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Bzeer
MG GROUP
41
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Posted - 2012.07.14 19:10:00 -
[91] - Quote
Kharga Lum wrote:I drive a Sagaris but since my Engineering skills don't grant their proper bonus I can hardly fit it. I have 1 empty mid slot and 3 Type-G Powergrids in the low just to fit the guns. If anything looks at me side ways my shy tank turns red and catches fire. I've only got 5305 shield hp. Perhaps it's my install of Dust that's an issue but I've noticed any skill that grants a bonus per level isn't working, for me at least.
that is a lot of ehp, actually, working alone, I would have to upgrade my AV grenades AGAIN, be VERY SNEAKY, wait for you to fall into a predictiable movement pattern, or for you to stay put somewhere, and USE ALL 3 to score that kill. ... o-0 oh well, it's definitely worth it. |
Kharga Lum
Seraphim Initiative.
CRONOS.
33
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Posted - 2012.07.14 20:37:00 -
[92] - Quote
While 5k hp might sound like a lot it's still on 3-4 shots from a forge fun, which takes less SP to get then a marauder. Also a heavy with a forge gun renders at a shorter distance then a tank. So the Forge gunner will see me well before I see them. |
Utrigard
Zumari Force Projection
Caldari State
2
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Posted - 2012.07.14 22:42:00 -
[93] - Quote
The Sagaris is here to stay for this build, until CCP changes it. The availability of vehicles right now is purely to see how the mechanics function when used on large scales.
What sucks is that some people figured out how to spec themselves and their fittings so that the Sagaris is a rolling, nigh-invincible death machine that can only be destroyed if other players have power-specced into high-tier anti tank fittings.
If it wasn't the Sagaris, it would be something else. It's not going to be like this for the final release. Right now all we can do is put up with it.
If it's really that frustrating, go jump into an ambush game instead of skirmish. I know, it's a lot less fun for some and the rewards are hardly comparable. But at least the Sagaris (likely) won't be there. |
Cless Vallein
Teknomen
37
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Posted - 2012.07.14 23:01:00 -
[94] - Quote
took out a sagaris with an assault forge gun today and got a triple kill. Felt vindicated at last. Also kept peppering another one at a distance. He kept running away until another guy snuck around and got him. They can seem OP but with some coordination and some forge guns, everything's good |
Abron Garr
Amarr Templars
Amarr Empire
256
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Posted - 2012.07.15 00:14:00 -
[95] - Quote
Utrigard wrote:The Sagaris is here to stay for this build, until CCP changes it. The availability of vehicles right now is purely to see how the mechanics function when used on large scales.
What sucks is that some people figured out how to spec themselves and their fittings so that the Sagaris is a rolling, nigh-invincible death machine that can only be destroyed if other players have power-specced into high-tier anti tank fittings.
If it wasn't the Sagaris, it would be something else. It's not going to be like this for the final release. Right now all we can do is put up with it.
If it's really that frustrating, go jump into an ambush game instead of skirmish. I know, it's a lot less fun for some and the rewards are hardly comparable. But at least the Sagaris (likely) won't be there.
Oh it is. You can usually avoid most of the vehicles by fighting indoors but then it becomes a Mexican standoff with Red and Blue on either side of the facility. The dropship missile spam is getting annoying too. |
Iron Wolf Saber
BetaMax.
2867
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Posted - 2012.07.15 00:16:00 -
[96] - Quote
First off the sagaris is fine currently in performance.
What isnt fine is the total lack of electronic warfare.
How other vehicles have no per level bonus.
Its current price tag.
Sagaris should be the 1.2 million base at least making each fit 2 million a pop to replace. And in the match I kill just as much as a sagaris and damage I cause I only net about 400k and losing multiple sagaris in any battle will hurt the wallet significantly.
And before you go crying about me being a pilot of a sagaris Ill tell you thats a complete false hood. Im a gallente dropship pilot and I got about 8 sagaris kills with the drop ship and 3 suryas.
Next off if you think that capsuleers do not care what you lose on the field you are dead wrong. They will look up your combat records and if they see that your tank is constantly taken out by foot mobile milita instead of other murader tanks they will drop your contracts in a heart beat and even fire you or black list you. |
Kharga Lum
Seraphim Initiative.
CRONOS.
33
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Posted - 2012.07.15 13:57:00 -
[97] - Quote
A Sagaris is easier to kill then you think. A skilled swarm launcher or forge gun will kill a Marauder with little trouble from a distance or while it's distracted shooting another tank or installation.
...or if it's gunners don't know how to prioritize targets you can walk up to the tank a punch it to death. |
Kharga Lum
Seraphim Initiative.
CRONOS.
33
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Posted - 2012.07.15 16:30:00 -
[98] - Quote
With the fitting problems on the Sagaris and the lack of armor rep I will be going Gal tank for sure next time. |
Sylwester Dziewiecki
Doomheim
83
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Posted - 2012.07.15 16:52:00 -
[99] - Quote
Jack McReady wrote:Noc Tempre wrote:Kyy Seiska wrote:Rhadiem wrote:If you don't have Prototype Swarm Launcher or Prototype Forge gun trained you really shouldn't be making or posting complaints about Marauder tanks. Someone's invested millions into their fit, put down your AR and train an AV solution to an appropriate level. I've killed several and only have the upgraded SL. Prototype swarm launcher shoots 2 more missiles than the normal one, and one more than the tier-2 one. This is not a lot when you consider one missile (if it hits) deals only 350 damage. Not to mention how the weapon actually takes some time to load like the forge gun. Now you are at the point of the problem, currently no matter how much ISK or SP you spend on anti-vehicle equipment you don't get such super weapons comparable to these marauders. Fact: Prototype forge gun does more per shot and dps at max skills than a marauder. we know that forge guns are too stronk :) when the splash damage can one shot scout suits then something is really wrong.
Proto AFG users are not able to shoot every scout on alfa splash - those with proto suit and some shield extenders don't die after first splash. |
Jack McReady
46
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Posted - 2012.07.15 18:28:00 -
[100] - Quote
ironically tanks are able to dodge swarm missiles cause they so fast thus can easily drive behind an obstacle.
and this "take a dropship" argument does not hold cause the missiles launcher barely scratch the sagaris shields, the sagaris can ignore you. |
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Bzeer
MG GROUP
41
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Posted - 2012.07.15 18:59:00 -
[101] - Quote
I take about all the friendly comments and advice I've previously provided in this post, and in other posts regarding the destruction of tanks. Using AV grenades, forge guns, installation fire, as well as gunship missile support, I've seen multiple tanks just shake off the combined efforts of an entire team. Individually such weapons were mere scratches, combined, we were able to repel the tanks but not destroy them. I have in the past been able to take out other tanks with such weapons, but believe now they had an inferior fit. There seems to be certain fits that can make a tank effectively indestructable, and given the speed at which they seem to be able to achieve while sprinting, I think they will also avoid orbital bombardments when they enter into the equation. What's worse is I've seen no clear evidence they've begun spider-tanking yet, and that will add a whole additional level of weapon absorption. AV weapons need to scale up their damage to the point where whole teams don't have to be in heavy suits with heavy weapons to keep up with their max potential, and we need to be able to disable the movement of the tank to be able to kill them, when they are "super fit". Or else they will just get away and comeback for some more when they are pulse ready again. I think the tanks are fine, in that, their current buff makes them all but invunerable to sustained small arms fire (which is needed, expected), but they should not be so invunerable to heavy weapons specifically designed to counter them, but the heavy weapons don't seem to scale up in damage on a curve that allows them to remain competitive over time. So, Whenever opposite teams have multiple super tanks on the field now, you honestly might as well just get on the skyscrappers and let them have the whole field, unless you have similar tank capability on your side. |
Rafgas first
BetaMax.
18
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Posted - 2012.07.15 19:30:00 -
[102] - Quote
like has been said many times in this thread, this is not a problem with tanks, but a problem with soldiers thinking miltia or tier1 swarmlaunchers or forge guns can take out a very nice tank. That should not happen. a 30k infantry setup should never be able to kill a 250k tank setup. |
Jack McReady
46
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Posted - 2012.07.15 19:32:00 -
[103] - Quote
today I was shooting another sagaris tank with my proto swarm launcher and this one was very well fit and also well driven:
1. my swarms either never hit cause the sagaris driver just went somewhere else for a few seconds cause the tanks are really fast. my missiles ofcourse tried to keep up but always flew in some obstacle. I tried to curve them but the fly path of the swarms is really pathetic.
2. it dealt low dmg when I hit him in the open, like ~10% of his shields which were replenished fast. he was ofcourse shot by others too but the sagaris tank was not really impressed. he just went somewhere, again dodge shitload of swarms due to obstacles and flypath and came from another direction back with full hp.
the AV weapons dont deal enough AND are not reliable enough. a properly fit sagaris has like 15k SHIELD EHP. till a dropship even made a dent it gets shot down by assault rifle fire and the sagaris can evade all swarm launcher rockets due to its speed, alot of obstacles on the map and the pathetic fly path of swarm rockets. only chance is a pack of high SP forge gun guys but the heavies are still too slow to keep up with a tank.
so stop spreading false information about this and get your facts straight. even if the sagaris tank would cost 2m, if you are funded by a big alliance this is peanuts and such games will just end in tank vs tank spam. |
des polo
Villore Sec Ops
Gallente Federation
22
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Posted - 2012.07.15 20:19:00 -
[104] - Quote
They aren't that hard to kill, I destroyed four of them by myself with a prototype forge gun in a single match |
ilafey
29
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Posted - 2012.07.15 20:49:00 -
[105] - Quote
So is sagaris better than surya? |
Iron Wolf Saber
BetaMax.
2867
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Posted - 2012.07.15 21:00:00 -
[106] - Quote
Rafgas first wrote:like has been said many times in this thread, this is not a problem with tanks, but a problem with soldiers thinking miltia or tier1 swarmlaunchers or forge guns can take out a very nice tank. That should not happen. a 30k infantry setup should never be able to kill a 250k tank setup.
I did use a tier 1 forge gun and mostly milita gear to take out the last sagaris I blew up by myself and partly on foot without dying. took me a total of 5 seconds of spotting the tank on the map and setting up its demise its not that strong without infantry escort to protect it. Total cost of effort 60k for suit and modules mostly all tier 1. |
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