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HowDidThatTaste
Imperfects Negative-Feedback
2242
|
Posted - 2012.10.06 04:38:00 -
[31] - Quote
xprotoman23 wrote:strafing is the equivalent of "dog fighting" on the ground.
Yea I picture a Chihuahua bouncing around a poodle. |
Fivetimes Infinity
Immobile Infantry
1086
|
Posted - 2012.10.06 04:39:00 -
[32] - Quote
GIZMO2606 wrote:Now equipment doesn't decide a fight? Tell that to my Assault A Series, GEK Assault Rifle, Complex Damage Mods and Armor Rep. I'm able to drop players with no problem doesn't matter if it's a Heavy, Scout, Assault. Without strafing unnerfed, it makes the game have a lack feature in the gun game area.
So aiming, positioning, team work, and using cover don't contribute at all? I guess if you ever meet someone with the exact same gear as you, the fight always ends in both of you dying simultaneously? I understand that you prefer faster strafing, but you need to understand that making up bullshit like what you wrote there doesn't help your side of the discussion. Everyone knows you're full of **** in asserting that you will always win a fight against someone with inferior gear than you have, because we've actually played Dust. |
The-Truth
Zumari Force Projection Caldari State
3
|
Posted - 2012.10.06 04:41:00 -
[33] - Quote
How to put this.... by nerfing the strafing speed, it allows players with not so great aim, to keep a lock on their targets more easily... because we aren't movning side to side as fast... this makes the game easier for the common rabble.. which right now isn't necessarily a bad thing as the game is still in beta and getting more people to enjoy the game is key to it's future success... now for the veteran gamers, and the people that aren't scrubs, this nerf sucks for us as it apretty much forces us to to play straight up and gives the scrubs a better chance to kill us.... Personally I'm ok with the nerf for right now, as long as they continue to tweak it to find a balance that the veteran players are ok with, and still allows the scrubs to be semi competitive... |
xprotoman23
Internal Error. Negative-Feedback
1452
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Posted - 2012.10.06 04:43:00 -
[34] - Quote
Vermaak Doe wrote:xprotoman23 wrote:strafing is the equivalent of "dog fighting" on the ground. I call bs on that
Who stands like an idiot while in a gun fight? Of course people are going to move around as an effort to break somebody else's aim. |
Icedslayer
SVER True Blood Unclaimed.
42
|
Posted - 2012.10.06 04:44:00 -
[35] - Quote
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote:+1 A scout strafes just as slow as a heavy, and strafe speed is basically the only defense that the scout had in a gun fight, and now its gone. This isn't just a preference issue, its also a balance issue (poor scouts).
Your completely right that's our primary defense, seeing how a few assault rifle bullets drops our shields and a few more finishes us off. If the hit detection is fixed then put the strafe speed back, last build people in heavies were a joke cause they couldn't hit the scout, so they fix the HD and **** our primary defense and now whose telling us to get good, pathetic.
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KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf
Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS.
3064
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Posted - 2012.10.06 04:44:00 -
[36] - Quote
Vermaak Doe wrote:Poor scouts? Oh let's pitty those formerly intangible fairies that hopped around all day and night, that's exactly what they need right now
They could not be hit because of the hit detection. Hit detection is fixed now, so if your aiming skills are better than their evasion skills, then you should be fine. The scout trades defense for speed. If they can't use their speed in battle, then they have nothing. It is a balance issue. |
Vermaak Doe
SVER True Blood Unclaimed.
385
|
Posted - 2012.10.06 04:46:00 -
[37] - Quote
xprotoman23 wrote:Vermaak Doe wrote:xprotoman23 wrote:strafing is the equivalent of "dog fighting" on the ground. I call bs on that Who stands like an idiot while in a gun fight? Of course people are going to move around as an effort to break somebody else's aim.
Cover, we have tons of it |
Vermaak Doe
SVER True Blood Unclaimed.
385
|
Posted - 2012.10.06 04:47:00 -
[38] - Quote
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote:Vermaak Doe wrote:Poor scouts? Oh let's pitty those formerly intangible fairies that hopped around all day and night, that's exactly what they need right now They could not be hit because of the hit detection. Hit detection is fixed now, so if your aiming skills are better than their evasion skills, then you should be fine. The scout trades defense for speed. If they can't use their speed in battle, then they have nothing. It is a balance issue. Speed and a smaller hitbox |
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf
Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS.
3064
|
Posted - 2012.10.06 04:49:00 -
[39] - Quote
Vermaak Doe wrote:KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote:Vermaak Doe wrote:Poor scouts? Oh let's pitty those formerly intangible fairies that hopped around all day and night, that's exactly what they need right now They could not be hit because of the hit detection. Hit detection is fixed now, so if your aiming skills are better than their evasion skills, then you should be fine. The scout trades defense for speed. If they can't use their speed in battle, then they have nothing. It is a balance issue. Speed and a smaller hitbox If they can't use the speed in a gun fight (strafing), then they have nothing. A smaller hitbox doesn't amount to anything if you're almost standing still. |
HowDidThatTaste
Imperfects Negative-Feedback
2242
|
Posted - 2012.10.06 04:50:00 -
[40] - Quote
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote:Vermaak Doe wrote:Poor scouts? Oh let's pitty those formerly intangible fairies that hopped around all day and night, that's exactly what they need right now They could not be hit because of the hit detection. Hit detection is fixed now, so if your aiming skills are better than their evasion skills, then you should be fine. The scout trades defense for speed. If they can't use their speed in battle, then they have nothing. It is a balance issue.
But a scout typically isn't designed to engage the enemy head on. They are to run fast behind enemy lines and drop links and scout enemy positions. And they can also flip objectives.
There survivability is the opposite of the heavy which is speed. They should run from fights not into them. A heavy is supposed to tank some shots cause we all know he's not running anywhere.
The suits are supposed to have purpose in a larger group. The way we are playing now everyone wants there suit choice to be thebest. But each has a role to play. |
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KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf
Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS.
3064
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Posted - 2012.10.06 04:56:00 -
[41] - Quote
HowDidThatTaste wrote:I believe the slower straife speed is just what this game needed. Playing a heavy we have no straife speed so we adapted by using cover. This is how it should be makes it much more tactile than running straight at someone and expecting your dance moves to be the deciding factor.
This makes your aiming skills much more important. And you already have auto aim available. So I really don't get this complaint.
Get good!
Tactical means relating to tactics, and tactics is whatever set of available actions you do to maximize a desired result. This means if stafing was an available action, then it would be tactical. Tactical =/= realistic. I hate it when people just throw the word "tactical" around. |
Vermaak Doe
SVER True Blood Unclaimed.
385
|
Posted - 2012.10.06 04:57:00 -
[42] - Quote
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote:Vermaak Doe wrote:KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote:Vermaak Doe wrote:Poor scouts? Oh let's pitty those formerly intangible fairies that hopped around all day and night, that's exactly what they need right now They could not be hit because of the hit detection. Hit detection is fixed now, so if your aiming skills are better than their evasion skills, then you should be fine. The scout trades defense for speed. If they can't use their speed in battle, then they have nothing. It is a balance issue. Speed and a smaller hitbox If they can't use the speed in a gun fight (strafing), then they have nothing. A smaller hitbox doesn't amount to anything if you're almost standing still.
And why would anyone choose an open space to strafe in over cover? The speed isn't meant for them to run though enemy lines, but to have a chance of escaping confrontation |
xprotoman23
Internal Error. Negative-Feedback
1452
|
Posted - 2012.10.06 04:57:00 -
[43] - Quote
Vermaak Doe wrote:xprotoman23 wrote:Vermaak Doe wrote:xprotoman23 wrote:strafing is the equivalent of "dog fighting" on the ground. I call bs on that Who stands like an idiot while in a gun fight? Of course people are going to move around as an effort to break somebody else's aim. Cover, we have tons of it
what's the point in using cover when you have regenerating shields. |
GIZMO2606
Pink Fluffy Bounty Hunterz RISE of LEGION
293
|
Posted - 2012.10.06 05:01:00 -
[44] - Quote
Fivetimes Infinity wrote:GIZMO2606 wrote:Now equipment doesn't decide a fight? Tell that to my Assault A Series, GEK Assault Rifle, Complex Damage Mods and Armor Rep. I'm able to drop players with no problem doesn't matter if it's a Heavy, Scout, Assault. Without strafing unnerfed, it makes the game have a lack feature in the gun game area. So aiming, positioning, team work, and using cover don't contribute at all? I guess if you ever meet someone with the exact same gear as you, the fight always ends in both of you dying simultaneously? I understand that you prefer faster strafing, but you need to understand that making up bullshit like what you wrote there doesn't help your side of the discussion. Everyone knows you're full of **** in asserting that you will always win a fight against someone with inferior gear than you have, because we've actually played Dust.
No gun game wins gun fights but this game is lacking a major feature that add gun game, strafing. I'm not going to lie, I've been killed in my advance loadout a good amount of time. You can tell those that have good gun game and those that lack it. Sadly, a lot of players lack gun game in this game. Those with good gun game can take out anyone in any gear but if you give them advance gear, they'll wreck you in game. Strafing adds to the gun game factor and the survivability factor also. Again though, those that wanted to have a nerf on strafing lack the gun game and needed a Dev to hold their hand. |
Icedslayer
SVER True Blood Unclaimed.
42
|
Posted - 2012.10.06 05:02:00 -
[45] - Quote
Vermaak Doe wrote:KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote:Vermaak Doe wrote:Poor scouts? Oh let's pitty those formerly intangible fairies that hopped around all day and night, that's exactly what they need right now They could not be hit because of the hit detection. Hit detection is fixed now, so if your aiming skills are better than their evasion skills, then you should be fine. The scout trades defense for speed. If they can't use their speed in battle, then they have nothing. It is a balance issue. Speed and a smaller hitbox
Still its a balancing issue
-Assault has all round performance with decent run speed -Logi same for the most part but with more support slots -Heavy can take full clips and laugh it off and has horrible run speed
Scout has **** all for armor and shields 100 shields and 90 armor but our advantage is our speed
If i wanted to play Assault like everyone else i would, but what would be the point of the scout then?
And why would you care if they brought it back, as long as your aim is good, you could still drop me with a few bullets anyways. or should i say precision strike me
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HowDidThatTaste
Imperfects Negative-Feedback
2242
|
Posted - 2012.10.06 05:02:00 -
[46] - Quote
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote:HowDidThatTaste wrote:I believe the slower straife speed is just what this game needed. Playing a heavy we have no straife speed so we adapted by using cover. This is how it should be makes it much more tactile than running straight at someone and expecting your dance moves to be the deciding factor.
This makes your aiming skills much more important. And you already have auto aim available. So I really don't get this complaint.
Get good! Tactical means relating to tactics, and tactics is whatever set of available actions you do to maximize a desired result. This means if stafing was an available action, then it would be tactical. Tactical =/= realistic. I hate it when people just throw the word "tactical" around.
a : of or relating to tactics: as (1) : of or relating to small-scale actions serving a larger purpose (2) : made or carried out with only a limited or immediate end in view |
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf
Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS.
3064
|
Posted - 2012.10.06 05:06:00 -
[47] - Quote
HowDidThatTaste wrote:KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote:HowDidThatTaste wrote:I believe the slower straife speed is just what this game needed. Playing a heavy we have no straife speed so we adapted by using cover. This is how it should be makes it much more tactile than running straight at someone and expecting your dance moves to be the deciding factor.
This makes your aiming skills much more important. And you already have auto aim available. So I really don't get this complaint.
Get good! Tactical means relating to tactics, and tactics is whatever set of available actions you do to maximize a desired result. This means if stafing was an available action, then it would be tactical. Tactical =/= realistic. I hate it when people just throw the word "tactical" around. a : of or relating to tactics: as (1) : of or relating to small-scale actions serving a larger purpose (2) : made or carried out with only a limited or immediate end in view
The end of which is winning. Anything is tactical if its something that contributes to the overall end or larger purpose (winning). If strafing was still an option, it would be tactical because it would help contribute to victory. Nothing about the definition of tactical favors strafing over cover. |
Vermaak Doe
SVER True Blood Unclaimed.
385
|
Posted - 2012.10.06 05:11:00 -
[48] - Quote
xprotoman23 wrote:Vermaak Doe wrote:xprotoman23 wrote:Vermaak Doe wrote:xprotoman23 wrote:strafing is the equivalent of "dog fighting" on the ground. I call bs on that Who stands like an idiot while in a gun fight? Of course people are going to move around as an effort to break somebody else's aim. Cover, we have tons of it what's the point in using cover when you have regenerating shields. Get shot, go into cover, regen shields or are you too stupid to understand simple methods of avoiding death? |
Icedslayer
SVER True Blood Unclaimed.
42
|
Posted - 2012.10.06 05:13:00 -
[49] - Quote
HowDidThatTaste wrote:KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote:HowDidThatTaste wrote:I believe the slower straife speed is just what this game needed. Playing a heavy we have no straife speed so we adapted by using cover. This is how it should be makes it much more tactile than running straight at someone and expecting your dance moves to be the deciding factor.
This makes your aiming skills much more important. And you already have auto aim available. So I really don't get this complaint.
Get good! Tactical means relating to tactics, and tactics is whatever set of available actions you do to maximize a desired result. This means if stafing was an available action, then it would be tactical. Tactical =/= realistic. I hate it when people just throw the word "tactical" around. a : of or relating to tactics: as (1) : of or relating to small-scale actions serving a larger purpose (2) : made or carried out with only a limited or immediate end in view
Why you so scared of them bringing strafing back? Your tactic is sitting in a suit that has over 1000 hp and wielding a HMG my tactic is running through and dropping up links behind your lines, so when i come across you you should drop me easily without my strafing but with it i give you a run for your money. Either way skill should conquer all. |
Vermaak Doe
SVER True Blood Unclaimed.
385
|
Posted - 2012.10.06 05:15:00 -
[50] - Quote
Icedslayer wrote:Vermaak Doe wrote:KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote:Vermaak Doe wrote:Poor scouts? Oh let's pitty those formerly intangible fairies that hopped around all day and night, that's exactly what they need right now They could not be hit because of the hit detection. Hit detection is fixed now, so if your aiming skills are better than their evasion skills, then you should be fine. The scout trades defense for speed. If they can't use their speed in battle, then they have nothing. It is a balance issue. Speed and a smaller hitbox Still its a balancing issue -Assault has all round performance with decent run speed -Logi same for the most part but with more support slots -Heavy can take full clips and laugh it off and has horrible run speed Scout has **** all for armor and shields 100 shields and 90 armor but our advantage is our speed If i wanted to play Assault like everyone else i would, but what would be the point of the scout then? And why would you care if they brought it back, as long as your aim is good, you could still drop me with a few bullets anyways. or should i say precision strike me
I call bs once again on the heavy assumption
Small hitbox = less sprayed rounds going into it which means it is harder to spray and pray at than any other suit
Since you gun game is so good, why do you need to waste time prancing when your fire could be more accurate from a still position? |
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Zekain Kade
BetaMax.
931
|
Posted - 2012.10.06 05:25:00 -
[51] - Quote
Vermaak Doe wrote:Icedslayer wrote:Vermaak Doe wrote:KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote:Vermaak Doe wrote:Poor scouts? Oh let's pitty those formerly intangible fairies that hopped around all day and night, that's exactly what they need right now They could not be hit because of the hit detection. Hit detection is fixed now, so if your aiming skills are better than their evasion skills, then you should be fine. The scout trades defense for speed. If they can't use their speed in battle, then they have nothing. It is a balance issue. Speed and a smaller hitbox Still its a balancing issue -Assault has all round performance with decent run speed -Logi same for the most part but with more support slots -Heavy can take full clips and laugh it off and has horrible run speed Scout has **** all for armor and shields 100 shields and 90 armor but our advantage is our speed If i wanted to play Assault like everyone else i would, but what would be the point of the scout then? And why would you care if they brought it back, as long as your aim is good, you could still drop me with a few bullets anyways. or should i say precision strike me I call bs once again on the heavy assumption Small hitbox = less sprayed rounds going into it which means it is harder to spray and pray at than any other suit Since you gun game is so good, why do you need to waste time prancing when your fire could be more accurate from a still position? you''re only defending the nerf because you'ere bad, and now that it has been nerfed, you're actually able to DO something. You're the type pf player the Devs were holding the hands of.
Cover cannot save you entirely. |
Icedslayer
SVER True Blood Unclaimed.
42
|
Posted - 2012.10.06 05:27:00 -
[52] - Quote
Vermaak Doe wrote:Icedslayer wrote:Vermaak Doe wrote:KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote:Vermaak Doe wrote:Poor scouts? Oh let's pitty those formerly intangible fairies that hopped around all day and night, that's exactly what they need right now They could not be hit because of the hit detection. Hit detection is fixed now, so if your aiming skills are better than their evasion skills, then you should be fine. The scout trades defense for speed. If they can't use their speed in battle, then they have nothing. It is a balance issue. Speed and a smaller hitbox Still its a balancing issue -Assault has all round performance with decent run speed -Logi same for the most part but with more support slots -Heavy can take full clips and laugh it off and has horrible run speed Scout has **** all for armor and shields 100 shields and 90 armor but our advantage is our speed If i wanted to play Assault like everyone else i would, but what would be the point of the scout then? And why would you care if they brought it back, as long as your aim is good, you could still drop me with a few bullets anyways. or should i say precision strike me I call bs once again on the heavy assumption Small hitbox = less sprayed rounds going into it which means it is harder to spray and pray at than any other suit Since you gun game is so good, why do you need to waste time prancing when your fire could be more accurate from a still position?
You miss the whole point of the scout, SPEED IS YOUR WEAPON AND YOUR DEFENCE. And yes i could stand completely still and fire, and yes its would be more accurate, and on many ocassions i do that. but if i get fired upon, i have don't have the luxury of having massive shield or armor to soak up the damage so i drop easily, compared to most Assaults which can rock up to 300 shield and almost 200 armor. |
HowDidThatTaste
Imperfects Negative-Feedback
2242
|
Posted - 2012.10.06 05:38:00 -
[53] - Quote
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote:HowDidThatTaste wrote:KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote:HowDidThatTaste wrote:I believe the slower straife speed is just what this game needed. Playing a heavy we have no straife speed so we adapted by using cover. This is how it should be makes it much more tactile than running straight at someone and expecting your dance moves to be the deciding factor.
This makes your aiming skills much more important. And you already have auto aim available. So I really don't get this complaint.
Get good! Tactical means relating to tactics, and tactics is whatever set of available actions you do to maximize a desired result. This means if stafing was an available action, then it would be tactical. Tactical =/= realistic. I hate it when people just throw the word "tactical" around. a : of or relating to tactics: as (1) : of or relating to small-scale actions serving a larger purpose (2) : made or carried out with only a limited or immediate end in view The end of which is winning. Anything is tactical if its something that contributes to the overall end or larger purpose (winning). If strafing was still an option, it would be tactical because it would help contribute to victory. Nothing about the definition of tactical favors strafing over cover.
We are both right. Just depend on if you have it or not.
Honestly I don't care. My gun game finds all targets. I just think the dancing is silly |
Fivetimes Infinity
Immobile Infantry
1086
|
Posted - 2012.10.06 05:59:00 -
[54] - Quote
GIZMO2606 wrote:Again though, those that wanted to have a nerf on strafing lack the gun game and needed a Dev to hold their hand.
You don't have any idea what you're talking about. |
Vermaak Doe
SVER True Blood Unclaimed.
385
|
Posted - 2012.10.06 06:06:00 -
[55] - Quote
Where does it say i care about kd? I implied he did since he bragged about being high on the leaderboard and he implied his status was.due to kills.
Simple deduction |
GIZMO2606
Pink Fluffy Bounty Hunterz RISE of LEGION
293
|
Posted - 2012.10.06 06:11:00 -
[56] - Quote
Fivetimes Infinity wrote:GIZMO2606 wrote:Again though, those that wanted to have a nerf on strafing lack the gun game and needed a Dev to hold their hand. You don't have any idea what you're talking about.
You must be one of those people that QQ'd about strafing players so you cried to the Devs right? Those with gun game can strafe and shoot at the same time and counter strafe and shoot at the same time. Those that lack skill in FPS games need someone or something to give them a edge. With that said, the nerf was highly unneeded and anyone that is good at FPS games know that. |
SILENTSAM 69
Pro Hic Immortalis RISE of LEGION
421
|
Posted - 2012.10.06 06:15:00 -
[57] - Quote
The OP gets it. |
APOPHIS Xxx
The Sound Of Freedom Renegade Alliance
3
|
Posted - 2012.10.06 06:44:00 -
[58] - Quote
My Dust playing time has significantly reduced due to this ridiculous NERF! Might as well play EVE where there's no strafing! Just orbit the fool and depend on your shield and armor HP's. Oh crap i'm taking damage!! Gotta warp away! Now i'm goiing to hide by this asteroid for a bit then go back and orbit some more! That's so skillful! LOL Hey!! Let's all line up in rows and don't shoot until we see the whites of their eyes!! Ready!! Aim!! Fire!! Reload!! You know!! Like how they fought back in the colonial days!! LOL |
Jax GG
Osmon Surveillance Caldari State
84
|
Posted - 2012.10.06 07:32:00 -
[59] - Quote
Zekain Kade wrote:............ if you think I'm wrong, then you're delusional.
Delusional, ret*arded, and so on and so on, I can not understand how you get so many 'likes' when you insist on calling people names.
Heaven forbid that someone disagrees with you.
Zekain Kade wrote:Deciding NOT to go somewhere because you're too slow to get there is not a tactical decision. Deciding not to go somewhere because you're too slow to get there is a game breaking limit.
......... of course it's a tactical decision. Any time any armed forces decide not to do something based on logistics it's a tactical decision.
And just for clarity, your ability to get somewhere is logistics.
I love posters like you, you play the 'not life like' card when you want and then play the 'please not life like' card another time.
If we left the design of games to the likes of you, we would have one rule for you when you are playing and one for the rest of us when you log off.
Regards (as always)
Jax |
mikegunnz
Pink Fluffy Bounty Hunterz RISE of LEGION
425
|
Posted - 2012.10.06 12:33:00 -
[60] - Quote
Zekain Kade wrote:It is a method of avoiding a sustained lock on by the player shooting you. You can't dodge bullets in this game because most of the weapons ARE hit scan. (they hit any surface you're aiming at instantly.) Some that aren't hit scan are the forge guns, swarms, mass drivers... basically anything that does not fire a bullet of some kind is projectile based.
It may look like they actually take time to across the battle field, but that's just an animation, the bullets ARE actually hitting what ever surface, or entity you're aiming at instantly.
Strafing required skill to be practiced effectively. Now... with player movement nerfed to ****, it has made this one small tactic that could change the outcome of a fight to a near worthless state.
Slow player movement DOES not encourage tactical warfare, it encourages camping, if you think I'm wrong, then you're delusional. Deciding NOT to go somewhere because you're too slow to get there is not a tactical decision.
Deciding not to go somewhere because you're too slow to get there is a game breaking limit.
CCP does not want equipment to be the largest deciding factor in this game to decide who wins what battles, yet with this nerf, they did just that. If you want to win, tank it out with the best gear, and out shoot the other turtle that's running at you. Who ever has the thickest shell wins, or has the biggest gun, or has the right weapon for the situation.
Now don't get me wrong, some of these factors should help decide who wins what battle. But no factor should decide who wins more then a player's skill. Even the most casual FPS games abide by this rule of thumb. Yes, even COD.
Bring back our strafe speed, give us our ability to actually play this game to our full ability.
+1 Scout got boned this build. Funny how CCP (like all developers) overcompensates when they try and balance things out. Scouts last build were nearly invincible. High strafe speed coupled with horrid hit detection=unstoppable. Instead of fixing Hit Detection alone (which would have fixed the problem), the ALSO nerfed the strafe speed.
Unintended consequence: Scout has NO counter to other suits' higher HP. Also, gun game is watered down to, who sees who first, and who has better gun and/or higher HP. |
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