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Vinsarrow New Eden Blades Of The Azure Zero-Day 120	Posted - 2013.12.02 20:33:00 - [1] - Quote For the very last time people stop with your going on about proto stomping & your insane nonesense ways to fix it. This is the 1 easy, fast, & clear solution so support it if you want proto stomping to finally be fixed.... All CCP has to do is this, those with higher Lifetime SP wiil be facing only people with the same high range of Lifetime SP. Example a person with 15 million Lifetime SP will only be facing people with 17 million & 13 million Lifetime SP range. People with low lifetime SP will only be facing people with low Lifetime SP. Example a person has 5 million Lifetime SP then they'll only be facing people with the range of 7 million & 3 million Lifetime SP. Veterans with Veterans - Newbies with Newbies With the exception of squads & PC matches, then the system can match varying similiar people with similiar Lifetime SP range, in other words the more squads that are full the more the Lifetime SP will change to fit a general Lifetime SP range for all those playing. Example Amarr side has 2 Squads, Squad A is full proto & they're lifetime SP is generally around 10 million, Squad B has 1 proto user, 3 moderate people running adavanced gear like GEK's lifetime SP ranging 5 - 2 million, with 2 newbies in it's squad - The Minmitar side has 1 full squad & 1 half full squad, Squad A is all moderate people running Advanced gear, Squad B (the half filled squad) has 1 proto & 2 newbies. Scotty The AI will be encripted with mathmatical calculation gathering each & everyone's SP coming to a general Lifetime SP range of say 6 million+ (for the example above) be around the general range then Scotty will only allow "The randoms or Extra" people entering the match only to be within the priamaters of 6 million. There only people with 8 - 6 - 4 million Lifetime SP range can get in on that match. This will mean a little longer match loading & if CCP brings back The War Room to matches besides Factional & PC then Scotty can do his calculations while "Waiting for deployment" & at The War Room....
daishi mk03 BLACK-GUARD Die Fremdenlegion 460	Posted - 2013.12.02 20:34:00 - [2] - Quote No. To know the true path, but yet, to never follow it. That is possibly the gravest sin. The Scriptures,Book of Missions
Vinsarrow New Eden Blades Of The Azure Zero-Day 120	Posted - 2013.12.02 20:36:00 - [3] - Quote You obviously did not read anything since you replied in under 10 seconds to my post 1st coming up
Karl Marx II Holdfast Syndicate Amarr Empire 208	Posted - 2013.12.02 20:38:00 - [4] - Quote Vinsarrow wrote: You obviously did not read anything since you replied in under 10 seconds to my post 1st coming up You always have morons replying to your ideas in that way .. his BLACK Guard corp are notorious for protostomping in pubgames because without it they suck Ignore him .. when matchmaking gets fixed and they are up against people with the same amount of SP as them they;ll be on the forums crying about how unfair it is that they are going up against people at their level and not new players they can kill easily again xD My Theme
daishi mk03 BLACK-GUARD Die Fremdenlegion 460	Posted - 2013.12.02 20:39:00 - [5] - Quote Karl Marx II wrote: Vinsarrow wrote: You obviously did not read anything since you replied in under 10 seconds to my post 1st coming up You always have morons replying to your ideas in that way .. his BLACK Guard corp are notorious for protostomping in pubgames because without it they suck Ignore him .. when matchmaking gets fixed and they are up against people with the same amount of SP as them they;ll be on the forums crying about how unfair it is that they are going up against people at their level and not new players they can kill easily again xD I don't even have proto, lol. To know the true path, but yet, to never follow it. That is possibly the gravest sin. The Scriptures,Book of Missions
HyperionsThunder Ghost Wolf Industries Alpha Wolf Pack 150	Posted - 2013.12.02 20:40:00 - [6] - Quote This leads nicely to another significant problem: the player base is too small for efficient match making. Have you noticed playing the same matches over and over with the same squad/players? It is tough to matchmake out of the problem, and the protostomping (really lets call it HigherSPThanYou-stomping, because proto gear is irrelevant) is only compounding the problem. We need 5000 new players, an option for respeccing following significant changes to the skill tree, and an option to split up the community to let the new players get some SP before getting crushed. Common sense will prevail. Adapt or die.
Tch Tch Red Shirts Away Team 20	Posted - 2013.12.02 20:42:00 - [7] - Quote Because all those squatters (AV doing triangle macros) back at base with high SP are going to spoil that. Even worse are exploiters gaining WP for ammo resupply in pairs. Add to that: 1) FPS skills 2) Not all skill points give the same bang for buck. You could have one person with a set of level 5 skills and an identical amount of SP spread across level 3. The specialist may be better or have a bunch of things like swarm launcher in an infantry fight. 3) Comms. Teams that talk together, stalk together. Three MLT, headsets and good planning can trump a single Vet despite a heavy SP advantage. Turrent - the sound a tankers pants makes when he finds out the four swarm militia doing squats around him aren't AFK.
Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 309	Posted - 2013.12.02 20:42:00 - [8] - Quote no why? because as a vet i dont always want to be a tryhard! in fact i rarely do there should be incentive to tryhard in specific game modes, that way those of us who are not doing the whole proto squad of death still have some place to go to use wierd subobtimal fits and playstyles that dont quite fit into the tryhard lifestyle
Malkai Inos Onikanabo Brigade Caldari State 1028	Posted - 2013.12.02 20:43:00 - [9] - Quote Lifetime SP is mostly indicating how old the character is. Not how much experience he has or how good the players gun game or tactics are. It also means that players that take a longer break end up with much harder opponents, despite being much worse players than when they left due to lack of practice. And think about poor IWS who has very high SP yet barely anything beyond ADV tier because he's a generalist and dumps a little SP everywhere. This was one of the first things CCP looked at and discarded for this very reason(s) months ago. You can take a benign object, -you can take a cheeseburger and deconstruct it to its source...
Spectre-M The Generals General Tso's Alliance 124	Posted - 2013.12.02 20:44:00 - [10] - Quote Sounds good but there isn't enough people for sp matchmaking. Since the issue is related to gear, we would have to approach it from there. Hi-sec / public = up to Adv Low-sec / FW = anything This way setting limits on what gear can be used where. Also if we have a squad with mixed sp values, it creates more issues.

Supernus Gigas Art of Assassination 4	Posted - 2013.12.02 20:45:00 - [11] - Quote I don't understand the problem with proto-stomping. You can play the game however you want to, proto-stomping is just as valid as any other play-style. If a proto-stomping squad is ruining your enjoyment of the game then just leave the match.
ratamaq doc Edge Regiment 187	Posted - 2013.12.02 20:46:00 - [12] - Quote How many people in this game have over 30 mil SP? Betting not enough to ever be online at the same time to fill 32 slots.
Mdog 24158 Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation 42	Posted - 2013.12.02 20:48:00 - [13] - Quote Vinsarrow wrote: For the very last time people stop with your going on about proto stomping & your insane nonesense ways to fix it. This is the 1 easy, fast, & clear solution so support it if you want proto stomping to finally be fixed.... All CCP has to do is this, those with higher Lifetime SP wiil be facing only people with the same high range of Lifetime SP. Example a person with 15 million Lifetime SP will only be facing people with 17 million & 13 million Lifetime SP range. People with low lifetime SP will only be facing people with low Lifetime SP. Example a person has 5 million Lifetime SP then they'll only be facing people with the range of 7 million & 3 million Lifetime SP. Veterans with Veterans - Newbies with Newbies With the exception of squads & PC matches, then the system can match varying similiar people with similiar Lifetime SP range, in other words the more squads that are full the more the Lifetime SP will change to fit a general Lifetime SP range for all those playing. Example Amarr side has 2 Squads, Squad A is full proto & they're lifetime SP is generally around 10 million, Squad B has 1 proto user, 3 moderate people running adavanced gear like GEK's lifetime SP ranging 5 - 2 million, with 2 newbies in it's squad - The Minmitar side has 1 full squad & 1 half full squad, Squad A is all moderate people running Advanced gear, Squad B (the half filled squad) has 1 proto & 2 newbies. Scotty The AI will be encripted with mathmatical calculation gathering each & everyone's SP coming to a general Lifetime SP range of say 6 million+ (for the example above) be around the general range then Scotty will only allow "The randoms or Extra" people entering the match only to be within the priamaters of 6 million. There only people with 8 - 6 - 4 million Lifetime SP range can get in on that match. This will mean a little longer match loading & if CCP brings back The War Room to matches besides Factional & PC then Scotty can do his calculations while "Waiting for deployment" & at The War Room.... No just cause i have 20 mil sp doesnt mean i should be forced to run proto Flying derpships and scout shotgunning 24/7 quite fun i must say
Vinsarrow New Eden Blades Of The Azure Zero-Day 120	Posted - 2013.12.02 20:51:00 - [14] - Quote Their is a clear line always between Elite & Newbies. If I made a brand new character with jsut 250k ISK & I set myself up with just what I have I gurrantee once I go in the academy I will have 1st place with ATLEAST 20+ kills/ Less then or equal to 5 deaths & WP at 2000+ or near at 2000 by myself ALONE. People must discern between the Elite & The Newbies.... This proto stomp fix system will just be their & try to make it fair. That way newbies or just bad players can't yell "OP PROTO STOMP" anymore. At that point they'll just be a newbie &/or bad player that just got off COD, saw a free to play game & decided to play it, expecting to just be able to shoot, run head 1st into enemy forces & expect to win with zero tactics....
Rynoceros Rise Of Old Dudes 1469	Posted - 2013.12.02 20:51:00 - [15] - Quote I'd like to run some cheaper matches in my BPOs. Let the vets and noobs mix. Seperating a small player base will result in a lot more 3 vs 5 matches. Collective Meta Tiering is the only way to go. (Not explaining this again, Search it.) Cheeseburgers.
Vinsarrow New Eden Blades Of The Azure Zero-Day 120	Posted - 2013.12.02 20:57:00 - [16] - Quote ratamaq doc wrote: How many people in this game have over 30 mil SP? Betting not enough to ever be online at the same time to fill 32 slots. Well at that point haven't you already kinda beaten the game....? Also you forget what I said about squads, you can get in 1 IF your in a squad. This would would support the new Squad Finder option which will encourage teaming up, making new friends, & learning new tactics. Just saying but I've seen 13ear himself hosting a public squad in squad finder more then once. Besides as you said hardly anyone has that high of Lifetime SP so Scotty won't be counting you highly in his calculations compared to the 10 - 2 million Lifetime SP people on both sides. It'll probably bring more proto people to fight you then newbies anyway....
Ansiiis The Trustworthy Ahrendee Mercenaries 455	Posted - 2013.12.02 21:00:00 - [17] - Quote daishi mk03 wrote: Karl Marx II wrote: Vinsarrow wrote: You obviously did not read anything since you replied in under 10 seconds to my post 1st coming up You always have morons replying to your ideas in that way .. his BLACK Guard corp are notorious for protostomping in pubgames because without it they suck Ignore him .. when matchmaking gets fixed and they are up against people with the same amount of SP as them they;ll be on the forums crying about how unfair it is that they are going up against people at their level and not new players they can kill easily again xD I don't even have proto, lol. Tank. Argument invalid. Sworn Shield of Cat Merc.
Vinsarrow New Eden Blades Of The Azure Zero-Day 120	Posted - 2013.12.02 21:01:00 - [18] - Quote Rynoceros wrote: I'd like to run some cheaper matches in my BPOs. Let the vets and noobs mix. Seperating a small player base will result in a lot more 3 vs 5 matches. Collective Meta Tiering is the only way to go. (Not explaining this again, Search it.) Sounds interesting.... you'll be fighting people on your & your friends level & if it's smaller it may become more intense we've seen what 1squad vs 1 squad can do during the squad cup....
Tch Tch Red Shirts Away Team 21	Posted - 2013.12.02 21:04:00 - [19] - Quote Well they could use KDR and/or SP as mixed pools. Just make sure both teams get an even mix of vets, noobs and squatters. Don't separate them off just get the mix a bit more even. Turrent - the sound a tankers pants makes when he finds out the four swarm militia doing squats around him aren't AFK.
Vinsarrow New Eden Blades Of The Azure Zero-Day 120	Posted - 2013.12.02 21:04:00 - [20] - Quote Malkai Inos wrote: Lifetime SP is mostly indicating how old the character is. Not how much experience he has or how good the players gun game or tactics are. It also means that players that take a longer break end up with much harder opponents, despite being much worse players than when they left due to lack of practice. And think about poor IWS who has very high SP yet barely anything beyond ADV tier because he's a generalist and dumps a little SP everywhere. This was one of the first things CCP looked at and discarded for this very reason(s) months ago. Lest I forget: Throwing high SP chars together means that PRO becomes the minimum to be competitive. Only PC funded players/corps can affort to run PRO in pubs with any kind of consistency. The rest will be forced to revert to STV/ADV eventually and thus gets stomped even harder than you can imagine. Maybe, but in New Eden I suspect by the time you have 10 million or so Lifetime SP & your still playing that you may have picked up a few things by then....

Vinsarrow New Eden Blades Of The Azure Zero-Day 120	Posted - 2013.12.02 21:07:00 - [21] - Quote Tch Tch wrote: Well they could use KDR and/or SP as mixed pools. Just make sure both teams get an even mix of vets, noobs and squatters. Don't separate them off just get the mix a bit more even. Well I'd have to say no their, because you can be the best proto Logi. & you won't have that KDR or if your a pilot, Tanker, or forger & so on. But I like the idea if it includes KDR/SP/WL/WP all in 1 then maybe
Vinsarrow New Eden Blades Of The Azure Zero-Day 120	Posted - 2013.12.02 21:12:00 - [22] - Quote Also we have to consider Scotty The AI, how MUCH is computable for him we can't overload him otherwise we'll just get the infamous Scotty Error which means no matches for anyone let alone them being fair or not. Only a DEV, GM &/or CPM may know how much Scotty could possibly handle. We may be see proto stomping till Dust 514 is on PS4 I know PS3 can't possibly handle all that's instore for Dust 514 to become....
echo47 Minmatar Republic 103	Posted - 2013.12.02 21:14:00 - [23] - Quote No. There are already too may artificial barriers in this game.
Malkai Inos Onikanabo Brigade Caldari State 1030	Posted - 2013.12.02 21:16:00 - [24] - Quote Vinsarrow wrote: Malkai Inos wrote: Lifetime SP is mostly indicating how old the character is. Not how much experience he has or how good the players gun game or tactics are. It also means that players that take a longer break end up with much harder opponents, despite being much worse players than when they left due to lack of practice. And think about poor IWS who has very high SP yet barely anything beyond ADV tier because he's a generalist and dumps a little SP everywhere. This was one of the first things CCP looked at and discarded for this very reason(s) months ago. Lest I forget: Throwing high SP chars together means that PRO becomes the minimum to be competitive. Only PC funded players/corps can affort to run PRO in pubs with any kind of consistency. The rest will be forced to revert to STV/ADV eventually and thus gets stomped even harder than you can imagine. Maybe, but in New Eden I suspect by the time you have 10 million or so Lifetime SP & your still playing that you may have picked up a few things by then.... Muscle memory deteriorates with increasing pace, the longer you don't train it. After a month or two your aim will be pretty much as it was on your very first match. After that time you'll also have no idea what you've skilled into and why. I've had no idea what the f i was doing when I returned after early CB and I had to pretty much relearn the game. Try doing that, facing shiny PRO suits instead of the academy. Issues with generalist play styles being pretty much invalidated and vastly increased cost to stay competitive remain unadressed. You can take a benign object, -you can take a cheeseburger and deconstruct it to its source...
Kane Fyea 2302	Posted - 2013.12.02 21:17:00 - [25] - Quote This wouldn't work because SP =/= Player skill. Also just because you have 15 mill SP doesn't mean you have the isk to run proto. This would cause non PC players with high SP (Such as myself) to have to run at least advanced gear (Which non PC players usually don't have very much ISK) since they'll be going against mostly players with so much isk that they don't care if they make a profit or not. Also not to mention that this would cause very long loading times for high SP players.
Kane Fyea 2302	Posted - 2013.12.02 21:18:00 - [26] - Quote Vinsarrow wrote: Also we have to consider Scotty The AI, how MUCH is computable for him we can't overload him otherwise we'll just get the infamous Scotty Error which means no matches for anyone let alone them being fair or not. Only a DEV, GM &/or CPM may know how much Scotty could possibly handle. We may be see proto stomping till Dust 514 is on PS4 I know PS3 can't possibly handle all that's instore for Dust 514 to become.... The reason why matchmaking can't be effective for dust is because of the very low playerbase. You either have very long lading times or unbalanced matches or both if the system isn't made very well.
BMSTUBBY 369	Posted - 2013.12.02 21:19:00 - [27] - Quote I found the solution to this issue about three months ago, I stopped playing this broke game. I will come back if and when they ever fix PC. Dusters - MMO WhenGäó ? CCP - MMO SoonGäó .
Malkai Inos Onikanabo Brigade Caldari State 1030	Posted - 2013.12.02 21:20:00 - [28] - Quote Tch Tch wrote: Well they could use KDR and/or SP as mixed pools. Just make sure both teams get an even mix of vets, noobs and squatters. Don't separate them off just get the mix a bit more even. Snipers and Tankers have vastly increased k/d compared to most other roles. Now you'll end up seperating players by class and age. Not actual ability. You can take a benign object, -you can take a cheeseburger and deconstruct it to its source...
Jadd Hatchen Psygod9 D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 91	Posted - 2013.12.02 21:21:00 - [29] - Quote Vinsarrow wrote: For the very last time people stop with your going on about proto stomping & your insane nonesense ways to fix it. This is the 1 easy, fast, & clear solution so support it if you want proto stomping to finally be fixed.... All CCP has to do is this, those with higher Lifetime SP wiil be facing only people with the same high range of Lifetime SP. Example a person with 15 million Lifetime SP will only be facing people with 17 million & 13 million Lifetime SP range. People with low lifetime SP will only be facing people with low Lifetime SP. Example a person has 5 million Lifetime SP then they'll only be facing people with the range of 7 million & 3 million Lifetime SP. Veterans with Veterans - Newbies with Newbies With the exception of squads & PC matches, then the system can match varying similiar people with similiar Lifetime SP range, in other words the more squads that are full the more the Lifetime SP will change to fit a general Lifetime SP range for all those playing. Example Amarr side has 2 Squads, Squad A is full proto & they're lifetime SP is generally around 10 million, Squad B has 1 proto user, 3 moderate people running adavanced gear like GEK's lifetime SP ranging 5 - 2 million, with 2 newbies in it's squad - The Minmitar side has 1 full squad & 1 half full squad, Squad A is all moderate people running Advanced gear, Squad B (the half filled squad) has 1 proto & 2 newbies. Scotty The AI will be encripted with mathmatical calculation gathering each & everyone's SP coming to a general Lifetime SP range of say 6 million+ (for the example above) be around the general range then Scotty will only allow "The randoms or Extra" people entering the match only to be within the priamaters of 6 million. There only people with 8 - 6 - 4 million Lifetime SP range can get in on that match. This will mean a little longer match loading & if CCP brings back The War Room to matches besides Factional & PC then Scotty can do his calculations while "Waiting for deployment" & at The War Room.... So what do you do late at night when the number of people queuing for battle won't allow for that system to work? What do you do when players figure out where the optimal "break point" is for the lifetime skill point thingy is and make sure that squads total lifetime SP doesn't exceed that number when putting squads together so taht they can still WTFPWN newbs? In the end you cannot account for everything and players are what break the system. So design a system that encourages players to get better, not worse. By putting same skill players against each other, they learn a hell of a lot less than if they are against a player that is higher skill than they are. Why the hell do you think that most jobs pair a newbie up with a veteran for mentoring?
Mordecai Sanguine What The French 185	Posted - 2013.12.02 21:25:00 - [30] - Quote Vinsarrow wrote: For the very last time people stop with your going on about proto stomping & your insane nonesense ways to fix it. This is the 1 easy, fast, & clear solution so support it if you want proto stomping to finally be fixed.... All CCP has to do is this, those with higher Lifetime SP wiil be facing only people with the same high range of Lifetime SP. Example a person with 15 million Lifetime SP will only be facing people with 17 million & 13 million Lifetime SP range. People with low lifetime SP will only be facing people with low Lifetime SP. Example a person has 5 million Lifetime SP then they'll only be facing people with the range of 7 million & 3 million Lifetime SP. Veterans with Veterans - Newbies with Newbies With the exception of squads & PC matches, then the system can match varying similiar people with similiar Lifetime SP range, in other words the more squads that are full the more the Lifetime SP will change to fit a general Lifetime SP range for all those playing. Example Amarr side has 2 Squads, Squad A is full proto & they're lifetime SP is generally around 10 million, Squad B has 1 proto user, 3 moderate people running adavanced gear like GEK's lifetime SP ranging 5 - 2 million, with 2 newbies in it's squad - The Minmitar side has 1 full squad & 1 half full squad, Squad A is all moderate people running Advanced gear, Squad B (the half filled squad) has 1 proto & 2 newbies. Scotty The AI will be encripted with mathmatical calculation gathering each & everyone's SP coming to a general Lifetime SP range of say 6 million+ (for the example above) be around the general range then Scotty will only allow "The randoms or Extra" people entering the match only to be within the priamaters of 6 million. There only people with 8 - 6 - 4 million Lifetime SP range can get in on that match. This will mean a little longer match loading & if CCP brings back The War Room to matches besides Factional & PC then Scotty can do his calculations while "Waiting for deployment" & at The War Room.... NO. That's stupid. It's not because you have a high Life time SP that you run only protos. I don't see the point here because if we listen you it's : Newbies and mid is using ONLY militia. While Bad veterans ALWAYS run in proto suits DESTROYING our poor little newbies. Driiiiiiing GET UP. The world and Dust 514 is not working like that.

John Demonsbane Unorganized Ninja Infantry Tactics League of Infamy 540	Posted - 2013.12.02 21:25:00 - [31] - Quote The OP's idea is a good one but the low playerbase probably would make it hard to implement, making it better in theory than in practice. Plus, scotty is a tard so who knows what he might start doing, lol. I think the high/lowsec solution is probably easier to quickly put in place, the noobs would still get beat down due to both passive skills and player 'skillz' but would at least have a sporting chance if everyone was in STD gear. "The line between disorder and order lies in logistics" -Sun Tzu Amarr victor!
Tch Tch Red Shirts Away Team 22	Posted - 2013.12.02 21:32:00 - [32] - Quote Malkai Inos wrote: Tch Tch wrote: Well they could use KDR and/or SP as mixed pools. Just make sure both teams get an even mix of vets, noobs and squatters. Don't separate them off just get the mix a bit more even. Snipers and Tankers have vastly increased k/d compared to most other roles. Now you'll end up seperating players by class and age. Not actual ability. Would it really hurt to put the tankers vs each other and the snipers too. Not all the time but more evenly spread between teams. Turrent - the sound a tankers pants makes when he finds out the four swarm militia doing squats around him aren't AFK.
CrotchGrab 360 Commando Perkone Caldari State 392	Posted - 2013.12.02 21:33:00 - [33] - Quote as i've stated a few times, this needed to be implemented in the first place. it's a good idea, it's one i agree with and i believe IS the solution but there simply isn't the player-base to necessitate such a thing. like my previous coffee comparison people say they like a rich, dark roast but really they prefer some milky, creamy ***** coffee. what i mean by that is people in proto don't want to fight people in proto, they want to stomp n00bs to inflate their e-peen and feel like they're good at the game even though they dealt 200% damage with 3-4x the amount of HP the other guy that.... It will be a bad decision for CCP and has been a bad decision for many games, to give the players what they DON'T want.
Kane Fyea 2303	Posted - 2013.12.02 21:35:00 - [34] - Quote Tch Tch wrote: Malkai Inos wrote: Tch Tch wrote: Well they could use KDR and/or SP as mixed pools. Just make sure both teams get an even mix of vets, noobs and squatters. Don't separate them off just get the mix a bit more even. Snipers and Tankers have vastly increased k/d compared to most other roles. Now you'll end up seperating players by class and age. Not actual ability. Would it really hurt to put the tankers vs each other and the snipers too. Not all the time but more evenly spread between teams. What would be the point of AV if we can only use it in very few matches. Why would I want to do that?
ER-Bullitt Molon Labe. RISE of LEGION 620	Posted - 2013.12.02 21:37:00 - [35] - Quote New players need to stop being lazy and get with the program, learn to squad up.. learn to join a ******* corp.. learn teamwork and communication. The day I join a match and DONT see a long list of unsquadded players is the day I consider something else is wrong and needs addressing with this "protostomp" issue. Matchmaking, limiting players to MIL/STD gear only, battle academy, blah blah blah... all bandaids to a problem that lies on the shoulders of bad/lazy players.
Assert Dominance 0bamacare 513	Posted - 2013.12.02 21:38:00 - [36] - Quote this wouldn't work, i have 30 million sp and dont use proto in pubs, as for many people. plus 4k players with this system means playing the same people every game. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BROWqjuTM0g < 1.7 leak!
Malkai Inos Onikanabo Brigade Caldari State 1030	Posted - 2013.12.02 21:41:00 - [37] - Quote Tch Tch wrote: Malkai Inos wrote: Tch Tch wrote: Well they could use KDR and/or SP as mixed pools. Just make sure both teams get an even mix of vets, noobs and squatters. Don't separate them off just get the mix a bit more even. Snipers and Tankers have vastly increased k/d compared to most other roles. Now you'll end up seperating players by class and age. Not actual ability. Would it really hurt to put the tankers vs each other and the snipers too. Not all the time but more evenly spread between teams. Yes it would. More than half of the vehicle tree is anti Infantry, or even infantry support, focused for a reason and snipers belong to the same battlefield as all the others aswell. This is ARDust514, not Tank514 or Sniping514 after all. You can take a benign object, -you can take a cheeseburger and deconstruct it to its source...
Draco Cerberus Brutor Vanguard Minmatar Republic 556	Posted - 2013.12.02 21:44:00 - [38] - Quote Vinsarrow wrote: For the very last time people stop with your going on about proto stomping & your insane nonesense ways to fix it. This is the 1 easy, fast, & clear solution so support it if you want proto stomping to finally be fixed.... All CCP has to do is this, those with higher Lifetime SP wiil be facing only people with the same high range of Lifetime SP. Example a person with 15 million Lifetime SP will only be facing people with 17 million & 13 million Lifetime SP range. People with low lifetime SP will only be facing people with low Lifetime SP. Example a person has 5 million Lifetime SP then they'll only be facing people with the range of 7 million & 3 million Lifetime SP. Veterans with Veterans - Newbies with Newbies With the exception of squads & PC matches, then the system can match varying similiar people with similiar Lifetime SP range, in other words the more squads that are full the more the Lifetime SP will change to fit a general Lifetime SP range for all those playing. Example Amarr side has 2 Squads, Squad A is full proto & they're lifetime SP is generally around 10 million, Squad B has 1 proto user, 3 moderate people running adavanced gear like GEK's lifetime SP ranging 5 - 2 million, with 2 newbies in it's squad - The Minmitar side has 1 full squad & 1 half full squad, Squad A is all moderate people running Advanced gear, Squad B (the half filled squad) has 1 proto & 2 newbies. Scotty The AI will be encripted with mathmatical calculation gathering each & everyone's SP coming to a general Lifetime SP range of say 6 million+ (for the example above) be around the general range then Scotty will only allow "The randoms or Extra" people entering the match only to be within the priamaters of 6 million. There only people with 8 - 6 - 4 million Lifetime SP range can get in on that match. This will mean a little longer match loading & if CCP brings back The War Room to matches besides Factional & PC then Scotty can do his calculations while "Waiting for deployment" & at The War Room.... With only around 4-6000 players active at once on average I think this would be fairly hard to do. Not to mention the people in the extremely high range of SP would likely be limited to only a few hundred and having all of them on at one time would most likely not happen. I've said it before but the problem with matchmaking is that there is no good solution. Eve Online solved this by doing something that was rather unique at the time it was done. They made an open universe to explore and blow things and players up in. This allowed for all skill levels to compete in a fluid rather than structured environment. Opening the planets up for exploration, PVE and PVP would solve the matchmaking QQ and give vets somewhere to go that the benefit from having good gear would be balanced by the challenge of the NPC targets or the group of individuals that catches the Proto Bears while out on a mission. Logi God in the Flesh
Karl Marx II Holdfast Syndicate Amarr Empire 209	Posted - 2013.12.02 21:46:00 - [39] - Quote daishi mk03 wrote: Karl Marx II wrote: Vinsarrow wrote: You obviously did not read anything since you replied in under 10 seconds to my post 1st coming up You always have morons replying to your ideas in that way .. his BLACK Guard corp are notorious for protostomping in pubgames because without it they suck Ignore him .. when matchmaking gets fixed and they are up against people with the same amount of SP as them they;ll be on the forums crying about how unfair it is that they are going up against people at their level and not new players they can kill easily again xD I don't even have proto, lol. I said your corp is notorious for protostomping in pubgames, I didn't specifically say you .. not everyone is Ancient Exiles or Outer.Heaven has full proto but they are both corps notorious for protostomping My Theme
CHICAGOCUBS4EVER TeamPlayers 2282	Posted - 2013.12.02 22:00:00 - [40] - Quote Such balancing in matchmaking makes perfect sense, with 1 exception. There simply isnt a large enough playerbase to support the separation of players by ANY methods. further limiting selection of players in matches will do more harm than good at this time. Just an unfortunate fact of the state of the game Common Sense and *Logic* are 2 things you have to forget when posting on these forums.

THUNDERGROOVE ZionTCD Public Disorder. 350	Posted - 2013.12.02 22:01:00 - [41] - Quote Quick question: How does this compensate for players with high SP and doesn't use proto gear? It doesn't. Quick question: How does this compensate for players who are generally better than others regardless of SP? It doesn't Quick question: How does this compensate for players who run vehicles? It takes about the same SP to get a good STD tank as it does to get a proto suit + all modules + three proto weapons one of which is maxed out. It doesn't, thus the vehicle user is going to be against one or more people with proto AV. Quick question: How does this compensate for people just getting back into the game, having tons of SP and not remembering the mechanics of the game? It doesn't. All your reasoning is flawed and on top of that you seem to think that gear > actual skill. All matchmaking should be SKILL and SKILL only. ZionTCD Director & Ammar Loyalist Amarr Sentinel \| Amarr Logi \| *Losematar* Scout What is a signature?
Eris Ernaga State Patriots 854	Posted - 2013.12.02 22:02:00 - [42] - Quote I wont read this thread I will just let you know that the Devs are incompetent at making anything work. They'll never be able to make a balanced matchmaking because they don't know how. For Caldari and Amarr faction warfare join State Patriots and help us on the front.
CHICAGOCUBS4EVER TeamPlayers 2282	Posted - 2013.12.02 22:04:00 - [43] - Quote Imo the most effective way to balance matchmaking would be twofold. First, expand the academy so players arent kicked out of it til much later, like 1m wp or 5m sp or something. Also, make all players uncapped til they hit like 10m sp. This will provide everyone a fighting chance against people like me with a metric ton of sp Common Sense and *Logic* are 2 things you have to forget when posting on these forums.
Luna Angelo We Who Walk Alone 252	Posted - 2013.12.02 22:08:00 - [44] - Quote While PVP is inherently unbalanced, Public Contracts should not be considered that. Names of playstyles
Malkai Inos Onikanabo Brigade Caldari State 1031	Posted - 2013.12.02 22:13:00 - [45] - Quote CHICAGOCUBS4EVER wrote: Such balancing in matchmaking makes perfect sense, with 1 exception. There simply isnt a large enough playerbase to support the separation of players by ANY methods. further limiting selection of players in matches will do more harm than good at this time. Just an unfortunate fact of the state of the game This doesn't have to be an issue at all. The system can be made so that it "tries" to match players by whatever metric(s) deemed appropriate and, if it can't within "optimal" ranges, just take the next "closest" player. Even a non-perfect system is better than no system as long as the distribution of whatever metric(s) deemed appropriate is even enough. It's the useless metric(s) OP proposes that would make this kind of match making useless itself. You can take a benign object, -you can take a cheeseburger and deconstruct it to its source...
Cosgar ParagonX 8206	Posted - 2013.12.02 22:14:00 - [46] - Quote CHICAGOCUBS4EVER wrote: Imo the most effective way to balance matchmaking would be twofold. First, expand the academy so players arent kicked out of it til much later, like 1m wp or 5m sp or something. Also, make all players uncapped til they hit like 10m sp. This will provide everyone a fighting chance against people like me with a metric ton of sp The academy was really a bandaid to matchmaking but I like the idea of building on it to further enhance new player experience. Raising the WP cap to 250k with the option to participate in pub/FW matches while still enrolled after 50k would help a lot. Uncapped SP until 10 would be good too as long as they get unlimited respecs while still enrolled to try out fittings and academy matches are limited to militia/standard gear. While enrolled, they get little side missions that teach them about the game from basic menu navigation to using all the different dropsuit frames and vehicles to give them an idea of what Dust 514 offers. Add in starter fits for all frame sizes, highsec, lowsec, and nullsec pub matches that restrict average meta level fittings by 5, 10, and no limit respectively and this would go a long way to make Dust a bit more forgiving for new players. This in no way would permanently fix the issue but it'd be a step in the right direction. One of the biggest problems is that new players don't have a place in Dust aside from being cannon fodder for vets. We need something like EWAR with tackling and debuffs to give newberries a chance to be competitive without overall nerfing ourselves. I tried to put a level into Amarr Commando once, but got a server notification saying "Why?"
Vell0cet SVER True Blood Public Disorder. 657	Posted - 2013.12.02 22:15:00 - [47] - Quote CHICAGOCUBS4EVER wrote: Imo the most effective way to balance matchmaking would be twofold. First, expand the academy so players arent kicked out of it til much later, like 1m wp or 5m sp or something. Also, make all players uncapped til they hit like 10m sp. This will provide everyone a fighting chance against people like me with a metric ton of sp You don't want to throw players loading the game for their first match (learning what buttons do what) with players who have 4.9 mill SP. a better solution is to keep the academy as is, and create an optional 2nd tier academy game mode that goes up to something like 5 mill sp and/or x number of WPs. Quick/Dirty Test Range Idea
Karl Marx II Holdfast Syndicate Amarr Empire 209	Posted - 2013.12.02 22:23:00 - [48] - Quote ER-Bullitt wrote: New players need to stop being lazy and get with the program, learn to squad up.. learn to join a ******* corp.. learn teamwork and communication. The day I join a match and DONT see a long list of unsquadded players is the day I consider something else is wrong and needs addressing with this "protostomp" issue. Matchmaking, limiting players to MIL/STD gear only, battle academy, blah blah blah... all bandaids to a problem that lies on the shoulders of bad/lazy players. 1. The Tutorial Doesn't tell new players to join a squad or a Corp, the only way they learn about it is via other players 2. Calling new players bad/lazy is ignorant and extremely arrogant, it's extremely difficult to be a master at something when you first start doing it and it takes time and experience to improve. 3. Throwing new players against organised squads of the most experienced players in the game straight out of the academy is ridiculous as they are just cannon fodder to pad the stats of the vets and ends up just demoralising the new players who then in turn quit the game. The true problems are an awful tutorial,poor matchmaking and no PVE -A better tutorial would mean better educated new players who have a better understanding of the game mechanics and the gamemodes as well as some tried and tested strategies to use in certain gamemodes -A better matchmaking system would balance teams and lead to closer more fun games .. whilst there may be issues doing this completely we currently have 2 veteran squads being put up against 16 randoms .. why can't the matchmaking split the 2 squads up 1 on each team ? -PVE would give the more casual players somewhere to go and something to do if they didn't feel like doing PVP as well as giving solo players something else to do and would also present an opportunity for new players to improve various skills which would make them better in the PVP games Protostomping or whatever you want to call it is a serious issue and needs to be fixed and if the 3 things i mentioned above were implemented I feel that a majority of the problem would be alleviated !! My Theme
Malkai Inos Onikanabo Brigade Caldari State 1034	Posted - 2013.12.02 22:39:00 - [49] - Quote Cosgar wrote: CHICAGOCUBS4EVER wrote: Imo the most effective way to balance matchmaking would be twofold. First, expand the academy so players arent kicked out of it til much later, like 1m wp or 5m sp or something. Also, make all players uncapped til they hit like 10m sp. This will provide everyone a fighting chance against people like me with a metric ton of sp The academy was really a bandaid to matchmaking but I like the idea of building on it to further enhance new player experience. Raising the WP cap to 250k with the option to participate in pub/FW matches while still enrolled after 50k would help a lot. Uncapped SP until 10 would be good too as long as they get unlimited respecs while still enrolled to try out fittings and academy matches are limited to militia/standard gear. While enrolled, they get little side missions that teach them about the game from basic menu navigation to using all the different dropsuit frames and vehicles to give them an idea of what Dust 514 offers. Add in starter fits for all frame sizes, highsec, lowsec, and nullsec pub matches that restrict average meta level fittings by 5, 10, and no limit respectively and this would go a long way to make Dust a bit more forgiving for new players. This in no way would permanently fix the issue but it'd be a step in the right direction. One of the biggest problems is that new players don't have a place in Dust aside from being cannon fodder for vets. We need something like EWAR with tackling and debuffs to give newberries a chance to be competitive without overall nerfing ourselves. A WP cap this high would definitely have to include all modes or players will simply get bored very soon. Even then giving players that much time in the academy will widen the SP/gear gap within the academy itself and thus create a lesser version of the protostomping it tries to get rid of in the first place. Handing out unlimited respecs has the massive problem of teaching them things that are simply and utterly not true for the rest of their entire career ("Go ahead. Waste your SP, it doesn't even matter") and promotes "bad habits" that have to be unlearned again. This would cause frustration and, I believe, hurt retention even more than unfair matches do. Uncapped SP has some of the above issues but to such a lesser degree that i tend to agree with this idea. More interactive tutorials are always good, but it should not be overdone. Players can and should be trusted to figure out trivial things like "throw grenades", "take cover" and "that one is the bad guy" on their own. Lastly. Adding MLT versions of everything in the game should have been done months ago. CCP: Copy standard gear from DB Lower cost by 60% Increase fitting reqs by 10-20% Release the damn stuff! It's not like the existing MLT stuff is any different. You can take a benign object, -you can take a cheeseburger and deconstruct it to its source...
Wolfica Fatal Absolution 367	Posted - 2013.12.02 22:42:00 - [50] - Quote 8mill sp is all you need to make a very capable proto assault. it will be made for 2 purposes. 1 to kill 2 to **** people off because your using proto I reject you reality and substitute my own.

ER-Bullitt Molon Labe. RISE of LEGION 622	Posted - 2013.12.02 22:45:00 - [51] - Quote Karl Marx II wrote: ER-Bullitt wrote: New players need to stop being lazy and get with the program, learn to squad up.. learn to join a ***** corp.. learn teamwork and communication. The day I join a match and DONT see a long list of unsquadded players is the day I consider something else is wrong and needs addressing with this "protostomp" issue. Matchmaking, limiting players to MIL/STD gear only, battle academy, blah blah blah... all bandaids to a problem that lies on the shoulders of bad/lazy players. 1. The Tutorial Doesn't tell new players to join a squad or a Corp, the only way they learn about it is via other players 2. Calling new players bad/lazy is ignorant and extremely arrogant, it's extremely difficult to be a master at something when you first start doing it and it takes time and experience to improve. 3. Throwing new players against organised squads of the most experienced players in the game straight out of the academy is ridiculous as they are just cannon fodder to pad the stats of the vets and ends up just demoralising the new players who then in turn quit the game. The true problems are an awful tutorial,poor matchmaking and no PVE -A better tutorial would mean better educated new players who have a better understanding of the game mechanics and the gamemodes as well as some tried and tested strategies to use in certain gamemodes -A better matchmaking system would balance teams and lead to closer more fun games .. whilst there may be issues doing this completely we currently have 2 veteran squads being put up against 16 randoms .. why can't the matchmaking split the 2 squads up 1 on each team ? -PVE would give the more casual players somewhere to go and something to do if they didn't feel like doing PVP as well as giving solo players something else to do and would also present an opportunity for new players to improve various skills which would make them better in the PVP games Protostomping or whatever you want to call it is a serious issue and needs to be fixed and if the 3 things i mentioned above were implemented I feel that a majority of the problem would be alleviated !! Have we been playing the same game? You expect CCP to fix this ** storm? Did you see the last time they tried to implement a matchmaking system "scotty hates you, scotty hates you, for days" lol. good luck with that. Next match you are in, everyone you see who isn't in a squad... send them a message that if they don't want to get protostomped to consider joining a squad or even better, an established corp. That will at least be an attempt to fix the problem which is probably very far down on the list of things to fix with what, the 3-4 people CCP has still working on this broken ass game. Or you can continue to post suggestions for the umteenthousandth time which will continue to fall on def ears.
Spectre-M The Generals General Tso's Alliance 127	Posted - 2013.12.02 22:46:00 - [52] - Quote Supernus Gigas wrote: I don't understand the problem with proto-stomping. You can play the game however you want to, proto-stomping is just as valid as any other play-style. If a proto-stomping squad is ruining your enjoyment of the game then just leave the match. Sorry but proto stomping is not a play style. The issue newbros are having is that they have no where to go to avoid it. In eve this problem doesn't exist in such a high volume as they have different security areas for different level players so not everyone undocking is immediately ganked. They would never get new subscriptions for long if that we're the case.
knight of 6 SVER True Blood Public Disorder. 747	Posted - 2013.12.02 22:51:00 - [53] - Quote your system would indeed stop proto stomping but it would also cluster-kitten any attempt at matchmaking what do you want? "I want to not be proto stomped, nothing extra, just that." well your plan will work, so good luck. "I want every match to test my abilities as a player by pitting me against equally skilled players" you're looking for match making then. sp does not equal skill. players with a large quantity of sp may still suck or have their sp spread out across many weapons and suits. and they would consistently be put matches above their skill level. things that must be considered in proper match making: WP/match payout/Death equipment lets start with WP/match. war points are the aggregate total of how good you are at what you do. it makes sense that they would weigh heavily on matchmaking. WP/match is also the simplest purest match making component. what is the average WP you want players to earn a match? as players face more skilled opponents their WP will fall. so we set an average we'll call it "Paul" so Paul is the number of war points the average player should earn per match. players consistently higher than Paul need to be placed in tougher matches. players consistently lower than Paul need to be put in easier matches. next is payout/death though a player may be consistently higher than Paul, it's no good if they die to often to make a profit. this could be a sign that the player needs to be put in easier matches. this perameter must be carefully balanced however because we can't be sending tankers back to academy for losing a vehicle. profit is everything in dust and it's a fools game to glorify any other statistic. equipment: Oh knows teh proto stompers! they will be put on their level and you will be "safe" on yours this doesn't mean that you will never see proto gear though, it simply means that it's wearer is about as good as you are. "God favors the side with the best artillery" ~ Napoleon Ko6, scout, tanker. CLOSED BETA VET
ER-Bullitt Molon Labe. RISE of LEGION 622	Posted - 2013.12.02 22:53:00 - [54] - Quote The only thing any of us can actually do besides make new forum posts is to embrace the new philosophy of "adopt-a-newb" That's right, say it with me now "adopt-a-newb" The day CCP implements ANY of your suggestions, which by the way have been suggested countless times already, will be a warm day in your moms ice cold vagina. Anyway, "adopt-a-newb" The next time you squad up with your bros... leave 1-2 spots open, go into a game.. and scroll down the list of players. When you come across the 1/2 dozen or more unsquadded players, invite them all.. make a message in team chat, start spreading education to all of these people who for some god awful reason don't realize this game is harder to win playing solo, without comms, or any semblance of strategy. Try that... see how it goes. Because the rest of this jibberish flooding 1/2 the new posts about protostomping and unfairness blah blah blah is pointless. Go out there and make a difference! I have faith in you all even if you don't have faith in yourselves. lol
Mobius Wyvern Guardian Solutions DARKSTAR ARMY 3952	Posted - 2013.12.02 22:55:00 - [55] - Quote Vinsarrow wrote: For the very last time people stop with your going on about proto stomping & your insane nonesense ways to fix it. This is the 1 easy, fast, & clear solution so support it if you want proto stomping to finally be fixed.... All CCP has to do is this, those with higher Lifetime SP wiil be facing only people with the same high range of Lifetime SP. Example a person with 15 million Lifetime SP will only be facing people with 17 million & 13 million Lifetime SP range. People with low lifetime SP will only be facing people with low Lifetime SP. Example a person has 5 million Lifetime SP then they'll only be facing people with the range of 7 million & 3 million Lifetime SP. Veterans with Veterans - Newbies with Newbies With the exception of squads & PC matches, then the system can match varying similiar people with similiar Lifetime SP range, in other words the more squads that are full the more the Lifetime SP will change to fit a general Lifetime SP range for all those playing. Example Amarr side has 2 Squads, Squad A is full proto & they're lifetime SP is generally around 10 million, Squad B has 1 proto user, 3 moderate people running adavanced gear like GEK's lifetime SP ranging 5 - 2 million, with 2 newbies in it's squad - The Minmitar side has 1 full squad & 1 half full squad, Squad A is all moderate people running Advanced gear, Squad B (the half filled squad) has 1 proto & 2 newbies. Scotty The AI will be encripted with mathmatical calculation gathering each & everyone's SP coming to a general Lifetime SP range of say 6 million+ (for the example above) be around the general range then Scotty will only allow "The randoms or Extra" people entering the match only to be within the priamaters of 6 million. There only people with 8 - 6 - 4 million Lifetime SP range can get in on that match. This will mean a little longer match loading & if CCP brings back The War Room to matches besides Factional & PC then Scotty can do his calculations while "Waiting for deployment" & at The War Room.... Yeah, and what happens if you have 15 million SP and you suck? You will now permanently be put into matches with people far better than you and thrashed over and over due to factors outside your control. So basically, it would be an even more guaranteed means of what only happens most of the time right now. Amidst the blue skies A link from past to future The sheltering wings of the protector
Karl Marx II Holdfast Syndicate Amarr Empire 209	Posted - 2013.12.02 23:01:00 - [56] - Quote ER-Bullitt wrote: Karl Marx II wrote: ER-Bullitt wrote: New players need to stop being lazy and get with the program, learn to squad up.. learn to join a ***** corp.. learn teamwork and communication. The day I join a match and DONT see a long list of unsquadded players is the day I consider something else is wrong and needs addressing with this "protostomp" issue. Matchmaking, limiting players to MIL/STD gear only, battle academy, blah blah blah... all bandaids to a problem that lies on the shoulders of bad/lazy players. 1. The Tutorial Doesn't tell new players to join a squad or a Corp, the only way they learn about it is via other players 2. Calling new players bad/lazy is ignorant and extremely arrogant, it's extremely difficult to be a master at something when you first start doing it and it takes time and experience to improve. 3. Throwing new players against organised squads of the most experienced players in the game straight out of the academy is ridiculous as they are just cannon fodder to pad the stats of the vets and ends up just demoralising the new players who then in turn quit the game. The true problems are an awful tutorial,poor matchmaking and no PVE -A better tutorial would mean better educated new players who have a better understanding of the game mechanics and the gamemodes as well as some tried and tested strategies to use in certain gamemodes -A better matchmaking system would balance teams and lead to closer more fun games .. whilst there may be issues doing this completely we currently have 2 veteran squads being put up against 16 randoms .. why can't the matchmaking split the 2 squads up 1 on each team ? -PVE would give the more casual players somewhere to go and something to do if they didn't feel like doing PVP as well as giving solo players something else to do and would also present an opportunity for new players to improve various skills which would make them better in the PVP games Protostomping or whatever you want to call it is a serious issue and needs to be fixed and if the 3 things i mentioned above were implemented I feel that a majority of the problem would be alleviated !! Have we been playing the same game? You expect CCP to fix this ** storm? Did you see the last time they tried to implement a matchmaking system "scotty hates you, scotty hates you, for days" lol. good luck with that. Next match you are in, everyone you see who isn't in a squad... send them a message that if they don't want to get protostomped to consider joining a squad or even better, an established corp. That will at least be an attempt to fix the problem which is probably very far down on the list of things to fix with what, the 3-4 people CCP has still working on this broken ass game. Or you can continue to post suggestions for the umteenthousandth time which will continue to fall on def ears. Yes I do expect CCP to fix the problem, it is nothing to do with wishing me luck, it's CCP you need to wish luck to for it is them with the most to lose if this game goes down the pan .. all the playerbase can do is tell them where they are going wrong and if they continue to ignore us then we'll just end up leaving and going to play something else I do what I can in game, I invite randoms into my squad if there's any space, I write 'Squad up' in team chat, I invite those players who do squad up into our corp channel ... there's only so much you can do as a player the only people who can actually make a true difference are CCP themselves My Theme
Karl Marx II Holdfast Syndicate Amarr Empire 209	Posted - 2013.12.02 23:07:00 - [57] - Quote Mobius Wyvern wrote: Vinsarrow wrote: For the very last time people stop with your going on about proto stomping & your insane nonesense ways to fix it. This is the 1 easy, fast, & clear solution so support it if you want proto stomping to finally be fixed.... All CCP has to do is this, those with higher Lifetime SP wiil be facing only people with the same high range of Lifetime SP. Example a person with 15 million Lifetime SP will only be facing people with 17 million & 13 million Lifetime SP range. People with low lifetime SP will only be facing people with low Lifetime SP. Example a person has 5 million Lifetime SP then they'll only be facing people with the range of 7 million & 3 million Lifetime SP. Veterans with Veterans - Newbies with Newbies With the exception of squads & PC matches, then the system can match varying similiar people with similiar Lifetime SP range, in other words the more squads that are full the more the Lifetime SP will change to fit a general Lifetime SP range for all those playing. Example Amarr side has 2 Squads, Squad A is full proto & they're lifetime SP is generally around 10 million, Squad B has 1 proto user, 3 moderate people running adavanced gear like GEK's lifetime SP ranging 5 - 2 million, with 2 newbies in it's squad - The Minmitar side has 1 full squad & 1 half full squad, Squad A is all moderate people running Advanced gear, Squad B (the half filled squad) has 1 proto & 2 newbies. Scotty The AI will be encripted with mathmatical calculation gathering each & everyone's SP coming to a general Lifetime SP range of say 6 million+ (for the example above) be around the general range then Scotty will only allow "The randoms or Extra" people entering the match only to be within the priamaters of 6 million. There only people with 8 - 6 - 4 million Lifetime SP range can get in on that match. This will mean a little longer match loading & if CCP brings back The War Room to matches besides Factional & PC then Scotty can do his calculations while "Waiting for deployment" & at The War Room.... Yeah, and what happens if you have 15 million SP and you suck? You will now permanently be put into matches with people far better than you and thrashed over and over due to factors outside your control. So basically, it would be an even more guaranteed means of what only happens most of the time right now. You will be dying due to your opponents having more skill than you at the game and not an SP / gear advantage ... what exactly is wrong with that ? You are trying to say that because you suck at the game you should go up against players with 1/10th of your SP using militia gear so you can kill them ? How exactly is sucking at the game being a factor outside of your control .. your the one playing the game if you suck then you have complete control over that factor .. at least you are fighting people at a similar level of SP and gear access .. imagine being in your position and sucking at the game but then being put up against a squad of people with 20m SP when you only have 600k SP .. what chance does the player in this scenario have ? To think your complaining about going up v people with the same SP as you .. LMAO most new players would love to be up against people with the same SP as them My Theme
Malkai Inos Onikanabo Brigade Caldari State 1035	Posted - 2013.12.02 23:29:00 - [58] - Quote Karl Marx II wrote: Mobius Wyvern wrote: Yeah, and what happens if you have 15 million SP and you suck? You will now permanently be put into matches with people far better than you and thrashed over and over due to factors outside your control. So basically, it would be an even more guaranteed means of what only happens most of the time right now. You will be dying due to your opponents having more skill than you at the game and not an SP / gear advantage ... what exactly is wrong with that ? You are trying to say that because you suck at the game you should go up against players with 1/10th of your SP using militia gear so you can kill them ? How exactly is sucking at the game being a factor outside of your control .. your the one playing the game if you suck then you have complete control over that factor .. at least you are fighting people at a similar level of SP and gear access .. imagine being in your position and sucking at the game but then being put up against a squad of people with 20m SP when you only have 600k SP .. what chance does the player in this scenario have ? To think your complaining about going up v people with the same SP as you .. LMAO most new players would love to be up against people with the same SP as them So it's an issue when people are constantly put up against players that are vastly superior to them, get obliterated in the process and throw in the towel in frustration unless they just so happen to have an unusually high amount of SP, regardless of how they got it in the first place, regardles of whether it's invested in skills that are actually useful to them and regardless of whether the player is actually able to use and sustain the equipment you expect him to wield on a daily basis from that point on, which leads to the exact same dynamics, experience and effect? Is the glaring hypocrisy in this post actually intended or would you like to revisit above statement? You can take a benign object, -you can take a cheeseburger and deconstruct it to its source...
Tch Tch Red Shirts Away Team 22	Posted - 2013.12.02 23:38:00 - [59] - Quote Malkai Inos wrote: Tch Tch wrote: Malkai Inos wrote: Tch Tch wrote: Well they could use KDR and/or SP as mixed pools. Just make sure both teams get an even mix of vets, noobs and squatters. Don't separate them off just get the mix a bit more even. Snipers and Tankers have vastly increased k/d compared to most other roles. Now you'll end up seperating players by class and age. Not actual ability. Would it really hurt to put the tankers vs each other and the snipers too. Not all the time but more evenly spread between teams. Yes it would. More than half of the vehicle tree is anti Infantry, or even inofantry support, focused for a reason and snipers belong to the same battlefield as all the others aswell. This is ARDust514, not Tank514 or Sniping514 after all. Read my post again particularly the last line: "more evenly spread between teams" In other words even amounts of squads, derpships, tanks and snipers on each side. More tank vs tank (not exclusively but less on the same side). I've literally been in a 6 vs 6 ambush with 3 tanks on my side. Probably can't fix it as the three tanks were a squad. But another 6 vs 6 and only 2 of us were active and fighting hard and losing. Fine, 6 man proto squad joins the other team (thanks Scotty for making matches so close) fine, dieing but biting back with flanking. Then you've not / been scanned combo starts flaring across the screen. So 2 vs 8 and no chance of pulling off a thing as all tactics die with bright glowing chevrons on ones head. More compelling closer matches with a tactical depth to match the skill tree not the Xmas tree bauble version that no noob can avoid. Yes young one you cannot hide. Turrent - the sound a tankers pants makes when he finds out the four swarm militia doing squats around him aren't AFK.
Karl Marx II Holdfast Syndicate Amarr Empire 210	Posted - 2013.12.03 03:03:00 - [60] - Quote Malkai Inos wrote: Karl Marx II wrote: Mobius Wyvern wrote: Yeah, and what happens if you have 15 million SP and you suck? You will now permanently be put into matches with people far better than you and thrashed over and over due to factors outside your control. So basically, it would be an even more guaranteed means of what only happens most of the time right now. You will be dying due to your opponents having more skill than you at the game and not an SP / gear advantage ... what exactly is wrong with that ? You are trying to say that because you suck at the game you should go up against players with 1/10th of your SP using militia gear so you can kill them ? How exactly is sucking at the game being a factor outside of your control .. your the one playing the game if you suck then you have complete control over that factor .. at least you are fighting people at a similar level of SP and gear access .. imagine being in your position and sucking at the game but then being put up against a squad of people with 20m SP when you only have 600k SP .. what chance does the player in this scenario have ? To think your complaining about going up v people with the same SP as you .. LMAO most new players would love to be up against people with the same SP as them So it's an issue when people are constantly put up against players that are vastly superior to them, get obliterated in the process and throw in the towel in frustration unless they just so happen to have an unusually high amount of SP, regardless of how they got it in the first place, regardles of whether it's invested in skills that are actually useful to them and regardless of whether the player is actually able to use and sustain the equipment you expect him to wield on a daily basis from that point on, which leads to the exact same dynamics, experience and outcome? Is the glaring hypocrisy in this post actually intended or would you like to revisit above statement? 1. You are missing the essence of why players want the matchmaking system fixed, it isn't so players who are bad at the game can have an easier time all the time they play the game.. it is so new players aren't going up against the best and most experienced players at the game as soon as they leave the academy. 2.If you have 15m SP and get slaughtered by other people with 15m SP why should you get put against players who have less SP ? You're basically saying that because you suck you need to be put up against people in Militia Gear when your using Proto/ADV gear so you can get kills and do well ! That is exactly why people want the matchmaking system fixed in the first place lol .. WE WANT PLAYER SKILL AND TEAMWORK TO BE THE DETERMINING FACTOR how exactly is giving you an advantage over players with less SP beneficial ? It may benefit you but it doesn't benefit the people you get put up against ! 3.If you have used your 15m SP sporadically and put it in a wide variety of skills then you will obviously be weaker than someone who specialised ther skills into 1 role .. although you will have a more diverse selection of fits .. but don;t forget that YOU are solely responsible for where you invested your SP and are therefore again responsible for having weaker fittings 4.As I have posted in an earlier comment .. it isn't just matchmaking that needs fixing, PVE needs adding as well therefore if you were losing alot in PVP and wanted to do something different to maybe earn ISK and SP or just improve your game then you could do PVE instead ! TL;DR Point 4 is more relevant as a solution to your issue with SP based matchmaking My Theme

Killar-12 The Corporate Raiders Top Men. 1831	Posted - 2013.12.03 03:28:00 - [61] - Quote Cosgar wrote: CHICAGOCUBS4EVER wrote: Imo the most effective way to balance matchmaking would be twofold. First, expand the academy so players arent kicked out of it til much later, like 1m wp or 5m sp or something. Also, make all players uncapped til they hit like 10m sp. This will provide everyone a fighting chance against people like me with a metric ton of sp The academy was really a bandaid to matchmaking but I like the idea of building on it to further enhance new player experience. Raising the WP cap to 250k with the option to participate in pub/FW matches while still enrolled after 50k would help a lot. Uncapped SP until 10 would be good too as long as they get unlimited respecs while still enrolled to try out fittings and academy matches are limited to militia/standard gear. While enrolled, they get little side missions that teach them about the game from basic menu navigation to using all the different dropsuit frames and vehicles to give them an idea of what Dust 514 offers. Add in starter fits for all frame sizes, highsec, lowsec, and nullsec pub matches that restrict average meta level fittings by 5, 10, and no limit respectively and this would go a long way to make Dust a bit more forgiving for new players. This in no way would permanently fix the issue but it'd be a step in the right direction. One of the biggest problems is that new players don't have a place in Dust aside from being cannon fodder for vets. We need something like EWAR with tackling and debuffs to give newberries a chance to be competitive without overall nerfing ourselves. I'm already good with EWAR in EVE you give me that in DUST and Kiss your ass goodbye Still buff the academy we'll need another shitstorm like the one that created the academy to make any change. Level 1 Forum Warrior I'm a bittervet, if I seem like a douche it's because of your stupidity
Tch Tch Red Shirts Away Team 25	Posted - 2013.12.03 03:46:00 - [62] - Quote You could also have a game mode that embraces the game balance issue 1 squad attacking a set of objectives vs 26 newberries If you want to make it more inline with what happens in a pub match you could have the scenario starts with an EMP blast that takes out the noob comms (matches play style) and/or have the orbital strikes hit the other teams comms. Attacking team has to take a series of objectives which once taken unlocks access to the null cannon. Note until then its the newberries if they chose to hack it... so the attackers really need to be on the ball... So attackers get to go special forces against garrison troops. Quality vs quantity. Turrent - the sound a tankers pants makes when he finds out the four swarm militia doing squats around him aren't AFK.
John Demonsbane Unorganized Ninja Infantry Tactics League of Infamy 540	Posted - 2013.12.03 04:36:00 - [63] - Quote Tch Tch wrote: You could also have a game mode that embraces the game balance issue 1 squad attacking a set of objectives vs 26 newberries If you want to make it more inline with what happens in a pub match you could have the scenario starts with an EMP blast that takes out the noob comms (matches play style) and/or have the orbital strikes hit the other teams comms. Attacking team has to take a series of objectives which once taken unlocks access to the null cannon. Note until then its the newberries if they chose to hack it... so the attackers really need to be on the ball... So attackers get to go special forces against garrison troops. Quality vs quantity. I actually like this idea. Not sure how easy the algorithm would be to program, but sounds fun. Almost like PvE but without programming the E, just substituting for a outnumbered squad of higher skilled players. "The line between disorder and order lies in logistics" -Sun Tzu Amarr victor!
Cosgar ParagonX 8245	Posted - 2013.12.03 05:10:00 - [64] - Quote Killar-12 wrote: Cosgar wrote: CHICAGOCUBS4EVER wrote: Imo the most effective way to balance matchmaking would be twofold. First, expand the academy so players arent kicked out of it til much later, like 1m wp or 5m sp or something. Also, make all players uncapped til they hit like 10m sp. This will provide everyone a fighting chance against people like me with a metric ton of sp The academy was really a bandaid to matchmaking but I like the idea of building on it to further enhance new player experience. Raising the WP cap to 250k with the option to participate in pub/FW matches while still enrolled after 50k would help a lot. Uncapped SP until 10 would be good too as long as they get unlimited respecs while still enrolled to try out fittings and academy matches are limited to militia/standard gear. While enrolled, they get little side missions that teach them about the game from basic menu navigation to using all the different dropsuit frames and vehicles to give them an idea of what Dust 514 offers. Add in starter fits for all frame sizes, highsec, lowsec, and nullsec pub matches that restrict average meta level fittings by 5, 10, and no limit respectively and this would go a long way to make Dust a bit more forgiving for new players. This in no way would permanently fix the issue but it'd be a step in the right direction. One of the biggest problems is that new players don't have a place in Dust aside from being cannon fodder for vets. We need something like EWAR with tackling and debuffs to give newberries a chance to be competitive without overall nerfing ourselves. I'm already good with EWAR in EVE you give me that in DUST and Kiss your ass goodbye Still buff the academy we'll need another shitstorm like the one that created the academy to make any change. We desperately need this extra dimension of combat to give Dust the personality it needs. Imagine scouts flanking a squad to web them while a mass driver closes in to wreck them with a MD or a scout LAV spotting for an artillery tank with a target painter. I tried to put a level into Amarr Commando once, but got a server notification saying "Why?"
Vinsarrow New Eden Blades Of The Azure Zero-Day 125	Posted - 2013.12.03 19:13:00 - [65] - Quote THUNDERGROOVE wrote: Quick question: How does this compensate for players with high SP and doesn't use proto gear? It doesn't. Quick question: How does this compensate for players who are generally better than others regardless of SP? It doesn't Quick question: How does this compensate for players who run vehicles? It takes about the same SP to get a good STD tank as it does to get a proto suit + all modules + three proto weapons one of which is maxed out. It doesn't, thus the vehicle user is going to be against one or more people with proto AV. Quick question: How does this compensate for people just getting back into the game, having tons of SP and not remembering the mechanics of the game? It doesn't. All your reasoning is flawed and on top of that you seem to think that gear > actual skill. All matchmaking should be SKILL and SKILL only. I already answered those questions on pages 1 & 2 if you actually read them. Come back when you have new quick questions & I'll be happy to answer them for you
Vinsarrow New Eden Blades Of The Azure Zero-Day 125	Posted - 2013.12.03 19:19:00 - [66] - Quote CHICAGOCUBS4EVER wrote: Imo the most effective way to balance matchmaking would be twofold. First, expand the academy so players arent kicked out of it til much later, like 1m wp or 5m sp or something. Also, make all players uncapped til they hit like 10m sp. This will provide everyone a fighting chance against people like me with a metric ton of sp I like this idea alot & it's quite possibly a 2nd solution. We could make 2 new match type areas where it picks a battle type at random. 1 could be named something simple like "Elite Match" for veterans & good players then the 2nd match be something called "Beginners Match" for newbies to join & fight each-other. Problem is you can't limit who can enter Elite or Beginner matches. Otherwise proto stompers & skilled people would just join the "Beginners" match just to crush them for easy ISK or they're precious KDR. Therefore you would have to limit who can enter using the Lifetime SP mechanic I mentioned
Vinsarrow New Eden Blades Of The Azure Zero-Day 125	Posted - 2013.12.03 19:58:00 - [67] - Quote Well I have yet to state my idea is perfect. It does have flaws, 1 reason why I opened this is so the idea can be improved apon because currently it's the only real solution & if edited/perfected it can be done in some form as the absolute solution to this long issue. If you loose once it's implamented then it will be due to skill set, tactics, & yourself as a good player & not due to OP gear which will finally absolve Dust of the proto stomp cry. No newbie no matter how real good can't really stand against a skilled, proto user with like 15 million Lifetime SP. A skilled into Duvolle AR added with Light DMG Modifiers can crush a proto Heavy let alone a newbie in militia gear skilled into nothing. But know theirs always a difference between the Elite & The Non-Elite as I said prior. That aside I digress.... Perhaps 2 new game modes but using the same game types with Lifetime SP as the restriction for both (as I said above in a reply) is the solution. Maybe it can be worked on, also I like the simple notion of offering a newbie a place in your squad off & on. Newbie's roiginally couldn't exactly get into just any squad so they made squad finder, then if a newbie join a Public squad will they keep him & if so how long? Also finding a corporation (if they've figured out to join a corporation) depends on what's right for the newbie & they're tastes, remember some corporations have rules & requirements. PIE Inc. for example it's simple enough it's a FW corporation, thing is it has some strong requirements like you can ONLY use Amarr gear & nothing else unless in the instance it's something you have to use because CCP has yet to make a Amarr version for it yet like you had to use AR's before they had Amarr SR's. Then they have to research which to join & most likely they'll hear mostly only of big corporations but they might eventually find a small corporation fitting them. Then theirs the issue of player base well if your on late don't forget about The Japanese, Russians, Spanish & etc. who are equally if not better then some USA corporations at being good players. But once it's implamented we might see more people, but I think we have enough people that it might work though I have my doubts. Also if Scotty has issues upon it being first implamented CCP will fix it as they always do eventually....
Vinsarrow New Eden Blades Of The Azure Zero-Day 125	Posted - 2013.12.03 20:21:00 - [68] - Quote Jadd Hatchen wrote: Vinsarrow wrote: For the very last time people stop with your going on about proto stomping & your insane nonesense ways to fix it. This is the 1 easy, fast, & clear solution so support it if you want proto stomping to finally be fixed.... All CCP has to do is this, those with higher Lifetime SP wiil be facing only people with the same high range of Lifetime SP. Example a person with 15 million Lifetime SP will only be facing people with 17 million & 13 million Lifetime SP range. People with low lifetime SP will only be facing people with low Lifetime SP. Example a person has 5 million Lifetime SP then they'll only be facing people with the range of 7 million & 3 million Lifetime SP. Veterans with Veterans - Newbies with Newbies With the exception of squads & PC matches, then the system can match varying similiar people with similiar Lifetime SP range, in other words the more squads that are full the more the Lifetime SP will change to fit a general Lifetime SP range for all those playing. Example Amarr side has 2 Squads, Squad A is full proto & they're lifetime SP is generally around 10 million, Squad B has 1 proto user, 3 moderate people running adavanced gear like GEK's lifetime SP ranging 5 - 2 million, with 2 newbies in it's squad - The Minmitar side has 1 full squad & 1 half full squad, Squad A is all moderate people running Advanced gear, Squad B (the half filled squad) has 1 proto & 2 newbies. Scotty The AI will be encripted with mathmatical calculation gathering each & everyone's SP coming to a general Lifetime SP range of say 6 million+ (for the example above) be around the general range then Scotty will only allow "The randoms or Extra" people entering the match only to be within the priamaters of 6 million. There only people with 8 - 6 - 4 million Lifetime SP range can get in on that match. This will mean a little longer match loading & if CCP brings back The War Room to matches besides Factional & PC then Scotty can do his calculations while "Waiting for deployment" & at The War Room.... So what do you do late at night when the number of people queuing for battle won't allow for that system to work? What do you do when players figure out where the optimal "break point" is for the lifetime skill point thingy is and make sure that squads total lifetime SP doesn't exceed that number when putting squads together so taht they can still WTFPWN newbs? In the end you cannot account for everything and players are what break the system. So design a system that encourages players to get better, not worse. By putting same skill players against each other, they learn a hell of a lot less than if they are against a player that is higher skill than they are. Why the hell do you think that most jobs pair a newbie up with a veteran for mentoring? Everyone learns differently first of all. Furthermore let me quote something from Mass Effect 3 "They're using our own tactic against us, destroy the enemy with over whealming force" No plan, no tactic, no strategy, & no matter how intelligent 1 may be they can never really hope to defeat something that's FFAARR beyond they're power level. If you were wise you would know that & know nothing is to be learned their. Note read my last reply post before this 1 also. Here are 3 exellent visual examples btw that your welcome to look up on YOUtube. - Ulquiorra vs Ishida. Then Ichigo as Vasto Lorde vs Ulquiorra. Then Aizen vs All The Captains. & the 3rd is The Repears in Mass Effect 3 vs everyone in the entire game. Their are many many more examples but I think those fights clearly spell out my point here. What your saying is near basic to like handing a blade to a child & saying beat Kratos in a real fight. Or having a medieval militia of 35 with swords & armor vs a Modern Day USA Marine platoon. It just ain't going to happen XD
AccursedZero New Eden Blades Of The Azure Zero-Day 2	Posted - 2013.12.03 20:57:00 - [69] - Quote +1
Malkai Inos Onikanabo Brigade Caldari State 1045	Posted - 2013.12.03 21:02:00 - [70] - Quote +1 for not taking the bait and elaborating. Karl Marx II wrote: 1. You are missing the essence of why players want the matchmaking system fixed, it isn't so players who are bad at the game can have an easier time all the time they play the game.. it is so new players aren't going up against the best and most experienced players at the game as soon as they leave the academy. 2.If you have 15m SP and get slaughtered by other people with 15m SP why should you get put against players who have less SP ? You're basically saying that because you suck you need to be put up against people in Militia Gear when your using Proto/ADV gear so you can get kills and do well ! That is exactly why people want the matchmaking system fixed in the first place lol .. WE WANT PLAYER SKILL AND TEAMWORK TO BE THE DETERMINING FACTOR how exactly is giving you an advantage over players with less SP beneficial ? It may benefit you but it doesn't benefit the people you get put up against ! After reading this i'm actually certain that I got the essence of why you (there are certainly others that think like that but i don't believe it's everyone) want the matchmaking system fixed and from your post I can understand why this is how you would do it. I just strongly disagree with this being the objective of a matchmaking system. As I've said, there are several reasons for why having high SP does not always translate to a performance that is competitive enough to allow reasonably balanced matches. I don't think that one group of players is more deserving of allowing them to play against similarly strong opponents than the other in general. All players should have a venue where they can count on getting a challenging, yet fun and potentially rewarding fight. I think that this venue are pubs and that this is the task that a matchmaking system ought to fulfill by putting an even distribution of different skill, SP and gear levels into each team. It should be holistic and not dependant on any individual factor of any individual player, but on the combined power of each team, so that everyone can focus on fulfilling his role on the battlefield and everyone gets a chance contribute to the match, regardless of his personal position within the spectrum. No one should be forced into a perpetual circle of matches where, for whatever reason, he has no chance to compete with the rest of both his team and the oppents team. Karl Marx II wrote: 3.If you have used your 15m SP sporadically and put it in a wide variety of skills then you will obviously be weaker than someone who specialised ther skills into 1 role .. although you will have a more diverse selection of fits .. but don;t forget that YOU are solely responsible for where you invested your SP and are therefore again responsible for having weaker fittings. This is a solid point and I agree if we are talking about PC and partially FW. But, just looking at current PC paradigms we can conclude that 15m SP spread out does not yield competitive performance against 15m SP focused. Not in any individual engagement (this works as intended) and not on a wider scope (this is a problem). I'd like to stress that "generalist approach" does not equal "dumping SP into every useless thing one probably can't/won't use properly anyway" just to clear on the definitions. As it stands, the up-sides of generalizing do not balance out the downsides. A generalist approach does not work well right now, and would work even less with a SP facused MM system, making a theoratically valid and viable approach to skilling a death trap for everyone going that route. I'd say that this might be a whole seperate issue that deserves its own thread, but its consequences are a part of this problem aswell. Karl Marx II wrote: 4.As I have posted in an earlier comment .. it isn't just matchmaking that needs fixing, PVE needs adding as well therefore if you were losing alot in PVP and wanted to do something different to maybe earn ISK and SP or just improve your game then you could do PVE instead ! Full agreement here. PVE can not come soon enough for so many reasons. I just don't think we'll see anything of the sorts for quite some time and therefore getting the match making right in the mean time is important. You can take a benign object, -you can take a cheeseburger and deconstruct it to its source...

Vinsarrow New Eden Blades Of The Azure Zero-Day 126	Posted - 2013.12.04 19:05:00 - [71] - Quote This post certainly grew fast.... just saying
Vinsarrow New Eden Blades Of The Azure Zero-Day 138	Posted - 2013.12.09 00:41:00 - [72] - Quote I'm seeing proto complaints again so i'm bumping this up again
John Demonsbane Unorganized Ninja Infantry Tactics League of Infamy 647	Posted - 2013.12.09 04:51:00 - [73] - Quote Yup. Saw a couple jackasses running around with officer weapons in a pub tonight. Some Spanish corp. "The line between disorder and order lies in logistics" -Sun Tzu Amarr victor!
Vinsarrow New Eden Blades Of The Azure Zero-Day 163	Posted - 2013.12.16 19:25:00 - [74] - Quote Well somethings need work, hit detection, for example when a bullet or whatever hits you - it shows with a red arrow where it came from, it's harder now to notice now as it's only a red blur in the direction you were hit & layered over it is the affect of your sheild being hit by attacks. As for Rail Rifle yes it's OP - Why? My friend bought the lowest level AUR (costs 30 AUR) & with barely any to no modules was able to swiftly kill Proto's, as for those who saved SP for 1.7 & were all proto & so on are expected to kill people with proto Rail Rifle however the Rail Rifle is OP & it will eventually be nerfed just stating the obvious. Everyone's running it simply because it's OP which is obvious if you go into almost any & all matches.... Hopefully though CCP won't nerf it so bad it becomes as useless as Laser Rifles or Flaylocks the Rail Rifle has potential just needs work. But this is reply is more on about 1.7 & less aboto the proto issue
CLONE117 planetary retaliation organisation 515	Posted - 2013.12.16 19:33:00 - [75] - Quote make an opendoor type restriction. which is basically optional parameters that can be turned on and off at anytime at your merc quarters. would include gear, squad size, wp, sp. all that stuff... and the best part its all optional and doesnt actually force players to do anything. this is how i feel it should be like. its pretty much the perfect solution. as it allows players to go into matches they want or basically set up their own matches.
Vinsarrow New Eden Blades Of The Azure Zero-Day 165	Posted - 2013.12.21 19:50:00 - [76] - Quote Not a bad idea
Vinsarrow New Eden Blades Of The Azure Zero-Day 170	Posted - 2014.01.02 19:47:00 - [77] - Quote Bumping
PARKOUR PRACTIONER Redline Defense Force Seekers of the Unseen 216	Posted - 2014.01.02 19:51:00 - [78] - Quote I love militiastomping the protostompers. 'Don't talk to stranger, shoot them.' Snow LOCKOUT I will never stop killing you. Dropship Pilot/Ninja/Sniper
trraacx Seituoda Taskforce Command Caldari State 57	Posted - 2014.01.02 20:00:00 - [79] - Quote Have matchmaking based on the amount of ISK you are willing to put into a match. If you lose more ISK than you have bid, you get booted, no SP or ISK earned. Your team goes a man down.
TheWee BabySeamus Dem Durrty Boyz Renegade Alliance 73	Posted - 2014.01.02 20:16:00 - [80] - Quote Vinsarrow wrote: For the very last time people stop with your going on about proto stomping & your insane nonesense ways to fix it. This is the 1 easy, fast, & clear solution so support it if you want proto stomping to finally be fixed.... All CCP has to do is this, those with higher Lifetime SP wiil be facing only people with the same high range of Lifetime SP. Example a person with 15 million Lifetime SP will only be facing people with 17 million & 13 million Lifetime SP range. People with low lifetime SP will only be facing people with low Lifetime SP. Example a person has 5 million Lifetime SP then they'll only be facing people with the range of 7 million & 3 million Lifetime SP. Veterans with Veterans - Newbies with Newbies With the exception of squads & PC matches, then the system can match varying similiar people with similiar Lifetime SP range, in other words the more squads that are full the more the Lifetime SP will change to fit a general Lifetime SP range for all those playing. Example Amarr side has 2 Squads, Squad A is full proto & they're lifetime SP is generally around 10 million, Squad B has 1 proto user, 3 moderate people running adavanced gear like GEK's lifetime SP ranging 5 - 2 million, with 2 newbies in it's squad - The Minmitar side has 1 full squad & 1 half full squad, Squad A is all moderate people running Advanced gear, Squad B (the half filled squad) has 1 proto & 2 newbies. Scotty The AI will be encripted with mathmatical calculation gathering each & everyone's SP coming to a general Lifetime SP range of say 6 million+ (for the example above) be around the general range then Scotty will only allow "The randoms or Extra" people entering the match only to be within the priamaters of 6 million. There only people with 8 - 6 - 4 million Lifetime SP range can get in on that match. This will mean a little longer match loading & if CCP brings back The War Room to matches besides Factional & PC then Scotty can do his calculations while "Waiting for deployment" & at The War Room.... All well and good but the player base is waaaaayyyyyy to small for this to work effectively. Wee Baby Seamus-------------->DDB Director & #1 Sex chat operator

TunRa Third Rock From The Sun INTERGALACTIC WARPIGS 313	Posted - 2014.01.02 20:53:00 - [81] - Quote It is going to be so fun when the one dust player with 50mil SP is fighting the other player with...oh wait... With a low player count it will be hard to balance based on SP, we will be having 10v2 or 5v5 matches. Yeah that is much better. Thanks CCP Foxfour
Vulcanus Lightbringer Eyniletti Rangers Minmatar Republic 146	Posted - 2014.01.02 20:58:00 - [82] - Quote Two better ways in my opinion would be: 1. Tiericide! or, 2. Restrict PRO-equipment from being used in public matches.
Paran Tadec The Hetairoi 1817	Posted - 2014.01.02 20:59:00 - [83] - Quote Vinsarrow wrote: For the very last time people stop with your going on about proto stomping & your insane nonesense ways to fix it. This is the 1 easy, fast, & clear solution so support it if you want proto stomping to finally be fixed.... All CCP has to do is this, those with higher Lifetime SP wiil be facing only people with the same high range of Lifetime SP. Example a person with 15 million Lifetime SP will only be facing people with 17 million & 13 million Lifetime SP range. People with low lifetime SP will only be facing people with low Lifetime SP. Example a person has 5 million Lifetime SP then they'll only be facing people with the range of 7 million & 3 million Lifetime SP. Veterans with Veterans - Newbies with Newbies With the exception of squads & PC matches, then the system can match varying similiar people with similiar Lifetime SP range, in other words the more squads that are full the more the Lifetime SP will change to fit a general Lifetime SP range for all those playing. Example Amarr side has 2 Squads, Squad A is full proto & they're lifetime SP is generally around 10 million, Squad B has 1 proto user, 3 moderate people running adavanced gear like GEK's lifetime SP ranging 5 - 2 million, with 2 newbies in it's squad - The Minmitar side has 1 full squad & 1 half full squad, Squad A is all moderate people running Advanced gear, Squad B (the half filled squad) has 1 proto & 2 newbies. Scotty The AI will be encripted with mathmatical calculation gathering each & everyone's SP coming to a general Lifetime SP range of say 6 million+ (for the example above) be around the general range then Scotty will only allow "The randoms or Extra" people entering the match only to be within the priamaters of 6 million. There only people with 8 - 6 - 4 million Lifetime SP range can get in on that match. This will mean a little longer match loading & if CCP brings back The War Room to matches besides Factional & PC then Scotty can do his calculations while "Waiting for deployment" & at The War Room.... Skill into proto. Stop qq. Bittervet Proficiency V thanks logibro!
Jake Bloodworth Molon Labe. Public Disorder. 261	Posted - 2014.01.02 21:01:00 - [84] - Quote Another "fix" for a perceived problem. Protostomping is merely a symptom of a greater problem. TTK is too low for new players to react. Also, proto suits need roles and bonuses that change their play style instead of simply giving them more tank/gank. You can't matchmake your way out of proto stomping. What about high SP players with low Isk? How do they compete against wealthy players when they can't afford to proto all day? You give ideas that are tired and proven lacking. Only content and balance can improve dust for the new/poor player.
Vinsarrow New Eden Blades Of The Azure Zero-Day 177	Posted - 2014.01.27 21:20:00 - [85] - Quote Did you read everything I posted here? I assume no from the reply. The idea is good & has been edited & new ideas have arisen with it.
XANDER KAG Red Star. EoN. 556	Posted - 2014.01.27 21:24:00 - [86] - Quote While nice in theory, what if you are absolutely terrible at shooters but have 20 mil sp? You can't even quit and come back for easier opponents because your opponents would then be stronger still. Who says you can't kill in style? When CCP plays Dust514
Cat Merc Ahrendee Mercenaries EoN. 6031	Posted - 2014.01.27 21:44:00 - [87] - Quote I hate threads that use "-final" like they know their idea is the best there is in the whole universe and CCP must accept it because it's so holy since it came from your mouth. It's not final until CCP adds it in, and it's generally accepted to be balanced. In the future, it might get imbalanced, so in reality, it's never final until CCP stops working on the game. Shield regeneration bonus for Gallente Assault is about as useful as Sharpshooter for Nova Knives. Tuna > Tacos
sabre prime The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY 55	Posted - 2014.01.27 21:58:00 - [88] - Quote XANDER KAG wrote: While nice in theory, what if you are absolutely terrible at shooters but have 20 mil sp? You can't even quit and come back for easier opponents because your opponents would then be stronger still. Exactly, it sounds nice in theory. Maybe this has already been discussed earlier in the thread but the amount of SP you have doesn't necessarily dictate the gear you are going to use. What if someone with 20 M SP specialised into vehicles wants to play a few games running and gunning out of his/her vehicles? This player probably won't have very good dropsuits or weapons skills. Which team do they get put on? The game can't read a players mind and know which dropsuits/weapons they intend to spawn in with before a game starts. Just because you have high SP and protogear, doesn't mean you intend to use it. I think matchmaking is a more complicated issue. Desperate attempt to get BPOs
knight of 6 SVER True Blood Public Disorder. 1253	Posted - 2014.01.27 22:09:00 - [89] - Quote SP != skill you can get 8+ million skill points a year without logging in. a player that leaves the game or is generally a poor player will be forced up the ladder even though they may not deserve it. and it's not impossible to have a highly skilled player stuck low on the ladder with a min maxed build because they are hard capped at the amount of SP they can earn per week. "God favors the side with the best artillery" ~ Napoleon Ko6, scout. CLOSED BETA VET
Salviatino Maiano Eternal Beings Proficiency V. 111	Posted - 2014.01.27 22:25:00 - [90] - Quote Why is the solution always to take away from the game? Why not add to it? Add new game modes each new game mode the same as before but with limitations on gear, weapons and equipment. Maybe we could start offering better ways to add upon what we already have, instead of complaining about what's wrong with we already have I'm right behind you...

Everything Dies Chatelain Rapid Response Gallente Federation 440	Posted - 2014.01.27 22:51:00 - [91] - Quote Vinsarrow wrote: For the very last time people stop with your going on about proto stomping & your insane nonesense ways to fix it. This is the 1 easy, fast, & clear solution so support it if you want proto stomping to finally be fixed.... All CCP has to do is this, those with higher Lifetime SP wiil be facing only people with the same high range of Lifetime SP. Example a person with 15 million Lifetime SP will only be facing people with 17 million & 13 million Lifetime SP range. People with low lifetime SP will only be facing people with low Lifetime SP. Example a person has 5 million Lifetime SP then they'll only be facing people with the range of 7 million & 3 million Lifetime SP. Veterans with Veterans - Newbies with Newbies With the exception of squads & PC matches, then the system can match varying similiar people with similiar Lifetime SP range, in other words the more squads that are full the more the Lifetime SP will change to fit a general Lifetime SP range for all those playing. Example Amarr side has 2 Squads, Squad A is full proto & they're lifetime SP is generally around 10 million, Squad B has 1 proto user, 3 moderate people running adavanced gear like GEK's lifetime SP ranging 5 - 2 million, with 2 newbies in it's squad - The Minmitar side has 1 full squad & 1 half full squad, Squad A is all moderate people running Advanced gear, Squad B (the half filled squad) has 1 proto & 2 newbies. Scotty The AI will be encripted with mathmatical calculation gathering each & everyone's SP coming to a general Lifetime SP range of say 6 million+ (for the example above) be around the general range then Scotty will only allow "The randoms or Extra" people entering the match only to be within the priamaters of 6 million. There only people with 8 - 6 - 4 million Lifetime SP range can get in on that match. This will mean a little longer match loading & if CCP brings back The War Room to matches besides Factional & PC then Scotty can do his calculations while "Waiting for deployment" & at The War Room.... I disagree. The easiest option would simply be to have a squad-free mode; the problem isn't with individuals running proto gear--it's the players from big corps that all squad up together and spend every match redlining their opponents. Remove that ability from one game mode and you should a safe haven for newer/less-competitive gamers. Life is killing me.
Galvan Nized Deep Space Republic 557	Posted - 2014.01.27 22:54:00 - [92] - Quote I've always considered this a gamemode issue. It's obvious CCP wanted people to graduate out of pubs. However, both FW and PC are terrible in design that everyone is just funneled right back to pub matches. FW just cannot sustain itself while PC is a few matches a day at best for a very limited amount of players and is a glorified farm at worst. Fix this and add in PVE first. Give reason for older players to go play in FW/PC and give other players a safe haven in PVE. This alone will help bolster the player count. Once we get more players then metrics for matchmaking in pubs could work.
Derpty Derp Derpty Derp Derr Deerrr 6	Posted - 2014.01.27 23:04:00 - [93] - Quote Scotty will die a horrible death if you give him this many calculations... and as much as I wish it on a daily basis, that would mean no more matches at all... So I'm just gonna say no. Plus I like shooting people with proto gear, just land a cheap gorgon on their heads Squish But seriously you can kill proto ** with cheap , so I'm not seeing the problem... The only real problem is actual new players that have to go up against people who've been playing for ages (even if they don't have proto **, that's unfair.)


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