How so. A player gives up a specific slot to plug a resistance that could be of the meta or that they are weakest against. Their eHP is technically lesser but they are not necessarily subject to that weapons potent damage profile.

E.G- Laser Weapons.

Well, actually, if there is some OP meta, like let's say Scrambler Rifles, being able to say "I want to be properly defended against that and sacrffice HP" is pretty cool.

Why not throw some ideas out, types, names, fitting cost, and values plus slot (high/low)?

I'll do up a spread sheet XD I hear you like those :)

Well, considering that i was running around with my min sentinel with 570 shield and suddenly a charged shot of SCR rifle took me to zero shield, i think that resistance modules can be quite useless, at least for shields.
They will bring more problems than benefits imo.

Well, actually, if there is some OP meta, like let's say Scrambler Rifles, being able to say "I want to be properly defended against that and sacrffice HP" is pretty cool.

Why not throw some ideas out, types, names, fitting cost, and values plus slot (high/low)?

Well, actually, if there is some OP meta, like let's say Scrambler Rifles, being able to say "I want to be properly defended against that and sacrffice HP" is pretty cool.

Why not throw some ideas out, types, names, fitting cost, and values plus slot (high/low)?

It would be important to consider how resistances would interact with damage profiles and how they apply to armor/shields.

Imagine finding out that your 20/20 profile makes you useless, because the enemy's resistance applies to their shields and armor at the same time and you are pure Amarr Assault. With brick tanking, you at least know that your weapon is doing the amount of damage that it is supposed to do.

Then again, what, exactly, is the difference between added HP and a percentage-based resistance?
In the end, both do exactly the same thing. You just have to calculate more, to know which combination of resistance and HP modules grants the best eHP. Especially if resistance gets stacking penalties.
If those modules were implemented, I'd expect the stat sheet of my dropsuit loadout to show me my eHP for all damage profiles. Because I sure as **** won't get a calculator and calculate the most effective ratio manually.

Being able to be resistant against certain damage types is nice, but the infantry TTK will cause all kinds of frustration if it's implemented. We already have the silly situation where you select a Caldari, and then randomly run into someone with a Laser Rifle and see your shields evaporate in a flash.
I generally feel that combat is too hectic to really make use of damage profiles. The other characteristics of weapons, like range and reload speed, are generally far more important due to not being dependant on the enemy.

What if stacked laser resistance made explosive weapons better against that player? Wouldn't that be very counter-intuitive on, say, a Caldari? How would you even know that your laser weapon is being blocked by resistance and not stacked shield armor modules, with the former meaning that you'd better take out your sidearm and the latter meaning that you just need to keep firing?
Do you intend to add some kind of visual or acoustic cue?

we're inventing new ways of tanking and modules based around living longer... yeah, because there's so much diversity in infantry modules.

EWAR - we got damps and precisions (dont get me started on range amps..)
BIOTICS - running, stamina , melee and jump (funny how people got pissed about introducing a new and refreshing mechanic)
DAMAGE - well.. nothing to see here, just GIMME MOAR DAMAGE mods (yeaaah, 4 types..)
KING HP - 3 types of plates, armor reps, shield extenders, shield rechargers, shield regulators (and one more which I don't remember name)

I like the idea of having resistance modules, as it adds diversity, but don't you guys think there are other modules that would enrich gameplay than just "oh, lemme live longer" mods?

Just tossing this out there, will let other's deal with the math and stuff.

You ought to consider two types of damage reduction modules, shield and armor.

I would suggest for shield damage reduction modules to be in the highs.

Armor damage reduction modules in the lows.

This lets both shield and armor tankers be able to participate in this, and this way people have to sacrifice ehp in order to balance out the -damage modules. Otherwise you will have an imbalance.

we're inventing new ways of tanking and modules based around living longer... yeah, because there's so much diversity in infantry modules.

EWAR - we got damps and precisions (dont get me started on range amps..)
BIOTICS - running, stamina , melee and jump (funny how people got pissed about introducing a new and refreshing mechanic)
DAMAGE - well.. nothing to see here, just GIMME MOAR DAMAGE mods (yeaaah, 4 types..)
KING HP - 3 types of plates, armor reps, shield extenders, shield rechargers, shield regulators (and one more which I don't remember name)

I like the idea of having resistance modules, as it adds diversity, but don't you guys think there are other modules that would enrich gameplay than just "oh, lemme live longer" mods?

Well, actually, if there is some OP meta, like let's say Scrambler Rifles, being able to say "I want to be properly defended against that and sacrffice HP" is pretty cool.

Why not throw some ideas out, types, names, fitting cost, and values plus slot (high/low)?

Hardeners based on each damage type, that reduce incoming damage by

10%, 20%, 25% per level.

One for Shield, and Armor, with Shields being Highs, and Armor being lows. (They should not be able to be used without sacrificing the same spaces you use for buffer mods)

And similar to how extender vs hardener mods work on vehicles:

About 120% CPU than same level extender / plate, and 53% PG compared to same level extender / plate.

That seems good, no longer will ScR instantly desttoy shields.

You have to be careful with that though.

You know shields already have 20% resistance to explosives, while I'm all for making it even beefier we still have to think about balance so we really shouldn't add on another 25% to that 20% with infantry weapons.

Vehicle resist and infantry resist should not be implemented the same way. Vehicles have the luxury of being a bit easier to design while infantry will require a fine scapula to make things right with it.

I'll finish the rest of that document later tonight after work.

You've a point.

At least for now a flat bonus amount may be the way to go just to test the waters.

So all Shield Amplifiers and Resistance plates will grant the same amount.

To, "throw out some ideas," I would start by saying that they shouldn't be damage specific. I know EvE does the whole explosive damage resist, laser damage resist, so on and so forth, having one specific resist mod for each damage type, but Dust has a far different meta, with no ammunition swaps or anything of the sort, so I don't think that would work out. There should just be the two categories: shield and armor.

I also don't think they should be passive. If you go passive, it is just essentially the same thing a plate/extender, just giving a flat increase to your eHP, and if you do that, then why not just equip the plates/extenders?

-SNIP-

That is an interesting idea, but the counterpoint to that would be what is the benefit of skilling up?

There would be no benefit to skilling up from basic -> proto.

we're inventing new ways of tanking and modules based around living longer... yeah, because there's so much diversity in infantry modules.

EWAR - we got damps and precisions (dont get me started on range amps..)
BIOTICS - running, stamina , melee and jump (funny how people got pissed about introducing a new and refreshing mechanic)
DAMAGE - well.. nothing to see here, just GIMME MOAR DAMAGE mods (yeaaah, 4 types..)
KING HP - 3 types of plates, armor reps, shield extenders, shield rechargers, shield regulators (and one more which I don't remember name)

I like the idea of having resistance modules, as it adds diversity, but don't you guys think there are other modules that would enrich gameplay than just "oh, lemme live longer" mods?

Me and True Adamance(if he even shows up) will be more than happy to give you some good in-depth numbers.


People may not realize that something like this can't be a flat set bonus for all defenses and damage types, that would cause imbalance. Me and True will take theses things into consideration and will be back with good results.

I hope these come with Suit Capacitors (Or at least cooldowns)

Also: I would love to see active module tanking on suit side as well. We have lots of passive mods for infantry, but it would be really cool to see active mods on infantry.

For example: A shield booster would go a long way on a Cal Heavy, and the same for a heavy rep booster for a Gal Sent.

Active Resist for an Amarr Heavy to tank HMG fire. Scouts could then have equipment or grenades that could sap suits "Capacitors" deactivating and draining all active mods. Logis could get a tool reduces cooldowns (Remote Capacitor).

Even Cooler? Active Damage mods for when you gotta breach a room, or to put massive DPS on a vehicle.

You would sacrifice overall HP or constant benefits for short, powerful bursts of HP or Damage (or Rep). Benefit of this tanking is the extra power gained in bursts would make you difficult to fight in cycle, but susceptible to flanking when off cycle (or even being forced to attack/defend in cycles.)

I also want my Biotic Booster mods. Sprint at 30 m/s in a Min Scout

GOTTA GO FAST

Active modules would be tough to do....perhaps just let us try for the passives. I'll need Kirk to run me through his thinking in the spread sheet and we can go from there.

If they are only going to work against a single damage type, they should be passives.
If they reduce all damage, they should be active.

Reason being that you can't really anticipate what weapon you will come across next, the majority of the time.
By the time you know what weapon you are fighting next, it is usually to late to worry about activating a module, as you are likely fighting the weapon already.
Also, like Ratatti said "anti-FotM"...
I would set modules like these at 15/20/25% passive resistances at all times against each damage type. Make them a little easier to fit than standard HP mods (since they won't be nearly as effective overall for 80% of the weapons you'll face)... Probably about the fitting read of Ferroscales/Reactives.

Resistance mods that just reduce all incoming damage by a set percentage however, should definitely be actives. With mods like they you don't have to worry about what you'll be fighting only when you'll be fighting.
I'm actually not sure how these should be balanced, really.
At what HP level should they become more effective than HP mods? Should they stack? If so, should they have stacking penalties? How long should they last? A single 1v1 or a full firefight?

If they are active and reduce all damage by a %, and can or can not be stacked, they would also be able to reliably be used as defensive modules to counter a ambush, assassination from behind if the assassin uses weapons like rifles or massdrivers.
It is already possible to be hit/ambushed from behind and turn around and kill your opponent if the gear difference is large enough, and the assassin is only moderately good at aiming. With active hardening mods it would be much easier to do that if your hardener reduced all damage.

If active hardeners only affected 1 damage type, this would be less of an issue, because you sometimes cant tell what weapon your assassin is using when he is firing from behind you at a large distance.

You could however create active hardener modules that reduced all damage by a % but with a large activation delay, such as 3 seconds, this would limit those modules to being used during well planned attacks, when entering hotspots before the anticipated assassin comes, or when you burst out of cover to attack an enemy in a firefight that is also close to you behind cover.