Yeah I'll just sit in the corner in my Assault suit, wait until mommy and daddy stop fighting.

These are your PARENTS????

No wonder you're incurably insane.

Do the universe a favor and shoot them repeatedly until common sense returns.

The real reason for this is the demographics--In general, people who play as heavy (not all, but most nowadays) are new players, who have a much lesser grasp of the in game mechanics or map features, or the way that CQC works, etc.

On the opposite end of the spectrum we have scouts--most of the scouts who are complaining about ridiculous heavy spam are among what I lovingly call the "OG Cult". We have been around for a very long time, and I can't speak for all, but most of us went through the days of Slayer Logi permascan AR 514 with our shoulders high, and our profiles low, proud to be some of the few who actually ran scouts since day 1. These are the players who know the maps, understand the mechanics, and have become powerful while their suit was in a bad place.

The heavy and the scout each attract their own types of players, however, the ones that are more liable to complain are the newer players, the ones that don't understand the mechanics or how they work, and by coincidence, these player's demographic is comprised mainly of heavies.

These new players seem to have some ingrained sense of entitltement to fair 1v1 fights where even a militia heavy straight from the academy could slaughter even the game's toughest scouts. The problem is, the inherent play style that the scout utilizes requires trickery, a basic knowledge of human psychology, and an deep in depth knowledge of in-game mechanics.

Most players find this unfair, and believe that by donning the all-mighty sentinel suit that they should somehow become invulnerable, and that things such as the use of tactics or even their personal gun game are useless in comparison to the incredible advantages given to them by donning said sentinel suit.

When they are killed by something that is smaller and faster than them, it seems like a spit in the face, and indeed, for many, it is. They know that their skill and knowledge of game mechanics was less than that of their opponents, yet refuse to admit it. Instead, they become bitter and frustrated as they know that their gear is inherently stronger, yet they cannot beat their opponents.

To this, I have to say--Suck it the **** up. Seriously. 6/10 of the scouts complaining have been scouts throughout the dark ages, where the supremacy of fine rifles and brick tanked logis with perma-scans reigned supreme, and many of us even thrived (to whatever extent we were allowed).

You HMG sentinels have been given superior weaponry and suits, yet refuse to adapt to a battlefield in which tactical decisions and gun-game matter.


Despite saying this, however--
Are scouts OP? Yes. Will Charlie fix that? Yes, for the most part. Some may need buffs post Charlie, others, nerfs.

And we do openly admit it. We understand the game mechanics and the reasons why certain scouts coughCaldaricough are OP.

--BUT!--

Are Sentinels OP? Yes. Will Charlie fix that? No, all it will do is make it so that core skills will need to be close to maxed or maxed to fit full proto.

However, the lack of acknowledgement of the issues making the sentinel OP as well as the condescending, brash, rude, degenerate, and occasionally illiterate ways that the Sentinel community represent themselves makes the glaring balance problems all the more annoying for many of us long-timers.

TL;DR-- The reason Sentinels complain so much about scouts is because they are generally newer players, and the very way the sentinel role works causes them to resent scouts in particular.

Are Sentinels OP? Yes. Will Charlie fix that? No, all it will do is make it so that core skills will need to be close to maxed or maxed to fit full proto.

If you ask me, I think a lot of heavies and scouts are talking pure sht.

Best thing said in this thread.

Thanks, in all honesty, there was never and has never been a dark age for scouts.

These supposed dark ages are where the less skilled fell through the cracks.

Just like the heavy dark age, yeah it was hard but still owned, the scrubs fell through the cracks.

Just like the assault dark age, yeah it was hard but still owned, the scrubs fell through the cracks.

Just like the logi dark age........I don't think I need to go on.

No the real reason people complain about scouts is because of fits like this.
http://www.protofits.com/fittings/shared/0/6343

This gallante suit has nearly 800 eHP
Even with penalties moves faater than a Minmatar assault suit
Has a profile capable of avoiding the majprity of scanners and all medium heavy, and other bricked scouts
Has a prescision capable of scanning ALL medium or heavy suits
Has nearly a 40m Scan Radius
Has a Cloak
Has Remote Explosoves
Has 3 HP/s Armour Regen
Has 30 HP/s Shield Regen (faster than the Minmatar Assault Suit)

This Suit outclasses the Assault Suit in EVERYWAY, while still having the same/more eHP.

No the real reason people complain about scouts is because of fits like this.
http://www.protofits.com/fittings/shared/0/6343

This gallante suit has nearly 800 eHP
Even with penalties moves faater than a Minmatar assault suit
Has a profile capable of avoiding the majprity of scanners and all medium heavy, and other bricked scouts
Has a prescision capable of scanning ALL medium or heavy suits
Has nearly a 40m Scan Radius
Has a Cloak
Has Remote Explosoves
Has 3 HP/s Armour Regen
Has 30 HP/s Shield Regen (faster than the Minmatar Assault Suit)

This Suit outclasses the Assault Suit in EVERYWAY, while still having the same/more eHP.

But with the buff to assaults, the "Assault scout" will hopefully disappear, and we can go back to being the shotgunners/NK'ers in the dark that we were built to be.

That fit that you linked has around a total of 400 hp's with NO kincat..
3x Plates provides 443 HP before base. This is a bare-faced lie

Garbage fit slower than a heavy...
This fits movement speed 4.67 m/s a heavies movement speee 3.72 m/s This is a bare-faced lie.

the Gallente suit DOES NOT FRICKEN HAVE anywheres NEAR 800 EHP..
The above fit has 760 eHP that's very near 800 eHP

With Nothing but plates and shield extenders you can get 600 Hp's but once again no kincat, and no dampening or precision = sitting duck.. you obviously dont have a scout ..
Even with no Kincat dampening or prescision you still have better speed, dampening and presiscion than any medium or heavy suits can logically achieve without having less than 500 eHP

We can only hope!
While I'm happy to let it play for the time being, it maybe we have to see a drop layout reduction.
The Scout can achieve everything and more than an Assault suit can, with minimal drawbacks.

You said Scouts were being complained at more than sentinels because sentinels were supposedly newer players.
The truth of the matter is simple.

Scouts are meant to be low eHP Assassins and eWAR masters.
They do this and more (that they shouldn't be able to)

Sentinels are meamt to be slow moving, high eHP walking tanks.
They do this and they do it well.

It is easier to say a scout is broken because it operates outside of its expected parameters, while the sentinel is not quite so cut and dry, because it does what it's supposed, the question is, does it do it too well?

Thats actually very good analysis of the current situation IMO

Give it a rest OP. You're constant whining about heavies is becoming tiresome. Maybe, just maybe the problem is that you're just not a good scout.

my problem with scouts is the amount of bullets it takes me to kill one most the time i nearly empty a clip of sub into them wile they are running head on towards me ur hp says u should die in seconds yet they manage to run at u though wat would kill any normal suit and pull out a shotgun jump then kill me i don't believe that is tactical at all its broken

No the real reason people complain about scouts is because of fits like this.
http://www.protofits.com/fittings/shared/0/6343

This gallante suit has nearly 800 eHP
Even with penalties moves faater than a Minmatar assault suit
Has a profile capable of avoiding the majprity of scanners and all medium heavy, and other bricked scouts
Has a prescision capable of scanning ALL medium or heavy suits
Has nearly a 40m Scan Radius
Has a Cloak
Has Remote Explosoves
Has 3 HP/s Armour Regen
Has 30 HP/s Shield Regen (faster than the Minmatar Assault Suit)

This Suit outclasses the Assault Suit in EVERYWAY, while still having the same/more eHP.

Your*

Secondly, please read what I wrote.

I'd just like to point out that that fit you've provided a link for, is not faster than a minmatar assault suit. In fact it's slower than a minmatar logistics suits.

I'll be the first to admit that scouts outclass assaults in almost every way, they're are too many advantages & too few disadvantages to using a scout suit. But when you have 700+ EHP on a scout suit, especially an armour tanked scout suit, you have to make sacrifices. The only scout suit that has no problem in playing the assault role effectively is the CalScout, which is by far the most OP scout suit.

Imho the reason that the skilled players have such an issue w/ the trash players (HMG users) is the ease of use. We had the same issue w/ the RR, it's not just that's it's OP, it's the fact that it's so unbelievably easy to use that is takes any and all skill out of the equation. It's baffling to me that anyone who uses the HMG can imply scout SG is ez mode.

The main reason I miss chromosome is the fact that more often than not, the deciding factor in a straight up fight regardless of what suit or weapon you were using, was player ability.

The scout SGers you see facerolling heavies and going 50/0 did so w/ less EHP than you, less DPS than you & less range than you. They didn't beat you b/c the scout suit's OP. They beat you b/c they're the better than you.

Admittedly not all scouts play this way, there are some who just tank their suits and camp w/ long range rifles... I don't see this as being a problem anymore b/c assaults will now do a far better job of it.

I'd just like to point out that that fit you've provided a link for, is not faster than a minmatar assault suit. In fact it's slower than a minmatar logistics suits.

I'll be the first to admit that scouts outclass assaults in almost every way, they're are too many advantages & too few disadvantages to using a scout suit. But when you have 700+ EHP on a scout suit, especially an armour tanked scout suit, you have to make sacrifices. The only scout suit that has no problem in playing the assault role effectively is the CalScout, which is by far the most OP scout suit.

Imho the reason that the skilled players have such an issue w/ the trash players (HMG users) is the ease of use. We had the same issue w/ the RR, it's not just that's it's OP, it's the fact that it's so unbelievably easy to use that is takes any and all skill out of the equation. It's baffling to me that anyone who uses the HMG can imply scout SG is ez mode.

The main reason I miss chromosome is the fact that more often than not, the deciding factor in a straight up fight regardless of what suit or weapon you were using, was player ability.

The scout SGers you see facerolling heavies and going 50/0 did so w/ less EHP than you, less DPS than you & less range than you. They didn't beat you b/c the scout suit's OP. They beat you b/c they're the better than you.

Admittedly not all scouts play this way, there are some who just tank their suits and camp w/ long range rifles... I don't see this as being a problem anymore b/c assaults will now do a far better job of it.

I'd just like to point out that that fit you've provided a link for, is not faster than a minmatar assault suit. In fact it's slower than a minmatar logistics suit.s
Yeah I'll acknowledge that, I originally read the wrong number, but despite having 3 plates it's still faster than the Minmatar Heavy.

I'll be the first to admit that scouts outclass assaults in almost every way, they're are too many advantages & too few disadvantages to using a scout suit right now. But when you have 700+ EHP on a scout suit, especially an armour tanked scout suit, you have to make sacrifices. Speed is of course, the main one.
The only scout suit that can effectively play the assault role w/o any real drawbacks is the CalScout, which is by far the most OP scout suit.
Very few sacrifices, then gallante do not need to sacrifice so many armour platesmfpr dampeners, the amarr can dual tank to sacrifice little overall. The only one at a disadvantage is the Min Scout because of it having such poor eHP.

Imho the reason that skilled players have such an issue w/ those that use the HMG is simply the ease of use. We had the same issue w/ the RR, it's not just that it's OP, it's the fact that it's so unbelievably easy to use that is takes any and all skill out of the equation. It's baffling to me that anyone who uses the HMG can imply that the scout SG combo is ez mode.
Saying the HMG requires no gun game is equally baffling, if skill was not part of the equation my poor skill with a HMG wouldn't pertain that I loose to an ADV Rifle, or that I wouldn't be capable of defeating a PRO sentinel with a STD shotgun on an ADV Assault suit. It all depends on your perception of skill, I personally do not count chop strafing as skillful, yet other players wouldn't do nearly as well as they do without it.

The HMG like Aim Assist is Anti-ChopStrafe which some people wrongly believe is removing skill.

The main reason I miss chromosome is the fact that more often than not, the deciding factor in a straight up fight regardless of what suit or weapon you were using, was player ability.
Which at the same time was one of chromes fatal flaws, I could bring a suit resistant to your weaponry, a weapon which was more powerful against your suit and still loose to you because your ability to abuse Hit detection was more superior than mine, that isn't even remotely fair. Player skill should not be the deciding factor in a 1v1 fight. Player skill should be having the awareness to retreat and re engage when the odds are clearly not in your favour.

The scout SGers you see facerolling heavies and going 50/0 did so w/ less EHP than you, less DPS than you & less range than you. They didn't beat you b/c the scout suit's OP. They beat you b/c they're the better than you.
This is circumstantial evidence, personally EVERY scout I HAVE PERSOANLLY seen facing rolling heavies and going 50/0 also has more eHP than I do, (while still maintaining all of the scouts other bonuses) are you telling me each and everyone one of those players are actually better than me or am I simply playing an UP suit?

Admittedly not all scouts play this way, there are some who just dual tank and camp w/ long range rifles... I don't see this as being a issue for much longer as assaults will now do it far more effectively.
As you and I both know theory and practice are rarely the same, but hopefully, yes we will see this come hotfix charlie

That fit that you linked has around a total of 400 hp's with NO kincat.. lol.. Garbage fit slower than a heavy... the Gallente suit DOES NOT FRICKEN HAVE anywheres NEAR 800 EHP.. With Nothing but plates and shield extenders you can get 600 Hp's but once again no kincat, and no dampening or precision = sitting duck.. you obviously dont have a scout ..

Lol... This post tho... Without statistical prove you say that most new players are heavies... I think we can all see that it would be a balance in between all suits, or even scouts and heavies for that fact... You just can't wait for hotfix charlie can you? No you want to see statistical prove that you can get easy kill on heavies with no effort involved... I would love to have an intelligent conversation with you, but... You are the best example of a QQ extremist... Bojo gives awesome arguments, try to be like him more... You are proving with every post you make that you don't want to negotiate these changes unless its laid 100% in your favor... You are starting to sound like a FOTM chaser...