Like I already mentioned, there's room for improvement. Name one thing Dust related that CCP got right on the first try.

I apologize I'm not exactly sure what you are asking, if you can clarify that would be great, otherwise here hopefully this hits your question right.

Infantry are more spreedsheet based than vehicles, with vehicles being as close to no spreadsheets / no sp as possible in dust.

I do not want infantry to go the direction of the vehicles I would rather have vehicles go back towards the direction of infantry where there is some purpose to long term investment sp wise and not just personal experience.

Hopefully I answered your question there.

I'm saying should a proto suit be able to spreadsheet lower meta fits like tanks used to?

Like I already mentioned, there's room for improvement. Name one thing Dust related that CCP got right on the first try.

I think my last response answers that then, tanks are less spreadsheet than infantry as it stands, if you consider infantry "good", then tanks need to at least have the same spreadsheet potential as infantry, which has a skill to passively boost every stat.

I actually sympathize with the nechbead tankers because they were the bottom of the food chain to now being mocked as cheap tactics, and 0 mill tankers are just as effective as 10 mill tankers, which I see as disheartening for those players who's investment has just been trivialized.

I agree a tank is not OP.... but maybe 10 are?

that's how matches go now with anywhere from 5 or more tanks on each team on the field....

the real problem is that tank spam just makes dust boring, and even more stupid.

Actually I hope they do the opposite and remove all passive skills for infantry aside from stuff like circuitry and engineering. They made a good chili a by linking passives to efficacy bonuses but lingering skills like proficiency adding to raw DPS and shield/armor upgrades increasing HP hurt the overall skill > gear balance they keep claiming to aim for. But it also stems from TTK as well. Extenders and plates should be an added bonus, not a requirement with a higher emphasis on the complexities of different tanking types. If the new tank balancing is any indication to what 1.8's infantry balance will bring, I might get my wish.

The same could be said about AR spam.

I agree, tanks aren't OP. They're more accessible. No more SP > skill disparity to keep tanking a niche specialty anymore. You can do work with a soma or sica and get enough out of the experience to see if you want to actually invest SP. This pisses off neckbeard tankers and it pisses off AV spoiled by the crippled tanks we saw in early Uprising. Props to Wolfman for angering two communities while making a niche role viable and fun.

I think you mean Rail Rifle spam...but the AR is insanely good still. I don't see why some people call it "underpowered."

early chromosomes I had matches where I would easily kill 50 in ambush but one proto fg would kill me. Now, 20 kills is a great game. I just think everybody got used to paper thin they were in 1.6.-á I do way less damage than I did a week ago.

Here are the issues I do see currently

Damage threshold for sheild tanks don't account for hardeners. They keep repping while under fire.(swarms and large blaster)

Milita tanks plagued the battle feild due to their high effectiveness and low investment.

vehicle quotas count as a total number of vehicles. It should be breakdown of each vehicle. Ie: 4tanks, 4 lavs , 4 ds instead of 12 vehicles (just an example. Not numbers I'm suggesting)

Av has no incentive to chase tanks off.

Armor is fast but it turns like a 747... maybe a extended cool down on fuel injectors would help.

Sorry for another tank thread but I've been tanking a LONG time and wanted to share my thoughts.

Ty

Gunnlogi + 2 Shield Hardeners + Amped ADV Blaster versus Madrugar + 2 Armor Hardeners and 1 ENH or COM Armor Repairer + Amped ADV Blaster. Which wins?

What would be the shield tanker's role then?

Unlike the logi who can actually use a ton of modules to do what they want, the more deprived classes are on the other hand much more dependent on passives.

You are going to have to pardon me on this one but I find it a little suspicious to keep the cpu/pg increases when that is the logi's extreme stat, while the extreme stats of the other suits are to be dropped. I'm sure the heavy would like the ehp buffing skills (which they now lose 200+ ehp) because ehp is their extreme stat, precision and profile for scouts, and I'm pretty sure the more deprived cpu/pg classes would benefit more from dropping the cpu/pg skill because it would impact medium frames to a greater degree who have no issues with taking roles as it is.

That is not even getting into the fact that racials are currently passive and if they were to be replaced with bonuses to mods then any suit with a low module count gets screwed out of less utility from their racial.

A module only view is a very logi centric view because that is what logis operate on. So if that is the direction you want, classes are going to need an entire overhaul, changing all the stats again, and with logis losing their slot advantage because that would impede balance in a module only system.

1. Blasters are a primarily anti-infantry weapon. Complaining that they take a long time to kill a tank is like complaining that an Assault Rifle takes too long to kill a tank.

2. Blasters are primarily focused on shield damage. Giving both vehicles the same weapon when one vehicle has built-in resistance to the weapon on its main tank and the other vehicle has a built-in vulnerability is a great way to introduce a huge amount of bias. The best way to kill a Blaster Tank is with another tank using a weapon that ISN'T a Blaster. If there's an enemy Madrugar running Blasters, a primarily Militia-fitted Sica can attach a Standard Large Missile Turret and destroy the Maddy before it even gets in Blaster range. Also, as a shield tank, you have a lot less to fear from AV, which is heavily weighted towards anti-armour effectiveness. Most attacks short of Proto Swarms can be shrugged off with little concern even when you're NOT running hardeners. Forge Guns are a threat, but you can retreat, recover and pop hardeners before moving in again.

Where armour is good at actively tanking infantry AV attacks because of the longer duration of their modules, shields have a better passive tank against such things, making them more suited to long-range combat and running as the AV tank. You need to have good situational awareness for AV, but you need to get in closer for anti-infantry.

If tanks arn't OP then AV is UP. Five AVers can't kill a single tank with no gunners while his actives are up. Don't see the problem? Tanks are too fast to chase down, too deadly to engage directly, and too hard to engage during opportunistic times. The only way the current numbers will work is if AV is made into sidearms or equipment. Which is why I now use RE's on annoying tanks and crash an LAV into them. You asked for this.

You forgot my Soma costs like 65k and my proto AVers costs 180k.
And i cant still down a Soma with my AV suit.

AGAIN. in order to balance tanks,reduce their number to 2 per team. Done: Balance.

I'd be cool with that. Even as a tanker, I hate facing 4-6 enemy tanks with no av back up.

Edit: if you can't kill a stock soma with proto av, you really suck at av.

There's your problem right there. Glowy tank = Bad, not glowy tank = good.

He never said stock AV. He is a very good player. Try to read more.

Have you tried doing the math where you account for the range advantage of the Missile Turrets on a Sica/Gunnlogi? ...
And if you're running double hardeners on your Sica/Gunnlogi, guess what? The higher resist means you can cycle your hardeners instead of needing to pop both at once, and keep up the still-high resist for long enough to stand up against the enemy tank.

Have you considered bringing a Gunnlogi with a Heavy Shield Extender, one Hardener and a Shield Booster for mid-combat regen? Or with the Extender and dual hardeners? Either of those fittings is better than running dual hardeners and damage mod.

Designing a shield tank to do what armour tanks are built for ...

Also, you suck at Railguns. ... your second shot can follow up not only less than 2s after your first ... you can generally 3-shot an armour tank if the first hit lands ...

The same could be said about AR spam.

65k is almost stock. So he has 5k in mods? Still a fit starter swarms could kill. I also said "if" what specifically should I be reading?