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I'd pay 5 bucks for 1 million Skill Points

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Clone D Grundstein Automation 26	Posted - 2014.01.10 06:16:00 - [1] - Quote I wouldn't buy Aurum, and I won't purchase boosters, but I'd pay 5 bucks for a million SP. I have shortly reached a point where I feel like I'm wasting my time grinding away on the battlefield waiting for the next 3% upgrade that I can achieve in two weeks time (or more). I'd rather just skip playing altogether and find another game to enjoy while my passive SP accumulates. Why would I want to continue playing a game that takes so long to level up? The payoff just isn't worthwhile. Grundstein Automation
Tonka Legacy THIRD EARTH INCORPORATED Dark Taboo 31	Posted - 2014.01.10 06:27:00 - [2] - Quote Clone D wrote: I wouldn't buy Aurum, and I won't purchase boosters, but I'd pay 5 bucks for a million SP. I have shortly reached a point where I feel like I'm wasting my time grinding away on the battlefield waiting for the next 3% upgrade that I can achieve in two weeks time (or more). I'd rather just skip playing altogether and find another game to enjoy while my passive SP accumulates. Why would I want to continue playing a game that takes so long to level up? The payoff just isn't worthwhile. I wouldn't mind paying for sp either, but think of all the die hard dust players who spend Aur on a daily basis. They would have everything. But i'd also pay 5 for 10mil isk. Why does my shotgun shoot confetti? Its like I'm throwing parties for my victims.
Clone D Grundstein Automation 26	Posted - 2014.01.10 06:42:00 - [3] - Quote Tonka Legacy wrote: But i'd also pay 5 for 10mil isk. Good call. Here's a list of things for which I would fork over my hard earned cash. 1 million SP = 5$ Blueprint standard dropsuit = 5$ Blueprint advanced dropsuit = 10$ Blueprint proto dropsuit = 15$ ... Continue for each section of gear and vehicles with pricing appropriate to utility. I will never pay for microtransactions. If I buy something digital, then I expect to use it permanently. This game is too absurd to spend money on microtransactions. I like getting into the game, but I want to play for a reasonable amount of time and still have a powerful loadout. Currently I just play with militia gear all the time, because I don't want to care about how hard it is to earn ISK for expensive suits that will get demolished 1 second after spawning into an orbital strike. Grundstein Automation
Julius Vindice Algintal Core Gallente Federation 313	Posted - 2014.01.10 07:01:00 - [4] - Quote So how much would you fork over for 620 million? *Julius Vindice... "Chase knowledge, not passion".* I may suck at things but at least I can make people mad.
Sophie DV Mind Games For Party Animals 13	Posted - 2014.01.10 07:11:00 - [5] - Quote As much as i understand your reasoning, I doubt Dust will ever let you buy any adv or proto level blueprint original - it goes against the whole risk-vs-reward system that the Eve universe revolves around. I've been playing since partway through the closed beta, and it's my opinion that with enough experience, you'll appreciate the skills more if you have to wait to train them, and you'll also appreciate the more powerful suits the more you play with the militia ones. I just think that there need to be some more games modes where orbitals arent 'free' (faction warfare orbitals are quite uncommon, actually.) Paying for ISK i think they could/should do - in Eve they do that with Plexes and it works fine. Maybe once they open up the player market, they could allow you to sell the skill boosters? In a way, they are Dust's "subscription time" and should probably maintain a high ISK value. That way, buying $5 worth of boosters should net you a decent chunk of ISK on-demand; it also keeps the payout proportional to the current ISK inflation/deflation value. Also regarding your final comment, I'd suggest trying STD gear - I use a STD minmatar logistics suit with 2 enhanced armor extenders for extra HP and 2 complex (but enhanced would work too) light damage modifiers in the high slots. It's like using a slightly less versatile proto suit, but it costs less than 25k and isn't hugely skill intensive. Just my 0.02 isk.
jerrmy12 kahoalii The Phoenix Federation 309	Posted - 2014.01.10 07:12:00 - [6] - Quote Julius Vindice wrote: So how much would you fork over for 620 million? i'd give 10.2k aurum for 1.2 million sp or something I use a tablet so beware of typos
Clone D Grundstein Automation 26	Posted - 2014.01.10 07:33:00 - [7] - Quote Sophie DV wrote: I've been playing since partway through the closed beta, and it's my opinion that with enough experience, you'll appreciate the skills more if you have to wait to train them, and you'll also appreciate the more powerful suits the more you play with the militia ones. Sophie, I like and understand everything you said, and I appreciate your perspective. Here's where I'm coming from. I'm a working adult, and I don't have time to sit around trying to earn more SP so that I can upgrade my loadout. My philisophical stance is this: Why should you have better gear than I do just because you've been playing the game longer? It is digital, ethereal, electronically generated equipment we are playing with. It's not like working out at the gym to develop superior physical musculature. I want to pay cash so that I can have character skill levels and equipment that rival someone who has time to play day in and day out. When it comes to game knowledge and thumb/finger dexterity, I'm sure that my personal skills and practical knowledge are on par with my opponents. I just want the chance to fight without being at a disadvantage because of gear. Yes, we have all learned our lesson that Dust 514 = injustice. I am not shedding tears here, because personally, this ridiculous game makes me laugh so hard. I'm just stating my case that I would gladly pay for some SP since I don't want to spend my life hours earning points in a video game. Grundstein Automation
Valerie Viever Hell's Gate Inc League of Infamy 43	Posted - 2014.01.10 07:50:00 - [8] - Quote Clone D wrote: Sophie DV wrote: I've been playing since partway through the closed beta, and it's my opinion that with enough experience, you'll appreciate the skills more if you have to wait to train them, and you'll also appreciate the more powerful suits the more you play with the militia ones. Sophie, I like and understand everything you said, and I appreciate your perspective. Here's where I'm coming from. I'm a working adult, and I don't have time to sit around trying to earn more SP so that I can upgrade my loadout. My philisophical stance is this: Why should you have better gear than I do just because you've been playing the game longer? It is digital, ethereal, electronically generated equipment we are playing with. It's not like working out at the gym to develop superior physical musculature. I want to pay cash so that I can have character skill levels and equipment that rival someone who has time to play day in and day out. When it comes to game knowledge and thumb/finger dexterity, I'm sure that my personal skills and practical knowledge are on par with my opponents. I just want the chance to fight without being at a disadvantage because of gear. Yes, we have all learned our lesson that Dust 514 = injustice. I am not shedding tears here, because personally, this ridiculous game makes me laugh so hard. I'm just stating my case that I would gladly pay for some SP since I don't want to spend my life hours earning points in a video game. I'm also a working adult with two full time jobs, and let me be frank. Ccp will never implement this. It goes against everything they've built this game and Eve Online, on. I've been playing for 6 or 7 months, and I don't cap most weeks, but I've spent my sp wisely and make do with what I am good at. I don't want to come off as a troll but that's what the game is about, the long haul. Play at your pace and if you don't like the grind, then find another game that gives you instant gratification. Nothing against you, but I really feel like it just may not be the game for you. My point is that even with semi regular play, you can still fit a reasonable load out and win. Just prioritize what skills you need and don't spend the points frivolously.
TechMechMeds Swamp Marines 2030	Posted - 2014.01.10 08:03:00 - [9] - Quote I'd buy 10 mil or more sp per month, that's buttons. No. Level 2 forum warrior. Minmatar and Gallente fw. I sold my wife and kids to the Amarr for isk, its a valid tactic.
Valerie Viever Hell's Gate Inc League of Infamy 43	Posted - 2014.01.10 08:08:00 - [10] - Quote Yea, I mean if you could purchase sp, what would stop someone from maxing out their sp. You'd only exasperate the problem in that instead of proto stomps, you'd have 100 million sp super soldiers on the other side.

The Rolling Stone Sebiestor Field Sappers Minmatar Republic 0	Posted - 2014.01.10 08:21:00 - [11] - Quote Valerie Viever wrote: I'm also a working adult with two full time jobs, and let me be frank. Ccp will never implement this. It goes against everything they've built this game and Eve Online, on. I've been playing for 6 or 7 months, and I don't cap most weeks, but I've spent my sp wisely and make do with what I am good at. I don't want to come off as a troll but that's what the game is about, the long haul. Play at your pace and if you don't like the grind, then find another game that gives you instant gratification. Nothing against you, but I really feel like it just may not be the game for you. My point is that even with semi regular play, you can still fit a reasonable load out and win. Just prioritize what skills you need and don't spend the points frivolously. Nuff said .
Lt Royal Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 2390	Posted - 2014.01.10 09:17:00 - [12] - Quote Clone D wrote: I wouldn't buy Aurum, and I won't purchase boosters, but I'd pay 5 bucks for a million SP. Well good for you because its never going to happen. Keep on dreaming! Gÿ£GÿàGÿP Subdreddit Recruitment Video Gÿ£GÿàGÿP
Fizzer94 L.O.T.I.S. D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 1327	Posted - 2014.01.10 11:59:00 - [13] - Quote Passive SP boosters... A 7 day one will get you approximately 84000 SP. Yours Truly, Reginald Fizzer94 Delafontaine III, Esquire
Lt Royal Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 2396	Posted - 2014.01.10 12:02:00 - [14] - Quote Fizzer94 wrote: Passive SP boosters... A 7 day one will get you approximately 84000 SP. This^^ Also: 30 day passive boosters net you just over 1 million SP per month! Gÿ£GÿàGÿP Subdreddit Recruitment Video Gÿ£GÿàGÿP
X7 lion Swamp Marines 66	Posted - 2014.01.10 12:46:00 - [15] - Quote how about no.
Cyzad4 Blackfish Corp. 74	Posted - 2014.01.10 13:12:00 - [16] - Quote Clone D wrote: Why should you have better gear than I do just because you've been playing the game longer? I'm sorry but ^this^ is sarcasm right? (Gò»°Gûí°n+ëGò»n+¦ Gö+GöüGö+ "fuck this I'm out"... ... ..."I'm back"
Arx Ardashir Imperium Aeternum 357	Posted - 2014.01.10 13:13:00 - [17] - Quote Is there any game with experience and levels that lets you buy either of those? Besides phone games, of course. Amarr HAV Speculation
Tonka Legacy THIRD EARTH INCORPORATED Dark Taboo 32	Posted - 2014.01.10 13:16:00 - [18] - Quote what if we changed the topic to isk? You can't really get an unfair edge over others with money, money isn't going to help you tap that trigger to shoot. It could be used for PC purposes, restocking if your dangerously low on everything, helping out new corp members, attracting the gold digging female mercs, and paying for skill books. Why does my shotgun shoot confetti? Its like I'm throwing parties for my victims.
X7 lion Swamp Marines 66	Posted - 2014.01.10 13:18:00 - [19] - Quote Arx Ardashir wrote: Is there any game with experience and levels that lets you buy either of those? Besides phone games, of course. Assinss creed multiplayer (sort of) CRYS
Tonka Legacy THIRD EARTH INCORPORATED Dark Taboo 32	Posted - 2014.01.10 13:30:00 - [20] - Quote Arx Ardashir wrote: Is there any game with experience and levels that lets you buy either of those? Besides phone games, of course. they use to promote double xp on every bottlecap of a mountain dew for MW3...since the things were a dollar for the mountain dew, 2 hours per cap, people abused it. now Imagine this; bottlecap=X2 exp, Specialist (in game perk system)X2 more exp, moab (for obtaining a 25 kill streak)X2 more sp. total that up n you got 600exp per kill in a team deathmatch, or 3000exp per kill in search in destroy (not that you would ever get a moab in that sorry mode.....And now you know, And knowing is half the battle. G.I.JOE!!! Why does my shotgun shoot confetti? Its like I'm throwing parties for my victims.

Mobius Kaethis Molon Labe. Public Disorder. 1195	Posted - 2014.01.10 13:41:00 - [21] - Quote I hate to say it but the OP is under the impression that he is one of the few working adults who play this game making him feel entitled to an alternate route to success. This is unfortunately misguided since many of us long time players (and many of us who cap every week) are adults with real lives and jobs. We like the game enough to earn our SP by playing regularly and we deserve to have more of it than a person who devotes less time to the game. Additionally Pay to Win mechanics would be horribly abused as others pointed out. Fun > Realism
Clone D Grundstein Automation 26	Posted - 2014.01.10 14:07:00 - [22] - Quote I can appreciate what you are saying. People generally feel entitled to what they have earned when they devote time to an endeavor, whether that be social status or material. But if you want realism, then consider this: in life, people who are willing to pay to bypass waiting in line do so and get on with their lives a lot faster. Why do you think they sell speed passes for theme parks? Why do you think they sell college degrees? The issue of sinking weeks of time into the next 777k upgrade for +3% implies psychological addiction. I have limited time to be alive and the tradeoff of running the XP mill is simply too expensive for me. It is a fun game, and I would be willing to play it a couple of hours per week, not work at it like a part-time/full-time job. I've calculated the amount of SP I need to build the character that I would like to try. I may as well let passive SP accumulate for 1.5 years and then come back to play, which I will likely do. Grundstein Automation
Clone D Grundstein Automation 26	Posted - 2014.01.10 14:34:00 - [23] - Quote The day that CCP decommissions the servers, all of the time that you labored over this game evaporates. Personally, I'd rather commit my precious hours to building things that last; a healthier body, a stronger social network, an enduring bond between me and my sweetheart, an expansive worldview. I would pay a few bucks to get what I want out of this game, but I wouldn't pay with a significant portion of my life. Grundstein Automation
Hyborean Strain Immortal Guides 23	Posted - 2014.01.10 14:45:00 - [24] - Quote There is no way this is ever going to happen. If it did, it wouldn't be Eve anymore. You say that you don't think people who've been playing longer/harder, putting more work into their character should have more SP than you. I think they should. Eve purposefully mirrors life in that regard; hard work is rewarded more than just sitting around twiddling your thumbs. If you don't think that the active SP gains are worth the investment of your time, then you should do something else. Simple cost/benefit analysis. Besides, Dust offers a bit of a cheat when it comes to boosters. They are selling what you're asking for, just not at the price and delivery method that you want. It's your choice whether or not you want to take advantage of it. Clone D wrote: I've calculated the amount of SP I need to build the character that I would like to try. I may as well let passive SP accumulate for 1.5 years and then come back to play, which I will likely do. I suggest you do this.
Clone D Grundstein Automation 26	Posted - 2014.01.10 14:53:00 - [25] - Quote Hyborean Strain wrote: I suggest you do this. It is a matter of personal values. I respect our differences and I have a new appreciation of this community and the members who feel adamantly about their time commitment to this game. I am simply pointing out that there is an untapped revenue stream available to CCP via a simple product offering. I see that many members are strongly opposed to the idea, and therefore I withdraw my petition. Waiting a year and a half is not a problem. Peace Grundstein Automation
deepfried salad gilliam Sanguine Knights 370	Posted - 2014.01.10 16:03:00 - [26] - Quote Your doing it wrong If your just playing to level up then what? If you're having fun then cool you'll get that sp wile having fun If you're not having fun,that extra sp wont make a difference Btw dust isn't ptw Proud Christian one of the most essential parts of eve is left out of dust: freedom, exploration, open-world gameplay.
Clone D Grundstein Automation 26	Posted - 2014.01.10 16:29:00 - [27] - Quote deepfried salad gilliam wrote: If you're not having fun,that extra sp wont make a difference I only play for fun, and there is a concept called need for competence that describes how when your learning curve plateaus, then you seek a new challenge. My militia gear learning curve has plateaued, and the only thing keeping me from the next level is SP. It is a shining example of classic conditioning. You hear a bell, you salvate, but there is no food. You have been tamed by CCP and are not thinking rationally. Grundstein Automation
Bunny Demon Scions of Athra 59	Posted - 2014.01.10 18:10:00 - [28] - Quote Clone D wrote: Tonka Legacy wrote: But i'd also pay 5 for 10mil isk. Good call. Here's a list of things for which I would fork over my hard earned cash. 1 million SP = 5$ Blueprint standard dropsuit = 5$ Blueprint advanced dropsuit = 10$ Blueprint proto dropsuit = 15$ ... Continue for each section of gear and vehicles with pricing appropriate to utility. I will never pay for microtransactions. If I buy something digital, then I expect to use it permanently. This game is too absurd to spend money on microtransactions. I like getting into the game, but I want to play for a reasonable amount of time and still have a powerful loadout. Currently I just play with militia gear all the time, because I don't want to care about how hard it is to earn ISK for expensive suits that will get demolished 1 second after spawning into an orbital strike. Soooo what you're saying is..you don't care much about isk so you can give it to me Amarr logi ftw :D (Also...ScR is pretty good)
Skihids Bullet Cluster Legacy Rising 2676	Posted - 2014.01.10 18:45:00 - [29] - Quote I'm a working adult with limited time, but I manage to cap out each week. I've been doing it long enough to get 30M SP. Having to put in your time is part of what makes DUST what it is. Money can shorten that time by a third (standard boosters) and a boat load of money can cut it in half (Omega boosters), but there is no instant SP injection. I understand your desire to cut in line by waving a wad of bills and I'd be tempted to do the same if the option were available, but it would ultimately backfire for me. Once I "Had everything" I'd be more likely to lose interest and move on to something else. The journey is a good deal of the experience, and skipping it to reach the "destination" robs the game of a good deal of what it has to offer.
Cyzad4 Blackfish Corp. 76	Posted - 2014.01.10 18:46:00 - [30] - Quote Clone D wrote: I only play for fun, and there is a concept called need for competence that describes how when your learning curve plateaus, then you seek a new challenge. My militia gear learning curve has plateaued, and the only thing keeping me from the next level is SP. It is a shining example of classic conditioning. You hear a bell, you salivate, but there is no food. You have been tamed by CCP and are not thinking rationally. Try playing with different loadouts keep it a bit more interesting till you can get the next lvl gear, or yes just leave passive to build and come back later (that's what I do). I would have to agree that a decent portion of players are well conditioned, check the forums for the "OMG another 3x SP event now I HAVE to play 30+ hrs to cap". It's how CCP makes their money. (Gò»°Gûí°n+ëGò»n+¦ Gö+GöüGö+ "fuck this I'm out"... ... ..."I'm back"

Clone D Grundstein Automation 26	Posted - 2014.01.10 18:53:00 - [31] - Quote Bunny Demon wrote: Soooo what you're saying is..you don't care much about isk so you can give it to me I would sell units of 25,000 ISK for $1.00 USD. Grundstein Automation
low genius The Sound Of Freedom Renegade Alliance 1080	Posted - 2014.01.10 18:58:00 - [32] - Quote Clone D wrote: I wouldn't buy Aurum, and I won't purchase boosters, but I'd pay 5 bucks for a million SP. I have shortly reached a point where I feel like I'm wasting my time grinding away on the battlefield waiting for the next 3% upgrade that I can achieve in two weeks time (or more). I'd rather just skip playing altogether and find another game to enjoy while my passive SP accumulates. Why would I want to continue playing a game that takes so long to level up? The payoff just isn't worthwhile. lololololololol
Clone D Grundstein Automation 26	Posted - 2014.01.10 19:07:00 - [33] - Quote Cyzad4 wrote: Try playing with different loadouts keep it a bit more interesting till you can get the next lvl gear I agree with this. I have filled all 30 dropsuit fitting slots many times over with sundry builds. They lost me on lvl 3&4&5 upgrades. So boring!!! I will capitulate and resort to the waiting game. I'll return with a vengeance in 1.5 yrs :) Thanks for the reply! Grundstein Automation
Trey Hardin The dyst0pian Corporation Zero-Day 49	Posted - 2014.01.10 19:14:00 - [34] - Quote Sorry this idea is just plain stupid. It would be a p2w game. I will not sink any of my hard earned money in to a f2p game I live and die by The Logi Code
Clone D Grundstein Automation 26	Posted - 2014.01.10 19:35:00 - [35] - Quote Skihids wrote: The journey is a good deal of the experience, and skipping it to reach the "destination" robs the game of a good deal of what it has to offer. I like your philosophical stance. I have extrapolated many lessons from the game concerning moral behavior, online sociology, battle tactics when the odds are against you, and how easily soldiers of the future become fatigued. I reached a point when the game began to feel like work and the rewards weren't frequent enough. I am ready to fast forward through all of the repetition and get to the goods. The game is not refreshingly novel enough for me to spend years capping out every week, but it is cool enough to wait 1.5 years and come back. In the end, it is just a game. Why should I be throttled back just because I do not choose to make it a lifestyle? Grundstein Automation
jerrmy12 kahoalii The Phoenix Federation 314	Posted - 2014.01.10 19:39:00 - [36] - Quote Trey Hardin wrote: Sorry this idea is just plain stupid. It would be a p2w game. I will not sink any of my hard earned money in to a f2p game No p2w is paying for better better gear no one can get I use a tablet so beware of typos
MINA Longstrike 2Shitz 1Giggle 201	Posted - 2014.01.10 19:42:00 - [37] - Quote Clone D wrote: Sophie DV wrote: I've been playing since partway through the closed beta, and it's my opinion that with enough experience, you'll appreciate the skills more if you have to wait to train them, and you'll also appreciate the more powerful suits the more you play with the militia ones. Sophie, I like and understand everything you said, and I appreciate your perspective. Here's where I'm coming from. I'm a working adult, and I don't have time to sit around trying to earn more SP so that I can upgrade my loadout. My philisophical stance is this: Why should you have better gear than I do just because you've been playing the game longer? It is digital, ethereal, electronically generated equipment we are playing with. It's not like working out at the gym to develop superior physical musculature. I want to pay cash so that I can have character skill levels and equipment that rival someone who has time to play day in and day out. When it comes to game knowledge and thumb/finger dexterity, I'm sure that my personal skills and practical knowledge are on par with my opponents. I just want the chance to fight without being at a disadvantage because of gear. Yes, we have all learned our lesson that Dust 514 = injustice. I am not shedding tears here, because personally, this ridiculous game makes me laugh so hard. I'm just stating my case that I would gladly pay for some SP since I don't want to spend my life hours earning points in a video game. They have the better gear because they invested time into it. Demanding that the whole game design be changed to accommodate your busy life by changing it to a 'pay to win' mentality is awful beyond thought and it would still lead to you getting thrashed by teenagers who work 6 hours once a week and still play a lot.
MINA Longstrike 2Shitz 1Giggle 201	Posted - 2014.01.10 19:44:00 - [38] - Quote Clone D wrote: Skihids wrote: The journey is a good deal of the experience, and skipping it to reach the "destination" robs the game of a good deal of what it has to offer. I like your philosophical stance. I have extrapolated many lessons from the game concerning moral behavior, online sociology, battle tactics when the odds are against you, and how easily soldiers of the future become fatigued. I reached a point when the game began to feel like work and the rewards weren't frequent enough. I am ready to fast forward through all of the repetition and get to the goods. The game is not refreshingly novel enough for me to spend years capping out every week, but it is cool enough to wait 1.5 years and come back. In the end, it is just a game. Why should I be throttled back just because I do not choose to make it a lifestyle? http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operant_conditioning_chamber All mmo's are skinner boxes
Skihids Bullet Cluster Legacy Rising 2680	Posted - 2014.01.10 20:14:00 - [39] - Quote MINA Longstrike wrote: Clone D wrote: Skihids wrote: The journey is a good deal of the experience, and skipping it to reach the "destination" robs the game of a good deal of what it has to offer. I like your philosophical stance. I have extrapolated many lessons from the game concerning moral behavior, online sociology, battle tactics when the odds are against you, and how easily soldiers of the future become fatigued. I reached a point when the game began to feel like work and the rewards weren't frequent enough. I am ready to fast forward through all of the repetition and get to the goods. The game is not refreshingly novel enough for me to spend years capping out every week, but it is cool enough to wait 1.5 years and come back. In the end, it is just a game. Why should I be throttled back just because I do not choose to make it a lifestyle? http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operant_conditioning_chamber All mmo's are skinner boxes I've resisted every single MMO to date until DUST for that reason. The difference is that DUST is more FPS than MMO and I can take my fun shooting face or flying around in little chunks. It's not about attaining level 60, or even comparing your progress against someone else. I find enjoyment in the moment and "Leveling" isn't the all consuming goal. I wouldn't be left feeling cheated if DUST folded tomorrow ( well, I'd want unspent/unused Aurum refunded ) because I'm having fun as I go rather than focusing only on reaching some mythical end game.
TechMechMeds Swamp Marines 2050	Posted - 2014.01.11 00:22:00 - [40] - Quote It would become purely pay to win in the sense that if you cant afford to Max your chars you'd be screwed, it would destroy the game lol. Level 2 forum warrior. Minmatar and Gallente fw. I sold my wife and kids to the Amarr for isk, its a valid tactic.

Draco Cerberus BurgezzE.T.F Public Disorder. 676	Posted - 2014.01.11 01:42:00 - [41] - Quote IDK about any of the rest of you but it has been a long time since I needed to spend more than 3 days boosting to cap. If you can't find 3 evenings a week to cap your character then make do and at least activate the passive SP. Also with the 6000sp x 30= 180,000 free sp just for logging in every day, it makes sense to just log in even if you plan on taking your wife to the opera or fixing your junker car that will never run right anyways. LogiGod earns his pips
Harbinger Ironhide Osmon Surveillance Caldari State 0	Posted - 2014.01.11 02:05:00 - [42] - Quote dont waste your money dust doesnt seem to be a game to stand the test of time. Besides until the Devs actually figure out how to design an FPS the most efficient method is just to afk farm heres to your hard work.
Clone D Grundstein Automation 27	Posted - 2014.01.11 02:06:00 - [43] - Quote Draco Cerberus wrote: If you can't find 3 evenings a week ... Yeah. See, I have other things to do, but would still like to even the score in skill buffs and gear and see how you fare. As it is, I'm sure you have already met your fate at the barrel of my militia scrambler pistols once or twice. I am not committed to this game. I just want the quick pass. Understanding that the community frowns upon this, I have withdrawn my plea. But let me leave you with this: The parable of the old man and the lamborghini There was an old man who owned a lamborghini and enjoyed driving it every day. One morning, his grandson came to him and said, "Grandpa, can I drive your lamborghini today?" To which the old man replied, "You may drive my lamborghini when you get your driver's license." When the young man was of age, he passed his driver's examination with flying colors and ran straight to his grandfather's house exclaiming the good news. The grandfather did not hand over the keys to the car, but instead turned to his grandson and said, "You can drive the car when you understand the value of the car. Master economics and I will let you drive." So the young man attended a university and acquired a PhD in economics to prove his commitment and called his grandfather, telling him the good news. Once again, the grandfather gave an excuse why the grandson could not drive the lamborghini, saying, "Go fall in love so you will understand the value what is at stake if you crash and die." Seeing the pattern of being turned down, he decided to put his education to good use, save up money and go purchase his own lamborghini. When he had finally saved up $350,000, he went to the dealer to purchase the car. The dealer looked the man in the eyes, and with a frown he said, "Unfortunately, your grandfather got to me before you did. He said you may not purchase a lamborghini until you are as old as he is." And the young man contemplated for a moment and then said, "Hey game geezer, you've been playing this game way longer than I have and I will never catch up to you regardless of how many empty hours I spend repeating the same battlefield routines again and again. I would pay a few bucks to even the score, but refuse to spend my youth parked in front of a TV." The end Grundstein Automation
Tallen Ellecon KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 1171	Posted - 2014.01.11 10:28:00 - [44] - Quote They can make a lot more money selling boosters, and it's more balanced. Tarn chose peace. Tallen chose war. Where is my Gallente sidearm? SoonGäó514
Arx Ardashir Imperium Aeternum 373	Posted - 2014.01.11 16:57:00 - [45] - Quote Clone D wrote: -Parable- While I don't agree with your petition, I did like the ending. Unexpected. Amarr HAV Speculation
Suanar Daranaus Seykal Expeditionary Group Minmatar Republic 118	Posted - 2014.01.11 17:50:00 - [46] - Quote Clone D wrote: I wouldn't buy Aurum, and I won't purchase boosters, but I'd pay 5 bucks for a million SP. I have shortly reached a point where I feel like I'm wasting my time grinding away on the battlefield waiting for the next 3% upgrade that I can achieve in two weeks time (or more). I'd rather just skip playing altogether and find another game to enjoy while my passive SP accumulates. Why would I want to continue playing a game that takes so long to level up? The payoff just isn't worthwhile. Troll Thread, CCP Please delete.
Onesimus Tarsus 768	Posted - 2014.01.11 17:56:00 - [47] - Quote Clone D wrote: I can appreciate what you are saying. People generally feel entitled to what they have earned when they devote time to an endeavor, whether that be social status or material. But if you want realism, then consider this: in life, people who are willing to pay to bypass waiting in line do so and get on with their lives a lot faster. Why do you think they sell speed passes for theme parks? Why do you think they sell college degrees? The issue of sinking weeks of time into the next 777k upgrade for +3% implies psychological addiction. I have limited time to be alive and the tradeoff of running the XP mill is simply too expensive for me. It is a fun game, and I would be willing to play it a couple of hours per week, not work at it like a part-time/full-time job. I've calculated the amount of SP I need to build the character that I would like to try. I may as well let passive SP accumulate for 1.5 years and then come back to play, which I will likely do. You could DL Battlefield 1943. It's cheap, it's way more instant fun than DUST, and you start out with access to all the gear that anyone has. You have three great maps, jeep bombs, scary but killable and avoidable tanks, 4-man squads, air-raid calls, sniping that works, boats, planes, remote explosives, destructible landscapes, short load times, HALO dives, etc. Honestly, it came out in 2009 and is way the heck better than DUST. Play that for 2 years and come back to DUST if you want. I got my hand around the pistol grip, and the safety's off.
Clone D Grundstein Automation 28	Posted - 2014.01.11 18:08:00 - [48] - Quote Suanar Daranaus wrote: Troll Thread I am simply stating that the game is designed to reward people who devote their lives to it, not people who have skills, but are outclassed by proto. I would pay for SP. The community resists the idea. I respect that. Not a troll. Simply a heart felt request stemming from my own personal values that do not reflect the values of the majority. Our dialog has ended. Majority rules. I can abide. Peace Grundstein Automation
Ulysses Knapse Knapse and Co. Mercenary Firm 1066	Posted - 2014.01.11 19:51:00 - [49] - Quote Just five? That's a little cheap, don't you think? What's the difference between an immobile Minmatar ship and a pile of garbage? The pile of garbage is more lethal.
KEROSIINI-TERO The Rainbow Effect 986	Posted - 2014.01.11 20:03:00 - [50] - Quote Clone D wrote: I wouldn't buy Aurum, and I won't purchase boosters, but I'd pay 5 bucks for a million SP. I have shortly reached a point where I feel like I'm wasting my time grinding away on the battlefield waiting for the next 3% upgrade that I can achieve in two weeks time (or more). I'd rather just skip playing altogether and find another game to enjoy while my passive SP accumulates. Why would I want to continue playing a game that takes so long to level up? The payoff just isn't worthwhile. It adds longevity to the game in form of something to aim for. Fact is that in any game most people's interest drops the moment they have everything opened. BTW, I'd happily pay 20 bucks per 1M SP. But I'm glad that can not be done. I guess both in Eve and Dust there would be huge market for SP for $. But again, that would be counter productive in the long term. FEEDBACK: Analysis on 1.7 tank functionality

Sky Kage Immortal Guides 631	Posted - 2014.01.11 20:22:00 - [51] - Quote ^how to turn dust into "pay to win". imagine someone forking over $50 and getting 10m sp 5 minutes into the game. they will automatically have an edge over all the rest of the newberries in the game and I'm sure no one will like that. It would only be acceptable in my book if its a "one time" deal or something similar. -1 to the OP I die alot AND have fun... Who knew? a¦á_a¦á
Clone D Grundstein Automation 28	Posted - 2014.01.11 22:46:00 - [52] - Quote Sky Kage wrote: imagine someone forking over $50 and getting 10m sp 5 minutes into the game. In my opinion, that would rule. Note, dropsuits do have a cap for the various attributes. They are not infinitely powerful. When everyone maxes out their attributes, the game will once again reflect skill on the battlefield, as opposed to reflecting how much time a person plays the game. Also, it would allow much more variety for beginners to explore various builds without having to wait years to see what it would feel like to play with a certain loadout. I understand that apparently I am alone in this perspective and I do not expect many to agree that this would expand the variety of play. Grundstein Automation
Sirys Lyons Tronhadar Free Guard Minmatar Republic 45	Posted - 2014.01.12 01:07:00 - [53] - Quote Just out of curiosity, what do most people here make per match in SP? What's "average" for the "average" player?
Clone D Grundstein Automation 28	Posted - 2014.01.12 03:37:00 - [54] - Quote Sirys Lyons wrote: Just out of curiosity, what do most people here make per match in SP? What's "average" for the "average" player? I can only speak for myself: 3500 - 7000 per match with bonus; 1000 per match with exhausted bonus Grundstein Automation
Emerald Bellerophon Nenikekamen 81	Posted - 2014.01.12 12:23:00 - [55] - Quote Suanar Daranaus wrote: Clone D wrote: I wouldn't buy Aurum, and I won't purchase boosters, but I'd pay 5 bucks for a million SP. I have shortly reached a point where I feel like I'm wasting my time grinding away on the battlefield waiting for the next 3% upgrade that I can achieve in two weeks time (or more). I'd rather just skip playing altogether and find another game to enjoy while my passive SP accumulates. Why would I want to continue playing a game that takes so long to level up? The payoff just isn't worthwhile. Troll Thread, CCP Please delete. No. Business thread. CCP. please listen.
Emerald Bellerophon Nenikekamen 81	Posted - 2014.01.12 12:28:00 - [56] - Quote Clone D wrote: Sirys Lyons wrote: Just out of curiosity, what do most people here make per match in SP? What's "average" for the "average" player? I can only speak for myself: 3500 - 7000 per match with bonus; 1000 per match with exhausted bonus Ditto. Solo player.
Aikuchi Tomaru Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 1539	Posted - 2014.01.12 12:31:00 - [57] - Quote Clone D wrote: I wouldn't buy Aurum, and I won't purchase boosters, but I'd pay 5 bucks for a million SP. I have shortly reached a point where I feel like I'm wasting my time grinding away on the battlefield waiting for the next 3% upgrade that I can achieve in two weeks time (or more). I'd rather just skip playing altogether and find another game to enjoy while my passive SP accumulates. Why would I want to continue playing a game that takes so long to level up? The payoff just isn't worthwhile. 5 Bucks for 1 MIllion SP? Not going to happen. I think SP Boosters are somewhat 15 bucks fpr 500k or something. Sign up for Caldari FW and defeat the evil Gallente Overlords!
Jooki Chewaka Stalking Wolfpack 77	Posted - 2014.01.12 15:37:00 - [58] - Quote Clone D wrote: I wouldn't buy Aurum, and I won't purchase boosters, but I'd pay 5 bucks for a million SP. I have shortly reached a point where I feel like I'm wasting my time grinding away on the battlefield waiting for the next 3% upgrade that I can achieve in two weeks time (or more). I'd rather just skip playing altogether and find another game to enjoy while my passive SP accumulates. Why would I want to continue playing a game that takes so long to level up? The payoff just isn't worthwhile. Back in the day of quake and cs and enemy territory and medal of honor people used to play for fun. See you from orbit
Mobius Wyvern Ahrendee Mercenaries EoN. 4437	Posted - 2014.01.12 16:04:00 - [59] - Quote Cyzad4 wrote: Clone D wrote: Why should you have better gear than I do just because you've been playing the game longer? I'm sorry but ^this^ is sarcasm right? RIGHT?! This guy uses as the basis of his argument exactly what everyone complains about as far as free-to-play models that have "Gold Ammo/Weapons/Armor". Amidst the blue skies A link from past to future The sheltering wings of the protector
Clone D Grundstein Automation 28	Posted - 2014.01.12 16:05:00 - [60] - Quote Jooki Chewaka wrote: Back in the day of quake and cs and enemy territory and medal of honor people used to play for fun. This is an excerpt from an earlier post: Clone D wrote: I only play for fun, and there is a concept called need for competence that describes how when your learning curve plateaus, then you seek a new challenge. My militia gear learning curve has plateaued, and the only thing keeping me from the next level is SP. Grundstein Automation

Clone D Grundstein Automation 28	Posted - 2014.01.12 16:24:00 - [61] - Quote Mobius Wyvern wrote: free-to-play models that have "Gold Ammo/Weapons/Armor". I want to pay. They're just not selling me what I want. The upgrades are designed to take a long time to achieve. I have thoroughly examined the bonuses of skills and gear, looking for a shortcut to the top, but in the end, it is the time in months and years that you spend playing the game that determines the opportunities in the game and strength of your character. I have skill, but when it comes down to it, if you and I are of equal skill, then the person with the better stats and gear will win. I'm proposing that I would happily pay for stats and gear and skip the sitting around for years repeating the same behaviors iteratively. I have created over 15 characters just to try to pursue various builds since skill points are scarce and starting a new character is a good way to get a head start on a skillset. Even so, I will have to wait many months to specialize in one single weapon or dropsuit class per character. That is not a realistic expectation in my book. I have created myriad dropsuit builds and I know how the system works. I enjoyed optimizing my characters, but now, it is simply a matter of banal battlefield repetition. A video game is something that I want to pick up, play and walk away from, without having to schedule time against my outlook calendar reminding me to cap out this week. My understanding is that many here have a sense of identity when they roll out in each battle, that they have a job to do, that they are committed to, and that they won't let their team down, and they will do it time and time again. And, perhaps, that is the appeal of DUST 514. I would never ask to change the quiddity of the game and alter the experience for those who enjoy it. I was simply saying, I want something that is not currently sold for which I'm willing to pay money; the hardcore grinders pay with their lives. Grundstein Automation
Smooth Assassin Stardust Incorporation 693	Posted - 2014.01.12 16:25:00 - [62] - Quote Oh yeah sure, lets drop the Pay to win... for americans -.- *Assassination is my thing.*
Clone D Grundstein Automation 28	Posted - 2014.01.12 16:30:00 - [63] - Quote Smooth Assassin wrote: Oh yeah sure, lets drop the Pay to win... for americans -.- You either pay with money or with time. Right now they have an offering called boosters where you pay with money and time. I'd throw 60 bucks at a video game, but not years of my time. The experience isn't that novel. Grundstein Automation
Valmar Shadereaver The Exemplars Top Men. 36	Posted - 2014.01.12 17:29:00 - [64] - Quote Clone D wrote: Smooth Assassin wrote: Oh yeah sure, lets drop the Pay to win... for americans -.- You either pay with money or with time. Right now they have an offering called boosters where you pay with money and time. I'd throw 60 bucks at a video game, but not years of my time. The experience isn't that novel. if you dont like the game enof to spend your time on it then perhaps its time you looked for another alternative just afking for the pasive sp wel im sure youl notice a downside to it when you get back after 1.5 year seeing new skill's and stuf will get added and then you wont even be able to stand on equel grounds with ppl playing every day of every week of evry month to get there cap done and some extra 1K matches
Maken Tosch Edimmu Warfighters Gallente Federation 6394	Posted - 2014.01.12 17:34:00 - [65] - Quote No. I don't care if you have to work in real life to bring food to the table and don't have time to grind. There will be absolutely no way CCP would ever allow you to purchase SP with cash or aurum outside of using boosters. Ever. That is definitely pay to win and that's a stigma DUST is trying to avoid. Cash for ISK however is an entirely different matter. The plex system in Eve Online is a balanced system since ISK is transferred from one player to another in the process. This avoid generating ISK out of thin air outside of mission running and encourages further trade. OK, CCP. When are knives finally going to be improved? *CLOSED BETA VETERAN SINCE REPLICATION BUILD*
Clone D Grundstein Automation 28	Posted - 2014.01.12 20:22:00 - [66] - Quote Valmar Shadereaver wrote: ... ppl playing every day of every week of evry month to get there cap done and some extra 1K matches This is a modern miracle. I obviously can't compete with that level of drive. It's like a force of nature; just awesome. Thanks for opening my eyes to the extent of what the DSM-V classifies as an illness. I'm just saying that I'd like to be able to have access to the deeper parts of the game without forming an obsessive habit. Here's an excerpt from http://www.dsm5.org/Documents/Internet%20Gaming%20Disorder%20Fact%20Sheet.pdf "The GÇ£gamersGÇ¥ play compulsively, to the exclusion of other interests, and their persistent and recurrent online activity results in clinically significant impairment or distress. People with this condition endanger their academic or job functioning because of the amount of time they spend playing. They experience symptoms of withdrawal when pulled away from gaming." Grundstein Automation
Clone D Grundstein Automation 28	Posted - 2014.01.13 23:21:00 - [67] - Quote Okay, understanding the majority's position, what if it were capped to only 3 million purchased SP per character: $5 = 1 million SP $10 = 2 million SP $15 = 3 million SP That would prevent the game from becoming too unbalanced and would give beginners a way to select a variety of skills and develop their character a little faster. Just a little nudge to character development. It seems like a happy medium to me. Grundstein Automation
Marlin Kirby KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 229	Posted - 2014.01.13 23:23:00 - [68] - Quote This is a horrible pay to win idea. There is nothing you can say that can make it seem otherwise. The not Logic Bomb! -->We need better comms!<--
Clone D Grundstein Automation 28	Posted - 2014.01.13 23:24:00 - [69] - Quote Marlin Kirby wrote: This is a horrible pay to win idea. You have to admit, 3 million SP is marginal in the long run, but would make a big impact on beginners. Grundstein Automation
ADAM-OF-EVE Dead Man's Game 773	Posted - 2014.01.14 00:36:00 - [70] - Quote -1 because this idea would kill off dust overnight https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=99075&find

Tallen Ellecon KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 1197	Posted - 2014.01.14 00:58:00 - [71] - Quote Clone D wrote: I wouldn't buy Aurum, and I won't purchase boosters, but I'd pay 5 bucks for a million SP. I have shortly reached a point where I feel like I'm wasting my time grinding away on the battlefield waiting for the next 3% upgrade that I can achieve in two weeks time (or more). I'd rather just skip playing altogether and find another game to enjoy while my passive SP accumulates. Why would I want to continue playing a game that takes so long to level up? The payoff just isn't worthwhile. Well CCP won't do it. They make make more per SP with boosters and the timer keeps it from becoming pay to win. I'd like easy SP too but it's not going to happen, at least not for that amount. Tarn chose peace. Tallen chose war. Where is my Gallente sidearm? SoonGäó514
Meee One Clones Of The Damned Zero-Day 102	Posted - 2014.01.14 01:40:00 - [72] - Quote 8/10 Good troll thread OP! You persistently insult anyone who disagrees with you. You have managed to bait players into responding. And you 'withdrew' your petition but still manage to post it every few posts. You have everyone convinced you are a snobby brat that desires an easy out. AND you use big words as well as psychological problems to try to insult and convince people to join your parade of retardation. You are a master of the troll arts. To people such as myself who can see through your act,you appear like a baby crying because it can't get to the cookie jar on the top shelf. Take your pseudo intellectualism (aka a big word tantrum) and gtfo! tl;dr Don't feed the troll.
Aikuchi Tomaru Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 1544	Posted - 2014.01.14 02:00:00 - [73] - Quote Sophie DV wrote: As much as i understand your reasoning, I doubt Dust will ever let you buy any adv or proto level blueprint original - it goes against the whole risk-vs-reward system that the Eve universe revolves around. Especially considering the devs are working on removing blueprints / changing the way how they work. Advanced and Prototype Blueprints for real money would be extremely P2W. This is something that never should happen. Clone D wrote: Okay, understanding the majority's position, what if it were capped to only 3 million purchased SP per character: $5 = 1 million SP $10 = 2 million SP $15 = 3 million SP That would prevent the game from becoming too unbalanced and would give beginners a way to select a variety of skills and develop their character a little faster. Just a little nudge to character development. It seems like a happy medium to me. Why should CCP change this? I mean they have Aurum and Boosters who give you exactly that. I you don't want to buy Aurum it's your problem. Sign up for Caldari FW and defeat the evil Gallente Overlords!
Clone D Grundstein Automation 28	Posted - 2014.01.14 02:20:00 - [74] - Quote Meee One wrote: 8/10 Good troll thread OP! You persistently insult anyone who disagrees with you. You have managed to bait players into responding. And you 'withdrew' your petition but still manage to post it every few posts. You have everyone convinced you are a snobby brat that desires an easy out. AND you use big words as well as psychological problems to try to insult and convince people to join your parade of retardation. You are a master of the troll arts. To people such as myself who can see through your act,you appear like a baby crying because it can't get to the cookie jar on the top shelf. Take your pseudo intellectualism (aka a big word tantrum) and gtfo! tl;dr Don't feed the troll. It is not my intention to insult anyone, only to promote the idea that many kinds of players are part of the community, not only a single profile. I have had a lot of fun getting take downs left and right with militia gear, but I will patiently wait out my characters' maturation. I apologize for any damage done, but I don't see any harm in offerring up a new perspective. I do publicly withdraw my petition. Thank you all for taking the time to consider the idea and provide feedback. Best regards Grundstein Automation
LEHON Xeon Pradox XVI Proficiency V. 62	Posted - 2014.01.14 02:48:00 - [75] - Quote I'd love to buy SP as much as the next guy, but I don't ever see that happening in DUST. Necrophillia: That Uncontrollable Urge To Crack Open A Cold One.
Stephen Seneca Providence Guard Templis CALSF 51	Posted - 2014.01.14 05:57:00 - [76] - Quote I just want to touch on a point I think this entire thread is missing. This is a sandbox game. You must interact with others. I know the full potential of the sandbox element hasnt been reached at this point. We dont have a real market and whatnot. In any case, youre supposed to be squadding with people and not taking on the entire team by yourself. Individual SP are nice and do help. Squads and tactics help exponentially. Ive experienced this within the Cal/Gal FW matches time and time again. Being in squads helped me to get my nearly level 6 standing with Caldari, not my SP. The point is to make good contacts with people you enjoy playing this game with. I feel like choosing a faction to fight for exclusively gives you both a goal and people interested in the same fight. The point is to win the war, not grind out your cap every week. I personally feel like I was competing the whole time, regardless of my SP. Fighting the Gals I maintained a +1 kdr and had wins against proto squads when we were squadding up. Even use my nova knives on their incapacitated proto clones. It brings me joy. Just get with a good group of guys and be effective but most importantly have fun. This is a game. If you cant do that without the SP this game is clearly not for you. (But it might be in a year and a half) For the State! Keep your stick on the ice and get the pucks in deep, eh. Rail Rifles. All. The. Way!
Sophie DV Mind Games For Party Animals 19	Posted - 2014.01.14 07:06:00 - [77] - Quote Hey guys! If i may interject, someone made a (i think it was sarcastic, but hey) comment in one of the earlier posts, and it gave me an idea. The comment was something along the lines of paying $50 for 10m SP, being a one time deal. Now, think for a second - Whats wrong with THAT? It would give enough SP to get half-decent core skills and maybe 1 weapon and 1 specialized dropsuit to proto levels. Make it available only ONCE per character and only if that character is less than 1 or 2 months old (so noone complains about the already high-sp players getting even more annoying to play against) It would essentially be a "Combat Readyness Clone Enhancement" or something. Let it work for each of the character slots on an account (i bet alot of people would pay some cash to have an insta-specializable alt?) It wouldnt negate the work of perfecting a character - 10m SP isnt enough to get proto everything, so it wouldn't leave you with nothing left to work toward. What do you guys think? Try not to be biased one way or the other - understand that there are (at least) 3 sides to this: - Those that want to pay for instant rewards - Those who think that rewards need to be worked for and people shouldn't be able to easily pass them so 'easily' - Those who believe 'It's the journey that counts, not the destination' Dust really IS a harsh environment to get started in with low SP, and while free players might expect to rough it for a bit while their skills stabilize, i can't see anything wrong with people paying some cash for the ability to be half-decent at ONE THING right away. I bet alot of the pay-to-win people who rush into paying money will end up with dreadfully inbalanced skills anyways (all core or all suit or all weapons, for example) I don't think it would break the game at all, and it would certainly allow those players who are frustrated with dust a chance to take a small jump forward. My .02 iskies.
MINA Longstrike 2Shitz 1Giggle 203	Posted - 2014.01.14 08:26:00 - [78] - Quote Clone D wrote: Valmar Shadereaver wrote: ... ppl playing every day of every week of evry month to get there cap done and some extra 1K matches This is a modern miracle. I obviously can't compete with that level of drive. It's like a force of nature; just awesome. Thanks for opening my eyes to the extent of what the DSM-V classifies as an illness. I'm just saying that I'd like to be able to have access to the deeper parts of the game without forming an obsessive habit. Here's an excerpt from http://www.dsm5.org/Documents/Internet%20Gaming%20Disorder%20Fact%20Sheet.pdf "The GÇ£gamersGÇ¥ play compulsively, to the exclusion of other interests, and their persistent and recurrent online activity results in clinically significant impairment or distress. People with this condition endanger their academic or job functioning because of the amount of time they spend playing. They experience symptoms of withdrawal when pulled away from gaming." So people who play a game mostly because they enjoy it are all now automatically addicts to the point of being willing to lose their jobs over an activity? I wonder what that might say about you as you seem to be willing to drop a few hundred bucks to 'skip to the end' instead of simply being happy with what you have, enjoying the game and upgrading your stuff as sp allows. Your attitude towards people who play more often than you completely defeats any merit your arguments might have held.
BAD FURRY Oh No You Didn't 251	Posted - 2014.01.14 10:04:00 - [79] - Quote Clone D wrote: I wouldn't buy Aurum, and I won't purchase boosters, but I'd pay 5 bucks for a million SP. I have shortly reached a point where I feel like I'm wasting my time grinding away on the battlefield waiting for the next 3% upgrade that I can achieve in two weeks time (or more). I'd rather just skip playing altogether and find another game to enjoy while my passive SP accumulates. Why would I want to continue playing a game that takes so long to level up? The payoff just isn't worthwhile. id pay my 2 cents to see you leave the world of EvE
Clone D Grundstein Automation 31	Posted - 2014.01.14 11:35:00 - [80] - Quote BAD FURRY wrote: its about talking to other players as you and they have fun working as a TEAM to back up what you dont have in SP to get cake. I'm glad you brought this up. This is a great point. My experiences on the battlefield have taught me a few things and I have developed a few practices to stay alive on the battlefield. I'd be interested in your opinion of these principles: I always try to take the time to give people a ride in dropships or LAVs. Usually, people blow me off because they either want to trek on foot or they are too interested in their own objectives and would rather request their own vehicle. I always try to revive a fellow soldier if I can do it safely and bring them back in a low risk situation so that they don't immediately die. I am as courteous as I can be when it comes to revives, because I'd rather have a friend alive on the battlefield than my +60 revive points. I do not usually experience reciprocity in these values. I can't tell you how many times I have been revived to die again before I even had control of my character even though I was attempting a power slide or jump as soon as I saw a medic attending my merc. I always try to form a defensive line with soldiers taking heat to help keep them alive and strengthen the team's position. I have noticed that other mercs are generally not patient enough to hold the line and remain in position until an advantage has been achieved. Most will get antsy and run out into fire instead of following sound battle tactics. I always try to lay down suppressive fire for a buddy who may be inexperienced and exposes him/herself to danger. I usually try to contribute to HAV takedowns. I have two tactics. 1.) If I can reach a resupply depot, then I will change dropsuits to anti-armor or grab some demolitions. 2.) If I don't have any tools to fight a tank, then I will use myself as a distraction by running up in the face of the HAV where the turret is too slow to turn as I run around. I can distract the tank while others attack and usually walk away from the experience. I use other team members' drop uplinks and mobile reanimation units as often as possible to give them a +25. I ride with team mates as often as possible so that they don't end up isolated and alone when they arrive at their destination. I bail if I see that the vehicle is obviously going to be destroyed but I always check around the wreckage for survivors to regroup. I often see heroism on the battlefield which some may call stupidity, but I observe soldiers, whether it be for WP or team work rushing into danger to capture an objective, i.e. hack something in a hazardous zone. I will stand by and watch their back, defending them from assassins who prey on hackers. If the area is secure, then I will run to assist their hacking efforts. Overall, I will always try to aid a fellow team member if I can, but I have not experienced a reciprocation of these values on the battlefield. Often I glance at the minimap and ask myself, what just happened to my team? It's like dust blown in the wind; they scatter whimsically as if they have no concept of team morale. Because of these lessons, I have learned to watch my own six and never expect a team mate to support me against flanked and rear attacks. I have learned to be a guardian angel, and have experienced the joy of working on a team a total of three times out of hundreds of battles. At the end of a game, I will add contacts of players that I respect from the killboard. I don't receive mail/notifications from other players, even though I usually finish in the top 3. I don't have any psn friends who play this game, although I have recommended it. So my experience playing the game has been one of the lone wolf. I tried being a squad leader many times when I first started playing the game, but squad members did not follow tactical commands. I watched in amazement as green dots spread all over the map, while I was slowly moving in on the target with my A-45 Quantum Acive Sanner, providing useful, lasting information. I have often taken one for the team and stayed behind to guard captured null cannons against great odds, when everyone else had split because it will be boring standing around or they are hungry for WP. The game does not reward players who make sacrifices like that. Is it a game for teamwork? Yes, I recognize and promote it. But I have rarely seen teams/players that exhibit a strong solidarity. We will get farther when we work together. I hope to meet courteous soldiers like you on the battlefield. Grundstein Automation

Clone D Grundstein Automation 31	Posted - 2014.01.14 11:48:00 - [81] - Quote MINA Longstrike wrote: Your attitude towards people who play more often than you completely defeats any merit your arguments might have held. I am providing subjective feedback about how many hours I am willing to play the game. Honestly, I don't care about what other people do with their lives, and I do not pass judgement on them because life is hard and one must do whatever one can to make sense of it. Clone D wrote: I'm just saying that I'd like to be able to have access to the deeper parts of the game without forming an obsessive habit. I think I should be able to make significant progress by playing about 2 hours per week. I understand that other people play a lot more. When I check out the top scores on the leader boards, I calculate that some people must play about 10 hrs a day, 30 days out of the month. I can't afford that kind of time commitment, but I can throw a few bucks into developing my character, hence my original petition. I don't need to max out every skill in the tree. I would like to improve a few key skills to level 5 though. Two weeks or more for one level is not an appropriate amount of time playing a game for +3%. Grundstein Automation
Clone D Grundstein Automation 31	Posted - 2014.01.14 12:01:00 - [82] - Quote Aikuchi Tomaru wrote: I mean they have Aurum and Boosters The difference is the amount of time that it takes to wait for those 3 million SP. Like I said before: Clone D wrote: You have to admit, 3 million SP is marginal in the long run, but would make a big impact on beginners. Grundstein Automation
Timothy Reaper WASTELAND JUNK REMOVAL Top Men. 760	Posted - 2014.01.14 12:21:00 - [83] - Quote Nice story, but I have a better one. puts on reading glasses, clears throat "There once was a man from Nantucket..." Never argue with stupid people, they will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience.* Mark Twain
Clone D Grundstein Automation 31	Posted - 2014.01.14 13:49:00 - [84] - Quote Timothy Reaper wrote: "There once was a man from Nantucket..." Rational people think in the margin. Providing an opportunity with a cap (3 mill per char or 10 mill per char) would be a much needed benefit to beginners while keeping balance overall. Grundstein Automation
Clone D Grundstein Automation 31	Posted - 2014.01.14 13:56:00 - [85] - Quote I like where you're going Sophie! Sophie DV wrote: Make it available only ONCE per character and only if that character is less than 1 or 2 months old (so noone complains about the already high-sp players getting even more annoying to play against) It would essentially be a "Combat Readyness Clone Enhancement" or something. We could add conditions so that it can't be abused. Another example would be: If the character has less than 10 million lifetime SP, the SP may be purchased in units of 1 million. Grundstein Automation
Sophie DV Mind Games For Party Animals 21	Posted - 2014.01.14 20:02:00 - [86] - Quote Anything that helps pay-to-players get at least a small bit of specialized equipment is whats needed, i think. The fact that it takes such a long time to even get into an advanced suit with advanced gear with mid-range core skills is a little too much to ask EVERYONE to do, IMO. Giving new players a chance to start with 10m SP instead of 500k SP certainly wouldnt break the game in any way.
lee corwood Knights Of Ender Public Disorder. 359	Posted - 2014.01.14 21:57:00 - [87] - Quote Clone D wrote: Skihids wrote: The journey is a good deal of the experience, and skipping it to reach the "destination" robs the game of a good deal of what it has to offer. I like your philosophical stance. I have extrapolated many lessons from the game concerning moral behavior, online sociology, battle tactics when the odds are against you, and how easily soldiers of the future become fatigued. I reached a point when the game began to feel like work and the rewards weren't frequent enough. I am ready to fast forward through all of the repetition and get to the goods. The game is not refreshingly novel enough for me to spend years capping out every week, but it is cool enough to wait 1.5 years and come back. In the end, it is just a game. Why should I be throttled back just because I do not choose to make it a lifestyle? I'm not hating, but from reading several of your posts, I honestly don't think the game is for you. If it isn't fun for you now, I don't think it will be fun for you down the road when you have 'better' gear. I've seen lots of players with skills I will never have, that dominate this game in militia gear. I will never be that person. I'm a below average player but I'm having fun with the people I am playing with. I also have a job that takes a good portion of my day. I still have time to hit the gym, cook my meals, spend time with my family and play dust. I don't cap weekly (I have a few times on accident) and honestly I don't care to, I'm just playing to have fun (some days that is easier than others). From your posts and your very mature responses however, I get the feeling you're wanting to fast forward some of this because you want to reach a finality to the game and move on. The way this game is building, I don't think there will ever be a finality. I think it was intended to always be expanding and ever improving and thus not leading to a 'I beat the game' state that I think you might be subconsciously searching for. Minmatar Logisis \| Heavy lover. Come get some badass Band-Aids from this chick
lee corwood Knights Of Ender Public Disorder. 360	Posted - 2014.01.14 22:01:00 - [88] - Quote Also, I will be the first to advocate that newer players are getting the worst experience of their lives joining into this game in the state they are in. However, I don't think more SP is the answer to that. I think tiered matching, improved academy and a truly balanced system with better ttk is the answer to that. Giving someone more advancement to better gear they are still not good at using because they don't have the experience under their belts yet will not make them better at the game. I think that's the fast track to more players getting 1-5 ADV suits, losing them immediately and being forced to use starter kits again because they ran out of all their isk. We already have that trend today. It will be even worse with more expensive gear on the field. Minmatar Logisis \| Heavy lover. Come get some badass Band-Aids from this chick
Aero Yassavi Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 5076	Posted - 2014.01.14 22:24:00 - [89] - Quote Lt Royal wrote: Fizzer94 wrote: Passive SP boosters... A 7 day one will get you approximately 84000 SP. This^^ Also: 30 day passive boosters net you just over 1 million SP per month! Exactly what I was going to say. You can already buy SP, it just gets delivered over a period of time instead of instantly. A 30 day passive SP booster costs 28,000 AUR which is 14 USD and nets you an extra 360,000 SP over the course of a month. I wonder how many people have ever thought of it in terms like that. $14 for 360k SP. Even if you pay money in this game, you aren't getting that much more. That's why I love all the people who try to claim this game is Pay to Win. ARC Commander CPM Info and Q&A - Status: Open
Meee One Clones Of The Damned Zero-Day 105	Posted - 2014.01.14 22:52:00 - [90] - Quote Sophie DV wrote: Anything that helps pay-to-players get at least a small bit of specialized equipment is whats needed, i think. The fact that it takes such a long time to even get into an advanced suit with advanced gear with mid-range core skills is a little too much to ask EVERYONE to do, IMO. Giving new players a chance to start with 10m SP instead of 500k SP certainly wouldnt break the game in any way. Don't know if serious or just a troll. I've played for a litte whille and EARNED 9 mill SP. And you want players to receive it instantly. -specialised equipment -boosters -aur gear 9/10 Trolling. You say 'wouldn't break the game'.You mean 'i want it handed to me'. You are yet ANOTHER baby crying because it can't get to the cookie jar on the top shelf.

Meee One Clones Of The Damned Zero-Day 105	Posted - 2014.01.14 22:58:00 - [91] - Quote Clone D wrote: We could add conditions so that it can't be abused. Another example would be: If the character has less than 10 million lifetime SP, the SP may be purchased in units of 1 million. Proof positive you're a troll. You'withdrew' your petition,and now are trying to find work arounds to have a form of it implemented. Then you'll say "the noobs can do it,why not the vets,it's not fair" Then you'll campaign to have it fully integrated,ruining Dust. STOP NOW.
Sophie DV Mind Games For Party Animals 22	Posted - 2014.01.15 00:58:00 - [92] - Quote Meee One wrote: Sophie DV wrote: Anything that helps pay-to-players get at least a small bit of specialized equipment is whats needed, i think. The fact that it takes such a long time to even get into an advanced suit with advanced gear with mid-range core skills is a little too much to ask EVERYONE to do, IMO. Giving new players a chance to start with 10m SP instead of 500k SP certainly wouldnt break the game in any way. Don't know if serious or just a troll. I've played for a litte whille and EARNED 9 mill SP. And you want players to receive it instantly. -specialised equipment -boosters -aur gear 9/10 Trolling. You say 'wouldn't break the game'.You mean 'i want it handed to me'. You are yet ANOTHER baby crying because it can't get to the cookie jar on the top shelf. I've got over 17m sp myself, and that was enough to get one proto suit, 2 proto weapons and very high core skills. Maybe 10m is a little extreme, but anything less than 5m won't result in serious improvements. And due to skill bonuses, especially regarding weapons and core armor/shield/cpu/pg, having the SP to upgrade them can even make militia suits decent. I myself have been trying militia suits in ambush lately with good results. I still agree with the fellow who said that the new player experience needs better matchmaking, etc etc... It's because of the matchmaking imbalances that people are wanting some SP to begin with. Now, i know my proposed solution isnt perfect, but the alternative (that currently happens more often than you think) is that people simply don't play at all while they accumulate their first few million SP. They arent getting any better at the game, they will still lose a ton of advanced suits or whatnot when they get back. Why not just let them support Dust development with real money in exchange for not having to wait that few month period? Be open minded about this, and think; Wouldn't it even out matches a bit more if the average newberry on your team could use advanced damage mods or an advanced level weapon? The 'elite' power squads/corps would lose more proto suits on average, and be more likely to use advanced or standard in order to make pubstomping not cost them tonnes of isk. So yeah, what about 25 bucks for a starting 5m SP? Thats at least enough for lvl 3-4 core skills, an advanced basic frame and an advanced weapon. Not exactly game breaking gear, and the passive bonuses from skills would even out the game alot. 0.06 isk.
Scott Knight Osmon Surveillance Caldari State 2	Posted - 2014.01.15 03:46:00 - [93] - Quote Honestly if you are going to start selling proto blueprints it should be a significant cost, something like $25 or $50 dollars. The way the dust economy is supposed to work, blueprint items should never go above basic. If they go to advance it should be rare. But never prototype.
Scott Knight Osmon Surveillance Caldari State 2	Posted - 2014.01.15 03:55:00 - [94] - Quote I have 10m in skill points and recently made a new character. Honestly I don't feel like this new character needs anything. With a basic heavy dropsuit he can still do Fairly well. Yeah his weapons need more skill points in them, but that's about it. Granted he isn't quite as good as my 10m sp character, but he still does pretty well. As a side note my 10m character has no advance dropsuits. I run a skinweave with the exile assault rifle. And militia gear for everything else. Only problem I've had thus far is going against an entire team of proto guys.
Clone D Grundstein Automation 32	Posted - 2014.01.15 12:26:00 - [95] - Quote Scott Knight wrote: Honestly I don't feel like this new character needs anything. I agree. I can take any brand new character without any skills in a non-academy setting and get a chain of 10 kills. That's not the issue. I am interested in the science driving the game. We're all dealing with network lag + human response time, which on average can be anywhere from 250 milliseconds to 800 milliseconds. That means that if my out-of-the-box merc starts shooting your merc in the back with a militia assault rifle, then I could inflict between 102 HP and 340 HP of damage before you respond to your hit indicator. Not to mention that out-of-the-box mercs are terribly slow, unless sporting a Militia Minmitar Light Frame, so you'll most likely continue taking heat while you're responding to the threat. This implies that, while playing with militia gear without skill buffs, you had better be certain that nobody gets the drop on you. While there are many precautions one can take to avoid being ambushed, we are playing a battle game where threats abound and the viewport has restricted peripheral angle. Therefore rotation rate and inclination rate become a critical issues in order to maintain awareness at all times. This issue that I am facing isn't really about survival; it is competition. When up against proto gear, an out-of-the-box merc will be registered dead on the server before the player has any indication that he/she is being hit. That implies that to compete with proto gear, a player needs higher skill levels and proto gear. Since those can take a long time (many months or years) to acquire, then the players who have been playing longer will always have an advantage. So my point is that I will never play as many hours as those people, and while my skill level and knowledge base may be well developed, the amount of time I have played the game inhibits me from ever achieving a competitive edge. Have I gotten the drop on mercs with proto gear and made the +50 kill? Yes. It is a case of David and Goliath. Have I gotten the drop on mercs with proto gear and used all of my ammo on them with 100% accuracy and they turn around and in a split second I'm toast? Yes and that is an annoyance that would prevent me from wanting to play. It's simple, I want higher skill levels and better gear without having to play the game for a year or more. That is apparently very offensive to people who have been playing a long time and feel threatened by other players acquiring the same advantages that they have. Grundstein Automation
lee corwood Knights Of Ender Public Disorder. 367	Posted - 2014.01.15 12:46:00 - [96] - Quote Again, not yelling at you or calling you names, just having a mature disagreement. I don't think they bring the advantages you think. Running proto gear is its own risk losing an obscene amount of isk for a single loss. If I even lose one proto suit, I didn't make any money that game. I don't think that is strictly gear driven. I think its mostly experience driven understanding proper flanking and having memorized maps (because let's face it, we have like...4) and great squad work. I've seen better teamwork take down protos faster than I could blink. And yes, I've also had those situations where I shot a whole clip into someone's back to have them turn around and flick me off them like a sand gnat. It's not fun, but better gear isn't going to help me here either. The state of the game is horribly unbalanced. Ttk needs an adjustment as its simply too low to be competitive in any way. In my ADV logi suit, I can be one shotted to the body by a charged scrambler rifle. There are days I want to throw the controller too. However, I also see no problems with someone who can invest the time to be better at a game than I can be. In my personal opinion, time invest > money investment. I understand the game is free, but I don't expect my name to be at the top of the leaderboards because of money when someone is investing their real life time into the game. My time is valuable. I only have one life to live and its not going to be with me in front of my ps3 40 hours a week. We also have to understand that a lot of the current player base is a much younger generation as well. They don't have jobs. They come home, log in and play until the wee hours in the morning. I know I did when I was younger. So if I value my time so highly, I can't say I can value their time any less. I've been around this game for a while now, have 13 mil sp myself. I could have much, much more if I were a better player but I'm just not and I'm not mad about it. Given the cycles this game has been through, big kudos to those that stuck around because this is the best state this game has ever been in and that's really saying a lot. TL;DR: I don't think the issue is the SP gap, I think the issue is ttk, game balancing and a horrible new player experience. Minmatar Logisis \| Heavy lover. Come get some badass Band-Aids from this chick
Lt Royal Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 2478	Posted - 2014.01.15 12:57:00 - [97] - Quote I can't believe this thread is still going! Look mate; you should come out of this metaphorical black hole you are digging for yourself, smell the fresh air and stop wishing for something that is not going to happen. You will never be able to buy; SP or ISK, its just not ever going to happen. It doesn't fit in with the lore, it doesn't fit in with the progression system CCP have been development for the past 10 years and many would abuse it throwing 1000GÇÖs of RL money at this opportunity and gain 100GÇÖs of SP over night. Would that really be that fun? The answer is no. I hate to keep repeating myself; but its not going to happen, get over it and move on. Gÿ£GÿàGÿP Subdreddit Recruitment Video Gÿ£GÿàGÿP
Clone D Grundstein Automation 32	Posted - 2014.01.15 13:05:00 - [98] - Quote Lt Royal wrote: I can't believe this thread is still going! I hate to keep repeating myself; but its not going to happen, get over it and move on. If it's not going to happen, then this thread does you no harm and you may go on your way without worries. This conversation helps to form a concept of what the game means to people and many valuable side notes have already been discussed. It is a dialog for the community, for us to understand one another better and share our outlook. The same goes for any other thread. Just because I don't like what someone has to say, doesn't require them to hush up. Everyone here has a right to discuss what is important to them. I have certainly learned a lot by reading the ideas of other people. It may not always change my mind, but it teaches me what is going on in other people's heads. Grundstein Automation
Lt Royal Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 2479	Posted - 2014.01.15 14:00:00 - [99] - Quote Clone D wrote: Lt Royal wrote: I can't believe this thread is still going! I hate to keep repeating myself; but its not going to happen, get over it and move on. If it's not going to happen, then this thread does you no harm and you may go on your way without worries. This conversation helps to form a concept of what the game means to people and many valuable side notes have already been discussed. It is a dialog for the community, for us to understand one another better and share our outlook. The same goes for any other thread. Just because I don't like what someone has to say, doesn't require them to hush up. Everyone here has a right to discuss what is important to them. I have certainly learned a lot by reading the ideas of other people. It may not always change my mind, but it teaches me what is going on in other people's heads. From that reply I can indeed tell you have changed and learnt stuff and I apologise. Gÿ£GÿàGÿP Subdreddit Recruitment Video Gÿ£GÿàGÿP
Cyzad4 Blackfish Corp. 84	Posted - 2014.01.15 18:48:00 - [100] - Quote Clone D wrote: If it's not going to happen, then this thread does you no harm and you may go on your way without worries. This conversation helps to form a concept of what the game means to people and many valuable side notes have already been discussed. It is a dialog for the community, for us to understand one another better and share our outlook. The same goes for any other thread. Just because I don't like what someone has to say, doesn't require them to hush up. Everyone here has a right to discuss what is important to them. I have certainly learned a lot by reading the ideas of other people. It may not always change my mind, but it teaches me what is going on in other people's heads. TOO... MUCH... POLITE... ON... INTERNETS... CAN'T... BE... REAL... (Gò»°Gûí°n+ëGò»n+¦ Gö+GöüGö+ "fuck this I'm out"... ... ..."I'm back"

Stephen Seneca Providence Guard Templis CALSF 52	Posted - 2014.01.16 04:05:00 - [101] - Quote I need to keep the polite thread a-rockin'. Another thing that was touched on was the cost. Everything comes down to money. Hypothetical situation. Say you have 1 or 2 hours a week to play. You bought your 10 mil SP and can use a full proto suit. Im not sure how much they cost, Im assuming above the 100,000 isk mark. Lets just say 100k for this point. You would have to grind out ambushes with your garbage suits, 1 ambush per 1-2 suits. An ambush takes 6-10 minutes not counting fatal errors and disconnects. So you get 10 proto suits after an hour to play with, then you get your big match and could potentially lose them all. Im assuming you wont save your protos because the whole point is to use them. Is that worth it? For the State! Keep your stick on the ice and get the pucks in deep, eh. Rail Rifles. All. The. Way!
Seeth Mensch Hawkborn Brotherhood IMMORTAL REGIME 123	Posted - 2014.01.16 04:17:00 - [102] - Quote Clone D wrote: Tonka Legacy wrote: But i'd also pay 5 for 10mil isk. Good call. Here's a list of things for which I would fork over my hard earned cash. 1 million SP = 5$ Blueprint standard dropsuit = 5$ Blueprint advanced dropsuit = 10$ Blueprint proto dropsuit = 15$ ... Continue for each section of gear and vehicles with pricing appropriate to utility. I will never pay for microtransactions. If I buy something digital, then I expect to use it permanently. This game is too absurd to spend money on microtransactions. I like getting into the game, but I want to play for a reasonable amount of time and still have a powerful loadout. Currently I just play with militia gear all the time, because I don't want to care about how hard it is to earn ISK for expensive suits that will get demolished 1 second after spawning into an orbital strike. nonono. Blueprints at militia levels are barely acceptable--I say this as a person who has a lot of them. There is no way any balance could be achieved by giving anyone an advanced, much less prototype, BP suit. That advantage would rack up hugely, tailspinning the economy even worse than it is now! I have bought AUR for boosters. I wish it was an instant have-it-now sort of thing, that would be more satisfying, I think. It would also eliminate any respec need, because, "you dumped your points? Wait or get more." Finally, yeah, i kind of agree. I put down a chunk of change because my friends swore this was awesome. Now they are gone and I'm still going. I have hopes for the future, but this game feels very beta-quality to me. I play for team and corp, mostly now. Money should get you something in this game, a permanent thing. If they would let us have SKINS they could make bank, but they haven't even nailed good variety in gameplay yet. We'll see. It's still better than a lot of other options--maybe I just think that out of habit now. But I'm content with what I got. Hi! Gosh, I've missed you...with every bullet, plasma shot, rail gun, and missile.
Clone D Grundstein Automation 34	Posted - 2014.01.16 10:34:00 - [103] - Quote Stephen Seneca wrote: Is that worth it? I don't mind playing on and off with proto gear and militia gear. What really matters to me is getting my skill levels up so that I can make extremely cool, cheap suits. What I've found so far is that it's best to focus on a few key functions that I want out of each of my suits and then buff relevant attributes with high-level modules, never exceeding two modules where stacking penalties apply. I can get a decent build out of militia gear and lvl 1 dropsuits, and maybe throw in a high-level module or two. I'm playing the waiting game until my skill levels are where I want them. My typical match budget is approximately this: $15k Dropsuits $30k Transport (Dropship or LAV) Usually, I can return my transport and recover the cost leaving me with $15k or less expenses per match. At that rate, I could play with proto every other game. Sounds good to me :) Grundstein Automation
Clone D Grundstein Automation 34	Posted - 2014.01.16 10:53:00 - [104] - Quote Seeth Mensch wrote: Clone D wrote: Blueprint advanced dropsuit = 10$ Blueprint proto dropsuit = 15$ ... Continue for each section of gear and vehicles with pricing appropriate to utility. I will never pay for microtransactions. If I buy something digital, then I expect to use it permanently. This game is too absurd to spend money on microtransactions. nonono. Blueprints at militia levels are barely acceptable. I hear ya, and I agree that BPO proto would cause a huge change in the economy. Just sayin' that it's definitely something I would pay real money for. There are too many acts of god that would cause one to lose an expensive proto suit in under 1 second: spawn farming, orbital strikes, distant missile launchers, snipers, explosions near spawn points, friendly vehicle deployments, dropship crashes, spawning into a wall and all kinds of hazards outside of view or detection. As a rule, even with cheap suits, I never spawn into a firefight. I always spawn in a calm area due to the clone generation vulnerability. This keeps pointless deaths to a minimum. Even so, Charge Sniper Rifle - Damage 451. Grundstein Automation
Cyzad4 Blackfish Corp. 86	Posted - 2014.01.16 13:46:00 - [105] - Quote Clone D wrote: Stephen Seneca wrote: Is that worth it? I don't mind playing on and off with proto gear and militia gear. What really matters to me is getting my skill levels up so that I can make extremely cool, cheap suits. What I've found so far is that it's best to focus on a few key functions that I want out of each of my suits and then buff relevant attributes with high-level modules, never exceeding two modules where stacking penalties apply. I can get a decent build out of militia gear and lvl 1 dropsuits, and maybe throw in a high-level module or two. You can make all kinds of fun cheap stuff w MLT gear decent mods my default loadout is MLT G-1 3x adv Armour plates nanohive SMG grenades CR whole thing costs around 10k (give or take) Nothing quite as fun as massacring someone in a loadout thats literally 10x the cost of your own. (Gò»°Gûí°n+ëGò»n+¦ Gö+GöüGö+ "fuck this I'm out"... ... ..."I'm back"
Clone D Grundstein Automation 34	Posted - 2014.01.16 14:30:00 - [106] - Quote Cyzad4 wrote: my default loadout is MLT G-1 3x adv Armour plates nanohive SMG grenades CR Very nice, I will certainly try that when I can use enhanced armor plates. I might modify the 3x enhanced Armor plates to 2x enhanced Armor plates and an armor repairer, since the third armor plate slot will suffer massive stacking penalties (only 62.76 additional HP even though -3% movement speed). I wrote an article about stacking penalties here: http://grundsteinautomation.tumblr.com/post/70191411111/dust-514-stacking-penalties-rule-of-thumb Grundstein Automation
lee corwood Knights Of Ender Public Disorder. 376	Posted - 2014.01.16 16:22:00 - [107] - Quote Stephen Seneca wrote: Im not sure how much they cost, Im assuming above the 100,000 isk mark. Lets just say 100k for this point. My proto suit is 200k, but then again I'm also carrying way more equipment than most people as a logi, but still. I know some great smart builds that can be made placing proto modules on ADV suits, but using a proto suit to carry cheap crappy modules is a huge waste of money, which is usually why most proto suits cost people up in the 130k+. You should always skill your mods ahead of your suit. Otherwise, you'll be in a isk black hole with no better performance to show for it. Minmatar Logisis \| Heavy lover. Come get some badass Band-Aids from this chick
Clone D Grundstein Automation 34	Posted - 2014.01.16 16:36:00 - [108] - Quote lee corwood wrote: You should always skill your mods ahead of your suit. Agreed. Cheap dropsuits compounded by skills and gear can go a long way. Grundstein Automation
Maken Tosch Edimmu Warfighters Gallente Federation 6468	Posted - 2014.01.16 16:40:00 - [109] - Quote Clone D wrote: Okay, understanding the majority's position, what if it were capped to only 3 million purchased SP per character: $5 = 1 million SP $10 = 2 million SP $15 = 3 million SP That would prevent the game from becoming too unbalanced and would give beginners a way to select a variety of skills and develop their character a little faster. Just a little nudge to character development. It seems like a happy medium to me. I don't think you get it. This won't happen. Period. It's still too pay to win anyways since you can train up a whole suit with 3 million SP in an instant. OK, CCP. When are knives finally going to be improved? *CLOSED BETA VETERAN SINCE REPLICATION BUILD*
Clone D Grundstein Automation 34	Posted - 2014.01.16 16:47:00 - [110] - Quote Maken Tosch wrote: It's still too pay to win anyways Yes, that is a common theme in this thread. It is my goal to enrich this thinking with a fact. Players either pay with money or with time. Some people are richer in time than other people so they can afford proto gear. Some people like me would rather spend money than months and years of time on a game. So one way or another, players pay. Regardless of how you pay, it is pay to win. Grundstein Automation

Cyzad4 Blackfish Corp. 86	Posted - 2014.01.16 18:46:00 - [111] - Quote Clone D wrote: I might modify the 3x enhanced Armor plates to 2x enhanced Armor plates and an armor repairer, since the third armor plate slot will suffer massive stacking penalties (only 62.76 additional HP even though -3% movement speed). I've tried swapping one out for a repper before but the rate always seems too slow to be of much use. For me personally I've never really noticed the -3% penalty to be overly bothersome, But again that's just personal preference. lee corwood wrote: You should always skill your mods ahead of your suit. This is something that should be highly strenuated to new players. Personally I don't even have any proto suits (granted I pretty much only solo in pub matches so there's no real need) but all my core skills are maxed and I've got prof 3 in 2 Lt weapons and SMG and that seems to make me at least if not more than a match for many players i come across. (Gò»°Gûí°n+ëGò»n+¦ Gö+GöüGö+ "fuck this I'm out"... ... ..."I'm back"
Clone D Grundstein Automation 34	Posted - 2014.01.16 18:53:00 - [112] - Quote Cyzad4 wrote: I've tried swapping one out for a repper before but the rate always seems too slow to be of much use. I noticed a trend that raw defensive HP beats just about anything. I'll definitely give the 3x enhanced armor plates a go then, that is when I can use adv plates. Grundstein Automation
Clone D Grundstein Automation 35	Posted - 2014.01.16 19:52:00 - [113] - Quote I would like to hear more factual information concerning new players. Are they starting a new character and sticking around to take the abuse, or are they leaving temporarily to let SP accumulate, or are they left feeling helpless and abandoning the game for good. Pretty much everyone admits that new players have it bad. Most players that I've heard to date fall into this camp insofar as recommending an easier beginner experience: Fix team matching so that battles are more even, and extend the battle academy. I have a few other ideas as well. I'd like to discuss this one first: All gear under a skillset could be available upon purchasing skill level 1. For instance, Assault Rifle - Point and shoot. Do I really need skill level 5 to use Duvolle equipment? The cost is still prohibitive enough to prevent people from rushing out into every battle with proto. What do you think? Right now, higher level players have skill buffs + proto. Noobs have nothing. Allowing all equipmet at level 1 would tighten the gap between new players and lifers. Grundstein Automation
Valerie Viever Hellstorm Inc League of Infamy 60	Posted - 2014.01.16 20:10:00 - [114] - Quote Why are people still commenting about this.
Cyzad4 Blackfish Corp. 87	Posted - 2014.01.17 00:30:00 - [115] - Quote Clone D wrote: All gear under a skillset could be available upon purchasing skill level 1. For instance, Assault Rifle - Point and shoot. Do I really need skill level 5 to use Duvolle equipment? The cost is still prohibitive enough to prevent people from rushing out into every battle with proto. My first thought would be "not gunna happen", First thought would be that it wouldn't actually end up helping the NPE. Newberries spec into 1 level, funnel all their isk for some proto because "it's the most expensive therefor the best", then go broke because they still suck and quit, likely telling everyone how terrible a game Dust is. But rational reason or not Dust is F2P so hugely grind oriented, the longer people play the more likely they are to buy in game items. I can't imagine CCP choosing to bypass a possible source of income. (Gò»°Gûí°n+ëGò»n+¦ Gö+GöüGö+ "fuck this I'm out"... ... ..."I'm back"
Clone D Grundstein Automation 35	Posted - 2014.01.17 03:28:00 - [116] - Quote Cyzad4 wrote: First thought would be that it wouldn't actually end up helping the NPE. I'm a new player, so let me describe my NPE. My first impression of Dust was that I was annoyed because my merc would be dead before I had any indication that I was being hit. No problem, I can attribute that to network lag and low HP as a beginner. So once I started digging into the game, I discovered that I didn't have very many equipment options, due to skill requirements. Dust feels too limiting, like it is funnelling me through some arbitrary agenda. I can't get Biotic upgrades until I reach level 4 of Dropsuit Upgrades (which has no benefit whatsoever). So the skill tree is a complete imbroglio. My merc can use a Militia Active Scanner, but is apparently not skilled enough to use an advanced/proto active scanner? That's like saying I know how to tune into FM radio, but I'm not skilled enough to change the setting to AM radio yet. What is that all about? Same goes for all equipment. The skill progression is an embarrasment. The gear doesn't make sense either, like a 45 db built-in dropsuit scanner is light enough to fit on a scout suit, but they can't build a 45 db scanner into a heavy suit? Lame. The damage system doesn't make sense. A complement of rockets can't at least immobilize a tank? Due to adding by percentages, skill buffs will add +100 HP to heavy armor, but + 20 to light armor? This doesn't make any sense at all. How does a skill add armor? Material mass adds armor. The hit detection is pathetic. The list of things that blow my mind are endless, so why did I want to play again? Because I wanted to understand the game and why people play it. So I learned the system, the skill tree, the gear, the feel of all of the various suits I could get my hands on. I created 15 different characters each specializing in a different skillset in order to broaden my knowledge of the game. So now that I have briefly described the scope of my NPE, I can tell you with a fully qualified opinion that something is incredibly imbalanced with this game and it is directly related to how when a player earns skill buffs, they can also get better gear, which compounds the graduations between player levels. Those two functions need to be decoupled. Balanced matchmaking would help, but it would also deny new players encounters with advanced behaviors. I have the skills to play the game and I have found that the limiting factor to my progression is the inaccessibility to skill levels and gear. So when I hear things like "noobs wouldn't know how to use proto gear properly", that is a blanket statement that does not accurately describe the situation. Some noobs would know how to use proto well enough, or would quickly adapt in order to be able to leverage the strength of proto while weighing the risk of losing expensive gear. Each individual should decide when to use proto or not depending on affordability, not skill level. Then freedom to choose loadouts would create a stronger sense of control. The NPE is one of being stuck at the bottom of a well, having no control whatsoever. That's my NPE: annoying - especially now that I know that the game is designed for characters to evolve over years of play and that there is no fast route for quick learners. It's like fighting elephants with mice. Hence, my inclination to step away from the game for 1.5 years and come back when SP has accumulated. Grundstein Automation
maeth-01 2501 DUST University Ivy League 30	Posted - 2014.01.17 06:23:00 - [117] - Quote only read the first post.... but 10 mil SP can be 5 months worth of work.....its almost a PAY TO WIN to a certain point and CCP wont do that *Laugh, and the world laughs with you;Weep, and you weep alone*
OZAROW Dem Durrty Boyz Renegade Alliance 1257	Posted - 2014.01.17 06:36:00 - [118] - Quote So get a booster! I bought boosters, lots of mercs bought boosters an we had to wait for them to gain a million, an get our @$$3$ handed to us in the meantime, your dead wrong if you think me or any other merc is gonna let you get 10 mill instantly for 50 bucks! SUPER NOVA KNIFE SAIYAN 4
Maken Tosch Edimmu Warfighters Gallente Federation 6472	Posted - 2014.01.17 07:40:00 - [119] - Quote Clone D wrote: Maken Tosch wrote: It's still too pay to win anyways Yes, that is a common theme in this thread. It is my goal to enrich this thinking with a fact. Players either pay with money or with time. Some people are richer in time than other people so they can afford proto gear. Some people like me would rather spend money than months and years of time on a game. So one way or another, players pay. Regardless of how you pay, it is pay to win. Quit trying to pass on your twisted definition of what is considered pay to win to try to justify implementing an mechanic that has so much negative stigma on it that it almost gives me cancer. You and I fully know that pay to win in the context of games only involves real world cash. And if you're so desperate to gain so much SP using cash as a crutch, why don't you play other games that have it already rather than bring dust down to such pitiful levels? OK, CCP. When are knives finally going to be improved? *CLOSED BETA VETERAN SINCE REPLICATION BUILD*
Maken Tosch Edimmu Warfighters Gallente Federation 6472	Posted - 2014.01.17 07:43:00 - [120] - Quote Seriously, I don't care what you say on the matter. Pay to win is not the way to go. Either grind for what you want, buy boosters or get out. OK, CCP. When are knives finally going to be improved? *CLOSED BETA VETERAN SINCE REPLICATION BUILD*

Derpty Derp Derpty Derp Derr Deerrr 1	Posted - 2014.01.17 08:00:00 - [121] - Quote Limit it to the amount that people who started playing in beta can have gotten from passive sp... As it stands if you started playing before someone else it's an unfair advantage with no way to catch up. I started playing about a year after a large number of people made an account and would have no plans of buying anything, but I see no difference in facing people who started before me to get ahead and people who buy their way to get ahead (apart from one lot of people contributing to the game.)
Iron Wolf Saber Den of Swords 12180	Posted - 2014.01.17 08:30:00 - [122] - Quote Its called a booster, you wont get that million instantly but over the course of many games or days. CPM 0 Secretary Omni-Soldier, Forum Warrior, Annoying Artist \\= Advanced Caldari Assault // Unlocked
Clone D Grundstein Automation 35	Posted - 2014.01.17 11:20:00 - [123] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Its called a booster, you wont get that million instantly but over the course of many games or days. Get out your calculator or a spreadsheet: OMEGA BOOSTER (100% Passive SP Bonus) will give you an additional 24k SP per day. It takes 41.66 days to earn 1 million SP which costs 90277.7 AUR. If you shell out $99 to buy 200k AUR + 25K bonus, then that's .00044 Dollars per AUR. 1 million SP costs $39.72 and takes 41.66 days to earn. OMEGA BOOSTER ........... 1 million SP ............. $39.72 .............. 41.66 days PASSIVE BOOSTER ......... 1 million SP ............. $34.22 .............. 83.33 days That is not remotely close to the product offering that I am suggesting. If you want 10 million SP (counting only SP earned from booster), then you'd have to pay $397.22 and wait 416.66 days. THAT'S OVER A YEAR AT A RIDICULOUS PRICE! Grundstein Automation
Spartan MK420 D.A.R.K L.E.G.I.O.N D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 81	Posted - 2014.01.17 11:34:00 - [124] - Quote -1 you know how many freaking super tanks/dropships would be roaming the field within the first week of this? I know I would have one on my alt. Unofficial D.A.R.K.L.E.G.I.O.N team mascot.
Clone D Grundstein Automation 35	Posted - 2014.01.17 11:36:00 - [125] - Quote Spartan MK420 wrote: -1 you know how many freaking super tanks/dropships would be roaming the field within the first week of this? I know I would have one on my alt. Ever watch The Incredibles? Syndrome says, "... and when everyone's super, no one will be." Grundstein Automation
Ripley Riley 346	Posted - 2014.01.17 13:27:00 - [126] - Quote Suanar Daranaus wrote: Troll Thread Yes, it is. It's got an air of believability with the "I'm a grown up with grown up things to do!" line of reasoning and he takes time to reply to nearly every comment. 6 out of 10 troll only because P2W trolls are clich+¬. Clone D wrote: I am simply stating that the game is designed to reward people who devote their lives to it, not people who have skills, but are outclassed by proto. I would pay for SP. The community resists the idea. I respect that. Not a troll. Simply a heart felt request stemming from my own personal values that do not reflect the values of the majority. Our dialog has ended. Majority rules. I can abide. Peace In the extremely unlikely event that you are not a troll, let me ask you a serious question: did you really think anyone would go for this? You are asking thousands of people who have spent hundreds of hours playing Dust to allow someone to essentially pay a few bucks to instantaneously equal them in hard-earned SP. All because they have grown up problems... Here's a fun fact Clone D, we all do. We're parents, we work full time (sometimes multiple jobs), we have significant others, take care of a home, and still manage to win matches. I don't cap out every week, but I do occasionally and I work 50 - 55 hours a week myself. If you want to buy SP then buy active and passive SP boosters. I notice my SP gains skyrocket when I started using active boosters, and passive boosters are just gravy. Login every day, even for a minute or two, for that sweet 6,000 daily consecutive log in bonus. One final thought before I leave you: having more SP =/= I win button. I routinely kill prototype suits in a STD fitting. Run with a squad of corpmates and your chances of stomping, even in MIL gear, exponentially increase. For poops and laughs my corp ran an all MIL fit night. We went 6-1 in public contracts. "I need not food nor water. Your tears alone sustain me." - Ripley Riley
Clone D Grundstein Automation 35	Posted - 2014.01.17 13:41:00 - [127] - Quote Ripley Riley wrote: did you really think anyone would go for this? I didn't know. That's why I brought it up. The idea has been spurned by many. Obviously, the community would rather pay for this: OMEGA BOOSTER ........... 1 million SP ............. $39.72 .............. 41.66 days My observations tell me that I am better off walking away and letting SP accumulate, since there is no following for the idea of purchasing limited amounts of SP per character. Read the entire thread and you will understand that my goal is not to win, but to achieve a competitive state with old-timers who have a huge advantage only due to the amount of time that they devote to the game. Grundstein Automation
Iron Wolf Saber Den of Swords 12192	Posted - 2014.01.17 13:52:00 - [128] - Quote Clone D wrote: Spartan MK420 wrote: -1 you know how many freaking super tanks/dropships would be roaming the field within the first week of this? I know I would have one on my alt. Ever watch The Incredibles? Syndrome says, "... and when everyone's super, no one will be." Cept not everyone can afford to be super, hence why the 1% argument keeps popping up at poor people's rallys. CPM 0 Secretary Omni-Soldier, Forum Warrior, Annoying Artist \\= Advanced Caldari Assault // Unlocked
Clone D Grundstein Automation 35	Posted - 2014.01.17 14:02:00 - [129] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: ... not everyone can afford to be super, hence why the 1% argument keeps popping up at poor people's rallys. If you think about it, my idea would save people who buy boosters both time and money. People who play for free are already being outclassed by people who purchase boosters anyway. I don't think it's about the money. I think it's about justification of effort: People who have put hundreds of hours into this game need to feel like they had a good reason for doing so. If SP could be purchased cheaply, then they might feel like their hard earned SP was a waste of time and it would subtract meaning from their lives. If you ask me, they're the one's who aren't playing for fun. They're playing for power, and anything that threatens that power, i.e. allowing noobs to catch up to their status quickly, makes them afraid, so they respond with hostility as opposed to reason. Like I said before, I'd shell out a few bucks on a game, but I won't pay with my life. Grundstein Automation
Cyzad4 Blackfish Corp. 89	Posted - 2014.01.17 14:02:00 - [130] - Quote Clone D wrote: I can't get Biotic upgrades until I reach level 4 of Dropsuit Upgrades (which has no benefit whatsoever). Agreed, Dropsuit upgrades should be changed to either a useful buff or removed all together, as it is it's nothing more than an SP sink right now and not even a well veiled one. Clone D wrote: My merc can use a Militia Active Scanner, but is apparently not skilled enough to use an advanced/proto active scanner? That's like saying I know how to tune into FM radio, but I'm not skilled enough to change the setting to AM radio yet. This can be said about every game with skill leveled items/weapons though, which is to say basically every game. I can swing a sword but why can't I swing that slightly longer one?. Clone D wrote: The gear doesn't make sense either, like a 45 db built-in dropsuit scanner is light enough to fit on a scout suit, but they can't build a 45 db scanner into a heavy suit? Lame. I know this seems a bit silly but it's a way to make suits/equipment more role specific, adds more flavour to the battlefield. Clone D wrote: The hit detection is pathetic. hahahahaha if you think this is bad you should've been here 6-8 moths ago. Clone D wrote: ...something is incredibly imbalanced with this game and it is directly related to how when a player earns skill buffs, they can also get better gear, which compounds the graduations between player levels. Those two functions need to be decoupled. Balanced matchmaking would help, but it would also deny new players encounters with advanced behaviors. I honestly think balanced matchmaking would help this game immensely, personally I'm on the equipment specific side of the argument; MLT/BASIC, ADV>, PROTO> higher cost/risk=higer reward and would leave veterans open to play with "the new kids", after a much longer and more encompassing battle academy that is. Also a full MTL line needs to be available so people don't bother sinking SP into something random that won't be used later on. (Gò»°Gûí°n+ëGò»n+¦ Gö+GöüGö+ "fuck this I'm out"... ... ..."I'm back"

Ripley Riley 346	Posted - 2014.01.17 14:29:00 - [131] - Quote Clone D wrote: My observations tell me that I am better off walking away and letting SP accumulate, since there is no following for the idea of purchasing limited amounts of SP per character. Good plan. 1.5 years may not be long enough though. By then the people who play the game 2 - 4 times a week will have earned even more SP so you will be that much rather behind. I'd wait 3 years... oh damn, I just realized by then we will have earned EVEN MORE SP Better stay gone for 4.5 years... OH NO, we will have tremendous amounts of SP by then!!! You should probably come back in 6 years... "I need not food nor water. Your tears alone sustain me." - Ripley Riley
Dimitri Rascolovitch The Immortal Knights 111	Posted - 2014.01.17 14:35:00 - [132] - Quote Clone D wrote: Sophie DV wrote: I've been playing since partway through the closed beta, and it's my opinion that with enough experience, you'll appreciate the skills more if you have to wait to train them, and you'll also appreciate the more powerful suits the more you play with the militia ones. Sophie, I like and understand everything you said, and I appreciate your perspective. Here's where I'm coming from. I'm a working adult, and I don't have time to sit around trying to earn more SP so that I can upgrade my loadout. My philisophical stance is this: Why should you have better gear than I do just because you've been playing the game longer? It is digital, ethereal, electronically generated equipment we are playing with. It's not like working out at the gym to develop superior physical musculature. I want to pay cash so that I can have character skill levels and equipment that rival someone who has time to play day in and day out. When it comes to game knowledge and thumb/finger dexterity, I'm sure that my personal skills and practical knowledge are on par with my opponents. I just want the chance to fight without being at a disadvantage because of gear. Yes, we have all learned our lesson that Dust 514 = injustice. I am not shedding tears here, because personally, this ridiculous game makes me laugh so hard. I'm just stating my case that I would gladly pay for some SP since I don't want to spend my life hours earning points in a video game. although i understand where you are coming from, if we were to shorten this, you want the game to be pay to win ...Yeah, i use a heavy machine gun, and I think i do a Damn good job at it. i eat babies forum warrior Lv0
Clone D Grundstein Automation 35	Posted - 2014.01.17 14:39:00 - [133] - Quote Ripley Riley wrote: Good plan. 1.5 years may not be long enough though. 1.5 years will get me some core skills and a few extras. I'm sure that will be plenty regardless of how much time you grind between now and then. Good luck Grundstein Automation
Ripley Riley 347	Posted - 2014.01.17 14:50:00 - [134] - Quote Clone D wrote: 1.5 years will get me some core skills and a few extras. I'm sure that will be plenty regardless of how much time you grind between now and then. A corpmate of mine got all of the skills in the Dropsuit Upgrades tree to V inside of two months... that's with some SP spent on combat rifles... 1.5 years is vastly over estimating the time it takes to get core skills to V. Have your considered the possibility that you are just bad at this game? "I need not food nor water. Your tears alone sustain me." - Ripley Riley
Dimitri Rascolovitch The Immortal Knights 112	Posted - 2014.01.17 14:53:00 - [135] - Quote the skills are easy, you just need to actually play the game, you cant just jump in and expect to be just ad good as everyone else this is new eden not COD ...Yeah, i use a heavy machine gun, and I think i do a Damn good job at it. i eat babies forum warrior Lv0
Clone D Grundstein Automation 35	Posted - 2014.01.17 15:17:00 - [136] - Quote Ripley Riley wrote: Have your considered the possibility that you are just bad at this game? Educate yourself before speaking. Read the whole thread. Already answered. Grundstein Automation
Clone D Grundstein Automation 35	Posted - 2014.01.17 15:22:00 - [137] - Quote Dimitri Rascolovitch wrote: the skills are easy, you just need to actually play the game Another nescient responder. Read the whole thread. Grundstein Automation
Dimitri Rascolovitch The Immortal Knights 113	Posted - 2014.01.17 15:39:00 - [138] - Quote Clone D wrote: Dimitri Rascolovitch wrote: the skills are easy, you just need to actually play the game Another nescient responder. Read the whole thread. i read your first two posts, both went like this "i dont have the time to play because of my 'life' but i have money so that should make me as good as everyone else who actually earned their skills" ...Yeah, i use a heavy machine gun, and I think i do a Damn good job at it. i eat babies forum warrior Lv0
Ripley Riley 347	Posted - 2014.01.17 15:43:00 - [139] - Quote Clone D wrote: Educate yourself before speaking. Read the whole thread. Already answered. I hear what you are saying, but... have you considered it? I have recruited friends of mine to play Dust 514 very recently. They come from everything from WoW, TF2, CoD, BF, to Eve. Some of them are terrible at games of the FPS variety; they complain about low SP being this massive hurdle to overcome and bellyache about not being able to fit X, Y, or Z. Meanwhile, the fellows that are veteran FPS players are having a ball. I help them with their fits so I know what they are using: their tanking modules are usually STD, weapons are STD or ADV, and everything else is MIL or STD. My point being they aren't running PRO by any means. Yet they still do well in matches and don't seem to mind being 10mil SP below me at all. You have indicated that games are not novel to you. You went on to say that you find it hard to justify the time it takes to play certain games like Dust. You also seem have problems striking a balance between being good at video games and good at life in general. Dust might be too taxing for you. I suggest something less stressful like macrame or water color painting. "I need not food nor water. Your tears alone sustain me." - Ripley Riley
Clone D Grundstein Automation 35	Posted - 2014.01.17 15:54:00 - [140] - Quote Ripley Riley wrote: Clone D wrote: Educate yourself before speaking. Read the whole thread. Already answered. I hear what you are saying, but... have you considered it? I have recruited friends of mine to play Dust 514 very recently. They come from everything from WoW, TF2, CoD, BF, to Eve. Some of them are terrible at games of the FPS variety; they complain about low SP being this massive hurdle to overcome and bellyache about not being able to fit X, Y, or Z. Meanwhile, the fellows that are veteran FPS players are having a ball. I help them with their fits so I know what they are using: their tanking modules are usually STD, weapons are STD or ADV, and everything else is MIL or STD. My point being they aren't running PRO by any means. Yet they still do well in matches and don't seem to mind being 10mil SP below me at all. You have indicated that games are not novel to you. You went on to say that you find it hard to justify the time it takes to play certain games like Dust. You also seem have problems striking a balance between being good at video games and good at life in Dust might be too taxing for you. I suggest something less stressful like macrame or water color painting. I would rate your reading and comprehension skills at just about 50%. Look for the author's intention. I also indicated that I can take any out-of-the-box merc and get a 10 kill chain in a non-academy environment. Player skill is not the issue. Game design is. I brought an idea to the table for discussion. If you think differently, that's fine, but please speak from an informed reference point. "Donny, you're out of your element." Grundstein Automation

Maken Tosch Edimmu Warfighters Gallente Federation 6478	Posted - 2014.01.17 16:13:00 - [141] - Quote @Clone D I can tell you're just a needy little brat for someone who is a grown up and you just want pay-to-win just for the sake of pay-to-win. And once again, don't bring up your twisted definition of what's considered pay-to-win for reasons that I already pointed out in the previous page. You just want to justify taking major shortcuts and undermine the efforts of everyone else around you because they have more SP, you don't, and you're jealous that we are ahead of you. For someone who is a grown up, you seem to lack the ability (let alone the intellect) to understand. After further reading, I have come to the conclusion that you have already made up your mind on the matter and you just want to make every effort to instill your twisted vision upon this game that doesn't want anything to do with it. One more thing, if you wanted to know what everyone thought about your idea you could have at least done a forum search. We have that feature, you know. There have been countless threads on it and on each and every one of them the debate has always ended with people that are mostly (and vehemently) against it. See for yourself. http://dustsearch.com/ OK, CCP. When are knives finally going to be improved? *CLOSED BETA VETERAN SINCE REPLICATION BUILD*
Ripley Riley 348	Posted - 2014.01.17 16:23:00 - [142] - Quote Maken Tosch wrote: One more thing, if you wanted to know what everyone thought about your idea you could have at least done a forum search. We have that feature, you know. There have been countless threads on it and on each and every one of them the debate has always ended with people that are mostly (and vehemently) against it. See for yourself. http://dustsearch.com/ He can't be troubled with forums searches, he is a busy grown up. Can he pay some money to have you do it for him? "I need not food nor water. Your tears alone sustain me." - Ripley Riley
Clone D Grundstein Automation 35	Posted - 2014.01.17 16:50:00 - [143] - Quote Dimitri Rascolovitch wrote: i read your first two posts Then you are comfortable in your ineptitude. Grundstein Automation
Maken Tosch Edimmu Warfighters Gallente Federation 6478	Posted - 2014.01.17 17:03:00 - [144] - Quote Ripley Riley wrote: Maken Tosch wrote: One more thing, if you wanted to know what everyone thought about your idea you could have at least done a forum search. We have that feature, you know. There have been countless threads on it and on each and every one of them the debate has always ended with people that are mostly (and vehemently) against it. See for yourself. http://dustsearch.com/ He can't be troubled with forums searches, he is a busy grown up. Can he pay some money to have you do it for him? That will be $1,000 in cash. No checks, money orders, and not even PayPal. OK, CCP. When are knives finally going to be improved? *CLOSED BETA VETERAN SINCE REPLICATION BUILD*
Clone D Grundstein Automation 35	Posted - 2014.01.17 17:05:00 - [145] - Quote Maken Tosch wrote: Ripley Riley wrote: Maken Tosch wrote: One more thing, if you wanted to know what everyone thought about your idea you could have at least done a forum search. We have that feature, you know. There have been countless threads on it and on each and every one of them the debate has always ended with people that are mostly (and vehemently) against it. See for yourself. http://dustsearch.com/ He can't be troubled with forums searches, he is a busy grown up. Can he pay some money to have you do it for him? That will be $1,000 in cash. No checks, money orders, and not even PayPal. Thanks for spamming this thread with juvenile dribble. Grundstein Automation
Ripley Riley 348	Posted - 2014.01.17 17:26:00 - [146] - Quote Clone D wrote: Thanks for spamming this thread with juvenile dribble. Your troll thread was losing momentum at around 7 pages. We've managed to push it out to almost 9! You should be thrilled. @Maken On a serious note, have your ever considered the idea of allowing new players the ability to purchase Recruit boosters? Recruit boosters cost as much AUR as a passive booster, but provide a +100% passive SP boost instead of +50%. They last 30 days. Recruit boosters do not come in varieties shorter than 30 days. Cannot be stored, unlike typical boosters; they are used immediately after you purchase them. This will prevent people from making alts just to buy omegas and transfer them to their mains. They are only available for the first 30 days of a new player's career. Pros: New players will get a slow injection of SP spread out over several months Separates fools from their mon-I MEAN, provides an option for grown-ups with too many grown-up things to do Can you think of any cons? "I need not food nor water. Your tears alone sustain me." - Ripley Riley
Maken Tosch Edimmu Warfighters Gallente Federation 6478	Posted - 2014.01.17 17:40:00 - [147] - Quote Ripley Riley wrote: Clone D wrote: Thanks for spamming this thread with juvenile dribble. Your troll thread was losing momentum at around 7 pages. We've managed to push it out to almost 9! You should be thrilled. @Maken On a serious note, have you ever considered the idea of allowing new players the ability to purchase Recruit boosters? Recruit boosters cost as much AUR as a passive booster, but provide a +100% passive SP boost instead of +50%. They last 30 days. Recruit boosters do not come in varieties shorter than 30 days. Cannot be stored, unlike typical boosters; they are used immediately after you purchase them. This will prevent people from making alts just to buy omegas and transfer them to their mains. They are only available for the first 30 days of a new player's career. Pros: New players will get a slow injection of SP spread out over several months Separates fools from their mon-I MEAN, provides an option for grown-ups with too many grown-up things to do Can you think of any cons? I'm gonna be neutral on that. OK, CCP. When are knives finally going to be improved? *CLOSED BETA VETERAN SINCE REPLICATION BUILD*
Maken Tosch Edimmu Warfighters Gallente Federation 6478	Posted - 2014.01.17 17:41:00 - [148] - Quote Clone D wrote: Maken Tosch wrote: Ripley Riley wrote: Maken Tosch wrote: One more thing, if you wanted to know what everyone thought about your idea you could have at least done a forum search. We have that feature, you know. There have been countless threads on it and on each and every one of them the debate has always ended with people that are mostly (and vehemently) against it. See for yourself. http://dustsearch.com/ He can't be troubled with forums searches, he is a busy grown up. Can he pay some money to have you do it for him? That will be $1,000 in cash. No checks, money orders, and not even PayPal. Thanks for spamming this thread with juvenile drivel. It's an honor to spam a thread that is already about juvenile drivel anyways. OK, CCP. When are knives finally going to be improved? *CLOSED BETA VETERAN SINCE REPLICATION BUILD*
Clone D Grundstein Automation 35	Posted - 2014.01.17 18:02:00 - [149] - Quote Maken Tosch wrote: It's an honor to spam a thread that is already about juvenile drivel anyways. I am not easily susceptible to normative conformity, so I expressed an idea for discussion. People who discourage individual thinking are called fascists. There's a noticeable difference between a genuine disagreement and asinine remarks. Your flippant fear-based opposition reeks of mendacity. Enjoy your power trip. It will give you something to reflect back on when you arrive at the conclusion that you have no true friends or self respect. Grundstein Automation
Ripley Riley 349	Posted - 2014.01.17 18:15:00 - [150] - Quote Clone D wrote: Enjoy your power trip. It will give you something to reflect back on when you arrive at the conclusion that you have no true friends or self respect. You paint yourself as very enlightened then make personal attacks against posters who disagree with you. Back to the discussion at hand: have you learned your lesson that buying SP isn't something the community wants or needs? If so, I think we can go back to playing video games or whatever-the-hell Clone D does that is incredibly important. "I need not food nor water. Your tears alone sustain me." - Ripley Riley

Clone D Grundstein Automation 35	Posted - 2014.01.17 18:24:00 - [151] - Quote Ripley Riley wrote: You paint yourself as very enlightened then make personal attacks against posters who disagree with you. Back to the discussion at hand: have you learned your lesson that buying SP isn't something the community wants or needs? If so, I think we can go back to playing video games or whatever-the-hell Clone D does that is incredibly important. I'm just not into passive resistance when it comes to fascism. Yes, the voice of the community has been heard. I leave you in peace :) Grundstein Automation
Cyzad4 Blackfish Corp. 89	Posted - 2014.01.17 18:36:00 - [152] - Quote I was wondering how long it would take for this thread to degrade to name calling... now where were we? (Gò»°Gûí°n+ëGò»n+¦ Gö+GöüGö+ "fuck this I'm out"... ... ..."I'm back"
Maken Tosch Edimmu Warfighters Gallente Federation 6480	Posted - 2014.01.17 19:39:00 - [153] - Quote Clone D wrote: Maken Tosch wrote: It's an honor to spam a thread that is already about juvenile drivel anyways. I am not easily susceptible to normative conformity, so I expressed an idea for discussion. People who discourage individual thinking are called fascists. There's a noticeable difference between a genuine disagreement and asinine remarks. Your flippant fear-based opposition reeks of mendacity. Enjoy your power trip. It will give you something to reflect back on when you arrive at the conclusion that you have no true friends or self respect. Wait, I'm a fascist? I never knew. Anyways, if you are not easily susceptible to normative conformity, then why are you conforming to the "we want pay-to-win" crowd? So you want to be different? Then go over to that group that is full of people who want to be different. OK, CCP. When are knives finally going to be improved? *CLOSED BETA VETERAN SINCE REPLICATION BUILD*
Maken Tosch Edimmu Warfighters Gallente Federation 6480	Posted - 2014.01.17 19:40:00 - [154] - Quote Cyzad4 wrote: now where were we? That will be $50. OK, CCP. When are knives finally going to be improved? *CLOSED BETA VETERAN SINCE REPLICATION BUILD*
Timtron Victory Tech Guard RISE of LEGION 44	Posted - 2014.01.17 20:35:00 - [155] - Quote End this thread already. I got lost at page 3 or 4. Pay to win is already available in a way with boosters. I dont intend to spend AURUM on this game. I never played FPS or any first person games before only third person. My draw to this game was that we could create your own weapons. I spread my SP thing and didn't try militia variants. I left the game for a few months came back and just try to do the weekly SP bonus. I am not too bothered if I don't make it. I think the OP entire point is ironic. He says its just a game but he cannot let it go. If the game pisses me off too much I leave it for a few weeks and come back. Nothing to get so pissed off about Proud Christian Jesus Loves You
Cyzad4 Blackfish Corp. 89	Posted - 2014.01.17 22:27:00 - [156] - Quote Maken Tosch wrote: That will be $50. hahaha, that was directed more at Clone but thx (Gò»°Gûí°n+ëGò»n+¦ Gö+GöüGö+ "fuck this I'm out"... ... ..."I'm back"
Stephen Seneca Providence Guard Templis CALSF 53	Posted - 2014.01.17 23:35:00 - [157] - Quote Can't let this die... Anyways, while playing my WoT I thought of something. Well I didn't so much think of it myself but kinda just stole the idea. Im assuming Clone is too cheap to pay for aurum now but wants to supplement his SP gain. So I have an idea, not related to the OP or the name calling. A daily SP bonus for your first match/win. So players who don't play often get a little kick for their one match of the day. This wouldn't bother any players because everyone gets it. People who still play longer will still have more SP gain.. etc. So relatively everyone stays at the same level and those who play less often get a slight boost. fancy words and insults regarding your extreme right or left wing actions Cheers, eh. For the State! Keep your stick on the ice and get the pucks in deep, eh. Rail Rifles. All. The. Way!
maeth-01 2501 DUST University Ivy League 32	Posted - 2014.01.18 01:10:00 - [158] - Quote Clone D wrote: Cyzad4 wrote: First thought would be that it wouldn't actually end up helping the NPE. I'm a new player, so let me describe my NPE. My first impression of Dust was that I was annoyed because my merc would be dead before I had any indication that I was being hit. No problem, I can attribute that to network lag and low HP as a beginner. So once I started digging into the game, I discovered that I didn't have very many equipment options, due to skill requirements. Dust feels too limiting, like it is funnelling me through some arbitrary agenda. I can't get Biotic upgrades until I reach level 4 of Dropsuit Upgrades (which has no benefit whatsoever). So the skill tree is a complete imbroglio. My merc can use a Militia Active Scanner, but is apparently not skilled enough to use an advanced/proto active scanner? That's like saying I know how to tune into FM radio, but I'm not skilled enough to change the setting to AM radio yet. What is that.....blah blah blah. 5 months ago I was in your shoes....now im either Advanced or Proto in most of the gear I have.....yes its a meat grinder and you get killed a lot of the time........I remember the days when I would go 1/17 KDR now I go 25+/0 most of the time....you will notice a lot of people will have proto guns and advanced suits and the rest of the equipment will be a mish mash of different typs to fit in with the PG and CPU.....it wont take long and the more you play the easier it gets *Laugh, and the world laughs with you;Weep, and you weep alone*
Aizen Intiki Hell's Gate Inc League of Infamy 702	Posted - 2014.01.18 01:52:00 - [159] - Quote It's never going to happen. So you can stop asking. "Hello, world!" lol, sounds like something a whore lover would say Alt of the great Godin I like chocolate ^___^
Clone D Grundstein Automation 37	Posted - 2014.01.18 05:33:00 - [160] - Quote Aizen Intiki wrote: It's never going to happen. So you can stop asking. I can stop asking, and you can stop being a maggot obstructing the creative process. Grundstein Automation

Dimitri Rascolovitch The Immortal Knights 114	Posted - 2014.01.18 05:42:00 - [161] - Quote Clone D wrote: Aizen Intiki wrote: It's never going to happen. So you can stop asking. I can stop asking, and you can stop being a maggot obstructing the creative process. your creative process has been rejected by not only the community, but the entire basis of the game, as well as the developers give up on it and move on ...Yeah, i use a heavy machine gun, and I think i do a Damn good job at it. i eat babies forum warrior Lv0
Clone D Grundstein Automation 37	Posted - 2014.01.18 06:15:00 - [162] - Quote Dimitri Rascolovitch wrote: your creative process has been rejected by not only the community, but the entire basis of the game, as well as the developers give up on it and move on This conversation was becoming civilized and a thread for serious information exchange before a group of pre-rational mental snails decided to camp out here and pester the OP. This game teaches us to return fire, so don't expect to create senseless resistance without taking some flak. You mindless invertebrates have tried to douse the proposal by saying that it is against the game and the community without reading the entire thread and observing developments in understanding and reasonable negotiations. I understand that confused bigots abound in subcultures like this one, but please, give it a rest and let people discuss things in peace. You make the world an unpleasant place. Please change. Grundstein Automation
Dimitri Rascolovitch The Immortal Knights 114	Posted - 2014.01.18 06:25:00 - [163] - Quote both the title and OP of the thread indicate "i want pay to win" thus pointing out that you dont belong in new eden and should not be taken seriously you remind me of this Asian kid i know, you talk **** and then pretend to be the "bigger" person and act all cutsey sad ...Yeah, i use a heavy machine gun, and I think i do a Damn good job at it. i eat babies forum warrior Lv0
Clone D Grundstein Automation 37	Posted - 2014.01.18 06:27:00 - [164] - Quote Dimitri Rascolovitch wrote: both the title and OP of the thread indicate "i want pay to win" thus pointing out that you dont belong in new eden and should not be taken seriously There is an old saying. Do not judge a book by its cover. You would do well to heed its wisdom. Grundstein Automation
lee corwood Knights Of Ender Public Disorder. 384	Posted - 2014.01.18 19:22:00 - [165] - Quote Clone D wrote: You make the world an unpleasant place. Please change. This is now one of my favorite quotes Minmatar Logisis \| Heavy lover. Come get some badass Band-Aids from this chick
Maken Tosch Edimmu Warfighters Gallente Federation 6492	Posted - 2014.01.18 21:17:00 - [166] - Quote Clone D wrote: Dimitri Rascolovitch wrote: both the title and OP of the thread indicate "i want pay to win" thus pointing out that you dont belong in new eden and should not be taken seriously There is an old saying. Do not judge a book by its cover. You would do well to heed its wisdom. Welcome to New Eden. Here, pay-to-win is taken to the backyard and shot in the head with a blaster like Old Yeller. If you don't like it, the door is that way. No is stopping you from leaving. In fact, we just want you gone. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j5WxRC9jcxs&list=PLA19164DFA1080FBB&index=61 OK, CCP. When are knives finally going to be improved? *CLOSED BETA VETERAN SINCE REPLICATION BUILD*
Cyzad4 Blackfish Corp. 89	Posted - 2014.01.19 00:25:00 - [167] - Quote Stephen Seneca wrote: A daily SP bonus for your first match/win. So players who don't play often get a little kick for their one match of the day. This wouldn't bother any players because everyone gets it. People who still play longer will still have more SP gain.. etc. So relatively everyone stays at the same level and those who play less often get a slight boost. Not a bad idea actually, can't really do much other than possibly increase consistent player base (if only slightly) and from CCP's side more people actually playing rather than just logging in and collecting the bonus means higher chance of them spending real $ on AUR. (Gò»°Gûí°n+ëGò»n+¦ Gö+GöüGö+ "fuck this I'm out"... ... ..."I'm back"
Stephen Seneca Providence Guard Templis CALSF 53	Posted - 2014.01.19 01:30:00 - [168] - Quote Yeah, I think the daily bonus might be the best petition for those strapped for time. CloneD doesnt seem too worried about other peoples SP levels relative to his own, so a bit more incentive for playing once a day to get more SP might be wise. The log in bonus is nice and all but we need incentives to bring activity. For the State! Keep your stick on the ice and get the pucks in deep, eh. Rail Rifles. All. The. Way!


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