Yup. Another AR balancing post. This is my view on how we can balance it.

I've been an AR user since I've first started playing in January. From my experience as an AR user, I put together a document that would make this weapon more of a 'jack-of-all-trades' weapon. I'm not necessarily proposing to nerf or buff it. Simply balancing it.

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1UDin3aJhrQ2dg_oTzbMfoDlQ9H542of48Twk-NG_9Xw/edit?usp=sharing

Do note, I've not done any variants or tiers of this weapon. Just the plain Assault Rifle. I'll do tiers and variants later.

I hope you enjoy! Feedback is always welcomed.

I'll give you a +1 because that was very elaborate work.
But i disagree.I think ARs are powerful,but as they are i think they are good.
An above avarege player like myself can do in any AR user with my niche weapon the Scrambler rifle.(Other playerswith TAC ars,ASCR,SMG's,Mass drivers,etc...)
They are just the most overall effective weapon,but its not OP.There by they dont need a ''balance''.

Hear me now people.The AR playerbase is around 55%-60% Of all dust 514

If you ''balance'' (NERF) the AR, you will have at LEAST 50% of our miserable 2000 playerbase complaining/leaving just because some niche weapon users felt they were getting overrun by ARs.

I prefer dealing with ARs as they are than loosing yet another 400-800 players due to AR nerf.

I was just talking with 4 of my friends about your post.
They all use Duvolles ARs.

They say they wouldnt mind a CLIP REDUCTION, but the damage should stay.

I kind of agree with them,i mean,still hit hard,but negating your spray and pray ability wthat is at the end of the day the REAL problem.

45 For Regular ARS
18-24 TAC
30 for Burst
30 For Breach

This of course.If applied needs,for balance sake, a clip reduction for Scramblers:

55 ASCR
35 SCrbs

Just my 2 cents.

I'm an AR user. It's the only weapon I have trained to a prototype level. I want ARs to be toned down.

Let that sink in for a moment. I want the only weapon I am capable of using to be toned down. It is OP. There's a reason 60% or higher of the playerbase uses ARs. This whole build has been a giant clusterf*ck, and rapid fire weapons (aside from the HMG) are to blame. The time to kill has gone down to a Rainbow 6 shooter level of one shot one kill, effectively. You don't get to react. Your skill points in shield extension or armor plating don't count for anything. All that matters is that you're using an AR or assault scrambler, and that you shot the other guy first.

Imagine if every frigate in eve came with a doomsday device on it. That is what Dust is today. Subdreddit has 382 people in it who have logged in during the last 30 days. After a few weeks with this ridiculous instakill version of Dust the average number of players logged in for our corp has dropped to less than 10.

People do not enjoy playing Dust in it's current state.

My approach to this is to log in and play a few games with cheap fits in a squad, and log out the moment I get bored. Lately I'm getting about two games in before I get to that point. The only reason I'm still logging in every day is because of the SP bonus. If it weren't for that I'd play once every three days. I used to cap out every week and then start leveling an alt.

Yes Dust has had some major improvements, and yes it will continue to do so. But I think the game has come to a critical point. The massive buff to high ROF weapons was a gigantic leap in the wrong direction. People just die way too fast. If this doesn't get fixed quickly, I'm concerned that the playerbase is going to fall off a cliff that will take years to recover from.

I think even the laser rifle may need to be looked at. I loved it back in the day and was sad when it became useless, but now I think it's just too powerful again. This is all about time to kill, not how powerful one weapon is compared to another.

It is a good proposal, I too have thought of just reducing clip size. But in reality you're making the weapon UP. A few times I'll find myself have barely 5 or so bullets left right after killing just a medium frame. This is usually due to himher being a somewhat good distance from me and he/she's movement. If you reduce JUST the clip size you're penalizing the AR user for a situation like that. Increasing the damage just a tad bit would compensate for this. It's reducing the spray and pray 'tactic' from ARs, while maintaining a good amount of damage. Because you will always miss. The least skilled players will miss more than the skilled, and will find that this weapon is not worth speccing into, then we'll have a reduced population using such a good weapon. (I'm not saying that reducing the population is a bad thing, but reducing the population because it's UP is a bad thing. I'd rather the population be reduced because there are weapons just as good as this one out there.)

I do appreciate their input, and I do like the clip stats for the variants. And it does make sense to reduce the ScrR's clip size.

The AR in Dust is supposed to be a blaster rifle. This means it should have high DPS, but be very short range.

It shouldn't be a generalist weapon in the first place - That was CCP's second mistake with it.
Their first was naming it the assault rifle rather than the blaster/plasma rifle that it is.

Even the generalist version of this weapon might be ok if CCP didn't also go ahead and make it OP. Yes it is. It has too long a range, to much ammo, too high of DPS, and is too accurate.

Nerf a couple of these stats and the AR might be ok. Until then, Dust is dead.

Hail king AR. Hail AR 514.

I agree on the Range and the Accuracy, I disagree on the DPS and ammo.

Compared to the AsCR ( the only real comparable weapon) the GAR has nearly the same DPS and Range (Stupid concep) but the AsCR has a bigger clip and more ammo. So any changes to the GAR have to be followed by a balance approach on the AsCR (and bear in mind the AsCr should only mimic the power of the GAR)

People comparing ASCR with ARs are demented, sorry but its true.
If the ASCR was so good , there would be more people using it,and as it is i can get in a game and see 10 people with AR and i've never seen more than 1-2 ASCR in a game.Why, the ARs dont have recoil,nor dispersion rate, have equal or even more optimal range than the ASCR,dont have the amount of muzzle flash the ASCR has nor it overheats....
the :''the only real comparable weapon'' part is just , incorrect.There is NO weapon that compares to the AR.

OF COURSE if the ARs would get a ammo decrease to 45 the ASCR would have an ammo decrease equally comparable.ASCR clips, 60.

I'm an AR user. It's the only weapon I have trained to a prototype level. I want ARs to be toned down.

Let that sink in for a moment. I want the only weapon I am capable of using to be toned down. It is OP. There's a reason 60% or higher of the playerbase uses ARs. This whole build has been a giant clusterf*ck, and rapid fire weapons (aside from the HMG) are to blame. The time to kill has gone down to a Rainbow 6 shooter level of one shot one kill, effectively. You don't get to react. Your skill points in shield extension or armor plating don't count for anything. All that matters is that you're using an AR or assault scrambler, and that you shot the other guy first.

Imagine if every frigate in eve came with a doomsday device on it. That is what Dust is today. Subdreddit has 382 people in it who have logged in during the last 30 days. After a few weeks with this ridiculous instakill version of Dust the average number of players logged in for our corp has dropped to less than 10.

People do not enjoy playing Dust in it's current state.

My approach to this is to log in and play a few games with cheap fits in a squad, and log out the moment I get bored. Lately I'm getting about two games in before I get to that point. The only reason I'm still logging in every day is because of the SP bonus. If it weren't for that I'd play once every three days. I used to cap out every week and then start leveling an alt.

Yes Dust has had some major improvements, and yes it will continue to do so. But I think the game has come to a critical point. The massive buff to high ROF weapons was a gigantic leap in the wrong direction. People just die way too fast. If this doesn't get fixed quickly, I'm concerned that the playerbase is going to fall off a cliff that will take years to recover from.

I think even the laser rifle may need to be looked at. I loved it back in the day and was sad when it became useless, but now I think it's just too powerful again. This is all about time to kill, not how powerful one weapon is compared to another.

Gonna throw my two cents in as well I believe.

AR's. I love them. I play a scout running a scrambler pistol so this is the majority of my opposition. They do their job very efficiently especially to my poor over taxed shielding and armor. I've been slowly progressing this new character ( Just a little over a mill sp and rising. Just hit my cap a few hours ago for the week so I'm very happy that resets soon. ) Off topic. Back on topic now. The AR does its job of reminding me that I have no freakin armor. I run a valor suit because I'm cheap and had some aur left over from a pack I decided to buy. So my current ehp on my main ADV hacking scout is 92/199. The heavies with the HMG's don't scare me like an AR plinking at my armor when I'm tacticly retreating my motocross looking backside behind some cover toward my squad. Heavies simple cant keep up unless I missed one on my initial overlook of an area before moving in to harass. I'm the annoying little guy that always tries to flank your group with the pistol and headshots people from you side to try and thin the group. So these AR's as current do their job to send my suit scurrying.

Now for a subject of things I've noticed on my bonus sp used up character. This one is specced into AR level 4 cause again, new characters. Now the problem seems to lie with my burst AR's. Doing damage calc's my ar is firing a three round burst at I believe ( cant remember exact figure but we will say...) 34 damage a shot? Three round bursts hitting a target with each bullet doing 34 should add up to 102 damage per pull of the trigger. It however still takes me half a mag to down an enemy from across two close rooftops. Im not sure if it's because I'm doing the calculations wrong or what but I think the hit registration might be wonky on this. I love that its a three round burst but for the effectiveness I cannot afford to fit it on my regular suits. ive used entire stocks of ammo with it not getting a single kill because people hop back into cover after standing there and letting me lay into them for several seconds. Idk, could just be me on those rifles.

In short, AR's dont all need a nerf, maybe a buff on the breach's rate of fire and a little bit more recoil would fix them. As well as maybe a bit less range to them with the exception of the burst and tac which I feel should be classed as Marksmen role type weapons, hence keep the range. My two cents.

You've earned my +1 sir. My ideas for balancing ARs were a lot less involved than this; basically just increasing recoil and reducing range. But I actually really appreciate your approach because I think it really does drive that jack of all trades role home. One thing I didn't see you mention that I think also needs to be done is making the recoil actually work properly. Because right now, any recoil accumulated from continuous fire can instantly be removed and reset simply by letting go of the trigger for an instant. This makes no sense from either a mechanical or thematic perspective.

The only thing about your work that I really specifically didn't agree with was your comparison to real world assault rifles. This is really something that needs to be said more clearly anyway, so to go off on a minor tangent: this game has nothing to do with the real world. People frequently try to reference real world guns to make cases for their ideas, things like "IRL ARs and even miniguns can fire accurately up to or past 100 meters easy!" But again, this means literally nothing. Because Dust doesn't take place in modern day earth, it takes place in a future sci-fi far away galaxy setting. The technology used here in no way follows the norms and conventions of our technology, for better or worse.

And think about this, there is no 'biotic' HP, just shields and armor. This implies that when even a single bullet penetrates your suit, it kills you immediately with ease. Which means these guns are all actually incredibly lethal, which in turn means that these dropsuits must also be really really good at keeping people alive against such powerful munition. So while I have no doubt that your assault rifle can fire a bullet at least 100 meters, it simply isn't able to damage a target in a high-tech Iron Man suit at that range.

Ok, sorry to get a little ranty there, but I think it needed to be said. Anywho, overall great work here OP. I look forward to seeing more of your balancing ideas for other weapons in the future.

I'll give you a +1 because that was very elaborate work.
But i disagree.I think ARs are powerful,but as they are i think they are good.
An above avarege player like myself can do in any AR user with my niche weapon the Scrambler rifle.(Other playerswith TAC ars,ASCR,SMG's,Mass drivers,etc...)
They are just the most overall effective weapon,but its not OP.There by they dont need a ''balance''.

Hear me now people.The AR playerbase is around 55%-60% Of all dust 514

If you ''balance'' (NERF) the AR, you will have at LEAST 50% of our miserable 2000 playerbase complaining/leaving just because some niche weapon users felt they were getting overrun by ARs.

I prefer dealing with ARs as they are than loosing yet another 400-800 players due to AR nerf.

you know the RoF for the laser rifle is 750.

when you remove the HMG from the ammo count because is skews the numbers you only get 28 rounds per clip average.

also remove MD/sniper rifles because it skews your damage number as well as AV weapons.

I was just talking with 4 of my friends about your post.
They all use Duvolles ARs.

They say they wouldnt mind a CLIP REDUCTION, but the damage should stay.

I kind of agree with them,i mean,still hit hard,but negating your spray and pray ability wthat is at the end of the day the REAL problem.

45 For Regular ARS
18-24 TAC
30 for Burst
30 For Breach

This of course.If applied needs,for balance sake, a clip reduction for Scramblers:

55 ASCR
35 SCrbs

Just my 2 cents.

I'll give you a +1 because that was very elaborate work.
But i disagree.I think ARs are powerful,but as they are i think they are good.
An above avarege player like myself can do in any AR user with my niche weapon the Scrambler rifle.(Other playerswith TAC ars,ASCR,SMG's,Mass drivers,etc...)
They are just the most overall effective weapon,but its not OP.There by they dont need a ''balance''.

Hear me now people.The AR playerbase is around 55%-60% Of all dust 514

If you ''balance'' (NERF) the AR, you will have at LEAST 50% of our miserable 2000 playerbase complaining/leaving just because some niche weapon users felt they were getting overrun by ARs.

I prefer dealing with ARs as they are than loosing yet another 400-800 players due to AR nerf.

The auto scrambler being at a high SP level is a big part of its limited use. I'd have to log in and check, but I think it's also more expensive than a GEK as well. Combine this with a lot of people running only logi suits, it means that they have to always use the high end weapon in the line or be helpless up close. I skilled it up on an alt and it hits fairly accurately at a surprisingly long range, despite the scatter.

Yup. Another AR balancing post. This is my view on how we can balance it.

I've been an AR user since I've first started playing in January. From my experience as an AR user, I put together a document that would make this weapon more of a 'jack-of-all-trades' weapon. I'm not necessarily proposing to nerf or buff it. Simply balancing it.

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1UDin3aJhrQ2dg_oTzbMfoDlQ9H542of48Twk-NG_9Xw/edit?usp=sharing

Do note, I've not done any variants or tiers of this weapon. Just the plain Assault Rifle. I'll do tiers and variants later.

I hope you enjoy! Feedback is always welcomed.

+1 for the data. Once again, you were very thorough.

Anyways, I disagree on what you should do for the Breach AR.

IMHO A Breach weapon is designed to do one thing: Kill whoever is in front of you FAST. Think about breaching a door with one person on the other side. You don't want to ruin the element of surprise by drawing out the gunfight. You want him dead before he can react.

How is that achieved? High Damage, High ROF.

"But Ghost, that's SO OP"

Right now, yeah, but that's whats balancing is for.

If you want a High DPS weapon for CQC, you need to make sure that it doesn't become deadly at range or be able to mow through a horde of people with one clip. Breach weapons are made to take on a single target (OR two) in a clip. Due to the huge damage and high ROF, it should have terrible accuracy. Why? Cause you don't need accuracy at point blank. You are just trying to kill one or two people, and then reload and move up or run away .

So, I propose that all Breach weapons follow this Stat Trend:

Breach "INSERT WEAPON HERE"
Damage: HIGH
ROF: HIGH
Accuracy: MID-LOW
Range: VERY SHORT
Clip Size: LOW

***EDIT***
As a side note, I wanna see who agree's with me on this.

Right now, the standard AR has a HIGHER hipfire accuracy than an SMG.

In what world would an AR be easier to handle full auto over an SMG from the hip. Makes no sense. And that is what is probably leading to the CQC Spray and Pray from AR users. And why they beat SMG's silly in point blank CQC

I agree with everything you've said but the clip size of 225 is the only thing I'm wary of. A 3% (if memory serves) ammo increase on that is only 6 bullets per freaking skill level. That's just stupid. It would have to be changed to lets say 15 rounds per skill level, at level 5 that would be 75 coming to a nice round 300 rounds. :)

I hate running out of ammo, but I hate running out of ammo with an AR the most. I run out of ammo the most with it. I would prefer it not be reduced but I don't know what 225 would feel like right now.

Quick thing, I'd recommend adding just the new weapon stats to the OP. That way they can be quickly and easily referenced, without needing to look through your longer document.

Edit: Looking at the TAR, I'm afraid that the damage may be a bit too high. I understand that it's doing the same damage per clip as your proposed AR, but I think you might have underestimated the advantage of raw damage over clip size here. I mean, I know you said you weren't a fan of using DPS to help calculate this variant's stats, but skilled players are going to get good enough with it to fire many shots quickly and accurately, and right now it would dish out a whopping 700 dps. I'd strongly recommend lowering the damage.

While I'm on that subject, how exactly do you decide on what damage/clip size to start off with? I understand (and 100% agree with) your notion of making sure all the variants do the same damage per clip, but where do the starting numbers come from? Do you just pick what seems right for damage and balance the rest from there? Just something I was curious about.

Lastly, I think there's something you don't quite get about the point of these rifles and their variants. As has been stated by CCP here, the overall idea for the finished product is that each race has their main assault rifle, made with that race's signature technology and specific firing mechanics, and then the three variants are attempts to mimic the other races' assault rifles with their own tech. So it goes:

Amarr- Scrambler Rifle [Laser]; Tactical
Caldari- Rail Rifle [Railgun]; Breach (man that really does need a better name...)
Gallente- Plasma Rifle [Plasma]; Assault
Minmatar- Combat Rifle [Projectile]; Burst

So it just doesn't really make sense to say there shouldn't be a tactical variant for the Gallente rifle just because it's typically a short range weapon. Think of it this way, it may shoot farther than the normal base assault variant of the weapon, but it should still never shoot farther than the Amarr's base scrambler rifle.

Edit 2: Found the post I was talking about.

No.

Just did the DPS math on them, and 490 DPS with the same accuracy as now is the definition of OP.

It shouldn't be this accurate even with the current DPS, and this new stats is 65 DPS faster at killing.

Bump recoil and nerf accuracy moderately and keep damage stats.

If it is necessary, reduce clip size.

Done.

The auto scrambler being at a high SP level is a big part of its limited use. I'd have to log in and check, but I think it's also more expensive than a GEK as well. Combine this with a lot of people running only logi suits, it means that they have to always use the high end weapon in the line or be helpless up close. I skilled it up on an alt and it hits fairly accurately at a surprisingly long range, despite the scatter.

His proposed stats nerfed accuracy, recoil, clip size, reload time, and range. So....

It says NOTHING about range.

Or Recoil.

The Change to reload is Negligible, a fourth a second

And, all it does is make this new clip size is STILL a negligible difference considering that the AR now kills 15 percent faster!

It wont NEED the clip size with the TTK!

It still can Kill even the biggest brick a heavy can be with ONE clip.

This, isn't what is needed.

The AR needs a Clip size drop, a accuracy nerf, and a range change, nothing more.

This is an overly complicated proposal, compared to the one we have known NEEDED to be put in for a long time!

It says NOTHING about range.

Or Recoil.

The Change to reload is Negligible, a fourth a second

And, all it does is make this new clip size is STILL a negligible difference considering that the AR now kills 15 percent faster!

It wont NEED the clip size with the TTK!

It still can Kill even the biggest brick a heavy can be with ONE clip.

This, isn't what is needed.

The AR needs a Clip size drop, a accuracy nerf, and a range change, nothing more.

This is an overly complicated proposal, compared to the one we have known NEEDED to be put in for a long time!

Uh, maybe go read it again...?

Although that does bring up a point Syn; some of your stats in the OP need their ranges added. And I'd suggest maybe also putting in a sentence or two about making sure the AR's recoil isn't immediately reset by not firing for an instant.

Honestly, I still feel like the TAR is doing a little too much damage. Let's not forget that right now, unfortunately, modded controllers are a thing that happens. And people are going to use them to get the maximum DPS, which would currently be 633.33. I'd like to effectively negate their use by lowering the fire rate. I actually really like the idea of 300 RPM, because that equates to exactly 5 shots per second, which is definitely doable by just a decent player with some practice, so modded controllers wouldn't really have an edge here. Also, I feel like 5 shots per second is about how many I'd expect from a tactical rifle. This would bring its DPS to 475, or 15 below the standard AR. Which again, I'm ok with, because I feel it sacrifices that small amount of DPS for its extended range. That's my opinion, anyway.

As a side note, the TAR in the OP still seems to have the old stats. And as a side side note, did you change the ammo stats to correlate with new damage? By my count, it would be Clip Size: 20 and Max Ammo: 100.

Honestly, I still feel like the TAR is doing a little too much damage. Let's not forget that right now, unfortunately, modded controllers are a thing that happens. And people are going to use them to get the maximum DPS, which would currently be 633.33. I'd like to effectively negate their use by lowering the fire rate. I actually really like the idea of 300 RPM, because that equates to exactly 5 shots per second, which is definitely doable by just a decent player with some practice, so modded controllers wouldn't really have an edge here. Also, I feel like 5 shots per second is about how many I'd expect from a tactical rifle. This would bring its DPS to 475, or 15 below the standard AR. Which again, I'm ok with, because I feel it sacrifices that small amount of DPS for its extended range. That's my opinion, anyway.

As a side note, the TAR in the OP still seems to have the old stats. And as a side side note, did you change the ammo stats to correlate with new damage? By my count, it would be Clip Size: 20 and Max Ammo: 100.

OMG, why do you want to change the TAR!?

No.

Just no.

Leave it alone!

TAR is meant to be a variant that mimics the Scrambler Rifle. The range on a blaster is greater than the range on the actual thing it's trying to mimic. Something I have to go back and address in my proposal actually. The TAR is not balanced if you have unbalanced variants of the same weapon.

That's perfect AR scrub logic. You practically just admitted the AR was OP. Every other weapon (except AV) gets huge nerfs and ya'll laugh, but when people start saying the AR needs a nerf, and are intelligent about it, you're all up in arms because there are too many of you. All the niche weapon users had to adapt and you will have to as well, unless, of course, you beg for a respec. HTFU, scrub.

Yea so it looks like some people just saw the posts about suggested TAR stats and jumped on the opportunity to defend their weapon of choice. To those people, please read the rest of the thread before suddenly spouting unwarranted concerns.

I read the rest of the thread and there is nothing I like about the suggested TAR stats.

I read the rest of the thread and there is nothing I like about the suggested TAR stats.

The MILLITIA AR is way OP, but i think ALL millitia weapons are.
The EXILE AR is a bit to powerfull to.

The gek-38 AR works ok, but the EXILE and MILLITIA are better.

The tactical AR's got nerfed so bad, and there was only a prob with the ROF, but the nerf squad did not stop there, now its almost useless to, i never use it anymore.

The breach AR's OMG they suck, i -never use them anymore, they are utterly USELESS.

The burst AR's are even worse, i never use them anymore, they also have become utterly USELESS.

The only AR that Works as it is supose to is the DUVOLLE AR.

Most of the AR's sucks and are utterly USELESS.

STOP nerfing the AR's, and fix the broken ones insted.

I can se from the things many of you whrite that you DONT use AR's or only tried the millitia AR, becourse its pure lies and false statements they come up with.

I am lvl 5 light weapon, lvl 5 AR, lvl 5 pro, on my main here, im also lvl 5 sniper, lvl 5 swarms, and lvl 5 SMG i do know what im talking about.
.
My alt GHOST 2630 is lvl 5 laser and SCR and all i can say is AR's are NOT OP. Millitia weapons and BPO weapons are OP...

That was a long, vivid account. In which you said absolutely nothing that relates to the point of this thread. Incidentally, you may or may not find this to be an interesting read.

Please read the post from the start to the end and you will find the Words NERF and AR many many times, a few times it is called ballance for some reason, but really they talk about nerfing...

I dont know if you are stupid or just dumb, or if you just try to be funny. IDIOT

Anywho Syn, got the burst stats coming up soon?

No worries. Also, the breach variant really needs a new name, we should work on that. How about....the 'Siege' variant?

Alrighty. So what were your specific issues with it?

I think the TAR is much better as it is and it doesn't feel unbalanced at all. I don't think it needs more damage output and sure I don't think it needs a ROF reduction and this extends to all the other proposed stats. There is not a real reason why these basic mechanics should be changed...

About the range, which is a slightly different point, it should not be reduced. Instead, the scrambler's optimal range should be increased by 10 meters (more or less).

The thing is they donGÇÖt need to nerf, they just need to get the prices right.. for example if you get to 250% the price the GEK has now, do any of you think the weapon would be so indiscriminately used as right now?
The answer is no, and AR users would need to start thinking more about fitting and start using more the other AR variants, just because the weapon itGÇÖs so good overall it should reflect in its cost, the same goes for any other weapon in its assault form and in all tiers; kind of how it is in the AScR vs ScR pricing situation.

That aside I think that by numbers and some other features the assault variants (in almost any weapon it has it) are really well balanced with each other, but not with all the other versions available in the market.

If we are gonna be handed crappy or niche weapons they should cost less, and OHK and assault and really good weapons should cost a lot more

The AR in Dust is supposed to be a blaster rifle. This means it should have high DPS, but be very short range.

It shouldn't be a generalist weapon in the first place - That was CCP's second mistake with it.
Their first was naming it the assault rifle rather than the blaster/plasma rifle that it is.

Even the generalist version of this weapon might be ok if CCP didn't also go ahead and make it OP. Yes it is. It has too long a range, to much ammo, too high of DPS, and is too accurate.

Nerf a couple of these stats and the AR might be ok. Until then, Dust is dead.

Hail king AR. Hail AR 514.

The idea behind balancing is to give all weapons a relatively even amount of usability and functionality. It is not meant to make all weapons the same. At range a sniper rifle or SCR are by far superior to an AR (other than a TAC which is on par with the SCR). My point is that if you want to balance something, looking at the role it plays is key. You don't use an AR to mow down a whole squad of mercs as they are approaching an objective you use an HMG. If you must use an AR try to pull mercs out of the group. The same is true of the SCR and neither one does it better, they are very close in damage and have Mid range as their engagement range.

I don't feel that the AR is unbalanced one bit. Currently 5-10 shots from any weapon that any merc uses against me seem to take me down from around 500 hp to 0 hp, it doesn't matter which one it is. I know that there are probably other factors such as combined dps from multiple guns or splash from MDs and grenades but I don't think it is reasonable to say that an AR needs to be balanced at this time. If that were the case we would all be asking for more damage and larger clips (which I honestly would not say no to).

If you want more balance within the weapon classes you may just be waiting for the Combat and Rail rifles. I don't know what to expect out of the new weapons but I believe that it will be longer range than the AR and SCR while doing more damage and be a tactical type of gun. There is really no need to worry about AR balance until these are brought to the table, and I am sure we will revisit this topic once they are here, but I don't really see the point in balancing a weaker (than SCR, HMG, MD) weapon unless it is to ask for a Buff.

Edit: I just looked back at another thread and realized ARs are the only weapon with a Sharpshooter skill, used to reduce dispersion. The HMG and SCR as well as the SMG should all have this skill as they are Automatic Weapons, this is the answer, dispersion reduction by skill level.

I would like to mention that I will terminate this character. Mainly because of the poor choices I made when using skill points. Sadly I see no respec in the horizon, so this is the only way I must go about doing things. Not only that but I like to start fresh and new, this character feels junky. This main fully specced into ARs, and I feel that it's not challenging enough. It's to 'easy-mode' actually. And I want more of a challenge.

My main will now be Archbot.

You can't just start speccing into what you want now?