I like hearing people that spec'd into FOTM weapons crying when they get nerfed.

Respecs would deny me this pleasure.

Respecs would mean everyone is always skilled into the FOTM. There would be even less variation in the game than there is now. Your call for respecs would cancel out all the possible benefits you have proposed. No more respecs ever.

Hm. I made a really similar thread yesterday!

Basically, I agree. I think that $20 is a bit much (I posted up some really weaselly small amount of AUR, because I didn't want to engage in the "what's the exact right price" debate), and definitely want an ISK variant. Some folks mentioned a cooldown on the respec, which is a pretty good idea, I guess, if you have to limit it for some reason.

I think what you said is valid!

And yes, people would respec into the FotM, but that doesn't matter for the same reasons our OP stated--people like to try new things. Yes, even you, you jaded old EVE/DUST player. You want more, and this is a way to get it. Since playing on that one map can get old (wait, was there more than one?), we have to keep our characters fresh.

...side note: Someone somehwere mentioned monocles for their character. OMG, skins? Changes in gameplay? VARIETY!?

Take my money, CCP!



(sorry, if I got off track a bit there!)

Respecs would mean everyone is always skilled into the FOTM. There would be even less variation in the game than there is now. Your call for respecs would cancel out all the possible benefits you have proposed. No more respecs ever.

this is the only argument i keep hearing against respecs. What's stopping people from skilling into FoTM now? What's to stop people from ALREADY having the FoTM?

I have multiple proto weapons already, and I'm sure many others do as well, so how is this FoTM argument work for people like me? I have enough SP right now to get proto MDs + proficiency. Only weapon I don't have proto is the LR and Sniper Rifle (AI not AV)

So why shouldn't I get a respec now? I have the same lame ass heavy suit for over a year now. Shouldn't I get a respec for CCP's lack of heavy content by now? No new suit, no new weapon, and a useless racial suit.

A cash based resepec system would be stupidly pay to win and something CCP wouldn't do.

A cash based resepec system would be stupidly pay to win and something CCP wouldn't do.

What's funny too is that people are quick to say you grow wider, not taller, which means all respecs will ever do is shake things up, since no one can respec and instantly be better than everyone else.

That literally only happens when CCP fails to balance their game by making things like Cal Lolgis and Flaylocks, along with Plasma Cannons and Commando's on the other end of that spectrum.

Respecs would mean everyone is always skilled into the FOTM. There would be even less variation in the game than there is now. Your call for respecs would cancel out all the possible benefits you have proposed. No more respecs ever.

A cash based resepec system would be stupidly pay to win and something CCP wouldn't do.

respecs are a bad thing, and they make a 'thinking mans shooter' into a 'well, i'll just skill into whatever is best this month' kind of a shooter.

"Keeping it fresh" is not going to be what these are used for. As with any other possible advantage, they will be exploited mercilessly because this is a game where losing actually hurts you.

24 hour cooldown, 3 day cooldown, 7 day cooldown, any kind of cooldown at all.

The only people who fear people changing specializations is those with spies in the enemy corp, otherwise it's fairly moot.

Also respec option shouldn't be $$$

Letting people actually enjoy their SP instead of forcing it to sit there growing stale would encourage fun, not hurt it. It will also highlight issues in the game with "FoTM" builds, which can be identified and dealt with easier, without scorning players since they could just shake things up if they didn't like the changes.

I hope when DUST finally gets an EP again, he can see this.

Also @ Low Genius, lmao "thinking mans" shooter? You drank the punch, didn't you? Capture C and redline hardly qualifies as "thinking"

Constant respecs would be bad because eveyrone would simply spec into the current FOTM.

So for 2-3 months we'd have "Caldari TAR logi Dust 514"....followed by "Caldari MD logi Dust 514", followed by the next FOTM.

No full-out respec. Passive partial respec only; as much as I would love to try every little thing out on this game, being smart with your SP is a little more important than unlocking some proto weapon or proto suit that will not only burn up ISK, but will eat your patience as well when you lose a million ISK in one fight because your dropsuit upgrade skills are not leveled up enough to pump the max amount of PG/CPU, shields, and armor.

"Thou shalt save thine SP; In time, thou shall find the proper and best way to distribute thine SP without exploding into fits of rage."

Constant respecs would be bad because eveyrone would simply spec into the current FOTM.

So for 2-3 months we'd have "Caldari TAR logi Dust 514"....followed by "Caldari MD logi Dust 514", followed by the next FOTM.

Again it would show the FOTM quicker getting it nerfed. Plus PEOPLE STILL USED THE FOTM EVEN WITHOUT RESPECS. So it's not going to change!

It's not as if it takes CCP long to figure out the FOTM or OP stuff...what takes time is fixing it.

People do this anyway? So why does it matter if CCP makes money so they can make a better game? Your just being ignorant. Its not like you have to respec! If you don't want to use then go ahead. Some people want this. Our community is too divided to make this an EVE type game. Which right now isn't working. The best players of this game quit everyday. The game is too one sided line this. But for some reason the FPS players are the QQ'ers, because they know what it takes to make a good FPS.

You don't need a lot of SP to get into new suits or use new weapons. You need a lot of SP to go full Proto.
You don't want a respec to try new things, you want to dominate with a new thing, without spending any time trying out the lower tiers.
Spending another month with a new weapon until you can get it to Proto level doesn't limit your gameplay choices.

I believe that respecs need to be an option in this game in order to survive. I think there are a few reasons why.

1. Respecs would allow players to try new things and keep this game fresh while we wait for new content. Keeping a bigger player base.

2. Players are able to be more versatile when it comes to PC and gives newer players more chances to get in PC. Players who say want to join Corp A but Corp A has good logi's and your a logi, you could switch to heavy let's say if they're weak in that area.

3. CCP can make money when players want to use the FOTM. Players will skill into the FOTM no matter what. Use flaylock for example, players skilled into it even though it was obviously getting nerfed, but competive players need every advantage in order to succeed in PC.

4. It could also even the playing field when it comes to PC. It could allow for different playstyles. Different tactics! It would be a question what every player runs when you get into a warbarge rather than, "I see two tanks, a forge, 2 heavies, etc..."

I think that if CCP put a respec option for $20 or 100 million ISK. That it would ultimately allow for more reasons to stick around while this game get better. I see potential, but something like this needs to happen in order to survive long term. But we can't have an ignorant player base that either complains about every little flaw or anything that is just QQ'ing because your butt hurt.

I don't post or QQ on the forums. So if you guys could at least give this a thought that would be much appreciated!

Edit: Also its not like its forced on to you. If you don't want to respec then obviously you don't have to.

people are always complaining that respecs would ruin this game and people would just put points into the fotm. This is not eve and it never will be you are playing a fps game and players that come from fps games do no not normally wait months to unlock one piece of gear. If you want this game to thrive then allow respecs, people will be able to jump from fitting to fitting at whatever cost you come up with. I personally would stick with what I have, maybe tweak a few things. Stop being such stubborn old, bandwagon farts and pressure ccp for respecs or this game will slowly fall apart

It wouldn't actually change the battlefield at all, aside from making people more apt to play.

People just can't admit that they don't trust CCPs ability to introduce reasonable balance, as "FoTM" is basically the only argument against respecs. Then there's the "well EVE does it", well, EVE is a mostly complete game, DUST is still in its early Beta stages right now.

Also lmao at all these people who assume a respec option / system would be available all the time at a moments notice. Cooldown much?

exactly, im tired of hearing fotm and how respecs would make it so people keep swapping over. Well think about it, its flavor of the month, if respecs had an aur price tag dust would make lots of money, and all you wieners could laugh at people spending aur, you could all cry pay to win and feel better then others. everybody wins

If you give it an Aurum price Tag, then it IS P2W.

You just pay Money to just skill into whatever gun you desire.

People want to be able to skill into the FOTM at will.

People want to be able to skill into the FOTM at will.

People get bored of sitting on skills that are no longer relevant to them

And here it is. You (the people that want respecs) skilled into FOTM setups, they got nerfed, and now you're regretful that you put all your eggs in Flaylock pistols.

Well, too bad. Skill into new things that you want to play, or continue using the Flaylock pistol (or whatever is your FOTM-that-got-nerfed) and be happy you skilled into it, since IT WAS THE PLAYSTYLE YOU ENJOYED, OR YOU WOULD NOT HAVE SPENT YOUR SP THERE IN THE FIRST PLACE, NO?

[quote=Obi Wan-Jacobi]I believe that respecs need to be an option in this game in order to survive. I think there are a few reasons why.



1. They Break The Skill System entirely. Why play for that new Weapon when I can Just respec into it, whenever I need it?

The Skill system is designed, as to elongate the Games Life-span. You play to get into that new gear, and then get farther into that gear, and eventually max out that Skill set, over a long period of time. If you can just respect into whatever the hell you want in a moments notice, not only does it make the issue of FOTM, extremely exaggerated, as then everybody would just respect into the FOTM OPedness.


tl;dr, Respecs break the Skill system, and therefore break one of the few remaining selling points of DUST, which therefore, basically Breaks DUST, and its compatriot Game.

People want to be able to skill into the FOTM at will.

And here it is. You (the people that want respecs) skilled into FOTM setups, they got nerfed, and now you're regretful that you put all your eggs in Flaylock pistols.

Well, too bad. Skill into new things that you want to play, or continue using the Flaylock pistol (or whatever is your FOTM-that-got-nerfed) and be happy you skilled into it, since IT WAS THE PLAYSTYLE YOU ENJOYED, OR YOU WOULD NOT HAVE SPENT YOUR SP THERE IN THE FIRST PLACE, NO?

And here it is. You (the people that want respecs) skilled into FOTM setups, they got nerfed, and now you're regretful that you put all your eggs in Flaylock pistols.

Well, too bad. Skill into new things that you want to play, or continue using the Flaylock pistol (or whatever is your FOTM-that-got-nerfed) and be happy you skilled into it, since IT WAS THE PLAYSTYLE YOU ENJOYED, OR YOU WOULD NOT HAVE SPENT YOUR SP THERE IN THE FIRST PLACE, NO?

oh? Please explain to me how my situation, is me wanting the FoTM.

- 17 mil SP

- Proto weapons: HMG, AR, SR, FG, FLP, SMG, Nades, Shotgun

- Proto suits: Heavy basic, Gallente basic

- SP saved up: by now 1 mil

How do I need a respec to be up to the FoTM? Some people want a respec simply cuz they're tired of playing their current role / class. Heavies haven't got a single new item in this game since closed beta. What if i don't want to the class anymore simply cuz it's boring as **** having nothing new for over a year and a half?

But nah... EVERYBODY wants a respec for FoTM right?

enough with this flavor of the month bs once they are done fixing aiming or what ever they do. Balancing will be come much better and then we can stop seeing fotm.

to the p2w guy -Respecs are less p2w than boosters or aur weaponry. Im not going to play a game come across a sniper and say " hey why don't I replace 14mill sp and become a sniper to kill that guy" Some people have jobs or are getting ready to go to university and cant spend every week capping out for months so they can get equipment they don't like. Respecs will keep people playing.

oh? Please explain to me how my situation, is me wanting the FoTM.

- 17 mil SP

- Proto weapons: HMG, AR, SR, FG, FLP, SMG, Nades, Shotgun

- Proto suits: Heavy basic, Gallente basic

- SP saved up: by now 1 mil

How do I need a respec to be up to the FoTM? Some people want a respec simply cuz they're tired of playing their current role / class. Heavies haven't got a single new item in this game since closed beta. What if i don't want to the class anymore simply cuz it's boring as **** having nothing new for over a year and a half?

But nah... EVERYBODY wants a respec for FoTM right?

No, if this is really such an issue we need to get rid of the skill system and be done with it. It's completely pointless and self defeating for a system based around specializations to have a means to just opt out at will. Also the "I have personal commitments" reasoning is played out. Unfortunately any and all long term progression systems will conflict with this unless, as the op proposes, we negate the point of the system.

Lets just go with a COD-like level system and be done with it. Skills are pointless when easily overridden.

im in the same boat only I have every vehicle type, would be nice to try some new stuff.

oh yea cuz paying money for a respec once every couple months is totally unreasonable

With 1m SP you should easily be able to try other things, especially since having high SP counts likely means you don't have to worry about much by way of core skills and can go about fully dedicated to expanding your arsenal. The only reason your situation is problematic is if you have the impression that proto gear/suits are needed just for trying something new, refuse to run gear below proto, or only play PC matches which necessitate proto. I don't see any of these being a very compelling justification for a respec.

I believe that respecs need to be an option in this game in order to survive. I think there are a few reasons why.

1. Respecs would allow players to try new things and keep this game fresh while we wait for new content. Keeping a bigger player base.

2. Players are able to be more versatile when it comes to PC and gives newer players more chances to get in PC. Players who say want to join Corp A but Corp A has good logi's and your a logi, you could switch to heavy let's say if they're weak in that area.

3. CCP can make money when players want to use the FOTM. Players will skill into the FOTM no matter what. Use flaylock for example, players skilled into it even though it was obviously getting nerfed, but competive players need every advantage in order to succeed in PC.

4. It could also even the playing field when it comes to PC. It could allow for different playstyles. Different tactics! It would be a question what every player runs when you get into a warbarge rather than, "I see two tanks, a forge, 2 heavies, etc..."

I think that if CCP put a respec option for $20 or 100 million ISK. That it would ultimately allow for more reasons to stick around while this game get better. I see potential, but something like this needs to happen in order to survive long term. But we can't have an ignorant player base that either complains about every little flaw or anything that is just QQ'ing because your butt hurt.

I don't post or QQ on the forums. So if you guys could at least give this a thought that would be much appreciated!

Edit: Also its not like its forced on to you. If you don't want to respec then obviously you don't have to.

Edit: I've stated why respecs ruin the SP system and proposed we (request to) abolish it instead of having it linger pointlessly. Care to explain how "reasonable" a long term specialization based system with years of skills is when negated by getting do-overs every month?

Do you actually have a counter argument?

Edit: I've stated why respecs ruin the SP system and proposed we (request to) abolish it instead of having it linger pointlessly. Care to explain how "reasonable" a long term specialization based system with years of skills is when negated by getting do-overs every month?

Any new suit proto is what, 1.5 mil and a racial suit is what, 2.5 mil or something? So people are suppose to grind this boring game for weeks / months to get something new simply because their class offers nothing anymore?

Proto gear is needed for PC, which was about the only thing I played in this game since lolpubs.

I played this game since E3 last year, grinding every week to get SP to try new things. Now that I'm where I am SP wise, and I want to try new things, I'm suppose to continue grinding? lol... nice way to keep people playing huh?

What do you think people rather? More grinding in lolpubs, or paying to get a respec on their hard earned SP? For the betterment of the game, people should be able to pay to get a respec on their SP ALREADY EARNED.

Then GET RID OF THE SKILL SYSTEM IN FAVOR OF A SHORT TERM SYSTEM. It doesn't make sense to have a system like this in place if a) All that matters is the top tier (really it just means that lower tiers are irrelevant as well as the players confined to them) and b) the skill system locks you into a particular equipment set by design, a design which is diametrically opposed to respecs.

And pointing out that people earned their SP in no way negates that. Remember, those same people chose where to place that SP.

ccp has already stated there will be no more respecs. so, these threads are just for trolling :(

long term specialization? How is this possible when not everything is in the game? Heavies have 1 suit, scouts have 2 suits. How is this specializing into anything? Sounds more like being forced to spend SP on a race you don't want but have no choice.

Do we not have skills that take large amounts of time and/or gameplay to max out? If we don't, why does this thread exist? If we do, guess what kind of skill system we have? Incomplete offerings don't negate that. If you train min scout for lack of caldari scout you are still specializing in min scout. You may chose later to diversify, or CCP could provide an entirely justified 1 time respec upon completion of the basic suit tree, but that doesn't change what you are doing with the investment of skills.

not sure if trolling at this point...

get rid of the SP system is your argument? smfh... i'm done.

People choose?

lol... people are forced to choose a race, yet you're still preaching specialization? lol...

Edit: this game is not EVE btw. This no respec thing only flies on PC games. CCP running DUST like they do EVE has done nothing but put DUST in its current state.

It is and always has been. People spec into the thing that closest represents what they are after. Not having a subset of options doesn't negate this.

At this point you're arguing that Dust was a failed concept from the beginning.

I'm starting to agree.

Edit: And it's not CCP that has me leaning that way.

Edit: I've stated why respecs ruin the SP system and proposed we (request to) abolish it instead of having it linger pointlessly. Care to explain how "reasonable" a long term specialization based system with years of skills is when negated by getting do-overs every month?

"Forced" specialization is no less specialization than that which is done in the presence of a full set of options. After all they still chose scout over heavy or medium or their specs.

Yes its going to fail if this is run like EVE. It already is. Everybody just AFK's or plays just PC. Not a successful game in my mind

that's not a choice. That's an illusion of choice. Either is "choose" to pick the Amarr heavy, or I don't play. Simple. Since I wanted to play, Amarr was the ONLY "choice" I had, as well as others.

Again, that's not a choice, that's a forced option.

I agree with the option to buy respecs and have a time limit for when i can do it again but only until all the suits have come out then it should stop. Cause for me im caldari as you can see and i want my caldari scout suit. i don't want to have to grind anther 2.5mil (it takes about 2 months with an active and passive booster and if you cap out every week) to get it when i should already have it. same for the heavies i know they want there choice of a suit to get cause they only have one

Yes its going to fail if this is run like EVE. It already is. Everybody just AFK's or plays just PC. Not a successful game in my mind

The system doesn't have "years" of skills in specializations. This game actually has FAR too few skills to truly promote any form of long term specialization, and instead of in depth cool detailed content we just unlock a couple % differences and maybe a high or low slot along with a higher base number.

You max out any given specialization in a few months, then you "sidegrade", assuming you had the patience to sit on the only thing keeping the game remotely interesting at this point (SP). If you sidegrade first and spread out your skills, you can compensate a little for having low FPS skills by being more versatile, since having better gear won't make up for you lack of skill in the first place.

This game does not promote long term specialization because specializations are a joke and the only reason people fear FoTM is because there is a striking lack of customization in this game to the point where a system designed to support "endless" specializations boils down to a few choice builds in the build touted by the game designers to be a big step in the right direction.

One word

Flaylock

Responding to Title:

Yes they are and you should feel bad for feeling otherwise.

Who is this "everyone"? I've as of yet not found a terribly large shortage of people to shoot or trying to shoot me and I've never done a PC match. There are plenty of people playing and the only people who don't see that are the ones who spend all their time in the MCC.

This game in the past few months have gone from like 6000 at a time to like 4000. Thats A LOT of players lost. Not many players i used to play with even play at this point.

6000 was right after the expansion. The expansion gave people a greater reason to log in. Numbers tapering afterwards isn't really odd IMHO. Numbers prior to the launch date look like they were lower despite being in open beta. Also there hasn't been too many strong pushes to get players in lately and likely won't be for a while yet while CCP tries to clean things up.

I had plenty of friends quit the game at Uprising cus they hated it. While in Chromosome they played like all day.

This is a direct contradiction to your assertion though. It's a clear indication that the issue isn't a lack of respecs, it's the gameplay issues introduced with Uprising.

100mil ISK? Ohh so only the PC corps can get them I see.

If your trying to "troll" you should feel bad. If not give reasons not a broad statement

That has nothing to do with my post though. I want a respec for my scout being a a piece of ****.

I see your issue here you don't want to live your choices so you come here to cry foul that your k/d is affected by the changes instead of speccing into something else or changing tactics up adapting....

I used Flaylocks before AND after the so called 'nerf' and I'm still doing fine. I used a lot of Fused Contact grenades before the nerf (yeah it was OP) so I went back to 'cooking' my grenades and guess what... I'm still doing fine. I adapted... so for respecs the answer is:

No.

Live with it.

Or

Leave. Your choice.

Respecs would mean everyone is always skilled into the FOTM. There would be even less variation in the game than there is now. Your call for respecs would cancel out all the possible benefits you have proposed. No more respecs ever.

I dont care about my k/d. But i'm sorry that i wanted to use the most UP thing in this game. But after like 4 months of using it in sick of it. By the time i get another proto suit the ps4 is going to be out. So it's pointless. You can't adapt to taking like 6 bullets and dying. Im one of the better scouts in the game but an assault/logi can doo anything i do better. So i want to change suits.

Edit: As a scout i have posted 22-10, 18-13 as notable games against Team Players. So it's not like im bad. I just want to be better.

You're my bro, but you can't be more wrong on this one.

There have been some very well thought out posts on the respec issue. At this point in this game's development I think it's vital to the future of this game. It doesn't even need to be something that stays long term.

But this game has a few months left at this rate. If a respec or two keeps people around while they get it fixed. It might b ethe difference between its life or death.

Exactly if they add respecs ill wait it's release on ps4. Without them i'll find another game play. So far that's one person that'll sick around

The game keeps pulling me back, but to be honest it's not as much to do with the game as it is to the guys I play with. How long will that be enough if I'm not having fun.

I started speccing into a different suit and a different weapon. After a few weeks I don't like the shotgun. I went prof 2. So now I have to find a different weapon while saving 1.8 mil ISK to go from ADV to proto in my new suit.

I had the drive to grind for what I've got. The motivation isn't there to do it. I almost didn't cap last week for the first time. If I wasn't in a FB chat with corp mates I wouldn't have.

There are dozens of guys I know who just left. I'm sure everybody is going through this.

How can we hang on to this stubborn mentality? It just doesn't make sense. The game is stagnant. I understand CCP is working their ass off to get it fixed, but I'm bored.

I dont care about my k/d. But i'm sorry that i wanted to use the most UP thing in this game. But after like 4 months of using it in sick of it. By the time i get another proto suit the ps4 is going to be out. So it's pointless. You can't adapt to taking like 6 bullets and dying. Im one of the better scouts in the game but an assault/logi can doo anything i do better. So i want to change suits.

Edit: As a scout i have posted 22-10, 18-13 as notable games against Team Players. So it's not like im bad. I just want to be better.

respecs are a bad thing, and they make a 'thinking mans shooter' into a 'well, i'll just skill into whatever is best this month' kind of a shooter.