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Queen of Uranus
Dust 514 Forum Trolls
149
|
Posted - 2013.07.16 09:13:00 -
[31] - Quote
You're a moron if you don't think a Calogi isn't OP. I run CalAss. and I would gladly give up my sidearm for an extra High, Low, and Equipment slot. The hammer is coming, otherwise expect to see Calogis everywhere. Also I'm ready to laugh when you don't get a respec. |
Arkena Wyrnspire
Turalyon Plus
1993
|
Posted - 2013.07.16 09:13:00 -
[32] - Quote
Xero The Mishima wrote: IF they change the suit drastically they will need to give us reset. A huge % of population uses this suit and we used it because it has 5H to shield tank. For a shield tanker it's CLEARLY the best option. I honestly don't think it's OP at all there are things put in the game made to destroy shields.
"Waaaah I specced into FotM and it might get nerfed respec RESPEC RESPEC WAAAAAAH!!!" |
Xero The Mishima
Vherokior Combat Logistics Minmatar Republic
163
|
Posted - 2013.07.16 09:20:00 -
[33] - Quote
Arkena Wyrnspire wrote:Xero The Mishima wrote: IF they change the suit drastically they will need to give us reset. A huge % of population uses this suit and we used it because it has 5H to shield tank. For a shield tanker it's CLEARLY the best option. I honestly don't think it's OP at all there are things put in the game made to destroy shields.
"Waaaah I specced into FotM and it might get nerfed respec RESPEC RESPEC WAAAAAAH!!!"
Yes that's exactly it... You got me. I wasn't good with a Scout suit in Chromosome and I didn't wreck noobs with Assault Type2 I waited and waited for a Cal Logi and if it gets nerfed I will have to wait years for another suit like this..... get real. I'll wreck most of you no matter what suit I use to be honest... |
xSir Campsalotx
D.A.R.K L.E.G.I.O.N D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E
20
|
Posted - 2013.07.16 09:26:00 -
[34] - Quote
Queen of Uranus wrote:You're a moron if you don't think a Calogi isn't OP. I run CalAss. and I would gladly give up my sidearm for an extra High, Low, and Equipment slot. The hammer is coming, otherwise expect to see Calogis everywhere. Also I'm ready to laugh when you don't get a respec.
Yes but would you do it with my proposed fixes, just trying to keep the logis health while getting rid of its slayer ability. No Dmg mod, no pro gun without pro equipment, and .5-.7m/s slower than assualt variant. |
Echoist
Fenrir's Wolves RUST415
39
|
Posted - 2013.07.16 09:30:00 -
[35] - Quote
Xero The Mishima wrote:Echoist wrote:Xero The Mishima wrote:Marston VC wrote:hackerzilla wrote:It's not. It sacrifices utility, unlike other logis, and adds more 1 more high slot/ 1 more low slot.
Adapt or Die
Btw CCP shouldn't nerf the cal logi they should just buff other suits, so they ACTUALLY FILL THEIR ROLE.
Yeah.... you better adapt when they nerf the hell out of your god suit. IDC what you say, you can have 670 shields on your Pseudo assault/god suit and that's more then any other suit in game (except for perhaps an advanced heavy suit......). Maybe some of the other people are right, maybe the other suits are just underpowered due to lack of relevant racial bonuses. But should every suit be brought up to the standards of one suit? or should one suit be brought down to the standard of every other suit? IF they change the suit drastically they will need to give us reset. A huge % of population uses this suit and we used it because it has 5H to shield tank. For a shield tanker it's CLEARLY the best option. I honestly don't think it's OP at all there are things put in the game made to destroy shields. Changing the bonus is fine with me. As long as it's something that is helpful and not just a waist. maybe 2% movement speed every level? ADAPT OR DIE!!! TROLOLOLOL Didn't I already smash your corp when you attacked our friends? Wasn't it your corp that made a thread crying for advice because you got ROFL stomped? I rest my case... btw ADAPT or DIE. First of all i thought we were talking about was the caldari logistical suit and not corps. Second, I've never even heard of your corp nor has my corp fought your corp. and the only PC battle we had only had two different corp names on the opposing team and I know for a fact that your corp name wasn't on the end game leaderboard. Third its sad that you have to resort to insulting my corp to respond to something that has NOTHING to do with the wolves. Next time you try and make an argument make it actually include what we're talking about.
Oh and don't expect a response this "argument" has become too childish to even continue, hope you have a good day. |
KingBabar
Internal Error. League of Infamy
899
|
Posted - 2013.07.16 09:54:00 -
[36] - Quote
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote:Pretty idiotic. With all skills maxed out: A prototype Caldari logi can tank more HP while holding a Duvolle AR than an prototype heavy sentinel with a boundless HMG, AND the Cal logi is still faster than the sentinel when they are both fully tanked like that. They need to lose a low slot, and gain an equipment slot at prototype level; they have 9 module slot, coupled with the shield extender bonus makes their HP far too much. In depth analysis of all the racial logis compared to each other, and their assault counterparts, and solutions. https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=93653"Adapt or Die" = "I don't want to lose my OP crutch" Last time I checked, their role wasn't meant to be faster heavies.
To fully fit a Caldari Logi suit at proto level I need 1 CPU uppgrade and 1 PG uppgrade.
So what are we left with?
588 Shields with 4 shield extenders and one recharder on it, which you will need since having 588 shileds and 20 in shield rep per second isn't a viable option in my opinion.
So we have 2 low slots left, with using 2 complex plates you get = 112 (base) + 115 * 2 * 1,1 = 365
This will give a maximum of 953 HP... Which adimttadly is a lot.
But gives you roughly a - 20% movement penalty on an already slow suit.
The suit also suffers from a lack of general stamina so a fitting like that is only usable for "sentinel" duty or other forms of static gameplay, which kind of defeats the purpose of a Logi.
A much more usable setup is to do as above but to change the plates into two complex ferroscale plates, in order to keep the whopping 4.7 move speed and 6.7 run speed if I remember correctly.
IN wich case you'll get = 112 + (60*2*1,1= 132) = 244 armor. Which gives a total HP of 832 with all skills maxed out.
I'm not saying its bad, but I do say that one have to take into consideration the slow speed, strafe speed, lack of stamina and a sidearm...
As I see it the Caldari Logi suit is a combat/support hybrid suit, good at doing both but I highly doubt its any better at the pure slayer role then for example a Caldari assault suit is, I don't have it so I'm not sure about the final stats. You will however have a suit with a higher natural shield regen, reload speed and not least a higher strafe speed which is a very important feature for a combat suit.
Its kind of funny how I mostly see various assault suits consistently having the highest numbers of kills and the best KDR, with a few Cal Logi suits thrown in the mix. I don't have any issues myself with taking out other Cal Logi suits at all, I hardly notice any difference at all.
Get it fitted and test it out before you cry OP, I'm quite sure i'd do a lot better in terms of kills and KDR with the CAL assault suit than my current Logi suit, at least thats what my experience from using that suit through all the Beta builds tell me...
Personally I can't stand using it without a minimum of one basic green stamina thingy, which leaves me a maximum of 766 HP, as long as I don't want a damage mod on it... |
KingBabar
Internal Error. League of Infamy
899
|
Posted - 2013.07.16 09:55:00 -
[37] - Quote
Edit: A fully fitted Cal proto Logi suit costs over 200 K isk to fit. |
Xero The Mishima
Vherokior Combat Logistics Minmatar Republic
163
|
Posted - 2013.07.16 09:57:00 -
[38] - Quote
First of all i thought we were talking about was the caldari logistical suit and not corps. Second, I've never even heard of your corp nor has my corp fought your corp. and the only PC battle we had only had two different corp names on the opposing team and I know for a fact that your corp name wasn't on the end game leaderboard. Third its sad that you have to resort to insulting my corp to respond to something that has NOTHING to do with the wolves. Next time you try and make an argument make it actually include what we're talking about.
Oh and don't expect a response this "argument" has become too childish to even continue, hope you have a good day.[/quote]
Than attack Blood money and you'll see me AGAIN. I'll slay down on you fags with this shotty AGAIN. The suit is not OP stop crying and get good. |
Bettie Boop 2100190003
A.N.O.N.Y.M.O.U.S. League of Infamy
47
|
Posted - 2013.07.16 10:07:00 -
[39] - Quote
I dont mind the shields, flux grenades make those a non issue.
What I dislike is the D. Bags stacking 3-5 damage mods on the suit and doing stupid amounts of damage. Yes your douval has a longer range and does less... I mean more damage than an HMG per second? Charged sniper rifle 1 shotting over 1k EHP...
The problem is the suitability & stacking damage mods that 5 low + 4 high slots gives. Increasing the penalty for stacking damage mods by a significant margin would be a great start for a lot of problems with the game. |
negative49er
The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY
76
|
Posted - 2013.07.16 10:41:00 -
[40] - Quote
Xero The Mishima wrote:Marston VC wrote:hackerzilla wrote:It's not. It sacrifices utility, unlike other logis, and adds more 1 more high slot/ 1 more low slot.
Adapt or Die
Btw CCP shouldn't nerf the cal logi they should just buff other suits, so they ACTUALLY FILL THEIR ROLE.
Yeah.... you better adapt when they nerf the hell out of your god suit. IDC what you say, you can have 670 shields on your Pseudo assault/god suit and that's more then any other suit in game (except for perhaps an advanced heavy suit......). Maybe some of the other people are right, maybe the other suits are just underpowered due to lack of relevant racial bonuses. But should every suit be brought up to the standards of one suit? or should one suit be brought down to the standard of every other suit? IF they change the suit drastically they will need to give us reset. A huge % of population uses this suit and we used it because it has 5H to shield tank. For a shield tanker it's CLEARLY the best option. I honestly don't think it's OP at all there are things put in the game made to destroy shields. Changing the bonus is fine with me. As long as it's something that is helpful and not just a waist. maybe 2% movement speed every level?
That will make them faster than the scout suit and they can put kinetic catalyze on them making scout useless |
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Guinevere Bravo
SVER True Blood Public Disorder.
261
|
Posted - 2013.07.16 10:53:00 -
[41] - Quote
We already have a fast logi suit... its called the Winmatar suit!
On a serious note, just reduce the 5% shield extender buff to a 2-3%, get the total amount of possible HP down and it should even things out a bit.
Tbh i think the extra low slot could be taken away and replaced with an equipment slot (to keep it inline with the other suit set-ups), at the end of the day you cant use all four bits of equipment at once... |
Duran Lex
Silver Talon Corporation
81
|
Posted - 2013.07.16 11:44:00 -
[42] - Quote
Of course its OP, They are able to perform the main role of an assault class suit better then the suit that has the intended role.
But thats more to Shield/Armor tanking being completely unbalanced then the actual suit itself.
Shield extenders have no downside to use, and they are High slots making it ridiculously easy to fit shield tanks. While Armor tanks have to ONLY use Low slots. No balance.
Now there's weapons to counter Shields and Armor.
There's 3 weapons that are stronger against shields. There's what, 7 that are stronger against armor? No balance.
Since "Throw a Flux to take down their shield, gawd" seems to be a viable argument against shields being OP, lets look at shield and armor grenades.
Flux grenade - Shield damage, no armor damage, target will never die.
Locus grenade - Shield damage, Large amount of armor damage, target can be killed.
No balance.
CCP simply needs to balance out shields and armor, and stop favouring shield tanking to the point of silliness. The caldari logi would most likely fall in line then.
|
Xero The Mishima
Vherokior Combat Logistics Minmatar Republic
167
|
Posted - 2013.07.16 11:52:00 -
[43] - Quote
Guinevere Bravo wrote:We already have a fast logi suit... its called the Winmatar suit!
On a serious note, just reduce the 5% shield extender buff to a 2-3%, get the total amount of possible HP down and it should even things out a bit.
Tbh i think the extra low slot could be taken away and replaced with an equipment slot (to keep it inline with the other suit set-ups), at the end of the day you cant use all four bits of equipment at once...
I wish I would of went Minmatar with my mentor. I told him I was and than for some reason I went Cal Logi lol! I don't feel too bad because his brother who is also one of the best shot gunners misses Cal Logi. My mentor however likes Winmatar more. I am thinking of specing into Winmatar so if the day comes Cal logi gets nerfed it's no big deal :) |
Galvan Nized
Deep Space Republic Top Men.
152
|
Posted - 2013.07.16 13:19:00 -
[44] - Quote
Duran Lex wrote:Of course its OP, They are able to perform the main role of an assault class suit better then the suit that has the intended role.
But thats more to Shield/Armor tanking being completely unbalanced then the actual suit itself.
Shield extenders have no downside to use, and they are High slots making it ridiculously easy to fit shield tanks. While Armor tanks have to ONLY use Low slots. No balance.
Now there's weapons to counter Shields and Armor.
There's 3 weapons that are stronger against shields. There's what, 7 that are stronger against armor? No balance.
Since "Throw a Flux to take down their shield, gawd" seems to be a viable argument against shields being OP, lets look at shield and armor grenades.
Flux grenade - Shield damage, no armor damage, target will never die.
Locus grenade - Shield damage, Large amount of armor damage, target can be killed.
No balance.
CCP simply needs to balance out shields and armor, and stop favouring shield tanking to the point of silliness. The caldari logi would most likely fall in line then.
While I understand your anger... right now it is pretty much even if you figure handheld weapons that damage infantry. There are 6 anti shield weapons and 6 anti armor weapons check out this Dev blog [url]http:// http://dust514.com/news/blog/2013/07/weapon-ranges-in-uprising-1.2-and-beyond/[/url]
I could argue why the disparity between armor and shields is smaller than one thinks but that's a whole different subject.
But to me the Cal Logi bonus isn't OP itself it just does not fit with the other Logis. It seems to fit a heavy much better (really this would be great for the Caldari Heavy). The Caldari has an extensive layout but the other logis aren't too far away. Nerf the Caldari logi and the Gallente Logi would be next up |
Your Absolut End
Neanderthal Nation Public Disorder.
127
|
Posted - 2013.07.16 13:53:00 -
[45] - Quote
ZDub 303 wrote:I actually sacrifices 1 equipment slot for 1 low slot and thats it. Otherwise it maintains the same 8 slot config that the other non-amarr logis have.
Some say the shield extender bonus is OP... but its one of the few relevant bonuses in this game. Its not balanced in its current state, I won't argue that anymore... however I think the problem lies in the fact that most racial bonuses for all non cal-logi suits suck balls, not that the cal logi's bonus is ridiculously OP.
so.... if everybody drives a car in a city around 50 km/h, and yours run 100 km/h, ALL the others are to slow right?
I understand and agree with your statement, but this doesn't take care of the problem that Cal Logis are OP atm.....
I'd rather see the cal logi nerfed for a bit, before CCP balances the bonusses, than have the cal logi OP all the time untill CCP finally changes this.
|
Exergonic
TeamPlayers EoN.
214
|
Posted - 2013.07.16 14:01:00 -
[46] - Quote
Inc an unbiased list of things to do =)
1. Caldi assault suit needs a slight buff (All the assault suits need a buff)
2. Caldi logi suit needs to lose 1 low slot
3. CCP needs to give a respec... Can't blame AR players for going with one of the best choices in the game
(No i don't use the Cald logi suit... My Logi uses the Gallente) |
Your Absolut End
Neanderthal Nation Public Disorder.
127
|
Posted - 2013.07.16 14:06:00 -
[47] - Quote
Exergonic wrote:Inc an unbiased list of things to do =)
1. Caldi assault suit needs a slight buff (All the assault suits need a buff)
2. Caldi logi suit needs to lose 1 low slot
3. CCP needs to give a respec... Can't blame AR players for going with one of the best choices in the game
(No i don't use the Cald logi suit... My Logi uses the Gallente)
I don't blame anybody running this neither, but running this and then pretend like this suit is balanced is bullcrap. |
Cody Sietz
Tritan's Onslaught rise of legion
554
|
Posted - 2013.07.16 14:13:00 -
[48] - Quote
If they nerf the Cal Logi, will you adapt or die? |
Daxxis KANNAH
Tronhadar Free Guard Minmatar Republic
196
|
Posted - 2013.07.16 14:23:00 -
[49] - Quote
ZDub 303 wrote:I actually sacrifices 1 equipment slot for 1 low slot and thats it. Otherwise it maintains the same 8 slot config that the other non-amarr logis have.
Some say the shield extender bonus is OP... but its one of the few relevant bonuses in this game. Its not balanced in its current state, I won't argue that anymore... however I think the problem lies in the fact that most racial bonuses for all non cal-logi suits suck balls, not that the cal logi's bonus is ridiculously OP.
You attack the Flaylock at every turn even asking for an emergency patch but you defending your bottom b!tch
Where is your credibility guy? |
Guinevere Bravo
SVER True Blood Public Disorder.
263
|
Posted - 2013.07.16 14:58:00 -
[50] - Quote
Xero The Mishima wrote:
I wish I would of went Minmatar with my mentor. I told him I was and than for some reason I went Cal Logi lol! I don't feel too bad because his brother who is also one of the best shot gunners misses Cal Logi. My mentor however likes Winmatar more. I am thinking of specing into Winmatar so if the day comes Cal logi gets nerfed it's no big deal :)
Whilst i /facepalmed when i decided to go with winmatar it was definately an uphill struggle...
I'd say i've been sup-par until the last 2-3 weeks when my SP started to work together and now i have a great suit that im proud of.
Plus it scales really well from even T1, with a basic armor rep and the suits basic bonus i get 8-9 armor a second whilst having a decent armor pool. Very good for running with minimal costs. |
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Phantom Vaxer
The Generals EoN.
30
|
Posted - 2013.07.16 16:01:00 -
[51] - Quote
Ugh they get a ******* 25% bonus to shield efficiency! The ****...Logis should be support not mobile tankers. All Logi's should have the benefit of more equipment slots not more high and lows to allow them to just stack shield and armor mods. Caldari Logis are the worst with about the most balanced Logi being the Amarr. |
Cosgar
ParagonX
2705
|
Posted - 2013.07.16 16:12:00 -
[52] - Quote
CaLogi isn't OP to me, they're easy kills. Flux Grenade + MD FTW |
Master Jaraiya
Ultramarine Corp
442
|
Posted - 2013.07.16 16:18:00 -
[53] - Quote
hackerzilla wrote:It's not. It sacrifices utility, unlike other logis, and adds more 1 more high slot/ 1 more low slot.
Adapt or Die
Btw CCP shouldn't nerf the cal logi they should just buff other suits, so they ACTUALLY FILL THEIR ROLE.
*coughamarrheaviescough* |
Kam Elto
KILL-EM-QUICK rise of legion
20
|
Posted - 2013.07.16 16:33:00 -
[54] - Quote
CCP just needs to stop stacking. All stacking. Only one of each type of module is allowed. Only one of each type of weapon is allowed. No more triple shield extenders. No more double damage mods (you could have a main and sidearm damage mod). No more dual Flaylocks. This would require players to be more versatile with their SP. It would also save CCP a lot of work trying to fix their broken stacking penalties. |
General John Ripper
The Generals EoN.
1825
|
Posted - 2013.07.16 16:36:00 -
[55] - Quote
funny how no one says anymore "cal logi needs to be side arm only" anymore. now that flaylocks are popular everyone has different opinions on how many high/low slots to take away. |
Sloth9230
Deepspace Digital
2383
|
Posted - 2013.07.16 16:44:00 -
[56] - Quote
Daxxis KANNAH wrote:ZDub 303 wrote:I actually sacrifices 1 equipment slot for 1 low slot and thats it. Otherwise it maintains the same 8 slot config that the other non-amarr logis have.
Some say the shield extender bonus is OP... but its one of the few relevant bonuses in this game. Its not balanced in its current state, I won't argue that anymore... however I think the problem lies in the fact that most racial bonuses for all non cal-logi suits suck balls, not that the cal logi's bonus is ridiculously OP. You attack the Flaylock at every turn even asking for an emergency patch but you defending your bottom b!tch Where is your credibility guy? some crutches are more frowned upon than others apparently |
ZDub 303
TeamPlayers EoN.
939
|
Posted - 2013.07.16 16:49:00 -
[57] - Quote
Daxxis KANNAH wrote:ZDub 303 wrote:I actually sacrifices 1 equipment slot for 1 low slot and thats it. Otherwise it maintains the same 8 slot config that the other non-amarr logis have.
Some say the shield extender bonus is OP... but its one of the few relevant bonuses in this game. Its not balanced in its current state, I won't argue that anymore... however I think the problem lies in the fact that most racial bonuses for all non cal-logi suits suck balls, not that the cal logi's bonus is ridiculously OP. You attack the Flaylock at every turn even asking for an emergency patch but you defending your bottom b!tch Where is your credibility guy?
hm... I think you need to read my post again. I said it wasn't balanced... I was saying we're looking at it the wrong way. Cal Logi isn't OP imo, the other logi suits are just UP.
Honestly... sad to say it guys... but its not really the cal logi's bonus is some ridiculously overpowered bonus... its the fact that most skilled players picked it because it has one of the only relevant bonuses in the game (i.e. more ehp cause thats what this game is all about).
So people get killed by skilled players all using the same suit.. so the suit must be OP right? Seriously, my buddy runs a cal assault suit and when we 1v1 in no-show PC matches he wins 9/10 times. OMG CAL ASSAULT SO OP. (he wins because he is better at fps gun game than I am and because move speed is huge when you are in a 1v1 strafe battle)
I bet you anything if you look at the metrics for cal logis in PC you would find they do not dominate the field at all. Lack of move speed and sidearm is huge when you are proto vs. proto. The fact of the matter is... with or without the shield extender bonus, skilled players in cal logi suits will still dominate pub matches... why? Cause its skilled players in proto suits mowing down noobs who are too afraid to run anything but militia gear.
The only way you'll get skilled players out of cal logi suits is to nerf the suit so far into the ground that players are now forced to grind for 4 months to get the 2.47 million exp to get into proto-something else. At which point most of them would just say **** this game and quit. |
THUNDERGROOVE
ZionTCD
72
|
Posted - 2013.07.16 18:05:00 -
[58] - Quote
Caldari Logistics is by far better than my Prototype Amarr Sentinel with ONLY 1 high and 4 low slots no equipment a sprint speed .1 higher than an average assault fits walk speed. The only thing thing we get out of it is 405 armor, 405 shield and the ability to use heavy weapons. Out of the two heavy weapons the only real feasible one for good use has more spread than a tub of margarine that in most cases does nothing if you're not in "shotgun" range or made entirely out of armor.
Now don't come back whining because your precious suit is more than likely going to be overnerfed and you'll be stuck with all that SP sunk into a suit that isn't good for anything but real logistics. |
Garrett Blacknova
Codex Troopers
3333
|
Posted - 2013.07.16 18:38:00 -
[59] - Quote
Caldari Logi isn't OP...
...as a Logi suit...
As an Assault suit, it's at least high-tier, and that's why it's OP. It's a non-Assault suit that's better as an Assault suit than most Assault suits are. And it can do the Logi role (badly, but still better than an Assault) while also being a top-level Assault suit.
So looking from that perspective, yeah, it's OP. But not by a huge amount. Make it less of a viable Assault role suit, and it'll be fine. |
Aero Yassavi
PIE Inc. Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
580
|
Posted - 2013.07.16 19:16:00 -
[60] - Quote
General John Ripper wrote:funny how no one says anymore "cal logi needs to be side arm only" anymore. now that flaylocks are popular everyone has different opinions on how many high/low slots to take away. Not really, I've been hearing people complain about the amount of modules logistics suits get for a long time. CCP puts way too much stock in the value of weapons. They remove the sidearm slot so think it needs to be offset by adding nearly the max amount of highs and lows as well as equipment. Meanwhile the Commando got the sidearm upgraded to a light so it needs to be offset by the removal of nearly ever high and low as well as the grenade. I mean, what the heck?
I just don't see why logistics players need more modules than assault players. They should be roughly the same there. |
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