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D legendary hero
THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND
391
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Posted - 2013.07.20 17:11:00 -
[1] - Quote
due to the fact that there are many threads on similar topics and that my explainations tend to be lengthy and would require alot of programming i decided to develop this series of threads called the QUICK fix series.
this series intends to use preexisting elements of the game and/or simple changes to balance out weaponry, vehicles, etc already in the game. that why it can effectively fix a problem in the short term while long term solutions are in development.
this threads topic is: HMGs
problem: damage output is low verses all the drawbacks and range.
solution: reduce the fire rate to 500 RPM, increase damage per shot to 73 per shot for STD, 75 ADV, 77 PROTO. (the dps for the STD would be 608)
keeping dispersion, heat build up, and recoil the same. the damage profile will match the downsides while in CQC the low fire rate will prevent any buffs to the suit from overwhelming shotgunners. |
xSir Campsalotx
D.A.R.K L.E.G.I.O.N D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E
21
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Posted - 2013.07.20 17:14:00 -
[2] - Quote
Clip size ? |
Django Quik
R.I.f.t
1007
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Posted - 2013.07.20 17:17:00 -
[3] - Quote
I really don't see a problem with the HMGs. They're currently the 3rd most killing weapon in the game after only ARs and snipers and used a hell of a lot less than either of those. |
Alldin Kan
Internal Error. Negative-Feedback
415
|
Posted - 2013.07.20 17:24:00 -
[4] - Quote
D legendary hero wrote:due to the fact that there are many threads on similar topics and that my explainations tend to be lengthy and would require alot of programming i decided to develop this series of threads called the QUICK fix series.
this series intends to use preexisting elements of the game and/or simple changes to balance out weaponry, vehicles, etc already in the game. that why it can effectively fix a problem in the short term while long term solutions are in development.
this threads topic is: HMGs
problem: damage output is low verses all the drawbacks and range.
solution: reduce the fire rate to 500 RPM, increase damage per shot to 73 per shot for STD, 75 ADV, 77 PROTO. (the dps for the STD would be 608)
keeping dispersion, heat build up, and recoil the same. the damage profile will match the downsides while in CQC the low fire rate will prevent any buffs to the suit from overwhelming shotgunners.
go away |
Knight Soiaire
Better Hide R Die D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E
1358
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Posted - 2013.07.20 17:26:00 -
[5] - Quote
HMGs are okay, they insta-kill my Scout suit in CQC if I physically run into them = Insta-death |
D legendary hero
THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND
393
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Posted - 2013.07.20 17:27:00 -
[6] - Quote
xSir Campsalotx wrote:Clip size ?
200 |
D legendary hero
THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND
393
|
Posted - 2013.07.20 17:29:00 -
[7] - Quote
Knight Soiaire wrote:HMGs are okay, they insta-kill my Scout suit in CQC if I physically run into them = Insta-death
HMGs arent meant for CQC. they are a niche weapon designed for a range between close and medium combat. at max they should go out to medium combat.
ARs are supposed to be medium to long ange combat, and snipers long to extrememly long range combat.
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Ansiiis The Trustworthy
WE ARE LEGENDS
150
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Posted - 2013.07.20 17:30:00 -
[8] - Quote
I like the trying but your fixes are bad.
I'm not judging as I couldn't do it any better but let people who know their role do this in more than 5 sentences. |
D legendary hero
THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND
393
|
Posted - 2013.07.20 17:32:00 -
[9] - Quote
Alldin Kan wrote:D legendary hero wrote:due to the fact that there are many threads on similar topics and that my explainations tend to be lengthy and would require alot of programming i decided to develop this series of threads called the QUICK fix series.
this series intends to use preexisting elements of the game and/or simple changes to balance out weaponry, vehicles, etc already in the game. that why it can effectively fix a problem in the short term while long term solutions are in development.
this threads topic is: HMGs
problem: damage output is low verses all the drawbacks and range.
solution: reduce the fire rate to 500 RPM, increase damage per shot to 73 per shot for STD, 75 ADV, 77 PROTO. (the dps for the STD would be 608)
keeping dispersion, heat build up, and recoil the same. the damage profile will match the downsides while in CQC the low fire rate will prevent any buffs to the suit from overwhelming shotgunners. go away
haha i know what happened to you. you saw "damage per shot 73" and stopped reading. if yoou look at the math, the DPS is still the same. the RPM are only 100 more than a breach AR. the numbers are swapped. HMGs or LMGs should have a low fire rate, high damage per shot and high clip size to be balanced by its long reload, over heating, inaccuracy, and high recoil. |
Severance Pay
Krullefor Organization Minmatar Republic
783
|
Posted - 2013.07.20 17:32:00 -
[10] - Quote
Wait. I wanna stop you here before CCP thinks they have to stop something that isn't broken. |
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D legendary hero
THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND
393
|
Posted - 2013.07.20 17:35:00 -
[11] - Quote
Ansiiis The Trustworthy wrote:I like the trying but your fixes are bad.
I'm not judging as I couldn't do it any better but let people who know their role do this in more than 5 sentences.
but i use HMGs and i know what the problem here is. ive been using them for 4 months and change... and seriously enough is enough. the damage per shot is very important.
right now the HMG operates like a super SMG with less damage. in extremely close range it works magic but the suit its attached to is not designed for close range. so there is no point to having it like that.
lowering the fire rate and increasing damage per shot is the best way to get this gun to operate like an actual HMG |
HowDidThatTaste
Internal Error. Negative-Feedback
3420
|
Posted - 2013.07.20 17:38:00 -
[12] - Quote
D legendary hero wrote:Alldin Kan wrote:D legendary hero wrote:due to the fact that there are many threads on similar topics and that my explainations tend to be lengthy and would require alot of programming i decided to develop this series of threads called the QUICK fix series.
this series intends to use preexisting elements of the game and/or simple changes to balance out weaponry, vehicles, etc already in the game. that why it can effectively fix a problem in the short term while long term solutions are in development.
this threads topic is: HMGs
problem: damage output is low verses all the drawbacks and range.
solution: reduce the fire rate to 500 RPM, increase damage per shot to 73 per shot for STD, 75 ADV, 77 PROTO. (the dps for the STD would be 608)
keeping dispersion, heat build up, and recoil the same. the damage profile will match the downsides while in CQC the low fire rate will prevent any buffs to the suit from overwhelming shotgunners. go away haha i know what happened to you. you saw "damage per shot 73" and stopped reading. if yoou look at the math, the DPS is still the same. the RPM are only 100 more than a breach AR. the numbers are swapped. HMGs or LMGs should have a low fire rate, high damage per shot and high clip size to be balanced by its long reload, over heating, inaccuracy, and high recoil.
Try the breach SMG and get back to us
|
Lance 2ballzStrong
SyNergy Gaming EoN.
2919
|
Posted - 2013.07.20 17:39:00 -
[13] - Quote
Django Quik wrote:I really don't see a problem with the HMGs. They're currently the 3rd most killing weapon in the game after only ARs and snipers and used a hell of a lot less than either of those.
flaylocks and nades say "HI!!" |
D legendary hero
THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND
393
|
Posted - 2013.07.20 17:39:00 -
[14] - Quote
Severance Pay wrote:Wait. I wanna stop you here before CCP thinks they have to stop something that isn't broken.
when a submachine gun can out gun an HMG there is a problem |
Razielraze
Ahrendee Mercenaries EoN.
0
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Posted - 2013.07.20 17:41:00 -
[15] - Quote
Stay away from my HMG. Maybe up turn speed by a small margin, but stay far far away from my HMG. |
D legendary hero
THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND
393
|
Posted - 2013.07.20 17:42:00 -
[16] - Quote
Lance 2ballzStrong wrote:Django Quik wrote:I really don't see a problem with the HMGs. They're currently the 3rd most killing weapon in the game after only ARs and snipers and used a hell of a lot less than either of those. flaylocks and nades say "HI!!"
LAnce whats up man? so what do think about this quick fix? |
ER-Bullitt
Molon Labe. League of Infamy
114
|
Posted - 2013.07.20 17:44:00 -
[17] - Quote
Dont have a problem with the damage.
I personally have never been comfortable with the slow tracking/turn speed of the heavy suit, and most of my failed 1v1 gun fights are because my enemy out strafed me (or was using explosions, FP, MD or Fused Nades). When I land bullets they do well enough to drop health, its the landing of the bullets part that is holding me back from getting better with the weapon.
Ive tried the Burst Variant, and that does nicely at medium range.. but its a ***** to use in CqC with all the strafing and jumping going on.
Kneeling fixes some of the problems at medium range and can be quite useful, but it leaves you as a sitting duck.
just my $0.02 |
Severance Pay
Krullefor Organization Minmatar Republic
783
|
Posted - 2013.07.20 17:47:00 -
[18] - Quote
The HMG isn't bad, it's just you. No seriously. Get gud scrub. |
D legendary hero
THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND
393
|
Posted - 2013.07.20 17:50:00 -
[19] - Quote
ER-Bullitt wrote:Dont have a problem with the damage.
I personally have never been comfortable with the slow tracking/turn speed of the heavy suit, and most of my failed 1v1 gun fights are because my enemy out strafed me (or was using explosions, FP, MD or Fused Nades). When I land bullets they do well enough to drop health, its the landing of the bullets part that is holding me back from getting better with the weapon.
Ive tried the Burst Variant, and that does nicely at medium range.. but its a ***** to use in CqC with all the strafing and jumping going on.
Kneeling fixes some of the problems at medium range and can be quite useful, but it leaves you as a sitting duck.
just my $0.02
turning speed is the suit issue. the same turn speed is used for the light weapons, and side arms the heavy suit uses.
as far as DPS is concerned fire rate and damage per shot dnt matter. but in practice they make a world of diference. having high damage per shot means when you hit something chunks of hp disappear promting a retreat by the enemy.
suppresion is then accomplished. low fire rate also means your clip lasts longer. |
ER-Bullitt
Molon Labe. League of Infamy
115
|
Posted - 2013.07.20 17:54:00 -
[20] - Quote
D legendary hero wrote:ER-Bullitt wrote:Dont have a problem with the damage.
I personally have never been comfortable with the slow tracking/turn speed of the heavy suit, and most of my failed 1v1 gun fights are because my enemy out strafed me (or was using explosions, FP, MD or Fused Nades). When I land bullets they do well enough to drop health, its the landing of the bullets part that is holding me back from getting better with the weapon.
Ive tried the Burst Variant, and that does nicely at medium range.. but its a ***** to use in CqC with all the strafing and jumping going on.
Kneeling fixes some of the problems at medium range and can be quite useful, but it leaves you as a sitting duck.
just my $0.02 turning speed is the suit issue. the same turn speed is used for the light weapons, and side arms the heavy suit uses. as far as DPS is concerned fire rate and damage per shot dnt matter. but in practice they make a world of diference. having high damage per shot means when you hit something chunks of hp disappear promting a retreat by the enemy. suppresion is then accomplished. low fire rate also means your clip lasts longer.
Someone posted above for you to try the Breach SMG.
The breach SMG is basically setup the way you want the HMG to be changed.
It would behoove you to try a regular SMG, then try the breach, and feel the difference. I personally cant stand the breach SMG.. looking at the stats on paper I thought it would be a good choice to backup my HMG, but yeah... me no likey.
I know turning speed is the suit issue.. but its not like we have the option to use a different suit combined with the HMG.. |
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D legendary hero
THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND
393
|
Posted - 2013.07.20 17:54:00 -
[21] - Quote
Severance Pay wrote:The HMG isn't bad, it's just you. No seriously. Get gud scrub.
**** you im nice. i've been using HMGs since chromosome and i still had a high K/D even when the HMG did 12 damage per shot. then one broken thing after another just begame toppling the HMG. its been bad for a while bro. i used a militia minmintar suit and got a one OB on my alt. i hopped on Cod and get high scores all the time, just yesterday i got 51-4 with an LMG.
its not my skills the gun ******* sucks. deal with it Ar noob.
now dnt get me wrong in dust an HMG should't be getting 51-4... my point was that the gun in Cod was balanced and effective, but here its not effective and losses it purpose because ARs can do its job better... |
ER-Bullitt
Molon Labe. League of Infamy
115
|
Posted - 2013.07.20 17:57:00 -
[22] - Quote
Dont let the trolls get to you dude. Keep posting your ideas and suggestions and try to ignore them. |
TuFar Gon
0uter.Heaven EoN.
12
|
Posted - 2013.07.20 17:57:00 -
[23] - Quote
D legendary hero wrote:due to the fact that there are many threads on similar topics and that my explainations tend to be lengthy and would require alot of programming i decided to develop this series of threads called the QUICK fix series.
this series intends to use preexisting elements of the game and/or simple changes to balance out weaponry, vehicles, etc already in the game. that why it can effectively fix a problem in the short term while long term solutions are in development.
this threads topic is: HMGs
problem: damage output is low verses all the drawbacks and range.
solution: reduce the fire rate to 500 RPM, increase damage per shot to 73 per shot for STD, 75 ADV, 77 PROTO. (the dps for the STD would be 608). reduce clip size to 200.
keeping dispersion, heat build up, and recoil the same. the damage profile will match the downsides while in CQC the low fire rate will prevent any buffs to the suit from overwhelming shotgunners. a subtle attempt to destroy the hmg?? Dude,,,GTFO
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D legendary hero
THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND
393
|
Posted - 2013.07.20 18:00:00 -
[24] - Quote
ER-Bullitt wrote:
turning speed is the suit issue. the same turn speed is used for the light weapons, and side arms the heavy suit uses.
as far as DPS is concerned fire rate and damage per shot dnt matter. but in practice they make a world of diference. having high damage per shot means when you hit something chunks of hp disappear promting a retreat by the enemy.
suppresion is then accomplished. low fire rate also means your clip lasts longer.
Someone posted above for you to try the Breach SMG.
The breach SMG is basically setup the way you want the HMG to be changed.
It would behoove you to try a regular SMG, then try the breach, and feel the difference. I personally cant stand the breach SMG.. looking at the stats on paper I thought it would be a good choice to backup my HMG, but yeah... me no likey.
I know turning speed is the suit issue.. but its not like we have the option to use a different suit combined with the HMG..[/quote]
the breach SMG only does 33% more damage than the regular at 34 damage per shot with a 544 RPM. basically the halfed the fire rate, and only increased the damag per shot marginally o the DPS suffer.s
what i am suggesting is increaseing the damage by 600% but reducing the fire rate by 400% (500 * 400% = 2000), or rather to 25% ( 25% of 2000 is 500) of the original value.
so the damage would be 73, but the fire rate 500+.
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xSir Campsalotx
D.A.R.K L.E.G.I.O.N D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E
22
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Posted - 2013.07.20 18:06:00 -
[25] - Quote
True, just give it a slight damage buff it should be fine or just make it do basic sub machine gun damage at proto level makes sense lore wise (sounds like something the Minmatars would do, have the same bullet for multiple guns) plus yes pubs theyre good against ransoms but in pc battles they don't cut it, been in 3 battles vs sver true blood and only 2 guys in 1 game ever used an HMG and they both did horrible. 4-9 and 2-11 something to this effect.
If you really are all about dps look at the scrambler rifle Std level 847 If its dam per clip thats gets you going, same gun 3240 still pretty good and at 60yd range or about. Not saying nerf scrambler only supporting why a damage buff to hmg is not a ludicrous proposition.
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Himiko Kuronaga
SyNergy Gaming EoN.
970
|
Posted - 2013.07.20 18:25:00 -
[26] - Quote
Truthfully the HMG might actually be halfways viable, but since nobody can aim there is no way to be certain.
As the game is currently, its not viable. It takes a full second for it to reach appropriate accuracy level, and after a full second your target is strafing. With the input delay present, it is not reasonable to expect anyone to track them after this point and survive. |
calvin b
Molon Labe. League of Infamy
66
|
Posted - 2013.07.20 18:37:00 -
[27] - Quote
The HMG is flawed, those of us who use it make it work. I have been a heavy for a long time so I can use it very well. The hit detection, the dispersion of the bullets will make you want to quit. I keep coming back because I love being a heavy with my HMG but alas it is a broken toy. Scouts can strafe faster than my gun can follow. If they take damage they can run faster than my bullets can travel. The shotgun has more range as well compared to my HMG. I have gone toe to toe with a scout/shotgun and have lost due to its poor design. It needs more damage out put at the moment or the heavy suit needs another high slot. I have mine at proficiency lvl 4 and at this lvl the gun should be a monster but sadly it is not. If you think I'm lying, skill into a proto heavy with a HMG similar to mine and take on any proto suit other than a heavy and see what happens. Also being an HMG user it takes more SP than an AR to skill into. So please fix this so I can do my job and actually hold a point and no a logi is not the answer. Because I will always shoot the logi first, so I can cut the life line of the other heavy. |
xSir Campsalotx
D.A.R.K L.E.G.I.O.N D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E
22
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Posted - 2013.07.20 18:40:00 -
[28] - Quote
True add that in with bad turn speed and the effects are compounded, on paper it sounds good but real life dispersion, damage of other guns, slow movement speed, giant hit box and only marginally higher HP than medium suits makes heavies a difficult class to play, I see most heavies reduced to forge DMR type roles. I think the damage would help but remember not all of the damage is ever applied, come to think of it only a relatively small percentage is ever consistently applied. So either make it so semi consistent damage is aplied or up the damage now, where it's at best inconsistently applied. |
Lance 2ballzStrong
SyNergy Gaming EoN.
2921
|
Posted - 2013.07.20 18:57:00 -
[29] - Quote
D legendary hero wrote:Lance 2ballzStrong wrote:Django Quik wrote:I really don't see a problem with the HMGs. They're currently the 3rd most killing weapon in the game after only ARs and snipers and used a hell of a lot less than either of those. flaylocks and nades say "HI!!" LAnce whats up man? so what do think about this quick fix?
Honestly? I give up. When this game start to mean something again I'll care. Hate to be the "doom and gloom" kind of person, but I'm pretty sure most people are seeing the writing on the wall. |
Asher Night
Condotta Rouvenor Gallente Federation
431
|
Posted - 2013.07.20 19:47:00 -
[30] - Quote
If you have a problem with the HMG, in Dust of all games, then you are pathetic and definitely should not try to play other first person shooters. |
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