All you people ever want is change. Why cant you just leave it alone. If you get your "skill" manual shot what then? will you still ask for another change because it still does not have enough skill? Skill does not equal fun its as simple as that.

Also calling us lazy because we don't want to play like you is trash. I don't care about skill or aim i just want to have fun. If you want your "skill" shot you can have it!

Im a tank driver. So i see all this first hand. This is what needs to happen with swarm launchers:
Keep the lock (travel time is a issue for a swarm duder)
- Manual fire is not the answer
STOP HAVING THE MISSILES CUT DAMN CORNERS.

If im below a hill or around a building, SWARMS SHOULD NOT BE HOMING MISSILES. Missiles should lock on, and fire straight. if a hill or a building is in the way, then too bad. Tanks should be able to grab cover. This is the same problem with drop ships. There are plunty of buildings to hide behind, but not against swarms.

Fit it plx.

Sorry about my post. I was really angry about a number of things and I let it show up in my post. Again I apologize for this. What I meant to say yesterday is that yes this game is subject to change but I really don't think they would have removed manual fire if it was not useless. Most of the time your better off switching to a secondary. Also we need an Av weapon with lock on. if all the av weapons in this game were dumbfire i dont think anyone would use them because they would be even easier to avoid. I wasnt trying to flame yesterday I just wanted say that not every one wants a skill or gtfo game like you do. after all video game were made for fun first skill second. I look forward to you reply.

Do be honest I think I only got maybe one kill with dumbfire lol. Most of the time if I got into and infantry battle I would run away or switch to a secondary. I always found it difficult to line up the shot against infantry but hey that's just me. Ive never been good at fps games which is why I turn into a burnt out toaster oven when some one asks for a change I mean I just got used to how the thing works . If dumbfire does return how do you think it would handle?

I think they should make two swarm launcher variants. A dumbfire swarm launcher and a lock on only swarm launcher. The lock on variant would have lower damage to make up for the fact that its lock on. The dumbfire would of course have hi damage. Or you could just make it that when you tap r1 it fires hi speed high damage dumbfire missiles but when you hold it down it goes into lock on mode. Thats as for as I got with it .

You do realize swarms will be used in the future to shoot down fighters which go much faster than current.

I kind of don't see the point in swarm launchers currently. Forge guns have much better DPM as far as I'm aware, and they're much more reliable in terms of actually damaging the enemy. Swarms are too easily avoided. They're okay against dropships I guess, but even then, forge gun has been more reliable for shooting down dropships in my experience.

Personally, I think they need to seriously look at how swarm launchers fit into the pantheon of anti-vehicle options. As well, if forge guns can one-shot any infantry from great distances, I don't see why swarm launchers ought to be totally useless for shooting infantry at all.



We have no idea how other aircraft will work. Speculation like this doesn't help address the game as it is.

Lock time based on sig radius and no more turning 90-¦ on corners, simple fix

Ya that's be nice too, but its still hard on DS's, whose logistic role is to rep tanks.


I did like the idea of line of sight lock, if you looked away the missiles would go sporadic.


People usually assume tanks when talking about swarms, think of the poor DS's and LAV's too! lol.

Actually had a DS rep my madrugar last night, he got 1 hit by swarms and it tossed him into the ground.

He was plenty above me as well, idk what the rep range is on those, was a sick amount of rep though.

Wrong..my militia swarms smash tanks all the time..lock on hide behind something shoot up auto lock does the work swarms take no skill at all

Im a tank driver. So i see all this first hand. This is what needs to happen with swarm launchers:
Keep the lock (travel time is a issue for a swarm duder)
- Manual fire is not the answer
STOP HAVING THE MISSILES CUT DAMN CORNERS.

If im below a hill or around a building, SWARMS SHOULD NOT BE HOMING MISSILES. Missiles should lock on, and fire straight. if a hill or a building is in the way, then too bad. Tanks should be able to grab cover. This is the same problem with drop ships. There are plunty of buildings to hide behind, but not against swarms.

Fit it plx.

Mabye i'm doing something severly wrong but my militia Swarms do almost nothing against any decently leveled tank.
The bad tanks, prolly militia ones, but how can i tell, just take 2-3 hits, this makes sense.

A few days ago i spend almost the whole match on the 3 point map, next to 'B', our spawn letter, just hunting tanks...or lets say TRYING to hunt 'em.


Tank pretty much parked next to 'B', giving me a clear sight of it. I was spamming it it with my Swarm from the mountains next to, but i could not reload fast enough to deal enough damage to overcome his repairing, i was so close to be pretty sure their were no LOGIs backing him up from behind. I had my nanohive next to me, to prevent me from running out of ammo, but never was able to really damge it. It did not even try to dodge my swarms or ever tried to look for cover, 'scared' off me shooting at it.
Its easier to destroy a GRU with a swarm launcher than those tanks, and GRUs still seem to take 20+hits of a swarm.


Seriously, to keep me from doing this, being a 'threat' to a tank, it should send a few infantries to me, taking me out, not much of a task, cosindering i just carry a secondary to defend myself against non vehicle targets.. Or have a sniper watching the mountains, taking me out, before i can hit it once too often. But having so much shield and armor to make a Swarm almost useless, no matter hom much skill it takes to hit with autoaim or not, not even forcing a tank to try to dodge the rockets, can not be right.
Maybe blame my team for not spamming a few Flux or Swarms aswell.



By no mean a 'newb' should be able to take out a high end tank, with 1,2 or 3 swarm hits, from safe zone, no requiring any skill to 'aim', giving the tank no chance to 'defend' itself, by eliminating the 'threat' fast enough of by taking cover. But if i shoot a tank for FIVE straight minutes, the tank should be down, by not taking cover or taking me about before, any tank owner desevers to look at his buring 600'000+ ISK investment.



Auto aim might not require much skill, but you also have to account the down side of, beside not be able to hit infantry. It takes a few seconds to get those rockets off, i can not just tap R2 once and shot you with a swarm 1 second later, in case a vehicle gets in my sight, while still doing my normal front line job, fighting infantry. I can not carry a normal front line gun, when i'm on my swarm load out, its my primary weapon.


How often is shooting from behind cover really an option, to justfy this call for nerfing it, only allowing the 'skilled' ones take out tanks with a swarm, instead of 'cowardish newbs'.

First, you're confusing rockets with missiles. Missiles have guidance systems, rockets do not. That's what the OP wants is to turn SWARMs into basic rocket launchers making them, in effect, long range light forge guns carryable by anyone. It will be able to pop infantry more easily than a forge. It currently still kills infantry if they're within the SWARM blast radius when the missiles hit. It already hit's vehicles at a greater distance than the Forge. So the proposed changes would end up eliminating the Forge Gun.

Second. Since this build started, I have been top small turret for two tank drivers in my clan quite often and I have as yet to see Swarms track around obstacles.

Ugh... don't you need to find an assault guy who willing specs into some Swarm skills? As a Logi, I'm not wasting points on it. Instead I chase tanks on foot when they are dominating the battlefield (as 2,3,4 tanks these days are being fielded at once) firing my wait to lock and fire before he hides pea shooter thus giving away my position where Ithen put my dodgeball skills to full use from incomnig sniper fire just to scratch a tanks shields. Then either I'm run over by the tank in rocky terrain or I am waiting for a reload from hell walking up over a hill where the tank may have sped away barrelling down the side of a cliff.

Why a cliff you say? and why was I chasing it? because I've been on the same side of a map from one tower and watch a drop ship spawn in a tank on another tower and I couldn't hit it with my swarms. . . or I'm dropping a hive and reloading because 6 swarms just got through the shields and I have to hurry before they come back up. This has already taken valuable time at this point and I just wanna tank hunt to get someting out of the lost battle.

Get that tank outta the redzone you panzy, till then I am left riskikgn my life standnig still in the open to a hail storm waiting to lock on. If the tank can stay up there, then give me dumbfires and splash damage to fend of the snipers in the hills and the 3 assualts chasing my backside while I am left with a scrambler pistol as back up.

I probably shouldn't be the swarm guy but since they are dodged, ducked, dipped, and defended against so well by the good tankers (or hide where they can't be reached like cowardly ones) unless the team is smart enough to spawn 3-4 AV's the next time around. . . tanks have no gripe in this argument.

The real issue would be DS needing a bolster in something like warning detection and some serious shields to take the first hit and decide if staying is worth a second. Maybe put in a flight damage issue or cripple effect instead of KABOOMing them so fast.

[
This was my alts tank, it runs 800k with 84% resistance, plus 6600 buffer and heavy rep

I think it was a SVER TB one, might be similar build, but neverless, this thing should have been down, after i spammed it for FIVE straight minutes, and i'm not exaggerating here, prolly even longer than that, went 3-2 , off 1st few minutes, when i was still thinking we could atleast hold 'B'.
No ones was shooting at me while and killing me here should have been the only way to keep me from destroying such a tank with a few Swarm hits. 6-7 hits should have been enough, something in that range, it still being up after 40+ can't be right. Being fully repaired after not being hit for 30sec sounds ok to me, considering the 'high' cost, but just sitting on one spot, pretty much impossible to be destroyed, freely taking hit after hit, not even trying to dodge it, this does not requir much skill either, atleast not in the context of 'auto aim of swarms being too easy'.

Ya this isn't a tank QQ thread, I can sit my tank in a **** storm of swarms all day, this is just looking at a general rebalance to make dumbfire viable for the swarms again.

DS's and LAV's are my main concern.

And auto lock is like auto aim to me, there needs to be more downsides to it.

I personally love AV guys going at me, but the swarm dudes hide in the mountains way outa range with no real downfall.

Hey OP I just thought of the smartest thing instead of asking ccp to turn the swarms into dumbfire rockest why not ask them to add a rocket launcher instead. Doesnt that make more sense?