion is an unknown product that will most likely play different from Dust all together. Lastly, we don't even know that the Dust devs and the Legion devs collaborate at all like that. |
Sgt Kirk
Fatal Absolution
7740
|
Posted - 2014.10.03 05:19:00 -
[46] - Quote
*walks back into thread*
*Leaves thread*
Something's wrong when you regret
Things that haven't happened yet
|
Michael Arck
5839
|
Posted - 2014.10.03 05:34:00 -
[47] - Quote
Well that was some thorough answers. Let's not undo the thread people.
Archistrategos / The 7th Prime / Selah
*Where the fear has gone there will be nothing....only I will remain
|
Arkena Wyrnspire
Fatal Absolution
17981
|
Posted - 2014.10.03 06:03:00 -
[48] - Quote
Soraya Xel wrote:So are you suggesting that a modifier should rank the Mu of squads higher then? Because Sgt Kirk's post above made me think he was unhappy his squad was being teamed up with newberries. Which would happen even more if having a full squad raised your Mu higher.
Maybe you are both on completely different sides of the debate, or I don't understand one of you. Please clarify.
No, he was unhappy his squad was being teamed up with newberries against two squads. The point was that squads > all - even if you have a good squad, if the rest of your team are complete terribads and the enemy team has an extra squad, the extra squad is going to make a huge difference.
Sgt Kirk wrote: Rattati it should never be "intended" that players squad up with each other only to see two squads on the other team and get wrecked because their friendlies are fresh out the Academy just for the sake of "equalizing Mu" numbers. This is not balanced, this is not fair to your players, this is not logical. Anyone who plays this game for long knows that squads are what win battles not individuals. It doesn't matter if you have an A-team squad with the best DUSTers if the enemy team has two decent squads that communicate with each other.
Even if you have an excellent squad, if the enemy have twice as many squads they are going to have the advantage. One effect I've also noticed personally is that even if I squad with just two or three of my friends on a similar skill level to me, a lot of matches end up with us being the only squad on the team against a double full squad on the other team. Yes, I have a shiny KDR. No, I simply will not win a match if I and two others with a similar KDR are put against two solid squads.
This is why I feel that mu score is too inflated for individuals rather than squads.
The forums have ruined me.
|
|
CCP Rattati
C C P C C P Alliance
8404
|
Posted - 2014.10.03 06:49:00 -
[49] - Quote
Arkena Wyrnspire wrote:Soraya Xel wrote:So are you suggesting that a modifier should rank the Mu of squads higher then? Because Sgt Kirk's post above made me think he was unhappy his squad was being teamed up with newberries. Which would happen even more if having a full squad raised your Mu higher.
Maybe you are both on completely different sides of the debate, or I don't understand one of you. Please clarify. No, he was unhappy his squad was being teamed up with newberries against two squads. The point was that squads > all - even if you have a good squad, if the rest of your team are complete terribads and the enemy team has an extra squad, the extra squad is going to make a huge difference. Sgt Kirk wrote: Rattati it should never be "intended" that players squad up with each other only to see two squads on the other team and get wrecked because their friendlies are fresh out the Academy just for the sake of "equalizing Mu" numbers. This is not balanced, this is not fair to your players, this is not logical. Anyone who plays this game for long knows that squads are what win battles not individuals. It doesn't matter if you have an A-team squad with the best DUSTers if the enemy team has two decent squads that communicate with each other.
Even if you have an excellent squad, if the enemy have twice as many squads they are going to have the advantage. One effect I've also noticed personally is that even if I squad with just two or three of my friends on a similar skill level to me, a lot of matches end up with us being the only squad on the team against a double full squad on the other team. Yes, I have a shiny KDR. No, I simply will not win a match if I and two others with a similar KDR are put against two solid squads. This is why I feel that mu score is too inflated for individuals rather than squads.
FA squad Normal Squad Normal Squad Solo Veterans Solo New Players
If this is the hand that is dealt to the Teambuilder, what else can we do but pit the FA squad against the other two? The FA squad will probably get the best solo player, and so on and so forth.
What is a better solution in this situation? Certainly not FA squad plus second Normal Squad.
"As well as stupid, Rattati is incredibly slow and accident-prone, and cannot even swim"
|
|
|
CCP Rattati
C C P C C P Alliance
8404
|
Posted - 2014.10.03 06:51:00 -
[50] - Quote
Sgt Kirk wrote:*walks back into thread*
*Leaves thread*
Not even a reply
"As well as stupid, Rattati is incredibly slow and accident-prone, and cannot even swim"
|
|
|
Michael Arck
5841
|
Posted - 2014.10.03 07:40:00 -
[51] - Quote
Such a pity. Are people really trying to find solutions or are they just arguing just to argue, because they have nothing else to offer?
That's a damn shame, really.
Archistrategos / The 7th Prime / Selah
*Where the fear has gone there will be nothing....only I will remain
|
Spankdamonke
Dapper Gentlemen Corporation
13
|
Posted - 2014.10.03 07:55:00 -
[52] - Quote
CCP Rattati wrote:Arkena Wyrnspire wrote:Soraya Xel wrote:So are you suggesting that a modifier should rank the Mu of squads higher then? Because Sgt Kirk's post above made me think he was unhappy his squad was being teamed up with newberries. Which would happen even more if having a full squad raised your Mu higher.
Maybe you are both on completely different sides of the debate, or I don't understand one of you. Please clarify. No, he was unhappy his squad was being teamed up with newberries against two squads. The point was that squads > all - even if you have a good squad, if the rest of your team are complete terribads and the enemy team has an extra squad, the extra squad is going to make a huge difference. Sgt Kirk wrote: Rattati it should never be "intended" that players squad up with each other only to see two squads on the other team and get wrecked because their friendlies are fresh out the Academy just for the sake of "equalizing Mu" numbers. This is not balanced, this is not fair to your players, this is not logical. Anyone who plays this game for long knows that squads are what win battles not individuals. It doesn't matter if you have an A-team squad with the best DUSTers if the enemy team has two decent squads that communicate with each other.
Even if you have an excellent squad, if the enemy have twice as many squads they are going to have the advantage. One effect I've also noticed personally is that even if I squad with just two or three of my friends on a similar skill level to me, a lot of matches end up with us being the only squad on the team against a double full squad on the other team. Yes, I have a shiny KDR. No, I simply will not win a match if I and two others with a similar KDR are put against two solid squads. This is why I feel that mu score is too inflated for individuals rather than squads. FA squad Normal Squad Normal Squad Solo Veterans Solo New Players If this is the hand that is dealt to the Teambuilder, what else can we do but pit the FA squad against the other two? The FA squad will probably get the best solo player, and so on and so forth. What is a better solution in this situation? Certainly not FA squad plus second Normal Squad.
Are there no other preemptive measures which can be taken by the teambuilder to assess whether "balance" could reasonably be achieved with the queue of players it was dealt?
For example, in the scenario you listed; If a FA squad was up against 2 other "normal squads" with nothing but lower end or (god forbid) academy fresh blueberries to fill in gaps, the imbalance is clear. Could the system reference a battle's current queue against other players that are waiting in line for a battle, to see if they would better suit the Mu balance? If imbalance is seen, Scotty can perform an additional check or 2 to help even things out. Wait times may be increased some, but it may go a good distance toward the goal of securing a true and even Tug-of-war for victory in any given fight.
The force multiplication of a good squad (specifically how well they communicate) truly can not be totally accounted for, I understand that. But for a mostly Solo player like myself...I can assure you that I am being RAILED by matchmaking pretty regularly.
Where should I send those Screenshots again?
|
Pseudogenesis
Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
698
|
Posted - 2014.10.03 08:01:00 -
[53] - Quote
ITT: Conspiracy theorists who don't understand basic economics
Stabby-stabber extraordinaire
I stabbed Rattati once, you know.
|
Michael Arck
5841
|
Posted - 2014.10.03 08:05:00 -
[54] - Quote
I think its pretty simple, with the current playerbase. It's not grade A infallible, but its a system in a place designed to better the battles. Yet all I see is "that's not good enough". In fact, I've seen alot of that from forum members with whatever they implement according to what is desired by the community.
The bottom line is this community often shorts itself.
Here's the deal, you want better battles, then you need better players who are not selfish and work as a team. What else can they do? They are working with the best they have and some of you guys just say, "it's not good enough".
And its not like this is last year where uneven teams were common occurrences.
I love this game but sometimes this community makes it harder to appreciate Dust because some of you guys just can NEVER be satisfied.
It's tiresome.
Archistrategos / The 7th Prime / Selah
*Where the fear has gone there will be nothing....only I will remain
|
CommanderBolt
KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION
1860
|
Posted - 2014.10.03 08:25:00 -
[55] - Quote
I really feel like saying, this is how it has been for us solo players since.... forever. We have learnt to adapt, use cheap stuff, accept that your team is pants and just enjoy the game and have what ever fun there is to be had.
The thing is if good squads are being put up against more noobie squads, is this not the most balanced outcome?
Short of a solo only mode I fail to see how we can get this any more balanced.
And for the record, I have noticed a lot more balanced games recently but yes I still have been finding battles where my team of randoms gets put up against 2 or more proto squads. I need to start taking pics of the end of battle screen.
"Also I think knives are a good idea, big f**k-off shiny ones"
"Guns for show, Knives for a pro"
MY LIFE FOR AIUR!
|
Breakin Stuff
Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group
3356
|
Posted - 2014.10.03 10:00:00 -
[56] - Quote
CCP Rattati wrote:Sgt Kirk wrote:*walks back into thread*
*Leaves thread* Not even a reply Probably the best response.
The tinfoil is strong here because people seem to be under the delusion that "because I said so" constitutes evidence without a need for numbers or cited sources.
There also seems to be vast swathes of ignorance about "trade secrets," NDAs, and the boss simply saying "no, don't share that up."
Here's the thing nerds. If Rattati hands out his data metrics snd explains exactly how he reviews these metrics, you jerks will manipulate the data provided in game to get things you dislike nerfed, and things you use buffed.
It's called information manipulation, and CCP has learned precisely NOT to do this because of EVE players. You haven't played until you have witnessed someone artificially inflating market values of useless mods to inflate LP payouts and make literal BILLIONS in minutes.
There are also worse examples.
Trying to force the devs to supply you their secrets is disingenuous and will allow you to manipulate the metagame to your own benefit at great cost to the other players.
No I do not believe you wouldn't. If you say you would not I will automatically believe you to be lying. Human behavior makes me far too cynical to believe otherwise. |
BL4CKST4R
La Muerte Eterna Dark Taboo
3185
|
Posted - 2014.10.03 10:25:00 -
[57] - Quote
CCP Rattati wrote:Arkena Wyrnspire wrote:Soraya Xel wrote:So are you suggesting that a modifier should rank the Mu of squads higher then? Because Sgt Kirk's post above made me think he was unhappy his squad was being teamed up with newberries. Which would happen even more if having a full squad raised your Mu higher.
Maybe you are both on completely different sides of the debate, or I don't understand one of you. Please clarify. No, he was unhappy his squad was being teamed up with newberries against two squads. The point was that squads > all - even if you have a good squad, if the rest of your team are complete terribads and the enemy team has an extra squad, the extra squad is going to make a huge difference. Sgt Kirk wrote: Rattati it should never be "intended" that players squad up with each other only to see two squads on the other team and get wrecked because their friendlies are fresh out the Academy just for the sake of "equalizing Mu" numbers. This is not balanced, this is not fair to your players, this is not logical. Anyone who plays this game for long knows that squads are what win battles not individuals. It doesn't matter if you have an A-team squad with the best DUSTers if the enemy team has two decent squads that communicate with each other.
Even if you have an excellent squad, if the enemy have twice as many squads they are going to have the advantage. One effect I've also noticed personally is that even if I squad with just two or three of my friends on a similar skill level to me, a lot of matches end up with us being the only squad on the team against a double full squad on the other team. Yes, I have a shiny KDR. No, I simply will not win a match if I and two others with a similar KDR are put against two solid squads. This is why I feel that mu score is too inflated for individuals rather than squads. FA squad Normal Squad Normal Squad Solo Veterans Solo New Players If this is the hand that is dealt to the Teambuilder, what else can we do but pit the FA squad against the other two? The FA squad will probably get the best solo player, and so on and so forth. What is a better solution in this situation? Certainly not FA squad plus second Normal Squad.
Just gonna drop my 2 here.
If Mu sorts out squad by an average of the "stats" of that squad why not add a multiplier to that number, for example if mu is blah, give it a 2.2x multiplier (0.2x increase per member).
it is to my assumption Mu doesn't put extra weight on the size of a squad, because this I assume that Mu will probably also match the Mu of both teams regardless of squad. Another thing is that without putting heavier weight on being in a squad you can have one really good player, 5 mediocre to good players and be put in a lowberry match because of the relatively low score, stomping time.
Or maybe it could be possible to create a tag that Mu will always match the amount of squads in a match, so squads will always be even on both sides by player number.
supercalifragilisticexpialidocious
|
501st Headstrong
G0DS AM0NG MEN General Tso's Alliance
631
|
Posted - 2014.10.03 10:50:00 -
[58] - Quote
Fights are a lot harder now...I like that :)
CEO of GODS AMONG MEN/ Code name: Kronos
Friendships are forged by war, enemies by peace
Stars Wars Fan4ever, BFront3
|
KEROSIINI-TERO
The Rainbow Effect
1325
|
Posted - 2014.10.03 11:17:00 -
[59] - Quote
Sgt Kirk wrote: . .
OP POSTS . .
A very good description on what has happened and why those things went wrong. A few inaccuracies though, and one statement based on a guess.
But, good stuff.
People would enjoy Dust a lot more if they accepted the fact that EVERYTHING is subject to change
|
TheD1CK
Dead Man's Game RUST415
1323
|
Posted - 2014.10.03 11:34:00 -
[60] - Quote
CCP Rattati wrote:Sgt Kirk wrote:*walks back into thread*
*Leaves thread* Not even a reply
The points raised about having CCP play the game, would make a big difference.. I don't just mean joining in, deploying, finding a few squads and gaming for a while But get involved with in game corps/groups.. public events etc @ GM Archduke - We had some fun with Plasma Carnage .. but you guys took him back to work
Whichever staff member was tasked with it gets an occasional DUST session during work hours Along with the crazed feedback you will hear and the feel of fighting with and against mixed levels of players And seeing varied performances of gear depending on how it's used and by who (new/skilled mercs)
@ Rattati. The balance is better, but there is a large sense of carrying your team.. Not all bad.. But depending on teams. battles of 16v16 become 5/6v8/10 mercs that will take objectives Leaving an serious grind for one team, But at times there has been really good matches
Replys would come more freely via ingame communication, for better and worse
Innapropriate Irrelevence...
Welcome to the Dust Forum, hang around to see why everyone else left :/
|
|
|
|
|
Pages: 1 [2] 3 4 :: one page |
First page | Previous page | Next page | Last page |