You are changing multiple variables at once but basing your decision to reduce graduation requirements on the older setup. I would have changed the academy mode and then checked the WP average for that.

I also vote for opening the opportunity to move out of the academy battles but leaving the option there for some time.

I also suggest giving faster SP accrual during some initial period.

Yes, we are. For a number of reasons we're running tests on a weekly cadence right now, so we don't really have time to explore the entire possibility space variable-by-variable. Instead we're jumping between reasonably optimized implementations of various different plausible models of new player behavior, to try and establish as quickly as possible which model gets us in the right ballpark. We have a number of likely-looking mountains that we want to do a rough height-check on; once we've established some baselines for those, we'll be in a position to consider doing hill-climbing to find local maxima.

All this experimentation is in service of building a better understanding of how new players actually behave, which we can then lean on in future to build a better overall new player experience. We're very aware of the need to review all aspects of the way we introduce DUST to new players; what we're doing here is just trying to learn what we can with the tools already in place.

Yes, we are. For a number of reasons we're running tests on a weekly cadence right now, so we don't really have time to explore the entire possibility space variable-by-variable. Instead we're jumping between reasonably optimized implementations of various different plausible models of new player behavior, to try and establish as quickly as possible which model gets us in the right ballpark. We have a number of likely-looking mountains that we want to do a rough height-check on; once we've established some baselines for those, we'll be in a position to consider doing hill-climbing to find local maxima.

(...)We're also adjusting the War Point total you need to accumulate in order to graduate from the Academy, down to 400 War Points. This didn't seem like a very large number to most of us here, but our metrics suggest the median new player is scoring about 100 WP per battle, so this has them graduating from the Academy after probably 3-5 battles (with better players graduating sooner and less able ones staying longer, of course). Once graduated, players are free to join any of the normal game modes.(...)

We're also adjusting the War Point total you need to accumulate in order to graduate from the Academy, down to 400 War Points.

Hi there Mercenaries,

So as many of you noticed, we made some adjustments to the Battle Academy (the new player battle queue) in Uprising 1.3 last week. Today, you'll notice in the patchnotes that we're adjusting it again. If you're reading this thread, it's probably because you're interested in knowing why, so let me try and explain

The short version is that we're trying to figure out exactly what works, in terms of giving new players the best experience possible.

In 1.3, we did an experiment to see what effect giving new players the simplest possible game mode would have, by moving the Academy to a 16-player Ambush map. Our provisional conclusion is "new players don't really like super-simple game modes", so today we're switching the Academy queue over to 32-player Domination. This adds more players, and takes the experience closer to the "full-fat" Skirmish mode while still (hopefully!) keeping the game flow easily comprehensible.

We're also adjusting the War Point total you need to accumulate in order to graduate from the Academy, down to 400 War Points. This didn't seem like a very large number to most of us here, but our metrics suggest the median new player is scoring about 100 WP per battle, so this has them graduating from the Academy after probably 3-5 battles (with better players graduating sooner and less able ones staying longer, of course). Once graduated, players are free to join any of the normal game modes.

This is an ongoing experiment, so we're expecting to make further changes in the coming weeks, to try out new theories and home in on the best experience. Happily, we've got a reasonably comprehensive set of metrics tracking retention and so on, so we have a pretty good overview of the trends involved.

If you have any questions, please ask away and I'll try and answer as best I can.

Cheers,
-Greyscale

Yes, we are. For a number of reasons we're running tests on a weekly cadence right now, so we don't really have time to explore the entire possibility space variable-by-variable. Instead we're jumping between reasonably optimized implementations of various different plausible models of new player behavior, to try and establish as quickly as possible which model gets us in the right ballpark. We have a number of likely-looking mountains that we want to do a rough height-check on; once we've established some baselines for those, we'll be in a position to consider doing hill-climbing to find local maxima.

Ok. So are you really adding something constructive to the table? Something that would better the experience of the new player??

Fortitude is a mentality that never gets old.

400 war points is a really bad idea. once they play their 4-5 games you are going to throw them into the proto stomping game and they will leave and never come back. It seems whoever is telling yall what to do is really incompetent. there is no way you can justify this change.

I guess it's safe to say by this point that CCP is not afraid to lose some players in the name of statistical research.

Not many people seem to understand what the Dev. said. From my understanding this is a temporary adjustment purely for the point of seeing how new players behave activity wise. Since the main activity change here is how quickly they will be thrown into the main part of the game, I would guess what CCP is looking at is new player acivity once they are out of the academy not so much while they are in it.

Gathering data on how well low SP new players stick around in the main game to get an idea of what SP levels make a considerable difference in player retention looks like the point of this change. Maybe???

All I know is some newberries are gonna die.

Remember, there never used to be an academy.

Tell me, what is the difference between 500k sp and 520k sp when you get thrown up against 15M SP death squads?

What is the difference between 500k sp and 520k sp when you still forget that L2 is to throw a grenade and instead, pull out a nano hive?

What is the difference between a player that leaves after getting proto stomped with only 500k sp and a player that leaves after getting proto stomped with only 520k sp?

Oh I remember. I made my alt just to see what the academy was all about. Right now it's just a big experiment. New players should be called lab rats.

EDIT or rather call them beta beta testers

We're actually looking into this at the moment

You guys at CCP should really re-mention the fact that you have completely REDESIGNED the matchmaking system for a future update...so that all of us know that getting out of the academy won't be such a bad thing here in the near future.

Cause I think that without that little bit of CRUCIAL information, everyone here is going to think that 400 wp is absolutely ridiculous.

Hi there Mercenaries,

So as many of you noticed, we made some adjustments to the Battle Academy (the new player battle queue) in Uprising 1.3 last week. Today, you'll notice in the patchnotes that we're adjusting it again. If you're reading this thread, it's probably because you're interested in knowing why, so let me try and explain

The short version is that we're trying to figure out exactly what works, in terms of giving new players the best experience possible.

In 1.3, we did an experiment to see what effect giving new players the simplest possible game mode would have, by moving the Academy to a 16-player Ambush map. Our provisional conclusion is "new players don't really like super-simple game modes", so today we're switching the Academy queue over to 32-player Domination. This adds more players, and takes the experience closer to the "full-fat" Skirmish mode while still (hopefully!) keeping the game flow easily comprehensible.

We're also adjusting the War Point total you need to accumulate in order to graduate from the Academy, down to 400 War Points. This didn't seem like a very large number to most of us here, but our metrics suggest the median new player is scoring about 100 WP per battle, so this has them graduating from the Academy after probably 3-5 battles (with better players graduating sooner and less able ones staying longer, of course). Once graduated, players are free to join any of the normal game modes.

This is an ongoing experiment, so we're expecting to make further changes in the coming weeks, to try out new theories and home in on the best experience. Happily, we've got a reasonably comprehensive set of metrics tracking retention and so on, so we have a pretty good overview of the trends involved.

If you have any questions, please ask away and I'll try and answer as best I can.

Cheers,
-Greyscale

Really? 100 wp per match so after FOUR GAMES the new players are ready to be protostomped?
ffs cut all the BS and make stats-based matchmaking. in fact i don't know if there's enough people playing to create balanced
teams. if dust had this upon release you WOULD have the player counts!

people aren't going to stick around, grind for months just to be able to compete. and they will always be further and further behind. so why not create a dust for them, a different dust for everyone. where it's enjoyable regardless of your skill level because you will always be progressing at the same rate as others with similar stats.

did you even think this over?

why did you think this was a good idea?

@Michael

Much has already been said about what can be done to improve the new player experience. That's what we are trying to discuss.

You are the one who is offering nothing to the table other than "let the newbie scour the internet for information. DIS IS NEW EDEN!", information that should be easily available in-game.





You sound like one of those old 70 year olds who are "set in their ways". This is a video game. It can and will cease to exist if player counts keep dropping.