What did i do :(

That cant be right, if we (PFBHz) were to attack unreal, they would undoubtedly just give up the territory in their infamous tactic of dodging.

I'm not sure if I misread this but is MCC destruction not a district capture condition for the attackers? Only clone depletion?

Not sure I like district capture based around TDM, it should be an objective based capture as well...

This thread made me lol with all the insertions of corpmates. But the point is valid; holy ISK sinks!

Nice post Beers. +1. Would like to have seen corp A and Corp B. But you make valid constructive points.

PFBHz now controls the district. It took 4 days and a cost of 89.3 million isk. while unreal lost quiet a bit more and the district. It will take PFBHz ~ 15 days to recoup its losses from the district if no one attacks it.

I wanna look at this for a bit.

After your battle, PFBHz was left with 250 clones. Let's say they leave it in the 60 clones per day district so as to max that out faster and start moving it into the 40 clones a day district. After day 1, the 60 clones per day would be maxed and the 40 clones per day would have a total of 50 clones, (10 were transferred from the overflow of day 1.) At 100 clones per day total, it's a simple 4 day jaunt until both are maxed out and profit starts rolling in. Then it would be 9 days at 10 mil a day to recoup battle losses.

So it would be a 13 day turnaround.

The rest looks good though.

This is approx how I was thinking about it. There's also what's going on overhead - if we're taking these districts for our own interests then maybe orbital support is throwing us a freebie, otherwise we're prolly paying something significant for it.

Beers' analysis is essentially the game for now - there will be variations on this - raider corps, disposable minimum investment territory, feints, etc., the economics of which we will have to plow through.

No MCC cost right now, but also no EVE Bonus stated yet. Would make the cost of district ownership lower if it was also attractive to an EVE entity - this is prolly the long term economics of the thing. We give them enough districts to get their bonuses, we get cheaper districts ourselves.

Question is, who gets the exposed buffer districts and who gets the cozy middle district?

Based on the example above lets assume that unreal purchased a cargo hub instead, thus increasing its total clones to 450.

If unreal defends with only 100 clones in the first 4 matches and loses they still force PFBHz to attack 5 times in a row. If we assume that 5 days in battles costs PFBH a total of 160 million isk. This is 32 million a match and more then resonable even in victory.

PFBHz will need ~ 40 days to make up the cost of taking the district.

Moral of story is buy the cargo hub and make it a finacial deterent to attack your district.

This is step one of the Blue Donut of Beers

What?

It has nothing to do with the close PFBHz have left. It has to do with total loss of isk incurred while taking the district. Once PFBHz has control of the district it produces 60 clones a day because it has a production facility which generates 50% more clones. The basic clone generation rate is 40 der day or 4 million isk.

This district generates 60 clones a day or 6 million into 89.3 million is ~14 days.

Even though its negligible if you are on the same planet as a district you want to control there is still a 500K ISK cost to transport your troops into the neighboring district each go.

There is also the attrition cost for travel beyond the planet and the travel cost also rise with obviously cuts into the profit. In your scenario its only an additional 500K ISK/per attack so if it take 5 attacks thats an additional 2.5 Million added to the books and thats just to attack a district thats on the same planet

Districts within the same solar system is 1M ISK travel cost per attack cycle and unless coming from a district with a research lab thats a 5% loss on clones which is 100K/clone loss per attack cylce.

I'll reread but im not sure if that was factored into the attack cost.

So if a corp is smart enough to the right solar system or at the least the right mix of small district planets it will become extremely unviable economically to attack them.

circle gets the square.

Total loss is 37.2

PFBHz is rewarded with 20% ~7.4 million in loot

Even though its negligible if you are on the same planet as a district you want to control there is still a 500K ISK cost to transport your troops into the neighboring district each go.

There is also the attrition cost for travel beyond the planet and the travel cost also rise with obviously cuts into the profit. In your scenario its only an additional 500K ISK/per attack so if it take 5 attacks thats an additional 2.5 Million added to the books and thats just to attack a district thats on the same planet

Districts within the same solar system is 1M ISK travel cost per attack cycle and unless coming from a district with a research lab thats a 5% loss on clones which is 100K/clone loss per attack cylce.

I'll reread but im not sure if that was factored into the attack cost.

So if a corp is smart enough to the right solar system or at the least the right mix of small district planets it will become extremely unviable economically to attack them.

circle gets the square.

This is the exact type of feedback that should be in the feedback thread here: https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=63760&find=unread

It's really good stuff.

The numbers you give are right on the money. What if we are not given the whole picture yet, this is still the beginning of a large feature so what if we are not only making money off of clones.

Now I know that I am just shooting in the dark here by saying that there is something else hidden that we don't know about. Also that how can we make money from EvE if we don't have a combined economy. All that is true but you never know right now, that is all I am saying.

I do though hope that what we have is not what you have stated that would really not be fun and would ruin that game entirely, for me and many more.

Beers question.

I thought the game allowed you to reattack with in a hour of your first attack. So you could attack the same district 4 times in 1 day could you not?

Also I thought once a district is under attack you could not reinforce. thus the attacker can pound you into the ground with 4 attacks in a row meanwhile preventing you from reinforcing. so unless you had 450 clones there to start you have to fight with what you left there.

Also who says you have to run expensive kit to win? You could run mostly adv level equipment or standard and cut costs for the battle adjusting on the fly using supply depos.

Also people do not use logis much in corp battles right now or injectors for that matter. their use would ob become far more critical for the long term campaign. instead of 4 guys carrying ammo in most corp battles. a team of 6 would have enough guys that if 2 survive they can res the others. KDR and injectors become far more critical. lone wolfing in the corp battle will be a bad idea as you always will want someone within range to rez you. every clone costing 200k goes a long way to wanting people to rez.

Also is not the 100 clones lost the MINIMUM amount you can lose per battle. I thought if you lost lets say 150 clones then you lose that amount plus 100 clone. or is it just 150?

So basically a district can be bullied? lol

I was correct in that you can re-attack in the same day within the hour. so you could attack with 450 clones and take a district if 4 fights or less.

That is not correct.

If you attack a district you have an 1-hour exclusive window, from the start of the match, to schedule another battle for the following day, and not the same day.

In that 1-hour window no other corps can attack the district, but only you.

Edit: But it is correct that if the attacker wins then the defender cannot reinforce the district until after the next reinforcement window.

also this means the attacker has the clone production advantage because his attacking district will be making babies.

Well this does not seem fair I think the advantage should go to the defenders. Unless this is an inccentive to attack districts to prevent the evil doughnut.

Its why i noted they failed their dodge saving throw. They need a 20 when you bitches roll up

Well this does not seem fair I think the advantage should go to the defenders. Unless this is an inccentive to attack districts to prevent the evil doughnut.

Ding Ding Ding...We Have A Winner
CCP has stated multiple times that they do not want a camp fest, they want attacking and action...

Yes I agree that would make sense but, the ability to make babies while your opponent cannot does not seem to be really fair. How are you still able to but you opponent is not. Incentive or not that does not feel right.

I may have missed the reason there please forgive me if I did.

Well defenders don't have to deal with moving babies costs. The fact that some of the babies are going to die during transport depending on how many jumps away the attacker is means that the attacker has more overhead depending on his location relative.
Also isk cost as per moving babies ref bottom of the table not including cost of dead babies.

http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Planetary_Conquest#Distance_And_Its_Effect_On_Moves

The reason you cannot is you lost the battle in your district Meta reason= your facility is under attack and thus shut down. workers dont work in combat zones. equipment would be shut down to prevent damage and such things.

Is it me or does peace sound profitable?

Is it me or does peace sound profitable?

Is it me or does peace sound profitable?

you want a planet near a star or a wormhole?

this is why it will end in blue donut. We're holding an auction day 1 you want a planet near a star or a wormhole?

Make me wonder on the map layout we have several dozen valid candidates for the conquest mode.

Why do we think its necessary that the average fit is 150k? Wouldn't profit improve for attackers/defenders if they could engage forces with suits that were ~50k?