Tiericide means "Kill the tiers"

Basically a lot of us believe that a major problem with Dust's infantry combat is how unbalanced the game is between militia, standard, advanced, and proto fits. The idea of tiericide is that it would be better if everything was the same tier, thus there would be no tiers, and instead of spending skill points to move up the tiers you spend skill points to specialize and find your role. Every bonus that you add to your fits would come with an equal negative to balance it out and keep all fits on an even playing field.

At least, that's how I think of tiericde.

Weapons can get subjected though lets say they brought in weapon customization. For example we bring in weapon customization and trim all the extra variants out and let players design thier own within limits.

I hope this is what people have been screaming about. To be honest, I was never sure what people meant exactly by the term. If this is what the general use of the term entails then I'm on board.

Tiericide would destroy the risk vs. ISK mechanism which is DUST's biggest redeeming quality. It would turn DUST into a pathetic clone of PS2. We can fix the NPE by creating an optional 2nd tier academy battle mode available to all players with less than x SP (maybe around 2 -5 million SP). I usually don't wear my proto suit in most pub matches, but sometimes I feel compelled to pull it out. Making those kinds of decisions are why I play DUST. It's incredibly satisfying to take out a proto suit while wearing a cheap fit.

F*ck tiericide.

Shift the costs to the suits and weapons that is lost on the suits. Make certain suit classes slightly more pronounced in prices too for example there would be a large multiplier of a difference between tech 1 suits and their tech 2 cousins like 10x more maybe?

Gallente had 7 frigates,

3 in teir 1 2 in teir 2 and 2 in teir 3 and teir 3 where not always the best even though they had the highest skill requirement (lvl 3) and nobody ever used tier 1s despite being the most cheapest because it was riskier to get caught dead in those ships.

Post Teiricide

7 Frigates, all the similar mineral price. All useful all being used much more often now a days

Also your idea would not work in the academy Vell0cet, it has yet to work, and I know expanding a second round of battles it would pronounce how wrong your idea is.

But all suits are being used right now. I use PRO, ADV, and STD fits (and I used MIL when I was trying things out in the beginning) regularly. DUST doesn't have the problem of suits from various tiers going unused because they're worthless. If I'm trying to earn ISK i'll go cheap, for most battles I'll use ADV gear, and for things that matter (or if someone really p*sses me off and I want revenge) I'll step it up to the expensive stuff. That's an interesting and fun dynamic that already exists. Tiericide in EVE was solving a very different problem (most ships were lame and unused/unloved). The problem DUST is having is the NPE which could be solved much better with the suggestion I posed above.

Your looking at it the wrong way. What tier code would do is give MLT-ADV suits a fair fight vs a proto suit. The Proto suit will still be better and more expensive but the difference would be a lot smaller for example a proto suit compared to a MLT suit can have up to 30% more damage and double the HP. That's so unfair, and the learning curve and SP required to catch up is very steep. What tiercide would do is bring low level suits inline with proto suits, but will reward the higher level suits with a small advantage not a huge one. At the same time it will add variation with type II suits etc.

Why would I run a suit that costs 10x the cost if it's advantage is very small? Look at EVE. An Omen costs roughly 8 mill, it's T2 counterpart the Zealot costs roughly 150 mill. That's nearly a 20x increase in price, and anyone who plays EVE knows that in a straight 1v1 fight, the Omen will loose every time. But if you bring 2-3 Omens, you can easily take out a Zealot with much less ISK on the line.

I don't want fair fights. I want INTERESTING fights with tactics and different tiers of gear. It makes DUST fun, unique and exciting. With mixed levels of gear, the tactical situation is always changing and never the same. That's fun and interesting gameplay to me. Make DUST cookie-cutter where everyone's on a level playing field and you've got a **** game like Plannetside 2. If DUST tries to be a PS2 clone, it will fail miserably. Tiered gear and risk vs. ISK is literally the most interesting/fun aspect of DUST.

I bet the reward for destroying the Zealot is great... what's the reward for 3 mlt suits taking out a proto suit? Practically nothing.

people throw that word around. what do you guys think tiericide means?

Destruction of tiers?

Why would I run a suit that costs 10x the cost if it's advantage is very small? Look at EVE. An Omen costs roughly 8 mill, it's T2 counterpart the Zealot costs roughly 150 mill. That's nearly a 20x increase in price, and anyone who plays EVE knows that in a straight 1v1 fight, the Omen will loose every time. But if you bring 2-3 Omens, you can easily take out a Zealot with much less ISK on the line.

I don't want fair fights. I want INTERESTING fights with tactics and different tiers of gear. It makes DUST fun, unique and exciting. With mixed levels of gear, the tactical situation is always changing and never the same. That's fun and interesting gameplay to me. Make DUST cookie-cutter where everyone's on a level playing field and you've got a **** game like Plannetside 2. If DUST tries to be a PS2 clone, it will fail miserably. Tiered gear and risk vs. ISK is literally the most interesting/fun aspect of DUST.

In Eve you can also call in needed Support from anywhere in the cluster as needed. Your not stuck with defined teams. With suits with defined roles, tactics will have to emerge in order to use each suit to the est of its ability. Squad compositions and strategies will matter more.

Your contradicting yourself by wanting interesting fights when the only real tactic in matches right now is to field the 1-2 biggest and strongest gear and overrun the opposition with it. Take a moment to think about how our combat would change from these enhancements and give what IWS and others are saying a chance.

Even the basic ship command skill in EVE gives some tiny little agility bonus...

My plan calls for a fitting bonus to be given to all suits as you raise their required command level thus a player first stepping into the suit cannot equip prototype weapons and modules but as he puts more levels into it he can then afford to continue to upgrade the suits performance.

The idea is not remove player progression at all but to shift its focus onto suit fittig and more extreme focus on making better fits for the playstyle thus fitting and how to fit the suit becomes the overall meta.

A player who grasps the concept early and quickly an empower a suit as easily as a proto suit can by equipping the same exact but weaker which the module's own gulfs between bottom to top are not so massive as the one pronounced in proto suits verses militia due to slot disparity alone. (slots are if you done any math wizardry on how ccp concluded their balance designs are extremely weighted )

With the loss of the proto suits the isk cost on regular suits are going have to adjust to be affordable and common. This means the modules between metas are going to gulfen a bit more to emphasize risk versus reward still matters.

This also cuts down on totally useless skills and empowers players earlier per level they unlock with suit command.

CPM been nearly screaming with every chance we get.

CPM been nearly screaming with every chance we get.

I'm not trying to start anything here, but we had something similar to this once, didn't we? The type IIs, I mean. Would you be behind the return of the type IIs? They offered a different sort of flexibility, giving up their sidearms for an equipment slot.

I'd love tiericide, but at the least I'd hope to have a uniform slot layout across all tiers. Slots are what we use to make our fitting and roles unique and individualized to our own preferences. They are something that we should always have, and not be the bargaining chips to balancing the game.

Actually it's just a chance for some of it's mods to drop. It's mostly the satisfaction of taking away someone's expensive toy, which is the same reward you get in DUST (and also a percent of the cost of the suit/fittings gets added to the pool to be distributed at the end of the match, so you get a bigger payout). Don't you get a warm and fuzzy feeling when you kill someone's proto? Is there any other FPS that delivers such a satisfying experience?

Tiericide means "Kill the tiers"

Basically a lot of us believe that a major problem with Dust's infantry combat is how unbalanced the game is between militia, standard, advanced, and proto fits. The idea of tiericide is that it would be better if everything was the same tier, thus there would be no tiers, and instead of spending skill points to move up the tiers you spend skill points to specialize and find your role. Every bonus that you add to your fits would come with an equal negative to balance it out and keep all fits on an even playing field.

At least, that's how I think of tiericde.

The purpose of tiericide is to introduce a greater diversity in fits. With tiers you simply have improved versions of the same few dropsuits. Without tiers we're free to spread out rather than up, so no suit would be better than any other, but there would be a larger difference between individual suits.

Aero basically got the premise right there are ways to go about it though.

A purist tericide would remove ALL meta levels. While this would be neat and players would grow outwards the game would be too flat for most people's liking.

So generally there is a knock off version, one of lesser degree.

For example the one I am currently advocating would remove basic and advanced frames and suits leaving players with prototype slot layouts as the only suit in each class entry. Then introducing two more suit entries at base classes that creating a 'tech 1' experience in which the suits are slightly skewed towards the roles but are able to fulfill many of them. Then the current tech 2 suits get an additional suit and they're heavily skewed into very specific roles. For example

Light Frames under my model would have three types

GK. 0 GK. 1 Gk. 2

The slot layout of 0 would suggest high speed, high stealth, or high mobility. Slot layout of Gk. 1 would suggest high utility, the stats and slots can suggest utility, sabotage, intel, while the third suit seems deemingly more worthy of being either a light combat scout or a pilot of some sort or a covert or skirmish. squad leader.

but thats the light frames and if any bonuses would support a broad range of modules instead of one or two but the bonus overall is a bit weak.

Then with Tech 2 we get specialist suits that are laser focused.

A scout suit designed purely for infiltration, gets bonuses for being able to not only cloak but dodge scanners as well and assassinate players with a damage bonus to melee and other short ranged weapons.
Its brother suit would be more suited to being a saboteur giving up some speed and attack for ability to set more traps covertly and not get caught doing so.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AqHgiF-KXQZXdDdKYjRQT193VDlfbFM5b0FwdlB5Ymc&usp=drive_web#gid=0 while its missing stats or bonuses this is what my model could look like in tree format.

Make our fitting unique but at the same time have a uniform slot layout across all tiers? What the hell is wrong with everyone? Layout of the slots is half of the uniqueness of the suit. You people want to play the most uniform boring game that it can be?

Tiericide is a bad idea because who would use anything but the the best and why?

Uniform slots would make the game even more repeatative than it is now and coupled with tiericide there might as well only be one suit and two guns.

Your are stripping the game of diversity with every push towards uniformity of weapons and suits. This kind of thing is what will make me biomass my character because the point of the game is to be able to fit the suit like I want with things I worked hard for. I invested SP and ISK, all anyone wants to do is make all items the same tier and completely generic. What happened to this game? I am truely and honestly dissapointed to read these type of posts about tiericide. They are junk.