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NovaSpree
Always playing to AFK
0
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Posted - 2013.06.08 08:15:00 -
[1] - Quote
GÇósame/similar *difference +Pro -Con
Heavy Pro Frame (maxed core) GÇó3.65 movement speed GÇó1154hp=2complex shield ext +core skills GÇó5hp/s (through complex armor rep) GÇóShield recharge 3.5sec GÇóDepleted shield recharge 5sec (2 complex shield regulators) GÇó20hp/s shield repair
*759dps = boundless + 15% proficiency -
*has sidearm+ *No equipment - *giant hit box- *Only WP through hacks or kills- *Slower Turning speed -
Caldari Logi Pro (maxed core) GÇó3.62 movement speed -23% due to plate penalty GÇó1172hp=Complex plate+2 enhanced plate+basic plate+5complex shield extenders+maxed core skills GÇó5hp/s passive armor repair GÇóShield recharge 4sec GÇóDepleted shield recharge 6sec GÇó20hp/s shield repair
*1078 dps=imperial scrambler+15% proficiency+
*no sidearm- *3 Equipment slots +++ *small hit box+ *faster turning speed Can get WP through GÇókills GÇóhacks (Choose 3 below) *revives+ *repairs+ *drop link spawn+ *ammo resupply+
What does this tell you? Basically caldari logis are heavies with way smaller hit boxes that can use 3 equipments and can turn quicker. But surely the HMG makes up for it but it has -lower range -more dispersion -less DPS +bigger clip ...than scrambler rifle. But the scrambler has over heat. So does the HMG. Not calling for another nerf logis should be beefy to survive but as much as a heavy? Keep logis the same but make the heavy class true heavies with resistance to small arms and more base HP ...or just give us smaller hit boxes with 3 equipment slots to balance.
Gotta love that light scrambler rifle that anyone can use. Again not calling for a nerf but can the heavy slot mean something,(at least same dps!) if heavies do have to give up 3 equipment slots, have a larger hit box, and turn slower for identical stats make the heavy weapon slot worth something more if we have to give up the above. (Fore gun AV is good but HMG AP is obviously lacking)
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NovaSpree
Always playing to AFK
0
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Posted - 2013.06.08 08:22:00 -
[2] - Quote
Thoughts, ideas? |
Sgt Kirk
SyNergy Gaming EoN.
649
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Posted - 2013.06.08 08:24:00 -
[3] - Quote
milk |
GLiMPSE X
IMPSwarm Negative-Feedback
114
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Posted - 2013.06.08 08:25:00 -
[4] - Quote
NovaSpree wrote:Thoughts, ideas?
Give cal logi a dif bonus. |
Yeva Kalsani
Reckoners
122
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Posted - 2013.06.08 08:25:00 -
[5] - Quote
One-shot the logi with a Forge Gun, balance achieved? |
Delta 749
Kestrel Reconnaissance
262
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Posted - 2013.06.08 08:28:00 -
[6] - Quote
Said it before and Ill say it again, the only nerf logistics need is replacing the light weapon slot with a sidearm slot Do that and youll see people migrate away from it so they can actually use their favorite weapons |
NovaSpree
Always playing to AFK
0
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Posted - 2013.06.08 08:29:00 -
[7] - Quote
Yeva Kalsani wrote:One-shot the logi with a Forge Gun, balance achieved?
Lol maybe I should practice with it, those players that can use it like that are few and far between. Wish I was good with that thing. |
GLiMPSE X
IMPSwarm Negative-Feedback
114
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Posted - 2013.06.08 08:30:00 -
[8] - Quote
Delta 749 wrote:Said it before and Ill say it again, the only nerf logistics need is replacing the light weapon slot with a sidearm slot Do that and youll see people migrate away from it so they can actually use their favorite weapons
The problem isnt with logi's it's with cal logi. Any other logi classes dont have near this ability to tank/deal damage. |
NovaSpree
Always playing to AFK
0
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Posted - 2013.06.08 08:33:00 -
[9] - Quote
Delta 749 wrote:Said it before and Ill say it again, the only nerf logistics need is replacing the light weapon slot with a sidearm slot Do that and youll see people migrate away from it so they can actually use their favorite weapons
Yeah but I'd hate to see true logi bros reduced to SMG, maybe if MD was included to sidearm for logis only. Cause if you get knocked down and they can't kill the guy who did it or at least back him up (MD) you stay down. But if you never die you don't have to worry about I guess . |
Ignatius Crumwald
IMPSwarm Negative-Feedback
551
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Posted - 2013.06.08 08:46:00 -
[10] - Quote
Way back in the Replication build, tears of Waaaaah! came over those who faced off with a heavy in their loludied 10 meter range area.
Back then it seemed justifiable that they had no equipment slot and very limited High/Low slots. But we still thought of many ways to further balance the heavy/HMG considering the HMG dominance in close quarters. - Lower turn speed, lower damage, higher dispersion, less health, faster heatbuild-up. All of these ideas were possible fixes for the perceived dominance of the heavy suit.
Then, in E3 built we found that they had implemented EVERY SINGLE ONE of those debuffs. Since then they have only piled those debuffs higher and higher and the heavy falls farther and farther behind until it is now one of the single most boring classes to play in all of vidyagaeming.. |
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NovaSpree
Always playing to AFK
0
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Posted - 2013.06.08 08:52:00 -
[11] - Quote
Ignatius Crumwald wrote:Way back in the Replication build, tears of Waaaaah! came over those who faced off with a heavy in their loludied 10 meter range area.
Back then it seemed justifiable that they had no equipment slot and very limited High/Low slots. But we still thought of many ways to further balance the heavy/HMG considering the HMG dominance in close quarters. - Lower turn speed, lower damage, higher dispersion, less health, faster heatbuild-up. All of these ideas were possible fixes for the perceived dominance of the heavy suit.
Then, in E3 built we found that they had implemented EVERY SINGLE ONE of those debuffs. Since then they have only piled those debuffs higher and higher and the heavy falls farther and farther behind until it is now one of the single most boring classes to play in all of vidyagaeming..
Wow didn't even know there was a republican build. Well explains a lot I started in the final days of chromosome. |
Novawolf McDustingham The514th
The Official Mintchip Fanclub
176
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Posted - 2013.06.08 09:03:00 -
[12] - Quote
NovaSpree wrote:Ignatius Crumwald wrote:Way back in the Replication build, tears of Waaaaah! came over those who faced off with a heavy in their loludied 10 meter range area.
Back then it seemed justifiable that they had no equipment slot and very limited High/Low slots. But we still thought of many ways to further balance the heavy/HMG considering the HMG dominance in close quarters. - Lower turn speed, lower damage, higher dispersion, less health, faster heatbuild-up. All of these ideas were possible fixes for the perceived dominance of the heavy suit.
Then, in E3 built we found that they had implemented EVERY SINGLE ONE of those debuffs. Since then they have only piled those debuffs higher and higher and the heavy falls farther and farther behind until it is now one of the single most boring classes to play in all of vidyagaeming.. Wow didn't even know there was a republican build. Well explains a lot I started in the final days of chromosome.
There was even a build before that, but SP was hard to come by and there was no HMG - only a forge gun. The heavy suit required Drop suit level 5 and it was a 10x skill, so no one had one. |
Ignatius Crumwald
IMPSwarm Negative-Feedback
551
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Posted - 2013.06.08 09:12:00 -
[13] - Quote
Novawolf McDustingham The514th wrote:NovaSpree wrote:Ignatius Crumwald wrote:Way back in the Replication build, tears of Waaaaah! came over those who faced off with a heavy in their loludied 10 meter range area.
Back then it seemed justifiable that they had no equipment slot and very limited High/Low slots. But we still thought of many ways to further balance the heavy/HMG considering the HMG dominance in close quarters. - Lower turn speed, lower damage, higher dispersion, less health, faster heatbuild-up. All of these ideas were possible fixes for the perceived dominance of the heavy suit.
Then, in E3 built we found that they had implemented EVERY SINGLE ONE of those debuffs. Since then they have only piled those debuffs higher and higher and the heavy falls farther and farther behind until it is now one of the single most boring classes to play in all of vidyagaeming.. Wow didn't even know there was a republican build. Well explains a lot I started in the final days of chromosome. There was even a build before that, but SP was hard to come by and there was no HMG - only a forge gun. The heavy suit required Drop suit level 5 and it was a 10x skill, so no one had one.
I almost had one.... One more day and I could have taken my revenge on GM Nythanos and Player0003 in their friggin' tanks... |
Panther Alpha
Lone Wolf Going Solo
456
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Posted - 2013.06.08 09:14:00 -
[14] - Quote
Yeva Kalsani wrote:One-shot the logi with a Forge Gun, balance achieved?
That, or use the Scrambler Rifle... it drops shields in one single shot. |
NovaSpree
Always playing to AFK
0
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Posted - 2013.06.08 09:19:00 -
[15] - Quote
Panther Alpha wrote:Yeva Kalsani wrote:One-shot the logi with a Forge Gun, balance achieved? That, or use the Scrambler Rifle... it drops shields in one single shot.
Lol with a charge in the head, they have something like 676 shield give or take so yeah I can see it.
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Panther Alpha
Lone Wolf Going Solo
456
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Posted - 2013.06.08 09:22:00 -
[16] - Quote
NovaSpree wrote:Panther Alpha wrote:Yeva Kalsani wrote:One-shot the logi with a Forge Gun, balance achieved? That, or use the Scrambler Rifle... it drops shields in one single shot. Lol with a charge in the head, they have something like 676 shield give or take so yeah I can see it.
It does... I know because i already done it. A power shot with two short burst, completely drops the shields of any Class, Proto or not, then you can rip their armor with a SMG. |
GLiMPSE X
IMPSwarm Negative-Feedback
115
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Posted - 2013.06.08 09:26:00 -
[17] - Quote
Panther Alpha wrote:NovaSpree wrote:Panther Alpha wrote:Yeva Kalsani wrote:One-shot the logi with a Forge Gun, balance achieved? That, or use the Scrambler Rifle... it drops shields in one single shot. Lol with a charge in the head, they have something like 676 shield give or take so yeah I can see it. It does... I know because i already done it. A power shot with two short burst, completely drops the shields of any Class, Proto or not, then you can rip their armor with a SMG.
This is where having a sidearm is important -- creates a lot of versatility in being able to have weapons that cater to certain types of tanking.
The scrampler + smg or scrambler + flaylock combo is beginning to emerge as a strong combo. |
NovaSpree
Always playing to AFK
0
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Posted - 2013.06.08 09:27:00 -
[18] - Quote
But that was the thought behind original post, heavies lose a lot for the HMG and SCR f**** s*** up hard, it's a great gun I like it. |
GLiMPSE X
IMPSwarm Negative-Feedback
116
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Posted - 2013.06.08 09:32:00 -
[19] - Quote
NovaSpree wrote:But that was the thought behind original post, heavies lose a lot for the HMG and SCR f**** s*** up hard, it's a great gun I like it.
Heavies could use a little more ehp, cal logies could use a little less.
I don't think there's much more that needs to be said here. |
NovaSpree
Always playing to AFK
0
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Posted - 2013.06.08 09:34:00 -
[20] - Quote
GLiMPSE X wrote:NovaSpree wrote:But that was the thought behind original post, heavies lose a lot for the HMG and SCR f**** s*** up hard, it's a great gun I like it. Heavies could use a little more ehp, cal logies could use a little less. I don't think there's much more that needs to be said here. True true, think the Amarr logi might need some love too |
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Cass Barr
Red Star. EoN.
156
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Posted - 2013.06.08 09:37:00 -
[21] - Quote
I know it's just a hypothetical, but no one in their right minds would stack that many plates.
Speaking of which, armor tanking in general needs work. |
GLiMPSE X
IMPSwarm Negative-Feedback
116
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Posted - 2013.06.08 09:41:00 -
[22] - Quote
NovaSpree wrote:GLiMPSE X wrote:NovaSpree wrote:But that was the thought behind original post, heavies lose a lot for the HMG and SCR f**** s*** up hard, it's a great gun I like it. Heavies could use a little more ehp, cal logies could use a little less. I don't think there's much more that needs to be said here. True true, think the Amarr logi might need some love too
It has a sidearm -- it's fine. |
GLiMPSE X
IMPSwarm Negative-Feedback
116
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Posted - 2013.06.08 09:41:00 -
[23] - Quote
Cass Barr wrote:I know it's just a hypothetical, but no one in their right minds would stack that many plates.
Speaking of which, armor tanking in general needs work.
There are a few people that do... and do well with it.. |
Panther Alpha
Lone Wolf Going Solo
456
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Posted - 2013.06.08 09:42:00 -
[24] - Quote
GLiMPSE X wrote:Panther Alpha wrote:NovaSpree wrote:Panther Alpha wrote:Yeva Kalsani wrote:One-shot the logi with a Forge Gun, balance achieved? That, or use the Scrambler Rifle... it drops shields in one single shot. Lol with a charge in the head, they have something like 676 shield give or take so yeah I can see it. It does... I know because i already done it. A power shot with two short burst, completely drops the shields of any Class, Proto or not, then you can rip their armor with a SMG. This is where having a sidearm is important -- creates a lot of versatility in being able to have weapons that cater to certain types of tanking. The scrampler + smg or scrambler + flaylock combo is beginning to emerge as a strong combo.
How long is going to take, for people to start to QQ about OP combos... ? any bets ? |
EVEry DUSTOID
United Planetary Soldiers
107
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Posted - 2013.06.08 09:43:00 -
[25] - Quote
damage per clip> dps |
NovaSpree
Always playing to AFK
0
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Posted - 2013.06.08 09:44:00 -
[26] - Quote
Well the reason I did it this way was to get everything the same I could speed, HP, shield regen, etc thus allowing to focus on differences HMG, turning speed, hit box and lack of equipment someone could for all intents and purposes play a heavy with logi capabilities while offering no down sides other than a lack of a sidearm slot. |
EVEry DUSTOID
United Planetary Soldiers
107
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Posted - 2013.06.08 09:45:00 -
[27] - Quote
Also the caldari logi is one flux away from the weakest suit in the game, LEARN HOW TO PLAY, stop making excuses as to why your bad...
Plenty of top players have chosen other suits besides the caldari logi, some imps respec'd out of it because the lack of side arm makes it tough, especially if you want to snipe or run with a weapon with low ammo.
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NovaSpree
Always playing to AFK
0
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Posted - 2013.06.08 09:47:00 -
[28] - Quote
EVEry DUSTOID wrote:damage per clip> dps Well if that's all that mattered the proto forge gun would out class all weapons with its 2800 Dmg +277splash x 4. But then how many players do you see using breach forge guns for infantry because it has highest damage per clip?
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NovaSpree
Always playing to AFK
0
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Posted - 2013.06.08 09:51:00 -
[29] - Quote
EVEry DUSTOID wrote:Also the caldari logi is one flux away from the weakest suit in the game, LEARN HOW TO PLAY, stop making excuses as to why your bad...
Plenty of top players have chosen other suits besides the caldari logi, some imps respec'd out of it because the lack of side arm makes it tough, especially if you want to snipe or run with a weapon with low ammo.
Actually in proposed set up said caldari logi still has 502 armor just 4 less than a heavy. Which by most accounts still puts it at higher tiers of HP. Hell they will still have as much HP as a fully tanked scout. |
EVEry DUSTOID
United Planetary Soldiers
107
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Posted - 2013.06.08 09:51:00 -
[30] - Quote
NovaSpree wrote:EVEry DUSTOID wrote:damage per clip> dps Well if that's all that mattered the proto forge gun would out class all weapons with its 2800 Dmg +277splash x 4. But then how many players do you see using breach forge guns for infantry because it has highest damage per clip?
well it has no ammo pool and requires a charge up time and it's built for AV so it's not really relevant for Anti-infantry... |
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