I would say another equipment slot + a cpu/pg boost + a buff to move/sprint speed is what scouts need.

Why?

An extra equipment slot would allow me to do more scout-y things at once, like uplink + scanner or uplink + stealth (once it gets here)

The cpu/pg boost would be so that I could actually fit this new equipment on my already cpu/pg tight suit

The move/sprint speed boost would help move the scout away from being a weak assault. 0.5-0.6 m/s difference between our assault variants isn't much to talk about.

You aren't supposed to be able to fit all of your slots with prototype gear.

I certainly can't on my prototype Minmatar logistics suit(even if I had all passive skills at level 5). I could maybe fit 9 prototype items with 1 dead slot(cpu/pg upgrade). That's 9 out of 14 slots(64%).


So I gave it a shot using the fitting tool to see what I could do with proto scouts.

I was able to fit a minmatar mk.0 with 3 complex shield modules, prototype shotgun, standard smg, prototype grenades, prototype kinetic catalyzer, and advanced nanohive while using one enhanced cpu upgrade. That's 6 out of 9 slots(66%).

I was also able to fit a gallente gk.0 with 1 complex shield module, prototype shotgun, prototype nova knives, prototype grenades, 2x prototype kinetic catalyzers, a prototype cardiac regulator, stable drop uplinks(standard but uses less CPU/PG), and using 1 militia CPU upgrade. This one is very tight for PG(uses 79 of 79). That's 7 out of 9(78%).

A cheaper grenade could be used to allow you to use the dead slots with standard items. The flaylock could also be used to make these fittings work more easily as well.



It seems to me that the scout suit is balanced with other suits as far as fittings go, although one extra low slot would help(use it for CPU or PG upgrades).

The primary concern is not about the slots but the lack of CPU/PG for scouts. I'm not asking for too much. Just maybe a tiny little buff is enough.

Ah, so you're basically asking for an 11%(1/9*100) increase in pg and cpu for each new slot given if any are given. I could see one low module with an 11% increase in CPU and PG.

gk.0 has 1 high, 4 low, 1 equip, 1 light weapon, 1 sidearm, 1 grenade for a total of 9 slots. The mk.0 similarly has 9 slots. 12.5% is a rounder number though.

[Gallente light vs medium comparison]
EDIT: extra PG/CPU should be added to be able to fit modules in those slots.

EDIT 2: More speed and an extra equipment slot would also be a nice alternative.

I actually really like the idea of having the basic frame being quite a bit of difference from the specialized versions. This means basic lights might actually fill some sort of niche instead of being a poor man's scout suit.

- Increase base scan range to 15m Only beneficial to CQC scouts. Caldari and Amarr are theorized to have a more ranged focus
- Add 15-20 CPU per suit tier (this assumes no extra modules)
- Add .2 or .3 to base & sprint speed I fear this is too little. Someone mentioned some where that since heavies have ~1.3 less speed than mediums, lights should have ~1.3 more than mediums. That seems like it might work
- Increase jump height by foot or two Sounds cool, but might make bunny hopping better (which I think is bad). Would need field testing.
- Fix stamina 1.2 downgrade I actually like the downgrade. It makes stamina conservation mroe important
- Add another high slot to Gallente pro, Low to Min @ pro (adjust CPU/PG to accomodate) As I said earlier, I fear this would push scouts to be more like assaults.

Actually basic frames are more expensive than specialized dropsuits.

[u][center]
[b][Conclusion]

Gallente light loses 80 HP, loses 2 module slots / gains 0.5 movement speed, gains 0.6 sprint speed, gains better and faster shield recharge: not worth it IMO.

Minmatar ight loses 115 HP, loses 2 module slots / gains 0.4 movement speed, gains 0.5 sprint speed, and gains better and faster shield recharge.

It's the endurance nerf I'm telling you!, running jumping turning corners is gone now

I think it be better if medium suits were slower cause scouts are like 5% faster while heavys are 30% slower and if there medium suits they should be in the medium in between the suits.

What all did they do in the Stamina nerf? I have only noticed the delay when you empty the stamina bar. (Is the delay still there when it isn't emptied?) It's hard for me to tell the extent of it since I switched to my scout sniper fit which has two adv cardiac regulators right after 1.2 occurred.

this stamina nerf is driving me crazy, i have to double think before trying to assassinate someone, as probably i cant run away, i mean, a scout that avoids detection by radar and visual detection, gets close to you, waits, practically preys on you, when the time to kill strikes, boom, lousy hit detection, or something happens, or they have enoght health to tank 2 shotgun shells at pointblank range, the risk/reward balance for us is competedly off, honestly on the WP and ISK front we are better off just hacking and planting drop uplinks, which is ridicoulous for our predominant assassin style

It's not really the amount of stamina that you have that determines the amount of jumping you can do. I have noticed that for every subsequent jump twice the amount of stamina is used. On my minmatar logi I can get 4 jumps out of my stamina before it's completely empty.

My G-Scout can only pull off 3 (sometimes I'm unlucky and am only able to jump twice).

I do think that a solid number would be best. Cardiacs would be much more valuable and would diversify the frames a little more.

CCp, make us full-fledged scouts.
I infiltrate all the time in skirmish, gets the ol' ticker pumping.
Scouts can win wars.

That's odd although I do have a cardiac regulator on it as well. Scouts should be able to out jump other suits(1 more than assaults, 2 more than heavies).

I think Assaults should get a second equip slot at Proto levels, or lvl 4 operation, and the Sentinel gets 1 equip slot at advanced lvl. Logibros shouldn't be the only ones packing multiple equipment slots.

The equip slots were removed because it made logis less (not at all) important. For the mediums and heavies the equipment slots are perfect. Multiple equipment slots should be the strict domain of specific specialisations.

With regards to the rest of this thread, here are my thoughts:
- An extra equipment slot would be great for some players but not so useful for others (until the cloak comes out); personally atm I'd rather have extra mod slots than equipment.
- Gallente scouts should get 1 extra low slot at STD and ADV and 1 extra high at PRO with extra CPU/PG to make it usable. (not sure about min because don't run that)
- Speed should be buffed 0.5m/s (sprint and movement)
- Scan range should be 20m

An extra equipment slot could perhaps be added for another light suit specialisation or the cloak module could be inbuilt to scout suits when it is released.

An extra slot would not allow scouts to become speedy assaults because even with an extra ~70hp, you're still really squishy and the assaults will still mow you down.

Speed and scan range are really the base changes that must be done to enable scouts to perform their proper scoutly duties in whatever battlefield role they choose.

And of course, whatever has been done to stamina needs undoing and jump cost should be a static amount rather than percentage based, which is ridiculous. There should be no complaints about bunny hopping because we're scouts and should be able to hop around nimbly to avoid fire!

Scouts need a buff! Thank you Kagehoshi for lobbying for us : )

We don't need more health, we should be rebalanced on other factors like speed and stealth and equipment.

I would like to point out that we are a little short on CPU and PG at the moment, lemme show you.

At lv 4 skills:
Minnie assault gets 400 CPU and 80 PG
Minnie logi gets 488 CPU and 98PG
Minnie scout gets 288 CPU 75PG

What if the additional Equipment slot was limited selection, so it could only be a Scanner?
That way -all- scouts could easily fit a scanner to... scout.
Also, they'd have one extra piece of equipment to do whatever they want with and be tactically flexible.

Good thread.

1) If we want more CPU/PG and slots to do more 'scouty' stuff - why not just a big reduction to electronics and Biotics module CPU/pg usage? Even better, 'recon' equipment (uplinks, scanners and REs) - especially for that extra equip slot.

Actually help scouts fulfil a role, rather than simply allow it the option of fitting more tank and gank. Something assaults are already good at no?

2) More speed - especially base movement would be good as well, but as far as I'm aware, speed was previously reduced due to technical limitations, so I'm not holding out for too much on that front.

3) Ideally, scout lv5 dampening lv5 and a single complex mod should be enough for a scout to evade 15db scanners as well.

4) Also - if heavies can be the only frame type to get a heavy weapon slot - maybe scouts/lights could get a 'recon' slot or some such for specific light equipment/mods/weapons/grenades/whatever.

5) There's that and stuff like no/reduced fall damage, stamina friendly vaulting capabilities etc.

I always say don't buff scouts, just make scouts the best at that role (cause I don't feel we should nerf logis just to achieve that).

This is somewhat similar to an idea Oswald had, but how about this:

New Dropsuit slot type

Active Module Slot
- Modules that go into this slot work like active modules on vehicles (Active time & cooldown time)
- Used to fit Cloaking, E-War, etc.
- Each suit is given one (except Sentinels)
- Scouts get more
--- Amount each scout suit has is dependent on the suit's tier and race
- Scouts get an additional Class Bonus that decreases fitting costs of all active modules (Could out right replace if scouts also got a ~25% decrease to scan profile)
- Scouts get an additional Racial Bonus that improves the performance of an active module relevant to their race
--- For example, Gallente Scout could get a bonus that decreases Cloaking cooldown time

This would change scouts so that we would be the most versatile in being anti-logis but not denying the other suits access to our abilities.

Edit: Cleaned up proposal

**Solution updated**

[Gallente light vs medium comparison]
Gallente medium:
7 module slots
Gallente medium
330 HP: 120 shield / 210 armor
20 shield recharge rate / 7 s shield recharge delay
5 movement / 7 sprint

Gallente light:
5 module slots
200: 70 armor / 130 armor
40 shield recharge rage / 4 s shield recharge delay
5.5 movement / 7.6 sprint

[Minmatar light vs medium comparison]
Minmatar medium:
7 module slots
Minmatar medium
285 HP: 150 shield / 135 armor
18 shield recharge rate / 6 s shield recharge delay
5.3 movement / 7.4 sprint

Minmatar light:
5 module slots
170 HP: 100 shield / 70 armor
40 shield recharge rate / 4 s shield recharge delay
5.7 movement / 7.9 sprint

[Conclusion]

Gallente light loses 80 HP, loses 2 module slots / gains 0.5 movement speed, gains 0.6 sprint speed, gains better and faster shield recharge: not worth it IMO.

Minmatar ight loses 115 HP, loses 2 module slots / gains 0.4 movement speed, gains 0.5 sprint speed, and gains better and faster shield recharge.

The problem is that light suits sacrifice too much: think the HP loss is a fair tradeoff for the speed and shield recharging, but the loss of slots is too much. With the better hit detection, light suits are going extinct because they are way too easy to kill.

Give basic lights one or two more module slots would make them more able to compete; either through HP tanking for combat light suits, or through increasing their natural abilities like speed. Extra PG/CPU should be added to be able to fit modules in those slots.

Instead of giving scouts more module slots, give them an extra equipment slot, more PG/CPU to use it, and extra movement and sprint speed. This would allow them to carry things like drop uplinks, and also carry more scouty stuff like the active scanner, or cloak field equipment (when it comes). This will help differentiate the specialization from its basic frame.

EDIT: Undo the stamina nerf also

EDIT 2: 1.4 makes the need for a buff even more apparent.