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Boss Dirge
Sanmatar Kelkoons Minmatar Republic
71
|
Posted - 2012.07.20 03:21:00 -
[61] - Quote
I suck pretty bad at Dust, I have fun so even though I die a lot, is there something I am missing? |
Corvus Ravensong
Skyel Industries Subspace Exploration Agency
179
|
Posted - 2012.07.20 03:33:00 -
[62] - Quote
Nope, you got the important part - the rest of these guys might have missed it though. |
JONLUK167
Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation
18
|
Posted - 2012.07.20 13:02:00 -
[63] - Quote
6thAD Lord Kermit wrote:JONLUK167 wrote: Yeah bud i do remember it took me years to get in to different types of ships but I stuck around, The difference is that not all will wait, I tried to get my friends to join me in EVE but when they saw how long it takes to get into those ships none stayed! MY son lasted one year and said im done hes on xbox at least 5 to 7 hours a day with his friends and they wont put up with waiting to fit into anything thats the problem CCP is going to run into with DUST these console guys want it NOW not years from NOW. Most of the responses that are in the forums now are from eve players, im waiting to here just from console players that have not played one day or even herd of eve to get there take, CCP maid this game to get them not us from EVE and by the way you should take a pole and see how many EVE players dont want this game to make it you may be shocked! This "instant gratification" you speak of is the bane of every society. Teaching our children patience and working toward a long term goal can help alleviate this undesirable behaviour. There might be quite a few EVE players that don't want this game. There are also quite a few who do. Regardless, I doubt CCP is going to scrap the game. So you might as well accept reality and live with it. I disagree totally with people saying this is not a console game. The writing is NOT "on the wall"! The game hasn't even gone live yet. SERIOUSLY?!? While I agree that the game could benifit from the added functionality that a true computer brings to the table, the PS3 is quite capable of handling what this game requires. Yes there have been thousands of keys handed out. And if you truly think about timezones and daily allowable play time in peoples schedules you would see that actually the total number of players has skyrocketed in the last 2 months (give or take). When I started beta you were lucky to see 100 people on any given server at any given time of day... Now you can regularly find 300-500 on some servers at any given time of the day. It is true that there will be a certiain amount of "player" attrition that this game will go through. Every game does. And quite frankly (no offense to them) those people who drop out for one reason or another; all the more power to them. Those that stay will find themselves a part of the first game of its genre and one that every game developer will be trying to copy. (Look up other upcoming games and see how many are copying CCP's ideas on MMOFPS or cross-game/platrform interlinks. World of Tanks/Planes and Battleships anyone?) Good ol fashioned FPS are cool and all, but they grow stale quickly with the same gameplay over and over. And they are a dime a dozen... How many CoD's are there now? How many Medal of Honor's? Personally I'm willing to give CCP the benifit of the doubt and see where this game is going before I condemn it. Those of you who really think this game is going nowhere, I wish you luck in your search for a better game. P.S. No I'm not a "fanboy"... I'm just far less pessimistic than the rest of you.
IVE waited for this game a long time i want it to make it and make it big, i fought with my boy on what game was going to be bigger HALO or DUST and he an avid HALO freak anlong with 100 of his friends and they wont bother even trying to give this game a chance thats the problem that CCP is going to have, and guys like you that put down console players are not good publicity for CCP. The money is in console games CCP knows this and wants into the muti billion $$ industry and as for the way i bring up my children one is off to college at the age of 17 and my other got to skip 8th grade and go on to 9th.
When guys like you say it should of been on the PC who the **** has the money to dish out for a PC that can handle these types of games and why would you when you can go and buy a PS3, XBOX, WII for$ 200 to$ 300 a good PC will cost you $1500 and up to play the games they put out today!! GET REAL
They need a better marketing strategy!!!!!! |
Garrett Blacknova
Codex Troopers
1849
|
Posted - 2012.07.20 13:21:00 -
[64] - Quote
jus nukem wrote:the typical console fps player, (which is the target audience of course) I'm pretty sure it's NOT, actually.
They're after the people who AREN'T sitting there waiting to pour everything into the next CoD or BF game, and instead want something NEW and DIFFERENT, but who play those games as placeholders while hoping for a change. |
jus nukem
19
|
Posted - 2012.07.20 14:07:00 -
[65] - Quote
Garrett Blacknova wrote:jus nukem wrote:the typical console fps player, (which is the target audience of course) I'm pretty sure it's NOT, actually. They're after the people who AREN'T sitting there waiting to pour everything into the next CoD or BF game, and instead want something NEW and DIFFERENT, but who play those games as placeholders while hoping for a change. While something "NEW" and "DIFFERENT" is always a good thing, the typical console player won't embrace the complexities that DUST 514 brings to the table. A large pool of console players who play shooters are strictly about k/d ratio n that is it. |
tribal wyvern
ZionTCD Legacy Rising
675
|
Posted - 2012.07.20 16:30:00 -
[66] - Quote
Enzo Entech wrote:So I have been enjoying the beta, and I love the potential DUST has to be a great experience, but it currently has one big problem that will hold it back.
People who start playing Dust (lets say a month) after launch don't have even a small chance when going up against someone who had been playing since launch. And from my own personal experience, I am never turned off from a multiplayer game faster than when other players are destroying me solely based on their equipment. New players will feel helpless and then quickly turn away.
I am not saying a new player should be able to easily take down someone who has been playing for months, but they should have a fighting chance.
Of course, Dust being what it is, it will be really hard to make that balance. That's the name of the game Bro. Its that way in eve......so its that way in dust too. And even if new people aren't skilled....... there are other ways to earn sp and isk in order to learn skills etc, like nanohives,revive,drop uplink, hacking turrets etc. You don't have to get kills to be a good player. Team mates appreciate support more than kills |
Sha Kharn Clone
Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS.
1087
|
Posted - 2012.07.20 16:55:00 -
[67] - Quote
I fell and hurt my knee on an ambush map so yea I'm with the OP on this one |
Garrett Blacknova
Codex Troopers
1849
|
Posted - 2012.07.20 19:38:00 -
[68] - Quote
jus nukem wrote:Garrett Blacknova wrote:jus nukem wrote:the typical console fps player, (which is the target audience of course) I'm pretty sure it's NOT, actually. They're after the people who AREN'T sitting there waiting to pour everything into the next CoD or BF game, and instead want something NEW and DIFFERENT, but who play those games as placeholders while hoping for a change. While something "NEW" and "DIFFERENT" is always a good thing, the typical console player won't embrace the complexities that DUST 514 brings to the table. A large pool of console players who play shooters are strictly about k/d ratio n that is it. A large pool of console players won't be interested.
Another, equally large pool of console players ARE interested. And we're also drawing a portion of the EVE crowd in from PC, along with a few of their friends who wouldn't NORMALLY be interested, but are willing to give it a look and help out their spacer friends from ground level. Having friends in a tie-in game like EVE is for DUST can be enough incentive for some people to stick with something that's a little off their usual preference.
One of my best friends can happily play a game with instant gratification for HOURS on end, but has no patience for games with long-running skill trees and things. I'm planning to suggest that he downloads the game and sets up several characters, then leaves it alone until he's built up a decent collection of SP from the passive gains so he can start off with a bit of an edge over other noobs. I suspect that if he gets to see immediate returns like he will with that SP headstart, he'll probably be able to get into the game easier than he would picking it up day one. |
JONLUK167
Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation
18
|
Posted - 2012.07.21 02:34:00 -
[69] - Quote
Garrett Blacknova wrote:jus nukem wrote:Garrett Blacknova wrote:jus nukem wrote:the typical console fps player, (which is the target audience of course) I'm pretty sure it's NOT, actually. They're after the people who AREN'T sitting there waiting to pour everything into the next CoD or BF game, and instead want something NEW and DIFFERENT, but who play those games as placeholders while hoping for a change. While something "NEW" and "DIFFERENT" is always a good thing, the typical console player won't embrace the complexities that DUST 514 brings to the table. A large pool of console players who play shooters are strictly about k/d ratio n that is it. A large pool of console players won't be interested. Another, equally large pool of console players ARE interested. And we're also drawing a portion of the EVE crowd in from PC, along with a few of their friends who wouldn't NORMALLY be interested, but are willing to give it a look and help out their spacer friends from ground level. Having friends in a tie-in game like EVE is for DUST can be enough incentive for some people to stick with something that's a little off their usual preference. One of my best friends can happily play a game with instant gratification for HOURS on end, but has no patience for games with long-running skill trees and things. I'm planning to suggest that he downloads the game and sets up several characters, then leaves it alone until he's built up a decent collection of SP from the passive gains so he can start off with a bit of an edge over other noobs. I suspect that if he gets to see immediate returns like he will with that SP headstart, he'll probably be able to get into the game easier than he would picking it up day one.
WOW dowload the game wait for a year to build up SP then come and play with me thats what your going with!
GET RID OF SP NOW BEFORE ITS TO LATE!! YOU MADE ARE CASE THANKS
|
Bones1182
Circle of Huskarl Minmatar Republic
86
|
Posted - 2012.07.21 02:57:00 -
[70] - Quote
^^^ Stop yelling at people, oh and good luck changing the developers minds on that. I feel fairly confident in saying SP is not going anywhere. Also maybe you can explain to me how it is really different the COD leveling because I play that as well and I always find my self being killed by max level players even when I get the first shot on them so??? |
|
Garrett Blacknova
Codex Troopers
1849
|
Posted - 2012.07.21 03:53:00 -
[71] - Quote
JONLUK167 wrote:WOW dowload the game wait for a year to build up SP then come and play with me thats what your going with!
GET RID OF SP NOW BEFORE ITS TO LATE!! YOU MADE ARE CASE THANKS I'm saying it's AN option, not the ONLY option.
You could also try to learn about something called "patience" - and a little bit of something else called "maturity" might help in New Eden as well (although rumours claim Goonswarm will value you more without that second part). If you're unsure what those things are (they're difficult concepts for many of my fellow console gamers), feel free to track down an interesting device known as a "dictionary" - and I hope your reading comprehension is at a decent level, because if not, DUST probably isn't for you anyway.
Calm down, learn English a little better ("you made are case" ... REALLY?), and try again when you can coherently present a rational argument, instead of babbling incoherent stream of consciousness poetry at people who are trying to have a conversation. Thanks. |
Bones1182
Circle of Huskarl Minmatar Republic
86
|
Posted - 2012.07.21 04:12:00 -
[72] - Quote
^^^ Like
|
Templar Two
Villore Sec Ops Gallente Federation
459
|
Posted - 2012.07.21 07:22:00 -
[73] - Quote
Garrett Blacknova wrote: Nobody said a new player HAS to fight in HighSec. You can go out into the less-regulated areas if you WANT to die horribly against over-geared enemies, if you really want to.
So you can play in low/null-sec but then you are naturally disadvantaged: worst gear, not enough SP, nobody wants you because you don't have a stat next to you name, etc... This is just like in RPG where player at lvl 3 character can't compete with players at level 30. In FPS if you get you ass kicked is because you are not good enough but not because the structure of the game says so: I can jump in BF 3 hardcore mode, or Arma, an do well with the basic SR/AR/SMG because I have the right skills not because I have the right SP. RPG freedom is not FPS freedom!
Plus CCP has devised a PVE system exactly because it doesn't expect you to jump in null-sec immediately: they want us to first PVE then to PVP just like RPG. They built the game on the idea that there must be ranks in Dust and danger zones like RPG.
And the game's not trying to be a typical FPS. Is it first-person? Yes. Do you shoot people? Yes. Does that mean it's impossible, by definition, for it to NOT be FPS? Yes. Stop saying it's anti-FPS when it's only anti-convention. And welcome to New Eden.
First the important thing is how you shoot people. Second: FPS is a genre built with certain characteristic so you can't alter them too much and expect to work.
Although, in spite of what I just said, I think they need to scale back the level of "upgrade-ness" from one suit to the next. Instead of having a sequential system where every suit has a different price and is a direct upgrade from the previous, they need to add "side-grades" where one suit has a larger weapon slot, and another has more armour, and a third suit could have an extra module slot.
Militia suits in each class could have baseline stats for everything, then there could be 3 - 5 versions of the standard suit, one of which is an "all-rounder" with small upgrades to several aspects. The others would be more specialised to fine-tune them for a specific playstyle. This all-rounder suit could then be used as the baseline for an equivalent upgrade going to Advanced, then the same pattern will follow for Prototype suits. You still get a wide variety of different gear to save up and buy, but you'll be using it VERY differently.
This happens is because Dust 514 uses another RPG element: rarity. Militia = CommonAdvanced = Rare. Prototype = Ultra Rare.
6thAD Lord Kermit wrote: This "instant gratification" you speak of is the bane of every society. Teaching our children patience and working toward a long term goal can help alleviate this undesirable behaviour. There might be quite a few EVE players that don't want this game. There are also quite a few who do. Regardless, I doubt CCP is going to scrap the game. So you might as well accept reality and live with it.
You mistake instant gratification with learning curve: Instant gratification is you having fun without having to learn much. All games have learning curve but undeniably FPS are very immediate: pick, point, shoot. it takes time to be good in every VG but here nobody nobody spoke about getting good!
I disagree totally with people saying this is not a console game. The writing is NOT "on the wall"! The game hasn't even gone live yet. SERIOUSLY?!? While I agree that the game could benifit from the added functionality that a true computer brings to the table, the PS3 is quite capable of handling what this game requires. Yes there have been thousands of keys handed out. And if you truly think about timezones and daily allowable play time in peoples schedules you would see that actually the total number of players has skyrocketed in the last 2 months (give or take). When I started beta you were lucky to see 100 people on any given server at any given time of day... Now you can regularly find 300-500 on some servers at any given time of the day.
I agree but the more I see Dut 514 the more I see a PC mentality driving this project. The fact that CCP introduced MKB is a undeniable proof that they want to cater to PC players.
It is true that there will be a certiain amount of "player" attrition that this game will go through. Every game does. And quite frankly (no offense to them) those people who drop out for one reason or another; all the more power to them. Those that stay will find themselves a part of the first game of its genre and one that every game developer will be trying to copy. (Look up other upcoming games and see how many are copying CCP's ideas on MMOFPS or cross-game/platrform interlinks. World of Tanks/Planes and Battleships anyone?) Good ol fashioned FPS are cool and all, but they grow stale quickly with the same gameplay over and over. And they are a dime a dozen... How many CoD's are there now? How many Medal of Honor's? Personally I'm willing to give CCP the benifit of the doubt and see where this game is going before I condemn it.
No CCP din't come out with anything new: EVE integration is unique but the rests (gameplay, RPG elements, the MMO side) is not new. Also it doesn't matter if Dust 514 it's the first of its kind: that won't matter if it's not good enough. Bungie is making a FPS MMO and they want it to be WoW in space: if they do better why should I stick with Dust 514? For the integration with EVE? For a inferior FPS experience?
Those of you who really think this game is going nowhere, I wish you luck in your search for a better game. P.S. No I'm not a "fanboy"... I'm just far less pessimistic than the rest of you.
As I said Bungie is making a FPS MMO and Sony now owes Gaikai so PlanetSide 2 can arrive on PS4 thanks to cloud gaming. The search for better games will end soon.
|
JONLUK167
Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation
18
|
Posted - 2012.07.21 22:28:00 -
[74] - Quote
#71 Posted: 2012.07.21 03:53 | Report Like 1 JONLUK167 wrote:WOW dowload the game wait for a year to build up SP then come and play with me thats what your going with!
GET RID OF SP NOW BEFORE ITS TO LATE!! YOU MADE ARE CASE THANKS
I'm saying it's AN option, not the ONLY option.
You could also try to learn about something called "patience" - and a little bit of something else called "maturity" might help in New Eden as well (although rumours claim Goonswarm will value you more without that second part). If you're unsure what those things are (they're difficult concepts for many of my fellow console gamers), feel free to track down an interesting device known as a "dictionary" - and I hope your reading comprehension is at a decent level, because if not, DUST probably isn't for you anyway.
Calm down, learn English a little better ("you made are case" ... REALLY?), and try again when you can coherently present a rational argument, instead of babbling incoherent stream of consciousness poetry at people who are trying to have a conversation. Thanks.
I must first apologize to those of you who thought I was yelling. I do have a bad habit of leaving the caps on. At times it is just because I am trying to make a quick comment/point. I am also aware of my grammar error. I just didn't realize that someone with such "maturity" and educational standards would have the time to sit around and read/respond to these message boards. I will be sure to reread my posts and not be so quick to post my comments in the future. I am patient. I have been very patient. My "rational argument" is actually for those people who haven't been on Eve for years. I have spoken to several other gamers, trying to convince them to come try Dust. Their complaints are all the same. The time they have to invest is not something they are looking to do. The ignorant comments from the PC players about the console players are ridiculous. For a game to truly be as big as they want it to be, they must be able to target many people. I play both PC and console games. I enjoy both. I also enjoy strategy games. Yes, games that require thought. I have been on Eve for over six years. Yes, it's true, my reading comprehension has allowed me to play with the intellectuals for that long. I surely hope you are not a representative of CCP, because with the disrespectual way you talk to veteran Eve players, you may just cost them a few accounts. To insult the console players is not the way to bring them in to play the game. Obviously you feel that your intellect is far above the rest, I hope you are able to understand my English this time around. I will continue to work on my poetry but in the meantime, please feel free to spell/grammar check me. |
Mr TamiyaCowboy
Condotta Rouvenor Gallente Federation
121
|
Posted - 2012.07.21 22:57:00 -
[75] - Quote
Starting to change my mind now.
5 day old char 2m sp (new char)
20 kills
260+ deaths
now please tell me something is not right. i mean for sure its beta but, weapons and stuff way OVERPOWERED.
for one CCP should have gave two options mouse/keyboard and/or controller. the controllers system is total pony and trap. The hit system is borked. i mean killing through a wall, splash damage like you been hit by a titan.
for one Dust will not be a most played game for me. it will be something that gathers cobwebs on my HDD, and from time to time i would log in to spend those passive SP you get. camping is still rife, it needs fixing NOW ccp not when it goes live public. weapons need balancing NOW ccp not when it goes live public.
becoming more disheartened each day i play dust. mo s*** mo problems mo stress. gave my godson a quick peek , he loved mw3 and likes but would rather play fifa with me. and tbh i enjoyed that single game of fifa more than the two weekends i have been playing dust.
when i see it going live i can see myself trying to gain a refund for the merc pack i purchased, kinda wasteful if i will only play dust now and again ( and just to log in and set skills/sp).
so to sum it up CCP, dust i think is just for the playstation generation that want a quick fix not a long term marriage. you kind of cheated to CCP i expected a gfx engine made by you, unreal is old ( unrealengine 4 out very soon) why choose something so outdated graphics wise. yes its beta but i expected to see small glances of the eye candy we know CCP can give us. |
Garrett Blacknova
Codex Troopers
1849
|
Posted - 2012.07.21 23:01:00 -
[76] - Quote
Templar Two wrote:So you can play in low/null-sec but then you are naturally disadvantaged: worst gear, not enough SP, nobody wants you because you don't have a stat next to you name, etc... This is just like in RPG where player at lvl 3 character can't compete with players at level 30. In FPS if you get you ass kicked is because you are not good enough but not because the structure of the game says so: I can jump in BF 3 hardcore mode, or Arma, an do well with the basic SR/AR/SMG because I have the right skills not because I have the right SP. RPG freedom is not FPS freedom!
Plus CCP has devised a PVE system exactly because it doesn't expect you to jump in null-sec immediately: they want us to first PVE then to PVP just like RPG. They built the game on the idea that there must be ranks in Dust and danger zones like RPG. Yes. This is a game with RPG and FPS elements. That's the POINT. And yes, you CAN just jump in and play in battles that are, to some degree "fair" on you - in HighSec. If you're willing to take up the challenge of fighting high-tier opponents, you can go to LowSec or NullSec for that, but if you're under-geared, there's a disadvantage involved in doing so.
Quote:First the important thing is how you shoot people. Second: FPS is a genre built with certain characteristic so you can't alter them too much and expect to work. FPS literally means First-Person Shooter. This game has shooting, and is first person. Anything beyond that is PERSONAL PREFERENCE. Deus Ex didn't fit the usual mold, and was AMAZING. Human Revolution tried too hard to be a modern FPS and not hard enough to be a Deus Ex game, and was only decent. Plenty of other games have done things that are outside of the normal rules that their genre follows (including FPS games), and succeeded.
Quote:This happens is because Dust 514 uses another RPG element: rarity. Militia = CommonAdvanced = Rare. Prototype = Ultra Rare. That should be common, UNCOMMON, and rare, but I see your point.
I also don't see the relevance. DUST's gear SHOULD be less tiered than it is, BUT IT SHOULD STILL BE TIERED. Expensive gear = advantage. But the advantage, at the moment, is often larger than it should be.
But even while saying that (again), there's another point I should make. If you SPECIALISE in a certain aspect early on, you can build up a reasonable amount of skills and buy some decent gear for a particular role VERY EARLY ON. It's only when you're moving into being good at a little of everything that it becomes more difficult. |
Garrett Blacknova
Codex Troopers
1849
|
Posted - 2012.07.21 23:09:00 -
[77] - Quote
JONLUK167 wrote:I must first apologize to those of you who thought I was yelling. I do have a bad habit of leaving the caps on. At times it is just because I am trying to make a quick comment/point. I am also aware of my grammar error. I just didn't realize that someone with such "maturity" and educational standards would have the time to sit around and read/respond to these message boards. I will be sure to reread my posts and not be so quick to post my comments in the future. I am patient. I have been very patient. My "rational argument" is actually for those people who haven't been on Eve for years. I have spoken to several other gamers, trying to convince them to come try Dust. Their complaints are all the same. The time they have to invest is not something they are looking to do. The ignorant comments from the PC players about the console players are ridiculous. For a game to truly be as big as they want it to be, they must be able to target many people. I play both PC and console games. I enjoy both. I also enjoy strategy games. Yes, games that require thought. I have been on Eve for over six years. Yes, it's true, my reading comprehension has allowed me to play with the intellectuals for that long. I surely hope you are not a representative of CCP, because with the disrespectual way you talk to veteran Eve players, you may just cost them a few accounts. To insult the console players is not the way to bring them in to play the game. Obviously you feel that your intellect is far above the rest, I hope you are able to understand my English this time around. I will continue to work on my poetry but in the meantime, please feel free to spell/grammar check me. I'm not a CCP employee.
I've never said anything to suggest I am.
I've said in multiple threads on this forum that I don't even PLAY EVE.
I play PC and console games, but I don't have an up-to-date PC, so I don't play modern PC games except when visiting friends. I've owned a PS3 since they were first released.
I'm sorry for having a job where I can work from home, so I have more free time to post on forums and enjoy myself. I'll try hard to be a "normal" intelligent person next time. (don't worry, I won't really)
And I have plenty of friends who are console gamers too, and many of them are, like I am, EXCITED about a game which encourages a real investment in your character.
I'm not arguing that the balance between high-tier gear and cheap junk is correct. It's a little too extreme for a console game. I'm not arguing that we should expect every new player to show up and just deal with being slaughtered with minimal returns for ages. But as people have mentioned in the past, there WILL be places where low-tier players will be relatively (but not entirely) safe from predation by the high-tier players with expensive kit. There will be ways that those new people will be able to avoid getting stomped in unfair fights while they get a few skills built up. And more importantly, getting to a DECENT level (not top-tier) takes VERY LITTLE TIME. Getting the high-tier equipment is a HUGE deal. Getting mid-tier equipment is only a minor consideration, as long as you're willing to SPECIALISE in a particular playstyle. |
Silax Minour
Doomheim
29
|
Posted - 2012.07.22 03:39:00 -
[78] - Quote
Shep Lando wrote:[quote=jus nukem]
I think all this debate certainly highlights a need for some kind of "safety net" for new players. This is a free game that can easily be deleted off the PS3 at no consequence to the player, so it really needs to grab you by the 2nd or 3rd match. Getting hosed by higher level players will not be fun and will result in "Well, this game sucks....DELETE" a lot of the time. CCP has their work cut out for them.
And to this I say 'GOOD!' Not EVERY game should be played by all gamers! I am an Ex EVE player (PC died, no loot to rebuild) that all but **** myself when I heard about DUST a year or so ago. I am going to ROCK DUST when it releases!
And, I might be wrong, but I was under the impression that all the Beta Characters are going to be wiped when the gold version releases, i.e. we will ALL be back to sqaure one with our characters. IF that is the case, I do hope that CCP hooks up us Beta Testers with SOMETHING! Maybe some extra BPO's or maybe lets us keep a percentage of the SP we have earned? I assume this because of the disclaimer when I got the Merc Pack saying that I would have ALL my AUR refunded... |
Garrett Blacknova
Codex Troopers
1849
|
Posted - 2012.07.22 05:14:00 -
[79] - Quote
Silax Minour wrote:And, I might be wrong, but I was under the impression that all the Beta Characters are going to be wiped when the gold version releases, i.e. we will ALL be back to sqaure one with our characters. IF that is the case, I do hope that CCP hooks up us Beta Testers with SOMETHING! Maybe some extra BPO's or maybe lets us keep a percentage of the SP we have earned? I assume this because of the disclaimer when I got the Merc Pack saying that I would have ALL my AUR refunded... Pre-release wipe - some people have said (I haven't seen a confirmed source personally) that we'll get about a week after the wipe before the actual release. But in saying that, keep in mind we're currently earning SP at 4x the intended rate.
And with that wipe, ALL Merc Pack gear will be reset. Any items you bought with AUR will be deleted, and all AUR you bought (either through the Merc Pack or other means) will be refunded.
Also, the devs are tracking player activity, and each "event" weekend, players who were active in the beta unlock a new special item, which will presumably carry over to the full version. Last week's bonus was a Logistics Dropsuit, I forget what the previous event weekend's reward had been, but I'm pretty sure it's another Dropsuit. When the next build shows up, those items will be appearing in our inventories for us. |
Mr TamiyaCowboy
Condotta Rouvenor Gallente Federation
121
|
Posted - 2012.07.22 12:41:00 -
[80] - Quote
Garrett Blacknova wrote:Silax Minour wrote:And, I might be wrong, but I was under the impression that all the Beta Characters are going to be wiped when the gold version releases, i.e. we will ALL be back to sqaure one with our characters. IF that is the case, I do hope that CCP hooks up us Beta Testers with SOMETHING! Maybe some extra BPO's or maybe lets us keep a percentage of the SP we have earned? I assume this because of the disclaimer when I got the Merc Pack saying that I would have ALL my AUR refunded... Pre-release wipe - some people have said (I haven't seen a confirmed source personally) that we'll get about a week after the wipe before the actual release. But in saying that, keep in mind we're currently earning SP at 4x the intended rate. .
your kidding us right 4x intended.
going to be very brutal here, if that sp gain is not shifted higher, people will not play dust. hell i am very a tuned to the skilling here, but even i am struggling to gain sp . my max ever was 20,000 my reaction " omfg its mah birthdayz ?" or ccp done a booboo. now its barely 8,000sp max. no wonder the camping is rife, its not KB hoe's, its a flawed game mechanic to gain SP on a higher level that others !! hoe a swarm launcher camp a spawn point and woot your into a larger SP gain
boosters for arum to speed up the SP gain, NO if is just arum it is unfair. those boosters should also be purchased with isk, that includes that 30 DAY BOOSTER if need be CCP needs to bring in Learning skills to dust, so that sp gain can be boosted alot. the skill tree works for eve it is a very long term game, what works in eve sometimes does not work in other games. |
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JONLUK167
Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation
18
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Posted - 2012.07.22 12:47:00 -
[81] - Quote
Mr TamiyaCowboy wrote:Garrett Blacknova wrote:Silax Minour wrote:And, I might be wrong, but I was under the impression that all the Beta Characters are going to be wiped when the gold version releases, i.e. we will ALL be back to sqaure one with our characters. IF that is the case, I do hope that CCP hooks up us Beta Testers with SOMETHING! Maybe some extra BPO's or maybe lets us keep a percentage of the SP we have earned? I assume this because of the disclaimer when I got the Merc Pack saying that I would have ALL my AUR refunded... Pre-release wipe - some people have said (I haven't seen a confirmed source personally) that we'll get about a week after the wipe before the actual release. But in saying that, keep in mind we're currently earning SP at 4x the intended rate. . your kidding us right 4x intended. going to be very brutal here, if that sp gain is not shifted higher, people will not play dust. hell i am very a tuned to the skilling here, but even i am struggling to gain sp . my max ever was 20,000 my reaction " omfg its mah birthdayz ?" or ccp done a booboo. now its barely 8,000sp max. no wonder the camping is rife, its not KB hoe's, its a flawed game mechanic to gain SP on a higher level that others !!boosters for arum to speed up the SP gain, NO if is just arum it is unfair. those boosters should also be purchased with isk if need be CCP needs to bring in Learning skills to dust, so that sp gain can be boosted alot. the skill tree works for eve it is a very long term game, what works in eve sometimes does not work in other games.
Thank you bud this guy just dosent get it, when the sp drops to 10,000 per game how long will it take to reach level 5 on some of the skill wich need close to 1mill to complete! Right now Im getting from 60,000 to 100,000 and some times alot more. |
Templar Two
Villore Sec Ops Gallente Federation
459
|
Posted - 2012.07.22 14:02:00 -
[82] - Quote
Garrett Blacknova wrote: Yes. This is a game with RPG and FPS elements. That's the POINT. And yes, you CAN just jump in and play in battles that are, to some degree "fair" on you - in HighSec. If you're willing to take up the challenge of fighting high-tier opponents, you can go to LowSec or NullSec for that, but if you're under-geared, there's a disadvantage involved in doing so.
PlanetSide 2 has also RPG element and, hey, NO MATCHMAKING: you jump in and have 3 continents (64km wide each) and can have fun 24/7 with any kind of player.
FPS literally means First-Person Shooter. This game has shooting, and is first person. Anything beyond that is PERSONAL PREFERENCE. Deus Ex didn't fit the usual mold, and was AMAZING. Human Revolution tried too hard to be a modern FPS and not hard enough to be a Deus Ex game, and was only decent. Plenty of other games have done things that are outside of the normal rules that their genre follows (including FPS games), and succeeded.
When I said "how you shoot people" I was talking about performance & video quality in FPS.
I will be more precise next time. Also I KNOW what FPS means but if you have a tag slapped next to you name it doesn't mean you are worthy of it!
I also don't see the relevance. DUST's gear SHOULD be less tiered than it is, BUT IT SHOULD STILL BE TIERED. Expensive gear = advantage. But the advantage, at the moment, is often larger than it should be.
First this "expensive grear = advantage" is a CCP mentality...a RPG mentality.
In many FPS you unlock more gear but not necessarily that gear gives you an advantage. I can unlock a SMG with higher fire rate but that has less damage: no advantage just balance! When you loose something to get something there can't be an advantage: tradeoff are the way to go in FPS not scaling gear as in RPG! Really giving advantages from gear is wrong in FPS: this is how overpowered weapons come to life and this is how you unbalance/break a FPS!
But even while saying that (again), there's another point I should make. If you SPECIALISE in a certain aspect early on, you can build up a reasonable amount of skills and buy some decent gear for a particular role VERY EARLY ON. It's only when you're moving into being good at a little of everything that it becomes more difficult
You cant make "difficult" for the player to achieve variety in a FPS: it should take more time to unlock everything (this happens already in a every FPS) but it should not be "difficult".
CCP said specialization is the key of Dust 514; they said it clearly many times that they expect you to specialize "like in real life"...but this isn't real life this is a VIDEO GAME and NOBODY plays VG to have the limitations of real life. Really CCP want us to do/be 1-2 thing only: to choose a role and stick to it (They don't even give you all options at day one). People get bored by repetition in FPS when they can be many classes and have hundreds of different weapons and in Dust we are supposed to be 1 class or have stick around 7 YEARS to be able to have total variety! Why do you think people want new things from FPS: because variety is far more appealing! In FPS forcing players to play as 1 thing and one thing only for many years = stagnation. Hell in VG doing/being only 1 thing is stagnation!
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Mobius Wyvern
BetaMax.
1216
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Posted - 2012.07.22 14:28:00 -
[83] - Quote
Templar Two wrote:Garrett Blacknova wrote: Yes. This is a game with RPG and FPS elements. That's the POINT. And yes, you CAN just jump in and play in battles that are, to some degree "fair" on you - in HighSec. If you're willing to take up the challenge of fighting high-tier opponents, you can go to LowSec or NullSec for that, but if you're under-geared, there's a disadvantage involved in doing so.
PlanetSide 2 has also RPG element and, hey, NO MATCHMAKING: you jump in and have 3 continents (64km wide each) and can have fun 24/7 with any kind of player, just like you do in any FPS.
FPS literally means First-Person Shooter. This game has shooting, and is first person. Anything beyond that is PERSONAL PREFERENCE. Deus Ex didn't fit the usual mold, and was AMAZING. Human Revolution tried too hard to be a modern FPS and not hard enough to be a Deus Ex game, and was only decent. Plenty of other games have done things that are outside of the normal rules that their genre follows (including FPS games), and succeeded.
When I said "how you shoot people" I was talking about performance & video quality in FPS.
I will be more precise next time. Also I KNOW what FPS means but if you have a tag slapped next to you name it doesn't mean you are worthy of it!
I also don't see the relevance. DUST's gear SHOULD be less tiered than it is, BUT IT SHOULD STILL BE TIERED. Expensive gear = advantage. But the advantage, at the moment, is often larger than it should be.
First this "expensive grear = advantage" is a CCP mentality...a RPG mentality.
In many FPS you unlock more gear but not necessarily that gear gives you an advantage. I can unlock a SMG with higher fire rate but that has less damage: no advantage just balance! When you loose something to get something there can't be an advantage: tradeoff are the way to go in FPS not scaling gear as in RPG! Really giving advantages from gear is wrong in FPS: this is how overpowered weapons come to life and this is how you unbalance/break a FPS!
But even while saying that (again), there's another point I should make. If you SPECIALISE in a certain aspect early on, you can build up a reasonable amount of skills and buy some decent gear for a particular role VERY EARLY ON. It's only when you're moving into being good at a little of everything that it becomes more difficult
You cant make "difficult" for the player to achieve variety in a FPS: it should take more time to unlock everything (this happens already in a every FPS) but it should not be "difficult".
CCP said specialization is the key of Dust 514; they said it clearly many times that they expect you to specialize "like in real life"...but this isn't real life this is a VIDEO GAME and NOBODY plays VG to have the limitations of real life. Really CCP want us to do/be 1-2 thing only: to choose a role and stick to it (They don't even give you all options at day one). People get bored by repetition in FPS when they can be many classes and have hundreds of different weapons and in Dust we are supposed to be 1 class or have stick around 7 YEARS to be able to have total variety! Why do you think people want new things from FPS: because variety is far more appealing then specialization! In FPS specialization = stagnation. Hell in VG doing/being only 1 thing is stagnation!
You do realize that Planetside 2 uses a certification system that allows you to unlock the ability to use equipment and vehicles, with a focus on specialization, right? So you say that forcing specialization is bad, yet use Planetside 2 as an example of a better MMOFPS in the same argument. Cool story, bro. |
Templar Two
Villore Sec Ops Gallente Federation
459
|
Posted - 2012.07.22 17:17:00 -
[84] - Quote
Clearly I miss-expressed myself: now it' much more clear. Plus this:
SOE says that it will take 3 years of dedication to unlock everything in PS 2. Asking 3 years of dedication to unlock everything is above the standard of FPS but is a pretty reasonable since the lifetime of a FPS nowadays is 2-3 years...nothing that a normal FPS player isn't willing to do. This means that in PS 2 in 18 months you have maxed half of the 6 classes available; FPS have 4 classes nowadays so it's not out of proportion to ask 18 months for 3 classes. BF 3 with DLC is giving people things to unlock for over a period of 18 months: 18 moths to unlock everything for 4 classes. Also in PS 2 you can perfectly be a jack of all trades if you want, it won't be "difficult" to be good in many things because, when maxed out, the difference between a specialized player and a not specialized one is just 15-20% and there are tradeoffs for everything...now in Dust if I am specialized I can get 25% more DMG/HP for free + another 25-30% from gear. |
jus nukem
19
|
Posted - 2012.07.23 08:57:00 -
[85] - Quote
Garrett Blacknova wrote:jus nukem wrote:Garrett Blacknova wrote:jus nukem wrote:the typical console fps player, (which is the target audience of course) I'm pretty sure it's NOT, actually. They're after the people who AREN'T sitting there waiting to pour everything into the next CoD or BF game, and instead want something NEW and DIFFERENT, but who play those games as placeholders while hoping for a change. While something "NEW" and "DIFFERENT" is always a good thing, the typical console player won't embrace the complexities that DUST 514 brings to the table. A large pool of console players who play shooters are strictly about k/d ratio n that is it. A large pool of console players won't be interested. Another, equally large pool of console players ARE interested. And we're also drawing a portion of the EVE crowd in from PC, along with a few of their friends who wouldn't NORMALLY be interested, but are willing to give it a look and help out their spacer friends from ground level. Having friends in a tie-in game like EVE is for DUST can be enough incentive for some people to stick with something that's a little off their usual preference. One of my best friends can happily play a game with instant gratification for HOURS on end, but has no patience for games with long-running skill trees and things. I'm planning to suggest that he downloads the game and sets up several characters, then leaves it alone until he's built up a decent collection of SP from the passive gains so he can start off with a bit of an edge over other noobs. I suspect that if he gets to see immediate returns like he will with that SP headstart, he'll probably be able to get into the game easier than he would picking it up day one. According to the beta player counts... there isn't a whole lot of interest from that "equally large pool of console players" you speak of either |
Rasatsu
Much Crying Old Experts
437
|
Posted - 2012.07.23 09:08:00 -
[86] - Quote
Everyone has been saying that EVE was dying since beta, that it is just a niche game for special nerds and will gradually decline due to the large number of new players quitting.
Yet that didn't happen. |
Mavado V Noriega
SyNergy Gaming
2283
|
Posted - 2012.07.23 11:18:00 -
[87] - Quote
really wish CCP would just come out and announce their plans for this already cuz it gets annoyin at times to keep seeing these threads.
Gear cost will be ramped up ALOT OP so that will help prevent ppl from stomping around hisec pub matches with proto gear also im sure there will be some sort of balance in hisec as corps that are funded by EVE alliances would still be able to fund their proto fetish in hisec
also the game should encourage vets to keep goin deeper and not just stick to hisec so i see alot of corp players moving to FW and 0.0 when its out
if a new players comes in and jumps straight into FW and 0.0 without getting some skills 1st then thats his fault and not the game. |
Templar Two
Villore Sec Ops Gallente Federation
459
|
Posted - 2012.07.23 16:50:00 -
[88] - Quote
So discriminating players because they don't have the right SP & gear is fine in FPS! If a player thinks that in FPS he can be good "armed" only with his thumbs and reflexes and that he doesn't need SP or better gear then he is wrong? |
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