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Swarm Launchers Are Not Meant To Be The Answer To Tanks

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Kane Fyea Scions of Athra 2398	Posted - 2013.12.15 20:27:00 - [31] - Quote Snip
Kane Fyea Scions of Athra 2398	Posted - 2013.12.15 20:28:00 - [32] - Quote Soulja Ghostface wrote: once again we forget that that 1. swarms are invisible (proto) 2. they go around walls 3. in open field they cannot outrun swarms 4. this encourages tactial play as you must get close enough with the swarms 5. forge guns cannot do 1. and 2. 1. You do know that this is a bug right? 2. They appear that way on your screen but on mine they don't go around walls 3. Yea but then your dead almost instantly vs tanks in open fields 4. This isn't encouraged enough with me being killed in less half a second already and having shitty anti infantry abilities
Soulja Ghostface MCDUSTDONALDS Zero-Day 2062	Posted - 2013.12.15 20:34:00 - [33] - Quote Kane Fyea wrote: Soulja Ghostface wrote: once again we forget that that 1. swarms are invisible (proto) 2. they go around walls 3. in open field they cannot outrun swarms 4. this encourages tactial play as you must get close enough with the swarms 5. forge guns cannot do 1. and 2. 1. You do know that this is a bug right? 2. They appear that way on your screen but on mine they don't go around walls 3. Yea but then your dead almost instantly vs tanks in open fields 4. This isn't encouraged enough with me being killed in less half a second already and having shitty anti infantry abilities Bingo! Again anyone who runs to a tank to AV him is a fool You must use and abuse those sniping towers As you forge a tank he dies or retreats. If you wannabe a d1ck lord. Forge snipe him while he's reatreating. Cruel but effective and why there is no point in swarming a tank. (Unless you get swarms of swarm launchers and swarm that tank) Gÿ£GÿàGÿPLogi Ranger is best at ASSAULTINGGÿ£GÿàGÿP *GO GO POWER RANGERS*
Soulja Ghostface MCDUSTDONALDS Zero-Day 2062	Posted - 2013.12.15 20:38:00 - [34] - Quote Don't line up 1 by 1 to take him on at a time like in the Kung-Fu movies point the forge at the tanks @$$ and pew pew (only guranteed success if the tanks hardners are cooldown) the point of 1.7 Gÿ£GÿàGÿPLogi Ranger is best at ASSAULTINGGÿ£GÿàGÿP *GO GO POWER RANGERS*
Reign Omega BurgezzE.T.F Public Disorder. 63	Posted - 2013.12.15 20:42:00 - [35] - Quote I have been getting a significant # of Vehicle kills by setting traps on the larger maps, it's not super efficient and I usually die several times in the process but eh.. See a tank? Set some mines down...usually further down the road he is/will be travelling on. (Vehicle hot routes.) Get behind said tank with Flux/AV and decent swarms. (Can be subbed for a duo/trio of basic swarms.) Punch tank in his giant buttcrack a few times forcing him to flee for reps. Receive +150, +50...etc etc as he drives over mines. Tank killing is by no means a simple process anymore, that being said I have lost several of MY own tanks from being careless or overestimating my strength in a given situation. I have maxed out armor tanks and Large Turrets, working on Shields next....
Soulja Ghostface MCDUSTDONALDS Zero-Day 2065	Posted - 2013.12.15 20:48:00 - [36] - Quote ^1 way Non heavies kill tanks.^ berries too lazy to do that. Then get on top of a building and forge snipe Gÿ£GÿàGÿPLogi Ranger is best at ASSAULTINGGÿ£GÿàGÿP *GO GO POWER RANGERS*
Reign Omega BurgezzE.T.F Public Disorder. 64	Posted - 2013.12.15 20:55:00 - [37] - Quote I think people are forgetting to scale these encounters, as you used to be able to pull out militia swarms with mods and take on the world. Yes...you WILL have to scale your skill to match the encounter. You will have to put points into AV to be effective. Militia crapola and STD gear will only just tickle a tank with proto mods. Based on the current schematics, the only thing that will be increased with prototype tanks will be Slot # and PG/CPU. MLT and STD tanks are essentially the same bearing in mind those 2 things. If you want to do damage, you have to spend SP it's that simple. Swarmers, even FG will just have to level up, build better fits, or work in groups. That being said, there should be a limit to how many tanks are fielded per match, it can be overwhelming for a team with no AV or an AVer with no team to tackle 6 tanks in a match lol.
Toby Flenderson research lab 148	Posted - 2013.12.15 20:55:00 - [38] - Quote Soulja Ghostface wrote: Toby Flenderson wrote: Benjamin Ciscko wrote: CrotchGrab 360 wrote: so tanks are meant to be able to rep through swarms? 1 swarmer I would say yes 2 swarmer's and you are breaking through is rep but not by much 3 swarmer's you have a chance of killing him 4+ swarmer's he has to be extremely skilled and extremely lucky to avoid death. Hahaha this is ridiculous. You shouldn't need 4 people to maybe kill 1 person. That's one quarter of the team sacrificing their primary and left arguably defenseless against most infantry. Are you even considering the frequent possibility of multiple tanks? Just how many dedicated SLs would your ideal build of Dust 514 require to take down 2 tanks? this is why forge guns are the only TRUE answer to tanks If there is any purpose for the SL it would be to take out vehicles. It literally cannot do anything else. I'm OK with it not being able to take out a tank in one clip but they are worthless as of now. If I strategically cut off an escape route and my squad mate running a (literally) max damage forge suit and he wounds the tank and scares it over to me, my 3 volleys should be able to finish him with a proto SL prof 3 and 3 complex damage mods. The fact that it can rep through it and just zoom away is ridiculous. If the only counter to a tank is to be a forge gun then someone with max proficiency, damage mods, and possibly the most skill with the weapon that I have ever seen should be able to beat a tank with the help of another SL tactically placed. I'd be ok knowing that if I managed to get to prof 5 and continue to stack my damage mods on the SL, then I could weaken a tank enough for someone else to finish it off. I don't need to be the hero as long as another person proficient in an AV weapon could finish what I started. But it should not take more than that.
Soulja Ghostface MCDUSTDONALDS Zero-Day 2066	Posted - 2013.12.15 21:03:00 - [39] - Quote Swarms do have a purpose. A slightly weaker alternative to the true AV class (fatboys) EDIT: They Still kill LAVS and dropships (if you play smart then you kill dropships) whats the problem EDIT2: You can still finish a TANK off with SWARMS if hardeners are off Gÿ£GÿàGÿPLogi Ranger is best at ASSAULTINGGÿ£GÿàGÿP *GO GO POWER RANGERS*
Django Quik Dust2Dust. 1920	Posted - 2013.12.15 21:11:00 - [40] - Quote Well, swarms can't outrun LAVs or reach dropships, so what are they meant for? Who would run a primary weapon that is only capable of annoying and will never get a kill? Dust2Dust - Funeral arrangements for all of New Eden. Join our public channel D2D. to chat and squad with us.

Justin Tymes Dem Durrty Boyz Renegade Alliance 555	Posted - 2013.12.15 21:18:00 - [41] - Quote Soulja Ghostface wrote: Swarms do have a purpose. A slightly weaker alternative to the true AV class (fatboys) EDIT: They Still kill LAVS and dropships (if you play smart then you kill dropships) whats the problem EDIT2: You can still finish a TANK off with SWARMS if hardeners are off Only bad dropship flyers get killed by Swarms now. Hell only bad dropship flyers were killed by swarms pre 1.7. My Militia LAV outruns swarms easily, they are not for killing LAVs with a 175 range lock. Only bad tankers are in AV range during cooldown.
Soulja Ghostface MCDUSTDONALDS Zero-Day 2067	Posted - 2013.12.15 21:21:00 - [42] - Quote Django Quik wrote: Well, swarms can't outrun LAVs or reach dropships, so what are they meant for? Who would run a primary weapon that is only capable of annoying and will never get a kill? Looksie at this real quik Why do you think the coverboy of dust is holding an assault rifle in his picture. (the caldari medium frame) why is the fatboy holding a forge gun the heavie is meant for doing the highest amount of damage to ANY vehicle The medium suit was intended for people who felt comfortable in normal FPS However those medium frames got shredded by a tank 1 too many time the devs took notice and made a swarm launcher Since they did not invest in the TRUE AV class... There is a slight penalty even though you swarmers got buffed in 1.4 (Lock On Times) The heavy is the games original and best AV class and it will always be ADAPT OR DIE Gÿ£GÿàGÿPLogi Ranger is best at ASSAULTINGGÿ£GÿàGÿP *GO GO POWER RANGERS*
Reign Omega BurgezzE.T.F Public Disorder. 66	Posted - 2013.12.15 21:22:00 - [43] - Quote Or you could all hop on the new FOTM Jihad Jeeps......funny how a tank has to be nervous when he hears LAVs nearby. Like an Elephant and a mouse..
Toby Flenderson research lab 148	Posted - 2013.12.15 21:25:00 - [44] - Quote Soulja Ghostface wrote: Swarms do have a purpose. A slightly weaker alternative to the true AV class (fatboys) EDIT: They Still kill LAVS and dropships (if you play smart then you kill dropships) whats the problem EDIT2: You can still finish a TANK off with SWARMS if hardeners are off They kill stupid dropships that fly close enough to be locked onto some of the times and only kill vehicles that are two stupid to just start driving away. If it's going to do so little against vehicles it shouldn't be a primary weapon. Or it should be able to kill infantry like the PLC. If a tank has less than a quarter of it's armor left and I hit all 3 volleys then it should go down hardeners or not. Tanks hear swarms and activate hardeners. There shouldn't be a two keystroke counter to an entire fit cued by a sound.
Toby Flenderson research lab 148	Posted - 2013.12.15 21:26:00 - [45] - Quote Reign Omega wrote: Or you could all hop on the new FOTM Jihad Jeeps......funny how a tank has to be nervous when he hears LAVs nearby. Like an Elephant and a mouse.. I would do that but sadly I play FW mostly and heard too much about people getting kicked for TK or friendly damage from this tactic. It does sound hilarious and a little intentional on CCP's side of things haha.
Django Quik Dust2Dust. 1920	Posted - 2013.12.15 21:27:00 - [46] - Quote Soulja Ghostface wrote: Django Quik wrote: Well, swarms can't outrun LAVs or reach dropships, so what are they meant for? Who would run a primary weapon that is only capable of annoying and will never get a kill? Looksie at this real quik Why do you think the coverboy of dust is holding an assault rifle in his picture. (the caldari medium frame) why is the fatboy holding a forge gun the heavie is meant for doing the highest amount of damage to ANY vehicle The medium suit was intended for people who felt comfortable in normal FPS However those medium frames got shredded by a tank 1 too many time the devs took notice and made a swarm launcher Since they did not invest in the TRUE AV class... There is a slight penalty even though you swarmers got buffed in 1.4 (Lock On Times) The heavy is the games original and best AV class and it will always be ADAPT OR DIE This does not answer my question. And no one gets to decide what the true classes of this game are except CCP and they've never said those guys in that pic are the only true classes. Dust2Dust - Funeral arrangements for all of New Eden. Join our public channel D2D. to chat and squad with us.
calisk galern BurgezzE.T.F Public Disorder. 1534	Posted - 2013.12.15 21:29:00 - [47] - Quote hmmmso light weapons shouldn't be able to kill heavies. I guess heavy suits need 17000hp and let's buff the hmg to deal 4500 damage a second, seems fine and follows the same line of thinking here.
Soulja Ghostface MCDUSTDONALDS Zero-Day 2069	Posted - 2013.12.15 21:33:00 - [48] - Quote DJANGO QUIK Look at this your attempt at trolling failed Quote: And no one gets to decide what the true classes of this game are except CCP and they've never said those guys in that pic are the only true classes. notice how they recomended heavy and forge gun for AV, not swarmers. GET YOUR TOGETHER and stop trying to prove me wrong, your looking mighty stupid Gÿ£GÿàGÿPLogi Ranger is best at ASSAULTINGGÿ£GÿàGÿP *GO GO POWER RANGERS*
Heavy Salvo Fatal Absolution 142	Posted - 2013.12.15 21:36:00 - [49] - Quote Feel like this whole thing has gone off the rails uhm...soooo for those of you who have never paid attention to damage types you do realize that swarms are considered explosive and when you apply how explosive damage works against dropsuit shielding and apply that to tanks you come out with reduced damage on the part of the gunnlogi, meaning that using a Swarms VS Gunnlogi argument to push for a buff for swarm launchers is completely and utterly pointless. A salute, to all the toy soldiers left to melt in the sun by those who would only dream of conquest.
Pvt Numnutz Black Phoenix Mercenaries 432	Posted - 2013.12.15 21:38:00 - [50] - Quote Benjamin Ciscko wrote: A swarm launcher is a light weapon it is meant for taking out light vehicles LAV's Forge Guns are heavy weapons they are meant to take out heavy vehicle HAV's Oh yeah, wow its amazing how much sense this made.

Soulja Ghostface MCDUSTDONALDS Zero-Day 2072	Posted - 2013.12.15 21:39:00 - [51] - Quote Footage of Forge gun dominance Gÿ£GÿàGÿPLogi Ranger is best at ASSAULTINGGÿ£GÿàGÿP *GO GO POWER RANGERS*
Toby Flenderson research lab 149	Posted - 2013.12.15 21:44:00 - [52] - Quote Django Quik wrote: Soulja Ghostface wrote: Django Quik wrote: Well, swarms can't outrun LAVs or reach dropships, so what are they meant for? Who would run a primary weapon that is only capable of annoying and will never get a kill? Looksie at this real quik Why do you think the coverboy of dust is holding an assault rifle in his picture. (the caldari medium frame) why is the fatboy holding a forge gun the heavie is meant for doing the highest amount of damage to ANY vehicle The medium suit was intended for people who felt comfortable in normal FPS However those medium frames got shredded by a tank 1 too many time the devs took notice and made a swarm launcher Since they did not invest in the TRUE AV class... There is a slight penalty even though you swarmers got buffed in 1.4 (Lock On Times) The heavy is the games original and best AV class and it will always be ADAPT OR DIE This does not answer my question. And no one gets to decide what the true classes of this game are except CCP and they've never said those guys in that pic are the only true classes. ^^^This. Apparently scouts are the true sniper classes too. Probably why everyone who wants to snipe goes straight to their gallente scout suitGÇª This guy basically just said "I found a picture of a heavy with a forge gun, therefore SLs should not be good". It's a picture. The logi doesn't have equipment, therefore he should not use equipment. Goodbye logis, your role has been proven to be nonexistent on the basis of a picture.
Vell0cet SVER True Blood Public Disorder. 714	Posted - 2013.12.15 21:45:00 - [53] - Quote Let's just assume the OP's premise is correct for the moment and swarms are working as intended. OP: would you ever want to dump massive amounts of SP into them? Would you want a dedicated swarmed specialist in your squad over other options? Would you bring a dedicated swarm specialist into your PC match, or take someone else? Would you reccomend swarms as a good specialty to a new player? I really don't see how anyone could answer yes to any of these questions. Given that, I really don't see how swarms can be working as intended. Quick/Dirty Test Range Idea
KING CHECKMATE Scions of Athra 3206	Posted - 2013.12.15 21:46:00 - [54] - Quote Benjamin Ciscko wrote: A swarm launcher is a light weapon it is meant for taking out light vehicles LAV's Forge Guns are heavy weapons they are meant to take out heavy vehicle HAV's Ok.So overall. Tanks only have 2 counters. Forge guns and other Tanks? HEH,no wonder... AV-TANK BALANCE = https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1612446#post1612446
Django Quik Dust2Dust. 1920	Posted - 2013.12.15 21:54:00 - [55] - Quote Soulja Ghostface wrote: DJANGO QUIK Look at this your attempt at trolling failed Quote: And no one gets to decide what the true classes of this game are except CCP and they've never said those guys in that pic are the only true classes. notice how they recomended heavy and forge gun for AV, not swarmers. GET YOUR TOGETHER and stop trying to prove me wrong, your looking mighty stupid What is your point? That a picture exists so defines everything that exists in the game? You still haven't answered what the point of swarms is since they can't kill anything. I don't dispute that forges are the best AV weapon but that doesn't mean that the one of the only true AV only weapons should be entirely useless at AV. CCP may recommend whatever they want but the fact is swarms were created for something and currently are capable of pretty much nothing. Dust2Dust - Funeral arrangements for all of New Eden. Join our public channel D2D. to chat and squad with us.
Soulja Ghostface MCDUSTDONALDS Zero-Day 2073	Posted - 2013.12.15 21:54:00 - [56] - Quote KING CHECKMATE wrote: Benjamin Ciscko wrote: A swarm launcher is a light weapon it is meant for taking out light vehicles LAV's Forge Guns are heavy weapons they are meant to take out heavy vehicle HAV's Ok.So overall. Tanks only have 2 counters. Forge guns and other Tanks? HEH,no wonder... theres moar. proximity mines are good enough i had to put an alarm system to survive. plasma cannons usually finish me if i just got out of tank or AV fight assault dropships hover above a tank and rain missles while he cant shoot you Even swarms can kill a WOUNDED tank so... yeah bud tanks have more than 2 counters Gÿ£GÿàGÿPLogi Ranger is best at ASSAULTINGGÿ£GÿàGÿP *GO GO POWER RANGERS*
Soulja Ghostface MCDUSTDONALDS Zero-Day 2073	Posted - 2013.12.15 21:56:00 - [57] - Quote Django Quik wrote: Soulja Ghostface wrote: DJANGO QUIK Look at this your attempt at trolling failed Quote: And no one gets to decide what the true classes of this game are except CCP and they've never said those guys in that pic are the only true classes. notice how they recomended heavy and forge gun for AV, not swarmers. GET YOUR TOGETHER and stop trying to prove me wrong, your looking mighty stupid What is your point? That a picture exists so defines everything that exists in the game? You still haven't answered what the point of swarms is since they can't kill anything. I don't dispute that forges are the best AV weapon but that doesn't mean that the one of the only true AV only weapons should be entirely useless at AV. CCP may recommend whatever they want but the fact is swarms were created for something and currently are capable of pretty much nothing. Quote: a light weapon makes them run away (But kills LAVS and dropships) Gÿ£GÿàGÿPLogi Ranger is best at ASSAULTINGGÿ£GÿàGÿP *GO GO POWER RANGERS*
TheWee BabySeamus Dem Durrty Boyz Renegade Alliance 59	Posted - 2013.12.15 21:58:00 - [58] - Quote Soulja Ghostface wrote: A nonbiased opinion from a person who has proto forge and used to have maxed out tanks They were meant for the people who wanted to have some form of AV Without skilling into another dropsuit Heavy suits and forge guns are the answer to tanks CCP intended to do. soontm. If you want to kill a tank. use the fatboy suit and his oversized vacuum cleaner. Swarm launchers were meant to be a less effective alternative because mostly everybody had medium suits. And As you know medium suits were intended for rifle 514 not AV 514 tl;dr: May the forge be with you False, with the new increase in charge up time and the ridiculous speed of tanks right now forge guns (even proto) do not destroy tanks. They take a hit or two and then speed off into the sunset. You need a combined effort of AV players or just a dumb ass tanker to rush you with no hardeners or fuel injector. Wee Baby Seamus-------------->DDB Director & #1 Sex chat operator
Kane Fyea Scions of Athra 2403	Posted - 2013.12.15 21:59:00 - [59] - Quote Soulja Ghostface wrote: KING CHECKMATE wrote: Benjamin Ciscko wrote: A swarm launcher is a light weapon it is meant for taking out light vehicles LAV's Forge Guns are heavy weapons they are meant to take out heavy vehicle HAV's Ok.So overall. Tanks only have 2 counters. Forge guns and other Tanks? HEH,no wonder... theres moar. proximity mines are good enough i had to put an alarm system to survive. plasma cannons usually finish me if i just got out of tank or AV fight assault dropships hover above a tank and rain missles while he cant shoot you Even swarms can kill a WOUNDED tank so... yeah bud tanks have more than 2 counters Proxy mines are shitty lol. If you die to proxy mines in a tank then you're the biggest noob of dust. Seriously in my soma I ran over at least 5 and didn't die. If you die to plasma cannons in a tank, even in a shield tank, then you officially are the biggest noob I've ever seen. Also dropships? Get a railgun and shoot those guys out of the sky. (Which is easy when the dropships hardeners are down)
Soulja Ghostface MCDUSTDONALDS Zero-Day 2075	Posted - 2013.12.15 21:59:00 - [60] - Quote Is someone QQing Just trying to stop the flood of TANKS ARE OP THREADS EDIT: this post was targeted at the weebaby semus Gÿ£GÿàGÿPLogi Ranger is best at ASSAULTINGGÿ£GÿàGÿP *GO GO POWER RANGERS*



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