DUST Search - Dancing Shotgun Fairies

mikegunnz wrote:

mcbob mcbob wrote:

Fivetimes Infinity wrote:

mcbob mcbob wrote:

One of the 2 things I mainly play as is a scout with a shotgun- if you attack us at range, we're screwed because we die from slight taps.

If only. I have shot scouts at range many, many times and the shot, despite being properly aimed generating a shield flash, does zero damage. The only way I can somewhat reliably kill a moving scout is if they're moving mostly away or toward me. If they're traversing, it's a crap shoot. So it's not just strafing in people's face. In fact, it isn't even a moving issue entirely. Many times I've shot enemy snipers who are in scout suits and they do not die. Guys who're not moving, who're just sitting there shooting, and they'll take repeated hits and no damage will be incurred.

Seriously, when hit detection gets fixed, all of you people using scout suits are in for a huge surprise. I don't think you realize just how big an advantage the broken hit detection gives you.

Sounds to me like you suck. Most of the time, unless I manage to catch someone by surprise, I either die or nearly die.

Actually, sounds like you suck. In the few times I put on a scout suit, I can go toe -to-toe with anybody. You just have to stay on the move. In CQC, with a shotty, I can go heads up against 2-3 ppl.

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 0 post(s)
Run you OVER 26	Posted - 2012.09.02 10:48:00 - [1] - Quote Side to side movement must be slowed down.
Mobius Wyvern BetaMax. 1216	Posted - 2012.09.02 10:50:00 - [2] - Quote Run you OVER wrote: Side to side movement must be slowed down. Scout hitbox needs fixing, and we're all already aware of this. You better be careful talking about movement nerfs, 'cause you'll get jumped on pretty damn quick.
Kyy Seiska Zumari Force Projection Caldari State 188	Posted - 2012.09.02 11:00:00 - [3] - Quote Mobius Wyvern wrote: Run you OVER wrote: Side to side movement must be slowed down. Scout hitbox needs fixing, and we're all already aware of this. You better be careful talking about movement nerfs, 'cause you'll get jumped on pretty damn quick. It's probably just the hit general detection problems and the movement speed, haven't had troubles with scouts when playing on European servers but on American ones I need to adjust my aim way in-front of them to hit, or just spray with SMG which often works fine too. Not many of them can take multiple hits from Duvolle tactical assault rifle. Higher movement speed the more you need to aim in the direction the target is moving.
miahus CrimeWave Syndicate 78	Posted - 2012.09.02 11:14:00 - [4] - Quote I always refer to them as ballerinas with shotguns. they totally spam movement/speed.
Run you OVER 26	Posted - 2012.09.02 11:28:00 - [5] - Quote The game play does not match the weapon destriptions. At 750RPM that is more than 10 rounds per second. No one is dodging bullets at less than 20 feet away.
miahus CrimeWave Syndicate 78	Posted - 2012.09.02 11:51:00 - [6] - Quote Neo from The matrix must have been wearing one of Dust 514's scout suits.
Evane Sa'edi Celtic Anarchy 62	Posted - 2012.09.02 12:23:00 - [7] - Quote miahus wrote: Neo from The matrix must have been wearing one of Dust 514's scout suits. if he was he would not of got hit, twice.
Icy Tiger 496	Posted - 2012.09.02 12:46:00 - [8] - Quote Scouts are supposed to be fast. Deal with it. Especially with how slow the game has gotten since 2 builds ago when movement and strafing speed was nerved hideously.
Vitriol18 Osmon Surveillance Caldari State 56	Posted - 2012.09.02 12:49:00 - [9] - Quote I was broke and started doing this with a free militia shotgun, its kinda odd, sometimes i can dance abuot a tiny little bit and no one can hit me, other times even rapid movements seem to have no effect, maybe its a latency issue, with some people seeing relativley smoove movement, and other seeing massive jerky jumps back and forth. Also using a shotgun point blank you really get to see the weird hit detection, even right next to someone i have to point waaay ahead of the target to score a hit
Patches The Hyena 204	Posted - 2012.09.02 13:41:00 - [10] - Quote The speed is fine. I just wish CCP didn't let Dust become another fps where bunny hopping is a viable means of dodging bullets.

Cpl Quartz 127	Posted - 2012.09.02 13:43:00 - [11] - Quote miahus wrote: Neo from The matrix must have been wearing one of Dust 514's scout suits. haha when tanks get nerfed this is what goons do next en mass although i have seen a lot of them weilding heavy machine guns, must have inside info or something. and i don't mean the general "you'll like what we are doing to them" quote.
BlacMage Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire 59	Posted - 2012.09.02 13:58:00 - [12] - Quote Patches The Hyena wrote: The speed is fine. I just wish CCP didn't let Dust become another fps where bunny hopping is a viable means of dodging bullets. Same here... Really was hoping that team movment and tactics would be more viable than loneman bunny hopping... Still have time to fix it and this is what Beta is for!
Mavado V Noriega SyNergy Gaming 2283	Posted - 2012.09.02 14:00:00 - [13] - Quote Run you OVER wrote: Side to side movement must be slowed down. get good strafing is fine the hit detection is the problem /thread
Run you OVER 26	Posted - 2012.09.02 14:21:00 - [14] - Quote If I spray an entire magazine at 750 RPM and hit nothing, it has nothing to do with hit detection. If someone is running up to you and you point a garden hose at them spraying water tell me they can dodge you and not get hit.
Omnipotent lilmamaj Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire 205	Posted - 2012.09.02 14:34:00 - [15] - Quote Hey scrub muffin, once hit detection is fixed, strafe speed will need to be raised.
Kengfa 138	Posted - 2012.09.02 14:42:00 - [16] - Quote Omnipotent lilmamaj wrote: Hey scrub muffin, once hit detection is fixed, strafe speed will need to be raised. LOL, no it won't. Strafing speed is absolutely terrible. They should slow it down or add a 40% chance that you'll fall over and temporarily not be able to shoot.
mikegunnz Pink Fluffy Bounty Hunterz RISE of LEGION 425	Posted - 2012.09.02 15:02:00 - [17] - Quote Kengfa wrote: Omnipotent lilmamaj wrote: Hey scrub muffin, once hit detection is fixed, strafe speed will need to be raised. LOL, no it won't. Strafing speed is absolutely terrible. They should slow it down or add a 40% chance that you'll fall over and temporarily not be able to shoot. Chalk up another dumb idea. Strafe speed is fine, this coming from someone who rarely uses scout. It's the hit detection that is bugged. Note: I've experimented with the shotty/scout combo, it IS pretty ridiculous. The only time it's not too effective is in the large maps that have really wide open areas. Small and even medium sized maps have enough CQC areas for the scout/shotty combo to dominate.
Elijah Revan 88	Posted - 2012.09.02 15:48:00 - [18] - Quote Run you OVER wrote: Side to side movement must be slowed down. AGREED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Aviva Cohen Seituoda Taskforce Command Caldari State 9	Posted - 2012.09.02 15:56:00 - [19] - Quote I run an Assault Shotty build a good chunk of the time, and it destroys the Scout Shotty builds I run into most of the time. That said If i'm not running a shotty build I suffer pretty hard at the hands of said scout. Admittedly I know how to bunny hop reasonably well, and I'm sure that accounts for a significant amount of my destructive prowess in this context, as I notice people are not very good at accounting for that. The shotgun builds are brutal in tight maps, and really really weak in wide open maps. I think that's how it is supposed to be. Also - hitboxes in general need to be worked on. It seems a little better than when I started but not much. I don't think it has anything to do with strafing speed though. I get ganked quite frequently, and I'm a decent strafer. Learn to shoot.
Ranger SnakeBlood 38	Posted - 2012.09.02 16:03:00 - [20] - Quote Oh the good old days of the nerf straffing forums is back i agree side to side and backward movement should not equal foward movement my suggestion is somewhare in the 20 to 25% strafe and backward movement reduction for over 3 months we have said stuff like this and the other side has always said wait till after hit detection well its been 3 months and hit detection is not fixed and iam starting to believe after plenty of testing that not only is the strafing tactic over powered against pretty much all other play styles but also is not helping hit detection i have come to this conclusion after using strafe happy scout and playing as a strafe happy assualt to find its causing lag, drops in FPS and most likely a issue with hit detection, also as it stands now with hit detection in this state with lag and the strafing speed as it get good is not a valid counter as what you are saying is get good at abusing a broken system straffing and jumping should not be a life line when things go wrong for you when you get jumped you have already lost unless you are close to cover

Fivetimes Infinity Immobile Infantry 1086	Posted - 2012.09.02 16:07:00 - [21] - Quote The bottom line is that scout suits are remarkably hard to kill at close range, in large part due to the hit detection. But, if it's their speed which is exacerbating the hit detection issues, I'd be fine with it being toned down, even if only temporarily. Whatever the case, fighting scouts is annoying and needs to be fixed, either through hit detection improvements, speed reductions, or both.
DUST Fiend Immobile Infantry 1903	Posted - 2012.09.02 16:20:00 - [22] - Quote Hey guys, scouts should use their speed to their advantage. Um, can we nerf scout speed, they seem to be using it to their advantage. Kthxby. (hit detection needs fixing across the board. Don't like scouts? Cook grenades, use mass drivers, aim where they're about to land, fall back to cover of allies, engage them from a distance, etc etc. As a dedicated shotgun scout, all these things give me plenty of trouble)
Aviva Cohen Seituoda Taskforce Command Caldari State 9	Posted - 2012.09.02 16:29:00 - [23] - Quote I think what people are saying is: Fix the broken system. If you're going to lower strafe speeds, you need to fix hit boxes. Honestly I think you just need to fix hitboxes. The strafe speeds seem fine. As to the argument that strafing is causing lag, I've never experienced this phenomenon. I will pay attention over my next few games to try and gauge this, but I think that might be something connection specific. Again - I own scouts all the time. ALL THE TIME. They get me sometimes too, but when they do its either because : a) They genuinely out played me (bastards!). b) The hit detection was ****** c) I was already near dead from sniper shots, or a previous encounter. It's never been because they moved to fast for me to keep up. Honestly even the scouts in this game move slow enough for a decent FPS player to handle without too much trouble.
Beld Errmon Tal-Romon Legion Amarr Empire 479	Posted - 2012.09.02 16:31:00 - [24] - Quote if you learn to lag shoot you'll nail scouts to the wall, i do it all the time, if you don't know what lag shooting is, guess you were born in the 90s. poor guys think bed hair is a good style.
Zerlathon Algintal Core Gallente Federation 213	Posted - 2012.09.02 16:44:00 - [25] - Quote hang on, so let me get this straight... the scout is supposed to be fast, and have you ever considered the possibility that people have been investing SP into speed mods? Oh forgive me, the concept of skills that are outside those that you level are irrelevant, and the ones that are a counter to your general gameplay MUST be nerfed. Talk about scissors complaining about rock much?
mcbob mcbob 10	Posted - 2012.09.02 17:11:00 - [26] - Quote One of the 2 things I mainly play as is a scout with a shotgun- if you attack us at range, we're screwed because we die from slight taps.
Fivetimes Infinity Immobile Infantry 1086	Posted - 2012.09.02 17:21:00 - [27] - Quote mcbob mcbob wrote: One of the 2 things I mainly play as is a scout with a shotgun- if you attack us at range, we're screwed because we die from slight taps. If only. I have shot scouts at range many, many times and the shot, despite being properly aimed generating a shield flash, does zero damage. The only way I can somewhat reliably kill a moving scout is if they're moving mostly away or toward me. If they're traversing, it's a crap shoot. So it's not just strafing in people's face. In fact, it isn't even a moving issue entirely. Many times I've shot enemy snipers who are in scout suits and they do not die. Guys who're not moving, who're just sitting there shooting, and they'll take repeated hits and no damage will be incurred. Seriously, when hit detection gets fixed, all of you people using scout suits are in for a huge surprise. I don't think you realize just how big an advantage the broken hit detection gives you.
mcbob mcbob 10	Posted - 2012.09.02 17:23:00 - [28] - Quote Fivetimes Infinity wrote: mcbob mcbob wrote: One of the 2 things I mainly play as is a scout with a shotgun- if you attack us at range, we're screwed because we die from slight taps. If only. I have shot scouts at range many, many times and the shot, despite being properly aimed generating a shield flash, does zero damage. The only way I can somewhat reliably kill a moving scout is if they're moving mostly away or toward me. If they're traversing, it's a crap shoot. So it's not just strafing in people's face. In fact, it isn't even a moving issue entirely. Many times I've shot enemy snipers who are in scout suits and they do not die. Guys who're not moving, who're just sitting there shooting, and they'll take repeated hits and no damage will be incurred. Seriously, when hit detection gets fixed, all of you people using scout suits are in for a huge surprise. I don't think you realize just how big an advantage the broken hit detection gives you. Sounds to me like you suck. Most of the time, unless I manage to catch someone by surprise, I either die or nearly die.
mikegunnz Pink Fluffy Bounty Hunterz RISE of LEGION 425	Posted - 2012.09.02 17:35:00 - [29] - Quote mcbob mcbob wrote: Fivetimes Infinity wrote: mcbob mcbob wrote: One of the 2 things I mainly play as is a scout with a shotgun- if you attack us at range, we're screwed because we die from slight taps. If only. I have shot scouts at range many, many times and the shot, despite being properly aimed generating a shield flash, does zero damage. The only way I can somewhat reliably kill a moving scout is if they're moving mostly away or toward me. If they're traversing, it's a crap shoot. So it's not just strafing in people's face. In fact, it isn't even a moving issue entirely. Many times I've shot enemy snipers who are in scout suits and they do not die. Guys who're not moving, who're just sitting there shooting, and they'll take repeated hits and no damage will be incurred. Seriously, when hit detection gets fixed, all of you people using scout suits are in for a huge surprise. I don't think you realize just how big an advantage the broken hit detection gives you. Sounds to me like you suck. Most of the time, unless I manage to catch someone by surprise, I either die or nearly die. Actually, sounds like you suck. In the few times I put on a scout suit, I can go toe -to-toe with anybody. You just have to stay on the move. In CQC, with a shotty, I can go heads up against 2-3 ppl.
mcbob mcbob 10	Posted - 2012.09.02 18:01:00 - [30] - Quote mikegunnz wrote: mcbob mcbob wrote: Fivetimes Infinity wrote: mcbob mcbob wrote: One of the 2 things I mainly play as is a scout with a shotgun- if you attack us at range, we're screwed because we die from slight taps. If only. I have shot scouts at range many, many times and the shot, despite being properly aimed generating a shield flash, does zero damage. The only way I can somewhat reliably kill a moving scout is if they're moving mostly away or toward me. If they're traversing, it's a crap shoot. So it's not just strafing in people's face. In fact, it isn't even a moving issue entirely. Many times I've shot enemy snipers who are in scout suits and they do not die. Guys who're not moving, who're just sitting there shooting, and they'll take repeated hits and no damage will be incurred. Seriously, when hit detection gets fixed, all of you people using scout suits are in for a huge surprise. I don't think you realize just how big an advantage the broken hit detection gives you. Sounds to me like you suck. Most of the time, unless I manage to catch someone by surprise, I either die or nearly die. Actually, sounds like you suck. In the few times I put on a scout suit, I can go toe -to-toe with anybody. You just have to stay on the move. In CQC, with a shotty, I can go heads up against 2-3 ppl. Yes, if I sneak into CQC I'm fine, but when I don't get the jump on someone, I won't live to get that close.



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