This, of course, begs the following questions:

1. What completely selfless, team-helping role are you fulfilling on the battle field?
2. Why is that choice superior to scout suits wanting to do more interesting things than skulking around telling all the big boys where the meanies are?
3. Why are you surprised that people are pursuing combat roles in a combat game?

I'm genuinely curious: Where is this scout role you're talking about described and decided? Are they found in the Dust manual. Hmmm....no. Anywhere in the scout suit description? Hm, let's see: "the scout suit is the obvious choice for infiltration, counter-espionage, and assassination". Huh? What's that? "Assassination"? Well, waddyaknow. I guess maybe the scout suit was actually meant to be able to kill someone, not just sidle around looking for people.[/sarcasm]

CCP's main marketing spiel for this game is that the player's can decide their own roles, rather than have the game force them to play in one particular way. So, yes, we reserve the right to be negative to suggestions that would unduly limit our choices.

1. I'm a speed-fit, profile-dampened Min logi in skirmish and an *actual* scout when ambushing in a squad, laser assault when solo. I believe that's 2/3 for selflessness, no?
2. The choice is superior because it's what the suit is designed to do.
3. I'm not surprised by that. What I'm surprised by is the apparent entitlement to have everything be combat viable 1st, intended role 2nd.

Bast*rds? Absolutely.
Selfish? Hmmm ...

Scout stalks and closes the gap on unsuspecting prey.
EZ-Mode AR fires over Scout's shoulder, from behind cover 50 meters away.
Sneak attack foiled; glory stolen from Scout ... who cares ... its his job to spot the red-dots, not to kill them.
And if the hostile turns around and kills the Scout ... who cares ... its the Scout's fault if he gets spotted.

Selfish safely describes why AR-514 keeps proposing this change under guise of a "buff" for Scouts. Poonmunch is an exception; he was actually trying to help. If you want all Scouts to be perform a Recon role, then give us two equipment slots. We'll all run Active Scanners (promise).


Absolutely. CCP does not use the phrase "Recon Drone" in describing the Scout; rather, they chose to label us Assassin. We hope to perform this role with greater odds of success and survival if/when CCP gets around to a true Scout buff.

1. In skirmish I'm assuming you do a lot of hacking for the team? Something that helps the team though no doubt. The fact that running from point to point hacking gives you 1,000-2,000 WP per match doesn't mean anything to you. I'd say you're closer to 1/3 and only if you really just run scanners as a scout. Otherwise you're not doing much anyone can't do themselves in ambush.
2. How? Explain that. Because profile dampening helps you sneak up on people or snipe and the melee bonus helps you assassinate. If you mean the scan radius bonus on the GalScout then you must be joking. How often do you scan someone within the smallest circle on the radar that a teammate can't also see? Scanners are very costly and scouts have very low CPU/PG so I really don't see why you think the role you're referring to was even considered when designing the Scout suit.
3. I refer you to bullet point 2 for the intended role counterargument. Entitlement? Are you kidding? Everyone has the same level of entitlement in this game to do whatever they want to with whatever suit they want to. Scout suit users that never touch a scanner have no one to answer to just like logi users that never run reppers/needles.

This is in reference to solo stealth/assassination work, correct? If so, then why are you in a squad of slayers/direct assault? If you want to assassinate reds, either do it on your own or join a squad specializing stealth that you can work together with. The point of a squad is to form groups to aid each other and work together.

There is nothing wrong with using a scout in a combative role. In fact, scouts can do well using stealth and surprise (hopefully even better once CCP finally gets around to buffing us). BUT there is something wrong with joining a squad and then expecting to do everything solo.

1) That doesn't happen with the scanner right now. Why would it happen with shared vision?
2) Running straight from teammates to an enemy ... not to be looking at you ... you're doing it wrong.
3) What happened to flanking? Or to using your speed to outmanoeuvre?
4) Instead of giving a likely scenario, you've constructed one that suits your opinion. Anyone can do that.
5) It's something of a contradictory ... label of "assassin" ... suit's name is "scout".
6) I am entirely in favour of the two eq slots.
7) I'm beginning to think people have assumed I want scouts to remain as gimped as they are now.

Sabotage the scout? You send the scout in first and the squad picks their targets. What exactly goes wrong?
You use the example of siphoning off Assault ammo. Ever heard of nanohives?

I don't criticise logis who run assault, or heavies who snipe. I criticise people who pick a role and complain that it doesn't do things it was never tailored to do. This is what scouts in this thread are doing by objecting to this idea.
The lack of WP rewards is a balance issue being addressed as we speak. It is not a valid complaint.

This is great idea IMO. Especially in PC.

Mine or his?
Would you rather your squad see what you see or you see what your squad sees so you don't need a scanner, leave it to the logi?

1) The first is ours to control, the second is not.
2) Agreed. It's all about calculating risk and playing smart.
3) Contrary to popular belief, the vast majority of us employ flanking tactics.
4) You're right, but the point remains.
5) Fair enough, but CCP could change the suit description if they thought it conveyed falsity.
6) \o/
7) Pardon my defensive posture; there've been quite a few bad "buff" ideas lately.

Dude your joking right?
Please explain how me sharing what I see benifits me?
Do I get points for this? Do you get points for this? Yes , +50+50 for spooking my targets an getting me dead.
This would make nova knifing impossible!
I have 21 million sp in a scout, I invested in all electronic skills and proto scanner, this scanner is your shared vision, my electronics skills are mine, not yours to mooch from!
You wanna help scouts then share your vision with us so we don't have to scan in un safe areas, that would benifit us.
1.5 scanners and wp will be insane so you don't need our vision, we need yours so our equipment slots can be used for more valuable things like uplinks and remotes to leave you a spot to spawn so we have reinforcements, so we're not taking on three mercs alone, and yes that is why we need to be light fast assaults because we are expected to get a spot solo!

So people saying we're not for killing and were only for recon are a friggen joke! You have any idea what a scouts role in pc is?
Keep 6 mercs chasing you so your team can use the uplink you placed to take the objectiv you made a full squad chase you from. An I'm sorry but my stamina does actually run out an I'm not faster than 6 op duv AR'S!

So yeah, your theory helps no one, why don't you put sp in something other than your gun, an spend your own millions of sp on ewar instead of trying to use ours an make us your bait, so why don't you quit being greedy an give us your vision!

I think it would be useful to give people using scout suits a native squad vision ability that they don't have to equip a scanner for.

If the scout can see it, then the whole squad should be able to see it, too.

Kinda what a scout is for. Spotting bad guys.


Munch

1. I'm a speed-fit, profile-dampened Min logi in skirmish and an *actual* scout when ambushing in a squad, laser assault when solo. I believe that's 2/3 for selflessness, no?
2. The choice is superior because it's what the suit is designed to do.
3. I'm not surprised by that. What I'm surprised by is the apparent entitlement to have everything be combat viable 1st, intended role 2nd.

That quote from the suit description is perfect. I hope you don't mind me throwing that in people's faces from now on whenever someone tries to tell me to "do my job" as a scout.

1. You've assumed I don't want scouts to be rewards for their efforts.
Don't do that.
2. The clue is in the title: scout. Just because CCP haven't been very good at making it work, it isn't an argument in favour of commandeering the suit for something else. If that was the case, the early WP-less Chromosome logis should have seen an entire redesign towards alternate assaults too.
3. No they don't. Heavies don't get equipment. Logis don't get forge guns. You're making an argument I've literally just addressed in that same post. We're entitled to do what we want with a suit, we aren't entitled to have the suit's design decisions tailored to something other than its intended role.

Point 2: Ok. Then, as an assault, you're only allowed to kill people and blow stuff up. No healing, reviving, hacking or anything else that isn't a display of direct aggression towards the enemy. Likewise, as a logi, you're only allowed to distribute equipment and ferry people around. Ie. perform logistics. Strictly no killing.

Void, have you heard of a strawman argument?

See my above post.

Yes, why? Have I misrepresented your arguments?

Also, have you heard of evasiveness? You still haven't answered my question about who decided that the scout has one exact role to fulfill; a role that strangely coincides with what you think a scout should do.

Yes. You've misrepresented me. I'm not interested in continuing any exchange unless you can manage a proper representation.

Then make them better. Maybe equivalent to hand held scanners.


Munch