Issue: Scouts and Assaults, even after the eventual buff to assaults suit, will have roles that are too similar.

Why? Because if there is no change to the scout suit there will be nothing stopping scouts from stacking hp and running as pseudo-assault suits.

Solution:Inconclusive, there are many ways to remedy said situation. The main remedy that scouts are banking on is that assaults become buffed to a point that it would be impractical for a scout to act as an assault. (Or that assaults become buffed to a point so that assault users are happy enough to forget that scouts can still perform the same role.)

Suggestion: As a gallente scout, assault, heavy, and logistics player, I believe that scouts should have their innate shield regeneration switched with that of the assaults. And that possibly lengthen the recharge delay of scout suits. (Generally the regeneration of health being so quick is the main issue I find with scout suits maybe add a delay to armor repair as well)

Why? Because I believe scouts should play the role of stealth and speed, if said shield changes are made it would deter scouts from attacking enemies in quick succession.

Ex: With the current hp regeneration a scout is able to Attack---->Cloak and hide for short amount of time-------Return attack again

With proposed change scouts will be more along the lines of Attack----->Cloak and hide for enough time to replenish------>return and attack. Assaults will use the latter method and fulfill their role at "assaulting. "

Also with said changes Caldari Scouts will be less tempted to just stack shields because the recharge time would not allow them to do so effectively. Gallente Scouts will also be less likely to become a brick tank because of the time it will take considerably longer to get shield back and armor repairers will become more attractive to run . (I thinks there should be another penalty to regeneration with the gallente scout, but it might even out because their innate armor repair is only 3hp/s not sure though)

Issue with this: Amarr and Minmatar scout will be gimped even more now that their shields(especially minmatar scout) will not replenish at the higher rate. (probably leave the recharge rates the same with these two suits so they have a better role on the battlefield, but conflicts with the whole "Caldari have the best regeneration of all suits" )

Hopefully better ideas will be given in the replies to this post, rather than just rage about not fixing scouts.

If there is anything I missed please point it out for me...

Honestly, scouts were complaining before that they had NO regen, mainly on Armor, requiring a logi.

The 3/s i feel is fine, but the assault needs a buff, maybe to 4 or 5/s, keeping it as 'slightly more regenerative' than a Scout.

Make shield delays 1s longer than the assault, eg 3/4 Seconds on Caldari Assault, 4/5 on Scout.

IMO, Assaults need better regen than Scouts/basic meds, but needs to not be monstrous.

Honestly, scouts were complaining before that they had NO regen, mainly on Armor, requiring a logi.

The 3/s i feel is fine, but the assault needs a buff, maybe to 4 or 5/s, keeping it as 'slightly more regenerative' than a Scout.

Make shield delays 1s longer than the assault, eg 3/4 Seconds on Caldari Assault, 4/5 on Scout.

IMO, Assaults need better regen than Scouts/basic meds, but needs to not be monstrous.

I don't think the issue with assault is the fact that scouts regen to fast(the assault do need faster regen just not scout level). The problem lies within how much HP the scouts has and how easy a scout can equip 1 of the 4 Racial Rifles,

I am working on a post now. I believe the best way to make a role for the assault player is to make them the RifleMen of Dust. They would give up the least amount of thing in order to fit one of the 4 rifles we have. Hopefully I will have my post done tonight. I believe we can balance the assault by changing the CPU/PG of a couple of modules along with smaller tweaks to the suits. If we limit the HP potential of the scout better then we can ensure the assault carves a niche between scouts and commandos.

Yes they are tanking because it works. I am suggesting we limit their stacking of hit points not reduce their regen. Even with my vision the Assault still needs a boost to regen just not become better then scouts. A scout needs to pop in hit you with a high alpha weapon and disappear. they need the high regen to fight like this. They do not need the 400-600 hit points.

Assaults need the 2% damage per level that commandos have. Commandos are changed to 20% increased magazine and max ammo capacity per level.

Assaults need a bonus that benefits their weapon, and a bonus that benefits their racial tank.

These examples are to illustrate a point.

Assault skill: 2% light/sidearm damage per level.

Amarr: 5% laser weaponry heat buildup and 5% armor plate efficiency per level
Caldari: 5% decreased reload of hybrid - rail weaponry and 5% efficiency to shield extenders per level
Gallente: 5% decreased hybrid - blaster weaponry kick and 5% efficiency to armor repairers per level
Minmatar: 10% increased projectile/explosive weapon magazine size and 10% efficiency to shield rechargers per level

This makes assaults a general purpose slayer suit, good at dealing damage with some staying power, but not near as much as heavies. Change bonuses as needed (personally I'd make minmatar have increased damage mod efficiency instead of recharger) to balance, but the idea remains. One racial weapon bonus, and one racial tank bonus.

I like the idea, but without some change to the scout suit, this change won't be enough to render the scout impractical for assault use. This is a good incentive for assaults to be assault suits(as if they can do anything else), however it would not in any way hinder scouts from being the assault suits they are at the moment.

My idea is to limit scout to 2 sidearms. Their job isn't to kill, its to scout and relay Intel. The sidearms allow it to defend itself long enough to break contact and escape.

Now assaults deal more damage, and scouts can't play as slayers.

I don't think regen on a scout should matter...

they should be dead in a few hits.

scouts should not have any shield or armor tank.... they are speed tankers (or should be).

a scout who is seen should be a dead scout. an unseen scout however should be a deadly scout...

I was against making cloaks less "cloaky" I think they should be invisible to all but scans. and I think they should move much quicker.
but a proto scout should die from a few shots from an std rifle, and 1/4 of a shotgun blast.

right now scouts do the assaults job better than the assault should be able to do it.

Issue: Scouts and Assaults, even after the eventual buff to assaults suit, will have roles that are too similar.

Why? Because if there is no change to the scout suit there will be nothing stopping scouts from stacking hp and running as pseudo-assault suits.

Solution:Inconclusive, there are many ways to remedy said situation. The main remedy that scouts are banking on is that assaults become buffed to a point that it would be impractical for a scout to act as an assault. (Or that assaults become buffed to a point so that assault users are happy enough to forget that scouts can still perform the same role.)

Suggestion: As a gallente scout, assault, heavy, and logistics player, I believe that scouts should have their innate shield regeneration switched with that of the assaults. And that possibly lengthen the recharge delay of scout suits. (Generally the regeneration of health being so quick is the main issue I find with scout suits maybe add a delay to armor repair as well)

Why? Because I believe scouts should play the role of stealth and speed, if said shield changes are made it would deter scouts from attacking enemies in quick succession.

Ex: With the current hp regeneration a scout is able to Attack---->Cloak and hide for short amount of time-------Return attack again

With proposed change scouts will be more along the lines of Attack----->Cloak and hide for enough time to replenish------>return and attack. Assaults will use the latter method and fulfill their role at "assaulting. "

Also with said changes Caldari Scouts will be less tempted to just stack shields because the recharge time would not allow them to do so effectively. Gallente Scouts will also be less likely to become a brick tank because of the time it will take considerably longer to get shield back and armor repairers will become more attractive to run . (I thinks there should be another penalty to regeneration with the gallente scout, but it might even out because their innate armor repair is only 3hp/s not sure though)

Issue with this: Amarr and Minmatar scout will be gimped even more now that their shields(especially minmatar scout) will not replenish at the higher rate. (probably leave the recharge rates the same with these two suits so they have a better role on the battlefield, but conflicts with the whole "Caldari have the best regeneration of all suits" )

Hopefully better ideas will be given in the replies to this post, rather than just rage about not fixing scouts.

If there is anything I missed please point it out for me...

****** idea beyond sh*t.

Changing the Recharge rate or delay of the scout will only cause Caldari Scouts to become Gallenete brick tank scouts. Who can still scan down your assault suit or make the scout suit disappear from the battle field. Lets look at some examples I see playing out.

Scout 1 has high regen and low hit points.
He does his job and sneak behind your team and shotguns someone in the back. You hear the shot turn and hit him a few times. The scout breaks combat and tries to escape. His high recharge allow him to gain back some of that life back so he can take another hit from you before finding cover or disappearing.

Scout 2 has lower then assault regen and low hit points(he attempting to be a scout)
He does his job and sneak behind your team and shotguns someone in the back and hits you with a couple of smg bullets. You hear the shot turn and hit him a few times. Now he can try to break combat and run away, but you regen faster then he does so it benefits you if combat is broken, He could stay an fight and attempt to out last you with inferior hit points but will most likely die. If he runs you can pursue him and put the last bullet in him before he finds cover.

Scout 3 has lower then assault regen and high hit points(Scout 2 learned to not be a scout)
He does his job and sneak up behind your team. Guns down you squad mate with his CR and starts hitting you. You return fire. Now Scout 3 already knows it more beneficial to you if combat breaks so he in it for the long haul and is fully plated up. Due to the plates their is a marginal difference between your Hit points and scout got the drop on you. Your losing the hit point war so you try to break combat to make use of your high regen but the scout is faster then you and it not going to let you escape. You die.

Example 1
Scout 1 was rewarded for playing his role and feels good about the choices he made. And in this case even if he didn't find cover he probably blames himself for dying.

Example 2
Scout 2 receive no reward for doing playing his role. Yes he killed a guy but he can't escape from you.

Example 3
Scout 3 was able to gun down 2 people because it was better for him to play like an assault and tank up due to not having high regen. He also learned the using niche weapon that require position are not worth the effort and instead sticks solely to the Rifles. Scout 3 wants to fight like scout 1 but if he tries he ends up being like scout 2. So Scout 3 become an assault scout so he can still enjoy the game.


The biggest issue that we have balancing suits is the CPU and PG cost of modules. Look at the scout, it is easier to fit armor plates and shield regulators in a low slot then it is to fit Kin Cats and Code breakers. Its cheaper to fit Combat rifles then shotguns. Why regulate yourself to an intended role when you can equip more stuff by acting like an assault.


(I would like to thank everyone this has been a good discussion on the matter)