Pages: [1] 2 3 4 5 6 :: one page |
|
Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 0 post(s) |
Exmaple Core
SyNergy Gaming EoN.
164
|
Posted - 2013.04.26 09:40:00 -
[1] - Quote
Sota Pop and i were discussing the changes to the skills next build and looked down at it for our belovid heavy class. We found sharpshooter no longer giving ranged bonuses cripples the HMG into a bigger SMG for short ranged engagements only. The HMG did benefit very well from the range bonus with how bullet falloff works (bullet damage over distance). Also, there will be no passive skills to increase weapon damage. The HMG is a spam cannon and relies on the buffs to make each shot hit hard, wich it wont anymore. So in conclusion, the HMG double wont do damage or even reach at distance, and wont chew through suits nearly as well. Between assult suit strafing and their 450+ most heavys are soloed by assult players at point blank. That is were a heavy is best and its happening now with the skills giving the HMG the bonuses it needs! Its still not working! Of course heavys generally get out gunned at mid to long range but that jus adds to the promblem. What is left for a heavy when these skills are taken away? Heavys will need B series or protosuits for pubs. The heavy will be 3 times as expensive to die 3 times quicker. If they moderate the prices on heavy gear wel be twice as expensive and still out DPS'ed, out ranged, out manuvered, and left to with only our butthurt because we have no more money to buy our gear nor SP sence heavy is THE most SP intensive class.
To top it all off, much like the swarm launcher, the plasma cannon is going to be a light weapon for all classes to use and much like the forge gun, its going to be a hybrid weapon (effective against sheilds and armor) with dumbfire capabiltys. Unlike the forge gun it will be dirt cheap because it is NOT heavy exclusive gear and thus will be used in place of forge guns. So the hmg sucks and heavys arnt needed for desinated AV any longer.
What im saying is, there is no reason to play heavy. Ifyou want lots of HP stack 4 complex sheild mods on an assult suit and skill up sheild controle to lv 5. over 500 sheilds, MORE than most heavys. Stack 2 or 3 complex armor extenders and you will have close or over 1100 effective HP and still be more mobile than a heavy. Your AR will outrange and out DPS them too. You also have equipment slots for 1/2 to 1/3 the price of the equvilant heavy suit. Also spent less SP on your superior class and fit. There is no reason for anyone to play heavy come uprising.
*There is no intensive to play heavy*
|
Freshticles
Internal Error. Negative-Feedback
53
|
Posted - 2013.04.26 09:47:00 -
[2] - Quote
I came to the same conclusion, however there might be some buffs so only May 6th will tell. |
lordeh42
The Red Guards EoN.
16
|
Posted - 2013.04.26 09:51:00 -
[3] - Quote
yep, totally agree
May 6th....... Heavy = Dodo Bird |
Exmaple Core
SyNergy Gaming EoN.
165
|
Posted - 2013.04.26 09:56:00 -
[4] - Quote
Freshticles wrote:I came to the same conclusion, however there might be some buffs so only May 6th will tell.
Iron Wolf Saber wrote:Exmaple Core wrote:Heavys everywere are dreading the new build, and durring the "Ask us anything!" event the devs said "watch at fanfest" or "were looking into it" and the classic, tottally ignored all other questions about the heavy suit. Riddle them this; will heavys have reduced upper tier prices on gear and/or have any stat/slots changes to the suit? Suit prices where normalized, suits of one tier cost about the same. Weaponry has been nerfed to 0%damage. All damage + skills except turrets and proficiency has been removed. Armor repair skill armor plate shield extenders and booster skills all increased module effectiveness and not fittings. Three fitting skills to max out at 15% + to CPU and pg. There are no buffs. Heres the proof, he says only turret and turret proficeiency are keeping the extra damage. Suit prices are "normalized" wich can mean there going to be priced "fairly" (wich will unfairly be twice the cost of anything else) or stay as normal thus far (wich is so far "normal" at 3 times the cost of other suits) and our weapons are hard to fit. proto hmgs and forge guns are over 120 CPU to fit. now skills are making mods harder to to fit, so were not using proto weapons any time soon. too hard and expensive to fit! |
Himiko Kuronaga
SyNergy Gaming EoN.
186
|
Posted - 2013.04.26 09:58:00 -
[5] - Quote
I'm holding out for more info.
I find it hard to believe they would remove the range bonuses completely.
Entirely possible its automatically applied without the need to train it. |
Iron Wolf Saber
BetaMax. CRONOS.
3695
|
Posted - 2013.04.26 10:00:00 -
[6] - Quote
Exmaple Core wrote:Freshticles wrote:I came to the same conclusion, however there might be some buffs so only May 6th will tell. Iron Wolf Saber wrote:Exmaple Core wrote:Heavys everywere are dreading the new build, and durring the "Ask us anything!" event the devs said "watch at fanfest" or "were looking into it" and the classic, tottally ignored all other questions about the heavy suit. Riddle them this; will heavys have reduced upper tier prices on gear and/or have any stat/slots changes to the suit? Suit prices where normalized, suits of one tier cost about the same. Weaponry has been nerfed to 0%damage. All damage + skills except turrets and proficiency has been removed. Armor repair skill armor plate shield extenders and booster skills all increased module effectiveness and not fittings. Three fitting skills to max out at 15% + to CPU and pg. There are no buffs. Heres the proof, he says only turret and turret proficeiency are keeping the extra damage. Suit prices are "normalized" wich can mean there going to be priced "fairly" (wich will unfairly be twice the cost of anything else) or stay as normal thus far (wich is so far "normal" at 3 times the cost of other suits) and our weapons are hard to fit. proto hmgs and forge guns are over 120 CPU to fit. now skills are making mods harder to to fit, so were not using proto weapons any time soon. too hard and expensive to fit!
The skills for fitting are separated by groups of modules. You can see these from sisi market. |
Exmaple Core
SyNergy Gaming EoN.
166
|
Posted - 2013.04.26 10:05:00 -
[7] - Quote
Iron Wolf Saber wrote:Exmaple Core wrote:Freshticles wrote:I came to the same conclusion, however there might be some buffs so only May 6th will tell. Iron Wolf Saber wrote:Exmaple Core wrote:Heavys everywere are dreading the new build, and durring the "Ask us anything!" event the devs said "watch at fanfest" or "were looking into it" and the classic, tottally ignored all other questions about the heavy suit. Riddle them this; will heavys have reduced upper tier prices on gear and/or have any stat/slots changes to the suit? Suit prices where normalized, suits of one tier cost about the same. Weaponry has been nerfed to 0%damage. All damage + skills except turrets and proficiency has been removed. Armor repair skill armor plate shield extenders and booster skills all increased module effectiveness and not fittings. Three fitting skills to max out at 15% + to CPU and pg. There are no buffs. Heres the proof, he says only turret and turret proficeiency are keeping the extra damage. Suit prices are "normalized" wich can mean there going to be priced "fairly" (wich will unfairly be twice the cost of anything else) or stay as normal thus far (wich is so far "normal" at 3 times the cost of other suits) and our weapons are hard to fit. proto hmgs and forge guns are over 120 CPU to fit. now skills are making mods harder to to fit, so were not using proto weapons any time soon. too hard and expensive to fit! The skills for fitting are separated by groups of modules. You can see these from sisi market.
sadly i dont have that ability. But its everything said up there^ dont need to check. Thank you for the answer as well, very kind :) |
Talruum Tezztarozza
Seituoda Taskforce Command Caldari State
81
|
Posted - 2013.04.26 10:07:00 -
[8] - Quote
And I'm about to come back to dust and my heavy as well D:
However, I would love for some actual information before I judge anything. I found it hard to believe that CCP will just remove all those +dmg +range skills, where is our character customization ?? |
Schalac 17
D3LTA FORC3 Orion Empire
22
|
Posted - 2013.04.26 10:12:00 -
[9] - Quote
The + damage and + range skills were some of the biggest contributors to the breaking of this game. I am glad that they are going away and I will still play my heavy on CQB maps. Now they need to start work on damage mod stacking penalties and hit detection. |
Exmaple Core
SyNergy Gaming EoN.
166
|
Posted - 2013.04.26 10:12:00 -
[10] - Quote
Talruum Tezztarozza wrote:And I'm about to come back to dust and my heavy as well D:
However, I would love for some actual information before I judge anything. I found it hard to believe that CCP will just remove all those +dmg +range skills, where is our character customization ??
Himiko Kuronaga wrote:I'm holding out for more info.
I find it hard to believe they would remove the range bonuses completely.
Entirely possible its automatically applied without the need to train it.
Besides, a reduction to dispersion/kick wouldn't make much sense in the case of the HMG. It already works differently in terms of accuracy than something like the AR, as it becomes more accurate over time rather than less. Proficiency could very well be giving a different kind of bonus altogether. How much more information do you guys need? the raw proof is posted up there^ and the weather Heavy says its gona rain on the 6th for any slowpokes caught in the rain/too poor to buy an exclusive cardbox box. Check SISI like saber said. See the bad news for yourselfs |
|
Lance 2ballzStrong
SyNergy Gaming EoN.
1078
|
Posted - 2013.04.26 10:14:00 -
[11] - Quote
I've been saying this for a while on the forums. Heavies are slowly getting more and more useless and other classes get stronger cuz their proto suits are actually good. How can heavies be competitive when their proto suits = a Heavy B series basically but cost 250k isk a pop. Does not make sense.
Not to mention the HMG. People cry soooo much about it, but in a competitive environment you see how weak it is. What makes it weak is the bullet dispersion, or bullet spread. Yeah the stats says it does "x" amount of dps, but in reality ALLOT of bullets miss the target. Not saying it needs a dmg buff, but the bullet spread is ridic. So while you're shooting a guy, bullets are missing even though your aim is fixed on him, you're missing, and in a competitive situation, missing = death... while the AR is NOT missing.
I know CCP said they were going to re-balance the class. So I'm hoping they balance it where Heavy Proto suit is actually useful or for the very least AFFORDABLE.
I share Maple's frustration, and so do the majority of heavies that know what might come down. If the class is nerfed further, then you might not see any heavy HMG out on the battlefield. Just does not make sense to invest time and SP into a class that's gonna fail.
I'll wait and see... I'm hoping CCP finds a good balance, and for goodness sake give us a skill to lower bullet spread...otherwise, LOLheavies. May as well point your finger and laugh when you see one in Uprising. |
J-Lewis
Edimmu Warfighters Gallente Federation
23
|
Posted - 2013.04.26 10:15:00 -
[12] - Quote
AFAIK all proficiency skills keep the damage bonus. This change really hangs on an increase in slots and fitting resources for heavies.
Confirm/Deny?
e: Also SISI doesn't show anything besides descriptions. No info on specific stat changes. |
Exmaple Core
SyNergy Gaming EoN.
166
|
Posted - 2013.04.26 10:20:00 -
[13] - Quote
J-Lewis wrote:AFAIK all proficiency skills keep the damage bonus. This change really hangs on an increase in slots and fitting resources for heavies.
Confirm/Deny?
e: Also SISI doesn't show anything besides descriptions. No info on specific stat changes. Deny. Wolf said otherwise. Than again, it is easy to read it in 2 ways. From what ppl are saying and specifically from what Saber quoted a dev im sticking with deny |
Lance 2ballzStrong
SyNergy Gaming EoN.
1078
|
Posted - 2013.04.26 10:22:00 -
[14] - Quote
J-Lewis wrote:AFAIK all proficiency skills keep the damage bonus. This change really hangs on an increase in slots and fitting resources for heavies.
Confirm/Deny?
e: Also SISI doesn't show anything besides descriptions. No info on specific stat changes.
I don't know what you mean.
If you mean there's a skill that increases slots on suits, then no. Proto VK1 has 3 high, 2 low...lol, and only costs 240k isk. |
J-Lewis
Edimmu Warfighters Gallente Federation
23
|
Posted - 2013.04.26 10:26:00 -
[15] - Quote
Not a skill; just a change in base stats.
You know... Like heavies having more than 2 low slots in Uprising. |
Lance 2ballzStrong
SyNergy Gaming EoN.
1078
|
Posted - 2013.04.26 10:28:00 -
[16] - Quote
J-Lewis wrote:Not a skill; just a change in base stats.
You know... Like heavies having more than 2 low slots in Uprising.
Aaaah... I don't know man. I'm waiting on the patch notes for confirmation on things mentioned above. |
J-Lewis
Edimmu Warfighters Gallente Federation
23
|
Posted - 2013.04.26 10:29:00 -
[17] - Quote
Lance 2ballzStrong wrote:J-Lewis wrote:Not a skill; just a change in base stats.
You know... Like heavies having more than 2 low slots in Uprising. Aaaah... I don't know man. I'm waiting on the patch notes for confirmation on things mentioned above.
That's why I asked, in hopes that Iron Wolf could spread some light |
Exmaple Core
SyNergy Gaming EoN.
167
|
Posted - 2013.04.26 10:30:00 -
[18] - Quote
J-Lewis wrote:Not a skill; just a change in base stats.
You know... Like heavies having more than 2 low slots in Uprising.
Exmaple Core wrote:Freshticles wrote:I came to the same conclusion, however there might be some buffs so only May 6th will tell. Iron Wolf Saber wrote:Exmaple Core wrote:Heavys everywere are dreading the new build, and durring the "Ask us anything!" event the devs said "watch at fanfest" or "were looking into it" and the classic, tottally ignored all other questions about the heavy suit. Riddle them this; will heavys have reduced upper tier prices on gear and/or have any stat/slots changes to the suit? Suit prices where normalized, suits of one tier cost about the same. Weaponry has been nerfed to 0%damage. All damage + skills except turrets and proficiency has been removed. Armor repair skill armor plate shield extenders and booster skills all increased module effectiveness and not fittings. Three fitting skills to max out at 15% + to CPU and pg. There are no buffs. Heres the proof, he says only turret and turret proficeiency are keeping the extra damage. Suit prices are "normalized" wich can mean there going to be priced "fairly" (wich will unfairly be twice the cost of anything else) or stay as normal thus far (wich is so far "normal" at 3 times the cost of other suits) and our weapons are hard to fit. proto hmgs and forge guns are over 120 CPU to fit. now skills are making mods harder to to fit, so were not using proto weapons any time soon. too hard and expensive to fit! I specifically asked if the suit was getting any modified slot count and Iron Wolf did not answer. That means the dev did not answer because he dident want to give bad news to the heavys. If they were making the suit better than the devs would have answered cuz that would make the players happy. He dident asnwer so its nothing positive |
Lance 2ballzStrong
SyNergy Gaming EoN.
1078
|
Posted - 2013.04.26 10:31:00 -
[19] - Quote
J-Lewis wrote:Lance 2ballzStrong wrote:J-Lewis wrote:Not a skill; just a change in base stats.
You know... Like heavies having more than 2 low slots in Uprising. Aaaah... I don't know man. I'm waiting on the patch notes for confirmation on things mentioned above. That's why I asked, in hopes that Iron Wolf could spread some light
They'll be playing the new build today, so maybe. Even then, I don't know if he or others are allowed to say anything more about it. |
Higgs flagrantfool
3dge of D4rkness SoulWing Alliance
38
|
Posted - 2013.04.26 10:32:00 -
[20] - Quote
Range isn't getting nerfed. Heavys should have all the range they do now, when the new HMG sharpshooter is skilled properly. The sharpshooter change has nothing to do with reducing the range of any weapon. It is simply swapping the current function of sharpshooter (bullet flight time increase) for a dispersion decrease given a max posible range. Functionally, there should be very very little difference between how the skill works now and how it will work post uprising. |
|
Lance 2ballzStrong
SyNergy Gaming EoN.
1078
|
Posted - 2013.04.26 10:37:00 -
[21] - Quote
Higgs flagrantfool wrote:Range isn't getting nerfed. Heavys should have all the range they do now, when the new HMG sharpshooter is skilled properly. The sharpshooter change has nothing to do with reducing the range of any weapon. It is simply swapping the current function of sharpshooter (bullet flight time increase) for a dispersion decrease given a max posible range. Functionally, there should be very very little difference between how the skill works now and how it will work post uprising.
Only the AR and SMG is getting the Sharpshooter skill, and it doesn't affect range.
No other weapon is getting that skill in Uprising. |
Exmaple Core
SyNergy Gaming EoN.
167
|
Posted - 2013.04.26 10:39:00 -
[22] - Quote
Higgs flagrantfool wrote:Range isn't getting nerfed. Heavys should have all the range they do now, when the new HMG sharpshooter is skilled properly. The sharpshooter change has nothing to do with reducing the range of any weapon. It is simply swapping the current function of sharpshooter (bullet flight time increase) for a dispersion decrease given a max posible range. Functionally, there should be very very little difference between how the skill works now and how it will work post uprising. Its not about weapons having reduced range, its about not being able to increase it. HMGS lack the effective range past point blank. its pretty bad. The sharpshooter diffrence in better accuracy wont matter when your PROTO 17.6 damage per shot is reduced to 8 damage per shot because the enemy is 40 meters away. No matter how many hits you score, the far too comon AR or laser rifle will mess your day up 6 ways to Caldari Prime before you drop their sheilds half way. EDIT:Sorry i was mistaken, lance pointed out that only the AR and SMG are going to benifit from the increased accuracy of sharpshooter. So were doing no damage at mid to long range AND not hitting. keeps getting better and better... |
J-Lewis
Edimmu Warfighters Gallente Federation
23
|
Posted - 2013.04.26 10:40:00 -
[23] - Quote
Exmaple Core wrote:I specifically asked if the suit was getting any modified slot count and Iron Wolf did not answer. That means the dev did not answer because he dident want to give bad news to the heavys. If they were making the suit better than the devs would have answered cuz that would make the players happy. He dident asnwer so its nothing positive
That's some really heavy duty tinfoil you're wearing. Shame it's all aluminium and not actual tin. |
Rusticuls
ATHEIST's For XENU
30
|
Posted - 2013.04.26 10:42:00 -
[24] - Quote
You do know that the logi's have a bunch of equipment they have to buy and spec into right.? Less gear = Less expenses. Fact is my medium tier heavy fittings cost about the same as my medium tier logi fittings. And my logistuff probably cost the same in sp requirements. |
Exmaple Core
SyNergy Gaming EoN.
167
|
Posted - 2013.04.26 10:43:00 -
[25] - Quote
J-Lewis wrote:Exmaple Core wrote:I specifically asked if the suit was getting any modified slot count and Iron Wolf did not answer. That means the dev did not answer because he dident want to give bad news to the heavys. If they were making the suit better than the devs would have answered cuz that would make the players happy. He dident asnwer so its nothing positive That's some really heavy duty tinfoil you're wearing. Shame it's all aluminium and not actual tin. Call it what you like. There is ZERO hope for the heavy and ive laid the proof there for you. Argue about the facts, the "CCP rebalencing the heavy suit" but thats how their doing it^^^ you say im wearing foil. I say im being realistic |
Lance 2ballzStrong
SyNergy Gaming EoN.
1078
|
Posted - 2013.04.26 10:45:00 -
[26] - Quote
J-Lewis wrote:Exmaple Core wrote:I specifically asked if the suit was getting any modified slot count and Iron Wolf did not answer. That means the dev did not answer because he dident want to give bad news to the heavys. If they were making the suit better than the devs would have answered cuz that would make the players happy. He dident asnwer so its nothing positive That's some really heavy duty tinfoil you're wearing. Shame it's all aluminium and not actual tin.
Not really. He has a point, but on the other hand you can say CCP isn't saying anything about how they balanced other suits either. One thing is certain, heavy is the only class that DIDN'T get another race variant...funny huh?!
That shows the lack of heavy love imo. Assault class? All 4 races. Logi? 2 races if I'm not mistaken. Scout? 2 races if I'm not mistaken.
So we're stuck with the same old Amarr heavy from way back last year since before June! |
ShwerShwerShwer
The Marching Mercs General Tso's Alliance
75
|
Posted - 2013.04.26 10:47:00 -
[27] - Quote
Exmaple Core wrote:J-Lewis wrote:Exmaple Core wrote:I specifically asked if the suit was getting any modified slot count and Iron Wolf did not answer. That means the dev did not answer because he dident want to give bad news to the heavys. If they were making the suit better than the devs would have answered cuz that would make the players happy. He dident asnwer so its nothing positive That's some really heavy duty tinfoil you're wearing. Shame it's all aluminium and not actual tin. Call it what you like. There is ZERO hope for the heavy and ive laid the proof there for you. Argue about the facts, the "CCP rebalencing the heavy suit" but thats how their doing it^^^ you say im wearing foil. I say im being realistic And I say you should wait for them to post the new stats sheet. Or just wait till May and try it for yourself. |
Sake Monster
The Tritan Industries RISE of LEGION
374
|
Posted - 2013.04.26 10:50:00 -
[28] - Quote
Although i plan on putting all my skill points right back into my Forge Gun, i fear Exmaple may be correct. None of the info about heavies (large frame users now, i guess) in Uprising seems promising.... |
Another Heavy SOB
TRUE TEA BAGGERS Orion Empire
49
|
Posted - 2013.04.26 10:51:00 -
[29] - Quote
I hate to say it but he's probably right. It's really leaning towards heavys being boned to extinction.
Although I still have some hope.....what can I say I'm new. |
Kushmir Nadian
Valor Coalition RISE of LEGION
173
|
Posted - 2013.04.26 10:54:00 -
[30] - Quote
I think we need to wait for more info (like how armor will be balanced/improved) but your point on cost, and damage loom large. Heavies give up speed/mobility for short to medium range damage and health, its poor balance to see assault suits get shields in the Heavy range and not give up anything.
I really like the paper, rock, scissors of Dust but they have to be consistent. HMGs can't dominate short and medium long range I GET THAT, it breaks the game for a weapon with that fire rate to be able to out-damage ARs at medium long range.
The problem is by giving away high shields so easily and crippling the heavy slot-wise you take away the heavy's advantage. NOTHING SHOULD DO MORE DAMAGE THAN THE HMG IN THE 10-40m RANGE except the shotty. Its damage should make players terrified to close the distance. If it can't excel at that range it doesn't have a niche. ARs/LRs dominate the HMG from the 50m+ range and they should, but a suit that can't hold equipment can't also get the shaft slot-wise as it advances to prototype level. |
|
|
|
|
Pages: [1] 2 3 4 5 6 :: one page |
First page | Previous page | Next page | Last page |