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Mortedeamor
The Black Masquerade
2
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Posted - 2015.11.03 17:19:00 -
[1] - Quote
lr is ina perfect place in every way
on every level whatever u do will put it out of balance
even the mlt lr is currently deadly if used properly
it may not be easy to use but it doesnt need to be its an elegant tool and requires elegance to operate that is all
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deezy dabest
IMPERIAL SPECIAL FORCES GROUP
Evil Syndicate Alliance.
3
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Posted - 2015.11.03 18:35:00 -
[2] - Quote
Did I miss something?
Show there is a future #CCPSpeakOn514
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Adipem Nothi
Nos Nothi
17
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Posted - 2015.11.03 19:06:00 -
[3] - Quote
What about zoom level when ADS, Morte? Would it help too much (or hurt) if increased slightly?
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Mortedeamor
The Black Masquerade
2
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Posted - 2015.11.03 19:50:00 -
[4] - Quote
Adipem Nothi wrote:What about zoom level when ADS, Morte? Would it help too much (or hurt) if increased slightly?
i think it would hurt honestly it doesnt need any more zoom fidelity and more zoom makes it harder to use closer
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XxBlazikenxX
Ancient Exiles.
Bleeding Sun Conglomerate
3
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Posted - 2015.11.03 20:21:00 -
[5] - Quote
Why would we buff the laser rifle?
Amarr Loyalist
Amarr Commando Forever
Ancient Exiles. Member
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Mortedeamor
The Black Masquerade
2
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Posted - 2015.11.03 22:06:00 -
[6] - Quote
XxBlazikenxX wrote:Why would we buff the laser rifle?
it was brought up ina thread along with buffing scr and changing amar assault bonus i dont like the idea of making my favorite gun easier to use as
when its used with skill its actually ina really solid place
the reason lr isnt used as much isnt because there is anything wrong with the gun its range or even its damage
its just not easy to use it doesnt spray it has 0 tolerance for missing 0 kick and its 100% accurate which means if you cant aim you cant use this gun at all
nothing wrong with it ide like to keep the few skill based guns dust has
most everything in this game is a spray and pray gun very few guns actually require you to aim the ones that do normally also have really strong hipfire
bolt pistol ion pistol sc pistol
the only ones i know of that dont are lr and sr
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Forever ETC
Praetoriani Classiarii Templares
Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
1
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Posted - 2015.11.03 23:48:00 -
[7] - Quote
It is very unlikely that they will buff it anytime soon, hell after the discussion of a few months ago they said it wasn't too bad. But seeing as how they have already dealt with the weapons they were concerned with... If any buff does happen it will probably be clipsize.
AmarrFTW
"The Hero got his feelings hurt for 9 hp... "
Not For Sale- Sanders 2016
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XxBlazikenxX
Ancient Exiles.
Bleeding Sun Conglomerate
3
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Posted - 2015.11.04 01:35:00 -
[8] - Quote
Mortedeamor wrote:XxBlazikenxX wrote:Why would we buff the laser rifle? it was brought up ina thread along with buffing scr and changing amar assault bonus i dont like the idea of making my favorite gun easier to use as when its used with skill its actually ina really solid place the reason lr isnt used as much isnt because there is anything wrong with the gun its range or even its damage its just not easy to use it doesnt spray it has 0 tolerance for missing 0 kick and its 100% accurate which means if you cant aim you cant use this gun at all nothing wrong with it ide like to keep the few skill based guns dust has most everything in this game is a spray and pray gun very few guns actually require you to aim the ones that do normally also have really strong hipfire bolt pistol ion pistol sc pistol the only ones i know of that dont are lr and sr
Laser Rifle aiming is everything and the most crucial part of using it. What you said about the Scrambler is true in close range, but at long range it does require skill to use and precision aiming.
Amarr Loyalist
Amarr Commando Forever
Ancient Exiles. Member
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Mortedeamor
The Black Masquerade
2
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Posted - 2015.11.04 01:51:00 -
[9] - Quote
XxBlazikenxX wrote:Mortedeamor wrote:XxBlazikenxX wrote:Why would we buff the laser rifle? it was brought up ina thread along with buffing scr and changing amar assault bonus i dont like the idea of making my favorite gun easier to use as when its used with skill its actually ina really solid place the reason lr isnt used as much isnt because there is anything wrong with the gun its range or even its damage its just not easy to use it doesnt spray it has 0 tolerance for missing 0 kick and its 100% accurate which means if you cant aim you cant use this gun at all nothing wrong with it ide like to keep the few skill based guns dust has most everything in this game is a spray and pray gun very few guns actually require you to aim the ones that do normally also have really strong hipfire bolt pistol ion pistol sc pistol the only ones i know of that dont are lr and sr Laser Rifle aiming is everything and the most crucial part of using it. What you said about the Scrambler is true in close range, but at long range it does require skill to use and precision aiming.
which is exactly why ive been saying it needed a cqc nerf from day 1...
the gun was so strong in cqc that people who used it rarey had the ability to use it at range even now most scr users suck there are those though that operate with it just fine..
the ones who know how to aim
i agree in mid -long range scr takes skill..but then so does the tac ar and the lr..long range weapons are all skill based weapons the most spray and pray one is the rr and even that takes some skill
unfortunately dust caters towards scrubs..most combat is cqc and most all cqc weapons take very little aiming
which is why i prefer long range ..i prefer a challenge is why i roll with mlt lr like i do
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Mortedeamor
The Black Masquerade
2
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Posted - 2015.11.04 01:53:00 -
[10] - Quote
Forever ETC wrote:It is very unlikely that they will buff it anytime soon, hell after the discussion of a few months ago they said it wasn't too bad. But seeing as how they have already dealt with the weapons they were concerned with... If any buff does happen it will probably be clipsize.
clipsize is fine i dont mind not having to reload as often..but that will double my kill streaks,,,ide like to see how that one plays out
it is an area denial weapon after all...larger clip = more firing time..(i wont have to pause to reload essentially just wait the 2 seconds for it to cool down) more fire time more denial
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Forever ETC
Praetoriani Classiarii Templares
Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
1
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Posted - 2015.11.04 02:42:00 -
[11] - Quote
Mortedeamor wrote:Forever ETC wrote:It is very unlikely that they will buff it anytime soon, hell after the discussion of a few months ago they said it wasn't too bad. But seeing as how they have already dealt with the weapons they were concerned with... If any buff does happen it will probably be clipsize. clipsize is fine i dont mind not having to reload as often..but that will double my kill streaks,,,ide like to see how that one plays out it is an area denial weapon after all...larger clip = more firing time..(i wont have to pause to reload essentially just wait the 2 seconds for it to cool down) more fire time more denial
Again, clipsize buff has already been decided upon months ago, if anything changes with this weapon that will be one of the things.
AmarrFTW
"The Hero got his feelings hurt for 9 hp... "
Not For Sale- Sanders 2016
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TooMany Names AlreadyTaken
Going for the gold
1
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Posted - 2015.11.04 11:02:00 -
[12] - Quote
Every race apart form Amarr has a light AV weapon...
Don't hesitate, make the LR AV.
No.Gäó
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Mortedeamor
The Black Masquerade
2
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Posted - 2015.11.04 12:34:00 -
[13] - Quote
TooMany Names AlreadyTaken wrote:Every race apart form Amarr has a light AV weapon...
Don't hesitate, make the LR AV.
itll be the stupidest thing in dust...ooo a tiny beam that hurts vehicles oooo...pfft
scrambler lance way better
i hope they dont do something like add an av variant of the lr what a waste of time
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Mortedeamor
The Black Masquerade
2
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Posted - 2015.11.04 12:37:00 -
[14] - Quote
Forever ETC wrote:Mortedeamor wrote:Forever ETC wrote:It is very unlikely that they will buff it anytime soon, hell after the discussion of a few months ago they said it wasn't too bad. But seeing as how they have already dealt with the weapons they were concerned with... If any buff does happen it will probably be clipsize. clipsize is fine i dont mind not having to reload as often..but that will double my kill streaks,,,ide like to see how that one plays out it is an area denial weapon after all...larger clip = more firing time..(i wont have to pause to reload essentially just wait the 2 seconds for it to cool down) more fire time more denial Again, clipsize buff has already been decided upon months ago, if anything changes with this weapon that will be one of the things.
really i dont see where ccp said they are needlessly buffing one of the most dangerous guns in dust
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XxBlazikenxX
Ancient Exiles.
Bleeding Sun Conglomerate
3
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Posted - 2015.11.04 14:40:00 -
[15] - Quote
TooMany Names AlreadyTaken wrote:Every race apart form Amarr has a light AV weapon...
Don't hesitate, make the LR AV.
I already got the stats in a spreadsheet on my Amarr Commando and Assault balancing thread.
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Amarr Commando Forever
Ancient Exiles. Member
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Mortedeamor
The Black Masquerade
2
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Posted - 2015.11.04 14:56:00 -
[16] - Quote
TooMany Names AlreadyTaken wrote:Every race apart form Amarr has a light AV weapon...
Don't hesitate, make the LR AV.
dont make the lr av ..make an av variant ..they had best not change the current lrs role ..unfortunately that'll kill dust for me actually go ahead ccp im addicted to the lr not dust go ahead i shouldnt be playing this piece of crap anyways if it wasnt for my problem with shiny things :/
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Forever ETC
Praetoriani Classiarii Templares
Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
1
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Posted - 2015.11.04 15:05:00 -
[17] - Quote
Mortedeamor wrote:Forever ETC wrote:Mortedeamor wrote:Forever ETC wrote:It is very unlikely that they will buff it anytime soon, hell after the discussion of a few months ago they said it wasn't too bad. But seeing as how they have already dealt with the weapons they were concerned with... If any buff does happen it will probably be clipsize. clipsize is fine i dont mind not having to reload as often..but that will double my kill streaks,,,ide like to see how that one plays out it is an area denial weapon after all...larger clip = more firing time..(i wont have to pause to reload essentially just wait the 2 seconds for it to cool down) more fire time more denial Again, clipsize buff has already been decided upon months ago, if anything changes with this weapon that will be one of the things. really i dont see where ccp said they are needlessly buffing one of the most dangerous guns in dust
It was back a few months ago, it was the first CPM Feedback thread. As for the AV LR, that would be our Breach Variant as Blaz has already said...
AmarrFTW
"The Hero got his feelings hurt for 9 hp... "
Not For Sale- Sanders 2016
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Mortedeamor
The Black Masquerade
2
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Posted - 2015.11.04 15:07:00 -
[18] - Quote
Forever ETC wrote:Mortedeamor wrote:Forever ETC wrote:Mortedeamor wrote:Forever ETC wrote:It is very unlikely that they will buff it anytime soon, hell after the discussion of a few months ago they said it wasn't too bad. But seeing as how they have already dealt with the weapons they were concerned with... If any buff does happen it will probably be clipsize. clipsize is fine i dont mind not having to reload as often..but that will double my kill streaks,,,ide like to see how that one plays out it is an area denial weapon after all...larger clip = more firing time..(i wont have to pause to reload essentially just wait the 2 seconds for it to cool down) more fire time more denial Again, clipsize buff has already been decided upon months ago, if anything changes with this weapon that will be one of the things. really i dont see where ccp said they are needlessly buffing one of the most dangerous guns in dust It was back a few months ago, it was the first CPM Feedback thread. As for the AV LR, that would be our Breach Variant as Blaz has already said...
ive been gone for months
i just got back when a friend pointed me to your thread ...i did a few matches before i responded just to make sure lr didnt suddenly become up
ok im cool with new variants i thought the premise was changing the current one
i still think there should be a scrambler lance av variant for amar heavy weapons
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XxBlazikenxX
Ancient Exiles.
Bleeding Sun Conglomerate
3
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Posted - 2015.11.04 15:20:00 -
[19] - Quote
Mortedeamor wrote:TooMany Names AlreadyTaken wrote:Every race apart form Amarr has a light AV weapon...
Don't hesitate, make the LR AV. dont make the lr av ..make an av variant ..they had best not change the current lrs role ..unfortunately that'll kill dust for me actually go ahead ccp im addicted to the lr not dust go ahead i shouldnt be playing this piece of crap anyways if it wasnt for my problem with shiny things :/
I already have the stats for a new varient of a laser rifle that will require no new assets. I call it the "Breach Laser Rifle"
Amarr Loyalist
Amarr Commando Forever
Ancient Exiles. Member
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Mortedeamor
The Black Masquerade
2
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Posted - 2015.11.04 16:32:00 -
[20] - Quote
XxBlazikenxX wrote:Mortedeamor wrote:TooMany Names AlreadyTaken wrote:Every race apart form Amarr has a light AV weapon...
Don't hesitate, make the LR AV. dont make the lr av ..make an av variant ..they had best not change the current lrs role ..unfortunately that'll kill dust for me actually go ahead ccp im addicted to the lr not dust go ahead i shouldnt be playing this piece of crap anyways if it wasnt for my problem with shiny things :/ I already have the stats for a new varient of a laser rifle that will require no new assets. I call it the "Breach Laser Rifle"
link ?
\
just dont buff lr ..this is why
http://imgur.com/J3GGbMX
i will get board
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Bradric Banewolf
Titans of Phoenix
Damage LLC
1
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Posted - 2015.11.04 17:20:00 -
[21] - Quote
Have to agree with the OP here! Laser Rifle is one of the few guns that is actually in a good place for its role on the field, and not just being buffed/nerfed because of usage stats.
I was soooo glad when the galass AR RoF bonus didn't effect the TacAR and burst AR! Those weapons take skill (or modded controller for those with no skill), and would've easily become fotm like day 1.
Currently the LR is as it should be. Dangerous as all hell at range, but in close you need a beast sidearm!
I could see the clipsize buff going through without a hitch, but anything else would seem sketchy. A better zoom would make it deadly beyond reason!
Glad there are still guys trying to have the weapons in the game be balanced, and not just trying to get their personal weapons be buffed for no reason. +1
"Anybody order chaos?"
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Adipem Nothi
Nos Nothi
17
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Posted - 2015.11.04 17:22:00 -
[22] - Quote
Bradric Banewolf wrote:
I was soooo glad when the galass AR RoF bonus didn't effect the TacAR and burst AR! Those weapons take skill (or modded controller for those with no skill), and would've easily become fotm like day 1.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TsJMFsyHgI0
Dropsuit Usage Rates
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Mortedeamor
The Black Masquerade
2
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Posted - 2015.11.04 17:29:00 -
[23] - Quote
Adipem Nothi wrote:Bradric Banewolf wrote:
I was soooo glad when the galass AR RoF bonus didn't effect the TacAR and burst AR! Those weapons take skill (or modded controller for those with no skill), and would've easily become fotm like day 1.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TsJMFsyHgI0
it doesnt really make the tac any better though if anything its worse ona gal assault it increases the kick .....
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XxBlazikenxX
Ancient Exiles.
Bleeding Sun Conglomerate
3
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Posted - 2015.11.04 17:39:00 -
[24] - Quote
Mortedeamor wrote:XxBlazikenxX wrote:Mortedeamor wrote:TooMany Names AlreadyTaken wrote:Every race apart form Amarr has a light AV weapon...
Don't hesitate, make the LR AV. dont make the lr av ..make an av variant ..they had best not change the current lrs role ..unfortunately that'll kill dust for me actually go ahead ccp im addicted to the lr not dust go ahead i shouldnt be playing this piece of crap anyways if it wasnt for my problem with shiny things :/ I already have the stats for a new varient of a laser rifle that will require no new assets. I call it the "Breach Laser Rifle" link ? \ just dont buff lr ..this is why http://imgur.com/J3GGbMXi will get board
For some reason it won't let me link things, just look in GD and look in the thread "Feedback: Amarr Commando and Assault balancing"
Amarr Loyalist
Amarr Commando Forever
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Bradric Banewolf
Titans of Phoenix
Damage LLC
1
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Posted - 2015.11.04 17:57:00 -
[25] - Quote
Mortedeamor wrote:Adipem Nothi wrote:Bradric Banewolf wrote:
I was soooo glad when the galass AR RoF bonus didn't effect the TacAR and burst AR! Those weapons take skill (or modded controller for those with no skill), and would've easily become fotm like day 1.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TsJMFsyHgI0 it doesnt really make the tac any better though if anything its worse ona gal assault it increases the kick .....
This is what I meant lol! In the hands of a skilled operator the tac and burst can be deadly with the RoF, but you lose more in accuracy, which is the highlight of the weapons, than you gain in RoF.
The RoF bonus shows its colors mainly on the breach and assault plasma rifles more than ever.
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Mortedeamor
The Black Masquerade
2
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Posted - 2015.11.04 18:01:00 -
[26] - Quote
Bradric Banewolf wrote:Mortedeamor wrote:Adipem Nothi wrote:Bradric Banewolf wrote:
I was soooo glad when the galass AR RoF bonus didn't effect the TacAR and burst AR! Those weapons take skill (or modded controller for those with no skill), and would've easily become fotm like day 1.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TsJMFsyHgI0 it doesnt really make the tac any better though if anything its worse ona gal assault it increases the kick ..... This is what I meant lol! In the hands of a skilled operator the tac and burst can be deadly with the RoF, but you lose more in accuracy, which is the highlight of the weapons, than you gain in RoF. The RoF bonus shows its colors mainly on the breach and assault plasma rifles more than ever.
yeah aiming is important to people who dont spray and pray ide use a tac ar on a galmando but never a gal assault...i keep missing headshots because that damn kick
the buff to gal assault made it dominant in cqc...with its rifles but it weakened its range ability i think but who cares 95% of dust players cant aim and spray and pray
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Bradric Banewolf
Titans of Phoenix
Damage LLC
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Posted - 2015.11.04 18:22:00 -
[27] - Quote
Mortedeamor wrote:Bradric Banewolf wrote:Mortedeamor wrote:Adipem Nothi wrote:Bradric Banewolf wrote:
I was soooo glad when the galass AR RoF bonus didn't effect the TacAR and burst AR! Those weapons take skill (or modded controller for those with no skill), and would've easily become fotm like day 1.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TsJMFsyHgI0 it doesnt really make the tac any better though if anything its worse ona gal assault it increases the kick ..... This is what I meant lol! In the hands of a skilled operator the tac and burst can be deadly with the RoF, but you lose more in accuracy, which is the highlight of the weapons, than you gain in RoF. The RoF bonus shows its colors mainly on the breach and assault plasma rifles more than ever. yeah aiming is important to people who dont spray and pray ide use a tac ar on a galmando but never a gal assault...i keep missing headshots because that damn kick the buff to gal assault made it dominant in cqc...with its rifles but it weakened its range ability i think but who cares 95% of dust players cant aim and spray and pray
Most use ARR or aiming modification that removes all recoil. Some even use aiming modification on spray and prey weapons lol!
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Georgia Xavier
Incorruptibles
1
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Posted - 2015.11.04 18:45:00 -
[28] - Quote
Mortedeamor wrote:TooMany Names AlreadyTaken wrote:Every race apart form Amarr has a light AV weapon...
Don't hesitate, make the LR AV. itll be the stupidest thing in dust...ooo a tiny beam that hurts vehicles oooo...pfft scrambler lance way better i hope they dont do something like add an av variant of the lr what a waste of time
Dip the forge in molten gold, increase the size of the beam, give it the old laser rifle sound and make it so its effective on vehicles and less so on infantry. Amarr AV! 
Click for an instant good day! (or atleast cheer you up a bit)
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Breakin Stuff
Goonfeet
Special Planetary Emergency Response Group
11
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Posted - 2015.11.05 20:25:00 -
[29] - Quote
We weren't looking at buffing it so much as altering it to work on the other amarr suits.
Until they work efficiently on the commandos, scouts and logis they aren't just fine.
But we're looking at zero-sum alterations that don't change the overall performance of the weapon.
WoW has taught me that Purple means Legendary. This means Quafe suits are the optimal loadout for killing all of you.
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deezy dabest
IMPERIAL SPECIAL FORCES GROUP
Evil Syndicate Alliance.
3
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Posted - 2015.11.05 20:33:00 -
[30] - Quote
Breakin Stuff wrote:We weren't looking at buffing it so much as altering it to work on the other amarr suits.
Until they work efficiently on the commandos, scouts and logis they aren't just fine.
But we're looking at zero-sum alterations that don't change the overall performance of the weapon.
Oh good just like the ScR was altered to work on other suits.
How about just stay away from it completely.
Show there is a future #CCPSpeakOn514
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Breakin Stuff
Goonfeet
Special Planetary Emergency Response Group
11
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Posted - 2015.11.05 20:54:00 -
[31] - Quote
deezy dabest wrote:How about just stay away from it completely.
How about providing more constructive commentary, because this isn't something I'm inclined to consider.
WoW has taught me that Purple means Legendary. This means Quafe suits are the optimal loadout for killing all of you.
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XxBlazikenxX
Ancient Exiles.
Bleeding Sun Conglomerate
3
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Posted - 2015.11.05 21:09:00 -
[32] - Quote
Breakin Stuff wrote:We weren't looking at buffing it so much as altering it to work on the other amarr suits.
Until they work efficiently on the commandos, scouts and logis they aren't just fine.
But we're looking at zero-sum alterations that don't change the overall performance of the weapon.
Did you see my proposal on the Amarr Commando and Assault? This will fix the LR to be viable on both the Assault AND Commando. I don't know about logis and scouts though because I don't play those.
Under contract by the Amarr Empire
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Breakin Stuff
Goonfeet
Special Planetary Emergency Response Group
11
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Posted - 2015.11.05 21:27:00 -
[33] - Quote
XxBlazikenxX wrote:Breakin Stuff wrote:We weren't looking at buffing it so much as altering it to work on the other amarr suits.
Until they work efficiently on the commandos, scouts and logis they aren't just fine.
But we're looking at zero-sum alterations that don't change the overall performance of the weapon. Did you see my proposal on the Amarr Commando and Assault? This will fix the LR to be viable on both the Assault AND Commando. I don't know about logis and scouts though because I don't play those.
Scanned it. Your bonus changes aren't something that I really support. Replacing a good bonus with several lackluster ones on the amarr assault isn't a way I'd like to go there. I'll put better feedback in the thread once I let the thoughts percolate fully.
WoW has taught me that Purple means Legendary. This means Quafe suits are the optimal loadout for killing all of you.
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Dragonmeballs
Better Hide R Die
257
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Posted - 2015.11.05 21:30:00 -
[34] - Quote
XxBlazikenxX wrote:Breakin Stuff wrote:We weren't looking at buffing it so much as altering it to work on the other amarr suits.
Until they work efficiently on the commandos, scouts and logis they aren't just fine.
But we're looking at zero-sum alterations that don't change the overall performance of the weapon. Did you see my proposal on the Amarr Commando and Assault? This will fix the LR to be viable on both the Assault AND Commando. I don't know about logis and scouts though because I don't play those.
I find it difficult to justify running a lasor on a logi suit but on a scout suit I see potential.
The scout suit offers the speed to move around the field and quickly help suppress an advance. The logi really should be closer to the front line which put the lasor at or below its optimal range.
For me the issue is the rail rifle is effective for CQC and out to 120 meters. This makes it a potent threat and somewhat unbalanced. All other medium weapons are governed by set ranges for effectiveness. Engage a RR user at 80 meter with an AR and he'll eat your lunch. The lasor is the only range weapon that actually is a threat to a RR user other than the PLC and Forge gun and both of these require as much skill as luck to kill.
The lasor is not fundamentally unbalanced at this time. It is a specialist's weapon. I agree with a point XxBlazikenxX made in another thread about the Amarr weapon choices being somewhat shallow in overall variety. An AV lasor would be a brilliant addition.
I would add the scope doesn't need the shading. Why do I have to look through a piece of yellow wax paper when I'm engaging a target at 100 meters CCP?
I also would like to lobby for an adjustment to feedback damage more in line but not as low as the scramblers. It is hard enough to suppress when everybody knows where I am and then I have to hobble around for 15-20 second healing from an overheat.
Blueberry!....Make yourself useful and shoot the blurry thing running this way with YES!
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Breakin Stuff
Goonfeet
Special Planetary Emergency Response Group
11
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Posted - 2015.11.05 21:40:00 -
[35] - Quote
Dragonmeballs wrote:
For me the issue is the rail rifle is effective for CQC and out to 120 meters.
ok, when discussing the rail rifle we need to remember that the scrambler is the answer to the rail rifle. laser Rifles are as you say a specialist weapon, more comparable to a mass driver as far as role and intent goes than it is to a rail rifle.
the closest analog to the Laser Rifle would be a hybrid of light machingun and sniper rifle, IMHO.
WoW has taught me that Purple means Legendary. This means Quafe suits are the optimal loadout for killing all of you.
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Dragonmeballs
Better Hide R Die
259
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Posted - 2015.11.05 21:55:00 -
[36] - Quote
Breakin Stuff wrote:Dragonmeballs wrote:
For me the issue is the rail rifle is effective for CQC and out to 120 meters.
ok, when discussing the rail rifle we need to remember that the scrambler is the answer to the rail rifle. laser Rifles are as you say a specialist weapon, more comparable to a mass driver as far as role and intent goes than it is to a rail rifle. the closest analog to the Laser Rifle would be a hybrid of light machingun and sniper rifle, IMHO.
@ Breakin
Fair enough
Is the scrambler an even match for the RR at various distances?
I ask because my experience with the scrambler is limited. I have just recently picked up the RR and find its bullet magnetism a little ridiculous. I've but a few hours into running a RR and it is just a fire hose of spray and pray whereas it seems the scrambler requires more economic choices to be made when pulling the trigger.
Blueberry!....Make yourself useful and shoot the blurry thing running this way with YES!
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Avallo Kantor
960
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Posted - 2015.11.05 22:00:00 -
[37] - Quote
Dragonmeballs wrote:Breakin Stuff wrote:Dragonmeballs wrote:
For me the issue is the rail rifle is effective for CQC and out to 120 meters.
ok, when discussing the rail rifle we need to remember that the scrambler is the answer to the rail rifle. laser Rifles are as you say a specialist weapon, more comparable to a mass driver as far as role and intent goes than it is to a rail rifle. the closest analog to the Laser Rifle would be a hybrid of light machingun and sniper rifle, IMHO. @ Breakin Fair enough Is the scrambler an even match for the RR at various distances? I ask because my experience with the scrambler is limited. I have just recently picked up the RR and find its bullet magnetism a little ridiculous. I've but a few hours into running a RR and it is just a fire hose of spray and pray whereas it seems the scrambler requires more economic choices to be made when pulling the trigger.
RR has superior range, but once you get into a ScR's optimal range, and closer I would argue it out performs the RR.
Also in a more meta sense RR pairs well with the Caldari Assault, which the ScR demolishes with ease. However the RR can win out if it can get a good position (with a huge range between you and target) and nail them that way.
"Mind Blown" - CCP Rattati
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XxBlazikenxX
Ancient Exiles.
Bleeding Sun Conglomerate
3
|
Posted - 2015.11.05 23:12:00 -
[38] - Quote
Breakin Stuff wrote:XxBlazikenxX wrote:Breakin Stuff wrote:We weren't looking at buffing it so much as altering it to work on the other amarr suits.
Until they work efficiently on the commandos, scouts and logis they aren't just fine.
But we're looking at zero-sum alterations that don't change the overall performance of the weapon. Did you see my proposal on the Amarr Commando and Assault? This will fix the LR to be viable on both the Assault AND Commando. I don't know about logis and scouts though because I don't play those. Scanned it. Your bonus changes aren't something that I really support. Replacing a good bonus with several lackluster ones on the amarr assault isn't a way I'd like to go there. I'll put better feedback in the thread once I let the thoughts percolate fully.
Pleased to hear it! Looking forward to the feedback, as I want to make my proposal as perfect as possible.
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THEAMAZING POTHEAD
Nyain San
1
|
Posted - 2015.11.06 20:12:00 -
[39] - Quote
Breakin Stuff wrote:deezy dabest wrote:How about just stay away from it completely. How about providing more constructive commentary, because this isn't something I'm inclined to consider.
Dont. If the Laser is usable on the amarr commando because overheat isnt as quick the damage bonus will lead to an inevitable nerf of the laser rifle, Its a bad idea, and everyone will just switch over to the amarr commando seeing as how many already have an amarr commando or at least level3 basic heavys to have specced into amarr sent. You wont be making it more viable on other suits, you'll be giving it a damage buff and making it a new fotm for commandos lasers.
Believe me the viktors will be a serious problem even moreso than now.
The reason the non officer lasers arent OP now is because damage modded theyre just below the instant kill dps of a damage modded officer LR, The 10% dmg will push them over the edge when damage modded commando proto lasers can get that big enough max damage window but doing viktors level damage.
Your post is making me facepalm. ò.ó
Nyan!~~=[,,..,,]:3
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Mortedeamor
The Black Masquerade
2
|
Posted - 2015.11.06 21:04:00 -
[40] - Quote
THEAMAZING POTHEAD wrote:Breakin Stuff wrote:deezy dabest wrote:How about just stay away from it completely. How about providing more constructive commentary, because this isn't something I'm inclined to consider. Dont. If the Laser is usable on the amarr commando because overheat isnt as quick the damage bonus will lead to an inevitable nerf of the laser rifle, Its a bad idea, and everyone will just switch over to the amarr commando seeing as how many already have an amarr commando or at least level3 basic heavys to have specced into amarr sent. You wont be making it more viable on other suits, you'll be giving it a damage buff and making it a new fotm for commandos lasers. Believe me the viktors will be a serious problem even moreso than now. The reason the non officer lasers arent OP now is because damage modded theyre just below the instant kill dps of a damage modded officer LR, The 10% dmg will push them over the edge when damage modded commando proto lasers can get that big enough max damage window but doing viktors level damage.
each lr can death touch the corresponding lvl suit ./...mlt lr death touchs all standard suits
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Breakin Stuff
Goonfeet
Special Planetary Emergency Response Group
11
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Posted - 2015.11.07 02:01:00 -
[41] - Quote
THEAMAZING POTHEAD wrote:
Dont. If the Laser is usable on the amarr commando because overheat isnt as quick the damage bonus will lead to an inevitable nerf of the laser rifle,
Doubtful, given the commando bonus plus two damage mods won't out-DPS an amarr assault by more than 3-5% as best case scenario.
I've already run the numbers. Even a two mod commando versus a three mod assault the DPS difference is the difference between 18% and some change and 21% and some change. Not enough to significantly change TTK, and even then, I'm still intending the amarr assault to be able to go longer before overheating than the commando. All this would do is close the gap between the suits, not causing the sky to fall.
WoW has taught me that Purple means Legendary. This means Quafe suits are the optimal loadout for killing all of you.
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XxBlazikenxX
Ancient Exiles.
Bleeding Sun Conglomerate
3
|
Posted - 2015.11.07 03:32:00 -
[42] - Quote
Breakin Stuff wrote:THEAMAZING POTHEAD wrote:
Dont. If the Laser is usable on the amarr commando because overheat isnt as quick the damage bonus will lead to an inevitable nerf of the laser rifle,
Doubtful, given the commando bonus plus two damage mods won't out-DPS an amarr assault by more than 3-5% as best case scenario. I've already run the numbers. Even a two mod commando versus a three mod assault the DPS difference is the difference between 18% and some change and 21% and some change. Not enough to significantly change TTK, and even then, I'm still intending the amarr assault to be able to go longer before overheating than the commando. All this would do is close the gap between the suits, not causing the sky to fall.
Yeah, I have done the math and a Commando at level 5 with a proto viziam lr with no proficiency will still do do 943 less damage before overheating than an Amarr Assault at level 5 under the same circumstances.
Under contract by the Amarr Empire
Amarr Commando Forever
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Mortedeamor
The Black Masquerade
2
|
Posted - 2015.11.07 17:48:00 -
[43] - Quote
XxBlazikenxX wrote:Breakin Stuff wrote:THEAMAZING POTHEAD wrote:
Dont. If the Laser is usable on the amarr commando because overheat isnt as quick the damage bonus will lead to an inevitable nerf of the laser rifle,
Doubtful, given the commando bonus plus two damage mods won't out-DPS an amarr assault by more than 3-5% as best case scenario. I've already run the numbers. Even a two mod commando versus a three mod assault the DPS difference is the difference between 18% and some change and 21% and some change. Not enough to significantly change TTK, and even then, I'm still intending the amarr assault to be able to go longer before overheating than the commando. All this would do is close the gap between the suits, not causing the sky to fall. Yeah, I have done the math and a Commando at level 5 with a proto viziam lr with no proficiency will still do do 943 less damage before overheating than an Amarr Assault at level 5 under the same circumstances.
the way the lr functions makes in inherently better on the amar assault more firing time means everything
the commando could fire 10 more rounds without breaking it
but they should do that by buffing the suit...
not the lr...
if they add it to the lrs...it will make them a lot stronger on the amar assault which im probably the only person in dust to not want that but....
10 extra rounds should really do..if amar commando had a 2% reduction to heat build up per skill lvl
without changing it though amar commando lr is worthless....
ive tryed it i respecced out of amar commando two days later,,,60 rounds from a lr is useless....70..is ok they could fix that
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XxBlazikenxX
Ancient Exiles.
Bleeding Sun Conglomerate
3
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Posted - 2015.11.07 17:49:00 -
[44] - Quote
Mortedeamor wrote:XxBlazikenxX wrote:Breakin Stuff wrote:THEAMAZING POTHEAD wrote:
Dont. If the Laser is usable on the amarr commando because overheat isnt as quick the damage bonus will lead to an inevitable nerf of the laser rifle,
Doubtful, given the commando bonus plus two damage mods won't out-DPS an amarr assault by more than 3-5% as best case scenario. I've already run the numbers. Even a two mod commando versus a three mod assault the DPS difference is the difference between 18% and some change and 21% and some change. Not enough to significantly change TTK, and even then, I'm still intending the amarr assault to be able to go longer before overheating than the commando. All this would do is close the gap between the suits, not causing the sky to fall. Yeah, I have done the math and a Commando at level 5 with a proto viziam lr with no proficiency will still do do 943 less damage before overheating than an Amarr Assault at level 5 under the same circumstances. the way the lr functions makes in inherently better on the amar assault more firing time means everything the commando could fire 10 more rounds without breaking it but they should do that by buffing the suit... not the lr... if they add it to the lrs...it will make them a lot stronger on the amar assault which im probably the only person in dust to not want that but.... 10 extra rounds should really do..if amar commando had a 2% reduction to heat build up per skill lvl
If you looked at my proposal, then that is exactly what I have done.
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Amarr Commando Forever
Ancient Exiles. Member
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Mortedeamor
The Black Masquerade
2
|
Posted - 2015.11.07 17:50:00 -
[45] - Quote
XxBlazikenxX wrote:Mortedeamor wrote:XxBlazikenxX wrote:Breakin Stuff wrote:THEAMAZING POTHEAD wrote:
Dont. If the Laser is usable on the amarr commando because overheat isnt as quick the damage bonus will lead to an inevitable nerf of the laser rifle,
Doubtful, given the commando bonus plus two damage mods won't out-DPS an amarr assault by more than 3-5% as best case scenario. I've already run the numbers. Even a two mod commando versus a three mod assault the DPS difference is the difference between 18% and some change and 21% and some change. Not enough to significantly change TTK, and even then, I'm still intending the amarr assault to be able to go longer before overheating than the commando. All this would do is close the gap between the suits, not causing the sky to fall. Yeah, I have done the math and a Commando at level 5 with a proto viziam lr with no proficiency will still do do 943 less damage before overheating than an Amarr Assault at level 5 under the same circumstances. the way the lr functions makes in inherently better on the amar assault more firing time means everything the commando could fire 10 more rounds without breaking it but they should do that by buffing the suit... not the lr... if they add it to the lrs...it will make them a lot stronger on the amar assault which im probably the only person in dust to not want that but.... 10 extra rounds should really do..if amar commando had a 2% reduction to heat build up per skill lvl If you looked at my proposal, then that is exactly what I have done.
what added 2 % per skill lvl to amar commando? effectively making it better with lr and scr while not buffing the guns themselves ya i saw its an ok idea
personally i hope ccp completely does the opposite though and makes all lrs overheats at 70....and thus 90 on amar assault just cause i dont want it...but ide secretly enjoy the slaughter ;)
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XxBlazikenxX
Ancient Exiles.
Bleeding Sun Conglomerate
3
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Posted - 2015.11.07 17:58:00 -
[46] - Quote
I actually did it by 3% because I wanted it to be weaker than the 5% that the Amarr Assault got, but I wasn't sure which number to go with.
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Amarr Commando Forever
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Mortedeamor
The Black Masquerade
2
|
Posted - 2015.11.07 18:06:00 -
[47] - Quote
XxBlazikenxX wrote:I actually did it by 3% because I wanted it to be weaker than the 5% that the Amarr Assault got, but I wasn't sure which number to go with.
whatever number will make it equate to the lr overheating at 70 on amar commando
70 at 10% damage modifier will make the lr actually solid at all levels on am commando ...if ur running a dmg mod with that it may ever be on par with the amar assault or close at least most lrs are dmg modded when on the assault
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deezy dabest
IMPERIAL SPECIAL FORCES GROUP
Evil Syndicate Alliance.
4
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Posted - 2015.11.07 18:22:00 -
[48] - Quote
A heat build up reduction goes into a bit of an unexplained area.
Some say that continuous fire builds damage on the laser rifle while others say it is simply tied to the amount of heat the weapon has built up. Personally I feel like it is tied to heat build up.
So we enter into 2 very different but very broken scenarios.
Option A) Damage is tied to continuous fire.
If this is the case then a huge reduction to heat build up then the commando would be able to reach DPS levels that the LR was never meant to reach. Add that in with damage mods and warbarge bonuses and we revert to the old days of the laser rifle becoming a light saber that you just swing around with the damage built up and cut people in half.
Needless to say shield users will flip and the nerf is already incoming.
Option B) Damage is tied to heat build up
This would mean that by giving the commando a reduction to heat build up you are making it take longer to reach the DPS levels of every other suit which is effectively a nerf. That would also lower the total damage output of single clip which seems odd as a "bonus".
This just makes it even less popular than it is and hurts the current users.
The solution to either problem is simple.
Give the commando an increased bonus to cool down time. The exact number on this would depend heavily on which mechanic actually multiplies the damage but no matter what it proves to be far more beneficial than playing with heat build up which I think we have already seen is one tough cookie to balance.
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XxBlazikenxX
Ancient Exiles.
Bleeding Sun Conglomerate
3
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Posted - 2015.11.07 18:27:00 -
[49] - Quote
Damage depends on how long you have been continuously firing it, not how much heat is built up. Gosh, that is like laser rifle 101 right there.
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Amarr Commando Forever
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deezy dabest
IMPERIAL SPECIAL FORCES GROUP
Evil Syndicate Alliance.
4
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Posted - 2015.11.07 18:32:00 -
[50] - Quote
XxBlazikenxX wrote:Damage depends on how long you have been continuously firing it, not how much heat is built up. Gosh, that is like laser rifle 101 right there.
First of all there is no clarification there what so ever. We know how quiet CCP is about EXACT mechanics but that is why I covered both scenarios.
Assuming you are correct that means a heat build up reduction would send per clip DPS through the roof for the commando / lr combo. When you account for a native damage bonus, damage mods, profile, and warbarge bonuses you have an OP situation which means the nerf bat is incoming before it has even happened.
Also lets not forget that at the same time an increase in cool down would give the commando more ability to natively use the ScR without creating a situation like we are seeing with the ScR/Assault combo.
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XxBlazikenxX
Ancient Exiles.
Bleeding Sun Conglomerate
3
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Posted - 2015.11.07 18:40:00 -
[51] - Quote
deezy dabest wrote:XxBlazikenxX wrote:Damage depends on how long you have been continuously firing it, not how much heat is built up. Gosh, that is like laser rifle 101 right there. First of all there is no clarification there what so ever. We know how quiet CCP is about EXACT mechanics but that is why I covered both scenarios. Assuming you are correct that means a heat build up reduction would send per clip DPS through the roof for the commando / lr combo. When you account for a native damage bonus, damage mods, profile, and warbarge bonuses you have an OP situation which means the nerf bat is incoming before it has even happened. Also lets not forget that at the same time an increase in cool down would give the commando more ability to natively use the ScR without creating a situation like we are seeing with the ScR/Assault combo.
Actually it does say when you first spawn in, "Continuous fire increases damage dealt" or something like that.
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Mortedeamor
The Black Masquerade
2
|
Posted - 2015.11.07 18:51:00 -
[52] - Quote
XxBlazikenxX wrote:deezy dabest wrote:XxBlazikenxX wrote:Damage depends on how long you have been continuously firing it, not how much heat is built up. Gosh, that is like laser rifle 101 right there. First of all there is no clarification there what so ever. We know how quiet CCP is about EXACT mechanics but that is why I covered both scenarios. Assuming you are correct that means a heat build up reduction would send per clip DPS through the roof for the commando / lr combo. When you account for a native damage bonus, damage mods, profile, and warbarge bonuses you have an OP situation which means the nerf bat is incoming before it has even happened. Also lets not forget that at the same time an increase in cool down would give the commando more ability to natively use the ScR without creating a situation like we are seeing with the ScR/Assault combo. Actually it does say when you first spawn in, "Continuous fire increases damage dealt" or something like that.
the exact mechanics are known musta tornius and others with some collaboration from me ran the full numbers on lr
it does increased dmg over time based on continuous fire each round can be measured
look it up pffft
the modifiers are even known they scale now btw
i believe viziams is 1.05 now....
elm was .94 ithink it has been ages you could ask ccp or pull up the numbers
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Mortedeamor
The Black Masquerade
2
|
Posted - 2015.11.07 18:53:00 -
[53] - Quote
XxBlazikenxX wrote:deezy dabest wrote:XxBlazikenxX wrote:Damage depends on how long you have been continuously firing it, not how much heat is built up. Gosh, that is like laser rifle 101 right there. First of all there is no clarification there what so ever. We know how quiet CCP is about EXACT mechanics but that is why I covered both scenarios. Assuming you are correct that means a heat build up reduction would send per clip DPS through the roof for the commando / lr combo. When you account for a native damage bonus, damage mods, profile, and warbarge bonuses you have an OP situation which means the nerf bat is incoming before it has even happened. Also lets not forget that at the same time an increase in cool down would give the commando more ability to natively use the ScR without creating a situation like we are seeing with the ScR/Assault combo. Actually it does say when you first spawn in, "Continuous fire increases damage dealt" or something like that.
the exact mechanics are known musta tornius and others with some collaboration from me ran the full numbers on lr
it does increased dmg over time based on continuous fire each round can be measured
look it up pffft
the modifiers are even known they scale now btw
https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=146762&find=unread
musta thread explaining
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deezy dabest
IMPERIAL SPECIAL FORCES GROUP
Evil Syndicate Alliance.
4
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Posted - 2015.11.07 19:07:00 -
[54] - Quote
XxBlazikenxX wrote:deezy dabest wrote:XxBlazikenxX wrote:Damage depends on how long you have been continuously firing it, not how much heat is built up. Gosh, that is like laser rifle 101 right there. First of all there is no clarification there what so ever. We know how quiet CCP is about EXACT mechanics but that is why I covered both scenarios. Assuming you are correct that means a heat build up reduction would send per clip DPS through the roof for the commando / lr combo. When you account for a native damage bonus, damage mods, profile, and warbarge bonuses you have an OP situation which means the nerf bat is incoming before it has even happened. Also lets not forget that at the same time an increase in cool down would give the commando more ability to natively use the ScR without creating a situation like we are seeing with the ScR/Assault combo. Actually it does say when you first spawn in, "Continuous fire increases damage dealt" or something like that.
Yes and all bonuses are listed on all suits. OOPs no they arent.
Oh and everyone knows the ScR has a 3.5x full charge multiplier based on older data. OOPs not true either myself and Thaddeus debunked that.
Uplinks have never mysteriously had their spawn direction changed either. OHHH not true either.
Trusting anything in this game unless it has been VERY recently tested is like trusting the guy that broke into your house with your wallet.
I love how all you guys like to pass over the real fact that the bonuses being proposed are broken no matter what in favor of bitching over the fact that I listed more than one scenario to cover all the possible bases.
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Mortedeamor
The Black Masquerade
2
|
Posted - 2015.11.07 19:12:00 -
[55] - Quote
deezy dabest wrote:A heat build up reduction goes into a bit of an unexplained area.
Some say that continuous fire builds damage on the laser rifle while others say it is simply tied to the amount of heat the weapon has built up. Personally I feel like it is tied to heat build up.
So we enter into 2 very different but very broken scenarios.
Option A) Damage is tied to continuous fire.
If this is the case then a huge reduction to heat build up then the commando would be able to reach DPS levels that the LR was never meant to reach. Add that in with damage mods and warbarge bonuses and we revert to the old days of the laser rifle becoming a light saber that you just swing around with the damage built up and cut people in half.
Needless to say shield users will flip and the nerf is already incoming.
Option B) Damage is tied to heat build up
This would mean that by giving the commando a reduction to heat build up you are making it take longer to reach the DPS levels of every other suit which is effectively a nerf. That would also lower the total damage output of single clip which seems odd as a "bonus".
This just makes it even less popular than it is and hurts the current users.
The solution to either problem is simple.
Give the commando an increased bonus to cool down time. The exact number on this would depend heavily on which mechanic actually multiplies the damage but no matter what it proves to be far more beneficial than playing with heat build up which I think we have already seen is one tough cookie to balance.
it is not tied to heat build up its tied to continuous fire you are completely wrong
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XxBlazikenxX
Ancient Exiles.
Bleeding Sun Conglomerate
3
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Posted - 2015.11.07 19:15:00 -
[56] - Quote
Mortedeamor wrote:deezy dabest wrote:A heat build up reduction goes into a bit of an unexplained area.
Some say that continuous fire builds damage on the laser rifle while others say it is simply tied to the amount of heat the weapon has built up. Personally I feel like it is tied to heat build up.
So we enter into 2 very different but very broken scenarios.
Option A) Damage is tied to continuous fire.
If this is the case then a huge reduction to heat build up then the commando would be able to reach DPS levels that the LR was never meant to reach. Add that in with damage mods and warbarge bonuses and we revert to the old days of the laser rifle becoming a light saber that you just swing around with the damage built up and cut people in half.
Needless to say shield users will flip and the nerf is already incoming.
Option B) Damage is tied to heat build up
This would mean that by giving the commando a reduction to heat build up you are making it take longer to reach the DPS levels of every other suit which is effectively a nerf. That would also lower the total damage output of single clip which seems odd as a "bonus".
This just makes it even less popular than it is and hurts the current users.
The solution to either problem is simple.
Give the commando an increased bonus to cool down time. The exact number on this would depend heavily on which mechanic actually multiplies the damage but no matter what it proves to be far more beneficial than playing with heat build up which I think we have already seen is one tough cookie to balance. it is not tied to heat build up its tied to continuous fire you are completely wrong
Yep, what he said.
Under contract by the Amarr Empire
Amarr Commando Forever
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deezy dabest
IMPERIAL SPECIAL FORCES GROUP
Evil Syndicate Alliance.
4
|
Posted - 2015.11.07 19:16:00 -
[57] - Quote
Mortedeamor wrote:
it is not tied to heat build up its tied to continuous fire you are completely wrong
Let me help you out with something here.
op-+tion
-ê+ñpSH(+Ö)n/
noun
1.
a thing that is or may be chosen.
Keep arguing over the fact that I presented multiple possible options and not over the fact that no matter what it is a broken idea to give the commando a reduction to heat build up along with a damage bonus and all of the other damage bonuses now in this game.
People wonder why balance will never happen in this game.
Here I will help you out on your next post:
No you are wrong thats not true no no no avoiding the actual facts wrong wrong no no no
Show there is a future #CCPSpeakOn514
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XxBlazikenxX
Ancient Exiles.
Bleeding Sun Conglomerate
3
|
Posted - 2015.11.07 19:23:00 -
[58] - Quote
deezy dabest wrote:Mortedeamor wrote:
it is not tied to heat build up its tied to continuous fire you are completely wrong
Let me help you out with something here. op-+tion -ê+ñpSH(+Ö)n/ noun 1. a thing that is or may be chosen. Keep arguing over the fact that I presented multiple possible options and not over the fact that no matter what it is a broken idea to give the commando a reduction to heat build up along with a damage bonus and all of the other damage bonuses now in this game. People wonder why balance will never happen in this game. Here I will help you out on your next post: No you are wrong thats not true no no no avoiding the actual facts wrong wrong no no no
No it is not broken to give it a heat reduction because that is the one thing which sets laser weapons apart from other weapons. The Amarr Commando is supposed to be a god with a Scrambler and Laser, but it can't do that because of the heat reduction. Likewise the Amarr Assault is OP because of that bonus, so naturally the bonus given to the Commando would be less than that. Unless we do a complete overhaul of laser weaponry, the only way the Commando will ever become balanced is through that method.
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Amarr Commando Forever
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deezy dabest
IMPERIAL SPECIAL FORCES GROUP
Evil Syndicate Alliance.
4
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Posted - 2015.11.07 19:25:00 -
[59] - Quote
Have fun.
Show there is a future #CCPSpeakOn514
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XxBlazikenxX
Ancient Exiles.
Bleeding Sun Conglomerate
3
|
Posted - 2015.11.07 19:26:00 -
[60] - Quote
deezy dabest wrote:Have fun.
Okay.
Under contract by the Amarr Empire
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KEROSIINI-TERO
The Rainbow Effect
2
|
Posted - 2015.11.07 19:33:00 -
[61] - Quote
Laser rifles are pretty much fine and are an EXCELLENT addition to the game.
However, the Victor's Laser Rifle (especially on an amarr suit) is ridiculously powerful.
I dare to claim that it's performance is relatively much higher than any other officer gun when comparing to respective proto variant.
Because of that, I'm afraid that all laser rifles will suffer a blanket nerf for Vic's sins. That would not be a smart change, nevertheless the treat exists.
KERO-TRADER is my official Eve character for Dust trading.
Search "KEROBPO" for list of bpos for sale.
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XxBlazikenxX
Ancient Exiles.
Bleeding Sun Conglomerate
3
|
Posted - 2015.11.07 19:34:00 -
[62] - Quote
KEROSIINI-TERO wrote:Laser rifles are pretty much fine and are an EXCELLENT addition to the game.
However, the Victor's Laser Rifle (especially on an amarr suit) is ridiculously powerful.
I dare to claim that it's performance is relatively much higher than any other officer gun when comparing to respective proto variant.
Only in certain cases where it shines. We can easily say the same for the Bon's shotgun or even the Ghalag's BP.
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Mortedeamor
The Black Masquerade
2
|
Posted - 2015.11.07 19:37:00 -
[63] - Quote
Mortedeamor wrote:deezy dabest wrote:A heat build up reduction goes into a bit of an unexplained area.
Some say that continuous fire builds damage on the laser rifle while others say it is simply tied to the amount of heat the weapon has built up. Personally I feel like it is tied to heat build up.
So we enter into 2 very different but very broken scenarios.
Option A) Damage is tied to continuous fire.
If this is the case then a huge reduction to heat build up then the commando would be able to reach DPS levels that the LR was never meant to reach. Add that in with damage mods and warbarge bonuses and we revert to the old days of the laser rifle becoming a light saber that you just swing around with the damage built up and cut people in half.
Needless to say shield users will flip and the nerf is already incoming.
Option B) Damage is tied to heat build up
This would mean that by giving the commando a reduction to heat build up you are making it take longer to reach the DPS levels of every other suit which is effectively a nerf. That would also lower the total damage output of single clip which seems odd as a "bonus".
This just makes it even less popular than it is and hurts the current users.
The solution to either problem is simple.
Give the commando an increased bonus to cool down time. The exact number on this would depend heavily on which mechanic actually multiplies the damage but no matter what it proves to be far more beneficial than playing with heat build up which I think we have already seen is one tough cookie to balance. it is not tied to heat build up its tied to continuous fire you are completely wrong
you dont know what your talking about there is only one option lr is tied to continuous fire...and the amar assault skill allows it to be fired longer thus deal more dmg....there is no debate its tested and discussed proven data...confirmed everything you say is completely invalid because you clearly dont know what your talking about
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KEROSIINI-TERO
The Rainbow Effect
2
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Posted - 2015.11.07 20:10:00 -
[64] - Quote
XxBlazikenxX wrote:
Only in certain cases where it shines. We can easily say the same for the Bon's shotgun or even the Ghalag's BP.
But I am comparing vic to both bons and ghals.
I make the claim that vic's performance gain is way greater than bons' or ghal's.
Ghal RR is, after all, 'just' a rail rifle.
The extreme beam on -time has a lot to do about it. Not overheating is a crutch, weapon of that type (laser) should always have that management to consider.
KERO-TRADER is my official Eve character for Dust trading.
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XxBlazikenxX
Ancient Exiles.
Bleeding Sun Conglomerate
3
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Posted - 2015.11.07 20:12:00 -
[65] - Quote
KEROSIINI-TERO wrote:XxBlazikenxX wrote:
Only in certain cases where it shines. We can easily say the same for the Bon's shotgun or even the Ghalag's BP.
But I am comparing vic to both bons and ghals. I make the claim that vic's performance gain is way greater than bons' or ghal's. Ghal RR is, after all, 'just' a rail rifle. The extreme beam on -time has a lot to do about it. Not overheating is a crutch, weapon of that type (laser) should always have that management to consider.
The only suit you wouldn't overheat with the viks is a proto Amarr Assault, and yes I do agree that the Amarr Assault is OP, but not the Vik's laser rifle.
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Amarr Commando Forever
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Mortedeamor
The Black Masquerade
2
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Posted - 2015.11.07 20:13:00 -
[66] - Quote
KEROSIINI-TERO wrote:XxBlazikenxX wrote:
Only in certain cases where it shines. We can easily say the same for the Bon's shotgun or even the Ghalag's BP.
But I am comparing vic to both bons and ghals. I make the claim that vic's performance gain is way greater than bons' or ghal's. Ghal RR is, after all, 'just' a rail rifle. The extreme beam on -time has a lot to do about it. Not overheating is a crutch, weapon of that type (laser) should always have that management to consider.
it is...40 extra firable rounds is insane power its beautiful
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Breakin Stuff
Goonfeet
Special Planetary Emergency Response Group
11
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Posted - 2015.11.07 23:13:00 -
[67] - Quote
The only change I am even entertaining as more than a bad joke would be splitting and combining the amarr assault and the operation skills.
I.E. amarr assault gets 2% heat reduction, 3% cooldown
But the operation gets 3% heat reduction, 2% cooldown.
Anything else just hits me as a bad idea because I agree, the weapon is actually very good in the right hands. But putting a straight heat reduction on the commando would necessitate removing the damage bonus most likely.
So some variation of the above is the most likely solution rather than adding to the laser rifle's damage.
As I said, I'm looking at zero-sum changes that make the weapon easier to deploy on other suits but don't buff the weapon itself overall, nor take away the amarr assault cooldown supremacy.
Actually making the laser more effective at a baseline would absolutely create an FOTM dumpster gun. Something none of us want.
WoW has taught me that Purple means Legendary. This means Quafe suits are the optimal loadout for killing all of you.
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XxBlazikenxX
Ancient Exiles.
Bleeding Sun Conglomerate
3
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Posted - 2015.11.07 23:43:00 -
[68] - Quote
Breakin Stuff wrote:The only change I am even entertaining as more than a bad joke would be splitting and combining the amarr assault and the operation skills.
I.E. amarr assault gets 2% heat reduction, 3% cooldown
But the operation gets 3% heat reduction, 2% cooldown.
Anything else just hits me as a bad idea because I agree, the weapon is actually very good in the right hands. But putting a straight heat reduction on the commando would necessitate removing the damage bonus most likely.
So some variation of the above is the most likely solution rather than adding to the laser rifle's damage.
As I said, I'm looking at zero-sum changes that make the weapon easier to deploy on other suits but don't buff the weapon for the amssault overall, nor take away the amarr assault cooldown supremacy.
Actually making the laser more effective at a baseline would absolutely create an FOTM dumpster gun. Something none of us want.
But the weapon being useless on every other suit needs to be flyshed straight down the toilet
So much, this, oh my gosh, so much this!!!!
*goes to edit proposal
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Amarr Commando Forever
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Mortedeamor
The Black Masquerade
2
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Posted - 2015.11.08 13:52:00 -
[69] - Quote
Breakin Stuff wrote:The only change I am even entertaining as more than a bad joke would be splitting and combining the amarr assault and the operation skills.
I.E. amarr assault gets 2% heat reduction, 3% cooldown
But the operation gets 3% heat reduction, 2% cooldown.
Anything else just hits me as a bad idea because I agree, the weapon is actually very good in the right hands. But putting a straight heat reduction on the commando would necessitate removing the damage bonus most likely.
So some variation of the above is the most likely solution rather than adding to the laser rifle's damage.
As I said, I'm looking at zero-sum changes that make the weapon easier to deploy on other suits but don't buff the weapon for the amssault overall, nor take away the amarr assault cooldown supremacy.
Actually making the laser more effective at a baseline would absolutely create an FOTM dumpster gun. Something none of us want.
But the weapon being useless on every other suit needs to be flyshed straight down the toilet
yeah the last thing i want is a baseline buff...i agree actually ide prefer your solution it willl make lr viable on non amar assaults without buffing the assault lr combo
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Breakin Stuff
Goonfeet
Special Planetary Emergency Response Group
11
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Posted - 2015.11.09 02:31:00 -
[70] - Quote
There is a reason I say "some variation" of the proposed idea.
And it's not my idea. I forget who, but it was another regular player who suggested the method. I just took it as a good solution in a sea of bad choices.
The details would need to be hashed out with the cpm, and give us time to gather input, look for exploits and submit a coherent proposal for rattati to review and make a decision.
Just for most people's ease of mind, the process of proposing a change to the devs from the CPM is NEVER "this is what we want" followed by a handwave labelled "because the CPM said so.
There are actually very few proposals (especially representative of merely one view) that don't get carved up with knives by the other CPM.
Very luckily, our crew is entirely motivated by the health of the game. I have yet to see any proposal from a CPM member aimed solely at a minority demographic for benefits/nerfs.
Let's face it. If we all just smiled and nodded at each other I would stir up sh*t just to make sure SOMEONE plays "devil's advocate."
And Mortdeamor, your input on the laser rifle and why it is not underpowered is valuable, we just need more data points to find a trend. We're not actually ignoring what you have to say on the topic.
WoW has taught me that Purple means Legendary. This means Quafe suits are the optimal loadout for killing all of you.
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XxBlazikenxX
Ancient Exiles.
Bleeding Sun Conglomerate
3
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Posted - 2015.11.09 05:17:00 -
[71] - Quote
And I will fine tune my proposal when I have the time to do it.
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Amarr Commando Forever
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