I haven't played dust for a few weeks now, due to one thing mainly.

Group sizing.

I'll make this short, cause no one wants to hear this dead horse again, but these are my two cents. We need to be able to fill a whole team with friends/clan mates. With corp battles being only 8v8, with no reward for individuals, pub matches are far more fun and rewarding. We NEED larger groups, 6 people is fine, 8 is better. We should also be allowed to either link groups, or just make one large group (up to 16 people). My main reasoning for this is simple..

I'm tired of playing against my friends. it's ridiculous that we are given absolutely no control over who we play alongside, unless we forgo advancing our characters (no SP in corp battles) or play a different game.

I've opted for the later. I doubt I'm the only one. I'm sure some people will cry about "bu..bu... bu... teh overpowered one-sided pub matches!"

Kinda like the "overpowered one-sided" pub matches we have already when you and your 3 friends go up against two dudes with tanks and your team just happens to have absolutely no AV capability? yeah. That is way more fair than once in a while running into a semi-organized (in most cases) enemy.

That or give us 16v16 (and bigger, as the game progresses) corp battles, with full SP/ISK rewards.

Corp matches aren't rewarding? Depends on the contracts you accept I suppose.

What we need is corp battles that are more than 8v8. Letting a corp fully stack one team against random people would be ridiculous, there'd be little chance an unorganized team could beat an organized team used to working together.

What we need is corp battles that are more than 8v8. Letting a corp fully stack one team against random people would be ridiculous, there'd be little chance an unorganized team could beat an organized team used to working together.

I haven't played dust for a few weeks now, due to one thing mainly.

Group sizing.

I'll make this short, cause no one wants to hear this dead horse again, but these are my two cents. We need to be able to fill a whole team with friends/clan mates. With corp battles being only 8v8, with no reward for individuals, pub matches are far more fun and rewarding. We NEED larger groups, 6 people is fine, 8 is better. We should also be allowed to either link groups, or just make one large group (up to 16 people). My main reasoning for this is simple..

I'm tired of playing against my friends. it's ridiculous that we are given absolutely no control over who we play alongside, unless we forgo advancing our characters (no SP in corp battles) or play a different game.

I've opted for the later. I doubt I'm the only one. I'm sure some people will cry about "bu..bu... bu... teh overpowered one-sided pub matches!"

Kinda like the "overpowered one-sided" pub matches we have already when you and your 3 friends go up against two dudes with tanks and your team just happens to have absolutely no AV capability? yeah. That is way more fair than once in a while running into a semi-organized (in most cases) enemy.

That or give us 16v16 (and bigger, as the game progresses) corp battles, with full SP/ISK rewards.

Exactly. Teams of randoms can barely handle 4 man squads right now and you want your entire corp in the same pub? Please...

what about a separate quene one for jsut small squads of 4 and randoms and then another quene where 2 or more squads can quene up and be on the same team. kinda like corp battles but the corp dosent get money and that quene is matched with onther squads for instance.

me and 3 buddys quene up in the game type modes we have now in instant battle and we get in battles like now with lots of randoms but we still got a few friends.

and then another quene for 2 or more squads quening up together that put against other groups of atleast 2 squads of the same corp. kinda like an un offical corp battle with a few randoms.

you can add more squads up to 4 squads on 1 corp vs 4 squads on the other but your quene would be longer since you can only fight a similar group composition..

everyone following me?

I haven't played dust for a few weeks now, due to one thing mainly.

Group sizing.

I'll make this short, cause no one wants to hear this dead horse again, but these are my two cents. We need to be able to fill a whole team with friends/clan mates. With corp battles being only 8v8, with no reward for individuals, pub matches are far more fun and rewarding. We NEED larger groups, 6 people is fine, 8 is better. We should also be allowed to either link groups, or just make one large group (up to 16 people). My main reasoning for this is simple..

I'm tired of playing against my friends. it's ridiculous that we are given absolutely no control over who we play alongside, unless we forgo advancing our characters (no SP in corp battles) or play a different game.

I've opted for the later. I doubt I'm the only one. I'm sure some people will cry about "bu..bu... bu... teh overpowered one-sided pub matches!"

Kinda like the "overpowered one-sided" pub matches we have already when you and your 3 friends go up against two dudes with tanks and your team just happens to have absolutely no AV capability? yeah. That is way more fair than once in a while running into a semi-organized (in most cases) enemy.

That or give us 16v16 (and bigger, as the game progresses) corp battles, with full SP/ISK rewards.

Corp matches aren't rewarding? Depends on the contracts you accept I suppose.

Considering if you met that group in a pub match, every player would get at least 1m+ individually at the end of the game, yes they aren't rewarding.

true but the idea of hisec pub matches isnt to be a corp stomping ground
infact ccp should encourage corps to get out of hisec
right now contracts dont mean much but i expect that to change.

CCP needs to make hisec unrewarding for corps so they look to seek greener pastures
if by implementing a teamwide grouping mechanic where ppl can fill entire teams and get decent to great rewards u take away any reason for the majority of corps to even go losec and play FW corp battles.

Caz mentioned this in 1 of his posts and i agree with him
4 man squads are fine for 16v16
6 man squads are fine for 24v24
8 man squads are fine for 32v32

that way games arent totally dominated by 1 corp just showing up for a free win to farm red dots and the casual players and solo players can still wonder around and play without having to constantly worry or back out of games for fear of just gettin wrecked everytime and not enjoying themselves.

Ppl gotta look at the bigger picture and the bigger picture is there are always alot more casuals playing a game than clan oriented players. We already have lowsec and nullsec for corps to stomp around in dont need to take away the only place the majority of the playerbase can have some fun as well

Maybe the idea shouldn't be get corps out of high sec, it should be to get randoms into corps.
We are playing a team-based game that doesn't allow organized teams. Remember MAG? Yeah... The whole no clan deploy thing was GRRREEEAAATTT....

Honestly, I get sick of hearing "protect the casuals". Make DUST a hardcore game, and the hardcore fans will support it to its death. And slowly the game sill grow larger. FOTM players aren't gonna be incentivized to play more by iving them boring pub games with a team full of random bluedots. Corps are the main draw of DUST, and thats where the focus should be, not the butthurt feelings of casual #736265227 who is mad he got trumped by teamwork.

Pubstomping is a reality of any large team based game. And honestly, thats fine. The people who will stay with DUST will find a corp to join and avoid getting pubstomped, and the casuals will leave anyways like they would have done.

The way the gaming industry works is this - You get casuals to obtain hardcore. Since they're concentrating on launch casuals should be there focus. Afterwords, the hardcore players get the love.

Maybe the idea shouldn't be get corps out of high sec, it should be to get randoms into corps.
We are playing a team-based game that doesn't allow organized teams. Remember MAG? Yeah... The whole no clan deploy thing was GRRREEEAAATTT....

Honestly, I get sick of hearing "protect the casuals". Make DUST a hardcore game, and the hardcore fans will support it to its death. And slowly the game sill grow larger. FOTM players aren't gonna be incentivized to play more by iving them boring pub games with a team full of random bluedots. Corps are the main draw of DUST, and thats where the focus should be, not the butthurt feelings of casual #736265227 who is mad he got trumped by teamwork.

Pubstomping is a reality of any large team based game. And honestly, thats fine. The people who will stay with DUST will find a corp to join and avoid getting pubstomped, and the casuals will leave anyways like they would have done.

DUST isnt protecting the casuals tho
please show me where it is?
u cannot FORCE ppl to join corps
like i said there are TWO lower security zones for hardcore play pubs will NEVER be hardcore play so why ppl want to zerg with full teams in pubs and find that fun and say "ppl are trounced by teamwork" no i can tell u 1st hand it does not take any sort of decent teamwork at all to beat randoms in pubs its quite appalling how most just roll over.

ur method hurts the game by trying to force the majority of ppl into corps instead of giving bigger benefits to corps moving out to fight each other. U have the casual friendly hisec and then u have low and null catering to hardcore, those that generally interested in teamwork and the big draw of dust will eventually find themselves into a lowsec/nullsec corp and continue on THAT is the draw of DUST.

Im pretty sure most ppl if not everyone here got drawn into DUST for the deeper meaningful battles and not to pub stomp casuals/randoms with full teams. Am i right or wrong J?

PS: clan/zerg deploy in MAG still is terrible. MAG should of had proper clan match options and not allowed ppl to just zerg randoms. Honestly speaking MAG became ALOT more boring once zerg deploy was added and back in PHI we started rollin 2+ squads in a game instead of 1, spent alot more time waiting for games than actually playing.

Hes right. Would ruin the game for those who don't have corps. Squad size should be increased only when player count is increased proportionally.

Eh. I could agree with your points above, except it makes for boring gameplay right now. I don't really want to play against randoms all day in a 4 man squad. But the alternstive is a corp battle with only 8 players that doesn't award me any SP or ISK personally, and thats just pointless to me.

Honestly the crux of the disagreement is whether or not organized groups in pub mathes will ruin the game. I say it will make it more fun, at the moment I find DUST pretty bland. You guys think it will turn away casuals and kill the game.

I hate to say it, but their needs to be some form of corp match that awards ISK/SP, because otherwise I will never play this game in the low/null sec areas. I think at some point we are all just gonna have to deal with people farming SP in corp battles, because otherwise it makes the game pointless for those playing legitamitely.

Whilst I personally love the idea of being able to deploy with more of my corpmates (Very tired of killing one another. We seem to bring out really expensive gear to fight one another xD) but it would be awful. You need to think of the consequences before doing such a thing.

Pubstomping is quite bad with just 4 players. I mean, Me, Crafty and Hughes went around with Balacs the other day and ended up killing over 20-25 each in a single match. The blue dots mopped up the few left and we lost 2 clones (bloody blue dots.) If we had a bigger squad it would've been over faster and we probably wouldn't of lost those clones.

So thats with 3 capable players. Imagine if we had 3 more? or 5 more?

My point is that you give people this option right now and it'll only result in players stomping newbies(/notsogoodplayers) and it becomes very unfair and very unfun very quickly.

I haven't played dust for a few weeks now, due to one thing mainly.

Group sizing.

I'll make this short, cause no one wants to hear this dead horse again, but these are my two cents. We need to be able to fill a whole team with friends/clan mates. With corp battles being only 8v8, with no reward for individuals, pub matches are far more fun and rewarding. We NEED larger groups, 6 people is fine, 8 is better. We should also be allowed to either link groups, or just make one large group (up to 16 people). My main reasoning for this is simple..

I'm tired of playing against my friends. it's ridiculous that we are given absolutely no control over who we play alongside, unless we forgo advancing our characters (no SP in corp battles) or play a different game.

I've opted for the later. I doubt I'm the only one. I'm sure some people will cry about "bu..bu... bu... teh overpowered one-sided pub matches!"

Kinda like the "overpowered one-sided" pub matches we have already when you and your 3 friends go up against two dudes with tanks and your team just happens to have absolutely no AV capability? yeah. That is way more fair than once in a while running into a semi-organized (in most cases) enemy.

That or give us 16v16 (and bigger, as the game progresses) corp battles, with full SP/ISK rewards.

these nerds can't play the game as it is.

they are all breathily awaiting the day when some crappy codboi AI bot mode is released so they won't be losing to humans any more.

blaming the clans for pubstomping?
so you're blaming the clans because YOUR team lost so bad? you guys have a team. you guys have mics. you DON'T use em so you blame the clans for you getting redlined?
interesting technique.


agreed though... clans standing around in pube rooms beating up on you nerds does nothing for them, nor the game.
but it's dust, not babysitting mmo, so if the devs want this game to tank, keep up with the handholding and protecting of the casuals from their own incompetence.

if they want this game to actually go someplace, at somepoint, they have to open the cages and let the mosnters out.
that's just the long and short of it.

Peace
B

these nerds can't play the game as it is.

they are all breathily awaiting the day when some crappy codboi AI bot mode is released so they won't be losing to humans any more.

blaming the clans for pubstomping?
so you're blaming the clans because YOUR team lost so bad? you guys have a team. you guys have mics. you DON'T use em so you blame the clans for you getting redlined?
interesting technique.


agreed though... clans standing around in pube rooms beating up on you nerds does nothing for them, nor the game.
but it's dust, not babysitting mmo, so if the devs want this game to tank, keep up with the handholding and protecting of the casuals from their own incompetence.

if they want this game to actually go someplace, at somepoint, they have to open the cages and let the mosnters out.
that's just the long and short of it.

Peace
B

To answer ur question about SP its simple u pub....whats wrong with pubbin with 1 squad? grind ur SP , do some PVE and grind SP there as well inbetween ur lowsec and nullsec fights. Simple solution is simple. Seperating the playerbase on a game that will have a small playerbase is a bad move so CCP also needs to make sure ppl play hisec pub games inbetween their low and null battles to keep games flowing.

Ppl gotta look at the bigger picture and the bigger picture is there are always alot more casuals playing a game than clan oriented players. We already have lowsec and nullsec for corps to stomp around in dont need to take away the only place the majority of the playerbase can have some fun as well

I think the battles we are thinking about would also fall under the Mercenary tab rather than the Corporation tab, and you do get SP from Mercenary contracts(like the tournament and these event matches). Just speculating, though.

I still didn't get a response to my question at the bottom of the first page of this thread :/

We could look at the socom series for inspiration. Socom didn't cater to the casuals and I consider it one of the greatest games of all time. I remember the first time I booted up S2, I went straight to multiplayer joined a game and got stomped on. Because it was a hardcore game. You didn't see many people in that game that didn't have clan tags because the community kept that game alive.

The main reason for a larger grouping system is so that you can play with all of your friends not just 3 of them. I've said it before I'll say it again, if this game starts catering to the causals, this game will die. MAG in the beta days was a hardcore game that I enjoyed immensely but patch after patch started catering to the causal gamer and MAG died because of it. If CCP wants this game to survive they have to listen to the hardcore playerbase, let the community keep the game alive.

I can tell you this even if we get a clan deploy system similar to MAG, clans will still be playing in corp battles, because that is the nature of a competitive environment. Hell I'm sure there will eventually be a gamebattles type system set up for clan battles because clans like competition. Sure there will be some pubstomp corps out there but there will always be pubstomp corps.

@ J how is it like EVE? isnt the majority of players in EVE in hisec and carebears who mine rocks and dont pvp? so u want CCP to encourage corps to be carebears just sitting in hisec farming noobs in dust?

CCP should be encouraging corps to fight EACH OTHER not stomp randoms. This MAG mentality ppl got gotta drop.

Put zerg deploy in hisec and u'll never see another contract go up because teams wont take any risks they will just sit in hisec and pub their entire dust life i can guarantee u that.

To answer ur question about SP its simple u pub....whats wrong with pubbin with 1 squad? grind ur SP , do some PVE and grind SP there as well inbetween ur lowsec and nullsec fights. Simple solution is simple. Seperating the playerbase on a game that will have a small playerbase is a bad move so CCP also needs to make sure ppl play hisec pub games inbetween their low and null battles to keep games flowing.

Agreed, +1. Pub matches are normally pretty one sided anyways. The only time I normally get a good fight is when our squad gets paired against another corp squad. And hell the outcome is normally decided on what team has the better blue dots (more corp players)

I disagree. Make a game for casuals, and they move on when the newest ice cream flavor comes out. Poof, there goes your fanbase. Hardcore players are left disgusted, and now you got no one.

Too many casual games out there right now. DUST needs to differentiate itself to people; MAKE IT HARD.

Fun, rewarding, deep, but don't cater to the capricious whims of a casual.

My 0.02 ISK

We could look at the socom series for inspiration. Socom didn't cater to the casuals and I consider it one of the greatest games of all time. I remember the first time I booted up S2, I went straight to multiplayer joined a game and got stomped on. Because it was a hardcore game. You didn't see many people in that game that didn't have clan tags because the community kept that game alive.

The main reason for a larger grouping system is so that you can play with all of your friends not just 3 of them. I've said it before I'll say it again, if this game starts catering to the causals, this game will die. MAG in the beta days was a hardcore game that I enjoyed immensely but patch after patch started catering to the causal gamer and MAG died because of it. If CCP wants this game to survive they have to listen to the hardcore playerbase, let the community keep the game alive.

I can tell you this even if we get a clan deploy system similar to MAG, clans will still be playing in corp battles, because that is the nature of a competitive environment. Hell I'm sure there will eventually be a gamebattles type system set up for clan battles because clans like competition. Sure there will be some pubstomp corps out there but there will always be pubstomp corps.

This is absurd. The game can be good for BOTH casuals AND "hardcore" players. It's incredibly foolish to make it exclusively for one or the other, and hey, guess what, hardcore players often begin as casual players. If you drive away casuals by making the game ****** for them to play, you ensure that your playerbase will not grow and that your game will not succeed.

No they aren't. Letting one corp stack an entire team would go a long way to making sure more public games are one-sided, though.

The bottom line is that it would be bad for Dust. Non-corp casual players would be driven away from the game, and corp players wouldn't really get anything out of it beyond an easy win, which isn't fun either. Nobody benefits from this. If you want to play with friends, you can as a single squad. If you want a big, organized fight for your corp, pick a battle with another corp. There's zero reason to allow pub stomping.

+100
this is why hisec needs to be the casual free zone and those that gradually wish to seek more out of their gameplay experience will naturally gravitate towards finding lowsec and nullsec corps , some will even look for corps that heavy into gladiator arenas and tournament play

5x is right everyone starts off as a casual player, hell i did then i got a taste of clan battles back on KZ2 and became hooked on the more competitive side of games

Ok. Then make a place for corps to deploy full teams and still gain SP and ISK. Like, a seperate queue for those who want to play with a full team. Keep high sec 4 player squads only, but form an early precursor to low sec where full teams can play matchmaking in another queue. Randoms could still join, but they would know that there would be corps in there.

Is that a better solution?

Ok. Then make a place for corps to deploy full teams and still gain SP and ISK. Like, a seperate queue for those who want to play with a full team. Keep high sec 4 player squads only, but form an early precursor to low sec where full teams can play matchmaking in another queue. Randoms could still join, but they would know that there would be corps in there.

Is that a better solution?

No, it isn't a better solution, for the same reason you don't get any SP or ISK from corp v. corp matches currently. Two organized teams against one another would result in two very organized teams trading kills/revives in militia gear against one another until the timer runs out. It would be incredibly open to abuse, and absolutely would be abused the moment it's allowed.

And allowing random people to join is pointless, as nobody would ever voluntarily play against organized teams while being solo themselves and on a team of other solo players. Being redlined and farmed probably isn't high on the list of things people are liable to volunteer for.

Ultimately it's just a lot of crap. CCP isn't going to let you farm pubbies, and they aren't going to let you trade kills with friendly corps for SP and ISK.

Well, I presented a median solution.

On one hand, I have Mav saying "why do u care about SP" and on the other hand, a claim that a corp matchmaking shstem would promote boosting.

As I said before, I think my corpmates and I would rather play against organized opposition most of the time, and aboid high sec as much as possible. Making high sec the only place to earn SP is a poor design choice imo.

I just don't think I would find myself playing DUST much if I only ever earn SP in say, an 8 person swuad in a 64 player game.
Like it or not, I have to care about SP because of the huge advantages it gives. If I simple don't care about it, I will permanently be at a disadvantage.

So the question remains... How do we have organized teams play pub matchmaking against other teams, whilst still earning ISK and SP? All while avoiding pubstomping randoms?

I really think the ability to group up with more then 4 people might enhance the experience. You have to figure most corps would be grouping up so it would be like getting into a corp battle where the players actually get SP and ISK for the battle.

Most games I play are already redline games for the most part. The ability to play with all of your friends is the main reason I want larger squads.

The player base needs to be conditioned to join corporations and pub-stacking is the only way to make that possible tbh.

People should be able to run 16 man squads if they desire. I shouldn't have to play against clanmates in pub matches.

CCP should simply add a "mercenary" playlist like COD does so people that want to be randomly matched up can have an enjoyable experience.

Join public games for SP and ISK and recruits.

Join corp games for the challenges that are suitable for your skill as a player.

People who join public games with squads in high level gear with the intent of getting cheap kills are not worth the effort of spitting on. You do not build community, you do not encourage new players to stay, you do not encourage players to join your corp: you are bad people and serve as bad PR for the game. You are the cancer that kills the community from the inside.

If CCP gets the linkage right, Capsuleers will be pouring money into DUST514 in order to improve their space.

In the meantime, stop worrying so much about the SP needed for the next shiny thing, and focus on using your current shiny things as best you can. There is more player and team skill required in this game than SP with shiny things will compensate for.

Well, I presented a median solution.

So the question remains... How do we have organized teams play pub matchmaking against other teams, whilst still earning ISK and SP? All while avoiding pubstomping randoms?

The player base needs to be conditioned to join corporations and pub-stacking is the only way to make that possible tbh.

This is horseshit and you have no idea what you're talking about. Making new player experience in Dust consist of playing public matches where they get redlined and farmed by full corp teams repeatedly will do little more than drive people away from the game. Console FPS gamers have a ton of great titles to choose from, and they aren't going to put up with that kind of crap. They'll get farmed a few times, then delete the game and go play something that's actually fun. The notion that the response of new players would instead be to go and find a corp to play with is silly.

While you're correct, new comers should be driven towards corps but not the way proto wants it. The tutorial should highly stress the necessity of joining a group of players

Should we reduce fleet size to 4 in Eve as well as long as you're in high sec? This should keep industrial players feeling safe and playing the game. Should CCP have stopped Burn Jita? It would have probably saved them some industrial subscriptions. Maybe even a lot of them.


The squad caps largely miss the whole spirit of the sandbox, and actually don't keep new players playing the game. We've seen this tons of times, and (*GASP*) even with MAG and (*GASP*) BF3 on PS3 and (*GASP*) Killzone 3.

When imposing low caps on player groups in any capacity, all you're doing is ruining the enjoyment of the player corporations that drive your game forward. In fact, you're crippling them and crippling your capacity to move forward as a social game. Corp matches are all fine and good, but they're scheduled for the moment and also very quickly over. Being able to schedule corp matches consistently enough to keep your player base entertained while not scheduling so many that you're losing money on fizzles is nothing less than a ***** of a problem. Even if this equilibrium position eventually gets reached, it will result in a lower activity level and a higher burnt out rate for the guys actually organizing battles.


It seems forgotten that compared to a player base of even 10k concurrent users, the number of battles with full corp teams in a public match making setting is going to be low compared to the total number. It also seems forgotten that once there's a reason to save ISK, nobody in their right mind is going to go into high sec matches with all prototype gear. The risk just isn't worth the reward when a similar reward can be gotten with smaller risk.


Let's take a look at Planetside 2, a game many of the people reading this post have played and possibly enjoyed. There's no group limit in Planetside 2, but the game has been a huge free to play success. New players haven't suddenly left in droves after being beaten by huge outfits. Limiting the squads and platoons in PS2 to a particular size would be pointless, and in fact doing so would just be a disservice to those people who organize such large numbers of players.



If there isn't a function where any reasonably sized corporate group can press a button and be in a casual match quickly and without fuss, the corps of Dust 514 will atrophy and eventually the core audience of this game will leave.


Most of the counterarguments here have been given by representatives of smaller corporations who stand to gain in the short term from a limited group size. Seeing past that bias is important, because a huge swathe of the Dust player base is invested in playing with their friends and corp mates. Not against them, not in tiny groups, but with all the guys they've come to know and appreciate over a history of FPS gaming.

CCP should simply add a "mercenary" playlist like COD does so people that want to be randomly matched up can have an enjoyable experience.

I think one part of protoman's post got a bit overlooked. What is wrong with this idea?



EDIT: Mercenary playlist for those who don't know is a separate queue where groups cannot enter

Why can't I play with my all my friends. Earn SP and ISK. Have fun. And not have the pressure of having to win a corp match.

Why can't I play with my all my friends. Earn SP and ISK. Have fun. And not have the pressure of having to win a corp match.

MAG had something good, so we should avoid it? Hmmm.

You're super defensive, Mav. Maybe you should take a break from ranting incoherently, yeah?

You're super defensive, Mav. Maybe you should take a break from ranting incoherently, yeah?

I think he is right. He wrote it in harsh words though.

I'd like to add one more argument.

The current content in the beta is mostly content for randoms. The current corpVScorp battles mechanic looks like placeholder for me. I no doubt think it will be largely extended.

What was promised by CCP for corps is territory and resource warfare, cooperation with EVE universe, conquest game mode and a lot more. Leave instance matchmaking system for randoms, we won't have a lot (horde-style PvE, yes, but it isn't on horizon yet).

Why can't I play with my all my friends. Earn SP and ISK. Have fun. And not have the pressure of having to win a corp match.

I can't believe I'm saying this but I agree with Mavado, to a degree...
...

Exactly.

the game is big enough for both solo players and groups. if the matchmaking is worth anything they'll be pve and ques where randoms get matched against each other and one where groups do. if u want to plan a campaign to take sov u can just organize that yourself. i dont want to see 24 person groups matched vs randoms either but the solution is not 4 man groups. the game has to be bigger than that based on the size of eve battles.

I don't see the reason for corp contracts not giving rewards though. You don't make more money than you lose by killing expensive suits, how will you farm them? If they just gave the players rewards, it'd be a lot better.

Hello?

No, you didn't. You didn't present a solution, because there isn't a problem. If you want to fight in large, organized teams, you have corp battles which reward no ISK/SP beyond the contract terms to the winner. If you want to play with friends for ISK/SP, you can hop in a squad and queue for public games.



The question doesn't remain. The question was solved by CCP the moment they added in squads and squad-queuing for fights.

Join public games for SP and ISK and recruits.

Join corp games for the challenges that are suitable for your skill as a player.

People who join public games with squads in high level gear with the intent of getting cheap kills are not worth the effort of spitting on. You do not build community, you do not encourage new players to stay, you do not encourage players to join your corp: you are bad people and serve as bad PR for the game. You are the cancer that kills the community from the inside.

If CCP gets the linkage right, Capsuleers will be pouring money into DUST514 in order to improve their space.

In the meantime, stop worrying so much about the SP needed for the next shiny thing, and focus on using your current shiny things as best you can. There is more player and team skill required in this game than SP with shiny things will compensate for.

What I'd like to see is to have the games locked in relation to SP and have mass corp deploy only function on SP unlocked games. For example;

HiSec battles = 0.0 SP to 2.99M SP, no mass corp deploy but can deploy a corp squad, players have to be under the 2.99M SP cap. Anyone over 3M SP is locked out.

LowSec battles = 0.0 SP to 5.99M SP, mass corp deploy, below 3M SP corp players can deploy at their own peril. Anyone over 6M Sp is locked out.

NulSec battles = 0.0 SP to 6M+ SP, mass corp deploy, below 6M SP corp players can deploy at their own peril and friendly fire turned on.

I think one part of protoman's post got a bit overlooked. What is wrong with this idea?



EDIT: Mercenary playlist for those who don't know is a separate queue where groups cannot enter

This is the best solution I have seen yet tbh

seperating the playerbase for a niche game is the problem.

if this game turns out to be as successful as cod in terms of ppl playing it regularly then **** yea bring on the mercenary playlist because then u have the playerbase to justify seperating the community like cod does but i highly doubt dust will ever have that amount of ppl playing it

Should we reduce fleet size to 4 in Eve as well as long as you're in high sec? This should keep industrial players feeling safe and playing the game. Should CCP have stopped Burn Jita? It would have probably saved them some industrial subscriptions. Maybe even a lot of them.

When imposing low caps on player groups in any capacity, all you're doing is ruining the enjoyment of the player corporations that drive your game forward. In fact, you're crippling them and crippling your capacity to move forward as a social game.

Let's take a look at Planetside 2, a game many of the people reading this post have played and possibly enjoyed. There's no group limit in Planetside 2, but the game has been a huge free to play success. New players haven't suddenly left in droves after being beaten by huge outfits. Limiting the squads and platoons in PS2 to a particular size would be pointless, and in fact doing so would just be a disservice to those people who organize such large numbers of players.

separating like FacWar, null sec, PvE missions all will do when we get to see more of those features?

I see no problem with making groups vs groups and randoms vs randoms.