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The Robot Devil
Molon Labe. Public Disorder.
1488
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Posted - 2014.01.11 04:00:00 -
[1] - Quote
Aero Yassavi wrote:I'd love tiericide, but at the least I'd hope to have a uniform slot layout across all tiers. Slots are what we use to make our fitting and roles unique and individualized to our own preferences. They are something that we should always have, and not be the bargaining chips to balancing the game.
Make our fitting unique but at the same time have a uniform slot layout across all tiers? What the hell is wrong with everyone? Layout of the slots is half of the uniqueness of the suit. You people want to play the most uniform boring game that it can be?
Tiericide is a bad idea because who would use anything but the the best and why?
Uniform slots would make the game even more repeatative than it is now and coupled with tiericide there might as well only be one suit and two guns.
Your are stripping the game of diversity with every push towards uniformity of weapons and suits. This kind of thing is what will make me biomass my character because the point of the game is to be able to fit the suit like I want with things I worked hard for. I invested SP and ISK, all anyone wants to do is make all items the same tier and completely generic. What happened to this game? I am truely and honestly dissapointed to read these type of posts about tiericide. They are junk.
GÇ£No sympathy for the devil; keep that in mind. Buy the ticket, take the ride."
Hunter S. Thompson
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The Robot Devil
Molon Labe. Public Disorder.
1488
|
Posted - 2014.01.11 04:04:00 -
[2] - Quote
Vell0cet wrote:BL4CKST4R wrote:Vell0cet wrote:BL4CKST4R wrote:Your looking at it the wrong way. What tier code would do is give MLT-ADV suits a fair fight vs a proto suit. The Proto suit will still be better and more expensive but the difference would be a lot smaller for example a proto suit compared to a MLT suit can have up to 30% more damage and double the HP. That's so unfair, and the learning curve and SP required to catch up is very steep. What tiercide would do is bring low level suits inline with proto suits, but will reward the higher level suits with a small advantage not a huge one. At the same time it will add variation with type II suits etc. Why would I run a suit that costs 10x the cost if it's advantage is very small? Look at EVE. An Omen costs roughly 8 mill, it's T2 counterpart the Zealot costs roughly 150 mill. That's nearly a 20x increase in price, and anyone who plays EVE knows that in a straight 1v1 fight, the Omen will loose every time. But if you bring 2-3 Omens, you can easily take out a Zealot with much less ISK on the line. I don't want fair fights. I want INTERESTING fights with tactics and different tiers of gear. It makes DUST fun, unique and exciting. With mixed levels of gear, the tactical situation is always changing and never the same. That's fun and interesting gameplay to me. Make DUST cookie-cutter where everyone's on a level playing field and you've got a **** game like Plannetside 2. If DUST tries to be a PS2 clone, it will fail miserably. Tiered gear and risk vs. ISK is literally the most interesting/fun aspect of DUST. I bet the reward for destroying the Zealot is great... what's the reward for 3 mlt suits taking out a proto suit? Practically nothing. Actually it's just a chance for some of it's mods to drop. It's mostly the satisfaction of taking away someone's expensive toy, which is the same reward you get in DUST (and also a percent of the cost of the suit/fittings gets added to the pool to be distributed at the end of the match, so you get a bigger payout). Don't you get a warm and fuzzy feeling when you kill someone's proto? Is there any other FPS that delivers such a satisfying experience?
They want uniform blandness for all things because having a different fit may cause them to lose. They have no pride in what they do because it is all about the grind, they have no imagination because all things should be the same and they have no sense of fun because everyone should be equal and have their hands held so it doesn't hurt so bad. These types of threads are the reason this game makes slow progress. No one wants hardcore, they all want win buttons that cannot be changed unless someone else has them.
GÇ£No sympathy for the devil; keep that in mind. Buy the ticket, take the ride."
Hunter S. Thompson
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The Robot Devil
Molon Labe. Public Disorder.
1491
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Posted - 2014.01.11 04:20:00 -
[3] - Quote
Alan-Ibn-Xuan Al-Alasabe wrote:The purpose of tiericide is to introduce a greater diversity in fits. With tiers you simply have improved versions of the same few dropsuits. Without tiers we're free to spread out rather than up, so no suit would be better than any other, but there would be a larger difference between individual suits.
Wrong.
Tiericide allowed differntly bonuses ships be accessed at level one skill instead of having wait till level five to fly a different ship than at level one. The fits are different on improved.
GÇ£No sympathy for the devil; keep that in mind. Buy the ticket, take the ride."
Hunter S. Thompson
|
The Robot Devil
Molon Labe. Public Disorder.
1491
|
Posted - 2014.01.11 05:23:00 -
[4] - Quote
BL4CKST4R wrote:The Robot Devil wrote:Aero Yassavi wrote:I'd love tiericide, but at the least I'd hope to have a uniform slot layout across all tiers. Slots are what we use to make our fitting and roles unique and individualized to our own preferences. They are something that we should always have, and not be the bargaining chips to balancing the game. Make our fitting unique but at the same time have a uniform slot layout across all tiers? What the hell is wrong with everyone? Layout of the slots is half of the uniqueness of the suit. You people want to play the most uniform boring game that it can be? Tiericide is a bad idea because who would use anything but the the best and why? Uniform slots would make the game even more repeatative than it is now and coupled with tiericide there might as well only be one suit and two guns. Your are stripping the game of diversity with every push towards uniformity of weapons and suits. This kind of thing is what will make me biomass my character because the point of the game is to be able to fit the suit like I want with things I worked hard for. I invested SP and ISK, all anyone wants to do is make all items the same tier and completely generic. What happened to this game? I am truely and honestly dissapointed to read these type of posts about tiericide. They are junk. What diversity there is no diversity know? Explain to me how diversity is having a bunch of crappy suits to be fed as fodder to proto suits. That's not diversity that's just having a huge advantage, that's like bringing a pen to a gun fight and saying it a fair fight because you have experience with the gun. Tiericide calls for providing an even field, he'll if every suit didn't have to worry about tanking alpha damage we would see MODULES which are what make or break suits actually meaning something. The only modules that matter are damage modifers, shields, and armor. Diversity should come from the role you play on the field now how weak/strong your suit is; because it is the same suit as the other guy except yours has more slots that's so diverse!
I can run a starter fit in a public match on any day and be competitive and make ISK. I can run BPO suits with mid level gear in FW and do decent. I don't do PC because I don't enjoy it. Saying that we all should be playing on an even field is bad. I use a BPO AR/SMG on Templar suit 90% of the time and I suck at FPSs. I have the money to run all gear at my level but it isn't needed to have fun, be profitable or place high on the leader boards.
The problems are not from the tiers in which our gear comes from. The problems with proto stomping is the way we are placed matches. If we were separated by meta it would be fine because the fit would matter and the battlefields would be level and skill more relevant. People say we don't have the numbers to do that but I disagree because each level of security status has its own meta value to be met. Yeah you might be able to fit a proto weapon on a standard suit but that would be all. Fits count more and skill counts more. If there isn't the right number of players then move sec stat. Just like PVP in EVE, can't find a good fight? Move on and try harder. Meta numbers would only stop proto stomps.
GÇ£No sympathy for the devil; keep that in mind. Buy the ticket, take the ride."
Hunter S. Thompson
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The Robot Devil
Molon Labe. Public Disorder.
1491
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Posted - 2014.01.11 05:25:00 -
[5] - Quote
Iron Wolf Saber wrote:My plan calls for a fitting bonus to be given to all suits as you raise their required command level thus a player first stepping into the suit cannot equip prototype weapons and modules but as he puts more levels into it he can then afford to continue to upgrade the suits performance.
The idea is not remove player progression at all but to shift its focus onto suit fittig and more extreme focus on making better fits for the playstyle thus fitting and how to fit the suit becomes the overall meta.
A player who grasps the concept early and quickly an empower a suit as easily as a proto suit can by equipping the same exact but weaker which the module's own gulfs between bottom to top are not so massive as the one pronounced in proto suits verses militia due to slot disparity alone. (slots are if you done any math wizardry on how ccp concluded their balance designs are extremely weighted )
With the loss of the proto suits the isk cost on regular suits are going have to adjust to be affordable and common. This means the modules between metas are going to gulfen a bit more to emphasize risk versus reward still matters.
This also cuts down on totally useless skills and empowers players earlier per level they unlock with suit command.
If you get rid of proto suits then advanced become the new proto and the same problems are still here until all suits are the same.
GÇ£No sympathy for the devil; keep that in mind. Buy the ticket, take the ride."
Hunter S. Thompson
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The Robot Devil
Molon Labe. Public Disorder.
1491
|
Posted - 2014.01.11 05:26:00 -
[6] - Quote
Brokerib wrote:Tiericide gets my vote. There's a number of good reasons for it, but the main benefit is that new players have a (slightly) more even playing field, which will help player retention.
How?
GÇ£No sympathy for the devil; keep that in mind. Buy the ticket, take the ride."
Hunter S. Thompson
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The Robot Devil
Molon Labe. Public Disorder.
1492
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Posted - 2014.01.11 06:15:00 -
[7] - Quote
I am confused then, I see suits differently than almost everyone else in the world evidently. I know this isn't EVE but they did three things perfect. The ablity to go anywhere, the economy and the ship bonuses we have now. Dust does none of these things and it sucks.
We have the exact same ideas about needs to be done and I just don't understand how you describe it. The end result is almost the same. What I am calling tiers are basically the same things you are callling tec. I am not worried about your ideas like I am others.
GÇ£No sympathy for the devil; keep that in mind. Buy the ticket, take the ride."
Hunter S. Thompson
|
The Robot Devil
Molon Labe. Public Disorder.
1492
|
Posted - 2014.01.11 07:12:00 -
[8] - Quote
We're on the same page but different paragraph.
GÇ£No sympathy for the devil; keep that in mind. Buy the ticket, take the ride."
Hunter S. Thompson
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