DUST Search - Swarm Launcher Observations

All Channels

General Discussions

Swarm Launcher Observations

» Click here to find additional results for this topic using Google

Monitor this thread via RSS [?]

Pages: 1 2 :: [one page]

Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 0 post(s)
Harpyja Legio DXIV 2265	Posted - 2015.01.15 06:54:00 - [1] - Quote Ok, I'm going to say my observations and personal thoughts about swarms and I'll prepare to take the flak. Vehicle used and fitting: Gunnlogi, 5300 shield / 1500 armor 2x Complex Heavy Shield Extender 1x Complex Shield Hardener 1x Enhanced PG Upgrade 1x Complex CPU Upgrade 1x XT-201 Missile Launcher 2x 20GJ Particle Accelerator Opponent: MLT/STD Swarm Launcher with AV starter fit / STD basic dropsuit Observations: Approximately one eigth of total shield lost per volley. No hardener needed to engage and kill or escape beyond lock range. Easy to deal with multiple opponents. Opponent: PRO Swarm Launcher with non-Commando dropsuit Observations: Approximately one quarter of total unhardened shield lost per volley. At least three swarm volleys are successfully launched and hit per each engagement. Shield hardener is a must. Engaging a single opponent without the help of gunners is risky and must have cover nearby for a last minute retreat. Engagement is not an option with more than one opponent. Threshold of reatreating with skilled gunners is at 3 or more opponents. Opponent: PRO Swarm Launcher with Min Commando dropsuit Observations: Approximately one third of total unhardened shield lost per volley. Engagement is highly in the opponent's favor. About two whole clips can be launched before outside of lock range. Survivability is determined by local terrain and objects. Gunners can help reduce the risk involved when engaging a single opponent. Multiple opponents are deadly unless cover can be reached within the first or second volley. Observations on swarm behavior: swarms still track a recent position of your vehicle and not your current position. Completely possible for swarms to hit you for a brief period after you went into cover. Invisible swarms are still a common issue and misjudging incoming damage is easy to do in those scenarios and sometimes even deadly. Some notes to consider: observations based on engagements initiating with opponents within a grenade's toss. As such, AV / flux grenades are a popular combination with swarms. Another important thing to note is that AV users almost always have first strike capability, meaning that my hardener isn't online for the first hit. Popular combo is to launch a swarm and throw an AV / flux grenade to achieve maximum first strike damage, sometimes taking out as much as half of my total unhardened shield. Personal thoughts: based on how the swarm works, it deals too much damage for what the user has to do. Swarm tracking should also always be directly towards the current position; managing to get into cover at the last possible moment and breaking line of sight with the swarms should "drag" them into the cover instead of going around and still manage to hit you. Invisible swarms is a problem that still needs to be fixed. Onto the dropsuits and swarm tiers. I feel that for a fully proto fit Gunnlogi for max tank should easily withstand militia and standard level swarms from starter fits and low-skillpoint dropsuits, just as I had observed. Going on the complete other side of the spectrum, with proto swarms and Min Commandos, those are just overkill, again based on the required amount of user input. A personal complaint about commandos is that they sacrifice nothing against other infantry when equipped with swarms due to their two light weapon slots and their bonuses. I think that the maximum amount of damage a swarm user can achieve should be at the current level of damage achievable by a non-Commando. Way too much damage can be currently achieved given the reliability of swarms. I'll often times focus on my opponent for a few seconds while I shoot off my missile volley and look back to see the majority of my shield gone. "By His light, and His will"- The Scriptures, 12:32
Stupid Blueberry Pure Evil. Capital Punishment. 914	Posted - 2015.01.15 07:31:00 - [2] - Quote AV knights incoming. Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu. Haajakin Kalen.
jane stalin Ametat Security Amarr Empire 90	Posted - 2015.01.15 07:59:00 - [3] - Quote People expect missles launched by infantry to hurt your tank because that is what happens in other games and in movies It does not matter if this expectation is silly or not their is rage when expectations are not met. Harpyja wrote: Opponent: MLT/STD Swarm Launcher with AV starter fit / STD basic dropsuit Observations: Approximately one eigth of total shield lost per volley. No hardener needed to engage and kill or escape beyond lock range. Easy to deal with multiple opponents. So you made many people hate tanks by taking your proto tank to a pub match and slaughtering the noobs as thy tried to gang up on your tank , They expected to win but they did not so you make multiple ETERNAL enemies that will always demand AV to be buffed. I think it is pointless to make arguments that prove swarms are overpowered, easy to use , and threaten things worth a lot more ISK Even though your arguments make logical sense for most people a game is about feelings and not thoughts so any thoughts will not update feelings that is why infantry that tried to hurt your tank but failed to do any damage will hate you forever.
rpastry Dead Man's Game 250	Posted - 2015.01.15 08:55:00 - [4] - Quote av don't need to comment on this thread, the op has done a perfect job illustrating the mindset and expectations of a mediocre tanker. no surprise that this deranged arrogance and overinflated sense of self-worth comes from a scripture quoting amarrian. [Removed ASCII Art - CCP Logibro]
Breakin Stuff Internal Error. Negative-Feedback 6437	Posted - 2015.01.15 09:16:00 - [5] - Quote Stupid Blueberry wrote: AV knights incoming. No, not this time. Swarms have DPS sufficient in my estimation to hunt chromosome marauders. It's why in my HAV proposal they are the only AV option unchanged from today's stats. Also, found the logi tourist! Please cry directly into the bucket. -Ripley Riley
Jack McReady DUST University Ivy League 1805	Posted - 2015.01.15 09:46:00 - [6] - Quote Harpyja wrote: Opponent: PRO Swarm Launcher with non-Commando dropsuit Observations: Approximately one quarter of total unhardened shield lost per volley. Opponent: PRO Swarm Launcher with Min Commando dropsuit Observations: Approximately one third of total unhardened shield lost per volley. actually this guy never tested anything, or atleast not properly, the numbers are way off. the only way his "approximation" could be correct is if he let himself hit in the weakspots on purpose. gunlogi with 2 complex heavy extenders will have 314 SHIELD HP left after being hit by 4 full volleys by proto minmando with 2 complex mods and proto swarms. ONE THIRD? not even close... gunlogi with 2 complex heavy extenders will have 589 SHIELD HP left after being hit by 4 full volleys on any other suit with 3 complex mods and proto swarms. ONE QUARTER PER VOLLEY? almost.
MINA Longstrike Kirjuun Heiian 1890	Posted - 2015.01.15 09:47:00 - [7] - Quote Lower tiers of swarms underperform. Prof 5 swarms from level 5 min commando? Hit as hard or harder than allotek plasma cannons - without any of the skill requirements, more range, homing capability and no need to reload until after 3 volleys. Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu. Kirjuun Heiian. I have a few alts.
Jonny D Buelle Mors Effera 402	Posted - 2015.01.15 09:56:00 - [8] - Quote Jack McReady wrote: Harpyja wrote: Opponent: PRO Swarm Launcher with non-Commando dropsuit Observations: Approximately one quarter of total unhardened shield lost per volley. Opponent: PRO Swarm Launcher with Min Commando dropsuit Observations: Approximately one third of total unhardened shield lost per volley. actually this guy never tested anything, or atleast not properly, the numbers are way off. the only way his "approximation" could be correct is if he let himself hit in the weakspots on purpose. gunlogi with 2 complex heavy extenders will have 314 SHIELD HP left after being hit by 4 full volleys by proto minmando with 2 complex mods and proto swarms. ONE THIRD? not even close... gunlogi with 2 complex heavy extenders will have 589 SHIELD HP left after being hit by 4 full volleys on any other suit with 3 complex mods and proto swarms. ONE QUARTER PER VOLLEY? almost. There are other factors to consider other than suit, proto vs adv or basic, and damage mods. Such as profiencies, explosive damage vs shields, how many missiles in the vollies actually made contact (instead of hitting a wall or other obstruction), if they were using Aurum gear to circumvent the need for level 5 for a suit/weapon etc. So I think you may have jumped the gun at this one... Good maths though. Drink until you can't drink no more. Then grab another bottle and drink some more! - Demetrious 'Jonny' Buelle.
LT SHANKS Amarr Templars Amarr Empire 4642	Posted - 2015.01.15 09:56:00 - [9] - Quote Stupid Blueberry wrote: AV knights incoming. SHOOOT TANK WITH YES!
Jack McReady DUST University Ivy League 1806	Posted - 2015.01.15 10:01:00 - [10] - Quote Jonny D Buelle wrote: There are other factors to consider other than suit, proto vs adv or basic, and damage mods. Such as profiencies, explosive damage vs shields, how many missiles in the vollies actually made contact (instead of hitting a wall or other obstruction), if they were using Aurum gear to circumvent the need for level 5 for a suit/weapon etc. So I think you may have jumped the gun at this one... Good maths though. this is all considered and those numbers are for max possible damage on non weakspot. I am not a random blueberry. PS: swarm proficiency increase the damage against armor only

Jonny D Buelle Mors Effera 402	Posted - 2015.01.15 10:04:00 - [11] - Quote Jack McReady wrote: Jonny D Buelle wrote: There are other factors to consider other than suit, proto vs adv or basic, and damage mods. Such as profiencies, explosive damage vs shields, how many missiles in the vollies actually made contact (instead of hitting a wall or other obstruction), if they were using Aurum gear to circumvent the need for level 5 for a suit/weapon etc. So I think you may have jumped the gun at this one... Good maths though. this is all considered and those numbers are for max possible damage on non weakspot. I am not a random blueberry. PS: swarm proficiency increase the damage against armor only Still seems like you are using a whole bunch of white room ***. Maybe this is his results maybe not but we can't call fake every time someone over/under estimates/exaggerate their results. Drink until you can't drink no more. Then grab another bottle and drink some more!* - Demetrious 'Jonny' Buelle.
Jack McReady DUST University Ivy League 1806	Posted - 2015.01.15 10:11:00 - [12] - Quote Jonny D Buelle wrote: Still seems like you are using a whole bunch of white room ****. Maybe this is his results maybe not but we can't call fake every time someone over/under estimates/exaggerate their results. when someone does tests in a vacuum he should atleast do it properly. I mean, who would guess, if he stands still and lets himself hit in the weakspot with hardeners off all day then he will have a rough time. what a "great" observation. to conclude that he needs a "test" and a huge wall of text in the forum. but oh wait, instead of doing it properly, he claims that damage is overkill. perfect job of illustrating the mindset and expectations of a mediocre tank driver.
Jonny D Buelle Mors Effera 402	Posted - 2015.01.15 10:18:00 - [13] - Quote Jack McReady wrote: Jonny D Buelle wrote: Still seems like you are using a whole bunch of white room ***. Maybe this is his results maybe not but we can't call fake every time someone over/under estimates/exaggerate their results. when someone does tests in a vacuum he should atleast do it properly. I mean, who would guess, if he stands still and lets himself hit in the weakspot with hardeners off all day then he will have a rough time. what a "great" observation. to conclude that he needs a "test" and a huge wall of text in the forum. but oh wait, instead of doing it properly, he claims that damage is overkill. perfect job of illustrating the mindset and expectations of a mediocre tank driver. Look, I wasn't trying to rustle your jimmies, I'm just saying give the poor bloke a chance will ya. AV is overpowered, and this is coming from a guy who spends a majority of his time running from tanks in a fat suit. Drink until you can't drink no more. Then grab another bottle and drink some more!* - Demetrious 'Jonny' Buelle.
DeadlyAztec11 Ostrakon Agency 7057	Posted - 2015.01.15 10:35:00 - [14] - Quote So you say that hardeners are a must to fight proto Swarms, though I will argue that proto Swarms are a must to fight hardeners. It might make actual sense to increase tank health significantly at higher tiers while limiting the ability of hardeners or making it more difficult to equip one. That way people would be equipping proto Swarms to fight high health enemies instead of enemies who just have temporary high health. Put your flags up in the sky. And wave them side to side. Show the world where you're from. Show the world we are one.
hold that Krusual Covert Operators Minmatar Republic 553	Posted - 2015.01.15 11:08:00 - [15] - Quote you think a lot of ads butt hurt comes from having to fear militia swarms? what it they lowed the militia swarm clip to 2 volleys then reload instead of 3 volleys we might see less of these type of posts? the starter fit/no sp invested militia swarmer will still get her/his well deserved +75 wp for damage, and the ads pilot, unless super scrubby, will get a chance to fly away. my bad, been reading so many swarm threads that mixed this one up, he's talking about tankers, still might apply though
Breakin Stuff Internal Error. Negative-Feedback 6440	Posted - 2015.01.15 11:15:00 - [16] - Quote LT SHANKS wrote: Stupid Blueberry wrote: AV knights incoming. SHOOOT TANK WITH YES! Wrong TANKS ARE YES! MUST COUNTER WITH NO! Also, found the logi tourist! Please cry directly into the bucket. -Ripley Riley
Litany 0f Fury Revolution of Evil Henchmen 21	Posted - 2015.01.15 13:57:00 - [17] - Quote The problem i see with the interaction between AV and vehicles is time... Because tanks can move so quickly they have less health and can therefore be destroyed by smaller AV groups. If they were slower but harder and worked with infantry instead of soloing, then it would make the job of killing the tank a lot harder. However by making them slower it would give the opposing team TIME to group together to take out the the vehicle. This is more specific to Ground based vehicles. This would also make Warbarge strikes a lot more tactically relevant. For Dropships their main attribute is maneuverability therefore i propose the following: Add a lock on alert to all vehicles based off of the AVers scan profile, for swarms. By doing this it would make plasma cannons and forge guns more of a surprise weapon but with the need of skill to hit the target. Therefore dropship pilots can then use their main attribute, maneuverability same as now. Swamers then have the choice of using a commando with double swarms but with the lock on alert or use an assault or scout with less chance of the lock on alert but only have one swarm launcher. Also by reducing lock on time with higher level weapon or with skills it will make you more effective against dropships. This will then counter everyone using basic fits to attack Dropships. Increase Swarm speed slightly, but reduce swarm maneuverability so that skilled pilots could potentially out maneuver them initially allowing more time to activate counteractive modules. This would work nicely with missile lock alert. Take what you will from these ideas as they are just ...ideas. I do wonder whether this would make swarms too counter-able. but this could potentially be balanced with damage and /or lock on range and/or missile flight duration. Commando 'till i die... then another commando Beta / / Stephenius
Atiim Titans of Phoenix 15064	Posted - 2015.01.15 14:01:00 - [18] - Quote Reserved. The 1st Matari Commando -HAND
Harpyja Legio DXIV 2272	Posted - 2015.01.15 16:50:00 - [19] - Quote Here's some math, with max skills and Min Commando: Swarm lock time: 1.05s Swarm reload time: 2.87s Swarm damage w/ 2 complex damage mods: 1247 unhardened shield / volley Ok, so I was wrong about Min Commandos dealing one third of total shield damage, but it's still just under a quarter of my total shields. With first strike damage, I'm left with 4053 shield and I turn on my hardener and start driving to get out of lock range from a standstill position; Gunnlogi speed is 19.5 m/s, so it would take me a little over 9 seconds to get out of range. So how much damage can that Min Commando theoretically do? 2.10 seconds to launch the rest of the clip plus a small delay in retargetting, dealing 1496 shield damage, bringing me down to 2557 shield. 2.87 seconds to reload. A little less than 4 seconds remain, enough time to launch three more volleys, dealing 2247 damage. I'm left with 310 shield when I finally get out of lock range. That's against only one Min Commando. Against two, I'm into armor after their first clip. Also, this is if they are standing still. A Min Commando has a base movement speed of 4.25 m/s, which means I'm only increasing our distance at 15.25 m/s, requiring 11.5 seconds to escape lock range, enough time to ensure that 2 full volleys are launched for the single Min Commando, also reducing the skill level needed to decrease reload time. This is not balanced, considering the anti-infantry power of the HAV in question. One man can nearly destroy the tankiest HAV fit possible, whereas it requires at least one gunner in the HAV to be successful at anti-infantry, which makes two people minimum in the HAV. Those of you saying that one person should be able to kill any other person are wrong and overlooking the aspect of how much damage can one person deal to the other versus how much damage they receive. If I by myself don't pose much of a threat to you, then you shouldn't a big threat to me either. If it takes me and a gunner to pose a threat to infantry, it should then require two of you to pose a threat. "By His light, and His will"- The Scriptures, 12:32
Spkr4theDead Red Star. 2742	Posted - 2015.01.15 17:11:00 - [20] - Quote Harpyja wrote: Ok, I'm going to say my observations and personal thoughts about swarms and I'll prepare to take the flak. Vehicle used and fitting: Gunnlogi, 5300 shield / 1500 armor 2x Complex Heavy Shield Extender 1x Complex Shield Hardener 1x Enhanced PG Upgrade 1x Complex CPU Upgrade 1x XT-201 Missile Launcher 2x 20GJ Particle Accelerator Opponent: MLT/STD Swarm Launcher with AV starter fit / STD basic dropsuit Observations: Approximately one eigth of total shield lost per volley. No hardener needed to engage and kill or escape beyond lock range. Easy to deal with multiple opponents. Opponent: PRO Swarm Launcher with non-Commando dropsuit Observations: Approximately one quarter of total unhardened shield lost per volley. At least three swarm volleys are successfully launched and hit per each engagement. Shield hardener is a must. Engaging a single opponent without the help of gunners is risky and must have cover nearby for a last minute retreat. Engagement is not an option with more than one opponent. Threshold of reatreating with skilled gunners is at 3 or more opponents. Opponent: PRO Swarm Launcher with Min Commando dropsuit Observations: Approximately one third of total unhardened shield lost per volley. Engagement is highly in the opponent's favor. About two whole clips can be launched before outside of lock range. Survivability is determined by local terrain and objects. Gunners can help reduce the risk involved when engaging a single opponent. Multiple opponents are deadly unless cover can be reached within the first or second volley. Observations on swarm behavior: swarms still track a recent position of your vehicle and not your current position. Completely possible for swarms to hit you for a brief period after you went into cover. Invisible swarms are still a common issue and misjudging incoming damage is easy to do in those scenarios and sometimes even deadly. Some notes to consider: observations based on engagements initiating with opponents within a grenade's toss. As such, AV / flux grenades are a popular combination with swarms. Another important thing to note is that AV users almost always have first strike capability, meaning that my hardener isn't online for the first hit. Popular combo is to launch a swarm and throw an AV / flux grenade to achieve maximum first strike damage, sometimes taking out as much as half of my total unhardened shield. Personal thoughts: based on how the swarm works, it deals too much damage for what the user has to do. Swarm tracking should also always be directly towards the current position; managing to get into cover at the last possible moment and breaking line of sight with the swarms should "drag" them into the cover instead of going around and still manage to hit you. Invisible swarms is a problem that still needs to be fixed. Onto the dropsuits and swarm tiers. I feel that for a fully proto fit Gunnlogi for max tank should easily withstand militia and standard level swarms from starter fits and low-skillpoint dropsuits, just as I had observed. Going on the complete other side of the spectrum, with proto swarms and Min Commandos, those are just overkill, again based on the required amount of user input. A personal complaint about commandos is that they sacrifice nothing against other infantry when equipped with swarms due to their two light weapon slots and their bonuses. I think that the maximum amount of damage a swarm user can achieve should be at the current level of damage achievable by a non-Commando. Way too much damage can be currently achieved given the reliability of swarms. I'll often times focus on my opponent for a few seconds while I shoot off my missile volley and look back to see the majority of my shield gone. I'd give this a like as an objective view of AV, but I can't because AV is just so damn easy to use. I may be missing something, but I'm pretty sure that I didn't call for a tank nerf before Uprising 1.7. - Atiim

Spkr4theDead Red Star. 2742	Posted - 2015.01.15 17:18:00 - [21] - Quote jane stalin wrote: People expect missles launched by infantry to hurt your tank because that is what happens in other games and in movies It does not matter if this expectation is silly or not. There is rage when expectations are not met. But it's not fair when 5ft long rockets with explosive warheads the size of a beachball kill infantry. Harpyja wrote: Opponent: MLT/STD Swarm Launcher with AV starter fit / STD basic dropsuit Observations: Approximately one eigth of total shield lost per volley. No hardener needed to engage and kill or escape beyond lock range. Easy to deal with multiple opponents. So you made many people hate tanks by taking your proto tank to a pub match and slaughtering the noobs as thy tried to gang up on your tank , They expected to win but they did not so you made many ETERNAL enemies that will always demand AV to be buffed. A PRO weapon doesn't turn a STD suit into the PRO suit; the same applies to vehicles, where a PRO turret doesn't turn a STD vehicle hull into a PRO hull. This "PRO vehicle" BS is exactly that: BS. It's a myth put forth by infantry to try to get the two on equal footing for the purposes of complaining. Yes, it's "PRO AV vs STD" tanks, but that's missing the point. This makes it pointless to make arguments that prove swarms are overpowered, easy to use , and threaten things worth a lot more ISK , Because even though your arguments make logical sense for most people a game is about feelings and not thoughts so any thoughts will not update feelings. An explosive AV weapon is doing ~1766 damage in that one volley against shield. A forge gets that in a direct hit; you wouldn't like it if that was the splash* damage itself.* TL DR ; the infantry that tried to hurt your tank but failed to do any damage will hate you forever and nothing will change their minds. That's because they have an irrational fear and hatred of vehicles. I may be missing something, but I'm pretty sure that I didn't call for a tank nerf before Uprising 1.7. - Atiim
Spkr4theDead Red Star. 2742	Posted - 2015.01.15 17:19:00 - [22] - Quote rpastry wrote: av don't need to comment on this thread, the op has done a perfect job illustrating the mindset and expectations of a mediocre tanker. no surprise that this deranged arrogance and overinflated sense of self-worth comes from a scripture quoting amarrian. Do you even tank? I may be missing something, but I'm pretty sure that I didn't call for a tank nerf before Uprising 1.7. - Atiim
Spkr4theDead Red Star. 2742	Posted - 2015.01.15 17:20:00 - [23] - Quote Jack McReady wrote: Harpyja wrote: Opponent: PRO Swarm Launcher with non-Commando dropsuit Observations: Approximately one quarter of total unhardened shield lost per volley. Opponent: PRO Swarm Launcher with Min Commando dropsuit Observations: Approximately one third of total unhardened shield lost per volley. actually this guy never tested anything, or atleast not properly, the numbers are way off. the only way his "approximation" could be correct is if he let himself hit in the weakspots on purpose. gunlogi with 2 complex heavy extenders will have 314 SHIELD HP left after being hit by 4 full volleys by proto minmando with 2 complex mods and proto swarms. ONE THIRD? not even close... gunlogi with 2 complex heavy extenders will have 589 SHIELD HP left after being hit by 4 full volleys on any other suit with 3 complex mods and proto swarms. ONE QUARTER PER VOLLEY? almost. with an active hardener up and two complex heavy extenders the gunlogi can take 7 missiles volleys to the face and will still have a sliver of shield hp left if hit by proto minmando with 2 complex mods and proto swarms. just saying. Not everybody had a good grasp of math in school. There's a large number of people in the world that don't need to do math in their every day life. I may be missing something, but I'm pretty sure that I didn't call for a tank nerf before Uprising 1.7. - Atiim
Spkr4theDead Red Star. 2742	Posted - 2015.01.15 17:22:00 - [24] - Quote Jonny D Buelle wrote: There are other factors to consider other than suit, proto vs adv or basic, and damage mods. Such as profiencies, explosive damage vs shields, how many missiles in the vollies actually made contact (instead of hitting a wall or other obstruction), if they were using Aurum gear to circumvent the need for level 5 for a suit/weapon etc. So I think you may have jumped the gun at this one... Good maths though. Edit: Just want to clarify I never stated that I agree with the OP just wanted to break people out of this white room mentality that seems to be more common than common sense. The swarm could be Aurum, but the suit needs to be at level 5. Swarm operation is just to reduce lock on time. I may be missing something, but I'm pretty sure that I didn't call for a tank nerf before Uprising 1.7. - Atiim
Spkr4theDead Red Star. 2742	Posted - 2015.01.15 17:22:00 - [25] - Quote Jonny D Buelle wrote: Jack McReady wrote: Jonny D Buelle wrote: There are other factors to consider other than suit, proto vs adv or basic, and damage mods. Such as profiencies, explosive damage vs shields, how many missiles in the vollies actually made contact (instead of hitting a wall or other obstruction), if they were using Aurum gear to circumvent the need for level 5 for a suit/weapon etc. So I think you may have jumped the gun at this one... Good maths though. this is all considered and those numbers are for max possible damage on non weakspot. I am not a random blueberry. PS: swarm proficiency increase the damage against armor only Still seems like you are using a whole bunch of white room ****. Maybe this is his results maybe not but we can't call fake every time someone over/under estimates/exaggerate their results. That was like someone saying their Soma could take 7000 damage every 2 seconds. I may be missing something, but I'm pretty sure that I didn't call for a tank nerf before Uprising 1.7. - Atiim
Spkr4theDead Red Star. 2742	Posted - 2015.01.15 17:23:00 - [26] - Quote Jack McReady wrote: perfect job of illustrating the mindset and expectations of a mediocre tank driver. Do you even tank? I may be missing something, but I'm pretty sure that I didn't call for a tank nerf before Uprising 1.7. - Atiim
Spkr4theDead Red Star. 2742	Posted - 2015.01.15 17:24:00 - [27] - Quote DeadlyAztec11 wrote: while limiting the ability of hardeners or making it more difficult to equip one. Yet again another bad idea from infantry. I may be missing something, but I'm pretty sure that I didn't call for a tank nerf before Uprising 1.7. - Atiim
Spkr4theDead Red Star. 2742	Posted - 2015.01.15 17:25:00 - [28] - Quote hold that wrote: you think a lot of ads butt hurt comes from having to fear militia swarms? what it they lowed the militia swarm clip to 2 volleys then reload instead of 3 volleys we might see less of these type of posts? the starter fit/no sp invested militia swarmer will still get her/his well deserved +75 wp for damage, and the ads pilot, unless super scrubby, will get a chance to fly away. my bad, been reading so many swarm threads that mixed this one up, he's talking about tankers, still might apply though A chance to fly away when swarms fly faster than the ADS can? Do you even fly? I may be missing something, but I'm pretty sure that I didn't call for a tank nerf before Uprising 1.7. - Atiim
Spkr4theDead Red Star. 2742	Posted - 2015.01.15 17:27:00 - [29] - Quote Litany 0f Fury wrote: Increase Swarm speed slightly, LOLWUT Their speed was already increased to 60m/s.Why do they need to travel even faster than that? I may be missing something, but I'm pretty sure that I didn't call for a tank nerf before Uprising 1.7. - Atiim
Spkr4theDead Red Star. 2742	Posted - 2015.01.15 17:28:00 - [30] - Quote Atiim wrote: Reserved. Entirely biased comment based on next to no experience in a tank incoming. I may be missing something, but I'm pretty sure that I didn't call for a tank nerf before Uprising 1.7. - Atiim

Spkr4theDead Red Star. 2742	Posted - 2015.01.15 17:30:00 - [31] - Quote Harpyja wrote: If it takes me and a gunner to pose a threat to infantry, it should then require two of you to pose a threat. "Teamwork for thee, but no teamwork for me." The double standards are astounding. I may be missing something, but I'm pretty sure that I didn't call for a tank nerf before Uprising 1.7. - Atiim
Lazer Fo Cused Shining Flame Amarr Empire 470	Posted - 2015.01.15 17:53:00 - [32] - Quote 1. Pilot uses math - Its super effective 2. The SL needs a big injection of skilled added to it or just delete the no skill required weapon
DeadlyAztec11 Ostrakon Agency 7066	Posted - 2015.01.15 19:51:00 - [33] - Quote Spkr4theDead wrote: DeadlyAztec11 wrote: while limiting the ability of hardeners or making it more difficult to equip one. Yet again another bad idea from infantry. That is completely out of context. In that thread I said it would be better if vehicle HP were substantially increased, preferably with a buff to HP mods, and that hardeners should become less useful or harder to fit. Right now hardeners are needed by vehicles and is a big reason people run proto AV. I mean you could surprise a vehicle and take out half its health and then they put on a hardener and can simply take the damage and get out of there. It is generally good for vehicles, but the second the hardeners are down the vehicle is extremely vulnerable which leads them to be very easily taken out by proto AV. It would be better if HAV's just had more HP always. Put your flags up in the sky. And wave them side to side. Show the world where you're from. Show the world we are one.
DeadlyAztec11 Ostrakon Agency 7066	Posted - 2015.01.15 19:53:00 - [34] - Quote Lazer Fo Cused wrote: 1. Pilot uses math - Its super effective 2. The SL needs a big injection of skilled added to it or just delete the no skill required weapon We could always add in laser guided missiles, but many pilots seem to hate this idea more. Put your flags up in the sky. And wave them side to side. Show the world where you're from. Show the world we are one.
Harpyja Legio DXIV 2275	Posted - 2015.01.15 20:35:00 - [35] - Quote DeadlyAztec11 wrote: Lazer Fo Cused wrote: 1. Pilot uses math - Its super effective 2. The SL needs a big injection of skilled added to it or just delete the no skill required weapon We could always add in laser guided missiles, but many pilots seem to hate this idea more. By laser guided, you mean that swarm users would have to actively aim at their target instead of the current fire and forget system that does all the work for you? That's exactly what I'd like to see, and I'm sure many other pilots wouldn't disagree either. "By His light, and His will"- The Scriptures, 12:32
Jack Galen Knights Of Ender RISE of LEGION 7	Posted - 2015.01.15 20:52:00 - [36] - Quote Harpyja wrote: DeadlyAztec11 wrote: Lazer Fo Cused wrote: 1. Pilot uses math - Its super effective 2. The SL needs a big injection of skilled added to it or just delete the no skill required weapon We could always add in laser guided missiles, but many pilots seem to hate this idea more. By laser guided, you mean that swarm users would have to actively aim at their target instead of the current fire and forget system that does all the work for you? That's exactly what I'd like to see, and I'm sure many other pilots wouldn't disagree either. If a system similar to IRL semi-active radar was introduced, I'd honestly not request any more changes to swarms. Having to actually lase your target would allow pilots to 'lose' swarms when they run, by increasing your v(transverse relative to the operator to make aiming harder.
Spkr4theDead Red Star. 2770	Posted - 2015.01.15 21:07:00 - [37] - Quote DeadlyAztec11 wrote: Spkr4theDead wrote: DeadlyAztec11 wrote: while limiting the ability of hardeners or making it more difficult to equip one. Yet again another bad idea from infantry. That is completely out of context. Out of context you say? Let's lower the PG/CPU fitting bonus for the suits to 3% instead of 5%; and the cloak fitting bonus down to 5% per level. Let's also increase the fitting cost of shield extenders AND armor plates. I can say these things because I have 5 PRO suits and 4 PRO weapons, so you can go stuff yourself. I may be missing something, but I'm pretty sure that I didn't call for a tank nerf before Uprising 1.7. - Atiim
Jack McReady DUST University Ivy League 1817	Posted - 2015.01.16 08:55:00 - [38] - Quote Harpyja wrote: Gunnlogi speed is 19.5 m/s, so it would take me a little over 9 seconds to get out of range. if you are in the open you are dead, if you run you present him your backside which gives weakspot damage bonus => bye tank. this shouldnt happen at all though, since the maps are covered with small hills and structures. Spkr4theDead wrote: Jack McReady wrote: perfect job of illustrating the mindset and expectations of a mediocre tank driver. Do you even tank? what does it even have to do with his poor attempt of testing if I drive a tank? my complain was only targeted at the way he did his "observations". if he does poor job at trying stuff out with high expectations then the result will obviously not please him.
KEROSIINI-TERO The Rainbow Effect 1787	Posted - 2015.02.22 18:10:00 - [39] - Quote Here's one observation for y'all! http://youtu.be/6oh8sLqXieU?t=4m20s Sweet <3 <3 <3 The answer
QRT30 Rave Technologies Inc. C0VEN 76	Posted - 2015.02.23 22:10:00 - [40] - Quote Harpyja wrote: Here's some math, with max skills and Min Commando: Swarm lock time: 1.05s Swarm reload time: 2.87s Swarm damage w/ 2 complex damage mods: 1247 unhardened shield / volley Ok, so I was wrong about Min Commandos dealing one third of total shield damage, but it's still just under a quarter of my total shields. With first strike damage, I'm left with 4053 shield and I turn on my hardener and start driving to get out of lock range from a standstill position; Gunnlogi speed is 19.5 m/s, so it would take me a little over 9 seconds to get out of range. So how much damage can that Min Commando theoretically do? 2.10 seconds to launch the rest of the clip plus a small delay in retargetting, dealing 1496 shield damage, bringing me down to 2557 shield. 2.87 seconds to reload. A little less than 4 seconds remain, enough time to launch three more volleys, dealing 2247 damage. I'm left with 310 shield when I finally get out of lock range. That's against only one Min Commando. Against two, I'm into armor after their first clip. Also, this is if they are standing still. A Min Commando has a base movement speed of 4.25 m/s, which means I'm only increasing our distance at 15.25 m/s, requiring 11.5 seconds to escape lock range, enough time to ensure that 2 full volleys are launched for the single Min Commando, also reducing the skill level needed to decrease reload time. This is not balanced, considering the anti-infantry power of the HAV in question. One man can nearly destroy the tankiest HAV fit possible, whereas it requires at least one gunner in the HAV to be successful at anti-infantry, which makes two people minimum in the HAV. Those of you saying that one person should be able to kill any other person are wrong and overlooking the aspect of how much damage can one person deal to the other versus how much damage they receive. If I by myself don't pose much of a threat to you, then you shouldn't a big threat to me either. If it takes me and a gunner to pose a threat to infantry, it should then require two of you to pose a threat. But sniping in gunlogi with rail on redline is balanced? Good gunlogi tanker always escape out of my swarms lock range. I can shoot up to 3 volleys and you have still some shields and armor. How many times have you been killed by swarm? I'm very often being killed from rail tank from distance over 200 meters. How many times do you see over 2 minimatando in one match but 2-5 tanks are always. QRT30 - all Caldari/Minimatar lvl 5, Gal all lvl.3 - core maxed QRT300 - Amarr heavy/commando

True Adamance Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 17221	Posted - 2015.02.23 22:33:00 - [41] - Quote QRT30 wrote: Harpyja wrote: Here's some math, with max skills and Min Commando: Swarm lock time: 1.05s Swarm reload time: 2.87s Swarm damage w/ 2 complex damage mods: 1247 unhardened shield / volley Ok, so I was wrong about Min Commandos dealing one third of total shield damage, but it's still just under a quarter of my total shields. With first strike damage, I'm left with 4053 shield and I turn on my hardener and start driving to get out of lock range from a standstill position; Gunnlogi speed is 19.5 m/s, so it would take me a little over 9 seconds to get out of range. So how much damage can that Min Commando theoretically do? 2.10 seconds to launch the rest of the clip plus a small delay in retargetting, dealing 1496 shield damage, bringing me down to 2557 shield. 2.87 seconds to reload. A little less than 4 seconds remain, enough time to launch three more volleys, dealing 2247 damage. I'm left with 310 shield when I finally get out of lock range. That's against only one Min Commando. Against two, I'm into armor after their first clip. Also, this is if they are standing still. A Min Commando has a base movement speed of 4.25 m/s, which means I'm only increasing our distance at 15.25 m/s, requiring 11.5 seconds to escape lock range, enough time to ensure that 2 full volleys are launched for the single Min Commando, also reducing the skill level needed to decrease reload time. This is not balanced, considering the anti-infantry power of the HAV in question. One man can nearly destroy the tankiest HAV fit possible, whereas it requires at least one gunner in the HAV to be successful at anti-infantry, which makes two people minimum in the HAV. Those of you saying that one person should be able to kill any other person are wrong and overlooking the aspect of how much damage can one person deal to the other versus how much damage they receive. If I by myself don't pose much of a threat to you, then you shouldn't a big threat to me either. If it takes me and a gunner to pose a threat to infantry, it should then require two of you to pose a threat. But sniping in gunlogi with rail on redline is balanced? Good gunlogi tanker always escape out of my swarms lock range. I can shoot up to 3 volleys and you have still some shields and armor. How many times have you been killed by swarm? I'm very often being killed from rail tank from distance over 200 meters. How many times do you see over 2 minimatando in one match but 2-5 tanks are always. Regardless of whether or not I agree with Redline Sniping (which I don't) you must.... Bear in mind you are engaging an enemy with specific natural resistances against your main AV weapon, which does have travel time reducing the over all DPS, at a target which is very likely entrenched and prepared to move as required..... "This is the Usumgal boy, the exalted dragon, wreathed in the fires of heaven. He is a true symbol of God's majesty."
Sir Dukey G0DS AM0NG MEN General Tso's Alliance 1775	Posted - 2015.02.23 22:42:00 - [42] - Quote Atiim is about to drop a bomb about how you as a tank driver have no skill like earlier today he said to a poor ADS pilot that he had no skill and should get gud when poor guy asked for ADS buff. Acquire Currency, Disregard Female Canis lupus familiaris
True Adamance Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 17221	Posted - 2015.02.23 22:53:00 - [43] - Quote Sir Dukey wrote: Atiim is about to drop a bomb about how you as a tank driver have no skill like earlier today he said to a poor ADS pilot that he had no skill and should get gud when poor guy asked for ADS buff. He's right though. With no projectile drop, insanely fast firing rounds, potent modules, rapid regeneration, etc We don't need to be good. The hulls do it for us. I mean hell tanks barely exist in Dust as opposed to the IFV's the actually are. Vastly more interesting to tank in games like Battlefield or War Thunder. "This is the Usumgal boy, the exalted dragon, wreathed in the fires of heaven. He is a true symbol of God's majesty."
Cody Sietz Random Gunz RISE of LEGION 4406	Posted - 2015.02.23 22:57:00 - [44] - Quote True Adamance wrote: Sir Dukey wrote: Atiim is about to drop a bomb about how you as a tank driver have no skill like earlier today he said to a poor ADS pilot that he had no skill and should get gud when poor guy asked for ADS buff. He's right though. With no projectile drop, insanely fast firing rounds, potent modules, rapid regeneration, etc We don't need to be good. The hulls do it for us. I mean hell tanks barely exist in Dust as opposed to the IFV's the actually are. Vastly more interesting to tank in games like Battlefield or War Thunder. I do love the tanking in those games. Though it can get frustrating playing as the Germans. "I do agree with you there though. shudders" -Arkena Wyrnspire
True Adamance Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 17223	Posted - 2015.02.23 23:01:00 - [45] - Quote Cody Sietz wrote: True Adamance wrote: Sir Dukey wrote: Atiim is about to drop a bomb about how you as a tank driver have no skill like earlier today he said to a poor ADS pilot that he had no skill and should get gud when poor guy asked for ADS buff. He's right though. With no projectile drop, insanely fast firing rounds, potent modules, rapid regeneration, etc We don't need to be good. The hulls do it for us. I mean hell tanks barely exist in Dust as opposed to the IFV's the actually are. Vastly more interesting to tank in games like Battlefield or War Thunder. I do love the tanking in those games. Though it can get frustrating playing as the Germans. I'm a huge fan of German Tanks. Yes we all know soviet rolled armour was incredibly tough to punch through with small calibre German guns...but a Tiger with an 88mm will put a hole in anything except one of those awkwardly powerful M-103's. Still I've been able to sit there in a Tiger (god praise the Tiger!) and just bounce rounds off my hull, while returning fire, until other players dragged me out of the open to repair. "This is the Usumgal boy, the exalted dragon, wreathed in the fires of heaven. He is a true symbol of God's majesty."
One Eyed King Nos Nothi 7995	Posted - 2015.02.23 23:02:00 - [46] - Quote I personally think that we need better test conditions to make any sort of judgement. These seem awfully unrealistic to what happens in game, particularly since no mention of hardener use was made, as if they aren't something to take into account. Invisible swarms are about the only reasonable problem that could be obtained from this test. I think it would have been a more reasonable conclusion to suggest other tests that need to be done rather than automatically suggesting swarm fixes based on such narrow testing procedures. Former CEO of the Land of the BIind. Any double entendre is unintended I assure you.
Cody Sietz Random Gunz RISE of LEGION 4406	Posted - 2015.02.23 23:07:00 - [47] - Quote True Adamance wrote: Cody Sietz wrote: True Adamance wrote: Sir Dukey wrote: Atiim is about to drop a bomb about how you as a tank driver have no skill like earlier today he said to a poor ADS pilot that he had no skill and should get gud when poor guy asked for ADS buff. He's right though. With no projectile drop, insanely fast firing rounds, potent modules, rapid regeneration, etc We don't need to be good. The hulls do it for us. I mean hell tanks barely exist in Dust as opposed to the IFV's the actually are. Vastly more interesting to tank in games like Battlefield or War Thunder. I do love the tanking in those games. Though it can get frustrating playing as the Germans. I'm a huge fan of German Tanks. Yes we all know soviet rolled armour was incredibly tough to punch through with small calibre German guns...but a Tiger with an 88mm will put a hole in anything except one of those awkwardly powerful M-103's. Still I've been able to sit there in a Tiger (god praise the Tiger!) and just bounce rounds off my hull, while returning fire, until other players dragged me out of the open to repair. Working on unlocking it now. Knew I should have gotten instead of the Stug G and Pz4 G! "I do agree with you there though. shudders" -Arkena Wyrnspire
Lorhak Gannarsein Nos Nothi 4323	Posted - 2015.02.23 23:07:00 - [48] - Quote Quote: I think that the maximum amount of damage a swarm user can achieve should be at the current level of damage achievable by a non-Commando. Way too much damage can be currently achieved given the reliability of swarms. This I cannot agree more with. There's no need for HAVs to be destroyed anymore; one (perhaps unintended) side-effect of the WP damage changes is that it's far more profitable to let it survive; as such AV suits are actually superior for extended WP gain than a HAV. With that in mind, the only thing that absolutely has to be able to destroy a HAV is another HAV (this is because of the nature of HAV v HAV; one can't very well escape from something the same size and speed as you, whereas infantry have more manoueverability). AV needs, therefore, to be able to drive them off for a significant period of time. ADSes are in a good place (on the whole; I think we're closer to balance now than previously) and their resistance to AV seems about what I'm suggesting (difficult to solo a sensible pilot, easy for him to escape, although a very short turnaround) but I would like HAVs to be given significant regeneration penalties, cooldown penalties and eHP increases (all tied into the frame; perhaps as an automatically-unlocked precursor skill?). HAV speeds would also have to be decreased somewhat. Hopefully this would allow for small numbers of AV to successfully drive multiple HAVs away from the field of battle for an extended period of time, while still being rewarded (quite extensively, to be honest) as a result of doing so. To clarify in no uncertain terms: with the WP reward system in place, I feel it is more valuable for AV to drive HAVs away than to destroy them, and I would like to facilitate this 'meta' by making it more difficult for HAVs to be soloed, but also increasing their 'downtime' by an extended period. Guys, we need to stop calling MU a 'matchmaker' when it's actually a 'teambuilder'. And I want to play FE:A now. Damn.
Lorhak Gannarsein Nos Nothi 4323	Posted - 2015.02.23 23:08:00 - [49] - Quote Sir Dukey wrote: Atiim is about to drop a bomb about how you as a tank driver have no skill like earlier today he said to a poor ADS pilot that he had no skill and should get gud when poor guy asked for ADS buff. Atiim is either blissfully unaware or has a keen sense for the ironic. Guys, we need to stop calling MU a 'matchmaker' when it's actually a 'teambuilder'. And I want to play FE:A now. Damn.
Mortishai Belmont G.L.O.R.Y General Tso's Alliance 522	Posted - 2015.02.23 23:11:00 - [50] - Quote Try it in a Madruger, you stand no chance and there is no escape. G.L.O.R.Y Soldier, I'm that Amarr heavy you warn your team about <3 -Heavy/Logi/Assault/Scout-

True Adamance Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 17225	Posted - 2015.02.23 23:11:00 - [51] - Quote Cody Sietz wrote: True Adamance wrote: Cody Sietz wrote: True Adamance wrote: Sir Dukey wrote: Atiim is about to drop a bomb about how you as a tank driver have no skill like earlier today he said to a poor ADS pilot that he had no skill and should get gud when poor guy asked for ADS buff. He's right though. With no projectile drop, insanely fast firing rounds, potent modules, rapid regeneration, etc We don't need to be good. The hulls do it for us. I mean hell tanks barely exist in Dust as opposed to the IFV's the actually are. Vastly more interesting to tank in games like Battlefield or War Thunder. I do love the tanking in those games. Though it can get frustrating playing as the Germans. I'm a huge fan of German Tanks. Yes we all know soviet rolled armour was incredibly tough to punch through with small calibre German guns...but a Tiger with an 88mm will put a hole in anything except one of those awkwardly powerful M-103's. Still I've been able to sit there in a Tiger (god praise the Tiger!) and just bounce rounds off my hull, while returning fire, until other players dragged me out of the open to repair. Working on unlocking it now. Knew I should have gotten instead of the Stug G and Pz4 G! Nah Stugs are insanely OP at lower tiers. Gotta put rounds across their rear armour to even have a chance of scoring a penetrating hit otherwise they just bounce. Pzkw IV is still a solid choice but if its the T3 with the 75mm 11.4 second reload you should have opted for the Tiger...... Pzkw IV seems to drop too quickly while the Tiger H1 endures. "This is the Usumgal boy, the exalted dragon, wreathed in the fires of heaven. He is a true symbol of God's majesty."
Lorhak Gannarsein Nos Nothi 4325	Posted - 2015.02.23 23:15:00 - [52] - Quote QRT30 wrote: But sniping in gunlogi with rail on redline is balanced? Good gunlogi tanker always escape out of my swarms lock range. I can shoot up to 3 volleys and you have still some shields and armor. How many times have you been killed by swarm? I'm very often being killed from rail tank from distance over 200 meters. How many times do you see over 2 minimatando in one match but 2-5 tanks are always. mate do you know how many WP I would get if there were always 2-5 tanks in a match? many. the answer is many. Guys, we need to stop calling MU a 'matchmaker' when it's actually a 'teambuilder'. And I want to play FE:A now. Damn.
Cody Sietz Random Gunz RISE of LEGION 4406	Posted - 2015.02.23 23:22:00 - [53] - Quote True Adamance wrote: Nah Stugs are insanely OP at lower tiers. Gotta put rounds across their rear armour to even have a chance of scoring a penetrating hit otherwise they just bounce. Pzkw IV is still a solid choice but if its the T3 with the 75mm 11.4 second reload you should have opted for the Tiger...... Pzkw IV seems to drop too quickly while the Tiger H1 endures. Yeah, 4.7 seems to be where Germany has a problem. Though I am enjoying the Jagpanzer (38)t At 3.7 even the Pz.3 M is bad ass once you get the APCR(F-those soft capped shells) "I do agree with you there though. shudders" -Arkena Wyrnspire
Eruditus 920 Nemo Malus Felix 1329	Posted - 2015.02.23 23:54:00 - [54] - Quote Grab a sniper rifle. Seems about right. "Stay gold, Ponyboy..."
TritusX PH4NT0M5 317	Posted - 2015.02.23 23:59:00 - [55] - Quote I like derping a Gorgon into a city with popular roof uplink spam and watch as one swarm knocks the stupid thing out of the air... Also ran a Kaalakiota Tac HAV with no gunners the other day and nearly died after two launches... and got hit with another rail tank Killer of Grand Master Kubo by a shotgun, Gav by a BAR, and countless others
HOLY PERFECTION OUTCAST MERCS RISE of LEGION 42	Posted - 2015.02.24 00:01:00 - [56] - Quote I agree, and people need to stop hating on tanks. Flux you people *I WILL WIN... DESTINY*
Sir Dukey G0DS AM0NG MEN General Tso's Alliance 1776	Posted - 2015.02.24 00:02:00 - [57] - Quote True Adamance wrote: Sir Dukey wrote: Atiim is about to drop a bomb about how you as a tank driver have no skill like earlier today he said to a poor ADS pilot that he had no skill and should get gud when poor guy asked for ADS buff. He's right though. With no projectile drop, insanely fast firing rounds, potent modules, rapid regeneration, etc We don't need to be good. The hulls do it for us. I mean hell tanks barely exist in Dust as opposed to the IFV's the actually are. Vastly more interesting to tank in games like Battlefield or War Thunder. Compared to swarms which is press R1 hold and release. - Profit. Acquire Currency, Disregard Female Canis lupus familiaris
True Adamance Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 17227	Posted - 2015.02.24 00:12:00 - [58] - Quote Sir Dukey wrote: True Adamance wrote: Sir Dukey wrote: Atiim is about to drop a bomb about how you as a tank driver have no skill like earlier today he said to a poor ADS pilot that he had no skill and should get gud when poor guy asked for ADS buff. He's right though. With no projectile drop, insanely fast firing rounds, potent modules, rapid regeneration, etc We don't need to be good. The hulls do it for us. I mean hell tanks barely exist in Dust as opposed to the IFV's the actually are. Vastly more interesting to tank in games like Battlefield or War Thunder. Compared to swarms which is press R1 hold and release. - Profit. Two very different thing not worth comparing. "This is the Usumgal boy, the exalted dragon, wreathed in the fires of heaven. He is a true symbol of God's majesty."
QRT30 Rave Technologies Inc. C0VEN 76	Posted - 2015.02.24 08:30:00 - [59] - Quote Lorhak Gannarsein wrote: QRT30 wrote: But sniping in gunlogi with rail on redline is balanced? Good gunlogi tanker always escape out of my swarms lock range. I can shoot up to 3 volleys and you have still some shields and armor. How many times have you been killed by swarm? I'm very often being killed from rail tank from distance over 200 meters. How many times do you see over 2 minimatando in one match but 2-5 tanks are always. mate do you know how many WP I would get if there were always 2-5 tanks in a match? many. the answer is many. Shield tanks/dropships don't generate many WP before destroy. 80% of time I run as a logi, commandos even can't dream about that WP. QRT30 - all Caldari/Minimatar lvl 5, Gal all lvl.3 - core maxed QRT300 - Amarr heavy/commando


Pages: 1 2 :: [one page]

COPYRIGHT NOTICE
EVE Online/DUST514, the EVE/DUST514 logo, EVE/DUST514 and all associated logos and designs are the intellectual property of CCP hf. All artwork, screenshots, characters, vehicles, storylines, world facts or other recognizable features of the intellectual property relating to these trademarks are likewise the intellectual property of CCP hf. EVE Online and the EVE logo are the registered trademarks of CCP hf. All rights are reserved worldwide. All other trademarks are the property of their respective owners. CCP hf. has granted permission to OMG Labs to use EVE Online/DUST514 and all associated logos and designs for promotional and information purposes on its website but does not endorse, and is not in any way affiliated with, OMG Labs. CCP is in no way responsible for the content on or functioning of this website, nor can it be liable for any damage arising from the use of this website.

Acquire Currency, Disregard Female Canis lupus familiaris

Acquire Currency, Disregard Female Canis lupus familiaris