Get over it, MDs were easy mode and everyone that used one enough to get used to how to shot it knows it. Splash damage was way too big. If you don't like the splash of the base variant use the assault. Otherwise, once again, get over it.

Get over it, MDs were easy mode and everyone that used one enough to get used to how to shot it knows it. Splash damage was way too big. If you don't like the splash of the base variant use the assault. Otherwise, once again, get over it.

Get over it, MDs were easy mode and everyone that used one enough to get used to how to shot it knows it. Splash damage was way too big. If you don't like the splash of the base variant use the assault. Otherwise, once again, get over it.

The MD has never been easy mode. It is, in fact, one of the most difficult to use handheld weapons.

The only problem with the MD at the moment is that I can't support with it. I'm getting kills up to something like 14 a game and when I land a flux on a target they're almost guaranteed a death. Thing is, I don't want this. I want to support with the MD. Damage should be severely brought down in exchange for larger splash radius'. There should be weapons that are geared towards team support in this game. The change to MDs have turned them from that tool of support into a weapon that can be used by someone playing solo. This shouldn't be the case! MDs should rely on there being some HMGs or ARs to sweep up the chaos you create with your rounds.

I wouldn't so much say that it is one of the MOST difficult weapons to use, but it is by far the easiest. Using it last build, I could rarely put rounds on target Did I mention I was bad with it?

During Chromosome I played on a alt with 1.5 million SP that used a STD Assault MD and consistently tore people up. So please, dont go there with that "you obviously havent played with it" BS. It was super easy mode.




I could actually get behind this. If the splash goes up, the damage needs to go down.

Disagree Recon. As an exclusive MD user last build. The MD is designed to be a suppression weapon and that radius was needed. Now one can argue that the base plus the operation skill made it a bit too large no longer requiring even the simplest bit of aiming.

That said in CB the MD wasnt the offensive juggernaut that it is in pubs. I used a Freedom with prof 3 and 2dmg mods and it really couldnt get kills agaisnt protobears. But it was just right enough for suppression.

Its arch now being smaller makes it a more direct attack weapon in which it isnt all that effective.

It really needs its arch so it can server its real purpose in organized manners. A high perch mortar like suppression weapon which it did well but not exceedingly well in CB's.

Pub data is not a good measure of MD activity because most ppl ran adv or lower gear and mostly shield tanked so once shields were gone(or eaten up using stacked dmg mods) kills were very easy to come by.


THE final and most important point is that with FF in PC the large radius is as much a liability as it is an assest. Those who play the weapon sloppily will simply end up killing their own teammates.

Now i can agree with you that because of its splash levels people rarely used the assault or breach varaints. but in truth the assualt variant wasnt an issue of radius but a insignifcant level of dmg, it simply wasnt enough of a factor to force people to take cover. I havent looked at the uprising levels but if they followed a similar model where the radius was larger at the cost of splash dmg then it will still be worthless.

NO
The MD did less damage per second than the AR even if all the grenades were direct hits (I did the math). The mass driver also contained less damage per magazine, meaning you could kill less people than the AR before needing to reload. There is also the fact that its almost useless at longer ranges because of the grenade arc which makes aiming require more skill, and the slowly traveling rounds which makes predicting where your targets will be.
The only thing it had going for it was the splash damage and splash radius which made it very balanced; now splash radius sucks.

If anything is easy mode (not necessarily overpowered though) it is the AR.

You obviously don't really know what you're talking about, but I'm not surprised. Easy mode? AR. Proof? The vast number of people playing it. Please take note of this :

https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=75585&find=unread

Not sure when we got into a discussion of what's 'easy mode' and what isn't. Here I thought I was discussing reasons as to how the MD should be tweaked to be more effective in its supporting role.

The AR doesn't damage diversity. It has no true weakness, but that is its only strength. Find yourself facing a shotgun around the corner? Nothing you can do about it. HMG mowing you down 5 meters away? MD on the roof? Laser rifle or sniper on the hill at their optimal ranges? In another weapon's optimal situation the AR is out of its league.

The very diversity of the weapons defies comparison.

The MD, like almost every other weapon, has optimal conditions where it thrives. Height advantage, clustered enemies, enemies focused on something else.

This, unlike the AR, means you can't simply calculate effectiveness based on raw DPS.

Factor in disorientation caused by smoke. Factor in splash damage, the potential for a user to have flux grenades multiplied by the average accuracy of the flux grenade hits, factor in the inaccuracy of the AR user, etc. etc.

The MD is still powerful. My KD is steadily rising despite horrible games where it goes as low as 0.4 and I exclusively use the EXO-5, and I still manage to resupply and repair my teammates. No proficiency in MDs yet either.

You obviously don't really know what you're talking about, but I'm not surprised. Easy mode? AR. Proof? The vast number of people playing it. Please take note of this :

https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=75585&find=unread

I can't believe I'm saying this, but for once, I 100% agree with you. No trolling, you're absolutely correct.

Why should I care about a long rant of yours defining what OP is? And how does everyone using a weapon make it easy mode? Most people use AR because it is familiar to them. Easy mode was heating a Viziam and then passing it over someone for a split second and instamelting them. Easy mode was throwing MD rounds at their feet WHILE KNOCKING THEIR AIM OFF WITH THE ROUND (something you MD users like to not mention). Easy mode is Swarms that auto track their target. Easy mode is using Scouts maxed with speed mods because you know the games hit detection sucks. I could keep going, but Id rather not.

AR is actually less easy mode than most of these weapons. You have to stay on target for every single shot in order to get a kill. This is definitely not true for especially the MD. Oh, you aimed a little to the left too much? Oh well, splash damage! Get over yourselves, the MD is now a lot more balanced than it was in Chromosome. Stop freakin crying.

Why should I care about a long rant of yours defining what OP is? And how does everyone using a weapon make it easy mode? Most people use AR because it is familiar to them. Easy mode was heating a Viziam and then passing it over someone for a split second and instamelting them. Easy mode was throwing MD rounds at their feet WHILE KNOCKING THEIR AIM OFF WITH THE ROUND (something you MD users like to not mention). Easy mode is Swarms that auto track their target. Easy mode is using Scouts maxed with speed mods because you know the games hit detection sucks. I could keep going, but Id rather not.

AR is actually less easy mode than most of these weapons. You have to stay on target for every single shot in order to get a kill. This is definitely not true for especially the MD. Oh, you aimed a little to the left too much? Oh well, splash damage! Get over yourselves, the MD is now a lot more balanced than it was in Chromosome. Stop freakin crying.

Seriously the apocalypse is coming cause ppl have been agreeing with the most hated of IMPS this week. Someone actually agreed with Proto in another thread.

I think we have ventured into Bizzaro forums.

lol. You're the one crying about how hard the poor ittle AR users have it. Lol. Enough said.

lol. You're the one crying about how hard the poor ittle AR users have it. Lol. Enough said.

Easy mode was throwing MD rounds at their feet WHILE KNOCKING THEIR AIM OFF WITH THE ROUND (something you MD users like to not mention).

To be perfectly honest, I'm a little baffled at what's happened with the Mass Driver. The reason for the splash and blast range nerf was that in playtests we found the MD to be so effective that at one point almost half the people in the office were using it in battles. Clearly, that's not been the case with Uprising and after getting the engineers to go elbow deep into the code it appears there may be a few reasons beyond dry numbers that are contributing to the MDs underwhelming performance.

One, there appears to be a de-sync between client and server so that (more often than it should) the server and client think the projectile exploded in different places. They're not far off, but enough so that shots you *think* are spot on are off the mark enough to do only minor splash damage. And two, I'm told splash occlusion is getting blocked by a single player character more than it should, contributing to the "randomness" of the damage dealt and the sometimes smudgy feeling of the weapon.

I'm hesitant to rebalance the weapon until we get these issues looked at (which is happening right now).

Yeah I love watching the smoke tracer thing I fire hit someone square in the chest they take no damage and then a second later theres an explosion about 5 meters behind them. Although is it just me or is it odd that I can now take out a shield LAV with one flux and one MD round and armour ones with 1 flux and 2-3 rounds used to take allot more I think.

You're right, things are strange, I took out an unshielded tank with a full clip..thats not right.

Yes I have managed that feat as well just didn't want to rub the poor HAV drivers faces in it lol they have enough problems at the moment.

To be perfectly honest, I'm a little baffled at what's happened with the Mass Driver. The reason for the splash and blast range nerf was that in playtests we found the MD to be so effective that at one point almost half the people in the office were using it in battles. Clearly, that's not been the case with Uprising and after getting the engineers to go elbow deep into the code it appears there may be a few reasons beyond dry numbers that are contributing to the MDs underwhelming performance.

One, there appears to be a de-sync between client and server so that (more often than it should) the server and client think the projectile exploded in different places. They're not far off, but enough so that shots you *think* are spot on are off the mark enough to do only minor splash damage. And two, I'm told splash occlusion is getting blocked by a single player character more than it should, contributing to the "randomness" of the damage dealt and the sometimes smudgy feeling of the weapon.

I'm hesitant to rebalance the weapon until we get these issues looked at (which is happening right now).

Easy mode was throwing MD rounds at their feet WHILE KNOCKING THEIR AIM OFF WITH THE ROUND (something you MD users like to not mention).

You're right, things are strange, I took out an unshielded tank with a full clip..thats not right.

I tried to get a hot thread on MDs going but it fell on it's face. I only used MD's in chromosone. Now, you can still get kills with them if you are talented, but they are definitely frustrating. The damage does seem random, I've had players just jump harmlessly over my blast, and more often than not I just put a few rounds into their chest to take them down. Atleast direct hit detection works better now than it did in Chromosone. (Mainly using an EXO MD currently)

With the introduction to the Caldari Mega-Shield Tankers (Logi's in particular), MD's are a lot less effective against them. It's strange hearing the testimony of players about the MD's performance against vehicles. In chromosone, I didn't even bother shooting at vehicles with MDs, unless they had low HP to help finish them off. Personally I don't think the MD's role should be AV.

As it stands, SP sink-hole of waste in my opinion. Switching to another weapon, if anything, get some variety in my weapon selection lol.

I really miss my MD. I spent months learning to place rounds where ever I wanted them. It wasn't "Easy mode" like the AR was, but it was fun.

(With a scout and an AR, I would consistently get a higher KD/R than with my MD, so STFU people who call it a noob tube and have no idea)

I'm only kinda masochistic, not enough to subject myself to the MD any more. I'm having to relearn the game.

Lasers are lame, MD's suck.

Balance is a fine thing, a rare thing.

NO
The MD did less damage per second than the AR even if all the grenades were direct hits (I did the math). The mass driver also contained less damage per magazine, meaning you could kill less people than the AR before needing to reload. There is also the fact that its almost useless at longer ranges because of the grenade arc which makes aiming require more skill, and the slowly traveling rounds which makes predicting where your targets will be.
The only thing it had going for it was the splash damage and splash radius which made it very balanced; now splash radius sucks.

If anything is easy mode (not necessarily overpowered though) it is the AR.

... mass driver direct hit is a 1 shot k/o it most cases, especially armor.

that was removed over two months ago stop grasping for straws

Lol no, it wasn't. Maybe it was changed for Uprising, I haven't had the pleasure of facing something other than lolTacs enough to know yet.

I've been Cue-Synching within my corp lately and have wound up squaring off with fellow MD enthusiasts on multiple occasions. There's no camera shake or anything anymore since a few builds ago. Hell, the smoke doesn't even land where you round hit half the damn time now. On top of that, there were times our rounds have gone through each other. Not only was it nerfed, but it's bugged than it was before. CCP, please stop fixing stuff that wasn't broken in the first place.

There is a lot of stuff bugged right now though dude, the best thing we can do to help fix that is to make sure we submit bug reports for everything we find. I know I am guilty of not doing this enough.

Back to the MD, I don't remember having camera shake for a while, but I do remember it moving my reticle. Does it not do this anymore?

Been using it for two builds and been on the receiving end too. There's no camera shake whatsoever, just the pillar of smoke that obstructs the view for both the user and the person its being used on. If anything it forces you turn around by reflex because getting hit by stuff that explodes would scare the **** out of anyone. lol

I seem to remember the reticle movement mechanic fairly recently (before Uprising), but maybe it was reflexes; who knows. Im glad that mechanic is gone though. I feel flux/MD is already broken enough, having the explosion knock their aim off just makes it superdouche.

You are half right. Flux (and Locus) ARE broken. It isn't the MD that is cutting through your massive shields like butter.

You are half right. Flux (and Locus) ARE broken. It isn't the MD that is cutting through your massive shields like butter.

You want to see broken? Wait until you see everyone and their mother running around with Scrambler Rifles and Flaylock Pistols. That damn Flaylock does more damage on splash than the MD. Despite it having SMG range, people are going to flood the forums in droves QQing for a nerf whether it needs it or not. Calling it now.

I mean in the way that, especially during Chromosome with mostly shield tankers, you could simply throw a flux and if it hit you could one shot them with the MD (outside of heavies). There is no real equivalent of that for the armor side. You can throw a Locus and then try to pop the shield before it goes off, but Im sure we can all agree that would take a lot more skill than the flux/MD combo.

I am still getting killed alot with this gun when I see it "out", most often the freedom varrient. It most often is a OHK when it does get me it seems.

This thread needs constant bumping.

The only way CCP are gonna take a look at our MD issues is with 30 pages of hate like the HMG whine thread got.

Our MD user population is a lot smaller, and a lot less defined since the weapon can be used across all classes. But the vast majority of users commenting have all said the same thing:

THE MASS DRIVER NEEDS TO BE RESTORED TO ITS FORMER GLORY AS A SUPPORT AND SUPPRESSION TOOL WITH A TRUE AoE.

Whether you believe the problem is splash, trajectory, damage, or lack of ammo from Hives, THERE IS A PROBLEM.

Coming from a person who is still getting relative successful kills from the 'Boundless' MD, the weapon would still not be my first choice if I had my time again. The catering to actual issues of the weapon (what I believe to be splash, trajectory, and effective damage against shields) has made my games less enjoyable since I can no longer go out into open flat ground or fire at a lower hill from above (trajectory issue); I run out of ammo after facing 3 other enemies (shield damage issue, Hive issue); and I no longer can suppress crowds for my squad (splash issue).

CCP, please don't ignore. The weapon is not as effective as it should be.

MD users, please continue to support this or another thread on the subject. 4 pages down, 26 to go.

This, pretty much.
CCP may have apparently tested the MD internally and decided it needed a nerf, but given how effective their testing seems to have been, and as someone who has actually played properly with the mass driver, I have no faith in that assessment.

See? That's the part that I don't understand. If they're going to base their analysis from playing with the MD or any game mechanic in the office, why the hell are they letting us beta test? I like what remnant has done for the logis and respect him for what he's doing for the heavies, but the basis for changing the MD was unprofessional. Not to mention the changes weren't listed on the patch notes.

Truth of the matter is CCP will look into things when they feel things get hot. HMG thread of QQ got 30 pages long and lo and behold CCP is caving in with hot fixes. MD was not a 'win button weapon' so few ppl specialized in it, so now we dont have the numbers to be able to influence CCP. The way things are it's only OP weapons that will be looked into like tanks AR and HMG because they have a huge lobby that can influence CCP. This is ironic.

Irony is that you put down people who complained about the Damage and (extra) Range nerf on HMGs while being upset over the Mass Drivers Splash Damage and Blast Radius nerfs.

I agree Mass Drivers are not now and were not a "win button" in the last build either. Would love to hear from a Dev how it was decided to neuter them.

To be perfectly honest, I'm a little baffled at what's happened with the Mass Driver. The reason for the splash and blast range nerf was that in playtests we found the MD to be so effective that at one point almost half the people in the office were using it in battles. Clearly, that's not been the case with Uprising and after getting the engineers to go elbow deep into the code it appears there may be a few reasons beyond dry numbers that are contributing to the MDs underwhelming performance.

One, there appears to be a de-sync between client and server so that (more often than it should) the server and client think the projectile exploded in different places. They're not far off, but enough so that shots you *think* are spot on are off the mark enough to do only minor splash damage. And two, I'm told splash occlusion is getting blocked by a single player character more than it should, contributing to the "randomness" of the damage dealt and the sometimes smudgy feeling of the weapon.

I'm hesitant to rebalance the weapon until we get these issues looked at (which is happening right now).

2 years of beta testing and they change a niche yet effective gaming mechanic after an office LAN party. Un-****ing believable.

So you are saying that flux gernades are very effective when the metagame favors shields and since the metagame still favors shields they are still pretty effective (And locus are pretty sweet too if they have armor). It doesnt matter what gun you have if you hit someone with a flux or locus. They just lost the majority of their HP. Scrambler pistol probably wouldn't have trouble finishing them off.

Yeah, basically. However, Im also saying that it favors the MD more than any other weapon. Scrambler pistol wouldn't have trouble finishing them off, but it would likely take 2 or more shots if you don't get a headshot and you have to actually hit your target dead on for those shots to count. Whereas the MD is very forgivining, you just place a shot near them and its bonus damage to armor will typically one shot someone.

Another sort of related problem is you cannot even use armor tanking as a way to get around this. Being that the MD has a bonus to armor damage they will be able to flux your shields off, and then hit you for bonus. To make this problem exponentially worse, armor plates give the user a movement penalty. This makes it even easier for a MD user to track and hit their target. But to be clear, I feel this is a problem with the flux filling a role that will no longer be needed soon, and not a problem with the MD itself. The mechanic is simply very broken with the MD.

I've been following your posts, and I'm trying really hard to read them objectively and not write you off.

One of the major concerns over Flux is it's ability to strip 1200Hp of shielding away, from both vehicles and suits alike. I guess I have to admit that does seem a little OP. But I think that stems from a different problem, one not associated with the Flux, but from the ineffectiveness of armor tanking dropsuits. IMO, if CCP decides to make changes to this combo, it needs to be done gingerly, and as a temporary fix while they adjust the viability of armor tanking. I personally feel that the damage the Flux nades do should be percentage based in the blast radius. This rewards those with excellent throwing skills, and gives those with great battlefield awareness the chance to minimize damage.

But, this has little to do with the MD changes, and stealth nerfing based on your cubicle neighbor's ability to own your ass is not the way to balance a game.

I don't give a flying flux about no grenades, I'd like a functioning weapon.

A weapon that does damage when it hits a target
a weapon that does damage where the visual indicators would lead you to believe it does.
A weapon that damages 2 targets if they are both in the splash radius
A weapon that doesn't require a second weapon to be slightly effective

This recon fella doesn't believe anything about the MD needs to be effective, he doesn't even like the fact that we can use a crutch weapon to make the primary weapon slightly effective. It doesn't matter that a Dev thinks the MD is broken (for whatever reason it may be) Recon by Fire will still find some way to disagree with anything an MD player suggests.

Individually all of these issues are that we have posted about are survivable for the MD, Some of them are really minor but when you add all of these together the MD has lost its place as a viable support weapon. This is the issue.

This is what we need to focus on.

I don't think Flux should do damage at all. I believe it should be a disruptive grenade instead. Its an incredibly unbalanced weapon, you don't see Locus grenades being able to do their full damage throughout their splash blast radius or have a fuse as short as the flux. I believe the Flux was a necessary evil before CCP could put out other weapons that counter shields. Flux, in my opinion, should do things like turn off active modules (on tanks and when they come later on dropsuits), as well as do things like disrupt the minimap for X amount of time, etc. It should be a purely disruptive weapon, not an offensive one. But, like you said, this is a bit off topic from the MD.

Lets compare the exo-5 and the freedom splash damage. Direct impacts are great and all, but most effective against heavies... And do they even count at this point?
Exo-5
51 CPU
7 PG
3.1m radius
110.2 HP splash damage
6 round clip -- 1 shot a second
4 second reload.

Freedom
93 CPU
14 PG
3.3m radius
115.5 Splash damage
6 round clip 1-- 1 shot a second
4 second reload.

So for 42 CPU and 7 PG you get...
~6.5% accuracy bonus
~31.8 damage a clip
Over the 10 second Fire/reload cycle that equals about 3.1 DPS difference... for double PG and 42 CPU

Furthermore, if every shot is a direct impact, the damage per 10 second reload cycle only increases to about 60 a clip.

Compare this with the 90 damage a clip for Gek vs Duvall... And the higher time spent firing (Basic AR clips last about 5 seconds w/ a 3 second reload. 4.8/7.8 VS. MD's 6/10)... Did I mention that the accuracy bonus between those two is also about 10% as well? For 1 more CPU and the same amount of PG....

Oh and ARs have another 3X multiplier skill that makes their shots more accurate as well...
Scale better much?

Just using an AR as an example... Not trying to say that the MD should do the same amount of damage as the AR, just saying that it doesn't scale well enough right now.

But if I WAS trying to make that arguement....

Duv DMG per clip (every shot hitting) 2040.
Freedom DMG per clip (Direct impacts every time!) 1452.

Ill leave it to the viewer to decide which of the two events are less likely... direct impacts every time -- or hitting with the AR.
Never mind the TAC duv...

I don't think you can have a complete discussion on the mass driver without talking about gernades too. Last patch it was viable to run gernades other than flux. Flux was the prefered choice for a MD user odviously, but AV was playable. This patch is different in that there is NO WAY I can play the gun without flux. Unless I want to go around last hitting people (which I have no problem with, but others might).

These things are my crutch. The same thing will happen with scrambler rifle and core locus and it will be even MORE effective. Break through half their shields + lob a few core locus. Flux themselves alone are a problem, but not THE problem. The problem is the blast radius on all of the anti personale gernades. It is more than twice the blast radius of the MD, with more than double the damage. Proto nanohives are still strong enough to support massive nade spam.

What I am saying is that the MD by itself could use a buff to levels slightly worse than chromosome. It is pretty much a crazy man shotgun at this point. It isn't strong in itself, but you destroy people with flux. It is effective against armor tanks, but a core locus will ONE SHOT them. Its hard to balance ANY gun without first balancing gernades. Mass driver users are just adapting... and spamming fluxes. Which turns out to be a better strategy than actually using their gun most of the time.

This is the worse of the two main MD threads that popped up. I've said in the other that a MD nerf was neccessary because of the removal of sharpshooter. And it was. The old freedom would eat the blobs up. My main issue with how they went about it is this:

1. The radius nerf was too extreme
2. The prototype weapons are too CPU/PG heavy for the marginal benefits they offer over the advanced varients.
I am going to copy paste my post from that thread to here.

I don't think you can have a complete discussion on the mass driver without talking about gernades too. Last patch it was viable to run gernades other than flux. Flux was the prefered choice for a MD user odviously, but AV was playable. This patch is different in that there is NO WAY I can play the gun without flux. Unless I want to go around last hitting people (which I have no problem with, but others might).

These things are my crutch. The same thing will happen with scrambler rifle and core locus and it will be even MORE effective. Break through half their shields + lob a few core locus. Flux themselves alone are a problem, but not THE problem. The problem is the blast radius on all of the anti personale gernades. It is more than twice the blast radius of the MD, with more than double the damage. Proto nanohives are still strong enough to support massive nade spam.

What I am saying is that the MD by itself could use a buff to levels slightly worse than chromosome. It is pretty much a crazy man shotgun at this point. It isn't strong in itself, but you destroy people with flux. It is effective against armor tanks, but a core locus will ONE SHOT them. Its hard to balance ANY gun without first balancing gernades. Mass driver users are just adapting... and spamming fluxes. Which turns out to be a better strategy than actually using their gun most of the time.

This is the worse of the two main MD threads that popped up. I've said in the other that a MD nerf was neccessary because of the removal of sharpshooter. And it was. The old freedom would eat the blobs up. My main issue with how they went about it is this:

1. The radius nerf was too extreme
2. The prototype weapons are too CPU/PG heavy for the marginal benefits they offer over the advanced varients.
I am going to copy paste my post from that thread to here.

[quote=Doc Audio]I thought the MD was rough when I first played uprising, but as I used it got better. Even better now that they added the 10% bonus Dmg back.

Im not the greatest player; honestly im slightly below average and I get plenty of kills with the MD. Ive had 2 matches that I had 21 plus kills with it which was unheard of for a Logi MD user in chromosome.

You just have to set up different suits and run the suit you need depending on the situation.

You get all the blast with teeth that you need with the Assault version, I run this when Im in a good squad and I am concentrating on being a Logi. It works well enough in most cases. After 1 or 2 shots plus a flux, peeps back off enough for you to revive and rep a bit. It wont get you a lot of kills but its not meant to...never has been.

I have another suit set up with the regular MD and it does what its supposed to, I get plenty of kills with it. Flux then MD and usually its lights out.

Dont get in to fights with the MD that you cant win. The blast physics still put u at a disadvantage when your opponent is on uneven ground and/or higher ground.

Just as the environment works against you. It also works for you. Look for opportunities to use it to your advantage.

Also check your system settings and make sure that your auto-aim is off. You cant hit anything with the MD when its turned on. Actually I think all weapons have this issue?

Im not against another MD boost but I dont believe its necessary.
From a logi point of view they need to fix my injector first....we can worry about the MD down the road somewhere.


21 kills was unheard of in chromo? Lol? My best on line harvest was 43 and i was able to top 30 consistantly on any map besides the 3 pointer. The MD is the only weapon ive ever used.. I was smart enough to check item stats before speccing so i did not. respecc into after the patch... That being said.. I have used it on an alt in uprising and honestly.. Stop crying. The weapon is fine and in the hands of anyone who actually knows how to use it its ******* deadly. Still. The damage patch uas brought it within 3 points of its former glory. The radius nerf is a joke to anyone who really understands the MD. Im not denying its taken a nerf.. But it is not THAT bad that it is unusable. Veteran MD users.. The good ones anyway, will still dominate.

Irony is that you put down people who complained about the Damage and (extra) Range nerf on HMGs while being upset over the Mass Drivers Splash Damage and Blast Radius nerfs.

I agree Mass Drivers are not now and were not a "win button" in the last build either. Would love to hear from a Dev how it was decided to neuter them.

Sorry if this request comes across lazy, but I'm on my iPhone reading this thread.

Is there a link or another thread that has confirmed the 10% damage boost to the MD?

2 years of beta testing and they change a niche yet effective gaming mechanic after an office LAN party. Un-****ing believable.

yeah I agree this is lame. My hope though is that after they fix the code the network game with MD will match their experience with LAN and hopefully MD will do what we all expect it to do.

Thanks Cosgar, appreciate it. Too hard to navigate these forums on a 3G device.

Yet another issue to think about....at long range, when you have to shoo above them and train the leaf sight a full body's worth above your sight does not reveal their HP marker anymore. You now are unaware of the affect of your weapon.

But that's the problem. It wasn't broken to begin with. After the necessary buff it got in chrome, and if they gave it the sight it has in uprising, it would have been absolutely perfect. Not too many people used it, those who did understood that intricacy and finesse need to operate it. In fact it was balanced to the point that people would QQ for a nerf once in a blue moon, but would get eaten up by MD users and people who don't use it, but enjoyed what it brought to the field. All that was stripped away because someone in a cubicle got butthurt.

Why even have beta testers if this is what happens? Stuff like this makes me want to stop posting feedback because I begin to wonder how many times I've gone ignored or anyone who had ever articulated a valid well thought out point about a game mechanic because someone found nerf posts from a QQing CoD casual or a LAN party much more compelling than 2 ****ing years of beta testing? At this point, I don't even care anymore. They should just shut the ****ing servers down and make the goddamned game the way they want to and if we have an issue with a game mechanic that's not game breakingly broken they can say what they say to EVE players: HTFU

Yeah, I've been noticing that. Don't quote me on this but I think that could be attributed to the scanning and scanning precision nerf.
Also, has anyone noticed that your rounds will occasionally not deplete your clip? I was doing some target practice today and started to realize that every once in a while there will be a "phantom round" that doesn't get counted. It still travels and detonates, but it doesn't count towards my ammunition. Pay more attention to how many shots you fire so I know I'm not crazy.

Get over it, MDs were easy mode and everyone that used one enough to get used to how to shot it knows it. Splash damage was way too big. If you don't like the splash of the base variant use the assault. Otherwise, once again, get over it.

I love how every ****** who bitches about the MD calls it easy mode and yet they don't use it, and I simply don't die to MD. Why? because I actually played with them, I got really good with them too and you know what Ive met exactly one MD user who could kill me with out stealing some one else kill to get the one hit. oh and can you guess what weapon I use most?? the ******* AR because nothing else gives me that much power and that much flexibility, same with every other pro play on the field. The only people who use anything else consistently are the die hards who love those things or retards thinking they are op(that doesn't last long, yet they always seem to continue bitching about them anyways). I can only imagine how broke **** they are now. To OP good post and my condolences hope the bring it back to where it was.

I agree with all changes made to the mass driver this build.

And the mass driver was and still is my primary weapon.

1. The mass driver blast radius was far too large last build, I could drop 3+ dudes in 2-3 well placed Freedom rounds.

2. Damage, see above.

3. Nanohives shouldn't of been that good at a standard level. Get advanced, If you're a logibro then you should already have them. (The difference between adv nanos and standard was far too small last build, especially with the gauged variant)


The damage application of the mass driver round is something that does need looked at though. As the target can jump and avoid all damage, be on an incline and avoid all damage. Which is pretty ridiculous. At least they fixed for the most part the direct hits actually hitting.

It's a weapon that you can get massive kills when you're good with it, but when someone who thinks it's an "I win button" tries to get the same results, they can't because they need to train with it. This is a sign of a balanced weapon.

Yeah, I've been noticing that. Don't quote me on this but I think that could be attributed to the scanning and scanning precision nerf.
Also, has anyone noticed that your rounds will occasionally not deplete your clip? I was doing some target practice today and started to realize that every once in a while there will be a "phantom round" that doesn't get counted. It still travels and detonates, but it doesn't count towards my ammunition. Pay more attention to how many shots you fire so I know I'm not crazy.

I agree with all changes made to the mass driver this build.

And the mass driver was and still is my primary weapon.

1. The mass driver blast radius was far too large last build, I could drop 3+ dudes in 2-3 well placed Freedom rounds.

2. Damage, see above.

The damage application of the mass driver round is something that does need looked at though. As the target can jump and avoid all damage, be on an incline and avoid all damage. Which is pretty ridiculous. At least they fixed for the most part the direct hits actually hitting.

Also the Mass Driver was NEVER supposed to be a CQC weapon thats why its a support, for supporting team mates who are the damage dealers and if you're a logibro using it then switch to a repair tool as in PC friendly fire will be turned on, so more than likely a mass driver user needs to stop firing after the enemy gets so close which was the probable reasoning behind the blast radius. (old blast radius would of killed most of my team mates)

Truth of the matter is CCP will look into things when they feel things get hot. HMG thread of QQ got 30 pages long and lo and behold CCP is caving in with hot fixes. MD was not a 'win button weapon' so few ppl specialized in it, so now we dont have the numbers to be able to influence CCP. The way things are it's only OP weapons that will be looked into like tanks AR and HMG because they have a huge lobby that can influence CCP. This is ironic.

nor is the HMG a win button, the only time you could of made that argument was the pre E3 build and even then only if you weren't aware of your surroundings.

ttt for the MD

It used to be a great weapon. Now it's a joke.

I check here every day, If they comment I'll be cooled out, If not there is tomorrow. I wonder why we got embargoed?

This is why I quit being as vocal and helpful as I once was. CCP is giving off the impression they're more concerned with how a female scout's gams look under dynamic lighting than fixing core gameplay issues or would rather base a game mechanic's balance off an office LAN party over 8 months of beta testing and feedback. This is why I'm going to get a respec and spec back into the AR again. No use in bringing logic into an argument when the squeaky wheel always gets the grease.

Hi guys,

We have been looking in to the Mass Driver and we have identified two technical issues that are causing problems for it. Firstly we found that the way we check for splash damage is prone to GÇ£missingGÇ¥ partially occluded targets. We have now improved the system to solve this problem (literally yesterday). We will be testing it internally to make sure it causes no new issues and to see if it requires any rebalance on the weapon.

We have also found issues with the Mass Driver projectile and client/server de-sync. In poor network conditions the projectile can GÇ£miss the markGÇ¥ making the weapon feel unreliable. We are looking in to this issue as well.

We are considering increasing the splash radius but we are hesitant to make significant changes to the weapons balance whilst we are still encountering technical issues with its performance. WeGÇÖll keep you informed on how the new splash fix works out.

Cheers

CCP Wolfman

I agree with all changes made to the mass driver this build.

And the mass driver was and still is my primary weapon.

1. The mass driver blast radius was far too large last build, I could drop 3+ dudes in 2-3 well placed Freedom rounds.

2. Damage, see above.

3. Nanohives shouldn't of been that good at a standard level. Get advanced, If you're a logibro then you should already have them. (The difference between adv nanos and standard was far too small last build, especially with the gauged variant)


The damage application of the mass driver round is something that does need looked at though. As the target can jump and avoid all damage, be on an incline and avoid all damage. Which is pretty ridiculous. At least they fixed for the most part the direct hits actually hitting.


Also the Mass Driver was NEVER supposed to be a CQC weapon thats why its a support, for supporting team mates who are the damage dealers and if you're a logibro using it then switch to a repair tool as in PC friendly fire will be turned on, so more than likely a mass driver user needs to stop firing after the enemy gets so close which was the probable reasoning behind the blast radius. (old blast radius would of killed most of my team mates)

The problem with you logic is that you are saying MD should be a support weapon for distance. But the father a target stands from MD the longer it takes for the shell to reach the rarget and in Dust shells fly too slow relative to infantry speed, so by the time the shell explodes the targe is no where near the blast radius (since the blast radius is so small now). So MD is mostly viable for CQC only now.

Anyone try the MD in 1.2 yet?

I've been trying to look around the forums to see if they got fixed yet. I used to LOVE the MD in Chromosome. Now I just want my baby back

The only problem with the MD at the moment is that I can't support with it. I'm getting kills up to something like 14 a game and when I land a flux on a target they're almost guaranteed a death. Thing is, I don't want this. I want to support with the MD. Damage should be severely brought down in exchange for larger splash radius'. There should be weapons that are geared towards team support in this game. The change to MDs have turned them from that tool of support into a weapon that can be used by someone playing solo. This shouldn't be the case! MDs should rely on there being some HMGs or ARs to sweep up the chaos you create with your rounds.