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Tanks and cloaked scouts have ruined this game.

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SirManBoy Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 480	Posted - 2014.04.07 03:39:00 - [1] - Quote Thanks to tanks and cloaked scouts, it blows to play Dust now. It's a shame because this game felt really good around build 1.6. and remained tolerable until 1.8. Seriously, how is anyone that's not a scout or tanker enjoying the game in its current state? I just don't see how it's possible, especially for support logis. I went from being a force multiplier who regularly got my squad 3,000+ WP from reps, uplinks, and other support actions to becoming lunch meat for 70K ISK tanks and invisible scouts with shottys. I'm legitimately sad, bros; I love Dust but I hate going into matches now.
Lorhak Gannarsein Science For Death 2633	Posted - 2014.04.07 03:40:00 - [2] - Quote Tanks are nerfed. They're pretty balanced at the moment; I think a small nerf to armour repairers and a large nerf to damage mods would sort us out EDIT: also blasters are fucken ridiculous. I've been using an MLT one on a soma and ripping up everything. ak.0 4 LYFE je ne regrette rien
Sourdough Muffins Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire 18	Posted - 2014.04.07 03:41:00 - [3] - Quote O RLY?
aden slayer Condotta Rouvenor Gallente Federation 611	Posted - 2014.04.07 03:42:00 - [4] - Quote Damn you guys try so hard to get something that kills you over and over again nerfed. Keep trying so hard.
Funkmaster Whale Ancient Exiles. 1742	Posted - 2014.04.07 03:45:00 - [5] - Quote There's a FotM every patch that "ruins" the game. It's just how CCP's balance philosophy works. They have no idea how to do things in baby steps. People whine about tanks being nerfed, they make them OP. People whine about Scouts being nerfed, they make them OP. They make these sweeping changes without really taking the warning signs from the players. All signs pointed to Scouts, Heavies, and Tanks being the only relevant things prior to 1.8. Lo and behold, here we are and there's not an Assault or Logi suit in sight save for the masochists who still cling to some sense of false hope. I gave up on that long ago. "When game is going full r-tard, you can only go with it. If you start going against it, if you start going half r-tard, you-¦re f-cking done for." -n0tail 2014 Let me play you the song of my people!
Tectonic Fusion 1433	Posted - 2014.04.07 03:50:00 - [6] - Quote Funkmaster Whale wrote: There's a FotM every patch that "ruins" the game. It's just how CCP's balance philosophy works. They have no idea how to do things in baby steps. People whine about tanks being nerfed, they make them OP. People whine about Scouts being nerfed, they make them OP. They make these sweeping changes without really taking the warning signs from the players. All signs pointed to Scouts, Heavies, and Tanks being the only relevant things prior to 1.8. Lo and behold, here we are and there's not an Assault or Logi suit in sight save for the masochists who still cling to some sense of false hope. I gave up on that long ago. "When game is going full r-tard, you can only go with it. If you start going against it, if you start going half r-tard, you-¦re f-cking done for." -n0tail 2014 True, I only use my assault suits if the enemy doesn't need to be flanked or if they are spamming heavys. Solo Player Squad status: Locked
Vinny Gar grief thief 18	Posted - 2014.04.07 03:51:00 - [7] - Quote With the increasing number of ways to die, I think the key is to diversify.(sorry for going dr. suess there...) In my opinion it is better to have your skill points spread to some degree than to be highly specialized in just one role. That is unless you're playing as part of a full platoon where everyone has there own specific function. I feel that the casual player needs to have a counter for many situations. Now I'm not necessarily saying that you don't have a wide array of suits; I'm just saying it in general. I also think tanks are close to being balanced, but I will agree that cloaks are op and quite game breaking. cosbyness is next to godliness
Operative 1171 Aajli Bragian Order Amarr Empire 1796	Posted - 2014.04.07 03:57:00 - [8] - Quote Lorhak Gannarsein wrote: Tanks are nerfed. They're pretty balanced at the moment; I think a small nerf to armour repairers and a large nerf to damage mods would sort us out EDIT: also blasters are fucken ridiculous. I've been using an MLT one on a soma and ripping up everything. This is the problem. Anybody can pull out a great tank. It's that easy. Militia no longer means "Just to try out and see if you want to train it up". Now we have to hear the fanbois say we should adapt. We should have to go tank to put up with tanks, we should have to go scout to put up with scouts. How about we remember that this is a product, it is changable and, like George Lucas fcking over Star Wars CCP is fcking over their game. They will end up with no customers or at least a small player base of temp console kiddies who happened upon their cute little freebieware. The distance that this game is getting from EVE and it's connection with EVE is laughable. Brick tanking a scout suit since April 2013!
Darken-Sol BIG BAD W0LVES Canis Eliminatus Operatives 1183	Posted - 2014.04.07 03:57:00 - [9] - Quote Try being a cloaked scout in a tank. Crush them
deepfried salad gilliam Sanguine Knights 633	Posted - 2014.04.07 03:59:00 - [10] - Quote i believe medium frames are supposed to get a slot and pg/cpu rework this next build It'll help define roles, i promise:)

Harpyja Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 1529	Posted - 2014.04.07 04:08:00 - [11] - Quote Hmm, that's funny, because my infantry alt is loving 1.8. Cloaked scouts are forcing me to stay alert and on my toes. One time, I was running over to counterhack an underground objective, and there was a blueberry that beat me to it by 100m. That blueberry got killed by a cloaked scout waiting for prey as he was counterhacking, and I was smart enough to realize what was going on. I ran over to the console but immediately turned around to see a scout decloak from the darkness and I dropped him after we made a quick dance around the central column. Then I proceeded to counterhack the objective. Lorhak Gannarsein wrote: Tanks are nerfed. They're pretty balanced at the moment; I think a small nerf to armour repairers and a large nerf to damage mods would sort us out EDIT: also blasters are fucken ridiculous. I've been using an MLT one on a soma and ripping up everything. Check out my thread regarding Balancing the Large Turrets "By His light, and His will" - The Scriptures, Gheinok the First, 12:32 Atiim didn't agree with limiting tanks!
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 7835	Posted - 2014.04.07 04:29:00 - [12] - Quote o.0 EDIT: Here's a tip. Bring a Caldari Scout into your squad. He will be your "eyes of god". Cloaky scouts will not be able to hide from them unless they are proto Gallente scouts will fully stacked profile damps. Dedicated Scout // Ninja Knifer Everything I know about the Caldari I learned at Nouvelle Rouvenor
True Adamance Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 9292	Posted - 2014.04.07 04:30:00 - [13] - Quote SirManBoy wrote: Thanks to tanks and cloaked scouts, it blows to play Dust now. It's a shame because this game felt really good around build 1.6. and remained tolerable until 1.8. Seriously, how is anyone that's not a scout or tanker enjoying the game in its current state? I just don't see how it's possible, especially for support logis. I went from being a force multiplier who regularly got my squad 3,000+ WP from reps, uplinks, and other support actions to becoming lunch meat for 70K ISK tanks and invisible scouts with shottys. I'm legitimately sad, bros; I love Dust but I hate going into matches now. Sorry to hear that. Dust is actually significantly more enjoyable as of 1.8.... best its been since Chromosome. "Get thine Swag out of my face! Next you'll be writing #YOLOswagforJamyl in all your posts!" -Dagger Two
Magnus Amadeuss Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 694	Posted - 2014.04.07 04:33:00 - [14] - Quote Lorhak Gannarsein wrote: Tanks are nerfed. They're pretty balanced at the moment; I think a small nerf to armour repairers and a large nerf to damage mods would sort us out EDIT: also blasters are fucken ridiculous. I've been using an MLT one on a soma and ripping up everything. Tanks were nerfed at the same time all infantry were nerfed. Infantry lost 50% to damage modifiers Infantry lost 50% to proficiency Infantry lost 33% AV grenade capacity Tankers lost ~30% to hardners. Relatively, tanks weren't really nerfed, and non-hardner tanks (like 3 repper tanks) were actually boosted. Fixing swarms
Chesyre Armundsen Thanes Of Dust 486	Posted - 2014.04.07 04:36:00 - [15] - Quote I would say that 1.8 has brought about the greatest change and diversity in DUST and it will continue to do so. Thinking that the game is being broken by CCP by making changes is too simple of a viewpoint. If you make a adjustments things will change, and we all know that DUST is far from static. CCP could easily leave everything set on stone from day 1, but they listen to our feedback (and that's everyone's on either side of an argument) then make alterations that they feel will help drive the game towards their overall vision. Try no to be narrow minded and looking at DUST as another game with DLC packs to give you another mode, maps or weapons to keep things fresh. DUST will grow ad change and as Mercs it's our job to learn how the battlefield is changing and adapt. Never saw jihad jeeps as an option to kill HAV's and then poof they show up because of a need. It's like the changing face of contemporary warfare. I don't want DUST to be a game that requires things like COD Ghosts Predator https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JLYUdzpGYX4 OR Titanfall Optimus Prime https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BX2qCpRxilM That would be the day we jump the shark IMO Mihi gravato Deus - "Let God lay the burden on me!" The Space Hippie
RuckingFetard Better Hide R Die 768	Posted - 2014.04.07 04:37:00 - [16] - Quote Disagree. 1.8 reminds me a lot of when I first started playing dust Running pure shield tanked Caldari 'cuz me a hippy
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 7836	Posted - 2014.04.07 04:48:00 - [17] - Quote Chesyre Armundsen wrote: I would say that 1.8 has brought about the greatest change and diversity in DUST and it will continue to do so. Thinking that the game is being broken by CCP by making changes is too simple of a viewpoint. If you make a adjustments things will change, and we all know that DUST is far from static. CCP could easily leave everything set on stone from day 1, but they listen to our feedback (and that's everyone's on either side of an argument) then make alterations that they feel will help drive the game towards their overall vision. Try no to be narrow minded and looking at DUST as another game with DLC packs to give you another mode, maps or weapons to keep things fresh. DUST will grow ad change and as Mercs it's our job to learn how the battlefield is changing and adapt. Never saw jihad jeeps as an option to kill HAV's and then poof they show up because of a need. It's like the changing face of contemporary warfare. I don't want DUST to be a game that requires things like COD Ghosts Predator https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JLYUdzpGYX4 OR Titanfall Optimus Prime https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BX2qCpRxilM That would be the day we jump the shark IMO Exactly. When the cross bow was introduced in the real world back in the middle ages, suddenly the dynamics of the battlefield changed because now you have a easy-mode weapon that can accurately fire an arrow at range and not have to invest much of any training to use it. Then the cannon was introduced. Then the flint-lock or musket came in. Then the AK-47 and now drones and computer viruses in modern warfare. War changes. It's up to us to adapt to those changes. Dedicated Scout // Ninja Knifer Everything I know about the Caldari I learned at Nouvelle Rouvenor
Lorhak Gannarsein Science For Death 2635	Posted - 2014.04.07 04:51:00 - [18] - Quote Magnus Amadeuss wrote: Lorhak Gannarsein wrote: Tanks are nerfed. They're pretty balanced at the moment; I think a small nerf to armour repairers and a large nerf to damage mods would sort us out EDIT: also blasters are fucken ridiculous. I've been using an MLT one on a soma and ripping up everything. Tanks were nerfed at the same time all infantry were nerfed. Infantry lost 50% to damage modifiers Infantry lost 50% to proficiency Infantry lost 33% AV grenade capacity Tankers lost ~30% to hardners. Relatively, tanks weren't really nerfed, and non-hardner tanks (like 3 repper tanks) were actually boosted. Not a proportionate nerf. That's 15% damage from my forge, which does not conpensate for the lost EHP. Especially since now everything breaks my regeneration. Definitely passive tanks got a buff, which makes them actually useful now. But the tank nerf was more significant, generally speaking, than the AV nerf was. ak.0 4 LYFE je ne regrette rien
Dexter307 The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar 1338	Posted - 2014.04.07 05:04:00 - [19] - Quote Seems that everything is viable except assaults and logis to a degree Seems obvious what needs to be done #mediumbuff
Khulmach Paladin Survey Force Amarr Empire 4	Posted - 2014.04.07 05:20:00 - [20] - Quote I agree with the tanks,but not the cloaks

Supernus Gigas sNk Syndicate 717	Posted - 2014.04.07 05:22:00 - [21] - Quote Maken Tosch wrote: ...War changes... Try telling that to Ron Perlman. *FIRE UP THE HEAVY MEAT GRINDER! WE'RE HAVIN' CLONE BURGERS TONIGHT, BOYS!*
Galvan Nized Deep Space Republic 857	Posted - 2014.04.07 05:28:00 - [22] - Quote Dexter307 wrote: Seems that everything is viable except assaults and logis to a degree Seems obvious what needs to be done #mediumbuff Wait, why are logis non viable? Logis don't need anything.
Harpyja Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 1532	Posted - 2014.04.07 05:29:00 - [23] - Quote Magnus Amadeuss wrote: Lorhak Gannarsein wrote: Tanks are nerfed. They're pretty balanced at the moment; I think a small nerf to armour repairers and a large nerf to damage mods would sort us out EDIT: also blasters are fucken ridiculous. I've been using an MLT one on a soma and ripping up everything. Tanks were nerfed at the same time all infantry were nerfed. Infantry lost 50% to damage modifiers Infantry lost 50% to proficiency Infantry lost 33% AV grenade capacity Tankers lost ~30% to hardners. Relatively, tanks weren't really nerfed, and non-hardner tanks (like 3 repper tanks) were actually boosted. Not even close. I take on 50% more damage, and all of those damnable swarms break my hardened regen, not just the really dedicated and invested ones. Your damage nerf is almost cute next to my EHP nerf. You have no reason to complain. AV vs tanks is perfectly balanced. It's just that tank vs tank got f***ed up the ass while making it perfect. "By His light, and His will" - The Scriptures, Gheinok the First, 12:32 Atiim didn't agree with limiting tanks!
Magnus Amadeuss Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 695	Posted - 2014.04.07 06:01:00 - [24] - Quote Lorhak Gannarsein wrote: Magnus Amadeuss wrote: Lorhak Gannarsein wrote: Tanks are nerfed. They're pretty balanced at the moment; I think a small nerf to armour repairers and a large nerf to damage mods would sort us out EDIT: also blasters are fucken ridiculous. I've been using an MLT one on a soma and ripping up everything. Tanks were nerfed at the same time all infantry were nerfed. Infantry lost 50% to damage modifiers Infantry lost 50% to proficiency Infantry lost 33% AV grenade capacity Tankers lost ~30% to hardners. Relatively, tanks weren't really nerfed, and non-hardner tanks (like 3 repper tanks) were actually boosted. Not a proportionate nerf. That's 15% damage from my forge, which does not conpensate for the lost EHP. Especially since now everything breaks my regeneration. Definitely passive tanks got a buff, which makes them actually useful now. But the tank nerf was more significant, generally speaking, than the AV nerf was. Everything AV should have always broke your regeneration. That was an obvious f-up (it was put in so that infantry weapons wouldn't break your regeneration, not AV). I actually did make some charts and graphs about it, but I feel like that would be overkill. Lets just say that the differences aren't that major in any way shape of form. Sure, tanks were definitely nerfed versus tank weaponry, but hte nerf versus our current AV wasn't nearly as bad, especially if you are an armor tanker. For example: Dual hardned madruger vs triple dmg mod lvl 5 proficiency swarms Pre 1.8 427 dmg Post 1.8 482 damage. Of course the nerf is harsher the more hardners you would have normally fit, meaning a 3 hardner gunnlogi/madruger got nerfed way harder than a 1 hardner boat did. Oddly enough, this also means that max hardner sica/somas didn't get nerfed as hard as max hardner gunnlogis/madrugars. Also upon further review, shield hardners were nerfed WAY hard than armor hardners. It is actually pretty insane the difference in the nerfs. For instance: Damage let through armor/(shield) 3 hardner pre 1.8 30%/(12.5%) 3 hardner post 1.8 50.3%/(30.2%) This means that the armor hardner setup is letting though 1.66 times more damage while the shield hardner setup is letting through 2.4 times more damage. Wow, man if you guys ever want a more detailed anaylysis of how shield tankers got screwed compared to armor tankers, let me know. Fixing swarms
Piraten Hovnoret Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 458	Posted - 2014.04.07 06:05:00 - [25] - Quote About scouts Idk if you have noticed in the killing numbers after the game. There is wery few cloked scouts rocking like 20-1. So many tourist scouts out there. Regards War never changes
G Torq ALTA B2O 617	Posted - 2014.04.07 06:09:00 - [26] - Quote Funkmaster Whale wrote: There's a FotM every patch that "ruins" the game. It's just how CCP's balance philosophy works. Completely independent of how CCP does things, there will always be a FotM. Yes, even if shite was perfectly balanced (impossible in a finite universe), players would still "find" what they believe is a superior fitting, and run it lemming-style. Team Fairy DUST HTTP://Dust.Thang.DK/ - DUST514 Fitting Tool based on DUST SDE
True Adamance Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 9298	Posted - 2014.04.07 06:10:00 - [27] - Quote Magnus Amadeuss wrote: Lorhak Gannarsein wrote: Magnus Amadeuss wrote: Lorhak Gannarsein wrote: Tanks are nerfed. They're pretty balanced at the moment; I think a small nerf to armour repairers and a large nerf to damage mods would sort us out EDIT: also blasters are fucken ridiculous. I've been using an MLT one on a soma and ripping up everything. Tanks were nerfed at the same time all infantry were nerfed. Infantry lost 50% to damage modifiers Infantry lost 50% to proficiency Infantry lost 33% AV grenade capacity Tankers lost ~30% to hardners. Relatively, tanks weren't really nerfed, and non-hardner tanks (like 3 repper tanks) were actually boosted. Not a proportionate nerf. That's 15% damage from my forge, which does not conpensate for the lost EHP. Especially since now everything breaks my regeneration. Definitely passive tanks got a buff, which makes them actually useful now. But the tank nerf was more significant, generally speaking, than the AV nerf was. Everything AV should have always broke your regeneration. That was an obvious f-up (it was put in so that infantry weapons wouldn't break your regeneration, not AV). I actually did make some charts and graphs about it, but I feel like that would be overkill. Lets just say that the differences aren't that major in any way shape of form. Sure, tanks were definitely nerfed versus tank weaponry, but hte nerf versus our current AV wasn't nearly as bad, especially if you are an armor tanker. For example: Dual hardned madruger vs triple dmg mod lvl 5 proficiency swarms Pre 1.8 427 dmg Post 1.8 482 damage. Of course the nerf is harsher the more hardners you would have normally fit, meaning a 3 hardner gunnlogi/madruger got nerfed way harder than a 1 hardner boat did. Oddly enough, this also means that max hardner sica/somas didn't get nerfed as hard as max hardner gunnlogis/madrugars. Also upon further review, shield hardners were nerfed WAY hard than armor hardners. It is actually pretty insane the difference in the nerfs. For instance: Damage let through armor/(shield) 3 hardner pre 1.8 30%/(12.5%) 3 hardner post 1.8 50.3%/(30.2%) This means that the armor hardner setup is letting though 1.66 times more damage while the shield hardner setup is letting through 2.4 times more damage. Wow, man if you guys ever want a more detailed anaylysis of how shield tankers got screwed compared to armor tankers, let me know. Actually in regeneration tanking traditionally regen never stops..... its constantly on going. Which is what makes the Drake such a powerful passive shield tanker. "Get thine Swag out of my face! Next you'll be writing #YOLOswagforJamyl in all your posts!" -Dagger Two
Magnus Amadeuss Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 695	Posted - 2014.04.07 06:40:00 - [28] - Quote Harpyja wrote: Magnus Amadeuss wrote: Lorhak Gannarsein wrote: Tanks are nerfed. They're pretty balanced at the moment; I think a small nerf to armour repairers and a large nerf to damage mods would sort us out EDIT: also blasters are fucken ridiculous. I've been using an MLT one on a soma and ripping up everything. Tanks were nerfed at the same time all infantry were nerfed. Infantry lost 50% to damage modifiers Infantry lost 50% to proficiency Infantry lost 33% AV grenade capacity Tankers lost ~30% to hardners. Relatively, tanks weren't really nerfed, and non-hardner tanks (like 3 repper tanks) were actually boosted. Not even close. I take on 50% more damage, and all of those damnable swarms break my hardened regen, not just the really dedicated and invested ones. Your damage nerf is almost cute next to my EHP nerf. You have no reason to complain. AV vs tanks is perfectly balanced. It's just that tank vs tank got f***ed up the ass while making it perfect. No it isn't. IT really isn't. The only way you take on 52% more damage, and this is only from other vehicles) is if you were running a triple hardened gunnlogi. A triple hardened gunnlogi now takes 19% of tank damage, rather than 12.5% of tank damage. Still quite good I would say. So what is 75% of 19% in the case of current AV versus shields? 14.25% damage, that is how much damage you take from swarms and forge guns, rather than 12.5%. That is not a large nerf. Oh and as for versus AV? A triple hardened gunnlogi only takes 357 damage from a fully maxed out prototype swarm launcher with 3 damage mods. That means you could potentially have 2 fully proto'd out swarm launchers firing at you at the exact same time, and they still wouldn't have the damage to kill you without a re-load... assuming you stuck around that long. Fixing swarms
Crimson ShieId Psygod9 D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 328	Posted - 2014.04.07 06:42:00 - [29] - Quote SirManBoy wrote: Thanks to tanks and cloaked scouts, it blows to play Dust now. It's a shame because this game felt really good around build 1.6. and remained tolerable until 1.8. Seriously, how is anyone that's not a scout or tanker enjoying the game in its current state? I just don't see how it's possible, especially for support logis. I went from being a force multiplier who regularly got my squad 3,000+ WP from reps, uplinks, and other support actions to becoming lunch meat for 70K ISK tanks and invisible scouts with shottys. I'm legitimately sad, bros; I love Dust but I hate going into matches now. I've actually been doing pretty good in my ADV Minmatar Commando. Only died a handful of times to cloaked scouts, and it's extremely satisfying to pop an invisishotgunner in the face with grenade from one. As long as you're observant, the scouts won't get you too often. I'm actually surprised by how few people I've seen camping objectives with the cloaks. As for the tanks, the spam has honestly gone down a fair bit. AV seems to be doing something to them again, and while things aren't nearly back to the levels they were before 1.7, they feel good for the most part... the only thing I can see ruining the game right now is the glitches and the lack of entertaining new roles or weapons (Sure, we got em, but two of em are bugged and the third is more of a lolweapon than anything) CCP, can I get a fully automatic plasma cannon with like... five shots in a clip? ... or a heavy laser... I'll take a heavy laser too... or fighters, those would be nice... Nova Knives are OP! Nerf em before you lose all your proto suits!
Magnus Amadeuss Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 695	Posted - 2014.04.07 06:43:00 - [30] - Quote True Adamance wrote: Magnus Amadeuss wrote: Lorhak Gannarsein wrote: Magnus Amadeuss wrote: Lorhak Gannarsein wrote: Tanks are nerfed. They're pretty balanced at the moment; I think a small nerf to armour repairers and a large nerf to damage mods would sort us out EDIT: also blasters are fucken ridiculous. I've been using an MLT one on a soma and ripping up everything. Tanks were nerfed at the same time all infantry were nerfed. Infantry lost 50% to damage modifiers Infantry lost 50% to proficiency Infantry lost 33% AV grenade capacity Tankers lost ~30% to hardners. Relatively, tanks weren't really nerfed, and non-hardner tanks (like 3 repper tanks) were actually boosted. Not a proportionate nerf. That's 15% damage from my forge, which does not conpensate for the lost EHP. Especially since now everything breaks my regeneration. Definitely passive tanks got a buff, which makes them actually useful now. But the tank nerf was more significant, generally speaking, than the AV nerf was. Everything AV should have always broke your regeneration. That was an obvious f-up (it was put in so that infantry weapons wouldn't break your regeneration, not AV). I actually did make some charts and graphs about it, but I feel like that would be overkill. Lets just say that the differences aren't that major in any way shape of form. Sure, tanks were definitely nerfed versus tank weaponry, but hte nerf versus our current AV wasn't nearly as bad, especially if you are an armor tanker. For example: Dual hardned madruger vs triple dmg mod lvl 5 proficiency swarms Pre 1.8 427 dmg Post 1.8 482 damage. Of course the nerf is harsher the more hardners you would have normally fit, meaning a 3 hardner gunnlogi/madruger got nerfed way harder than a 1 hardner boat did. Oddly enough, this also means that max hardner sica/somas didn't get nerfed as hard as max hardner gunnlogis/madrugars. Also upon further review, shield hardners were nerfed WAY hard than armor hardners. It is actually pretty insane the difference in the nerfs. For instance: Damage let through armor/(shield) 3 hardner pre 1.8 30%/(12.5%) 3 hardner post 1.8 50.3%/(30.2%) This means that the armor hardner setup is letting though 1.66 times more damage while the shield hardner setup is letting through 2.4 times more damage. Wow, man if you guys ever want a more detailed anaylysis of how shield tankers got screwed compared to armor tankers, let me know. Actually in regeneration tanking traditionally regen never stops..... its constantly on going. Which is what makes the Drake such a powerful passive shield tanker. What does that have to do with anything? There is a passive tank, it is called the madruger with 2-3 armor reps. I am not sure why CCP made the armor tanker the passive tanker, but they did. Shields were meant to regen when not under fire from other tanks/AV. Triple hardeners allowed shields to regen while under fire from AV. This was not CCP's intention (when asked, they said that they set the damage threshold so that small arms couldn't stop regen, not AV) Fixing swarms

HYENAKILLER X WILL FIGHT ANYONE 712	Posted - 2014.04.07 06:52:00 - [31] - Quote SirManBoy wrote: Thanks to tanks and cloaked scouts, it blows to play Dust now. It's a shame because this game felt really good around build 1.6. and remained tolerable until 1.8. Seriously, how is anyone that's not a scout or tanker enjoying the game in its current state? I just don't see how it's possible, especially for support logis. I went from being a force multiplier who regularly got my squad 3,000+ WP from reps, uplinks, and other support actions to becoming lunch meat for 70K ISK tanks and invisible scouts with shottys. I'm legitimately sad, bros; I love Dust but I hate going into matches now. Agree 1000000000%. Cloaks should only be for nova knives and nova knives should be part of av. Im not from new eden. I dont need back up, political power or support. I, unlike you dont fear nuetral territory.
Magnus Amadeuss Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 695	Posted - 2014.04.07 06:57:00 - [32] - Quote Harpyja wrote: Magnus Amadeuss wrote: Lorhak Gannarsein wrote: Tanks are nerfed. They're pretty balanced at the moment; I think a small nerf to armour repairers and a large nerf to damage mods would sort us out EDIT: also blasters are fucken ridiculous. I've been using an MLT one on a soma and ripping up everything. Tanks were nerfed at the same time all infantry were nerfed. Infantry lost 50% to damage modifiers Infantry lost 50% to proficiency Infantry lost 33% AV grenade capacity Tankers lost ~30% to hardners. Relatively, tanks weren't really nerfed, and non-hardner tanks (like 3 repper tanks) were actually boosted. Not even close. I take on 50% more damage, and all of those damnable swarms break my hardened regen, not just the really dedicated and invested ones. Your damage nerf is almost cute next to my EHP nerf. You have no reason to complain. AV vs tanks is perfectly balanced. It's just that tank vs tank got f***ed up the ass while making it perfect. Exactly close. My numbers are correct. AV is meant to break your regen, it always has been. CCP stated they set the threshold so that small arms fire wouldn't prevent regen, not AV. AV versus tanks is not balanced. Your triple hardned gunnlogi takes 200 dmg from standard swarms instead of 100 now, that is still absolutely pitiful. It would take 15 volleys just to try and crack your shield assuming they wouldn't regen (which they would) between reloads. No proto suit in the game is immune to 100% free starter suits (they die quite easily to them), but your gunnlogi is 100% immune to a solo standard swarmer, you know, AV'er, your dedicated counter. Yep that is broken. Fixing swarms
Dexter307 The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar 1345	Posted - 2014.04.07 21:27:00 - [33] - Quote Galvan Nized wrote: Dexter307 wrote: Seems that everything is viable except assaults and logis to a degree Seems obvious what needs to be done #mediumbuff Wait, why are logis non viable? Logis don't need anything. Equipment nerf mainly
Eruditus 920 Bragian Order Amarr Empire 16	Posted - 2014.04.08 01:03:00 - [34] - Quote Then leave. I'm sick of all the belly achin' about this. "It is well that war is so terrible, lest we should grow too fond of it." -Robert E. Lee
Vitharr Foebane Living Like Larry Schwag 997	Posted - 2014.04.08 01:13:00 - [35] - Quote Maken Tosch wrote: Chesyre Armundsen wrote: I would say that 1.8 has brought about the greatest change and diversity in DUST and it will continue to do so. Thinking that the game is being broken by CCP by making changes is too simple of a viewpoint. If you make a adjustments things will change, and we all know that DUST is far from static. CCP could easily leave everything set on stone from day 1, but they listen to our feedback (and that's everyone's on either side of an argument) then make alterations that they feel will help drive the game towards their overall vision. Try no to be narrow minded and looking at DUST as another game with DLC packs to give you another mode, maps or weapons to keep things fresh. DUST will grow ad change and as Mercs it's our job to learn how the battlefield is changing and adapt. Never saw jihad jeeps as an option to kill HAV's and then poof they show up because of a need. It's like the changing face of contemporary warfare. I don't want DUST to be a game that requires things like COD Ghosts Predator https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JLYUdzpGYX4 OR Titanfall Optimus Prime https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BX2qCpRxilM That would be the day we jump the shark IMO Exactly. When the cross bow was introduced in the real world back in the middle ages, suddenly the dynamics of the battlefield changed because now you have a easy-mode weapon that can accurately fire an arrow at range and not have to invest much of any training to use it. Then the cannon was introduced. Then the flint-lock or musket came in. Then the AK-47 and now drones and computer viruses in modern warfare. War changes. It's up to us to adapt to those changes. War NEVER changes... Amarr: Sentinel V Scout V Assault IV Commando III Logistics III I place my faith in my God, my Empress, and my Laz0r
Mobius Wyvern Ahrendee Mercenaries Dirt Nap Squad. 5019	Posted - 2014.04.08 01:24:00 - [36] - Quote SirManBoy wrote: Thanks to tanks and cloaked scouts, it blows to play Dust now. It's a shame because this game felt really good around build 1.6. and remained tolerable until 1.8. Seriously, how is anyone that's not a scout or tanker enjoying the game in its current state? I just don't see how it's possible, especially for support logis. I went from being a force multiplier who regularly got my squad 3,000+ WP from reps, uplinks, and other support actions to becoming lunch meat for 70K ISK tanks and invisible scouts with shottys. I'm legitimately sad, bros; I love Dust but I hate going into matches now. I fly Pythons, and I can now do so without getting one-shotted from 600 meters away, so I'm enjoying 1.8. Amidst the blue skies A link from past to future The sheltering wings of the protector
Baal Roo Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 3088	Posted - 2014.04.08 01:34:00 - [37] - Quote I think the cloaking is a bit too strong against infantry, simply because you can kill people before the cloak even disappears and it's never fun getting blind killed by an invisible foe. Tanks though aren't really a big deal. I find hunting and killing tanks to be one of the most fun things to do in the game right now. Especially with the added vehicle damage WPs, it's now relatively easy to rack up well over 1000 WPs just spending the whole match destroying enemy tanks. Hale Satin
Zirzo Valcyn Kameira Lodge Amarr Empire 400	Posted - 2014.04.08 01:53:00 - [38] - Quote the cloaker you complain about can RE the tank you complain about u can ban the troll out of the forums but u can't ban the forums out of the troll. forum warrior .189
Interplanetary Insanitarium 293	Posted - 2014.04.08 02:08:00 - [39] - Quote You're all seeming to forget one thing. The cloak has a shimmer. It's like how in all the Predator movies the people could sorta see something whenever someone looked at one of them. Just look for the shimmer then blast em. If fists were food you'd be full right now.
PAXTON HAILFIRE CORPORACION CRISTIAN MURATI 84 45	Posted - 2014.04.08 02:31:00 - [40] - Quote My only probem is that I listened to the vets and found a roll I liked, then skilled all in. Cal assault with maxed AR skills. Literally a week after getting my Duvolle and going + k/d since starting dust and rarely dying more than couple times, RRs, CRs and tanks showed up. Back to scrub status. So, my new mantra is core skills, diversity, and play with different fits. I don't do anything but dom and ambush and don't even care to have a proto fit anymore. I have adv commando, sentinal, logi (REs are fun mode), and a scout that I suck with (i never do well with FoTMs for some reason). Oddly, i do pretty darn well when I troll REs in a starter gal logi fit. Seems to me that if you specialize, ccp will **** in your cheerios sooner or later.

Rusty Shallows 1450	Posted - 2014.04.08 02:51:00 - [41] - Quote PAXTON HAILFIRE wrote: My only probem is that I listened to the vets and found a roll I liked, then skilled all in. Cal assault with maxed AR skills. Literally a week after getting my Duvolle and going + k/d since starting dust and rarely dying more than couple times, RRs, CRs and tanks showed up. Back to scrub status. So, my new mantra is core skills, diversity, and play with different fits. I don't do anything but dom and ambush and don't even care to have a proto fit anymore. I have adv commando, sentinal, logi (REs are fun mode), and a scout that I suck with (i never do well with FoTMs for some reason). Oddly, i do pretty darn well when I troll REs in a starter gal logi fit. Seems to me that if you specialize, ccp will **** in your cheerios sooner or later. The irony is that no one saw ARs ever taking a backseat to anything. You had the misfortune of entering this game at exactly the wrong time. We used to mock Dust by calling it AR 514 because everything else would be nerfed while this game had a sacred cow. The Vets didn't mean to waste your skill points. We all had been conditioned by CCPs behavior to expect a certain set of results. Forums > Game: So here is a cookie and a Like. Please keep posting. Bwahahahahahahahahahaha! >>> GòÜ(GÇóGîéGÇó)Gò¥ >>>
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 7842	Posted - 2014.04.08 03:48:00 - [42] - Quote Vitharr Foebane wrote: Maken Tosch wrote: Chesyre Armundsen wrote: I would say that 1.8 has brought about the greatest change and diversity in DUST and it will continue to do so. Thinking that the game is being broken by CCP by making changes is too simple of a viewpoint. If you make a adjustments things will change, and we all know that DUST is far from static. CCP could easily leave everything set on stone from day 1, but they listen to our feedback (and that's everyone's on either side of an argument) then make alterations that they feel will help drive the game towards their overall vision. Try no to be narrow minded and looking at DUST as another game with DLC packs to give you another mode, maps or weapons to keep things fresh. DUST will grow ad change and as Mercs it's our job to learn how the battlefield is changing and adapt. Never saw jihad jeeps as an option to kill HAV's and then poof they show up because of a need. It's like the changing face of contemporary warfare. I don't want DUST to be a game that requires things like COD Ghosts Predator https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JLYUdzpGYX4 OR Titanfall Optimus Prime https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BX2qCpRxilM That would be the day we jump the shark IMO Exactly. When the cross bow was introduced in the real world back in the middle ages, suddenly the dynamics of the battlefield changed because now you have a easy-mode weapon that can accurately fire an arrow at range and not have to invest much of any training to use it. Then the cannon was introduced. Then the flint-lock or musket came in. Then the AK-47 and now drones and computer viruses in modern warfare. War changes. It's up to us to adapt to those changes. War NEVER changes... 5,000 years of written history here on Earth says otherwise. Dedicated Scout // Ninja Knifer Everything I know about the Caldari I learned at Nouvelle Rouvenor
True Adamance Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 9321	Posted - 2014.04.08 03:54:00 - [43] - Quote Maken Tosch wrote: Vitharr Foebane wrote: Maken Tosch wrote: Chesyre Armundsen wrote: I would say that 1.8 has brought about the greatest change and diversity in DUST and it will continue to do so. Thinking that the game is being broken by CCP by making changes is too simple of a viewpoint. If you make a adjustments things will change, and we all know that DUST is far from static. CCP could easily leave everything set on stone from day 1, but they listen to our feedback (and that's everyone's on either side of an argument) then make alterations that they feel will help drive the game towards their overall vision. Try no to be narrow minded and looking at DUST as another game with DLC packs to give you another mode, maps or weapons to keep things fresh. DUST will grow ad change and as Mercs it's our job to learn how the battlefield is changing and adapt. Never saw jihad jeeps as an option to kill HAV's and then poof they show up because of a need. It's like the changing face of contemporary warfare. I don't want DUST to be a game that requires things like COD Ghosts Predator https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JLYUdzpGYX4 OR Titanfall Optimus Prime https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BX2qCpRxilM That would be the day we jump the shark IMO Exactly. When the cross bow was introduced in the real world back in the middle ages, suddenly the dynamics of the battlefield changed because now you have a easy-mode weapon that can accurately fire an arrow at range and not have to invest much of any training to use it. Then the cannon was introduced. Then the flint-lock or musket came in. Then the AK-47 and now drones and computer viruses in modern warfare. War changes. It's up to us to adapt to those changes. War NEVER changes... 5,000 years of written history here on Earth says otherwise. WAR NEVER CHANGES! RON PERLMAN TELL'S YOU WHAT! HE TELL'S YOU WHAT! "Get thine Swag out of my face! Next you'll be writing #YOLOswagforJamyl in all your posts!" -Dagger Two
Magnus Amadeuss Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 723	Posted - 2014.04.08 03:54:00 - [44] - Quote Maken Tosch wrote: Vitharr Foebane wrote: Maken Tosch wrote: Chesyre Armundsen wrote: I would say that 1.8 has brought about the greatest change and diversity in DUST and it will continue to do so. Thinking that the game is being broken by CCP by making changes is too simple of a viewpoint. If you make a adjustments things will change, and we all know that DUST is far from static. CCP could easily leave everything set on stone from day 1, but they listen to our feedback (and that's everyone's on either side of an argument) then make alterations that they feel will help drive the game towards their overall vision. Try no to be narrow minded and looking at DUST as another game with DLC packs to give you another mode, maps or weapons to keep things fresh. DUST will grow ad change and as Mercs it's our job to learn how the battlefield is changing and adapt. Never saw jihad jeeps as an option to kill HAV's and then poof they show up because of a need. It's like the changing face of contemporary warfare. I don't want DUST to be a game that requires things like COD Ghosts Predator https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JLYUdzpGYX4 OR Titanfall Optimus Prime https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BX2qCpRxilM That would be the day we jump the shark IMO Exactly. When the cross bow was introduced in the real world back in the middle ages, suddenly the dynamics of the battlefield changed because now you have a easy-mode weapon that can accurately fire an arrow at range and not have to invest much of any training to use it. Then the cannon was introduced. Then the flint-lock or musket came in. Then the AK-47 and now drones and computer viruses in modern warfare. War changes. It's up to us to adapt to those changes. War NEVER changes... 5,000 years of written history here on Earth says otherwise. Who are you going to believe, history or the narrator from fallout (Ron Perlman)? Fixing swarms
Magnus Amadeuss Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 723	Posted - 2014.04.08 03:55:00 - [45] - Quote True Adamance wrote: Maken Tosch wrote: Vitharr Foebane wrote: Maken Tosch wrote: Chesyre Armundsen wrote: I would say that 1.8 has brought about the greatest change and diversity in DUST and it will continue to do so. Thinking that the game is being broken by CCP by making changes is too simple of a viewpoint. If you make a adjustments things will change, and we all know that DUST is far from static. CCP could easily leave everything set on stone from day 1, but they listen to our feedback (and that's everyone's on either side of an argument) then make alterations that they feel will help drive the game towards their overall vision. Try no to be narrow minded and looking at DUST as another game with DLC packs to give you another mode, maps or weapons to keep things fresh. DUST will grow ad change and as Mercs it's our job to learn how the battlefield is changing and adapt. Never saw jihad jeeps as an option to kill HAV's and then poof they show up because of a need. It's like the changing face of contemporary warfare. I don't want DUST to be a game that requires things like COD Ghosts Predator https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JLYUdzpGYX4 OR Titanfall Optimus Prime https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BX2qCpRxilM That would be the day we jump the shark IMO Exactly. When the cross bow was introduced in the real world back in the middle ages, suddenly the dynamics of the battlefield changed because now you have a easy-mode weapon that can accurately fire an arrow at range and not have to invest much of any training to use it. Then the cannon was introduced. Then the flint-lock or musket came in. Then the AK-47 and now drones and computer viruses in modern warfare. War changes. It's up to us to adapt to those changes. War NEVER changes... 5,000 years of written history here on Earth says otherwise. WAR NEVER CHANGES! RON PERLMAN TELL'S YOU WHAT! HE TELL'S YOU WHAT! beat me by seconds true Fixing swarms
Harpyja Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 1538	Posted - 2014.04.08 03:57:00 - [46] - Quote Magnus Amadeuss wrote: Harpyja wrote: Magnus Amadeuss wrote: Lorhak Gannarsein wrote: Tanks are nerfed. They're pretty balanced at the moment; I think a small nerf to armour repairers and a large nerf to damage mods would sort us out EDIT: also blasters are fucken ridiculous. I've been using an MLT one on a soma and ripping up everything. Tanks were nerfed at the same time all infantry were nerfed. Infantry lost 50% to damage modifiers Infantry lost 50% to proficiency Infantry lost 33% AV grenade capacity Tankers lost ~30% to hardners. Relatively, tanks weren't really nerfed, and non-hardner tanks (like 3 repper tanks) were actually boosted. Not even close. I take on 50% more damage, and all of those damnable swarms break my hardened regen, not just the really dedicated and invested ones. Your damage nerf is almost cute next to my EHP nerf. You have no reason to complain. AV vs tanks is perfectly balanced. It's just that tank vs tank got f*ed up the ass while making it perfect. Exactly close. My numbers are correct. AV is meant to break your regen, it always has been. CCP stated they set the threshold so that small arms fire wouldn't prevent regen, not AV. AV versus tanks is not balanced. Your triple hardned gunnlogi takes 200 dmg from standard swarms instead of 100 now, that is still absolutely pitiful. It would take 15 volleys just to try and crack your shield assuming they wouldn't regen (which they would) between reloads. No proto suit in the game is immune to 100% free starter suits (they die quite easily to them), but your gunnlogi is 100% immune to a solo standard swarmer, you know, AV'er, your dedicated counter. Yep that is broken. I think it's cute how you state facts without really knowing what really goes on. A triple hardener fit just sucks. Yes I get high resistance, but my shields are at their base minimum, which means that I am f*ed if I'm caught when all three hardeners are cooling down. At least with 1 hardener and 2 shield extenders, I have 5300 shield to act as a buffer to let me get to safety if my hardener is on cooldown. A swarm shouldn't be able to break my hardened regen. It's specialized for anti-armor. This means that it has to give up effectiveness against shield. If it's making me retreat, then the swarm is too powerful because it's good at multiple things. It can't be specialized against armor and make a shield tank retreat. It's like asking for bug spray to deter wolves as well when you're out in the forest. AV versus tanks is balanced. I'm forced to retreat when I'm being hit by forge guns because my large missile turret isn't too reliable to kill a forge gunner. You see that? It's a perfect example of trade-offs. My missile turret has high AV abilities at the cost of AI abilities. If I had a blaster turret, I'd kill the forge gunner instead of retreating, because the blaster is meant for AI (thought its AV is too powerful now due to the hardener nerf, so either reduce its damage or its RoF). And if you're trying to take out a hardened shield tank with a swarm, GTFO. Don't cry that your swarm can't kill a hardened shield tank because it wasn't meant to in the first place. "By His light, and His will" - The Scriptures, Gheinok the First, 12:32 Atiim didn't agree with limiting tanks!
Selinate deux Ametat Security Amarr Empire 131	Posted - 2014.04.08 04:02:00 - [47] - Quote Have you tried running away from tanks and hiding instead of shooting them with your scrambler pistol? Also, have you tried shooting the bright shiny blue lights that are running around? Problem solved.
Operative 1171 Aajli Bragian Order Amarr Empire 1809	Posted - 2014.04.08 04:05:00 - [48] - Quote aden slayer wrote: Damn you guys try so hard to get something that kills you over and over again nerfed. Keep trying so hard. This just in: if you add sports channels on T.V. screens to my quiet little pub, it then becomes a sports bar. I don't like sports bars. My patronage then declines to zero quickly. If enough people feel like me, the sports bar then goes out of business. Let's hope enough people threaten CCPs small but significant bottom line that they change their tune. Probably won't. CCP will then contnue to nerf this game down to the appropriate kind of game you think of as a free to play, silly little game lumped in on the virtual bargain bin that is the FREE section of the PSN. Brick tanking a scout suit since April 2013!
Operative 1171 Aajli Bragian Order Amarr Empire 1809	Posted - 2014.04.08 04:07:00 - [49] - Quote Selinate deux wrote: Have you tried running away from tanks and hiding instead of shooting them with your scrambler pistol? Also, have you tried shooting the bright shiny blue lights that are running around? Problem solved. People. GET OUT OF THE F*CKING GAME WORLD AND LOOK AT WHAT THE PRODUCT IS BECOMING! Stop making stupid in-game suggestions for dealing with every little crap move CCP makes trying to do something with their game. It is gimmick after gimmick and doesn't solve the balance or slow dev problem. Brick tanking a scout suit since April 2013!
Magnus Amadeuss Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 725	Posted - 2014.04.08 04:08:00 - [50] - Quote Harpyja wrote: I think it's cute how you state facts without really knowing what really goes on. A triple hardener fit just sucks. Yes I get high resistance, but my shields are at their base minimum, which means that I am f*ed if I'm caught when all three hardeners are cooling down. At least with 1 hardener and 2 shield extenders, I have 5300 shield to act as a buffer to let me get to safety if my hardener is on cooldown. A swarm shouldn't be able to break my hardened regen. It's specialized for anti-armor. This means that it has to give up effectiveness against shield. If it's making me retreat, then the swarm is too powerful because it's good at multiple things. It can't be specialized against armor and make a shield tank retreat. It's like asking for bug spray to deter wolves as well when you're out in the forest. AV versus tanks is balanced. I'm forced to retreat when I'm being hit by forge guns because my large missile turret isn't too reliable to kill a forge gunner. You see that? It's a perfect example of trade-offs. My missile turret has high AV abilities at the cost of AI abilities. If I had a blaster turret, I'd kill the forge gunner instead of retreating, because the blaster is meant for AI (thought its AV is too powerful now due to the hardener nerf, so either reduce its damage or its RoF). And if you're trying to take out a hardened shield tank with a swarm, GTFO. Don't cry that your swarm can't kill a hardened shield tank because it wasn't meant to in the first place. That "I think it's cute..." line shows me that you put more value in uncle fester's back-handed wisdom than cold hard numbers, and that shows me that you are just ill equipped to have an adult conversation about tangible things. I underlined a bit of just complete insanity, I really can't believe you just wrote that. I had to read it a few times just to try to figure out where in the world you got this horrible idea of how dust works from. So you think that rail rifles, combat rifles, flaylocks, mass drivers, locus grenades and HMGs should not break shield regen based on the fact that they are armor specialized? I mean that is basically the SAME EXACT THING you just said, I just swaped out ANTI VEHICLE** weaponry for anti infantry weaponry. In the next paragraph, you state a bunch of supposition originating from you and other idiots, not from the game designers. I am pretty sure the last time I heard CCP mention vehicle weapons, they stated that large turrets were for larger sturctures and for vehicles, and small turrets were meant for infantry. Unfortunately, I do not have the quote off hand so I will not present it as a fact. Get this through your small brain; 1) There is not such thing as light-vehicle AV or heavy vehicle AV. 2) The differences in damage profiles of AV is purely to make the more efficient versus their racial enemies, not to pigeon-hole them 3)Math and facts >>> intuition and good ol' boy knowledge. Fixing swarms

Charlotte O'Dell Fatal Absolution Dirt Nap Squad. 2310	Posted - 2014.04.08 04:09:00 - [51] - Quote im a scout and tanker. can anyone guess how awesome i think this patch is? Charlotte O'Dell is the highest level unicorn!
Magnus Amadeuss Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 725	Posted - 2014.04.08 04:11:00 - [52] - Quote Charlotte O'Dell wrote: im a scout and tanker. can anyone guess how awesome i think this patch is? So Good Fixing swarms
Selinate deux Ametat Security Amarr Empire 131	Posted - 2014.04.08 04:13:00 - [53] - Quote Operative 1171 Aajli wrote: Selinate deux wrote: Have you tried running away from tanks and hiding instead of shooting them with your scrambler pistol? Also, have you tried shooting the bright shiny blue lights that are running around? Problem solved. People. GET OUT OF THE F*CKING GAME WORLD AND LOOK AT WHAT THE PRODUCT IS BECOMING! Stop making stupid in-game suggestions for dealing with every little crap move CCP makes trying to do something with their game. It is gimmick after gimmick and doesn't solve the balance or slow dev problem. It's noone's fault but your own for failing at playing the game with the relatively simple mechanics that CCP has presented you. You have AV and guns. Go shoot these people ffs.
Lorhak Gannarsein Science For Death 2664	Posted - 2014.04.08 04:39:00 - [54] - Quote Selinate deux wrote: Operative 1171 Aajli wrote: Selinate deux wrote: Have you tried running away from tanks and hiding instead of shooting them with your scrambler pistol? Also, have you tried shooting the bright shiny blue lights that are running around? Problem solved. People. GET OUT OF THE FCKING GAME WORLD AND LOOK AT WHAT THE PRODUCT IS BECOMING! Stop making stupid in-game suggestions for dealing with every little crap move CCP makes trying to do something with their game. It is gimmick after gimmick and doesn't solve the balance or slow dev problem. It's noone's fault but your own for failing at playing the game with the relatively simple mechanics that CCP has presented you. You have AV and guns. Go shoot these people ffs. lol scrub I agree with Operative Numbers Word. I just posted my AV fitting in Atiim's thread if you want to abuse and/or critique me over it. ak.0 4 LYFE je ne regrette rien*
castba Penguin's March 369	Posted - 2014.04.08 04:51:00 - [55] - Quote How do you know if tanks are balanced or not when forge guns do not yet work properly?
JP Acuna Pendejitos Canis Eliminatus Operatives 123	Posted - 2014.04.08 05:06:00 - [56] - Quote SirManBoy wrote: Thanks to tanks and cloaked scouts, it blows to play Dust now. It's a shame because this game felt really good around build 1.6. and remained tolerable until 1.8. Seriously, how is anyone that's not a scout or tanker enjoying the game in its current state? I just don't see how it's possible, especially for support logis. I went from being a force multiplier who regularly got my squad 3,000+ WP from reps, uplinks, and other support actions to becoming lunch meat for 70K ISK tanks and invisible scouts with shottys. I'm legitimately sad, bros; I love Dust but I hate going into matches now. I'm enjoying it as a heavy with logi support. I now don't fear these scouts when i'm well positioned, although they manage to kill me from time to time and certainly they kill my logi. And i only started growing heavy this build, but i'm loving it and have fun. I've had bad times too, so i kinda base my gameplay on avoiding shotgunners AND tanks. And it works! So far i've been having fun as Scout, Heavy and Commando, and it's not up to the suits i use; it's up to my disposition and positioning against what bothers me. The cloaked shottys are so common right now that they became predictable, i'm looking out for them and expecting them, it helps a lot. And once you spot them they're squishy as hell, no matter how tanked. If you can't kill them, just don't let them get close, eventually they'll give up.
D3LTA ARM3GGIDDO Sinq Laison Gendarmes Gallente Federation 65	Posted - 2014.04.08 05:16:00 - [57] - Quote I learned to evolve with the game which is why I have scout, heavy, commando and logi builds plus tanks with reppers. Diversify, improvise and evolve. Advanced and proto suits, weapons and equipment. Come on guys use that brain between your ears. Stop whining, feeling entitled and being spoiled. Just play the game. Thank you and have a good day sir.
IMMORTAL WAR HERO NECROM0NGERS Caps and Mercs 121	Posted - 2014.04.08 06:40:00 - [58] - Quote SirManBoy wrote: Thanks to tanks and cloaked scouts, it blows to play Dust now. It's a shame because this game felt really good around build 1.6. and remained tolerable until 1.8. Seriously, how is anyone that's not a scout or tanker enjoying the game in its current state? I just don't see how it's possible, especially for support logis. I went from being a force multiplier who regularly got my squad 3,000+ WP from reps, uplinks, and other support actions to becoming lunch meat for 70K ISK tanks and invisible scouts with shottys. I'm legitimately sad, bros; I love Dust but I hate going into matches now. no lag and rubber banding have ruined they game Frowned upon by amateurs: The object of war is not to die for your country but make the other bastard die for his. GSP
Johnny Guilt Algintal Core 641	Posted - 2014.04.08 08:38:00 - [59] - Quote As a logi, i dont have a problems with scouts at i see them pretty easily and i wouldnt have a problems with tanks or other vehicles IF MY KITTENING FORGEGUN WOULD WORK WHEN I WANTED IT TO!!! A strange game. The only winning move is not to play. GalHeav E-vo
al nize mk2 DUST University Ivy League 60	Posted - 2014.04.08 09:05:00 - [60] - Quote Funkmaster Whale wrote: All signs pointed to Scouts, Heavies, and Tanks being the only relevant things prior to 1.8. Lo and behold, here we are and there's not an Assault or Logi suit in sight save for the masochists who still cling to some sense of false hope. I gave up on that long ago. Haha - yup I'm one of those masochists. But the truth is I skilled back into assault (against the advice on the forums I should add) after the respec and now I have no other choice. So consta-death is my fate until Assault gets buffed and everyone starts to cry about that... except me as I go on a much deserved killing spree!! GÇ£All that I know most surely about morality and obligations I owe to football.GÇ¥

Pseudogenesis Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 104	Posted - 2014.04.08 09:18:00 - [61] - Quote Dust is the most fun now that it's been in months. Once AV and medium suits get a buff I think it will be unquestionably better than ever.
Cinnamon267 127	Posted - 2014.04.08 09:27:00 - [62] - Quote I use a cloaked scout with an Ion pistol but I also use a commando suit and a sentinel suit with a forge gun. Personally, I don't have an issue with cloaked scouts. My issue lies with the Rail Rifle and the like. I rarely see cloaked scouts, now. Most people are still running what they did before, it seems. If a scout kills me, it was, usually, from behind and cloak wouldn't have made it any different. Getting shotgunned in the back is the same regardless of if they use a cloak or not. I can't see them from behind. Tanks aren't ruining anything, either, I feel. I mean, when the Forge Gun is fixed things will be interesting.. But, even then, I find them to not be a problem any more. They go away more often than not. And, when I play my scout with remote explosives, they go away even faster. One Forge Gun shot and they bugger off. So, that's nice :)
Reign Omega BurgezzE.T.F General Tso's Alliance 280	Posted - 2014.04.08 10:33:00 - [63] - Quote Skipped to the end to add my 2cents, I'm enjoying killing scouts and tanks. Sometimes the abundance of either (or both) gets annoying, and sometimes I just have to turn the game off. I'm still having around 65% fun playing though.....Lol. I just tool around and was it to see what the game has in store. Emotional investment is not an option with the current state of affairs
Racro 01 Arifistan 501st Knights of Leanbox INTERGALACTIC WARPIGS 280	Posted - 2014.04.08 10:40:00 - [64] - Quote Lorhak Gannarsein wrote: Tanks are nerfed. They're pretty balanced at the moment; I think a small nerf to armour repairers and a large nerf to damage mods would sort us out EDIT: also blasters are fucken ridiculous. I've been using an MLT one on a soma and ripping up everything. although against tanks teh millita blaster is usless. also i found that blasters have more range (but ** all damge than railgins) so what better way to off a railgun tank than to sit at 305M and him of witha blaster. Elite Gallenten Soldier**
Talos Alomar Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 2152	Posted - 2014.04.08 10:43:00 - [65] - Quote How is dust fun? OHKing a scout out of his cloak with a shottie commando is pretty ******* fun. Gal-mando. Because the best sidearm is a shotgun.
steelRatt L.O.T.I.S. D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 15	Posted - 2014.04.08 10:51:00 - [66] - Quote Good scouts are a pain 3 shots from behind and I'm a Dead heavy however noob wanna be scouts in my line of sight die All in all I think the cloaks add something new and fresh. Tanks i hate tanks lol yes there OP but not if there's only one or two. On Saturday I ran a Av sqd from L.O.T.I.S in does it was a blast no tank or DS was safe even when there was 6 tanks on the other side so now you need to work as a unit is that a bad thing? Defeat dose not exist to them that are willing.
Second Cerberus Tested In Production 119	Posted - 2014.04.08 11:39:00 - [67] - Quote I have to say that 1.8 is a significant improvement over 1.7 for me. I am a casual player that spends a lot of time in Ambush and the vehicle limit hotfix has made that mode so much more enjoyable for infantry. Factor in the cloaked scouts and increase in RE's and Ambush is the least tank stompy that it's been for a long time. 1.8 is far from perfect, but the Hardener, Heavies and Scout changes combined with the Ambush vehicle limit have made this game FAR more diverse than the last several builds. I would say that Assaults may need looked at and that Logi's may have been overnerfed, but at least the FOTM logi and equipment spam has been reduced. "I don't always test my code, but when I do, I do it in production." - *CCP*
Cee Zet Phantom Universe Task Force Die Fremdenlegion 6	Posted - 2014.04.08 12:05:00 - [68] - Quote Quote: Thanks to tanks and cloaked scouts, it blows to play Dust now. It's a shame because this game felt really good around build 1.6. and remained tolerable until 1.8. Seriously, how is anyone that's not a scout or tanker enjoying the game in its current state? I just don't see how it's possible, especially for support logis. I went from being a force multiplier who regularly got my squad 3,000+ WP from reps, uplinks, and other support actions to becoming lunch meat for 70K ISK tanks and invisible scouts with shottys. I'm legitimately sad, bros; I love Dust but I hate going into matches now. Yes, you are right, the game changed. Feels like another game, another Dust514. The same game feels different. For me its nice to be a part of the changes. I like it to feel it in different ways. I like it when changes come, cause for me changes are chances. I like it cause i can try something new. I like it cause, to play in different ways, in the same game, its something i never had like this before. I like it cause iam not forced to be fotm (and i never make so many WP with D-U-Links, my LR and SMG) I like it to run around with an special corpmate and hunting tanks and oh boy, will they be fast away... I like it cause it feels. Sometimes good, sometimes bad. But it feels different like before. (and the most i like when some cloaked souts shimmer is falling into Dust before my feet..., thats always good) Maybe, i wouldnt like it, when... ...iam alone on my way, ...iam try to play like in 1.7, ...iam forced to use a RR :) (CCP, THX FOR THE LR) I know, there where many BUG-¦s and it will never be a finished game, but to me, that means endless new impressions and ideas to test, to feel, to try out, to..., to... After three month 1.7 for me it was boring, and i made a break, but why not? And come back cause it feels right, why not? Iam sure you will play again. Theres is no alternative wich has such an feeling like Dust. See you on the ground, soldier!
Justicar Karnellia Ikomari-Onu Enforcement Caldari State 787	Posted - 2014.04.08 12:06:00 - [69] - Quote Lorhak Gannarsein wrote: Magnus Amadeuss wrote: Lorhak Gannarsein wrote: Tanks are nerfed. They're pretty balanced at the moment; I think a small nerf to armour repairers and a large nerf to damage mods would sort us out EDIT: also blasters are fucken ridiculous. I've been using an MLT one on a soma and ripping up everything. Tanks were nerfed at the same time all infantry were nerfed. Infantry lost 50% to damage modifiers Infantry lost 50% to proficiency Infantry lost 33% AV grenade capacity Tankers lost ~30% to hardners. Relatively, tanks weren't really nerfed, and non-hardner tanks (like 3 repper tanks) were actually boosted. Not a proportionate nerf. That's 15% damage from my forge, which does not conpensate for the lost EHP. Especially since now everything breaks my regeneration. Definitely passive tanks got a buff, which makes them actually useful now. But the tank nerf was more significant, generally speaking, than the AV nerf was. What Lorhak says is true to an extent, but then it's also difficult to gauge this early on. Forges aren't really useable right now until they fix the bugged skills (I usually run assault forge guns.... so they suck right now)... but I do see more swarms on the field now, even if their effect is still dubious - there is still no effective infantry AV weapon which can counter shield tanks. Add to this mix the grenade count reduction (less AV grenades), skill proficiency and damage mods and you have a lot of variables being switched around quickly - which brings me to the next issue.... CCP have a habit of balancing in big leaps, not small steps, which is what causes these imbalances in the first place... at 1.7 what they SHOULD have done is just not touch the AV weapons and introduce the hardeners and then watched the data... then if it wasn't at the sweet spot , they should modified a little bit more (whatever variable they felt was right) and then analyse the data... The problem is I feel as though the "data" is what we the players bring to the forums, and that no analysis is being done at the source from the people who are best placed to analyse it (ie. CCP). I'm reserving jugement on the true state of the HAV/AV debate until all bugs are worked out but I think we are almost near the sweet spot - they could start working on peripheral things like making tanks appear on the mini-map and preventing people from exploiting the recall mechanic - so you can't just recall your tank in 5 seconds while it's taking fire so it magically disappears. :S Of course, tanker side it'd be nice for people who actually invest points into tanks to make them count, so that people who are using militia assets with no skills are as effective as the skills they put into it (so if you put no skills into something, you shouldn't really be dominating the field with that asset).
Altus Nox FACTION WARFARE ARMY FACTION WARFARE ALLIANCE 17	Posted - 2014.04.08 12:06:00 - [70] - Quote Maken Tosch wrote: Chesyre Armundsen wrote: I would say that 1.8 has brought about the greatest change and diversity in DUST and it will continue to do so. Thinking that the game is being broken by CCP by making changes is too simple of a viewpoint. If you make a adjustments things will change, and we all know that DUST is far from static. CCP could easily leave everything set on stone from day 1, but they listen to our feedback (and that's everyone's on either side of an argument) then make alterations that they feel will help drive the game towards their overall vision. Try no to be narrow minded and looking at DUST as another game with DLC packs to give you another mode, maps or weapons to keep things fresh. DUST will grow ad change and as Mercs it's our job to learn how the battlefield is changing and adapt. Never saw jihad jeeps as an option to kill HAV's and then poof they show up because of a need. It's like the changing face of contemporary warfare. I don't want DUST to be a game that requires things like COD Ghosts Predator https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JLYUdzpGYX4 OR Titanfall Optimus Prime https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BX2qCpRxilM That would be the day we jump the shark IMO Exactly. When the cross bow was introduced in the real world back in the middle ages, suddenly the dynamics of the battlefield changed because now you have a easy-mode weapon that can accurately fire an arrow at range and not have to invest much of any training to use it. Then the cannon was introduced. Then the flint-lock or musket came in. Then the AK-47 and now drones and computer viruses in modern warfare. War changes. It's up to us to adapt to those changes. I don't post much. Just tend to read these forums. I agree 100% that adaptation is a huge part of DUST. BUT, as an observer of multiple threads about the issues with 1.8, I have to say this: Most of you high and mighty vets need to get off of your HTFU crutch. The way DUST is structured and the way CCP addresses these changes makes it impossible for anyone but you 20mil+ SP vets to adapt properly. The stock response seems to be HTFU wiithout any consideration to why people are QQing. I joined in late 1.7 and put all of my 7-8mil SP towards building myself into support logi. I was getting good a it as well. 1.8 dropped and suddenly all of that work is gone. The equipment I skilled to advanced suddenly should have been into damping and precision skills. CCP gave us newer players absolutely no way to adapt without months more of suffering. I guarantee that this is the reason so many people are complaining. I didn't think a full respect was needed until I played 1.8 with my logi. -Omnes una manet Nox (The same night awaits us all)

Fox Gaden Immortal Guides 2883	Posted - 2014.04.08 12:22:00 - [71] - Quote I donGÇÖt have any trouble seeing cloaked Scouts. I can even spot them when standing still most of the time. If a Shotgun Scout gets behind me I am not going to see them cloak or no cloak. The Tank side of the V/AV balance seems fine since the Hardener nerf and the Rail rang nerf. Swarm Launchers still need a slight buff though. For those who say that infantry can just call in tanks to use for AV, I prove this wrong all the time by getting my Tank hacked when I am out hacking objectives, and then going back and slaughtering the Tank with the exact same fit. Experienced Tanker > Newb Tanker every time regardless of fit (unless the Newb is very lucky and the Experienced Tanker gets caught with their pants down.) But with recent Tank nerfs, Infantry AV should be fine if the Swarm gets 30 more damage per mussel. Hand/Eye coordination cannot be taught. For everything else there is the Learning Coalition.
NAV HIV The Generals General Tso's Alliance 1374	Posted - 2014.04.08 12:28:00 - [72] - Quote SirManBoy wrote: Thanks to tanks and cloaked scouts, it blows to play Dust now. It's a shame because this game felt really good around build 1.6. and remained tolerable until 1.8. Seriously, how is anyone that's not a scout or tanker enjoying the game in its current state? I just don't see how it's possible, especially for support logis. I went from being a force multiplier who regularly got my squad 3,000+ WP from reps, uplinks, and other support actions to becoming lunch meat for 70K ISK tanks and invisible scouts with shottys. I'm legitimately sad, bros; I love Dust but I hate going into matches now. Funny How some of my Logi friends still rack up 2-3K wp per-game... It's very simple actually, the logi-scout-commando-heavy Combo is working great tbh... If you have 5 scouts and 1 logi in a squad, well that's difficult logi work, since there wont be much to rep... The logi takes a slayer role and only uses nanites and nanos at that point... Cal Logi is great for that... But a Full heavy squad + logi wont have much fun against a Combo squad.. Now the roles actually complement each other... not just a jack of all trades...
Takahiro Kashuken Red Star. EoN. 3265	Posted - 2014.04.08 12:51:00 - [73] - Quote Nope CCP has screwed vehicles Less skills, less mods, less turrets, less vehicles, less slots, less fittings, less variety, less playstyles, less everything
The Headless Horseman Paladin Survey Force Amarr Empire 166	Posted - 2014.04.08 14:04:00 - [74] - Quote Eruditus 920 wrote: Then leave. I'm sick of all the belly achin' about this. In case you have'nt noticed, there are'nt many left still playing. I have over 200 contacts from closed beta that NEVER came back. The rest will leave soon for a more ballanced game...... coughdestinycough My bags are packed. Once I leave, not even speeders and fighter jets will bring me back. They had enough time to fix this garbage can of a mess. Signed, Sealed, Delivered
TechMechMeds SWAMPERIUM 2990	Posted - 2014.04.08 14:20:00 - [75] - Quote I simply quit matches the moment I'm not happy with my teams performance, there's no way I'm going all out for people who are either bad or shouldn't have left the academy yet. Likewise if the enemy aren't doing anything or its an instant redline then I'll leave that boring sht as well. I played a match yesterday and I was one of three people not running a cloaked scout lol. I run minmatar heavy or logi, I don't like the assault bonuses at all. If you know what a telefrag match is, then I love you. Dust for over a year, gaming for over 18 and counting.


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