Question:
I haven't really used a heavy suit all that much, but why do heavies feel as though they have to use a heavy weapon? If the HMG isn't working very well, why not just throw on an AR?

Question:
I haven't really used a heavy suit all that much, but why do heavies feel as though they have to use a heavy weapon? If the HMG isn't working very well, why not just throw on an AR?

How about using an ar with a heavy suit? The ultimate murder combo (until you run out of ammo that is)

I pubstomp hard on my heavy alt, except ambush where its strictly long range combat, but thats just bad map design.

Not so much bad map design as intelligent map design - forcing it so that you're not always going to be in your element. Adapt or die, yanno?

When the HEAVY was a beast , love it

Only heavies that'll do this are heavies with no SP in another suit. I can't see why they would otherwise.

Medium suit tank fits are great. So there's no reason to use a heavy suit with an AR when you have almost as much eHP as a heavy while using a medium suit.

CCP's answer to this was to increase the base eHP by 20%... so now the gap between a medium tank and a heavy tank suit increased ever so slightly...

yo...before Chromosome the heavy was a beast...then it slowly went from a lion to a house cat.

It was awesome,But I'm still running it and still have fun

IMO, a Class Balance gives all of the Classes a role. It gives them strengths and weaknesses and rewards them for doing their job. Right now, it seems like Logi's and Assaults are the only ones getting love, and while that fixes 75% of the game, the 25% minority is getting fed up (Dropships, Tanks, Scouts, etc).

From what I have gathered on the forums, this is what will make this game a "Tactical Shooter" which is what you guys want apparently.

You need Scouts that scout. Logi's that support (NOT attack), Assaulter's that make up the front lines, Heavies that take coordinated efforts to bring down, Dropships that survive long enough to give air support, Tanks that require coordinated efforts to be taken down, LAV's that actually SUPPORT infantry (lightning raids, rapid transportation, hit and run (not splatter and run))

Make the suits have some balance against each other.
For example;

The speed of a scout makes it effective against lone heavies, allowing them to outmanuver their slower foe, and their high DPS in CQC should make short work of him. However, an Assault at mid range would be very deadly to a scout if he were to try to attack. A scout should still be able to run away (thats what his speed is for right?), and to successfully kill a scout trying to run away, would require planning and probably more than one person. It would be the same as finding a criminal running in a building. You put men at the exits, and you box him in until he has nowhere left to run.

Medium Frames should be effective in all scenario's yet not a master in them. Their prime area is their versatility, being able to adapt their tactics to fit the need, always trying to get the enemy at a disadvantage, NOT themselves at an advantage. For example, engage scouts at mid-range (Scouts are only good in CQC). Attack heavies in groups (Give him more than one target to shoot at, he can only fire in one direction. Concentrated fire will kill him). They should move up to engage longer range opponents by moving from cover to cover, using their average speed and health to allow them to survive until the target is at a disadvantage.

Heavy Frames should be effective against medium suits at close-mid range with that HMG. That gun should shread through people not under cover, and force people to take cover. This allows the front-line to move forward. Since you are Aggro'ing at that point, the high eHP is important, allowing you to tank damage long enough for your front lines to move up. You stay still, they move up, you heal, rinse, repeat.

How the classes should be:

Make scouts great in 1v1's and CQC, but unable to survive sustained fire, making battle's against groups of enemies futile (thats the Assaulter's job). Give them WP for doing their job. Scanners should give WP on kills on detected enemies.

Make Logi's tough enough to SURVIVE behind the front lines. They should not be on the front lines (that's the Assaulter's job), they should give the Assault's a reason to fall back if need be. Mainly for health and ammo. They rez teammates after they push up, not sprinting to the front lines in a rambo revive (you have a 30 second timer for a reason)

Make Assaulter's versatile, and a "Jack of all Trades". They should be tough, yet flexible. Leave specialization to the other classes, you are there to be a Soldier. Proficient with your weapon of choice, and skilled at using it in that role. AR's should be an all around weapon, yet not outshine any other weapons specialization (Skilled in all, Master of None).

Make Heavies a force to be reckoned with. They should be the pushers, and the defenders. A heavy should be so tough, it should make the front line focus on him to take him down. They should help push the front line forward, by making the enemy fall back to cover. They should be able to shut down hallways, and mow down infantry and small vehicles with the HMG.

Dropships should be a form of air support and rapid transport. Think of the Transport chopper in BF3. Dang useful when used right. It could allow you to drop a whole squad in from the air, and even let your gunners clear the LZ, or help in an assault. Just like a chopper would.

Tanks need to shred though Armor, and Infantry at long-mid range. Close range is their weakness, but they should require coordinated efforts by AV to take down. They are the "big boys" for a reason. A lone AV should discourage attack but not kill. Two should wound a Tank FORCING it to move or be killed. Three AV should be the magical kill zone, (assuming standard meta level, ADV AV vs. ADV Tank, etc etc.)

If you fix these things, you WILL get your tactical shooter that most CPM's claim to want. I know this will not be instant, but I can wait, so long as I know that you are headed in this direction.

You should be trying to get the HMG fixed. What's the point of more resistance or HP if you don't have the accuracy, range, and DPS to back it up?

Question:
I haven't really used a heavy suit all that much, but why do heavies feel as though they have to use a heavy weapon? If the HMG isn't working very well, why not just throw on an AR?

Remember when heavies were feared? Remember when you heard an HMG you would think twice about confronting a heavy? Remember when it took 2-4 guys to take down a heavy? Remember when the HMG was a beast? Pepperidge Farm remembers!

Like honestly, this struggle...

Since Uprising 1.0 I've been fighting to get the heavy class back to when they were feared. 1.2-1.3 Heavies were alright, and even gimped they had a chance of doing decent in competitive modes. What makes a heavy good in Uprising is not the weapon he uses or the suit, is his brain and how he thinks.

When a heavy does good it's because he played his arse off, not because he had an easy mode AR with him. Positioning is key and support from a logi, but even then, a logi is not a guarantee. A heavy's best friend is his way of thinking. When a class is no longer doing well IN SPITE OF his best asset, THEN THE CLASS HAS GONE TO CRAP! The HMG is too weak, and the suit's inability to tank or to resist any explosive spam is a joke! A class ( Amarr heavy suit) that's suppose to be "point defense" can't handle a nade or 2, yet people have 3 in their pocket, and the ability to sit on a hive and spam more??!! What kind of logic is this?

No matter how well a heavy is thinking in PC, he'll get put down by either a lucky nade due to nade spam, or 1 dude holding an AR with thumbs. When last has anyone heard "MAN THE HMG IS OP!!!!"... lol... last time i heard that was from the AR leet players from Chromosome. Since Uprising came out the HMG is a joke compared to what it was.

I don't know what suits we're getting in the near future, but if they don't fix the HMG, then it won't matter! What happen to the people that actually want to play this "point defense" role? What gun should they use? A shotgun? An AR? An SMG? All these weapons are better suited to CQC battles than the HMG is, due to their ACCURACY.

Feedback to make the class better? Here we go again:

- Decrease HMG bullet spread

- Increase DMG if you're not decreasing bullet spread

- A skill to reduce spread (FFS!)

- A skill for explosive resistance

- Reduce the headshot penalties on heavies! It's not hard to shoot their heads, they're only the size of a microwave.

- Small arms resistance (?) People brought this up many times

- If none of these ideas suit you and you're still thinking buffing eHP is the solution for everything, then increase it by 50-100% because 20% is nothing, honestly, that may as well not even be done because heavies will die just as fast.

So many things I want to go off on a tangent about on this game, but this heavy issue strikes home for me because it's my class, and the chosen class of quite a few players, and the treatment and the general disregard for the class is grinding my gears.

Medium class got all their suits, got a full range of ARs, got Scrambler Rifles, new AR variants on the way. Medium class gets eveything, cool, what about the other 2 classes in this game CCP?

WHAT ABOUT THE HEAVY?

WHAT ABOUT THE SCOUT?

You have 2 classes that may as well not exist in DUST.

Heavies should STOP USING THE CLASS. Time to put up or shut up. The fact that you're complaining about the class and continue to use it shows CCP you're willing to take whatever they throw your way. This 20% increase to eHP is not enough! How about 20% decrease in HMG bullet spread? Or 20% increase in DMG?

You're giving the class something it doesn't care to have and that nobody asked for!

STOP USING THE CLASS

Time to protest like we did at the start of Uprising.

https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=72041

https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=73100&find=unread

^ They made a difference, and now it's time to make a difference again.

Please link whatever thread you have that's relevant feedback or just a discussion on how to make this class better. I don't understand where CCP got this 20% increase to eHP buff from.

Edit: This will be my last Heavy thread. I'll be shamelessly bumping this thread everyday until CCP says something about the class, or I see something somewhere in some patch notes. If it gets locked, I'll make the same one, if I get banned, I'll create a new account.

I'd just like to point out that you have been, literally, making threads crying and complaining about heavies for what seems like a year now. Carry on.