The splash damage on missile turrets was nerfed in response to a wealth of complaints about killing people with splash damage being "skilless" and "faceroll".

If I recall correctly, many of those threads were made by players who are now members of your alliance.

Somewhat ironic, wouldn't you say?

I feel sad that you think I don't tank :(

(It's true, in uprising I don't have HAVs trained because the LOLSP investments doubled for like everything, but before that I always had tank, dropship, and LAV skills pretty much maxed)

How would you make passive tanking Viable though, Bob? Is it the delay in recharge, or the low rate of recharge that is a problem? Would having vehicle versions of shield regulators help? Should vehicles have a delay at all? (No delay could excuse a low rate of recharge if that recharge is constant, and the modules to improve recharge became more attractive than a raw booster on a 'passive' setup) Though, there's a fine line between passive actually being decent and being better than active. Where would shield tankers put that line? (I usually tank armor)

As far as railguns go... I'd honestly want to see their range reduced. Not a lot, though. Maybe drop to like 300m since most other turrets seem to die off at 200m or so last I looked? They should still have the furthest range of any vehicle turret, but it shouldn't span pretty much the entire map IMO. Maybe have variants that are 'super ranged' but do less damage? (Thoughts on that?) But really, railguns struggle because you either hit or miss. To be honest, if the range issue is mitigated and 'hill sniping from across the map' becomes less of a thing, I'd like to see the massive splash radius come back for large turrets (4-5m for rails, matching their 'explosive' VFX and like 5-7m for missiles) The reason that was a problem in the past was because of the obnoxious damage that splash had with it. IF you buff the splash radius of both railguns and missiles (Since they both need it) but keep the damage relatively low (40-65 for rails, 90-115 for missiles, or around there) both will instantly gain back their 'usability' against infantry at close range without making them as hilariously broken as they were in the past. Splash damage should be used to 'whittle down', not to completely own everything.

Those numbers are something I'd rather see CCP play with a bit though tbh. Missile splash (For large turrets) might stand to be lower since the spread would likely all 'hit' with higher splash radius (Thus still owning everything even without directly hitting them)... railgun might need to be a bit higher because of the prohibitive nature and slow refire rate. It's possible the only rail that has 'problem' damage is the compressed variant (IIRC it has double, at like 225 splash at standard level) I'd honestly rather them spend like two weeks making a pass, where they have the lower numbers first and then the higher numbers, then after the second week decide which to keep. (A lot of stuff needs this done, tbh)

But those are the basic ideas of how I'd consider adjusting those turrets.

Here we are making a list. This list will collect the opinion of tankers, and a few reasonable AV friends. No CCP fanboys, no AR players no nothing.
1) PG skill should be re-implemented.
2) Turret damage bonus of all types of turrets should be re-implemented. (3% instead of 1.)
3) Resistance of tank hulls should be increased against AV by 20%. last night 2 swarm volleys dealt 10520 damage to my tank. Yes only 2 volleys, god knows how many damage mod that player stacked.
4) Railguns should deal more damage than a hanheld forge gun. (Forge nerf requested here.)
5) Scattered Ion Cannon's DPS should be more than a handheld D. Tac AR. One of them is a handheld gun, other is a tank mounted turret.
6) Active Shield Resistance module should be 30 second active and 30 second CD (Require opinions of serious shield tankers)
7) Passive regen of shields are joke, it should be 1.5x of what it is right now. (Require opinions of serious shield tankers)
8) Splash radius of missiles are joke, I have only been able to kill a few people with splash, it generally requires a missile to directly hit enemy to kill. All sorts of missile splash radius should be increased 1.5x
9) AV and Flux should branch off from grenadier to AV grenadier and Flux grenade Operation.
P.S. We want Surya and Sagaris back.
+ I find it funny how AV grenade of same level deal more damage to armor than swarm launchers.

I love almost all of sylwester's bullet points except for the last two.


I agree that the third person camera does give too much intelligence. It makes it super hard to get snuck up on by people trying to bomb you with RE's, and anyone who gets in that range in general is easily seen.

Dust is a first person game, and I honestly think that the camera should stay in first person for all vehicles (Including dropships, but dropships need some serious love before they can be viable like that) LAV and HAV first person cameras are both functional, and allow the driver to look around freely (Yet don't give an almost omnidirectional sense of sight for free)

That creates a specific weakness in vehicles (Line of sight) and it is absolutely necessary IMO, as it then requires you to communicate with passengers and gunners to know where you are being shot from, as well as communication from your teammates elsewhere.

I should not be able to avoid an ambush because 3rd person camera let me see someone that first person would've made me miss. Or at least, I think so. That does give AV yet ANOTHER advantage over vehicles, and I'll admit they don't really need more advantages atm... but in a perfect world where there's actually a balance between the two... Third person camera should die.

Here we are making a list. This list will collect the opinion of tankers, and a few reasonable AV friends. No CCP fanboys, no AR players no nothing.
1) PG skill should be re-implemented.
2) Turret damage bonus of all types of turrets should be re-implemented. (3% instead of 1.)
3) Resistance of tank hulls should be increased against AV by 20%. last night 2 swarm volleys dealt 10520 damage to my tank. Yes only 2 volleys, god knows how many damage mod that player stacked.
4) Railguns should deal more damage than a hanheld forge gun. (Forge nerf requested here.)
5) Scattered Ion Cannon's DPS should be more than a handheld D. Tac AR. One of them is a handheld gun, other is a tank mounted turret.
6) Active Shield Resistance module should be 30 second active and 30 second CD (Require opinions of serious shield tankers)
7) Passive regen of shields are joke, it should be 1.5x of what it is right now. (Require opinions of serious shield tankers)
8) Splash radius of missiles are joke, I have only been able to kill a few people with splash, it generally requires a missile to directly hit enemy to kill. All sorts of missile splash radius should be increased 1.5x
9) AV and Flux should branch off from grenadier to AV grenadier and Flux grenade Operation.
P.S. We want Surya and Sagaris back.
+ I find it funny how AV grenade of same level deal more damage to armor than swarm launchers.

AV grenades are too effective.
Every other AV weapon sacrifices significant anti-infantry capability in order to damage tanks. AV grenades don't, and they're too spammable. They should need some priming time before throwing, for example. I don't think they need significantly less damage, though I think they should have a damage reduction, but the ability to spam them absolutely needs to go.

One reason why loads of infantry are carrying them is also because it's the best counter to free LAV spam.

Trying to balance proto AV and turrets against standard hulls is a waste of time. Because they are not supposed to be balanced.


Give the tank drivers their toys and bring out the proto hulls, CCP.


Properly priced, of course.

+1 Awesome ideas!

Whenever Grideris is not busy doing whatever it is australians do when they aren't on the internet.

Just waiting on him to be available to record it, we have one planned.

-1 (some of them are really bad ideas.)
*I don't want scrubs to hop in my tank and learn my tank fit, tank fits are vital in this game. They only should be aware if I activate a heat sink.
* My dot is small enough to be confused with my gunners dot, changing main sight might do the trick.
*I don't care if my scrub gunners over heats or not.
*Yes activating several modules that you pre-selected should be easier if not all.
*If you take away 3rd person camera I want 60% resistance bonus since it is nearly impossible to see where the threat is coming from. Yes 60% not 20 not 40 exactly 60% resistance not plus health.
*3rd oerson is much better than adding 4 cameras.

Everything here is good. I'll just add my two cents.

Make the hacked EX-0 require at least a LITTLE sp put into it to use. Damn that thing is annoying as... Yeah you get the point.

Give the caldari HAV's a bit of a buff on power grid, but the PG skill would do that just fine I'm guessing but I've not done the math.

BUFF THE EFFIN SICA! The Soma literally wipes the floor with this thing as far as militia tanks go, give 'er another mid and a CPU buff. Then it suddenly becomes more viable, as it stands it's just a glorified LAV that rookies will have issues putting out in any game from the increased cost.(Rookie Soma = 160-180k, Rookie Sica = 190-220k ISK)

You need to be able to activate Precision Strikes from inside a HAV, or any other vehicle for that matter. Leaving the tank usually results in the passengers griefing by switching to the drivers' seat and stealing the tank.

I have a small list of things that I think would make HAVs perfect. Note these changes shoul apply to std and above grade HAVs

1) 15%-25% powergrid increase

2) 10%-15% dammage resistance or hp buff on top of what we have just now.

3) an eject button or the ability to asign the tank to your squad and your squad only

4) triage and guardian points for spider tanking.

5) +5%-10% acceleration on all tanks.

6) passive shield recharger moduals that acctually make a difference.

All the above i think would put tanks in their rightfull place and allow us to acctivlt tank more effectivly

has nothing to with the op or this^ post but I am wonder if/when we get a dev response and will it be filled with bad news. HAV need a reason to be on the field or we will just put out the much cheaper LLAVs and cause more nerf LAV threads just because of the new skill tree.

dude #6 I totally agree the shield passive recharge is worthless and the modules are just as bad. the passive recharge is only slightly useful with small arms fire and not a lot and really small arms fire doesn't bother armor tanks so there is no advantage there.

I agree on all point and I think the swarm launcher needs to be toned down. it literally is more effective the plasma launcher just on damage alone and is the most effective AV on LAV then any other AV because they are homing. now with this sure nerf LAV slightly because the LLAV can be a pain and would be more so then.

shield passive recharge is fine you can take multiple routes and gain your shield back quickly without using modules unlike armor tanking where you need to activate a module just to repair 300 damage

you lose strength for longevity and consistency

not to mentuion it increases your shield recharge rate when you use shield boosters

gunlogi with booster heals for 350 a second 1750 over 5 seconds
madrugar with repair heals for 414 every 3 seconds 2070 over 15 seconds
gunlogi will heal for 1950 after 15 seconds and continue to outpace a madrugar in repair

Can't we just reduce the amount of AV/Flux held to like 1 or 2? I remember another post talking about how taking down a well fitted HAV is a team task and not something a guy with 500ksp should be able to do alone, and I completely agree with that, tanks are there to dominate the battlefield and you should have to work together to take him down.

shield passive recharge is fine you can take multiple routes and gain your shield back quickly without using modules unlike armor tanking where you need to activate a module just to repair 300 damage

you lose strength for longevity and consistency

not to mentuion it increases your shield recharge rate when you use shield boosters

gunlogi with booster heals for 350 a second 1750 over 5 seconds
madrugar with repair heals for 414 every 3 seconds 2070 over 15 seconds
gunlogi will heal for 1950 after 15 seconds and continue to outpace a madrugar in repair

the math on the repper s nice now do the math on resistances and active res..