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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 6 post(s) |
Captain Africa Clone1
GRIM MARCH
6
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Posted - 2013.05.31 11:11:00 -
[1] - Quote
Player Owned Customs Office (POCO) is the answer to many current challenges in Dust .
To Dusties unfamiliar to what a POCO is , it is a space station above a planet , Eve players use this space station as a link to move resources (PI) from the planet into space and then to respective markets . Every planet can have one POCO anchored to it .The owner of this POCO sets a tax rate so everything you move through this space station from the planet you have to pay x amount of tax on the total value of shipment.
Ownership of this little feature can make or break the viability for everyone farming on the planet and is well worth fighting for. In high sec Concord own these stations so its a no go zone but as far as low GÇô sec , nul GÇô sec and wormholes go ..... its player owned.
If Eve players had to start putting contracts out for defending or attacking these POKOS , suddenly there will be a HUGE platform for additional interaction namely:
-This will give the opportunity for the big block Dust alliances to have additional stream of revenue and action.
-It will allow the medium and small Dust Corps to also get involved and make extra ISK.
-Due to the fact that there are so many planets being used for PI there will be more than enough action for everyone.
-I really like the fact that you as an Eve player can have a whole Dust corp on your pay role ...and donGÇÖt have to be a super power to make use of the Dust Corporations.
-Its not complicated, the Dust corp attacking the POCO and winning the match takes over the station and hand ownership over to new owner for a fee. GÇô
-A nice change if we could have a map/structure resembling a space station and fighting in it.
-Add additional game play where an Eve pilot have to collect DUST players in a ship from the MCC and deliver them to the POCO ( Its not a long trip ). So there is a chance that the whole squad and Eve pilot can get blown up by other Eve pilots or the defender.
Not that many extra features to be implemented except for an additional map to really make this a reality.
Hope this gets noticed.
Reg
Cap
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iceyburnz
Crux Special Tasks Group
Gallente Federation
562
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Posted - 2013.05.31 11:14:00 -
[2] - Quote
This is a really good idea.
Its that dream of boarding stuff (ships/stations) and fighting over it. Without and eve pilot feeling cheated when a dust team jettisons his pod.
Nice one. |
Daedric Lothar
Onslaught Inc
RISE of LEGION
585
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Posted - 2013.05.31 11:18:00 -
[3] - Quote
I'm not sure it would be worth it. EVE players only make like100-150 million a month from PI per character. Given that it cost us 80M per district I'm not sure the funding would be there. Mostly PI in EVE is a way to make some ISK on the side when you are bored more then an active career. |
Captain Africa Clone1
GRIM MARCH
6
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Posted - 2013.05.31 11:22:00 -
[4] - Quote
Your Info is wrong on ...nul sec and worm holes you can make a lot more , I personally have a few planet's in a wormhole and beleive me with a few characters on them you can make billions on them in a month. |
Captain Africa Clone1
GRIM MARCH
6
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Posted - 2013.05.31 11:47:00 -
[5] - Quote
Daedric Lothar wrote:I'm not sure it would be worth it. EVE players only make like100-150 million a month from PI per character, the poco makes a percentage of that. So if the tax is like 10% adn 3 players are making like 150 mill a month, that poco is like 45M a month revenue . Given that it cost us 80M per district I'm not sure the funding would be there. Mostly PI in EVE is a way to make some ISK on the side when you are bored more then an active career.
My math may be off because I don't mess with Pocos in space. I weighed the option and found Carrier belt ratting to be much more profitable.
You also need to remember that there can be a few different Eve players on one planet. If I had to go and take a hanfull of plantes say 20 . Can ypu imagine how much ISK I will be making off taxes. This would almost be a new career option for Eve players to consider.
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IamI3rian
OSG Planetary Operations
Covert Intervention
100
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Posted - 2013.05.31 11:51:00 -
[6] - Quote
This sounds cool. I know (mostly) nothing about EvE, but it APPEARS to be something (else) which could link the two games together.
Especially if we have an opportunity to fight over/construct these things as well.
As I said, I know nothing about it, so I might as well just +1 and be done with it. = ) |
Captain Africa Clone1
GRIM MARCH
9
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Posted - 2013.05.31 12:01:00 -
[7] - Quote
I think CCP mentioned that this was something they want to per-sue...it was mentioned during fan fest . There is just soooo much possibilities here and dynamics that can solve a lot of current pressing Dust Issues. |
Fadiia
Tal-Romon Legion
Amarr Empire
1
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Posted - 2013.05.31 12:16:00 -
[8] - Quote
Daedric Lothar wrote:I'm not sure it would be worth it. EVE players only make like100-150 million a month from PI per character, the poco makes a percentage of that. So if the tax is like 10% adn 3 players are making like 150 mill a month, that poco is like 45M a month revenue . Given that it cost us 80M per district I'm not sure the funding would be there. Mostly PI in EVE is a way to make some ISK on the side when you are bored more then an active career.
My math may be off because I don't mess with Pocos in space. I weighed the option and found Carrier belt ratting to be much more profitable.
Wrong. I mean totally wrong.
I made 5-7mil a day from from pi when i was an active capsuler. was doing that on highsec planets b/c i had no acces to null sec or wh-space. low-sec can be risky if you have to go collect stuff.
but for test purposes i deployed a commandcenter on a gas planet in wh-space. as i still could see what it was doing even if i wasnt in the system anymore (don't know if it changed, tried it with PI 1.0) i was doing 3x as much as on my high sec planet.
I must say. i had a fair amount of sp in PI and also my layout of the PI structures was very efficient. Nothing someone else with a little brain and sp couldn't do.
In the end i was able to produce a net income of 17mil per day per char. Or 510 mil a month. That was with the price structure of 2.5 years ago. I guess there has been some inflation going on... |
Daedric Lothar
Onslaught Inc
RISE of LEGION
589
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Posted - 2013.05.31 12:33:00 -
[9] - Quote
Fadiia wrote:[
In the end i was able to produce a net income of 17mil per day per char. Or 510 mil a month. That was with the price structure of 2.5 years ago. I guess there has been some inflation going on...
Yea 500M a month is a plex and thats pretty awesome, but I can pull like 100M an hour (200M with salvage) just killing stuff in null belts and anoms. I mean I understand that passive gains are awesome beacuse you can have that going on the side and also do something else, but for this then you have to show up for Orbitals, risk your ship because you can be seen in the whole sec, then you have to pay the mercs to defend your Poco.
What I was saying is that people like PI because its really low risk and not expensive to get into. This is going to change that and make it a much less attactive proposition. However I am sure it can be balanced and with the coming Ice Mining nerf in EVE I am sure anything Fuel related will become a gold mine Isk wise.
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Gundo Sens
DUST University
Ivy League
14
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Posted - 2013.05.31 12:33:00 -
[10] - Quote
I agree this sounds like a really good idea.
If EvE / Dust players could influence the control of resources that produce POS fuels then it could make things more interesting than they are now.
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Vrain Matari
ZionTCD
Unclaimed.
551
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Posted - 2013.05.31 12:44:00 -
[11] - Quote
Captain Africa Clone1 wrote:Your Info is wrong ....on nul sec and worm holes you can make a lot more , I personally have a few planet's in a wormhole and believe me with a few characters on them you can make a billion on them in a month.
Also remember your attacking the POCO so there is no additional charges as in a land grab. Your not attacking the planet or any districts on them. If you don't lose to much in clones you can make a nice profit. Its a nice once off money spinner not something you now have to defend either.
And it stacks nicely with other Eve-based SI bonuses. There's a synergy here that applies to corps who decide to invest in a system.
My question is what orbital improvements can podpilots build that will help the guys on the ground? |
Captain Africa Clone1
GRIM MARCH
11
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Posted - 2013.05.31 12:52:00 -
[12] - Quote
Not much risk either , You will need to get a destroyer near the planet to collect players from the MMC and deliver them to the POCO ( Thats if you wanna go that route)
To simplify things lets say you don't transport the Dust Players - Your squad starts in the station and by activating a few mechanisms you reinforce the station. The owner of the station gets the message that his station is under attack and organizes his own Dust team to defend the station when the station goes out of reinforce mode.
Reinforce timer runs out = match begins. The winning team wins ownership and completes the contract by handing station over to owner for a nice fee. This should happen automated ...we dont want Dust players to sit with all the planets in Eve lol... |
Obodiah Garro
Tech Guard
General Tso's Alliance
45
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Posted - 2013.05.31 12:55:00 -
[13] - Quote
POCOs in Dust... No sir just no.
The OP puts forward some really good points but id rather CCP bring in some fresh ideas/mechanics rather than a reskin/rehash of some old models. They currently have this other game out that's doing really well that caters to all your  needs currently. |
Captain Africa Clone1
GRIM MARCH
11
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Posted - 2013.05.31 12:57:00 -
[14] - Quote
In this case scenario there wont be OB'S cause your team is in space not on the planet. This has nothing to do with PC.
In distant future maybe you could have ships firing directly on station with Dust players replying on turrets shooting at space ships......whooo haaa ! |
Captain Africa Clone1
GRIM MARCH
11
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Posted - 2013.05.31 13:02:00 -
[15] - Quote
Obodiah Garro wrote:POCOs in Dust... No sir just no. The OP puts forward some really good points but id rather CCP bring in some fresh ideas/mechanics rather than a reskin/rehash of some old models. They currently have this other game out that's doing really well that caters to all your needs currently.
LOL it will turn a few eye brows for sure ! |
Daedric Lothar
Onslaught Inc
RISE of LEGION
589
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Posted - 2013.05.31 13:20:00 -
[16] - Quote
Obodiah Garro wrote:POCOs in Dust... No sir just no. The OP puts forward some really good points but id rather CCP bring in some fresh ideas/mechanics rather than a reskin/rehash of some old models. They currently have this other game out that's doing really well that caters to all your needs currently.
Well, it would just be another specialized battle like PC. This game needs more combat which has at least some meaning to it. That is what the Dust/EVE thing was supposed to be about and why people are hyping it and sticking around even when the game is messed up.
My only concern was that EVE wouldn't care. But more links between them would be great. |
Karl Koekwaus
Tronhadar Free Guard
Minmatar Republic
81
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Posted - 2013.05.31 14:57:00 -
[17] - Quote
Daedric Lothar wrote: I weighed the option and found Carrier belt ratting to be much more profitable.
must be trolling
on to the main point:
I like the idea, seeing how many corps hold low sec POCOs will make the interactions quite interesting.
Also, one has to keep in mind, Temperate planets are crap for most PI extraction purposes. The one big nice thing they have is that temperate planets are often used as Factory planets, importing and exporting higher tier PI materials, which have higher taxes associated with them. As temperate planets are one of the few (the other one being barren planets) able to produce the top tier PI materials using advanced Industrial facilities.
The bad thing however is that most people will use a high sec temperate planet for factory purposes, since hauling loads of PI is not as fun as it seems at first and having a market hub close by is always handy. |
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CCP FoxFour
C C P
C C P Alliance
18873
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Posted - 2013.05.31 17:27:00 -
[18] - Quote
Standby, post incoming. This is taking some time to write. Looking numbers up in DB even. O_O
Hope you are happy. |
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Arkena Wyrnspire
Turalyon Plus
574
|
Posted - 2013.05.31 17:30:00 -
[19] - Quote
CCP FoxFour wrote:Standby, post incoming. This is taking some time to write. Looking numbers up in DB even. O_O
Hope you are happy.
This could be interesting. |
Kain Spero
Imperfects
Negative-Feedback
1506
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Posted - 2013.05.31 17:31:00 -
[20] - Quote
+1 to this stuff. Had a great conversation with some Eve guys at Fanfest regarding something like this. |
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KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf
Seraphim Initiative.
CRONOS.
4158
|
Posted - 2013.05.31 17:38:00 -
[21] - Quote
+1
I love this idea for the new environments it will bring, and the expansion of the EVE-Dust link. Brilliant. |
PonyClause Rex
TRAMADOL KNIGHTS
33
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Posted - 2013.05.31 17:57:00 -
[22] - Quote
At least there will be no vehicles to run me over in the POCO or a single tank to stomp everyone, so signed |
Daedric Lothar
Onslaught Inc
RISE of LEGION
602
|
Posted - 2013.05.31 18:33:00 -
[23] - Quote
PonyClause Rex wrote:At least there will be no vehicles to run me over in the POCO or a single tank to stomp everyone, so signed
RDV Request Accepted. |
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CCP FoxFour
C C P
C C P Alliance
18882
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Posted - 2013.05.31 18:53:00 -
[24] - Quote
Got a bit distracted with work related stuff so this took longer than expected and was way more rushed than i wanted. Sorry.
Hey! Thank you very much for not just posting this but posting it well. It has some thought put into it, is short, and tries to make good arguments.
I am going to start with responding directly to each point, so this may come off a bit harsh, but I am just an idiot and don't know how to be nice. >.<
Captain Africa Clone1 wrote:
Player Owned Customs Office (POCO) is the answer to many current challenges in Dust .
Sweet!
Captain Africa Clone1 wrote:
To Dusties unfamiliar to what a POCO is , it is a space station above a planet , Eve players use this space station as a link to move resources (PI) from the planet into space and then to respective markets . Every planet can have one POCO anchored to it .The owner of this POCO sets a tax rate so everything you move through this space station from the planet you have to pay x amount of tax on the total value of shipment.
Ownership of this little feature can make or break the viability for everyone farming on the planet and is well worth fighting for. In high sec Concord own these stations so its a no go zone but as far as low GÇô sec , nul GÇô sec and wormholes go ..... its player owned.
Even explaining things that others may not understand, love it.
Firstly, when you start with saying that his will answer many of the current challenges in DUST, it is helpful to list what you think those are. Not everyone may agree but more importantly it helps get an idea of the goals of this feature.
Captain Africa Clone1 wrote:
If Eve players had to start putting contracts out for defending or attacking these POKOS , suddenly there will be a HUGE platform for additional interaction namely:
Can't really argue with that.
Captain Africa Clone1 wrote:
This will give the opportunity for the big block Dust alliances to have additional stream of revenue and action.
OK, but big block DUST alliances already kind of have planetary conquest.
Captain Africa Clone1 wrote:
It will allow the medium and small Dust Corps to also get involved and make extra ISK.
This is kind of completley counter to your first point isn't it? When the large groups can participate what is to stop them from just rolling the rest?
Captain Africa Clone1 wrote:
Due to the fact that there are so many planets being used for PI there will be more than enough action for everyone.
Will this actually lead to fights though?
Keep in mind I am no DB guy, but with a quick look I found the following:
50,968 planets in null security/WH space (couldn't find a quick and dirty way to filter out WH space)
5,612 planets in low secutiy space
10,392 planets in high security space
That is a LOT of planets and each one can have a POCO. Well, minus high sec, but I wouldn't really rule that out from ever happening.
Captain Africa Clone1 wrote:
I really like the fact that you as an Eve player can have a whole Dust corp on your pay role ...and donGÇÖt have to be a super power to make use of the Dust Corporations.
Yes, this is awesome.
Captain Africa Clone1 wrote:
Its not complicated, the Dust corp attacking the POCO and winning the match takes over the station and hand ownership over to new owner for a fee.
... I have to stop you here... OK maybe not stop you, since you already posted everything and I can't really stop you, but this is... well yea wrong.
So I am assuming we are just talking game mechanics here, not implementation challenges. So lets just talk about that for a few minutes. What happens when the POCO is reinforced? Why would EVE players even care if a DUST corp takes it when all they have to do is take it back and the DUST corp can't do anything? HOW does a EVE corp contract DUST players to fight? Especially when we don't have ISK transfer in yet. How do reinforcement timers work? What happens if it is attacked during the battle? Or the EVE corps trade it while the attack is underway? How do existing mechanics like vehicle drops, warbarge strikes, and the like all work? This is just what I thought of in a few minutes, I am sure there are more.
All solvable things sure, but all things that need to be thought of.
Captain Africa Clone1 wrote:
A nice change if we could have a map/structure resembling a space station and fighting in it.
Have you played a match of DUST and gotten both teams all around one objective or another close space? Open maps are kind of done for more than big pretty spaces.
Captain Africa Clone1 wrote:
Add additional game play where an Eve pilot have to collect DUST players in a ship from the MCC and deliver them to the POCO ( Its not a long trip ). So there is a chance that the whole squad and Eve pilot can get blown up by other Eve pilots or the defender.
Feature creep! If we don't have this in for planetary conquest, or null sec stuff, chances are we are not going to get it in for POCO conquest.
Captain Africa Clone1 wrote:
Not that many extra features to be implemented except for an additional map to really make this a reality.
This is my biggest... well facepalm moment:
- Viewing where POCOs are
- Viewing a list of your owned POCO
- Changing POCO settings
- In EVE POCOS set TAX based on standings. DUST has no concept of standings.
- A way to view and accept contracts from EVE players. I suppose also a way to issue them.
- A way in EVE to issue contracts to defend/attack POCOS.
- New maps
- New game modes (no MCC inside a POCO)
- New art assets for said map
- Figuring out all the design issues sort of listed above.
- A way in EVE to see fights for POCOs going on
- Probably want some way EVE pla... |
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gbghg
L.O.T.I.S.
RISE of LEGION
1942
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Posted - 2013.05.31 19:03:00 -
[25] - Quote
So seeing as you have sunken this idea, any word on what true grit is working on now? Aside from the current monitoring of PC in molten Heath. |
Daedric Lothar
Onslaught Inc
RISE of LEGION
603
|
Posted - 2013.05.31 19:08:00 -
[26] - Quote
Good post Soxfour.
Maybe this can be on the agenda in 2015 or 2016 lol. |
Arkena Wyrnspire
Turalyon Plus
583
|
Posted - 2013.05.31 19:12:00 -
[27] - Quote
SoxFour's post is great.
It's depressing that we can't have much content for ages, though... |
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CCP FoxFour
C C P
C C P Alliance
18894
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Posted - 2013.05.31 19:24:00 -
[28] - Quote
gbghg wrote:So seeing as you have sunken this idea, any word on what true grit is working on now? Aside from the current monitoring of PC in molten Heath.
Iterating on FW, corporations, communication, and the such while we monitor planetary conquest and look at what we want to do there. |
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CCP FoxFour
C C P
C C P Alliance
18894
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Posted - 2013.05.31 19:26:00 -
[29] - Quote
Arkena Wyrnspire wrote:SoxFour's post is great.
It's depressing that we can't have much content for ages, though...
That's not really true, but at the same time not really what this team does. We take content that the other teams have made (maps, game modes, and such) and create the things like planetary conquest that let you access that content. So when reading things I say keep that in mind. The art and level design guys are always working on new content. :D |
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DigiOps
Kirkinen Risk Control
Caldari State
324
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Posted - 2013.05.31 19:36:00 -
[30] - Quote
CCP FoxFour wrote:Arkena Wyrnspire wrote:SoxFour's post is great.
It's depressing that we can't have much content for ages, though... That's not really true, but at the same time not really what this team does. We take content that the other teams have made (maps, game modes, and such) and create the things like planetary conquest that let you access that content. So when reading things I say keep that in mind. The art and level design guys are always working on new content. :D
The map design dev blog was pretty cool. Good read. With any luck, I'll be on to stuff like that after school's done. |
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