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Stefan Stahl
Seituoda Taskforce Command Caldari State
384
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Posted - 2014.01.18 13:38:00 -
[31] - Quote
Suggestions I'd like: - ~10-15 hp armor bonus per level. OR: - 5% bonus to the efficacy of armor plates per level. OR: - A bonus to cloaking. Can't say in which way because I have no idea how cloaking is going to work.
Alternatively: - current stamina bonus AND 5% bonus to passive scan range per level (notice the lack of profile dampening or precision enhancement)
My vision for the Amarr Scout is that it should be the one suit best suited for a straight up fight. It doesn't have the ehp a medium suit has, but instead relies on either cloaking or passive scanning (at a low precision) to get the drop on whatever it hunts. Once the opening blow has been dealt with a charged Scrambler Rifle shot and the victim is at half health the Amarr Scout has the ehp to see the fight through to the end. If the victim had had a good scanner it would've seen the threat coming.
Example fitting for an Amarr Scout: (slot layout of the proto suit, adapt as necessary) High slots: - 2x damage mod Low slots: - 2x ferroscale plates - 2x scan range extender Light weapon: - Scrambler Rifle Eq: - Any mixture or drop uplink, cloaking device, nanohives or remote explosives |
Galvan Nized
Deep Space Republic
532
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Posted - 2014.01.18 14:27:00 -
[32] - Quote
I think the best answer is taking the old Caldari or Gallente bonus to cloaking and adding that to the Amarr scout. Maybe 25% faster recharge or 25% less shimmer when moving. Make the Amarr the ultimate cloaker.
Perhaps a bonus to uplink scan profile...make them the best stealth uplink layers. Maybe like 50% reduction in profile for uplinks (unsure on numbers as I don't know what the profile actual is). Everyone gripes about uplinks not being covert enough, this would solve that problem. Amarr scout would be a great behind the lines covert operator. |
Vell0cet
SVER True Blood Public Disorder.
801
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Posted - 2014.01.18 14:38:00 -
[33] - Quote
Stefan Stahl wrote:Suggestions I'd like: - ~10-15 hp armor bonus per level. OR: - 5% bonus to the efficacy of armor plates per level. OR: - A bonus to cloaking. Can't say in which way because I have no idea how cloaking is going to work.
Alternatively: - current stamina bonus AND 5% bonus to passive scan range per level (notice the lack of profile dampening or precision enhancement)
My vision for the Amarr Scout is that it should be the one suit best suited for a straight up fight. It doesn't have the ehp a medium suit has, but instead relies on either cloaking or passive scanning (at a low precision) to get the drop on whatever it hunts. Once the opening blow has been dealt with a charged Scrambler Rifle shot and the victim is at half health the Amarr Scout has the ehp to see the fight through to the end. If the victim had had a good scanner it would've seen the threat coming.
Example fitting for an Amarr Scout: (slot layout of the proto suit, adapt as necessary) High slots: - 2x damage mod Low slots: - 2x ferroscale plates - 2x scan range extender Light weapon: - Scrambler Rifle Eq: - Any mixture or drop uplink, cloaking device, nanohives or remote explosives Most of these feel too much like an assault suit. All scout suits should be pretty fragile. Scrambler rifle bonuses feel wrong too, again, that's more of an assault/commando weapon.
If people don't like the sabotage direction (and it seems most don't) I would have to go with either a cloaking bonus, or scrambler pistol clip size, plus a modest stamina buff.
Quick/Dirty Test Range Idea
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Scheneighnay McBob
Learning Coalition College
3610
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Posted - 2014.01.18 15:03:00 -
[34] - Quote
Fizzer94 wrote:Scheneighnay McBob wrote:You have to realize that every race actually has their specific playstyle- that's alot of the fun of making racial themed alts/squads.
Amarr are really the slow-and-steady race which, when used correctly, makes a rock-solid frontline that may have trouble advancing. With that, amarr scouts would focus on placing uplinks to help the frontliners move more efficiently.
They should probably have some bonus to using uplinks. Okay, why don't we just remove Amarr Logis from the game then while we're at it... Its not enough that we get a crappy racial bonus in 1.8, but now we should have to compete with the scouts for it? Logis aren't particularly good at sneaking around, last time I checked.
Keep the forward uplinks to the scouts, while you either spam or play medic.
We used to have a time machine
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Mortedeamor
1235
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Posted - 2014.01.18 15:09:00 -
[35] - Quote
2% scp fire rate 3% scp reload speed 5% stamina recovery and total
jihhhaders = av lvl 0
swarm master = av lvl 99+
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Monty Mole Clone
Shiv M
128
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Posted - 2014.01.18 15:39:00 -
[36] - Quote
the guy who authored the amarr scout bonus must have been in a hurry to get out on the lash or something:) coz its just dull, as in not very enticing. keep it or change it dont really care for these unamaginative suit bonus anymore. |
Cody Sietz
Bullet Cluster Legacy Rising
2015
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Posted - 2014.01.18 15:41:00 -
[37] - Quote
5 percent to kind cats would be crazy.
"I do agree with you there though. shudders"
-Arkena Wyrnspire
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low genius
The Sound Of Freedom Renegade Alliance
1103
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Posted - 2014.01.18 15:41:00 -
[38] - Quote
I kind of like the bonuses they've got listed now. |
Reav Hannari
Red Rock Outriders
2632
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Posted - 2014.01.18 15:45:00 -
[39] - Quote
Oswald Rehnquist wrote:Why not a % bonus to the hp of ferroscale armor?
I like this idea. Another plate related one would be to reduce the speed penalty of plates. "Through the use of advanced servos and load balancing the Amarr Scout, at skill level 5, can fit complex plates with no loss of mobility." The Ferroscale plates idea would probably be easier to justify and to provide a bonus for though.
// Venge Captain // Matari Logistics / Scout / Pilot // @ReesNoturana
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Quiet Li
Nos Nothi
1
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Posted - 2014.01.18 15:58:00 -
[40] - Quote
I wouldn't be too quick to toss out the green pill bonus altogether, guys ... I think it could be bumped up a bit, but those green pills, while not "sexy" ... are awesome for a scout. I've made more escapes due to green pills than reds by a mile, and I've also caught prey more often thanks to greens than reds...
As for a secondary bonus...
I'm not sure that bumping the RoF on a ScP is worth much, honestly. Those things already fire plenty fast enough, and deal a ton of damage if you hit your shots. I've never been killed because the RoF was too low ... more likely, I just missed a shot I needed to land and it cost me. It also sounds more like a bonus for assaults than scouts to me.
A secondary bonus to uplinks sounds like a good idea, personally. The one that fits best with a true scout role, I'd say.
Kind of interested in seeing a bonus to the headshot multilpier for A Scouts, too, for that matter...
It'd reward skill, for one, and something about an A Scout carrying a scrambler pistol seems righteous to me. |
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Cyrius Li-Moody
The New Age Outlaws WINMATAR.
3002
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Posted - 2014.01.18 16:10:00 -
[41] - Quote
Remember guys absolutely NO cloak bonuses. This community argued and fought about scouts having no specific cloak bonuses. I still standby the current stamina/regen bonus being useful for a scout though not entirely interesting.
The bonus to ferroscale it's a actually a pretty cool idea. I like the idea of a fitting cost reduction to laser weaponry. The SCR and pistol have pretty high fitting costs. A reduction to both of these will free up more resources for extra tank or extra gank. Heat damage reduction is also very good considering the very low HP of scouts. Perhaps even a reduction to seize time. Heat reduction bonuses with the way SCR is now throws the weapon out of balance and makes it far too good at close ranges when it is a mid-long distance weapon.
A resistance skill would be very useful for a scout and would make sense for amarr who are meant to soak up more damage.
Youtuber. Your friendly neighborhood whiskey-fueled merc.
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Stefan Stahl
Seituoda Taskforce Command Caldari State
384
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Posted - 2014.01.18 16:18:00 -
[42] - Quote
Cyrius Li-Moody wrote:Remember guys absolutely NO cloak bonuses. One noisy part of this community argued and fought about scouts having no specific cloak bonuses. Corrected. You're welcome.
Not that I demand a cloak bonus, but it shouldn't be off the table. One could argue that the Amarr suit would profit the most from cloaking due to it's lack of mobility. It's lack of scan precision, scan range and scan profile reduction also call for an alternative means of stealth than scanning. |
John Demonsbane
Unorganized Ninja Infantry Tactics League of Infamy
1619
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Posted - 2014.01.18 18:05:00 -
[43] - Quote
I'm coming around to the idea of armor-based bonuses. I like the idea of reducing the speed penalty from regular plates. That or add a sprint speed bonus so you get a "free" kin cat AND cardiac reg.
"The line between disorder and order lies in logistics" -Sun Tzu
Amarr victor!
Forum Warrior lv.1
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Vell0cet
SVER True Blood Public Disorder.
801
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Posted - 2014.01.18 18:06:00 -
[44] - Quote
Stefan Stahl wrote:Cyrius Li-Moody wrote:Remember guys absolutely NO cloak bonuses. One noisy part of this community argued and fought about scouts having no specific cloak bonuses. Corrected. You're welcome. Not that I demand a cloak bonus, but it shouldn't be off the table. One could argue that the Amarr suit would profit the most from cloaking due to it's lack of mobility. It's lack of scan precision, scan range and scan profile reduction also call for an alternative means of stealth than scanning. If there was going to be a suit with a cloak bonus, this one makes the most sense.
Quick/Dirty Test Range Idea
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Cooper Eudaemon
DUST University Ivy League
95
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Posted - 2014.01.18 18:20:00 -
[45] - Quote
Adding my vote to a cloaking bonus.
To me, it makes great sense as a counter to the Minja's Nova Knives.
It also makes sense that if your scout is designed to run slower and longer, without a boosted ability to scan or hide from scanners, that you would really want to be able to get the most out of a cloaking module.
I need a break from Dust! I'll just go hop on the forums...
I need a break from the forums! I'll just go hop on Dust...
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Viktor Hadah Jr
Critical-Impact
1970
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Posted - 2014.01.18 18:22:00 -
[46] - Quote
4% to kin cat effectiveness plus 5% laser weaponry heat build up.
Selling Templar BPO 300Mil
Earn 50Mil+ ISK in Dust
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Monty Mole Clone
Shiv M
128
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Posted - 2014.01.18 18:33:00 -
[47] - Quote
Cyrius Li-Moody wrote:Remember guys absolutely NO cloak bonuses. This community argued and fought about scouts having no specific cloak bonuses. I still standby the current stamina/regen bonus being useful for a scout though not entirely interesting.
The bonus to ferroscale it's a actually a pretty cool idea. I like the idea of a fitting cost reduction to laser weaponry. The SCR and pistol have pretty high fitting costs. A reduction to both of these will free up more resources for extra tank or extra gank. Heat damage reduction is also very good considering the very low HP of scouts. Perhaps even a reduction to seize time. Heat reduction bonuses with the way SCR is now throws the weapon out of balance and makes it far too good at close ranges when it is a mid-long distance weapon.
A resistance skill would be very useful for a scout and would make sense for amarr who are meant to soak up more damage.
i would much rather have my scout specialize in cloaking over stamina, i thought the basic frames where for people like you who want to fit suits how they wanted?
and why arnt all scouts getting a bonus to how the cloak works? make specialist suits special ffs ccp and not these boring generic abortions we will be getting |
Darken-Soul
Tal-Romon Legion Amarr Empire
3
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Posted - 2014.01.18 18:45:00 -
[48] - Quote
Give the Amarr scout a bonus to ScP mag, bringing it up to 17 for proto. I get chills thinking about it. |
Zeylon Rho
Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
3206
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Posted - 2014.01.18 18:54:00 -
[49] - Quote
I think any bonus to tanking (ferroscale, etc.) would be misguided. Scouts aren't supposed to be tanking roles, and you're starting in the hole somewhat as it stands since the closest assault (Minmatar) is slightly faster than you, has more slots, and more hp.
The stamina bonus, while meager, at least works on a similar theory of utility/mobility. Something related to putting people down while not necessarily tanking (scrambler or weapon bonuses), sprint/kincat, etc. bonuses make more sense than just trying to make the Amarr Scout into a crappier assault suit.
Join my cult.
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Reav Hannari
Red Rock Outriders
2640
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Posted - 2014.01.18 19:00:00 -
[50] - Quote
Zeylon Rho wrote:I think any bonus to tanking (ferroscale, etc.) would be misguided. Scouts aren't supposed to be tanking roles, and you're starting in the hole somewhat as it stands since the closest assault (Minmatar) is slightly faster than you, has more slots, and more hp.
The stamina bonus, while meager, at least works on a similar theory of utility/mobility. Something related to putting people down while not necessarily tanking (scrambler or weapon bonuses), sprint/kincat, etc. bonuses make more sense than just trying to make the Amarr Scout into a crappier assault suit.
They haven't published the new, proposed assault stats yet. I wouldn't be surprised if they changed the speeds on them.
// Venge Captain // Matari Logistics / Scout / Pilot // @ReesNoturana
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Mordecai Sanguine
What The French
304
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Posted - 2014.01.18 19:12:00 -
[51] - Quote
Nocturnal Soul wrote:Here I'm going to make a list of all the possibilities of a new bonus.
Primary: Increased ammo clip size. 5% to kin cat effectiveness. 2% to Scp rate of fire.
Secondary: 5% to stamina regain rate and max.
No. Useless and is more a "minmatarr" skill. No. Amarr is supposed to be the slowest. Not just base. No. Useless this is sharpshooter gun not a spam gun.
Primary : (equivalent of a complex regulator) 20% Max stamina per level. 10% regain rate per level.
Secondary : 10% more damage to backstab per level. (attacks from behind.)
Amarr philosophy is simple. They faith in tanking. They faith in battle. This suits will be perfet to eliminate fugitive targets. Attack from behind to deadly ambush.
"You can turn once. Not twice"
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Iron Wolf Saber
Den of Swords
12310
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Posted - 2014.01.18 19:20:00 -
[52] - Quote
I was hoping for something more interesting :(
And if you been paying attention the bonuses only effect the suit itself not its use with modules.
5% Stamina max, regen and 5% reduction in stamina consumption
CPM 0 Secretary
Omni-Soldier, Forum Warrior, Annoying Artist
\\= Advanced Caldari Assault // Unlocked
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Mordecai Sanguine
What The French
304
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Posted - 2014.01.18 19:22:00 -
[53] - Quote
Fizzer94 wrote:Scheneighnay McBob wrote:You have to realize that every race actually has their specific playstyle- that's alot of the fun of making racial themed alts/squads.
Amarr are really the slow-and-steady race which, when used correctly, makes a rock-solid frontline that may have trouble advancing. With that, amarr scouts would focus on placing uplinks to help the frontliners move more efficiently.
They should probably have some bonus to using uplinks. Okay, why don't we just remove Amarr Logis from the game then while we're at it... Its not enough that we get a crappy racial bonus in 1.8, but now we should have to compete with the scouts for it?
The Uplinks bonus should be for scouts not Logi. What Amarr bonus should be : 20% Max stmaina per level. 10% regain rate per level. And the drop uplinks bonus.
Amarr Logi has always supposed to be a "Combat Engineer" the "Support fire" the "frontline Logi"providing support with his equipements AND with some support fire from himself. Just set uplinks IS NOT a role for Logi but for scout.
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Mordecai Sanguine
What The French
304
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Posted - 2014.01.18 19:24:00 -
[54] - Quote
Iron Wolf Saber wrote:I was hoping for something more interesting :(
And if you been paying attention the bonuses only effect the suit itself not its use with modules.
5% Stamina max, regen and 5% reduction in stamina consumption
So what ? This is less than a Basic Module that takes 5CPU and 4 PG. |
John Demonsbane
Unorganized Ninja Infantry Tactics League of Infamy
1619
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Posted - 2014.01.18 19:25:00 -
[55] - Quote
Reav Hannari wrote:Zeylon Rho wrote:I think any bonus to tanking (ferroscale, etc.) would be misguided. Scouts aren't supposed to be tanking roles, and you're starting in the hole somewhat as it stands since the closest assault (Minmatar) is slightly faster than you, has more slots, and more hp.
The stamina bonus, while meager, at least works on a similar theory of utility/mobility. Something related to putting people down while not necessarily tanking (scrambler or weapon bonuses), sprint/kincat, etc. bonuses make more sense than just trying to make the Amarr Scout into a crappier assault suit. They haven't published the new, proposed assault stats yet. I wouldn't be surprised if they changed the speeds on them.
You both make excellent points. We don't know what the assaults will be so perhaps the Amarr scout will be faster than the Minnie assault. That's also somewhat of an apples to oranges comparison anyway.
The point about making it tanks detracting from its role also make sense, but if you say, make the bonus to ferroscale plates instead you keep the racial focus intact at the same time you keep the speed aspect.
Finally, whoever asked why the scouts can't have bonuses for cloaks, the fear is that they make become OP. Thing is though, they still get a "bonus" to cloaks, since, as Remnant said, the fitting costs are apparently going to be absurd on any suit that's not a scout, so the bonus is basically that they can run cloaks to begin with.
"The line between disorder and order lies in logistics" -Sun Tzu
Amarr victor!
Forum Warrior lv.1
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Monty Mole Clone
Shiv M
128
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Posted - 2014.01.18 19:30:00 -
[56] - Quote
Iron Wolf Saber wrote:I was hoping for something more interesting :(
And if you been paying attention the bonuses only effect the suit itself not its use with modules.
5% Stamina max, regen and 5% reduction in stamina consumption
so it gives zero boost to mods?
who thinks of this trash |
John Demonsbane
Unorganized Ninja Infantry Tactics League of Infamy
1619
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Posted - 2014.01.18 19:35:00 -
[57] - Quote
Mordecai Sanguine wrote:Fizzer94 wrote:Scheneighnay McBob wrote:You have to realize that every race actually has their specific playstyle- that's alot of the fun of making racial themed alts/squads.
Amarr are really the slow-and-steady race which, when used correctly, makes a rock-solid frontline that may have trouble advancing. With that, amarr scouts would focus on placing uplinks to help the frontliners move more efficiently.
They should probably have some bonus to using uplinks. Okay, why don't we just remove Amarr Logis from the game then while we're at it... Its not enough that we get a crappy racial bonus in 1.8, but now we should have to compete with the scouts for it? The Uplinks bonus should be for scouts not Logi. What Amarr bonus should be : 20% Max stmaina per level. 10% regain rate per level. And the drop uplinks bonus. Amarr Logi has always supposed to be a "Combat Engineer" the "Support fire" the "frontline Logi"providing support with his equipements AND with some support fire from himself. Just set uplinks IS NOT a role for Logi but for scout.
I could get behind that but then what bonus do you give the Amarr logi? I plan on using both suits and am big on uplinks like an Amarr should, so shifting the bonus makes sense, but we then need to give the logi a new bonus. Do you propose a more offensive-minded bonus? If so, it would have to be carefully chosen to avoid any further complaints about killer bees. Maybe something about clip size so our nanohives can be reserved for others? Or perhaps a better idea would be a defensive bonus to plates of some kind. (Or the inherent armor rep might be nice....,)
"The line between disorder and order lies in logistics" -Sun Tzu
Amarr victor!
Forum Warrior lv.1
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Marad''er
Ancient Exiles. Renegade Alliance
402
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Posted - 2014.01.18 19:36:00 -
[58] - Quote
I believe the best way to do this is
Bonus 1: 20% Stamina Max per lv 10% Stamina recovery per lv
Bonus 2: 10% clip size to Scrambler pistol Or 3% dmg bonus to scrambler pistol per lv
I'm afraid however this would make the scrambler pistol a tad OP, but... Lol
GôÉGô¥GôÿGô£Gôö > GôÉGô¢Gô¢
Gÿà¿When will dust get better?Gÿà
Forum Warrior LV. 4 | pâÅpéñpâápü»tºüpü«µëôµÆâpéÆF¦ápüúpüªpüäpéï | PSN: I-NINJA-ALL-DAY
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Ryder Azorria
Amarr Templars Amarr Empire
834
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Posted - 2014.01.18 19:37:00 -
[59] - Quote
Monty Mole Clone wrote:Iron Wolf Saber wrote:I was hoping for something more interesting :(
And if you been paying attention the bonuses only effect the suit itself not its use with modules.
5% Stamina max, regen and 5% reduction in stamina consumption so it gives zero boost to mods? who thinks of this trash Well it kinda does, increasing the base stat results in a numerically larger boost from percentage based mods. |
Mordecai Sanguine
What The French
306
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Posted - 2014.01.18 19:47:00 -
[60] - Quote
John Demonsbane wrote:Mordecai Sanguine wrote:Fizzer94 wrote:Scheneighnay McBob wrote:You have to realize that every race actually has their specific playstyle- that's alot of the fun of making racial themed alts/squads.
Amarr are really the slow-and-steady race which, when used correctly, makes a rock-solid frontline that may have trouble advancing. With that, amarr scouts would focus on placing uplinks to help the frontliners move more efficiently.
They should probably have some bonus to using uplinks. Okay, why don't we just remove Amarr Logis from the game then while we're at it... Its not enough that we get a crappy racial bonus in 1.8, but now we should have to compete with the scouts for it? The Uplinks bonus should be for scouts not Logi. What Amarr bonus should be : 20% Max stmaina per level. 10% regain rate per level. And the drop uplinks bonus. Amarr Logi has always supposed to be a "Combat Engineer" the "Support fire" the "frontline Logi"providing support with his equipements AND with some support fire from himself. Just set uplinks IS NOT a role for Logi but for scout. I could get behind that but then what bonus do you give the Amarr logi? I plan on using both suits and am big on uplinks like an Amarr should, so shifting the bonus makes sense, but we then need to give the logi a new bonus. Do you propose a more offensive-minded bonus? If so, it would have to be carefully chosen to avoid any further complaints about killer bees. Maybe something about clip size so our nanohives can be reserved for others? Or perhaps a better idea would be a defensive bonus to plates of some kind. (Or the inherent armor rep might be nice....,)
The armor repper bonus was good. BUT because there was these 5 base hp/s. And now the auto-hp regen is deserved to gallente not Amarr.
Amarr is supposed to armor tank. Not really "offensive" minded. This is not the purpose of a Logi. Maybe some bonus on Armor Plates. |
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