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Nocturnal Soul Primordial Threat 5942	Posted - 2015.03.15 19:56:00 - [1] - Quote I'm going to skip my usual post of honey dipped words and just flat out ask why this isn't a thing or hasn't been publicly considered since I know you can create modules as evident with vehicle shield regulators and dispersion mods. Its such a huge part of EVE that entire ship bonuses revolve around them. To have these in Dust would add a whole new level of intense fittings not plagued with HP mods but instead support functions. Plus its kinda what the Amarr do. (Gê¬n+Ç-´)GèâGöüGÿån+ƒ.pâ+n+ín+ƒ. LASERS BTCH!!!!!! The Incursions are back... and they're golden baby!
True Adamance Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 17666	Posted - 2015.03.15 20:17:00 - [2] - Quote Are you referring to any of the following Reactive Plating - Plating that has comparatively low resistances across the board but adjusts its primary resistance types based on incoming damage. Energized Plating- Static across the board resistances. Damage Type Specific Plating - Higher Resistance values vs a single damage type. Raphael: I'm warning you. Do not leave me here. I will find you. Castiel: Maybe one day. Today you're my little bitch
Nocturnal Soul Primordial Threat 5944	Posted - 2015.03.15 20:19:00 - [3] - Quote True Adamance wrote: Are you referring to any of the following Reactive Plating - Plating that has comparatively low resistances across the board but adjusts its primary resistance types based on incoming damage. Energized Plating- Static across the board resistances. Damage Type Specific Plating - Higher Resistance values vs a single damage type. The 1st & 3rd (Gê¬n+Ç-´)GèâGöüGÿån+ƒ.pâ+n+ín+ƒ. LASERS BTCH!!!!!! The Incursions are back... and they're golden baby!
True Adamance Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 17667	Posted - 2015.03.15 20:44:00 - [4] - Quote Nocturnal Soul wrote: True Adamance wrote: Are you referring to any of the following Reactive Plating - Plating that has comparatively low resistances across the board but adjusts its primary resistance types based on incoming damage. Energized Plating- Static across the board resistances. Damage Type Specific Plating - Higher Resistance values vs a single damage type. The 1st & 3rd Reactive would be damn difficult to do and most certainly only useful on Sentinels given TTK is longer on them. Damage Type Specific could work wonders, especially for Shield Suits to plug the EM resistance against Laser Weapons. Raphael: I'm warning you. Do not leave me here. I will find you. Castiel: Maybe one day. Today you're my little bitch
Nocturnal Soul Primordial Threat 5945	Posted - 2015.03.15 20:54:00 - [5] - Quote True Adamance wrote: Nocturnal Soul wrote: True Adamance wrote: Are you referring to any of the following Reactive Plating - Plating that has comparatively low resistances across the board but adjusts its primary resistance types based on incoming damage. Energized Plating- Static across the board resistances. Damage Type Specific Plating - Higher Resistance values vs a single damage type. The 1st & 3rd Reactive would be damn difficult to do and most certainly only useful on Sentinels given TTK is longer on them. Damage Type Specific could work wonders, especially for Shield Suits to plug the EM resistance against Laser Weapons. Change sentinel bonus to module efficiency, that way it only applies when you fit one. Maybe start low with 3%,5%, and 7% just like light damage mods. Shields would naturally get a higher % due to lower HP module which should ease some pain for the Caldari. (Gê¬n+Ç-´)GèâGöüGÿån+ƒ.pâ+n+ín+ƒ. LASERS BTCH!!!!!! The Incursions are back... and they're golden baby!
Sgt Kirk Fatal Absolution Negative-Feedback 9908	Posted - 2015.03.15 22:22:00 - [6] - Quote Reactive playing could work on vehicle modules and I'd love to have that. It could work for infantry too but it would be too difficult to work with it. Energized and basic resistance playing could work for both infantry and vehicles. *As long as 5/6 (83%) of infantry AV weapons are Anti Armor based you're never going to achieve vehicle balance CCP*
Nocturnal Soul Primordial Threat 5947	Posted - 2015.03.15 22:26:00 - [7] - Quote Sgt Kirk wrote: Reactive playing could work on vehicle modules and I'd love to have that. It could work for infantry too but it would be too difficult to work with it. Care to explain why it would be to difficult? (Gê¬n+Ç-´)GèâGöüGÿån+ƒ.pâ+n+ín+ƒ. LASERS BTCH!!!!!! The Incursions are back... and they're golden baby!
True Adamance Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 17669	Posted - 2015.03.15 22:31:00 - [8] - Quote Nocturnal Soul wrote: Sgt Kirk wrote: Reactive playing could work on vehicle modules and I'd love to have that. It could work for infantry too but it would be too difficult to work with it. Care to explain why it would be to difficult? Reactive Plating works under the premise that over time the values shift from being universal across all damage types into one single damage type. Aka its a resistance plate the gets better the longer the same damage type is used against it. Infantry combat has too low a TTK for this to be a useful module on anything but a sentinel in most respects so finding a place for it that isnt solely the doman of the Sentinel is tricky. That's even before programming something like this into the game.... Raphael: I'm warning you. Do not leave me here. I will find you. Castiel: Maybe one day. Today you're my little bitch
Sgt Kirk Fatal Absolution Negative-Feedback 9909	Posted - 2015.03.15 22:40:00 - [9] - Quote Nocturnal Soul wrote: Sgt Kirk wrote: Reactive playing could work on vehicle modules and I'd love to have that. It could work for infantry too but it would be too difficult to work with it. Care to explain why it would be to difficult? It's a similar reason to why reactive plates aren't often used on Frigates. The current TTK doesn't allow much absorption of damage for the reactive plate to finally settle its resistances. So in a firefight, it's over before the fight could even finish a cycle. Another reason why reactives wouldn't perform ideally with infantry is that you have multiple people using all different kinds of damage types. So lets say you're a heavy suit which would be about the only suit that could make use of it. There's a group of enemies and you're down into your armor so your reactive plate kicks in. You're surviving a long time against the onslaught of enemies but your reactive plate resistances are all pretty much staying the same. Why? Because the enemy you're facing are diverse. One enemy is dealing projectile damage, one using plasma damage, explosive damage with one laser damage . Your resistances are now all over the place with not a lot to spread around at all. Even though you survive this engagement two guys with Rail rifles and bolt pistols come in and take your ass out in a second. *As long as 5/6 (83%) of infantry AV weapons are Anti Armor based you're never going to achieve vehicle balance CCP*
Nocturnal Soul Primordial Threat 5947	Posted - 2015.03.15 22:42:00 - [10] - Quote True Adamance wrote: Nocturnal Soul wrote: Sgt Kirk wrote: Reactive playing could work on vehicle modules and I'd love to have that. It could work for infantry too but it would be too difficult to work with it. Care to explain why it would be to difficult? Reactive Plating works under the premise that over time the values shift from being universal across all damage types into one single damage type. Aka its a resistance plate the gets better the longer the same damage type is used against it. Infantry combat has too low a TTK for this to be a useful module on anything but a sentinel in most respects so finding a place for it that isnt solely the doman of the Sentinel is tricky. That's even before programming something like this into the game.... Ooh I didn't know that, I thought it was just a low flat bonus to all damage types... So I guess that's what energized plates are right? (Gê¬n+Ç-´)GèâGöüGÿån+ƒ.pâ+n+ín+ƒ. LASERS BTCH!!!!!! The Incursions are back... and they're golden baby!

Sgt Kirk Fatal Absolution Negative-Feedback 9909	Posted - 2015.03.15 22:48:00 - [11] - Quote Nocturnal Soul wrote: True Adamance wrote: Nocturnal Soul wrote: Sgt Kirk wrote: Reactive playing could work on vehicle modules and I'd love to have that. It could work for infantry too but it would be too difficult to work with it. Care to explain why it would be to difficult? Reactive Plating works under the premise that over time the values shift from being universal across all damage types into one single damage type. Aka its a resistance plate the gets better the longer the same damage type is used against it. Infantry combat has too low a TTK for this to be a useful module on anything but a sentinel in most respects so finding a place for it that isnt solely the doman of the Sentinel is tricky. That's even before programming something like this into the game.... Ooh I didn't know that, I thought it was just a low flat bonus to all damage types... So I guess that's what energized plates are right? Yep. Energized plates offer more resistance than regular resistance plate but at the cost of more CPU. Regular resistance plates dont offer much resistance but dont really take much CPU. *As long as 5/6 (83%) of infantry AV weapons are Anti Armor based you're never going to achieve vehicle balance CCP*
True Adamance Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 17670	Posted - 2015.03.15 22:55:00 - [12] - Quote Sgt Kirk wrote: Nocturnal Soul wrote: Sgt Kirk wrote: Reactive playing could work on vehicle modules and I'd love to have that. It could work for infantry too but it would be too difficult to work with it. Care to explain why it would be to difficult? It's a similar reason to why reactive plates aren't often used on Frigates. The current TTK doesn't allow much absorption of damage for the reactive plate to finally settle its resistances. So in a firefight, it's over before the fight could even finish a cycle. Another reason why reactives wouldn't perform ideally with infantry is that you have multiple people using all different kinds of damage types. So lets say you're a heavy suit which would be about the only suit that could make use of it. There's a group of enemies and you're down into your armor so your reactive plate kicks in. You're surviving a long time against the onslaught of enemies but your reactive plate resistances are all pretty much staying the same. Why? Because the enemy you're facing are diverse. One enemy is dealing projectile damage, one using plasma damage, explosive damage with one laser damage . Your resistances are now all over the place with not a lot to spread around at all. Even though you survive this engagement two guys with Rail rifles and bolt pistols come in and take your ass out in a second. Tell that to the corp Tormentor Kirk. Raphael: I'm warning you. Do not leave me here. I will find you. Castiel: Maybe one day. Today you're my little bitch
Nocturnal Soul Primordial Threat 5947	Posted - 2015.03.15 22:58:00 - [13] - Quote Well then, Type specific & Regular/Energized plating it is. Now we just need a response from Rattati...which could take forever. (Gê¬n+Ç-´)GèâGöüGÿån+ƒ.pâ+n+ín+ƒ. LASERS BTCH!!!!!! The Incursions are back... and they're golden baby!
DRT 99 Commando Perkone Caldari State 271	Posted - 2015.03.16 00:47:00 - [14] - Quote reactive plating that shifts resists like in eve would be really usefull in FW. have a teamate shoot you with an SMG a bit and walk into the heavy infested building have a teamate shoot you with an AR for a bit and facetank the blaster tank, or get shotgunned and laugh.
True Adamance Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 17673	Posted - 2015.03.16 00:56:00 - [15] - Quote DRT 99 wrote: reactive plating that shifts resists like in eve would be really usefull in FW. have a teamate shoot you with an SMG a bit and walk into the heavy infested building have a teamate shoot you with an AR for a bit and facetank the blaster tank, or get shotgunned and laugh. This is precisely the reason I'd rather not see Reactive in the game. Raphael: I'm warning you. Do not leave me here. I will find you. Castiel: Maybe one day. Today you're my little bitch
Thaddeus Reynolds Facepunch Security 219	Posted - 2015.03.16 01:03:00 - [16] - Quote True Adamance wrote: DRT 99 wrote: reactive plating that shifts resists like in eve would be really usefull in FW. have a teamate shoot you with an SMG a bit and walk into the heavy infested building have a teamate shoot you with an AR for a bit and facetank the blaster tank, or get shotgunned and laugh. This is precisely the reason I'd rather not see Reactive in the game. You shoot yourself with smaller bullets to build up an immunity to larger and larger bullets Khanid Logi and Tanker, sometimes AV Heavy or Sniper. Vehicle Re-vamp Proposal
True Adamance Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 17675	Posted - 2015.03.16 02:28:00 - [17] - Quote Thaddeus Reynolds wrote: True Adamance wrote: DRT 99 wrote: reactive plating that shifts resists like in eve would be really usefull in FW. have a teamate shoot you with an SMG a bit and walk into the heavy infested building have a teamate shoot you with an AR for a bit and facetank the blaster tank, or get shotgunned and laugh. This is precisely the reason I'd rather not see Reactive in the game. You shoot yourself with smaller bullets to build up an immunity to larger and larger bullets Indeed. Artifically build up resistances is not the intended function of the resistance plate nor with our low TTK and variety of damage types would this be worth having. On vehicles perhaps this could function reasonably well as the longer a tank duel goes on the better your resistances get against the primary damage type. Raphael: I'm warning you. Do not leave me here. I will find you. Castiel: Maybe one day. Today you're my little bitch
Nocturnal Soul Primordial Threat 5959	Posted - 2015.03.16 02:46:00 - [18] - Quote I'd rather keep it simple on all accounts, reactive plates seem like a feature for "legion" (Gê¬n+Ç-´)GèâGöüGÿån+ƒ.pâ+n+ín+ƒ. LASERS BTCH!!!!!! The Incursions are back... and they're golden baby!

CCP Rattati C C P C C P Alliance 18891	Posted - 2015.03.16 04:41:00 - [19] - Quote Well, actually, if there is some OP meta, like let's say Scrambler Rifles, being able to say "I want to be properly defended against that and sacrffice HP" is pretty cool. Why not throw some ideas out, types, names, fitting cost, and values plus slot (high/low)? "As well as stupid, Rattati is incredibly slow and accident-prone, and cannot even swim"

Avallo Kantor 514	Posted - 2015.03.16 04:57:00 - [20] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: Well, actually, if there is some OP meta, like let's say Scrambler Rifles, being able to say "I want to be properly defended against that and sacrffice HP" is pretty cool. Why not throw some ideas out, types, names, fitting cost, and values plus slot (high/low)? Hardeners based on each damage type, that reduce incoming damage by 10%, 20%, 25% per level. One for Shield, and Armor, with Shields being Highs, and Armor being lows. (They should not be able to be used without sacrificing the same spaces you use for buffer mods) And similar to how extender vs hardener mods work on vehicles: About 120% CPU than same level extender / plate, and 53% PG compared to same level extender / plate.

Apocalyptic Destroyer Killers 4 Hire 327	Posted - 2015.03.16 05:16:00 - [21] - Quote Maaaan I remember resistance plates on tanks .... Good OP times.. True Amarr In Disguise Pain is weakness leaving the body Proto : ADS Pilot, Tanker Ak.0 : Mando, Scout, Assault
WeapondigitX V7 The Exemplars RISE of LEGION 281	Posted - 2015.03.16 05:47:00 - [22] - Quote Avallo Kantor wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: Well, actually, if there is some OP meta, like let's say Scrambler Rifles, being able to say "I want to be properly defended against that and sacrffice HP" is pretty cool. Why not throw some ideas out, types, names, fitting cost, and values plus slot (high/low)? Hardeners based on each damage type, that reduce incoming damage by 10%, 20%, 25% per level. One for Shield, and Armor, with Shields being Highs, and Armor being lows. (They should not be able to be used without sacrificing the same spaces you use for buffer mods) And similar to how extender vs hardener mods work on vehicles: About 120% CPU than same level extender / plate, and 53% PG compared to same level extender / plate. I would suggest laser, projectile, hybrid blaster, hybrid rail, and explosive resistance hardeners, and perhaps a special flux resistance hardener unless the flux has a damage profile of a laser or hybrid blaster, then you wouldn't need a hardener against fluxes. The explosive hardener could be used in the grenade slot so that you could map the activation button to the grenade button. (this would help heavies and other suits survive 1 RE at the last second) these hardeners might accidentally be used to reduce orbital strike damage if you get hit by 1 strike but the rest hit behind a wall etc. those orbital strikes do have damage profiles don't they? I would suggest the hardeners do not increase in hardener % but increase in duration as they advance in tier. There activation could be manual by simply selecting them in the 4th equipment slot for the quick select weapon wheel (but create a condition where they can only be usable if the 4th equipment slot is not used and create invalid fittings if a 4th equipment slot and hardener are used, for logistics suits). I would suggest the laser and hybrid blaster hardeners have a CPU dominance cost and the projectile and explosive and hybrid rail hardeners have a PG dominance cost. The suggested hardener costs: laser hardener(std/adv/pro)(high slot): 20% extra CPU cost and 1 extra PG unit compared to shield extenders of same tier. 50% hardening 10/14/17.5 second duration 55 second cooldown hybrid blaster hardener(std/adv/pro)(high slot): 16% extra CPU cost and 3 extra PG unit compared to shield extenders of same tier 50% hardening 10/14/17.5 second duration 55 second cooldown hybrid rail hardener(std/adv/pro)(low slot): 14% extra PG cost and 25 extra CPU units in cost compared to armor plates of same tier 50% hardening 10/14/17.5 second duration 55 second cooldown projectile hardener(std/adv/pro)(low slot): 14% extra PG cost and 25 extra CPU units in cost compared to armor plates of same tier 50% hardening 10/14/17.5 55 second cooldown explosive splash resistance hardener(std/adv/pro)(grenade slot): 85% hardening 6/9/11.5 second duration 40second cooldown CPU/PG std: 20/3 adv: 30/4 pro: 45/5 you cant stack them with my design
Sgt Kirk Fatal Absolution Negative-Feedback 9942	Posted - 2015.03.16 06:17:00 - [23] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: Well, actually, if there is some OP meta, like let's say Scrambler Rifles, being able to say "I want to be properly defended against that and sacrffice HP" is pretty cool. Why not throw some ideas out, types, names, fitting cost, and values plus slot (high/low)? Me and True Adamance will be more than happy to give you some good in-depth numbers. People may not realize that something like this can't be a flat set bonus for all defenses and damage types, that would cause imbalance. Me and True will take theses things into consideration and will be back with good results. *As long as 5/6 (83%) of infantry AV weapons are Anti Armor based you're never going to achieve vehicle balance CCP*
LOOKMOM NOHANDS Warpoint Sharx 245	Posted - 2015.03.16 06:34:00 - [24] - Quote I thought about these before and I am not sure they are a good fit. Yes we have them in Eve but we are also able to select an ammunition type to counter those resists. Damage profiles are already bad enough as they stand without this.
THUNDERGROOVE Fatal Absolution Negative-Feedback 1642	Posted - 2015.03.16 06:35:00 - [25] - Quote Sgt Kirk wrote: Care to explain why it would be to difficult? It's a similar reason to why reactive plates aren't often used on Frigates. [/quote] They're not used on frigates because of capacitor needs. Mace yourself, blame someone else itGÇÖs okay, no one will believe you AIV member.
True Adamance Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 17680	Posted - 2015.03.16 06:59:00 - [26] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: Well, actually, if there is some OP meta, like let's say Scrambler Rifles, being able to say "I want to be properly defended against that and sacrffice HP" is pretty cool. Why not throw some ideas out, types, names, fitting cost, and values plus slot (high/low)? Well the Damage Type Specific Modules are usually simply named after the damage types they resist EM Resistance Plating Thermic Resistance Plating Blah Blah Resistance Plating If you felt specific names were required you could name them based on minerals that exist that have a fair propensity or resisting great temperatures, forces, or explosions. E.G You could use Thermic Energized Armour Plating/ Layering EM Energized Armour Plating/ Layering Raphael: I'm warning you. Do not leave me here. I will find you. Castiel: Maybe one day. Today you're my little bitch
True Adamance Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 17680	Posted - 2015.03.16 07:01:00 - [27] - Quote LOOKMOM NOHANDS wrote: I thought about these before and I am not sure they are a good fit. Yes we have them in Eve but we are also able to select an ammunition type to counter those resists. Damage profiles are already bad enough as they stand without this. How so. A player gives up a specific slot to plug a resistance that could be of the meta or that they are weakest against. Their eHP is technically lesser but they are not necessarily subject to that weapons potent damage profile. E.G- Laser Weapons. Raphael: I'm warning you. Do not leave me here. I will find you. Castiel: Maybe one day. Today you're my little bitch
Fizzer XCIV Tal-Romon Legion Amarr Empire 2720	Posted - 2015.03.16 07:43:00 - [28] - Quote WeapondigitX V7 wrote: Avallo Kantor wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: Well, actually, if there is some OP meta, like let's say Scrambler Rifles, being able to say "I want to be properly defended against that and sacrffice HP" is pretty cool. Why not throw some ideas out, types, names, fitting cost, and values plus slot (high/low)? Hardeners based on each damage type, that reduce incoming damage by 10%, 20%, 25% per level. One for Shield, and Armor, with Shields being Highs, and Armor being lows. (They should not be able to be used without sacrificing the same spaces you use for buffer mods) And similar to how extender vs hardener mods work on vehicles: About 120% CPU than same level extender / plate, and 53% PG compared to same level extender / plate. -snip- If they are only going to work against a single damage type, they should be passives. If they reduce all damage, they should be active. Reason being that you can't really anticipate what weapon you will come across next, the majority of the time. By the time you know what weapon you are fighting next, it is usually to late to worry about activating a module, as you are likely fighting the weapon already. Also, like Ratatti said "anti-FotM"... I would set modules like these at 15/20/25% passive resistances at all times against each damage type. Make them a little easier to fit than standard HP mods (since they won't be nearly as effective overall for 80% of the weapons you'll face)... Probably about the fitting read of Ferroscales/Reactives. Resistance mods that just reduce all incoming damage by a set percentage however, should definitely be actives. With mods like they you don't have to worry about what you'll be fighting only when you'll be fighting. I'm actually not sure how these should be balanced, really. At what HP level should they become more effective than HP mods? Should they stack? If so, should they have stacking penalties? How long should they last? A single 1v1 or a full firefight? Home at Last <3
Sgt Kirk Fatal Absolution Negative-Feedback 9943	Posted - 2015.03.16 07:52:00 - [29] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: Well, actually, if there is some OP meta, like let's say Scrambler Rifles, being able to say "I want to be properly defended against that and sacrffice HP" is pretty cool. Why not throw some ideas out, types, names, fitting cost, and values plus slot (high/low)? I'm not good with explaining things so I'll let my numbers do the talking. Here's what I'm envisioning when it comes to Resistance modules: Shield Resistance modules I wish I could complete it and flesh it out some more but it's 3am here and I work tomorrow so I should really get some sleep. If what's here is well accepted then I will continue to flesh it out and make one for armor and a separate thread for it maybe. Until then. o7 guys. *As long as 5/6 (83%) of infantry AV weapons are Anti Armor based you're never going to achieve vehicle balance CCP*
Nocturnal Soul Primordial Threat 5964	Posted - 2015.03.16 07:56:00 - [30] - Quote Whoa whoa whoa now Fizz, I'm definitely a firm believer in having passive resist on infantry due to the fact the game is too chaotic to simple use to great effectiveness which is balanced by its high CPU cost and low % as True said. P.s. thanks for starting the party while I slept :( (Gê¬n+Ç-´)GèâGöüGÿån+ƒ.pâ+n+ín+ƒ. LASERS BTCH!!!!!! The Incursions are back... and they're golden baby!



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