DUST Search - A Call to Boycott The Heavy Class

Master Jaraiya wrote:

I've said it before and I'll say it again:

The problem with the HMG is that they are forcing it to be a "Short range suppression weapon".

This is oxymoronic.

By it's inherent nature an HMG should not be a short range high dispersion weapon! It should be a med to med-long range low dispersion high damage weapon. (Real Life HMGs have twice the Range of an AR with greater accuracy see GE M134 Minigun.)

Suppression means keeping the enemy out, away, pinned down, restricted to cover. If my enemy is able to get within his own striking distance long before he is in mine, have I suppressed my enemy? The answer is no!

The problem occurs with balance. CCP has apparently tried to balance a Heavy Anti-infantry weapon against a Light Anti-Infantry Weapon, with terrible results.

The Light Infantry Assault should be the most versatile, and it is. It is able to deal Decent damage, carry Equipment, Sidearms, and Explosives, as well as have decent survivability. This is currently the case, so no real problems there.

The Heavy Infantry Sentinel should be dealing the Highest DPS (in practice, not only on paper) and have significantly more Tank/TTK, but require support from light infantry. Currently the only one of these Heavies can claim is requiring support from light infantry. This is where the problem lies.

The HMG: We currently have a weapon which requires Heavies to let Light infantry get danger close before we can even think about engaging. The HMG should be able to hold Light infantry at bay, forcing them to use tactics/specialist weapons to Counter such as flanking, or stealth using Shotguns, Knova Knives, Mass Drivers Tactical Rifles, etc. Instead The Poor range and poor dispersion of the HMG allows even shotgun users to sprint directly up to Heavies and pop off 2 shots to drop, before the HMG even reaches it's optimal killing potential. Ranged Light Weapons simply have to Stay outside an HMG's optimal range, and score a few headshots.

The best counter to an HMG Heavy should not be Light Infantry with an Assault Rifle!!!

I know that statement is upsetting to more than a few, but it is true nonetheless!

The HMG should be viable enough to defend the slow, very large Dropsuit required to wield it.

This means engaging at range. There is no other way to make the Heavy Dropsuit viable. Once an enemy has closed distance on a Heavy, the heavy doesn't stand a chance. Heavies simply do not have the maneuvering capabilities to make it a viable CQC Dropsuit.

In order to fix the problem with the Heavy Dropsuit, the HMG must become what it is inherently meant to be. A long range, High Damage Med. Dispersion, Suppression Weapon.


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Powerh8er Norwegian Dust514 Corporation Top Men. 207	Posted - 2013.10.29 23:18:00 - [1] - Quote From wikipedia: 'Many heavy machine guns, such as the Browning M2 .50 caliber machine gun, are accurate enough to engage targets at great distances. During the Vietnam War, Carlos Hathcock set the record for a long-distance shot at 7382 ft (2250 m) with a .50 caliber heavy machine gun he had equipped with a telescopic sight. This led to the introduction of .50 caliber anti-materiel sniper rifles, such as the Barrett M82.' Im not saying it needs to have the same range as a sniper rifle, but it needs a serious range buff and better dispersion. The way it is now it overheats even before hitting barndoor at rock throwing distance.
Powerh8er Norwegian Dust514 Corporation Top Men. 215	Posted - 2013.10.30 17:56:00 - [2] - Quote Master Jaraiya wrote: I've said it before and I'll say it again: The problem with the HMG is that they are forcing it to be a "Short range suppression weapon". This is oxymoronic. By it's inherent nature an HMG should not be a short range high dispersion weapon! It should be a med to med-long range low dispersion high damage weapon. (Real Life HMGs have twice the Range of an AR with greater accuracy see GE M134 Minigun.) Suppression means keeping the enemy out, away, pinned down, restricted to cover. If my enemy is able to get within his own striking distance long before he is in mine, have I suppressed my enemy? The answer is no! The problem occurs with balance. CCP has apparently tried to balance a Heavy Anti-infantry weapon against a Light Anti-Infantry Weapon, with terrible results. The Light Infantry Assault should be the most versatile, and it is. It is able to deal Decent damage, carry Equipment, Sidearms, and Explosives, as well as have decent survivability. This is currently the case, so no real problems there. The Heavy Infantry Sentinel should be dealing the Highest DPS (in practice, not only on paper) and have significantly more Tank/TTK, but require support from light infantry. Currently the only one of these Heavies can claim is requiring support from light infantry. This is where the problem lies. The HMG: We currently have a weapon which requires Heavies to let Light infantry get danger close before we can even think about engaging. The HMG should be able to hold Light infantry at bay, forcing them to use tactics/specialist weapons to Counter such as flanking, or stealth using Shotguns, Knova Knives, Mass Drivers Tactical Rifles, etc. Instead The Poor range and poor dispersion of the HMG allows even shotgun users to sprint directly up to Heavies and pop off 2 shots to drop, before the HMG even reaches it's optimal killing potential. Ranged Light Weapons simply have to Stay outside an HMG's optimal range, and score a few headshots. The best counter to an HMG Heavy should not be Light Infantry with an Assault Rifle!!! I know that statement is upsetting to more than a few, but it is true nonetheless! The HMG should be viable enough to defend the slow, very large Dropsuit required to wield it. This means engaging at range. There is no other way to make the Heavy Dropsuit viable. Once an enemy has closed distance on a Heavy, the heavy doesn't stand a chance. Heavies simply do not have the maneuvering capabilities to make it a viable CQC Dropsuit. In order to fix the problem with the Heavy Dropsuit, the HMG must become what it is inherently meant to be. A long range, High Damage Med. Dispersion, Suppression Weapon. +1 I wouldnt mind a bit if the HMG prize went up 500 percent, if they fix it so that it actually performs like a real HMG. Im that desperate and frustrated with the so-called heavy machine gun
Powerh8er Norwegian Dust514 Corporation Top Men. 258	Posted - 2013.11.03 23:14:00 - [3] - Quote Im boycotting my heavy main char.
Powerh8er Norwegian Dust514 Corporation Top Men. 263	Posted - 2013.11.04 02:58:00 - [4] - Quote Alpha 443-6732 wrote: What do you guys think of this suggestion? https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1460012#post1460012 Completely idiotic, the heavy aspect to a machine gun is useally to describe a much larger caliber round in comparison to other weapons aswell as the weight to the gun. The gun weighs 60 kilos in the description and in comparison to the Browning 50. cal machinegun that weighs 55 kilos has the former longest recorded kill with a scope fitted to it. (2,092 meters by U.S. Marine sniper Carlos Hathcock in 1967). What he suggest is not what i want by a long shot, i personally want the HMG to be very good from medium to long range, but hard to use in CQC, like the forge gun more or less.
Powerh8er Norwegian Dust514 Corporation Top Men. 263	Posted - 2013.11.04 03:24:00 - [5] - Quote Alpha 443-6732 wrote: Powerh8er wrote: Alpha 443-6732 wrote: What do you guys think of this suggestion? https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1460012#post1460012 Completely idiotic, the heavy aspect to a machine gun is useally to describe a much larger caliber round in comparison to other weapons aswell as the weight to the gun. The gun weighs 60 kilos in the description and in comparison to the Browning 50. cal machinegun that weighs 55 kilos has the former longest recorded kill with a scope fitted to it. (2,092 meters by U.S. Marine sniper Carlos Hathcock in 1967). What he suggest is not what i want by a long shot, i personally want the HMG to be very good from medium to long range, but hard to use in CQC, like the forge gun more or less. I suggest you guys keep an eye on that thread, I am trying to explain the fundamental purpose of heavy weapons and the other guys don't seem to get it... I know, and I thank you.
Powerh8er Norwegian Dust514 Corporation Top Men. 268	Posted - 2013.11.05 09:29:00 - [6] - Quote Killed a few heavies today myself with my scrubby assault alt char, shot them in the back and because their turn speed is the same as a 120 year old elephant they all died before me. Still boycotting my heavy main char.
Powerh8er Norwegian Dust514 Corporation Top Men. 271	Posted - 2013.11.05 19:14:00 - [7] - Quote Lance 2ballzStrong wrote: can we get a comment from a dev? Not bloody likely.