Okay, two things... That's all I want to know, just please answer these two questions...

1. Am I getting a respec.? I Chose the Gallente heavy over the Amarr because of the 4 low slots, because I liked the Amarr before you guys added in the new suits, and now you guys are changing it. Just wondering if I'm getting completely screwed like this is a big joke being played on me...

2. Is there a release date? Or a month in which you think it might possibly happen, or within the current year?

this is a pretty good idea actually. It's now on the list.

That's bordering awfully close to the mentality we were trying to get away from in that certain items were only available to Aurum users. EDIT: In fact, unless an LP option is given, that's exactly what it is.

Not sure if you read the part where is said "AUR/LP".

> LP represents the Loyalty point store.


CCP has been really good about the balance between AUR and ISK/LP variant items. I think they are extra sensitive to the community so this will be a non-issue.

Hopefully this "Charley" Caldari Heavy makes it's way into Charley release. This will open the door in the future, Loyalty point store and AUR users alike will have something interesting to spend time and resources. This is with the caveat it has successful results, there is nothing wrong with giving a little shack up from the ISK variant.

Yeah, thanks for that, don't know what I would have done if I hadn't had you to reinforce that fact - what with me mentioning "Unless an LP option is given". And [redacted] me, if I wouldn't have had you here to inform me, I would have NEVER known what LP was! Two years I've been here and I've never understood what people talk about when they say "LP". I was like a lost child playing with a fork near a light socket.

Sarcasm aside - Yes, I'm fully [redacted] aware of what LP is and I'm absolutely POSITIVE that I did, in fact, mention it in my post considering that you even -quoted- the damn thing.

EITHER WAY.... I'm iffy about it because then it pretty much obligates players to engage in FW or spend real money. I didn't like the Specialist weapons and upgraded Equipment being FW only for that very reason and without a player market it only reinforces the point. That being said, throwing up -more- items on the LP store that can only be obtained there or through Aurum doesn't help the situation.

Not to mention the fact that we're considering adding 'prototype play test' items onto FW without having the stuff that people -actually use on a day-to-day basis-. It's kinda jacked up, all things considered, when you consider that many items aren't available on the LP store (and likely won't be for sometime) and FW doesn't give ISK payouts.

And this isn't even touching on the fact that we have yet to balance the suits we already have let alone adding Type-II's. Just saying, why don't we solve problems before adding more..?

Yeah CCP. You'd be biting off more than you guys can chew (which is a common error with you guys) if you tried to add another suit in the game before the others ones were even near balanced.


See the Commando suit for example. We all could have lived without the suit. Some, like me, even protested against it, saying it would get in the way of the suits we have now but you guys decided to go right on your merry way thinking the community doesn't know jack squat about game balance and here you guys are today saying that "Maybe we should get rid of the suit, it gets in the way of other things". Which is what the smart members of the community said would happen in the beginning.

Let's just focus on the Balance and the problems at hand now please, that's the major issue with DUST.

We have a lot of weapons, suits, but only some are viable. Instead of adding new crap to the pile, why not fix what we have and make the crap pile more pleasant to be around.

This is all assuming the team working on DUST isn't big enough to be spread around, if there are a nice size of people working on DUST then please, go for it but from what I've seen that's not the case.

The point of adding the 'play test' suit is to... figure out if it's more/ or less balanced than the current one... and I doubt in the instance that it is indeed over powered, that it would remain in the full duration of Charlie. Kind of the point...

With FW payouts being far lesser than regular isk payouts, and they still will be in Charlie, is it really that big of an issue that people who put greater effort into something get greater rewards? At least you can AFK isk farm and get 80 to 100k a match, but that is simply not possible in FW, where in the majority of cases you will need a full team in order to win.

Suits are a little iffy in the department of making them stronger than other varients, but weapons that have no other performance effecting boost other than reduced to ADV levels cpu/pg, and equipment that is marginally better, is not that big of an issue when the majority of players only bring them out for PC's. Unless you play 24/7 and stockpile LP of your preferred in FW, it's a rare encounter to even see specialist weapons and pubs. It's not that big of an issue when it's hardly ever there...

Honestly, I don't believe that we even need to give isk payouts in FW. It's not hard to make when running cheap suits. You can't lose what you don't spend. It's even better when you're destroying people with militia or standard gear.

You realize you can AFK in FW as well, right..? You get better ISK rewards for having more war-points and actually doing damage to the enemy whereas, in FW, I get the same amount of LP for winning and losing. This is to say, that whether I went 20/0 and we won... or I AFKed in the MCC.. I'm still getting the same amount of LP. Whereas in Pub Matches, I'm getting ISK pay-outs relative to my performance. You still get LP for losing anyway, so it's no big deal to just AFK through the match - you're still getting pay-outs.

And the whole "players only bring them out for PC's" is because of the [redacted] LP payouts. I'd imagine they're going to get a lot more prominent once people are actually getting paid enough LP to purchase them.

Not that this has anything to do with the argument at hand. It has nothing to do with "greater effort = greater reward" it's about exclusive rewards that you absolutely have no other choice of getting UNLESS you engage in that game mode. A game mode that doesn't even cover your losses because of item availability and (even though Charlie touches on this) [redacted] LP payouts. There are a lot of players that would argue with you about whether or not FW should have ISK payouts because of that.

The only reason Specialist weapons, "marginally better" equipment, and now these suits would -ever- be a good idea is if we had a player market with which FW players could sell the stuff to people who -don't- do FW. Without that, it's just one more cog in the great machine of problems. I don't see any functionality in adding a "play-test prototype" to FW and Aurum stores for any reason than encouraging players to fight for one side of FW (something CCP should -NEVER- be involved in) or simply to gain money. Both of which are an atrocity, in my eyes.

Provide an ISK option, and it's not nearly as bad, even though it's still the same Type-II non-sense that we should worry about -AFTER- we work out balance issues that we have -RIGHT NOW-.

You can AFK farm in FW, but the reward of around 70 LP (by default) isn't going to get you much in a 10-15 match, while isk can get you a lot more in that 10-15 time period with 80-100k isk. That's 2 standard suits in LP, and 26-33 standard suits in isk...

You CAN AFK LP farm, but the payout simply ins't the same in comparison.

BTW: Do you really want to give proto stompers with millions upon millions of isk easy access to specialist weapons and powerful equipment? That would be a nightmare...

210 LP*

Rewards are being tripled across the board. I get the impression some people forget that it's not just your winning payouts that are being increased. And I would much rather Proto Stompers will millions of ISK (such as myself) actually be -SPENDING IT- on something that costs a lot, slowly trickling down the amount of ISK they -do- have as opposed to holding onto it indefinitely.

No

Most likely within the month

There's not a single change that I don't agree with. Can we get a release date, pretty please?

The 'nerf' is less than 100 damage (not that big of a deal...), and for proto swarms, they did increase the total damage of 4 missiles to be near equivalent to the current total 6 missiles.

Old damage total: 1,320
New damage total: 1,248

Please read the post before commenting.

Will you people stop full quoting massive amounts of text??? Anyways I was thinking that installations passive repair was rep they would give to nearby infantry. That would have totally changed the game but I guess they're just repping themselves. The changes are still enough to merit a dropsuit command respec. Nothing besides commandos and logis is what it was at the last respec. Changes are good but let us choose what we want please, not what we've been handed.

I did read the post, I also voiced my opinion. Reducing the "overall" damage is a bad move. 100 damage, regardless of what you think can mean the difference between a dead ADS or dead infantry. If you like all the changes great, but there is still an issue with the ADS.

As it sits right now, you have to hit an ADS 4 times with swarms(they usually run away by then, but sometimes you get lucky) the damage dealt by the current swarms(4 volleys) 5280, with the new numbers your looking at 4992. Couple that with regen and the ADS will be able to shrug it off as it's flying away. Yes, 100 damage matters here....

Please think before posting

Dear players,

the final numbers have gone into QA testing and eventual deployment. As per usual, a Devblog will be posted after the hotfix has been successfully deployed.

You can find them here: Hotfix Charlie - Final Numbers
For those that have been following the Hotfix Charlie discussions and thread, there should be no surprises.

Thanks everyone for your feedback and your enthusiasm

Feel free to discuss Hotfix Charlie here, in a constructive and polite manner

Rather than telling be to think before posting, you should be working on wording your voice correctly and define it. If ADS usually run away, and rarely are they possible to destroy with swarms, then why are you concerned about a slight damage reduction? Also, 5,280 and 4992 damage exceeds or is near the total health of the average ADS. You can tank an Incubus, but it's not worth the immense speed reduction, and will often get you killed.

Believe me though, without the ability to run away, swarms would utterly dominate the ADS. It would be boring for swarmers, and enraging for the ADS when a role is completely invalidated.

If ADS usually run away, and rarely are they possible to destroy with swarms, then why are you concerned about a slight damage reduction?

Also, 5,280 and 4992 damage exceeds or is near the total health of the average ADS.

My initial comment did not require a breakdown of why I felt the way I did, your quoting me did. I voiced a quick opinion, not a breakdown of how it will affect the dynamic of the game.

Let's refresh your memory on why I chose to end my comment as I did.....


Your closing statement was an implication that I didn't take the time to read the original post.

And on to the rest.....

Your argument:

Here is why:

If you have an ADS in your sights, you have hit them twice, your third volley is away, and you are lining up your forth. The ADS pilot is beginning to climb and you unleash your final volley.-- Now in the current setting, the fourth volley will possibly take the ADS down and all will be right in the world, in the new setting, your volley can hit and the pilot will fly away....only to return a few moments later to attack again.

Your argument

I underlined the flaw in your argument. There aren't many people who fly average ADS. Not only that, but ADS pilots get to stack their skills, which is idiotic.

You say that it would be boring to swarm launcher infantry? I completely disagree, there isn't one person who uses swarm launchers against ADS that would get bored, if it kept ADS pilots from being able to kill them before they got their shot off. Also, they didn't even increase the range of the swarms, another handicap they face.

ADS are extremely hard to take down alone. Even if you are running a commando suit, you can use a rifle and launcher(which will make you less effective in your roll), or you can go full swarm(this is just stupid, as it makes you completely ineffective against infantry), the ADS pilot will simply fly away, lick their wounds until they are back to full health and make another run. This is a severely broken mechanic and needs to be addressed.

From your post, I surmise you are an ADS pilot and want to make sure that you maintain your dominance on the battlefield, but as a player who has ran almost everything in the game, I can tell you that the ADS is severely over powered and needs to be adjusted.

My initial comment did not require a breakdown of why I felt the way I did, your quoting me did. I voiced a quick opinion, not a breakdown of how it will affect the dynamic of the game.

Let's refresh your memory on why I chose to end my comment as I did.....


Your closing statement was an implication that I didn't take the time to read the original post.

And on to the rest.....

Your argument:

Here is why:

If you have an ADS in your sights, you have hit them twice, your third volley is away, and you are lining up your forth. The ADS pilot is beginning to climb and you unleash your final volley.-- Now in the current setting, the fourth volley will possibly take the ADS down and all will be right in the world, in the new setting, your volley can hit and the pilot will fly away....only to return a few moments later to attack again.

Your argument

I underlined the flaw in your argument. There aren't many people who fly average ADS. Not only that, but ADS pilots get to stack their skills, which is idiotic.

You say that it would be boring to swarm launcher infantry? I completely disagree, there isn't one person who uses swarm launchers against ADS that would get bored, if it kept ADS pilots from being able to kill them before they got their shot off. Also, they didn't even increase the range of the swarms, another handicap they face.

ADS are extremely hard to take down alone. Even if you are running a commando suit, you can use a rifle and launcher(which will make you less effective in your roll), or you can go full swarm(this is just stupid, as it makes you completely ineffective against infantry), the ADS pilot will simply fly away, lick their wounds until they are back to full health and make another run. This is a severely broken mechanic and needs to be addressed.

From your post, I surmise you are an ADS pilot and want to make sure that you maintain your dominance on the battlefield, but as a player who has ran almost everything in the game, I can tell you that the ADS is severely over powered and needs to be adjusted.

Do we really have to explain 4000rpm to you?