DUST Search - Extinction of the Heavy Inbound- May 6th

Mavado V Noriega wrote:

Exmaple Core wrote:

J-Lewis wrote:

Exmaple Core wrote:

I specifically asked if the suit was getting any modified slot count and Iron Wolf did not answer. That means the dev did not answer because he dident want to give bad news to the heavys. If they were making the suit better than the devs would have answered cuz that would make the players happy. He dident asnwer so its nothing positive

That's some really heavy duty tinfoil you're wearing. Shame it's all aluminium and not actual tin. What?

Call it what you like. There is ZERO hope for the heavy and ive laid the proof there for you. Argue about the facts, the "CCP rebalencing the heavy suit" but thats how their doing it^^^ you say im wearing foil. I say im being realistic

u havent laid proof till u actually play the new build and see for urself
we dont know all the skills that are there

AFAIK none increase range anymore so everygun has a set range so how is only the hmg suffering?
besides decreasing spread makes alot more sense than increasing range for HMG

the "OP" comments all came because of Sharpshooter making the shotgun and hmg hit alot further than they should.

PS: CCP can also easily change the optimal ranges for every weapon since they removing the range skill so most likely all guns will have a higher optimal range so again u dont really know or shown any proof

Pages: 1 2 [3] 4 5 6 :: one page

Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 0 post(s)
Jack McReady DUST University Ivy League 106	Posted - 2013.04.26 11:55:00 - [61] - Quote Exmaple Core wrote: tears overflow obligatory "adapt or die" and "can I have your stuff"
Higgs flagrantfool 3dge of D4rkness SoulWing Alliance 39	Posted - 2013.04.26 11:59:00 - [62] - Quote Exmaple Core wrote: Higgs flagrantfool wrote: Higgs flagrantfool wrote: Exmaple Core wrote: Yeah i count 2 naive points, 3 math points, 1 try hard point, 4 boo whoo scouts points, and no points for no fucks given on this heavy thread. redeemable for exciting cash and prizes! Take a deep breath. Stop your bottom lip and chin from trembling and answer my question: Ignoble Son wrote: What are you complaining about? I am honestly confused here. Are you under the impression that the HMG will some how have less max posible range than it does now (i.e. max sharpshooter skill as it stands now)? Are you inferring that the HMG will somehow have the range it does now with sharpshooter unskilled? I find This extremely difficult to believe. Upon what are you basing this assumption? This is not what I asked for. Present me with proof that the HMG will suffer from this ultra game braking nerf you are alluding to (something that I find it VERY difficult to believe will ever happen). Or STFU until uprising cometh. I did present PROOF but you dident understand it for some reason. reread the beggining posts were irion wolf quoted the devs for answers, my math throughout the thread, and my OP. I cannot quote all of them in one post Dude I have read all of the posts in this thread, and all I have seen so far is you call out doomsday visions that, apparently, you have glimsed from your crystal ball.
ShwerShwerShwer The Marching Mercs General Tso's Alliance 75	Posted - 2013.04.26 12:02:00 - [63] - Quote Higgs flagrantfool wrote: Dude I have read all of the posts in this thread, and all I have seen so far is you call out doomsday visions that, apparently, you have glimsed from your crystal ball. Agreed
Exmaple Core SyNergy Gaming EoN. 170	Posted - 2013.04.26 12:02:00 - [64] - Quote Mavado V Noriega wrote: Exmaple Core wrote: J-Lewis wrote: Exmaple Core wrote: I specifically asked if the suit was getting any modified slot count and Iron Wolf did not answer. That means the dev did not answer because he dident want to give bad news to the heavys. If they were making the suit better than the devs would have answered cuz that would make the players happy. He dident asnwer so its nothing positive That's some really heavy duty tinfoil you're wearing. Shame it's all aluminium and not actual tin. Call it what you like. There is ZERO hope for the heavy and ive laid the proof there for you. Argue about the facts, the "CCP rebalencing the heavy suit" but thats how their doing it^^^ you say im wearing foil. I say im being realistic u havent laid proof till u actually play the new build and see for urself we dont know all the skills that are there AFAIK none increase range anymore so everygun has a set range so how is only the hmg suffering? besides decreasing spread makes alot more sense than increasing range for HMG the "OP" comments all came because of Sharpshooter making the shotgun and hmg hit alot further than they should. PS: CCP can also easily change the optimal ranges for every weapon since they removing the range skill so most likely all guns will have a higher optimal range so again u dont really know or shown any proof I posted my quotes of devs saying the heavy will not get significantly modified, the math of the gun and suit sucking, have the concent of heavys and non heavys alike saying heavys are done for, and thrown in the results of what is KNOWN to be comming in plain text in the OP. What more can i write? All the proof that is able to be present is there and the quotes of the dev saying that heavys are boned is ligit! Take the proof from a dev and my math + common sence and consider the points ive made that weve all seenin games time and time again. It comes out to the OP. Man convincing ppl this is gona suck is hard. It seems most of the non heavys are jus brushing it off. "i wont allow the math, quotes or your experience to prove that your anywere near right." but whatevs. The heavys and all those who recognize patterns agree with me. I see why Mr. Ztro trolls so often
Talruum Tezztarozza Seituoda Taskforce Command Caldari State 81	Posted - 2013.04.26 12:06:00 - [65] - Quote Himiko Kuronaga wrote: I'm waiting for actual patch notes, Maple. I'm not saying you're necessarily wrong, but It's not going to benefit me to get this worked up when we're looking at less than 1/4th of the total painted picture. There could be any number of unlisted changes that completely change our viability against the other suits. If heavies ARE actually boned, well, we have a respec on the way. I've played Eve for years and I've gotten pretty good at adapting to sudden extreme changes. I'm with this one. While this info may be true, it is far for a "solid proof" much less a "fact". More importantly, This list is most likely incomplete. While sharpshooter skill may no longer give maximum range bonus, but until we know what other benefit it give instead or whether HMG have its native range buff or not. We can't really say if a heavy is nerfed or buffed. If heavies ARE actually boned, well, we have been through this many time and we still prevail. I'm sure we can tough this one out as well :p Glory to all Heavies
Himiko Kuronaga SyNergy Gaming EoN. 186	Posted - 2013.04.26 12:08:00 - [66] - Quote You have no proof Maple. Just some speculation based on a few known facts that you are choosing to buy into and get worked up over. Set it down for now. If, after the 6th, everything really IS doom and gloom.... well, go nuts. I'll be right there with you. But this isn't serving you right now.
Higgs flagrantfool 3dge of D4rkness SoulWing Alliance 39	Posted - 2013.04.26 12:11:00 - [67] - Quote Himiko Kuronaga wrote: You have no proof Maple. Just some speculation based on a few known facts that you are choosing to buy into and get worked up over. Set it down for now. If, after the 6th, everything really IS doom and gloom.... well, go nuts. I'll be right there with you. But this isn't serving you right now. This^^^
Exmaple Core SyNergy Gaming EoN. 170	Posted - 2013.04.26 12:12:00 - [68] - Quote Himiko Kuronaga wrote: You have no proof Maple. Just some speculation based on a few known facts that you are choosing to buy into and get worked up over. Set it down for now. If, after the 6th, everything really IS doom and gloom.... well, go nuts. I'll be right there with you. But this isn't serving you right now. Your completely right. It is speculation with alot of backing, some that is actually hard evidence. But it is speculation and untill the new build hits theirs no for sure way of knowing and this thread is turning into a big circal. So im dropen it and gonna pay close attention to the new skills when they come to the reallocation
semperfi1999 Internal Error. Negative-Feedback 414	Posted - 2013.04.26 12:19:00 - [69] - Quote Well TBH I do agree that heavies suits are too expensive. Scout/Assault/Logi suits are all roughly the same price at proto lvl even though they have HP differences and I would not mind the heavy suit to be in that same price range because it would only make sense. Now that being said the removal of sharpshooter increasing range for any weapons (especially the shotgun and HMG) is a good thing. Right now HMGs have a ret@rded range once you spec into sharpshooter. Heck Its pretty common for me shooting a heavy at 30% efficiency on my rifle and they are just destroying my HP in that range. Sorry HMGs were meant to be CQC to mid range. Mid range gun fights end at about 35-40 meters. After that its long range gun fights.....the HMG currently is effective out to what.... 50ish meters without any skills?? I think it will be good when no weapon gets a range increase because its the range increase that was helping to break the balance of the weapon in the game.....Or have you not be OHK by a shotgun at 30meters?
Exmaple Core SyNergy Gaming EoN. 170	Posted - 2013.04.26 12:28:00 - [70] - Quote i agree completly the change in the skill is healthy for the game. But heavy is not the game. The hmg is effective out to 40m ive tested it. i also havehmg proficentcy 5 and weaponry so that helps alot with its effective range. thats like running 2 complex damage mods and an enhanced. 3 damage slots that heavys dont have taken up by skills, but not any more. with no falloff/range bonuses from sharpshooter and having to rely on damage mods the heavy becomes easier to kill to do more damage. if you use both of your 2 damage mods on damage mods assults have more sheilds than you and half as much armor for 20% damage at 40m tops. not very attractive

Alldin Kan Imperfects Negative-Feedback 179	Posted - 2013.04.26 12:34:00 - [71] - Quote Aside from prices of suits: HMG is for close-mid range battles with high DPS and clip Shotgun is strictly for CQC with highest DPS MD has lower DPS for splash only but it's meant for crowd control AR is for mid-long range with decent DPS but can only handle 1-2 strong targets before reloading Consider specializing into AR next build even with the lack of equipment.
Exmaple Core SyNergy Gaming EoN. 170	Posted - 2013.04.26 12:37:00 - [72] - Quote Alldin Kan wrote: Aside from prices of suits: HMG is for close-mid range battles with high DPS and clip Shotgun is strictly for CQC with highest DPS MD has lower DPS for splash only but it's meant for crowd control AR is for mid-long range with decent DPS but can only handle 1-2 strong targets before reloading Consider specializing into AR next build even with the lack of equipment. Oh i have lol. been testing out new things MDs are fun. I see why you use them
HowDidThatTaste Imperfects Negative-Feedback 2387	Posted - 2013.04.26 13:03:00 - [73] - Quote Well I think it is to early to tell, what these changes actually mean for the heavy class, though I do feel the heavy class is getting another nerf thrown at it. I have an AR class alt to back up too if this happens. With that being said the heavy suit has hadnits fair share of nerfs/tweaks and it usually takes some time to adjust your play style too, but I imagine that it will still be a viable class. I'm more concered that they are flattening out the weapons skills for everyone. It should be very interesting. And if we truely do get boned again I'm sure enough of us will speak up on these forums.
Emi Love The Southern Legion RISE of LEGION 49	Posted - 2013.04.26 13:06:00 - [74] - Quote My love for heavy, I'm torn if they will be broken and I won't be able to compete in PC matches.. and I don't want to sink in just being another AR scrub, just to win..
KryptixX Imperfects Negative-Feedback 388	Posted - 2013.04.26 13:25:00 - [75] - Quote Exmaple Core wrote: The Negative Feed back alliance looks down at heavys because they suck. All heavys everywere agree that heavys suck. Ssrly. heavys now i dont think they suck. they sure will come the 6th And yet we have the best heavies in the game. P.S. I can't believe you put beers on that list lulz.
GeneralButtNaked ZionTCD 379	Posted - 2013.04.26 13:43:00 - [76] - Quote I don't know why the heavies are surprised by this. Dust is all about the AR, and making sure that the assault troops are the complete focus of the game. Thankfully I have an ALT that will have enough SP to be relevant in the assault class come May 6th, so that I can wait and see how the heavies actually work before I spec this character into them. No sense wasting SP on a dead class.
Spacetits CDXX Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 259	Posted - 2013.04.26 14:21:00 - [77] - Quote Exmaple is probably right here, most heavies can see the writing on the wall. We will see come the 6th if anything else compensates for the lack of Heavy Sharpshooter, but if nothing does and all weapons are restricted to their current base range, HMG will be terrible.
Lance 2ballzStrong SyNergy Gaming EoN. 1078	Posted - 2013.04.26 14:44:00 - [78] - Quote GeneralButtNaked wrote: I don't know why the heavies are surprised by this. Dust is all about the AR, and making sure that the assault troops are the complete focus of the game. Thankfully I have an ALT that will have enough SP to be relevant in the assault class come May 6th, so that I can wait and see how the heavies actually work before I spec this character into them. No sense wasting SP on a dead class. not too surprised. It's a matter of waiting and seeing at this point, but yeah, no sharpshooter for HMG, I'm hoping for a bullet spread reduction skill. If not... lol.
Garrett Blacknova Codex Troopers 2614	Posted - 2013.04.26 14:53:00 - [79] - Quote Exmaple Core wrote: To top it all off, much like the swarm launcher, the plasma cannon is going to be a light weapon for all classes to use and much like the forge gun, its going to be a hybrid weapon (effective against sheilds and armor) with dumbfire capabiltys. Unlike the forge gun it will be dirt cheap because it is NOT heavy exclusive gear and thus will be used in place of forge guns. Got a source to confirm any of this? Particularly the "Plasma isn't an energy-based weapon type in DUST" part, since that goes against logic, sanity and established lore for the weapon? Also, it looks - from the trailer footage we've seen - like it fires in an arcing trajectory, and it's confirmed to be an extremely short-range weapon. Forge Guns will almost certainly do more damage, and being an ACTUAL hybrid weapon, they'll get decetn results against armour the Plasma Cannon can barely scratch, and you can hit from a LOT further way than the Plasma Cannon when using your Forge Gun. Also, there have been several official sources that mentioned all suits are getting their prices rebalanced to be much more in line with one another, so that "overpriced" flag people are waving over their Heavy suits should also be disappearing with Uprising as well.
BattleCry1791 Pink Fluffy Bounty Hunterz Noir. Mercenary Group 144	Posted - 2013.04.26 15:03:00 - [80] - Quote Here's one thing I would like to throw out there Maple...the sharpshooter Nerf is for every weapon. So technically speaking, the exchanges won't be much different, it's just how close they will take place. We'll still get outranged by AR's, but they can't shoot any further than their base either. In fact, the Sharpshooter nerf will make ALL exchanges closer. And it may make the Tac rifle useful again. Also, we don't know if the overall Heavy optimal firing distance is going to be longer or shorter. And who knows, maybe this will force us Heavies to actually spend money on Assault HMGs for the more wide open maps, which no one really uses right now. No one likes change, and it seems like there is a lot coming so there's more to not like. I'm willing to see what they do and then figure it out from there. Hey, it can't be worse than playing call of duty.

mikegunnz Pink Fluffy Bounty Hunterz Noir. Mercenary Group 553	Posted - 2013.04.26 15:19:00 - [81] - Quote At first glance, it does seem like the Heavies are going to get the shaft. It's a shame there aren't racial variants for the Heavy class like there will be for Assault. I actually like your thinking Battle. Give each gun more of a purpose in specific roles. With the upcoming changes, why not keep the Assault HMG variant's dmg, but increase its range another 3-5m. Buff the "regular" std/adv/proto HMGs dmg back to older (higher) levels, and shorten the range by an additional 1-2m. Not a huge amount, just enough to really differentiate the variants. Make one a UBER-DEADLY CQC weapon, but hardly usable in further ranges, make the other a solid mid-to-mid/long range gun, but with less dmg so its CQC capabilities are diminished. Edit: I know that they SORT OF work this way now. My point is more so on accentuating their good/bad characteristics even more.
Keyser Soze VerbalKint IMPSwarm Negative-Feedback 119	Posted - 2013.04.26 15:38:00 - [82] - Quote The SP investment to get into heavies may not be there post uprising. Remember with the elimination of 2ndary and 3* prerequistie skills getting into heavy class should cost less effective SP. Next the Officer HMG with DMG mod stacks is ungodly beastly. And with highend SS skills it can do enough damage at ranges that it becomes utterly devastating at suppression. It has next to no recoild and it increases in accuracy because of crouching. Lets not forget head glitching and the complete lack of respect for physical objects in its path as bullets continue to hit despite it going thorugh the ground, boxes, the lower half of a window frame etc. The suit has always been the source of the problem with proto suits being completely disproportionate. That is likely to change and the overall cost for running heavy will diminish. That said anyone who thinks the defensive powers of a well placed heavy in tight spaces isnt an assest for competitive play is outta their head.The heavy is a specialty class and roleplayer. Much like logis. Of course the assaults kick ass in pubs much of the game is designed around them because the game is played more in an aggressive and offensive manner. In CB's and organized battles we see defense as the primary key to winning matches and with the CQC nature of much of the maps 1-2 good heavies can destroy groups. Point is heavies are a specialty class and play a certain role. That role isnt fully realized in most of the gamemodes. But anyone who thinks they will have no place in the competitive battlefields is just fooling themselves. The HMG should never have had the kind of range it can pull off at max SS skills it's utterly mind boggling that it does. The suit does need a buff and looks to be getting one by way of cost decrease.
Mr Zitro Imperfects Negative-Feedback 480	Posted - 2013.04.26 15:41:00 - [83] - Quote All I read was tears. They are putting heavies more into a defensive role, like it always should of been IMO. You lose to ARs at CQC-mid range, well tha I'm officially a better heavy than you. I use a typeII heavy and can win 90% of my 1v1s at mid-close range. So all your "experience" is useless without sharpshooter? That's like all my experience is useless without the TAC AR, oh wait my tank and laser, heavy, and normal assault skills say otherwise Maple stop crying and eat some waffles
Fargen Icehole SyNergy Gaming EoN. 85	Posted - 2013.04.26 15:46:00 - [84] - Quote Wish we were getting racial variants... but I'll wait and see what the type1/Aseries/vk0 suits are like with the supposed armor buff. I don't mind losing SS skills, as long as the cost of the Heavy suits and HMG come down a bit.
Cat Merc BetaMax. CRONOS. 632	Posted - 2013.04.26 15:59:00 - [85] - Quote A. All weapons are rebalanced, what you're basing your claims upon aren't true. B. An HMG isn't supposed to be effective above close-medium range. Its a ******* spray gun, dafuq do you want. In conclusion, wait for May 6th and stop whining.
SoTa PoP Internal Error. Negative-Feedback 2035	Posted - 2013.04.26 16:17:00 - [86] - Quote Crystal Ball defense, huh? While it is true we're not even really sure how much of the content has been spilled for us to theorycraft with - the thing we know for a fact is that passive skills have kept heavies competitive in non-restricted corp matches much more so then it effects other classes. Threads like these showing major concern over it - seem neccesary to me. How can we not complain that everything we understand about our class is being turned on it's head with SP skill change and no details about our suit and weapons base stat changes to reflect the SP changes? CCP has a track record of ignoring our plight that could take them a VERY short time to fix. How long has heavy proto been broken? How long have heavies had to switch out of there fat suit because they wanted to keep up with there friends and not camp an objective that may never be attacked "But Heavies should be defensive!" What happened to options and sandbox? I thought I could make my own perfect soldier - guess I was wrong and CCP has my role set out for me.
Mr Zitro Imperfects Negative-Feedback 480	Posted - 2013.04.26 16:28:00 - [87] - Quote SoTa PoP wrote: Crystal Ball defense, huh? While it is true we're not even really sure how much of the content has been spilled for us to theorycraft with - the thing we know for a fact is that passive skills have kept heavies competitive in non-restricted corp matches much more so then it effects other classes. Threads like these showing major concern over it - seem neccesary to me. How can we not complain that everything we understand about our class is being turned on it's head with SP skill change and no details about our suit and weapons base stat changes to reflect the SP changes? CCP has a track record of ignoring our plight that could take them a VERY short time to fix. How long has heavy proto been broken? How long have heavies had to switch out of there fat suit because they wanted to keep up with there friends and not camp an objective that may never be attacked "But Heavies should be defensive!" What happened to options and sandbox? I thought I could make my own perfect soldier - guess I was wrong and CCP has my role set out for me. They ignore half the game, don't feel special. They keep turning every class up on its head because they don't know what they want to do with the game. That is what happens when someone makes a FPS and has no experience with it. As for keeping up with your friends with movement, do you really expect the fat kid to keep up with the fit kids?
Mark0h SVER True Blood Unclaimed. 2	Posted - 2013.04.26 16:29:00 - [88] - Quote I like turtles On a serious note, TLDR, Heavies becoming useless? **, just when I was using them to get my KDR up. Are we forgetting that they plan on making the 3 other variants? I am more concerned about how they are going to balance out the 4 types of heavies rather then what heavies are going to be like on may 6th. Peoples play styles are going to change regardless, and we shouldn't get to set on the way we play now. To many new variables. We can speculate, but do you really know what its like to play against the new weapons? The new squads of race specific badasses? I think we should tone it down before we get to riled up. I mean come on! Minmatar heavy, Gallente heavy, Caldari Heavy?!?! We don't even know ** about what its going to be when there are more then one hulking clone shell to choose from.
Lance 2ballzStrong SyNergy Gaming EoN. 1078	Posted - 2013.04.26 16:30:00 - [89] - Quote Cat Merc wrote: A. All weapons are rebalanced, what you're basing your claims upon aren't true. B. An HMG isn't supposed to be effective above close-medium range. Its a ******* spray gun, dafuq do you want. In conclusion, wait for May 6th and stop whining. Close yes, medium, no. If there's no sharpshooter, and the range of the HMG is where it starts at with no SS. There would be no heavies then. We're only resigned to camping an objective? lol...no WP, no ISK. A heavy's only job is to kill, and with no kills to be had unless camping, they will disappear. Spray and pray? I hope you use the heavy class and use that "tactic" against a good heavy, and see where that gets you. Good heavies have good aim. My point in all this, is if there's no sharpshooter, there has to be a skill to reduce bullet spread. Even though the HMG has a higher DPS than most weapons, guess what, IT MISSES ALLOT OF HITS DUE TO BULLET SPREAD. People that actually use the class will know this. They will also know that without SS, there is no medium range. I said I'll wait till May 6th to see what they have to offer, till then I only speculate. My speculation leads me to believe that heavies will get so little kills, they would drop the class, and convert to the only class that matters in this game, the Assault class. I'm hoping CCP gives the HMG a good enough range.
Zhar Ptitsaa The Red Guards EoN. 51	Posted - 2013.04.26 16:30:00 - [90] - Quote Has anyone even complained about the HMG?



Pages: 1 2 [3] 4 5 6 :: one page
First page \| Previous page \| Next page \| Last page