I too started playing EVE because of DUST. Created my EVE and DUST chars on the same day. But played EVE first. The danger of merging markets now, would be great ISK divide between DUSTies with EVE side connection and DUSTies without it. I am talking about ISK donations from EVE side. 1.000.000 ISK for one capsuleer is earned in 20 minutes and less. For merc who is not a ceo/director of district owning corp it takes 4 hours or 3. And not everybody wants to have an EVE account. Yet

Add to this market prices manipulation by capsuleers. I bet they can't wait for it Imagine 10x prices hikes in a matter of minutes... We are not ready for this yet imho. DUST battles payouts should be increased tenfold or more for the merge to be safe...

EDIT:
Yeah right! We need to rise the price of our services. Let's start the general strike

Pay or die! Pay or die! Pay or die! Comon guys, repeat. Pay or die! Pay or die! Pay or die!
Lol

Personally, I think Proto gear is way too cheap as it is right now. IMHO, it should cost roughly 15-20m for a full proto fit (dropsuit, mods and weapons). It would then be given the gravity that I believe CCP was hoping it would have rather than people just running around pubs tossing Proto around like it was water.

@Topher

No offense, but if you're gate-jumping a mining ship into low, you're doing it wrong. Haul that **** into a quiet little corner of low, drop it in the station there and then (here's the kicker) jump clone out. This way you can keep the system quiet as far as gate jumps are concerned on dotlan.

When you want to go mining there, STAY AT YOUR KEYBOARD and KEEP EVE UP FRONT ON YOUR MONITOR. Jumpclone into the system and tank the rats, don't kill them.

Keep these tips in mind and you should be able to mine till your heart's content in relative safety.

I believe that is far too expensive for how quickly you can be killed in DUST. DUST gear should be cheap, just like it is. This allows for players to use prototype gear in public matches without being deathly afraid of losing it. At that price no one would ever use the gear and it would just sit on the market forever.

I disagree, it would still be found in PC and potentially in FW too (if we're getting LP and better rewards that is). It would only disappear from pubs which I don't think is a bad thing.

There is currently very little risk v reward in Dust and if we had a single economy shared between the two, the risk would become even less.

I can't argue that risk would go down, but I think that the risk should go down to meet the current reward for playing any part of DUST.

Again, I have to disagree, if the risk is lessened, then the only barrier to Proto will become SP which will just cause newbs to get faceraped even worse than they do currently. This wouldn't be a good thing for Dust on the whole.

Protogear needs more gravity, not more commonality.

Dust 514 doesn't have an economy. It has an omnipotent vendor that sells whatever you need at unchanging prices, but never has to buy anything from anyone. Where does this omnipotent vendor find materials? How does it create the products? No one ones, not even the almighty space pigeons up there.

I see your point. Proto gear should be the tech II/III of the DUST world, but until they add more rewarding content for DUST players to participate in I just can't imagine a DUST player shelling out 15 - 20 million ISK for a dropsuit fitting. I usually spawn in DUST with a meta 1 dropsuit and a meta 5 weapon to save some cash. My scrambler pistol still rips through the most tanky prototypes out there. If they were to make a dropsuit fit cost 15 - 20 mil, that dropsuit had better be able to wreck anyone in militia with a couple shots. Think about someone attacking an Ishtar with a Merlin. The Ishtar should win. I just don't think prototype gear preforms that well to cost that much.

I support CCP's plan to allow Eve Online players control of the manufacturing of our assets mainly for two big reasons:

1. The system is already in place for it and the industry has been working and thriving for 10 years non-stop with many players already establishing effective production chains while figuring out and planning ahead for minimum production costs while also maximizing their gains.

2. Market competition is already in place and will guarantee that Dust players will get a good deal if they are smart enough to know where to look even if they don't have connections to Eve. If an Eve player wants to sell you a 'Thale' sniper rifle for 10 million ISK, you will always find another Eve player willing to sell you the same thing for less. The market is perfectly designed for that kind of stuff in Eve.

It would be nice for Dust to have its own industry, but right now Dust doesn't even have anything to start for that except clone production on PC districts. Therefore, it's best that Eve players spearhead the operation.

Of course EVE players want protosuits to cost more... why wouldnt they?

These two guys pushing this 10-20mil a protosuit probably want to manufacture. One more reason CCP shouldnt listen to spaceship nerds when it comes to making their FPS.

Of course EVE players want protosuits to cost more... why wouldnt they?

These two guys pushing this 10-20mil a protosuit probably want to manufacture. One more reason CCP shouldnt listen to spaceship nerds when it comes to making their FPS.

Actually, CCP should listen to the Eve players for this stuff. Why? Because those "two guys" you're referring to are not the only ones wanting to manufacture and sell. Remember, New Eden is all about market competition. Just because a player in Eve wants to sell you a 10 million ISK 'Thale' sniper rifle it doesn't mean that will be the new price. The price will be dependent on several factors listed below:

1. Supply: The greater the supply, the lower the cost.

2. Demand: The greater the demand, the higher the price.

3. Competition: If I'm selling a 'Thale' for 10 million ISK in Eve, there will always be another player in Eve who wants to sell for a fraction of that price thus stealing my customers while undercutting me.

4. Ease of production: It will depend heavily on how easy it is to produce the items. In Eve, I can produce 100 destroyers with no problem (cheap ships) but I will have a problem trying to produce even 10 interdictors (expensive ships).

5. Availability of materials needed for production: Do you have a tight control on the material or is the material something others can get readily?

6. How much is the buyer willing to pay and how badly do they need it?

^ This. Even if I wanted to make my DUST experience more expensive, I couldn't.

Maken has got a point Cyn, if I were the only one that could manufacture Proto suits, you'd be paying a damn sight more than 10-20m ISK per suit.

****, if I were the only one, I'd keep a stable of protoscrubs as my own personal lapdogs just feeding their addictions on the cheap while gouging everyone else.

Of course EVE players want protosuits to cost more... why wouldnt they?

These two guys pushing this 10-20mil a protosuit probably want to manufacture. One more reason CCP shouldnt listen to spaceship nerds when it comes to making their FPS.

actually CCP dropped the prices of infantry equipment sharply because the EVE manufacturing nerds were enraged that infantry equipment could cost as much as warships. It would have allowed an unchecked and horrendous ISK faucet into New Eden to pay for all of the things, and it would have sharply devalued everyone's ships, or forced a massive cost-inflation.

20 million is more than I need to effectively purchase and fit a fleet capable combat cruiser or buy a specialist frigate class ship or interdictor. why the hell would a suit of infantry body armor be reasonable at even a tenth of that cost?

As it stands current fitting costs at prototype level cost about ten proto fits = one fully fitted attack frigate. that's really pushing it on a cost scale.

I endorse a single economy, and CCP itself said it was coming, but I don't want the capsuleers to have all the fun. We mercenaries deserve some industry, too!

I've played EVE online for two months now. I started because I heard of this FPS that would have the same economy as this intense meta game known as EVE. I loved the idea of using the spaceship markets to fuel the cost of my Boba Fett style dropsuits. Sure I'd lose money playing this way, but it would be my reward for coordinating with my EVE mercenaries to protect my barge in low security space. I loved the idea so much I subscribed to EVE and bought a PS3. Now the game has been released and the beta officially over. Strangely when I began to investigate more closely after getting my bearings in both games I found an impenetrable investment wall between my two characters. Having prototype gear every time I spawn should be my reward for playing both games. When is DUST 514 actually actually going to be a part of the EVE universe, and when can I implement my perfectly fair strategy to have fun in this FPS?

I completely agree with this. If a corp is based entirely in Dust with no EVE connections, yet it has been successful in planetary conquest, it should be able to gather resources from the districts owned and produce products for at least the Dust market.

Dust 514 doesn't have an economy. It has an omnipotent vendor that sells whatever you need at unchanging prices, but never has to buy anything from anyone. Where does this omnipotent vendor find materials? How does it create the products? No one ones, not even the almighty space pigeons up there.

I completely agree with this. If a corp is based entirely in Dust with no EVE connections, yet it has been successful in planetary conquest, it should be able to gather resources from the districts owned and produce products for at least the Dust market.

why don't they just put in buy prices at 10% less so we can fund our pursuits on the salvage we pull?

It needs to happen sooner rather than later. However, there are a ton of things to tackle and it really needs to be eased into. I just want Dust to Dust trading / isk transfer (character, not corp) and I'd be happy for now.

the district wouldn't have the resources available to make all that stuff. you need resources from all the planet types just to be a well balanced machine.

I've played EVE online for two months now. I started because I heard of this FPS that would have the same economy as this intense meta game known as EVE. I loved the idea of using the spaceship markets to fuel the cost of my Boba Fett style dropsuits. Sure I'd lose money playing this way, but it would be my reward for coordinating with my EVE mercenaries to protect my barge in low security space. I loved the idea so much I subscribed to EVE and bought a PS3. Now the game has been released and the beta officially over. Strangely when I began to investigate more closely after getting my bearings in both games I found an impenetrable investment wall between my two characters. Having prototype gear every time I spawn should be my reward for playing both games. When is DUST 514 actually actually going to be a part of the EVE universe, and when can I implement my perfectly fair strategy to have fun in this FPS?

It will happen, but all the over-reaction of that one event on a server where ISK was worthless has a lot of people unduly worried.

A loophole was found to this iron wall.

The presentation we gave with Dr. EyjoG at Fanfest this year has 48 minutes worth of informational goodness regarding this very topic. Check it out if you're interested in a deep-dive on our thinking in terms of merging the economies.

Link: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-pzODp6-hO8


As far as the short term plans go, we are looking to enable taxed currency transactions between EVE and DUST (and perhaps player-to-player trading of items within DUST). This is coming as soon as we have the necessary features in place to support it and have a good feel how the economy is balancing out within DUST. Then, we'll carefully observe what happens, analyze the results and determine the next steps forward. Having full-on secondary market are high on the list of priorities for the subsequent economy features.

I appreciate your longwinded report but, a player to player trade feature Can't be that difficult to design and implement can it?

Also Eve to Dust isk transfers wouldn't hurt the economy? Are you thinking ok? Your affraid you might hurt the economy with any wrong moves yet your willing to let eve give billions to dust mercs? I dont get it?

I appreciate your longwinded report but, a player to player trade feature Can't be that difficult to design and implement can it?

Also Eve to Dust isk transfers wouldn't hurt the economy? Are you thinking ok? Your affraid you might hurt the economy with any wrong moves yet your willing to let eve give billions to dust mercs? I dont get it?

I appreciate your longwinded report but, a player to player trade feature Can't be that difficult to design and implement can it?

Also Eve to Dust isk transfers wouldn't hurt the economy? Are you thinking ok? Your affraid you might hurt the economy with any wrong moves yet your willing to let eve give billions to dust mercs? I dont get it?

The presentation we gave with Dr. EyjoG at Fanfest this year has 48 minutes worth of informational goodness regarding this very topic. Check it out if you're interested in a deep-dive on our thinking in terms of merging the economies.

Link: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-pzODp6-hO8

In a nutshell, the long term plan has always been to eventually merge the two economies fully and to have a player-driven manufacturing economy with free trading, but the process of getting there resembles a marathon more than a sprint. The EVE economy originally started just like the DUST economy did with NPCs seeding significant portions of the market and has grown to its current state through ten years of development. While it probably will be much faster to get DUST in a similar state, getting there still requires a lot of design, feature development and careful cycles of observation and iteration.

Having a measured approach to developing the DUST economy and its connection to EVE is necessary for several reasons. It reduces the risk of introducing too much volatility at once. Some volatility is always good as it creates opportunities for people to exploit, but on the other hand we want to avoid shocks that have the potential to break the economy. One example for a potential source for such a shock would be fully opening currency transactions without searching for evidence of a balance first. Similarly, proceeding carefully reduces the risk of introducing economy-wrecking bugs or exploits by allowing more time for design, programming and testing.

As far as the short term plans go, we are looking to enable taxed currency transactions between EVE and DUST (and perhaps player-to-player trading of items within DUST). This is coming as soon as we have the necessary features in place to support it and have a good feel how the economy is balancing out within DUST. Then, we'll carefully observe what happens, analyze the results and determine the next steps forward. Having full-on secondary market are high on the list of priorities for the subsequent economy features.

Personally, I think Proto gear is way too cheap as it is right now. IMHO, it should cost roughly 15-20m for a full proto fit (dropsuit, mods and weapons). It would then be given the gravity that I believe CCP was hoping it would have rather than people just running around pubs tossing Proto around like it was water.

Maybe not 15-20 M ISK but we should be paying more, there should also be a limited supply to make the market feel more real or at least have only a certain amount of proto gear made per hour, the unlimited supply is junk and I think hurts us more than people realize. I can't even imagine the amount of tears if when we logged on after DT that the TAR was very expensive and in limited supply. I would laugh and hold out my drinking cup.

Implementing player-to-player trading isn't a trivial, but definitely doable in the short term. We are working on it and hoping to get it in if not for the next release, then the one after that. I would love to help speed up the process, but I don't think you want me touching the code unless you are willing to risk universe-shattering dupe bugs and the like. I'm an economist after all, not a programmer

When it comes to managing the EVE-DUST ISK transfers, there are several different factors that play into the meaningfulness of the ISK flows from EVE towards DUST. One of the important ones is the NPC price level in DUST. By adjusting the DUST prices, we can increase or decrease the value of EVE ISK towards DUST. Such price adjustments don't have long term effects on the internal DUST economy, either. While initially devaluing savings (i.e. the ISK in your wallet), long term effects would be limited since the instant battle rewards are essentially a interlinked cycle of consumption and rewards. When the prices go up, so do the rewards. In other words, when HAVs worth 50M get destroyed in battles, a similar amount of ISK is given out as a reward.

The overall goal is to find a meaningful balance before we fully open up ISK transactions. People should be able to sponsor their DUST characters with EVE ISK, but the cost of doing so should neither be trivial nor prohibitively expensive. But it should be meaningful.

Implementing player-to-player trading isn't a trivial, but definitely doable in the short term. We are working on it and hoping to get it in if not for the next release, then the one after that. I would love to help speed up the process, but I don't think you want me touching the code unless you are willing to risk universe-shattering dupe bugs and the like. I'm an economist after all, not a programmer

When it comes to managing the EVE-DUST ISK transfers, there are several different factors that play into the meaningfulness of the ISK flows from EVE towards DUST. One of the important ones is the NPC price level in DUST. By adjusting the DUST prices, we can increase or decrease the value of EVE ISK towards DUST. Such price adjustments don't have long term effects on the internal DUST economy, either. While initially devaluing savings (i.e. the ISK in your wallet), long term effects would be limited since the instant battle rewards are essentially a interlinked cycle of consumption and rewards. When the prices go up, so do the rewards. In other words, when HAVs worth 50M get destroyed in battles, a similar amount of ISK is given out as a reward.

The overall goal is to find a meaningful balance before we fully open up ISK transactions. People should be able to sponsor their DUST characters with EVE ISK, but the cost of doing so should neither be trivial nor prohibitively expensive. But it should be meaningful.

Implementing player-to-player trading isn't a trivial, but definitely doable in the short term. We are working on it and hoping to get it in if not for the next release, then the one after that. I would love to help speed up the process, but I don't think you want me touching the code unless you are willing to risk universe-shattering dupe bugs and the like. I'm an economist after all, not a programmer

When it comes to managing the EVE-DUST ISK transfers, there are several different factors that play into the meaningfulness of the ISK flows from EVE towards DUST. One of the important ones is the NPC price level in DUST. By adjusting the DUST prices, we can increase or decrease the value of EVE ISK towards DUST. Such price adjustments don't have long term effects on the internal DUST economy, either. While initially devaluing savings (i.e. the ISK in your wallet), long term effects would be limited since the instant battle rewards are essentially a interlinked cycle of consumption and rewards. When the prices go up, so do the rewards. In other words, when HAVs worth 50M get destroyed in battles, a similar amount of ISK is given out as a reward.

The overall goal is to find a meaningful balance before we fully open up ISK transactions. People should be able to sponsor their DUST characters with EVE ISK, but the cost of doing so should neither be trivial nor prohibitively expensive. But it should be meaningful.

@ Cross

Yeah, I think we can expect some pretty cool stuff in the next 3-6 months from CCP. Dev blogs are always appreciated as they let us know what they have decided is most important on the agenda. It would be nice to have a ranking system for the requests to see what they feel is most important and what they've decided to focus on.

@ Cross

Yeah, I think we can expect some pretty cool stuff in the next 3-6 months from CCP. Dev blogs are always appreciated as they let us know what they have decided is most important on the agenda. It would be nice to have a ranking system for the requests to see what they feel is most important and what they've decided to focus on.

I still fail to see why we can't have DUST to DUST trading, idgaf about EVE and their economy tbh, I want to be able to transfer ISK to people in DUST, I'd like to receive ISK for my services without having to have a separate Corporation to use as a money handler, it's ridiculous, same with trading equipment, I should be able to select a player who's not in a battle, select Trade, when the player accepts it should open up 3 Boxes, My Inventory, My Offer, Their Offer, above should show their name, corporation, and then another Box showing ISK for ISK transfers (So it would be empty unless I pushed a number into it)