Corp battles can just remove the redline and let corps decide if they want to keep throwing money around or not. NPC's will play more on the safe side.

Ooop, sorry Noc. I'd already posted this for you.

https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=45370&find=unread

I'll shut that thread down.

While your MCC is in retreat, you need to capture more than half the objectives before it will turn back around and re-enter the fight.

That means you HAVE to take and hold the objectives, and if you can't you lose faster. But it should take a couple of minutes for the MCC to back off far enough to trigger the defeat state, so there's a decent amount of time to turn things around.

I see the MCC retreat as a way to stay in the game, not necessarily to win it. Taking more than half of the objectives needs you to be able to be capable of winning.

I'd suggest the MCC retreat stops as soon as you start hacking an objective. This means that the losing team can easily keep the match going if they want to; its not that difficult to at least start a hack, unless you are totally, totally dominated.

But then you would have the tactically superior teams just not cap the final one in order to keep the killing going. Trust me, that would happen. There would be no way to stop the farming. Unless you can come up with a way to keep the system from being gamed, -1

When the MCC is in retreat, it doesn't seem logical that it would turn around unless there's a good chance of the fight tipping back in your favour.

If you're getting pummeled by 3 heavy weapons for long enough to decide "right, I'm out" it's going to take more than just a minor reduction in threat to bring you back - you need to see a REAL hope for the battle.

My suggestion gives you a CHANCE to turn the fight around, but doesn't just hand you a free pass to extend an obvious losing battle.

When the MCC is in retreat, it doesn't seem logical that it would turn around unless there's a good chance of the fight tipping back in your favour.

Just because you have none of the objectives doesn't necessarily mean you're always losing in that scenario. I've seen several games where the other team manages to break out of a redline camp and cap everything, but nobody cares because their MCC has 2 bars of health left and the team that just lost all the objectives still has half shields and they're just waiting for their MCC to kill off the other one.

I'm in favor of a hack attempt resetting the timer. No way in hell should it require that you cap more than half the objectives to stop.

How about if the losing team can vote on it? 'All in favour of running away say "Aye".'

I could see Eve being able to have like a right click on the planet, evacuate MCC option but there would be a good 20 minutes count down...

and it would only be for like a losing side and you would have to have some wierd contact connection to the corp/ team on it...


IDK but 60 seconds inst enough for someone to recapture an objective.

can you run to an objective in 60 seconds if your redlined... you better be damn good at this game if you can..

There is a forum that discusses this issue and I think it provides a perfect solution. Here's the link:

https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=50015

BS. Just play the Kitten game already. What is with this constant whining about driving the team into the Red and now its too boring.

Drop the tanks.
Don't push them into the Red.
Exit the Battle.
Have a squad defend a letter objective.
Now defend two objectives.
Try three on a four or five objective map.
Only play Corp battles and use whatever rules you want to there.
Only play with one hand.

Even if you drive them into the Red how much longer does it take to finish them off? Not long with all the Null Cannons tearing their MCC apart.

A failure of imagination seems to be the one constant on these forums.

So if I want to have fun start tieing my hands behind my back? The redline is a problem. Hopeless games that you have to babysit the blues are a problem. Getting in a match that is already lost is a problem. I'm glad you're able to consistently find fun matches. The majority of my matches though are instant redlines followed by 15 minutes of picking off snipers. It's just not worth playing but you can't leave if you have assets on the field or want your SP.

Erm, I mean tactical retreat. If all points are red, the MCC starts a 60 second countdown. If no points are hacked or converted, the MCC warps out. With this change comes removal of the redline. If you get pushed back, it's over. Try again another day.

Corp battles can just remove the redline and let corps decide if they want to keep throwing money around or not. NPC's will play more on the safe side.

There is a forum that discusses this issue and I think it provides a perfect solution. Here's the link:

https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=50015

Erm, I mean tactical retreat. If all points are red, the MCC starts a 60 second countdown. If no points are hacked or converted, the MCC warps out. With this change comes removal of the redline. If you get pushed back, it's over. Try again another day.

Corp battles can just remove the redline and let corps decide if they want to keep throwing money around or not. NPC's will play more on the safe side.

Lol, no worries. Sometimes I miss things If I had seen that thread I would have just kept it going strong.

Furthermore, gaming the system means you have to cover at least 3 spawns (the two default and the "gamed" objective). While it is still possible, it would be a lot harder than the current system.

The OP as a suggestion for a new game mode +1 with a bullet.
The OP as a replacement for the current skirmish -1 don't damage game diversity and player choice.

Cross

Since it seems we're reiterating things ^

Sorry, OP.

A game like Battlefield has a match timer when objectives are captured, because there is no MCC there to blow. You hold objectives, and that's it.

The skirmish is just fine.
You've successfully pushed the enemy out, now successfully defend, until the MCC blows. If the enemy has given up, that's not a broken game mechanic, that's a tactical decision. Remember, players are going to cut their losses if they're smart.

Groups might leave a match, and allow players that can put up more of a fight, into the match. There has to be time to allow for that.
Skirmish isn't too bad, as it currently stands, because it still allows for victory by clone out.

I just got out of a match, where the opposing team held all objectives. I sniped to my heart's content as they ran out in the open trying to camp the redline, instead of camping an objective like they should have. We ended up cloning them by a difference of 30.

Skirmish, as it currently stands, permits foolish hotheads to lose their cool, and throw the match, just like in the one I just mentioned. I find this to be a good thing.

I couldn't ask for a more balanced game mode.

A victory timer of some sort would prevent this. So again, sorry OP. I understand your frustration, but I disagree with your point and intension.

EDIT:
As Cross recommended, a separate game mode is where this belongs.
Probably, like the single null-cannon game mode we had. Perhaps let the null cannon fire a mega shot if you hold the cannon for 3 normal shots.

Man, I've suggested this in a couple threads and I was shouted down every time. Screw you guys.

Point is, this is a good idea. I support it.

Sniping so many people from the redline as to clone them sounds like a boring match from both sides. Furthermore, why would the NPCs let the MCC sit there and die if the battle is wholly lost? This isn't about a finite length on the match (although that is already there) so much as it is ending the battle when the fight is over.

Erm, I mean tactical retreat. If all points are red, the MCC starts a 60 second countdown. If no points are hacked or converted, the MCC warps out. With this change comes removal of the redline. If you get pushed back, it's over. Try again another day.

Corp battles can just remove the redline and let corps decide if they want to keep throwing money around or not. NPC's will play more on the safe side.

Can we keep hitting this thread with the nanite injector until someone headshots it?

It's already a zombie, let it die in peace and spawn in a new fit better adapted to the current battlefield conditions.

I'd love to. What's changed?

Has redlining been solved?
Is it easier to get back into the game when redlined?
Is being redlined more fun (for either side)?

I understand what you're saying Cross, but nothing you've mentioned is new and I was responding to your "better adapted to the current battlefield conditions" point. I guess we'd just stretched the metaphor too far :-)

In response to your "not a solution to [..] those problems" point, I disagree. I think it is perfectly valid for matches to be uneven, and I think it is in both side's best interests to end the match quickly when that is the case.

We don't need to prevent redlining, it is just an indication that one side has effectively "won".
Ending an uneven game creates more possibilities because those involved will start new games, probably more even ones.
Being completely outclassed by the opposition is never going to be fun, but it is inevitable. Keep the "not fun" short.
Diminishing end-of-match rewards is countered by the fact that players will simply move on to the next game quicker and get rewards from that; there's also no reason the redlining team can't get a bonus.

As for allowing the losing team to get back into the game, you are assuming they want to. A lot of them won't. If enough of them do want to fight it out, all they need to do (if this was implemented the way I think it should be done) is *start* a hack on any objective. That's not that hard, and if they can't manage it then my guess is they aren't really trying anyway. The slaughter rule is a way for both sides to agree to end the match quickly.

No one is saying that this is a solution to all the problems or shortcomings of Dust 514, just a way to improve a situation that is inevitable in all competitive games/sports.

If you want other threads to suggest other potential solutions to the problems you see, feel free. I suspect you've already posted a few.

I have, on more than one occasion, turned a redline game into a victory while running solo, it's even easier to do with a squad.

There is a forum that discusses this issue and I think it provides a perfect solution. Here's the link:

https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=50015

Erm, I mean tactical retreat. If all points are red, the MCC starts a 60 second countdown. If no points are hacked or converted, the MCC warps out. With this change comes removal of the redline. If you get pushed back, it's over. Try again another day.

Corp battles can just remove the redline and let corps decide if they want to keep throwing money around or not. NPC's will play more on the safe side.