The Light Attack Vehicle (LAV) represents a new generation of mobile support vehicle, an agile and effective unit, adept at assisting both infantry and other vehicles on the battlefield with its cadre of electronic warfare subsystems and all-terrain maneuverability modules. Whether employed as a scout vehicle or as an anti-infantry unit, the LAV is a ubiquitous part of New Eden's modern battlefield.

Wrong kind of "hit and run".

How so? Either way, it's drive in, kill someone, drive out before AV can react.

Wrong kind of "hit and run".

If you remove LLAVs and buff the scout ones somehow, I would say yes. Some people may just want to be the best driver in new esen, drifting over the bodies of their enemies.

I never understood why logi vehicles were so hard to kill, but the infantry can be killed like wet paper. LLAVs need to be less difficult to kill. It should take only one, MAYBE 2 AV grenades of equivalent meta level to pop an LLAV. It would force real drivers to think about their maneuvers instead of just bull rushing a fire fight.

All I can say is hit and run

Hit
And
Run.

I do plenty of hitting and plenty of running beep beep killer cabbie behind the wheel.

Armor reps rep armor, not structure.

That's the problem, DUST is far too primitive to support actual structure damage on vehicles. At best we can expect a HULL hp bar, but that won't do anything unless impacts immediately damage the hull.

Anyone who thinks an LAV hitting an armored dropsuit (particularly a heavy, even more so if he's armor tanked) shouldn't be damaged simply doesn't want anything related to physics to relate to their death cab for noobie. I killed a full HP heavy yesterday with my free LAV by literally just barely tapping him with the corner of my LAV. BAM, over 1000 damage, and I was going maaaaybe 10 mph.

Don't defend the LAVs lack of physics. Abuse it, sure. Just don't defend it.

If you remove LLAVs and buff the scout ones somehow, I would say yes. Some people may just want to be the best driver in new esen, drifting over the bodies of their enemies.

I never understood why logi vehicles were so hard to kill, but the infantry can be killed like wet paper. LLAVs need to be less difficult to kill. It should take only one, MAYBE 2 AV grenades of equivalent meta level to pop an LLAV. It would force real drivers to think about their maneuvers instead of just bull rushing a fire fight.

Sorry what had that to do with my post . I have never stated in any thread that I dont support some form of impact dammage on my llav as ill just rep up and continue ramming

Scout LAV are useless , they have same stats as FREE LAV but they more expensive.

If LAV's are currently working (being used) as intended then **** CCP. If not then keep on abusing the LAV's people; the more you do the sooner it gets nerfed.

Edit: Now that I think about it, the nerf may already be locked in. Better run as many people over as you can before 1.3 gets here.

Come to think of it, should infantry really have free reign over the battlefield instead of riding in LAVs and dropships? HAVs aren't the cost effective way of controlling them.

Structure

Damage.

This game needs it.

You actually like having 8 LAVs trolling around the field, don't you?

ok i am Mortedeamor i am proto av specced ina logi lav i have proto forge prof 3, and proto swarm prof v. av specs running in logi lavs is the best defence cost effective vs logi lav swarm. my rigs run 500k vs tank millions

Structure

Damage.

This game needs it.

You actually like having 8 LAVs trolling around the field, don't you?

You haven't driven one.

I have an Abron with a prototype blaster, and it absolutely kicks ass.
The description doesn't tell you it, but it has more than increased acceleration. It also has higher turret tracking speed, and MUCH better handling.

All I can say is hit and run

Hit
And
Run.

I do plenty of hitting and plenty of running beep beep killer cabbie behind the wheel.

Short Answer

No

Correct answer should be a vehicle that provides infantry support and transportation. Current the modules that help infantry, sensors, repairs, and killing the hostiles isn't working.

The only thing that works really well on the LAV is the controls and physics (of itself not interacting with the environment) right now.

First off, I would like to say: http://youtu.be/ussCHoQttyQ

Second: let's see the description


So, more or less, LAVs are meant to support infantry and vehicles; I can't find it online, but the scout LAV description also says they're meant for hit-and-run attacks.

While I'm almost positive the turret is supposed to do the majority of the fighting, you could say that LAVs are doing their job- supporting infantry by running people over, and supporting vehicles by running AVers over. The turret just makes it more efficient at that.

As far as LLAVs, they can't do their intended job anyway because their built-in rep is garbage.

People should not be running around in the open on a battle field.

The fact that they do is the result of high health short AR ranges and dancing bunny hop mechanics.

In other words normally bullets would keep them from running around in the open...LAVs do tend to stop this.

No, the reason why they do it is AV dominance. I remember when infantry wouldn't run around in the open because HAVs would tear them apart if they did.

[quote=Scheneighnay McBob]IT SAYS ANTI INFANTRY ON IT...ARE YOU PEOPLE FREAKING BLIND? RUNNING PEOPLE OVER IS PART OF ANTI INFANTRY.......you people are amazing you know that? why is it that stupid assault rifle can destroy but nothing else can?....leave the lav the way it is.....so people can keep smashing those stupid infantry only assault rifle punks.....

And the gun on top is just there as an ornate piece of abstract art.
CCP was totally thinking "you know what? The gun is there, but let's have the front bumper be literally 10,000 times more effective."

LAV work great, minus the DPS. Throttle, Steering, Mod fits, all great. It's the DPS.

The amount of DMG done with no penalty. Plus they can out run most AV. Murder Taxi tactic is about
As lame as Core Flaylock as a primary weapon.

Best fix it a penalty to steering acceleration and over all speed after running over someone. It's only fair.

VonSpliff, Merc

its just common sense

ofc a moving VEHICLE can do you harm DUHH

and killing someone with LAV turret is a pain in the ass

LAV work great, minus the DPS. Throttle, Steering, Mod fits, all great. It's the DPS.

The amount of DMG done with no penalty. Plus they can out run most AV. Murder Taxi tactic is about
As lame as Core Flaylock as a primary weapon.

Best fix it a penalty to steering acceleration and over all speed after running over someone. It's only fair.

VonSpliff, Merc

How so? Either way, it's drive in, kill someone, drive out before AV can react.

And the gun on top is just there as an ornate piece of abstract art.
CCP was totally thinking "you know what? The gun is there, but let's have the front bumper be literally 10,000 times more effective."

Then wouldn't the fix be "buff the turret, take away impact damage?" Even make it harder to hit the guy on the turret too?

I feel like a lot of you are trying to "make sense" of a video game about multiple races of immortal clones fighting across the galaxy. It's a video game. None of anything going on in it makes a whole lot of sense "realistically". But for some reason, you guys are drawing the line here.

Imagine how bad ass it would be to have the Logi LAV working as intended (giving health support to infantry and tanks). It makes sense for it to have that much health so it can be in the fight without worrying about being immediately blown up. Instead, since you can use it as a super fast, high health battering ram, of course people go that route. It's crazy lame.

yeah lets just ignore everything by using the clones excuse

yeah lets just ignore everything by using the clones excuse

I'm using the video game excuse.
Street Fighter isn't a fighting sim, its a game, they make concessions to realism so it's balanced.
Battlefield isn't a war simulator, they make concessions so it's balanced.
Company of Heroes isn't a tactics sim, they made concessions so it's balanced.

Shall I go on?
It's a game. Games are supposed to be fun. Fun comes, in large part, from balance. One hit kill drive bys courtesy of a, near invincible to all infantry, speeding brick is not balanced and its not fun.

You are supposed to fear the turret not the bumper

If you remove LLAVs and buff the scout ones somehow, I would say yes. Some people may just want to be the best driver in new esen, drifting over the bodies of their enemies.

I never understood why logi vehicles were so hard to kill, but the infantry can be killed like wet paper. LLAVs need to be less difficult to kill. It should take only one, MAYBE 2 AV grenades of equivalent meta level to pop an LLAV. It would force real drivers to think about their maneuvers instead of just bull rushing a fire fight.

i dont like tank either , lets do something about them too , its a video game afterall and we do wear full high-tec body armor afterall

i dont like tank either , lets do something about them too , its a video game afterall and we do wear full high-tec body armor afterall

The tanks weapons are built to destroy full high-tec body armor. I don't think the bumper of LAVs are.

Well right now, the turret isn't scary at all because it takes to long to kill, and the physics for firing from a moving vehicle are broken.

That's a different discussion, start a new topic. Headline it with something like "I'm a cry baby who can't hold a conversation and wants to change the subject" or something then list any reasons you can come up with in there that you have against the tank.

The LAV situation, on the other hand, is a real problem and is breaking the game away from some of the really cool mechanics it could have. If you could take a step back away from "what makes sense in a video game" and talk more about "what makes a game fun" you might see the topic with clearer eyes.

LAV is not made from PAPER , it has weight add some speed to that , i mean come on
its simple as 1+1=2

ur last defense is trolling?
how sad

And the gun on top is just there as an ornate piece of abstract art.
CCP was totally thinking "you know what? The gun is there, but let's have the front bumper be literally 10,000 times more effective."

Well right now, the turret isn't scary at all because it takes to long to kill, and the physics for firing from a moving vehicle are broken.

ur last defense is trolling?
how sad

idk.. i have some good gunners who can get down with neutron scatter + 2 complex dmg mods. but i also drive/park good to get them shots instead of like most ppl who go full throttle the whole time.

Aren't speeders coming soon-ish, or the ccp definition of soon?
If so, surely they'd replace the LAV as the freebie, no?

the turret is worthless. thats why everyone just goes for road kills.

Even if the turret worked (which it really should), there is no incentive to use it. The instant kill is always going to beat out the point/shoot/hit a ton kill. That's why the road kill bull-**** needs to go.

You are supposed to fear the turret not the bumper

i dont like tank either , lets do something about them too , its a video game afterall and we do wear full high-tec body armor afterall

I've seen the LLAV Shield Transfer in use a total of one time. I imagine most of us don't even know what it looks like.

It's also hilarious how the concession to supposedly neuter the LLAV's offensive prowess in exchange for their durability is a damage debuff on the turret.

I'd honestly love to see LAVs on the field actually using a driver and gunner partnership to engage foes. MLT Blaster has a very low effective range, however, and MLT Missiles are slow projectiles, slow firing, pretty low damage output and prone to flying out of the barrel at up to a 45 degree angle if you're not completely still.

Most who try their hands at gunning will encounter these, with neither them or the driver possessing any investment in Turret Operation for up to a combined +20% damage bonus. Not the best first impression and it drives people away from thinking that, yes, it can actually work. Stabilised Blasters on a Scout LAV with Turret Operation... it's a smoother ride with smoother tracking, far superior damage, range and zoom on the turret. Complete paradigm shift. Briefly been on the shooting end with a couple ranks of TurretOp (it's a 1x skill, all turret skills are, dead cheap) and it's great. More of this type of LAV use in-game would be amazing.

Assault buggies are awesome fun to fight as and against. Murder taxis are unsatisfactory to be on the receiving end of and deteriorate from the feel of the game. Kinda takes you out of it, the sillyness of yellow cabs wheeling around to seek out unwary pedestrians. An assault buggy which gets some road kills is a very different thing to a murder taxi existing solely to weaponise it's bumper. More often than not it's actually a bit like they're playing their own game, everyone else is playing Dust while those few are playing Carmageddon.

Basically I would love to fight alongside LAVs, for LAVs to be a part of each side's forces. At the moment they're opportunists scoring some cheap kills that are ultimately removed and insulated from the main flow of battle.

Not that the flow of battle is great at the moment. Skirmish, Ambush and their various maps haven't been designed with the question of 'what tactics and gameplay do we want to promote and enable?' in mind. That there is one of the biggest problems with Dust but that's enough rambling for one day.
hey now we are playing dust...we are just using our bumper to help our team advance...if you disagree i will run you over
tl;dr: this detritus is fornicated

We need to be able to run people over so the driver gets decent WP.

fear the bumper....FEAR IT

Oh this is an rpg now ?

Its funny watching the rationalization of CCP's trainwreck....or should I say jeepwreck.

Yes I am baiting.

I really dont understand the Op's thread and intent.

We all know that the LAV isnt working as intended. It is meant for transport and attack (mainly using turret but also hitting people) but CCP went too far making them too durable and easy to handle. They were shortsighted and created this problem and still havent addressed it.

They should kill more from turrets and kill less from ramming (probably having to hit a suit multiple times given suits health) and maybe made a bit less durable.

The whole thread is one big bait.

i would kill from LAV turret but the LAV doesnt drive by itself

i have no complaint about LAV , they are good the way they are

if you get run over its your fault

without LAV or weaker LAV to the point where ppl would stop using them the game would become a campers heaven

LAV are tactic , like it or not

AFKing is a sound tactic to get stable ISK and SP returns, like it or not.

Does this mean that's how it should be? No.

About LAVs stopping the game being a "camper's heaven"... the same LAVs that encourage you to stay put in closed areas, keeping away from roads and the open? You what mate?

There's other reasons to do as such but to propose that LAVs prevent camping is preposterous.

What myself and some others want isn't for the LAV to be cycled out, we want it to be reborn as a fast attack vehicle with a formidable turret or, in the Logi's case, a true support vehicle that serves as a transport to get fighting suits into the fray and bolster them with shield transfers while they're there.

LAVs currently do one thing in one way. If we could get them to a point where there's incentive to utilise them in a variety of roles that would be great.

i use LLAV with 3 roles that im not gona divulge , if LLAV would die like the free LAV i couldnt execute those roles and it would cost me a lot

hell i wouldnt even use LAV

LAV's work as intended , its YOUR fault if you cant hear it coming or check the radar or look left/right before crossing the street/open area known for LAV traffic

all you want is go from here to there with no worries and kill everything in sight , like i said CoD ...

Yes I am baiting.

I really dont understand the Op's thread and intent.

We all know that the LAV isnt working as intended. It is meant for transport and attack (mainly using turret but also hitting people) but CCP went too far making them too durable and easy to handle. They were shortsighted and created this problem and still havent addressed it.

They should kill more from turrets and kill less from ramming (probably having to hit a suit multiple times given suits health) and maybe made a bit less durable.

The whole thread is one big bait.

i would kill from LAV turret but the LAV doesnt drive by itself and i DO kill from LAV turret when i get the chance and there is no one around but im always afraid i get sniped if i switch to turret

i have no complaint about LAV , they are good the way they are , the only bad thing is that now i cant look back if i use L2/R2 control scheme

if you get run over its your fault

without LAV or weaker LAV to the point where ppl would stop using them the game would become a campers heaven

if u like camping play CoD

dont say you dont like it when a LAV saves yo ass

LAV are tactic , like it or not

I just posted this to show another point other than "LAVs can run people over so they're OP"

Currently, all the forum threads are heavily biased in favor of infantry, while the drivers in those threads don't make the right points.

Gods, yes. I try to argue in favour of vehicles but vehicle users don't make it clucking easy.