Pages: 1 2 [3] :: one page |
|
Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 0 post(s) |
Tony Calif
Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS.
2002
|
Posted - 2012.10.30 02:51:00 -
[61] - Quote
If you say armour tanks aren't terrible this build you don't have a clue on how to fit a shield tank |
BobThe843CakeMan
BurgezzE.T.F
132
|
Posted - 2012.10.30 09:55:00 -
[62] - Quote
Tony Calif wrote:If you say armour tanks aren't terrible this build you don't have a clue on how to fit a shield tank U will see my comrad. :) but for someone who hasn't invested in both wouldn't know the power of an armor tank now would he. Hope to see ur tank on the battle field once i get my 500,000 sp. best of luck :). |
Drommy Hood
Tritan-Industries Legacy Rising
242
|
Posted - 2012.10.30 10:33:00 -
[63] - Quote
BobThe843CakeMan wrote:Tony Calif wrote:If you say armour tanks aren't terrible this build you don't have a clue on how to fit a shield tank U will see my comrad. :) but for someone who hasn't invested in both wouldn't know the power of an armor tank now would he. Hope to see ur tank on the battle field once i get my 500,000 sp. best of luck :).
Armour is crap at the moment. It always was a struggle to kill shield tanks now its impossible if its half decently fit. I used to run madruger with launcher, 2 large armour reps and 3 eanp. Could toe to toe with shield tanks but I'd have to try and limit there constant damage by circling and hoping he'd miss a few shots. When they made alterations at the the end of the last patch to shields, it turned into an unlikely contest. I'd die every time, I couldn't tank damage fast enough even with the 2 reps, and the massive buffer tank on the shields would always outlast me.
Now I'm a scout. Gallente always get nerfed, caldari always get buffed, minimatar get nothing, amarr get lasers and to much armour. Welcome to new eden |
EnglishSnake
Zumari Force Projection Caldari State
1012
|
Posted - 2012.10.30 11:20:00 -
[64] - Quote
Armor tanks do suck
10plum or something like that has an armor tank with 10k hp on the armor alone, you know what happened? that got popped stupidly easy because he couldnt move fast enough to escape and my missiles cause damage to armor really well
Missiles are the flavour of the month and why? because of the community complaining about tanks and getting them nerfed
Look what changed - Railgun splash damage reduced so its not anti-infantry anymore but since ppl really dont field tanks as much ther is no need to skill up for em so you have a main turret which is useless, also for large railguns you need to train the small railguns upto lvl4
Turret movement speed - Railgun once again got hit badly with this, its quicker to move the tank than the turret, blaster quickest and missiles in the middle
Really with the railgun you might aswell take that off and put on a heavy with a forge gun since the forge gun can do everything better than the large railgun can do - forge gun can do anti-vehicle anti-infantry anti-dropship anti-sniper even
The resistance and DC getting nerfed, so tanks are more open to getting whacked so missiles again the best option because they have range, they dont have to get close but then again with SL being able to cross the whole map then bend around your cover to hit you thers no point, same with the forge gun which can snipe from across the damn map
Now ppl want the splash damage reduced on missiles, talk about deja vu tbh we had this with the railgun which is now strickly a anti vehicle weapon but missiles have explosive damage which effects an area and its a ******* missile lets not forget i mean would you complain if we had an RPG which had a 5m damage radius, essentially the missiles carry an explosive payload
Just say they do get nerfed, what then for missiles? are we trying to turn this into an infantry only game? are we trying to turn tanks into something useless?
Yall keep going on about missile splash damage but it doesnt always work tbh, ppl can hide behind a small hill and i can hit the front of that hill and the splash doesnt carry over that hill and hit the enemy, hes okay he can crouch behind that and be safe unless i get a direct hit, this is what forge and SL users currently use atm because they know they wont get hit but if you run out into the open or stand next to a wall and i kill you yall cry about splash damage i mean ffs id get the same result if i hit you with an RPG
|
Sylwester Dziewiecki
Doomheim
83
|
Posted - 2012.10.30 11:56:00 -
[65] - Quote
If you(tank drivers) have a option to replace small turret with module as heavy shield/armor transfer, scaning module, some jamming system, drone control unit or something like that and allow crew members to control it, would you consider to use it?
|
Adeptus Ezekiel
Bragian Order Amarr Empire
30
|
Posted - 2012.10.30 12:02:00 -
[66] - Quote
EnglishSnake wrote:Armor tanks do suck
10plum or something like that has an armor tank with 10k hp on the armor alone, you know what happened? that got popped stupidly easy because he couldnt move fast enough to escape and my missiles cause damage to armor really well
Missiles are the flavour of the month and why? because of the community complaining about tanks and getting them nerfed
Look what changed - Railgun splash damage reduced so its not anti-infantry anymore but since ppl really dont field tanks as much ther is no need to skill up for em so you have a main turret which is useless, also for large railguns you need to train the small railguns upto lvl4
Turret movement speed - Railgun once again got hit badly with this, its quicker to move the tank than the turret, blaster quickest and missiles in the middle
Really with the railgun you might aswell take that off and put on a heavy with a forge gun since the forge gun can do everything better than the large railgun can do - forge gun can do anti-vehicle anti-infantry anti-dropship anti-sniper even
The resistance and DC getting nerfed, so tanks are more open to getting whacked so missiles again the best option because they have range, they dont have to get close but then again with SL being able to cross the whole map then bend around your cover to hit you thers no point, same with the forge gun which can snipe from across the damn map
Now ppl want the splash damage reduced on missiles, talk about deja vu tbh we had this with the railgun which is now strickly a anti vehicle weapon but missiles have explosive damage which effects an area and its a ******* missile lets not forget i mean would you complain if we had an RPG which had a 5m damage radius, essentially the missiles carry an explosive payload
Just say they do get nerfed, what then for missiles? are we trying to turn this into an infantry only game? are we trying to turn tanks into something useless?
Yall keep going on about missile splash damage but it doesnt always work tbh, ppl can hide behind a small hill and i can hit the front of that hill and the splash doesnt carry over that hill and hit the enemy, hes okay he can crouch behind that and be safe unless i get a direct hit, this is what forge and SL users currently use atm because they know they wont get hit but if you run out into the open or stand next to a wall and i kill you yall cry about splash damage i mean ffs id get the same result if i hit you with an RPG
All so true about the differences between Rails and Missiles sadly. Rails have extremely limited application now, and even then its only the largest ones that are any use at all.
As for missiles, you found one example where they aren't 100% effective? Thats pretty much the definition of OP.
Everything doesn't need to be nerfed into oblivion (as rails basically have been), but balance is important.
As for real world examples, modern MBT turrets can fire either sabot discarding shot (lets say rail for the sake of argument) or guided missiles in some cases. Is the speed of turret traverse different? No.
I'm not completely sure what CCP hope to achieve with these somewhat arbitrary rules, but basically they are guiding DUST down the EVE path of missiles & shield > everything else.
Edit: Fixed quantities of weapon ammo at least on MBT's, with the ability to resupply at the appropriate places, might well go a long way to balancing this out. Its hard to imagine an HAV carrying the thousands of rounds that seem to get spammed in most battles. Same for LAVs/Dropships. |
Dark-Cloud666
Reckless Solutions
0
|
Posted - 2012.10.30 12:10:00 -
[67] - Quote
if nobody noticed last build when the tanks have beeing nerfed the base splash damage for large missile turrets has beeing reduced. A single missile does around 120HP splash damage so you need around 2-3 missiles to take out a normal infantry player. The direct impact is still the same. You guys demand to nerf the only effective anti personel weapon for vehicles. Small blasters and railguns are just crap cause they either do no damage or you need to be mega accurate with them. I cant wait for the crybabys when artillery with ~15m splash damage gets introduced. They either are going to be like a much bigger version off the mass driver or mortars with a insane high range and capable to shot from behind cover at any point of the map. i think there are allmost all weapons that have infantry counterparts like this: AR= blasters (because they basically shot the same ammo type and that is hot plasma over range) Swarms= missile launchers (simply because before swarms where nerfed their missiles are dumb fired effective against infantry) sniper rifle= railguns (i picked snipers cause of the same tech thats used for them instead of forgeguns) laser= laser turrets (the turrets are supposed to be a effective counter against any kind of shield vehicles i expect them to have similar behaviour like the infantry laser rifles. mass drivers = artillery (they will create a bloody mess on the whole battlefield and maybe be better compared to missiles) HMG's= autocanons (possible next solution to get rid of infantry and aerial vehicles)
Honestly i think we just need the new turrets for vehicles to make a balance in terms of armor vs shield. Well to get further into this lets see What each weapon is what kind of weapon type.
-Blasters/railguns= hybrid and so they are equally effective against shields and armor so no damage boost on neither off them but also no damage drop. ( i think they belong to gallante)
-missile launchers= explosive weapon and very effective against armor but gets a penalty against shields. (belongs to caldari)
-laser turrets= belong to amarr, why i get this conclusion? Simply of the fine artwork on the laser rifle. And they have a damage advantage against shields and build up more damage the further the weapon heats up
Artillery/Autocanons= They are explosive/ projectile weapons and their counterparts are from minmatar. Projectile weapons are only a little bit less effective against shields then against armor. Though artillery will be explosive and has a advantage against armor vehicles.
Now to look further into this when there are turrets that belong to each race then there will also be tanks from the other races. i honestly think that CCP will balance the current situation simply by adding other weapons to the market for vehicles.
Sorry for bad english/grammar. If you find mistakes you can keep them
(WTF? why are im logged in with my other char? Oh well im The Dark Cloud sorry for confusion) |
Ty 'SweetCheeks' Borg
Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS.
192
|
Posted - 2012.10.30 13:02:00 -
[68] - Quote
So from this thread, can we all agree that both vehicles and their counters are screwed up?.
I know this thread was about the large missile, but there's far more going on here tbh. Every single turret in the game needs rebalancing. If it doesn't happen we're gonna see a million and one of these threads and CCP will just ruin the large missile like they did the rail. Which will leave only the blaster and no doubt someone will start whining about that.
If they keep AV in it's current state tanks are gonna need their resistances back. Armour tanks will at least need a armour hardener to match shields, although the armour repper is still better at it's job than a shield booster imo.
I'd like to see swarms buffed against dropships and not lock on the land vehicles, but then add in a dumbfire variant for vehicles. You know like an actual RPG works. |
Sir Meode
Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS.
317
|
Posted - 2012.10.30 13:05:00 -
[69] - Quote
Sylwester Dziewiecki wrote:If you(tank drivers) have a option to replace small turret with module as heavy shield/armor transfer, scaning module, some jamming system, drone control unit or something like that and allow crew members to control it, would you consider to use it?
no |
Adeptus Ezekiel
Bragian Order Amarr Empire
30
|
Posted - 2012.10.30 13:05:00 -
[70] - Quote
Ty 'SweetCheeks' Borg wrote:So from this thread, can we all agree that both vehicles and their counters are screwed up?.
I know this thread was about the large missile, but there's far more going on here tbh. Every single turret in the game needs rebalancing. If it doesn't happen we're gonna see a million and one of these threads and CCP will just ruin the large missile like they did the rail. Which will leave only the blaster and no doubt someone will start whining about that.
If they keep AV in it's current state tanks are gonna need their resistances back. Armour tanks will at least need a armour hardener to match shields, although the armour repper is still better at it's job than a shield booster imo. .
A good summary of the whole problem. Vehicles/AV are totally out of whack in nearly every possible way at present. |
|
EnglishSnake
Zumari Force Projection Caldari State
1012
|
Posted - 2012.10.30 13:20:00 -
[71] - Quote
Ty 'SweetCheeks' Borg wrote:So from this thread, can we all agree that both vehicles and their counters are screwed up?.
I know this thread was about the large missile, but there's far more going on here tbh. Every single turret in the game needs rebalancing. If it doesn't happen we're gonna see a million and one of these threads and CCP will just ruin the large missile like they did the rail. Which will leave only the blaster and no doubt someone will start whining about that.
If they keep AV in it's current state tanks are gonna need their resistances back. Armour tanks will at least need a armour hardener to match shields, although the armour repper is still better at it's job than a shield booster imo.
I'd like to see swarms buffed against dropships and not lock on the land vehicles, but then add in a dumbfire variant for vehicles. You know like an actual RPG works.
Armor buffers and repper have always healed more mainly because with shield it can passivly recharge where as armor cannot so that why it does more for armor, plus yea active armor hardeners are needed
The SL idea i could roll with, with the dumb fire varient the missile fly straight and hit anything in its path and not fly around cover since its work like an RPG so it would stop the current SL problem for tanks
As for tanks it seem they want to basically make them super weak and useless against infantry but only good enough to fight other tanks, it will get to the point where no one will bother with them, even in this build ther is less than 10 tank drivers, if anything ther is less than 5 regular tank drivers and im the only one who fields a tank consistantly in every match on every map and rarely see anyone do the same
The tank needs its resistances back because armor needs it tbh, plus its another option because all im using are the active ones, DC needs to be made useful aswell
Turret wise tho they did go too far, changing the turret speeds for me is a no tbh plus we have yet to see the other turrets and tanks not too mention EWAR in general
|
Ty 'SweetCheeks' Borg
Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS.
192
|
Posted - 2012.10.30 13:28:00 -
[72] - Quote
Sir Meode wrote:Sylwester Dziewiecki wrote:If you(tank drivers) have a option to replace small turret with module as heavy shield/armor transfer, scaning module, some jamming system, drone control unit or something like that and allow crew members to control it, would you consider to use it?
no
I'd say yes tbh.
Removing the small turrets to give me more options is an awesome idea tbh. I like the idea of being an armoured Logi. I'm not so sure it should be gunner controlled however, it'd be a fairly boring job for a guy sat there the entire match not shooting anything.
That is, if that's what you are talking about. |
Luther Mandrix
Planetary Response Organisation Test Friends Please Ignore
53
|
Posted - 2012.10.30 13:28:00 -
[73] - Quote
Zekain Kade wrote:Here's why.
A Large blaster turret has short range, is meant to deal with infantry, or light vehicles.
A rail gun is for long range, but it does have it's own range cap. it is meant to take out heavy armor, but can't deal enough damage towards shield tanks to be very effective. it has a low rate of fire, and is very ineffective against infantry.
The large missile turret has infinite range, has a massive splash damage radius. It can deal massive damage to dominate both armor, and shield tanks, it can vaporize infantry, it's rate of fire is stupidly high. It can also act like a massive, long range shot gun from any range. it is also the ideal weapon for AA. Which probably means it'll even be able to out do the auto cannon once it's released.
large missile turrets are supposed to be the type of weapon that can do anything, but cannot excel at any of the specialized jobs the other turrets are built for, yet the large missile turret can do everything, and excel far beyond the jobs of any other turret type.
Why...? why is it like this? it's so stupid. there is no reason to spec into any other turret type.
if this was a game of rock, paper, scissors. The large missile turret would be the laser sword.
Right now the large missile turret is like the replication SL on steroids.
Heavy Forge players deal with missle turrents took 3 shots ,I had cover 2 shield extenders with Samson Armor
|
EnglishSnake
Zumari Force Projection Caldari State
1012
|
Posted - 2012.10.30 13:30:00 -
[74] - Quote
Adeptus Ezekiel wrote:EnglishSnake wrote:Armor tanks do suck
10plum or something like that has an armor tank with 10k hp on the armor alone, you know what happened? that got popped stupidly easy because he couldnt move fast enough to escape and my missiles cause damage to armor really well
Missiles are the flavour of the month and why? because of the community complaining about tanks and getting them nerfed
Look what changed - Railgun splash damage reduced so its not anti-infantry anymore but since ppl really dont field tanks as much ther is no need to skill up for em so you have a main turret which is useless, also for large railguns you need to train the small railguns upto lvl4
Turret movement speed - Railgun once again got hit badly with this, its quicker to move the tank than the turret, blaster quickest and missiles in the middle
Really with the railgun you might aswell take that off and put on a heavy with a forge gun since the forge gun can do everything better than the large railgun can do - forge gun can do anti-vehicle anti-infantry anti-dropship anti-sniper even
The resistance and DC getting nerfed, so tanks are more open to getting whacked so missiles again the best option because they have range, they dont have to get close but then again with SL being able to cross the whole map then bend around your cover to hit you thers no point, same with the forge gun which can snipe from across the damn map
Now ppl want the splash damage reduced on missiles, talk about deja vu tbh we had this with the railgun which is now strickly a anti vehicle weapon but missiles have explosive damage which effects an area and its a ******* missile lets not forget i mean would you complain if we had an RPG which had a 5m damage radius, essentially the missiles carry an explosive payload
Just say they do get nerfed, what then for missiles? are we trying to turn this into an infantry only game? are we trying to turn tanks into something useless?
Yall keep going on about missile splash damage but it doesnt always work tbh, ppl can hide behind a small hill and i can hit the front of that hill and the splash doesnt carry over that hill and hit the enemy, hes okay he can crouch behind that and be safe unless i get a direct hit, this is what forge and SL users currently use atm because they know they wont get hit but if you run out into the open or stand next to a wall and i kill you yall cry about splash damage i mean ffs id get the same result if i hit you with an RPG
All so true about the differences between Rails and Missiles sadly. Rails have extremely limited application now, and even then its only the largest ones that are any use at all. As for missiles, you found one example where they aren't 100% effective? Thats pretty much the definition of OP. Everything doesn't need to be nerfed into oblivion (as rails basically have been), but balance is important. As for real world examples, modern MBT turrets can fire either sabot discarding shot (lets say rail for the sake of argument) or guided missiles in some cases. Is the speed of turret traverse different? No. I'm not completely sure what CCP hope to achieve with these somewhat arbitrary rules, but basically they are guiding DUST down the EVE path of missiles & shield > everything else. Edit: Fixed quantities of weapon ammo at least on MBT's, with the ability to resupply at the appropriate places, might well go a long way to balancing this out. Its hard to imagine an HAV carrying the thousands of rounds that seem to get spammed in most battles. Same for LAVs/Dropships.
If they are OP they would work in all situations, tbh they dont they are good for short and medium combat and long distance is hit n miss because of missile flight time |
BobThe843CakeMan
BurgezzE.T.F
132
|
Posted - 2012.10.30 19:08:00 -
[75] - Quote
you say armor tanks suck and you have very valid reasons but at the same time you have weapons good against armor but none tht are effective against shield tanks laser turrets for tanks. When ever these come all the people wth shield tanks will say to nerf these due to high damage applications. Fact of the matter is all we have are hybrid turrets and missiles. None which are good against shield. Do you guys remember how bad missiles used to be. 120 damage per shot. Thts the next step if u keep this complaining for them to nerf it. And this is coming from an armor tank person. Just saying. |
Bhor Derri
Legion of Eden
95
|
Posted - 2012.11.01 12:16:00 -
[76] - Quote
Drommy Hood wrote:BobThe843CakeMan wrote:Tony Calif wrote:If you say armour tanks aren't terrible this build you don't have a clue on how to fit a shield tank U will see my comrad. :) but for someone who hasn't invested in both wouldn't know the power of an armor tank now would he. Hope to see ur tank on the battle field once i get my 500,000 sp. best of luck :). Armour is crap at the moment. It always was a struggle to kill shield tanks now its impossible if its half decently fit. I used to run madruger with launcher, 2 large armour reps and 3 eanp. Could toe to toe with shield tanks but I'd have to try and limit there constant damage by circling and hoping he'd miss a few shots. When they made alterations at the the end of the last patch to shields, it turned into an unlikely contest. I'd die every time, I couldn't tank damage fast enough even with the 2 reps, and the massive buffer tank on the shields would always outlast me. Now I'm a scout. Gallente always get nerfed, caldari always get buffed, minimatar get nothing, amarr get lasers and to much armour. Welcome to new eden
I agree I've always gone with Gallente and it seems it gets owned by Caldari as if CCP wants Caldari as the only race in EVE .
I have hated rockets/missiles in all games I've played to this date: absurd damage ,long range ,splash damage ,high ROF.
And what's the problem with Gallente the only good thing they have now is Assault Rifles (which are blasters) and even that is OP(only GEK-38)
So if you are so bad at games use theese: Infantry: GEK-38 type-b assault armor Tank: Gunnlogi 3 Shield Extenders , 2 Shield Boosters , turret damage booster Dropship: Grimnses/Myron: Even though CCP broke Gallente, their dropships do pack some punch. 2 SE 2 Armor Plates or 3 SE 1 Armor plate with cycled or fragmented small missile launchers.
I know that balancing things is hard without braking other things (Look at what happened to BF3) and all this whining may not help but this needs fixing or in a year or so you'll get Gunnlogi , Assault Rifles , Forges , SML Lavs and Spawn Campers littering the battlefield.
Hope this gets fixed soon CCP |
|
|
|
Pages: 1 2 [3] :: one page |
First page | Previous page | Next page | Last page |