With allowing this game to spiral out of control..? I have to say, compared to the Eve community, this community is terrible. Not because it cant be civil or come to a cohesive agreement on anything but because it CHOOSES not to. There seem to be two kinds of players in this community and its the thinkers and the trollers. The thinkers explain their standpoint and provide evidence supporting their claim and the trollers respond with 'stop QQing and HTFU'.

Theres no constructive disagreement, theres no logical standpoints with which to consider another way of looking atthings, its just primitive grunts and echos of vague, offputting banter designed to destroy any semblance of a legitimate debate of ideals.

When a game like Warframe, stupid and simple as it may be with its lack of any competitive game modes, can achieve more civility and rational reasoning skills than the Dust 514 forums - I get disheartened. This game is only getting worse and lately im hard pressed to believe its the developers fault anymore because I know -for a ******* fact- theres going to be a stupid, unimaginative and uneducated troll comment SOMEWHERE in the following replies.

Yanno, its no wonder CCP decided to do away with transparency and stopped being communicative in what theyre working on when half of us cant even come to an agreement on something so stupid as whether or not Militia LAVs are too hard to kill. All the doomsayers, all the argumentative assholes who have nothing of value to say - just drooling out rambunctious jargon at the drop of a hat - its no wonder the Eve Online community cant take Dust 514 seriously and its nowonder the majority of Eve players want nothing to do with it.

Its a design that was good on paper and so far has just absolutely flopped - not because of the developers or the CPM or lack of funding/marketing etc... It flopped because 16 year old Johnny Nobody had access to the forums and couldnt come up with something better than a series of accronyms to convey his disapproval.

With allowing this game to spiral out of control..? I have to say, compared to the Eve community, this community is terrible.

It's because DUST is free to play and free to have "write" forum access. People simply abuse it instead to just go away. If somebody fares bad at EVE on trial account she simply doesn't upgrade her account, loose forum access and can't "contaminate" forums with her frustration about game. With anybody able to access DUST forum in "write" mode anytime people vent their anger unconstrained... We apparently can't appreciate "free to play" concept and will appreciate something costing us badly imho. This is something to do with maturity?

Thanks for posting this, at least gives reason to the madness.

Its a design that was good on paper and so far has just absolutely flopped - not because of the developers or the CPM or lack of funding/marketing etc... It flopped because 16 year old Johnny Nobody had access to the forums and couldnt come up with something better than a series of accronyms to convey his disapproval.

Free unlimited accounts don't help and only serve to fuel the fire. When a troll is banned they just make another account and start over. It also hurts CCP by inflating the numbers of players, there may be 600k accounts or whatever the number is but how many are troll accounts and alts?

Johnny didn't write the code for this game, Johnny doesn't have magical psychic powers that allow him to sway a developer's mind into making invisible walls and terrain hitches. Johnny didn't demand no matchmaking or guns that don't work.

How you can possibly believe one iota of this game's problems have anything to do with forum posts is utterly beyond me, regardless of what issue is being argued from whichever viewpoint. I would suggest that if you applied even the briefest spasm of commonsense it would become apparent that perhaps development problems are caused by ... you know ... developers?

I guess the obvious solution when you are in trouble is to close down communication and alienate your customers, that works well for most companies amirite?

So what if there is tonnes of drivel on this board, its not like anyone, either players or CCP, actually takes ANY of it seriously. There are also plenty of reasoned posts, many of which are restating the bleeding obvious, because well, this game's problems are pretty bleeding obvious. I can fully sympathise with vets who have been commenting for 12 months to minimal effect, I think they have every right to go feral after that long.

OP is old Forum FaNBoi aka the reason why this game is so bad.

Disregard FanBoi only way to fix the game

With allowing this game to spiral out of control..? I have to say, compared to the Eve community, this community is terrible. Not because it cant be civil or come to a cohesive agreement on anything but because it CHOOSES not to. There seem to be two kinds of players in this community and its the thinkers and the trollers. The thinkers explain their standpoint and provide evidence supporting their claim and the trollers respond with 'stop QQing and HTFU'.

Theres no constructive disagreement, theres no logical standpoints with which to consider another way of looking atthings, its just primitive grunts and echos of vague, offputting banter designed to destroy any semblance of a legitimate debate of ideals.

When a game like Warframe, stupid and simple as it may be with its lack of any competitive game modes, can achieve more civility and rational reasoning skills than the Dust 514 forums - I get disheartened. This game is only getting worse and lately im hard pressed to believe its the developers fault anymore because I know -for a ******* fact- theres going to be a stupid, unimaginative and uneducated troll comment SOMEWHERE in the following replies.

Yanno, its no wonder CCP decided to do away with transparency and stopped being communicative in what theyre working on when half of us cant even come to an agreement on something so stupid as whether or not Militia LAVs are too hard to kill. All the doomsayers, all the argumentative assholes who have nothing of value to say - just drooling out rambunctious jargon at the drop of a hat - its no wonder the Eve Online community cant take Dust 514 seriously and its nowonder the majority of Eve players want nothing to do with it.

Its a design that was good on paper and so far has just absolutely flopped - not because of the developers or the CPM or lack of funding/marketing etc... It flopped because 16 year old Johnny Nobody had access to the forums and couldnt come up with something better than a series of accronyms to convey his disapproval.

With allowing this game to spiral out of control..? I have to say, compared to the Eve community, this community is terrible. Not because it cant be civil or come to a cohesive agreement on anything but because it CHOOSES not to. There seem to be two kinds of players in this community and its the thinkers and the trollers. The thinkers explain their standpoint and provide evidence supporting their claim and the trollers respond with 'stop QQing and HTFU'.

Theres no constructive disagreement, theres no logical standpoints with which to consider another way of looking atthings, its just primitive grunts and echos of vague, offputting banter designed to destroy any semblance of a legitimate debate of ideals.

When a game like Warframe, stupid and simple as it may be with its lack of any competitive game modes, can achieve more civility and rational reasoning skills than the Dust 514 forums - I get disheartened. This game is only getting worse and lately im hard pressed to believe its the developers fault anymore because I know -for a ******* fact- theres going to be a stupid, unimaginative and uneducated troll comment SOMEWHERE in the following replies.

Yanno, its no wonder CCP decided to do away with transparency and stopped being communicative in what theyre working on when half of us cant even come to an agreement on something so stupid as whether or not Militia LAVs are too hard to kill. All the doomsayers, all the argumentative assholes who have nothing of value to say - just drooling out rambunctious jargon at the drop of a hat - its no wonder the Eve Online community cant take Dust 514 seriously and its nowonder the majority of Eve players want nothing to do with it.

Its a design that was good on paper and so far has just absolutely flopped - not because of the developers or the CPM or lack of funding/marketing etc... It flopped because 16 year old Johnny Nobody had access to the forums and couldnt come up with something better than a series of accronyms to convey his disapproval.

you cant blame the community for the total grind fest that rewards no lifers, garbage bonus on suits, garbage vehicles, garbage skill tree, garbage guns and garbage game modes.

i had high hopes for this game, ive played once in like a month. ccp just seem clueless

im bitter as **** lol

This is what happens when a new community is born suckling on the tit of misunderstood EVE tropes.

And this is also what comes from a community of players that were used to bungee and dice ramming their dicks down their throats (hello FPSers)

In any case two very conflicting gaming cultures just met.

The "IMA BE SUPER BADASS" FPS gaming crew who expect instant gratification, everything handed to them, and pin point accuracy.

and the "WHERES DAT SPREAD SHEET" EVE player base who want more content, more depth, and are prepared to wait.

Don't know why FPSers can't get along with the MMO crowd without calling them lame of no lifers since most FPSers are comparatively very similar in their gaming habits.

There are three kinds of people in this world:

1.) The Thinkers
2.) The Trollers
3.) Those Who Make Threads to Complain About the Trollers

I have to say, compared to the Eve community, this community is terrible. Not because it cant be civil or come to a cohesive agreement on anything but because it CHOOSES not to.

80% of the trolls are just carried players with no talent. There is no point in trying to bring up intelligent points anymore. They just get ignored anyway or troll food that brings them stomping in.

Yup, at least on these boards the community is pretty horrible compared to EVE. Tons of really childish "omgomgomgom DUSTFAIIIIIIL" posts instead of constructive criticism. Maybe it's due to it being a console game, but reading a lot of threads I can't help to feel like walking into a kindergarden sometimes.

The game is a launch product, and it deserves the terrible reviews and criticism. It's barely serviceable as a game.

When the developers do this bad of a job, what are we going to be able to say on the forums to help them fix it?

There's no real talent to exploit in this game anymore, it's all SP and shooting first. Strafing was reduced to quicksand levels so bad players don't feel bad about themselves for not being able to simultaneously move, aim, and shoot.

Everyone is being carried by their gear and the bad controls.

Stopped reading

I'm gonna have to agree with the OP over here.

The level of trolling in the Dust forums is unprecedented whenever CCP posts anything at all. People here would demand a dev blog and get some information, but then as soon as they do get a dev blog they start ignoring it saying that want action rather than words. But then as soon as action is done, people start saying that the action was unnecessary.

Cases in Point:
1. Heavies were believed to be OP. Community complained it wanting a nerf. Heavies got nerfed but the community didn't like the nerf. WTF?

2. Same thing with lazors.

3. Same thing with Tactical Asaault Rifles.

4. Now we have some ignorant moron who wants shotguns nerfed just because he wants them nerfed and doesn't care about the opinions of others.

I hope to ******* father in heaven that no one suggests nerfing the knives because they were too lazy to check their six every now and then. Then there is the whole optional-respec debate. And finally there is the whole CCP-no-show-at-E3 complaints when CCP made almost no announcement of what they were planning to do at E3. Finally, to top off the list of why this community is becoming indecisive, we have people who are not sure whether we should have an weekly SP cap or not.

I feel sorry for CCP at the moment. They have to put up with this level of BS for no reason.

Don't get me wrong here. I criticize CCP often but not to the level of hate mongering and posting endless threads of how Dust will collapse. But let's say for the sake of this argument that Dust does collapse. It will not be because of CCP. It will be because of the indecision of the community and the endless bickering amongst each other.

Sorry that you were expecting Call of Duty. Your tears are delicious.

CCP puts out a build full of sweeping changes that none of us wanted or asked for while breaking things by trying to fix what's not broken and you wonder why everyone is upset?

With allowing this game to spiral out of control..? I have to say, compared to the Eve community, this community is terrible. Not because it cant be civil or come to a cohesive agreement on anything but because it CHOOSES not to. There seem to be two kinds of players in this community and its the thinkers and the trollers. The thinkers explain their standpoint and provide evidence supporting their claim and the trollers respond with 'stop QQing and HTFU'.

Theres no constructive disagreement, theres no logical standpoints with which to consider another way of looking atthings, its just primitive grunts and echos of vague, offputting banter designed to destroy any semblance of a legitimate debate of ideals.

When a game like Warframe, stupid and simple as it may be with its lack of any competitive game modes, can achieve more civility and rational reasoning skills than the Dust 514 forums - I get disheartened. This game is only getting worse and lately im hard pressed to believe its the developers fault anymore because I know -for a ******* fact- theres going to be a stupid, unimaginative and uneducated troll comment SOMEWHERE in the following replies.

Yanno, its no wonder CCP decided to do away with transparency and stopped being communicative in what theyre working on when half of us cant even come to an agreement on something so stupid as whether or not Militia LAVs are too hard to kill. All the doomsayers, all the argumentative assholes who have nothing of value to say - just drooling out rambunctious jargon at the drop of a hat - its no wonder the Eve Online community cant take Dust 514 seriously and its nowonder the majority of Eve players want nothing to do with it.

Its a design that was good on paper and so far has just absolutely flopped - not because of the developers or the CPM or lack of funding/marketing etc... It flopped because 16 year old Johnny Nobody had access to the forums and couldnt come up with something better than a series of accronyms to convey his disapproval.

What exactly are you crying about Aeon?

Ccp are horrible at making a fps, many people find tnoo be entertaining.

You blame the community for unbalanced weapons....... i thought ccp were in charge?

Lol@people who still think dust will be anything other than irrelevant to the 99%.

Hardly, you misconstrue the message.

CCP arent the only ones at fault. The community proposes changes and the developers respond, after one year of Beta testing Ive seen this game get progressively worse and it surely wasnt because the developers intended for the game to be terrible. Hell, at one point Swarm Launchers were dumbfire and would have been great in concept saVe for the fact people were launching them at tyeir feet to get instant kills. Community says it needs to go, and now they lock on only to vehicles.

So whos at fault there? The devs for implementing a system they think is a better alternative, or the community for abusing it in its original conception?

And thatgoes for everything. A player in another thread says that if MCC AFKing is removed, the game will collapse because everyone will leave. Whos fault is that, exactly? The devs for trying to fix an obvious exploit or the community for being douchebags?

And then there's those stuck in the middle...

I don't find it a pleasant position to inhabit.

The irony in all of the comments stating im a fanboy is overflowing.

Iswear its like half of you have never read my posts absolutely condemning CCP over their poor execution and lack of action. Interestingly enough, the fact the community refuses to accept responsibility for proposing a variety of nerfs/buffs and receiving them, then - in pure childish demeanor - actually blames thedevelopers?

Yes, theyre at fault - but so are you.

You make it seem that all that community does is asking for nerfs and buffs to individual things. More often ppl are asking for reasonable stuff like: improve aiming, stop MCC AFKing, fix sticky terrain, add maps, add market, add a system where mercs actually are hired by EvE players to fight battles in EVE and not some parallel universe that has no bearing on the other game. I think you distort facts. If I understood your point, you are saying that the game sux because that's what the community requested in one way or another through QQ threads.

Hardly, you misconstrue the message.

CCP arent the only ones at fault. The community proposes changes and the developers respond, after one year of Beta testing Ive seen this game get progressively worse and it surely wasnt because the developers intended for the game to be terrible. Hell, at one point Swarm Launchers were dumbfire and would have been great in concept saVe for the fact people were launching them at tyeir feet to get instant kills. Community says it needs to go, and now they lock on only to vehicles.

So whos at fault there? The devs for implementing a system they think is a better alternative, or the community for abusing it in its original conception?

And thatgoes for everything. A player in another thread says that if MCC AFKing is removed, the game will collapse because everyone will leave. Whos fault is that, exactly? The devs for trying to fix an obvious exploit or the community for being douchebags?

Everything you mentioned there is 100% CCP's fault.

Oh you can have some fun in the middle of things if you're up for it.

http://community.eveonline.com/news/dev-blogs/archive/2003/

https://dust514.com/news/blog/2012/

15 promised dev blogs that never were.

Whole balance changes without a peep. Here's an example of what happens when a ton of new bonuses are thrown into the game.

Look at this
http://community.eveonline.com/news/dev-blogs/back-to-the-balancing-future/

What game releases "balance fixes" without presenting them to the community 1st .....

I have to say, compared to the Eve community, this community is terrible.

Actually the problem with the LAV's, is that they are not fulfilling their role. I think the majority of the community agrees with that..so no sure what you talking about.

The problem is the "Minority" of loud fanboys, that blindly tries to convince their self that the game is perfect, by trying to make a Game Design failure, sound like something that is Unique to Dust 514..

The LAV's at the moment ARE a Game Design FAILURE, not a Dust 514 feature.

Not sure if this has been mentioned (I only read the OP)

There will always be both ppl who are constructive and others who troll. Half the ppl who NOW troll, used to be constructive. They just gave up, because CCP is sinking this game into the toilet.

Stopped reading

This would be the reason this community is terrible - short attention spans

When a game like Warframe, stupid and simple as it may be with its lack of any competitive game modes, can achieve more civility and rational reasoning skills than the Dust 514 forums - I get disheartened. This game is only getting worse and lately im hard pressed to believe its the developers fault anymore because I know -for a ******* fact- theres going to be a stupid, unimaginative and uneducated troll comment SOMEWHERE in the following replies.

Feedback appreciated

Here is what I think

Not sure if this has been mentioned (I only read the OP)

There will always be both ppl who are constructive and others who troll. Half the ppl who NOW troll, used to be constructive. They just gave up, because CCP is sinking this game into the toilet.

Sad but true. Bad threads keep surfacing. Wonder if the planetside 2 bomber has anything to do with it.

Its a design that was good on paper and so far has just absolutely flopped - not because of the developers or the CPM or lack of funding/marketing etc... It flopped because 16 year old Johnny Nobody had access to the forums and couldnt come up with something better than a series of accronyms to convey his disapproval.

You're right, the players are not at fault in anyway.

Right from the start players set about finding glitches and exploitable game mechanics. When found CCP was immediately alerted and players actively avoided using the exploit in order to test out the rest of the content in the game.

Sp spent on offense was very diverse with each weapon being used at some point by most players to get a real feel for how they would work in tandem with each other. Maxing out any broken or OP weapon or exploiting a glitch for the sole purpose of boosting your stats, even though they would be erased soon, was unheard of on the battlefield. Because of this CCP was able to consistently get an accurate picture of what needed work that would have been impossible if players only used things already known to be broken/OP.

Very few people jumped on the tank badwagon for example. Teams would limit vehicles to one or two a match. Also even though the AV path was not one of glory and fame a large number of players trained up their AV skills, ensuring any decision made about balance would be based on sufficiently skilled builds. Militia anti-armor fits fell out of use as players leveled up to more advanced gear. Teamwork was also being used as players we comfortable working together as a group in order to complete objectives or destroy vehicles. As a result tanks are perfectly balanced and are thriving currently in the game.

CCP dropped the ball big time on this several times but you can all get over yourselves if you think that none of this is our fault just because we weren't the ones writing the code. Hell, a lot of this comes from Sony requiring approval for hanges so the only way CCP can really do it is to make all the changes at one time but that's the worst way in the world to troubleshoot.

CCP isn't the first company to set it's sights too high only to fall short. And it won't be the last. Hopefully they'll pull it together but it's looking like it's just more than they can handle. Common mistake, but that doesn't make the failures any less catastrophic.

I don't know what you did during the Beta but I tried all the weapons and suits that were available and provide feedback when necessary. That was the entire point of the increased sp gain. Again, you can blame the players all you want, but CCP has the responsibility to tweak and fix. CCP Iceland learned this back in late 2011 and EVE has improved greatly since. CCP Shanghai hasn't quite figured this out. If they do then Dust will probably turn out pretty good. If they don't, well, then Dust will just be one of those words people use as adjectives to describe other poor shooters.

Guns are OP, bullets are OP, melee is OP, I fell and died so the ground is OP, tanks are OP, anti-tank weapons are OP, the Sun is OP, bananas are OP, the Krebs Cycle is OP, everything is OP. I demand an open field that is flat and grassy with no rocks and a soft layer of dried hay so I don't get an ouchers.

There should be only 2 skills: Harsh Language (offense) and Hugging it Out (defense), Of course both of these will have a max level of 1 and require only 1 SP to train so someone that made a character 6 seconds before I did, or is using a skill point booster, doesn't have an unfair advantage.

I demand all of this to be done immediately, taking not one second longer than a normal downtime. At 11:31 GMT I will be on the forums demanding to know if the servers have been exploded by a volcano or something. When they are back up I will play the game, say it sucks, call all the DEVs idiots and blame them for the stupid changes that they forced on the players, make a fart joke and go back to playing Battlefild of Duty: Modern Covert Shootery of Blackness.

You're right, the players are not at fault in anyway.

Right from the start players set about finding glitches and exploitable game mechanics. When found CCP was immediately alerted and players actively avoided using the exploit in order to test out the rest of the content in the game.

Sp spent on offense was very diverse with each weapon being used at some point by most players to get a real feel for how they would work in tandem with each other. Maxing out any broken or OP weapon or exploiting a glitch for the sole purpose of boosting your stats, even though they would be erased soon, was unheard of on the battlefield. Because of this CCP was able to consistently get an accurate picture of what needed work that would have been impossible if players only used things already known to be broken/OP.

Very few people jumped on the tank badwagon for example. Teams would limit vehicles to one or two a match. Also even though the AV path was not one of glory and fame a large number of players trained up their AV skills, ensuring any decision made about balance would be based on sufficiently skilled builds. Militia anti-armor fits fell out of use as players leveled up to more advanced gear. Teamwork was also being used as players we comfortable working together as a group in order to complete objectives or destroy vehicles. As a result tanks are perfectly balanced and are thriving currently in the game.

CCP dropped the ball big time on this several times but you can all get over yourselves if you think that none of this is our fault just because we weren't the ones writing the code. Hell, a lot of this comes from Sony requiring approval for hanges so the only way CCP can really do it is to make all the changes at one time but that's the worst way in the world to troubleshoot.

CCP isn't the first company to set it's sights too high only to fall short. And it won't be the last. Hopefully they'll pull it together but it's looking like it's just more than they can handle. Common mistake, but that doesn't make the failures any less catastrophic.

I'm glad you did that, so did I. Never said every single player without exception did I?

And you're damn right I'm going to "blame the players" because while we didn't ultimately code the game and set values we didn't exactly do a whole lot. And I am not in the mood to argue about some goddamn post someone made that was trying to be constructive, that doesn't mean these forums did a damn bit of good about anything.

Endlessly arguing about P2W this or that on every thread for a while it felt like. And that garbage about the merc packs that was just people causing **** because you could. Whining about nerf this/buff that, sometimes like the first day of the build.

You guys remember open BETA and the weeks of threads about the upcoming heavy/HMG nerf? Cause they were so OP?

People wanted new content because they were getting bored so we got new content and then everbody really didn't want new content they really wanted the bugs fixed.

We got these new tanks that are even weaker than the old tanks...why? Why are they like that? CCP didn't make them like that at first, they were much stronger. Granted they were stupid broken but then they got fixed but people kept bitching and they got nerfed again and again.

A tanker made a thread asking for proto tanks because these now are too squishy and the responses were just garbage. Last one I saw said to get gun skillz. Really? That's what we've got as a community? "Play like me or GTFO"?

Screw it, I could go on but I won't. You know, CCP screwed this whole thing up from the start, it's obvious their play testers couldn't operate minesweeper but the attitude of this thread is "we tried our best to be helpful, it's all their fault" is complete bullshit. These forums have been nothing but whining and trolling since day one. I even have evidence:





Thread

It was a joke post but this isn't about whether or not I'm funny. I linked it so you could see that it's from 8 months ago. All I'm saying is maybe we didn't actually break the game we sure as hell didn't try very hard to put it back together.

Is this your first Beta forum? I'm not trying to be facetious. As FPS games go, this is pretty standard. As far as I'm concerned, GPD is a place for players to whine and vent. Feedback & Requests is where I'm sure most devs spend their time, or at least, should spend most of their time. If you're going to get upset because someone made a whine, angry, or nerf thread on GPD you might as well go dumpster your PC right now.

I know the DEVs are going to look at the feedback section but that wasn't for the DEVs it was for the other players. Why am I throwing my computer away? Who's upset about any particular post?

8 months ago I made a satirical thread warning that if everyone kept on with the endless nerf threads we'd end up with only one or two working weapons and the entire game nerfed to the point where it isn't even fun anymore. And once that happens all those players that whined and cried endlessly about crap being OP will call CCP idiots for nerfing things that didn't need it, blame them for everything and quit playing.

I know that's not a shock because I've seen it before. But at least I tried to stop it even though you know it's going to happen anyway. And now I'll draw some consolation from having watched exactly what I said would happen, happen.