DUST Search - Why the hmg hate?

Ripley Riley wrote:

Grease Spillett wrote:

I think they are balanced. A sentinel should be the highest killer on the field in cqc. I kill them all the time when they run point to point so I just avoid areas where they work best. There's no reason to nerf them? I watch them die like idiots for almost a year. I don't mind them being good at something. I think its unfair to nerf anything because it works. But if you call for a nerf that's what you get.

Why are they deemed the most potent CQC dropsuit? That would give them the most durability and highest killing potential... Pick one.

Again with the "avoid areas where they work best" nonsense. The areas they work best also happen to around the VICTORY objectives so this is not a valid argument.

As for killing them when they run point to point, vehicles can provide easy transport for sentinels so that can be a non-factor in squads.

Past performance (good or bad) of an item should not dictate how well it is allowed to perform in the present. If sentinels are overperforming other dropsuits by leaps and bounds then they need to be balanced in some way; turn speed reduction with an HMG, reduce/remove the splash damage resistance, whatever.

Hardcore sentinel mercs can either start offering up ways to balance their profession or let CCP decide their fate without input.

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Grease Spillett Bloodline Rebellion Capital Punishment. 541	Posted - 2014.11.17 01:16:00 - [1] - Quote I really don't get it?? I run hmg from time to time it does just like I would expect a massive close quarters machine gun would. If you are assault stay outside?? If you are a scout shotgun the guy he cant see you when you're dampened. I don't understand people at all. I guess we really won't ever get to a set game. CCP are you really always going to nerf/buff? Next time you see me, bring more friends. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gBM5hM5LdDw
Thumb Green Raymond James Corp 1751	Posted - 2014.11.17 01:19:00 - [2] - Quote Like a lot of QQ on the forum it boils down to "it's not my preferred weapon / playstyle and I'm to lazy too properly counter it". I'm surprised Maynard hasn't been assassinated yet. Join us in our Pumpkin Crushing
Jacques Cayton II Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 1086	Posted - 2014.11.17 01:26:00 - [3] - Quote I love the hmg but its beimg spammed so it will receive a nerf and thats why if it should receive ome just the heat build up should increase nothing else We fight for the future of the State not our personal goals
Grease Spillett Bloodline Rebellion Capital Punishment. 542	Posted - 2014.11.17 01:35:00 - [4] - Quote Jacques Cayton II wrote: I love the hmg but its beimg spammed so it will receive a nerf and thats why if it should receive ome just the heat build up should increase nothing else I have to blame map design for this. If you have a bunch of maps conducive to close quarters then duh your going to have hmg's and shotguns everywhere. Next time you see me, bring more friends. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gBM5hM5LdDw
castba Holdfast Syndicate Amarr Empire 643	Posted - 2014.11.17 01:37:00 - [5] - Quote Jacques Cayton II wrote: I love the hmg but its beimg spammed so it will receive a nerf and thats why if it should receive ome just the heat build up should increase nothing else Good Lord, if there is a heat increase on the burst it will be useless. Could do with a very slight damage increase (0.5 Hp) IMO. Standard Hmg heat increase? Sure. Assault? Leave as is. "When everything is OP, nothing is" - CCP Ratatti
Powerh8er The Rainbow Effect 535	Posted - 2014.11.17 01:40:00 - [6] - Quote Because they are a bunch of nerds. NERDS!
Thumb Green Raymond James Corp 1754	Posted - 2014.11.17 01:41:00 - [7] - Quote Grease Spillett wrote: Jacques Cayton II wrote: I love the hmg but its beimg spammed so it will receive a nerf and thats why if it should receive ome just the heat build up should increase nothing else I have to blame map design for this. If you have a bunch of maps conducive to close quarters then duh your going to have hmg's and shotguns everywhere. Exactly, I don't pull out my HMG Sentinel on Manus Peak for example because most of the fighting isn't CQC. I'm surprised Maynard hasn't been assassinated yet. Join us in our Pumpkin Crushing
Vicious Minotaur 1340	Posted - 2014.11.17 01:59:00 - [8] - Quote Well, what do you think the 'H' in HMG stands for? Hate. Duh. As in "Hate My Gun" I am a minotaur.
Thumb Green Raymond James Corp 1754	Posted - 2014.11.17 02:01:00 - [9] - Quote Jacques Cayton II wrote: I love the hmg but its beimg spammed so it will receive a nerf and thats why if it should receive ome just the heat build up should increase nothing else I can't support another heat build up increase but I would support a spoil up time like someone in another thread suggested (it's logical as well). Dust is the only game I can recall with a Gatling-style gun that doesn't have a spoil up tum. Though if they do go with more heat build up then they need to decrease cool down time from overheating (not drastically of course, I'd say go with 3/4th what it is now and see how that works) because as it stands now with how long it takes to cool down I'd rather it just straight up killed you when you overheated, even if you had full health. It feels like a Flaylock could kill you twice over with just splash damage in the time it takes the HMG to cool off. I'm surprised Maynard hasn't been assassinated yet. Join us in our Pumpkin Crushing
Ripley Riley Incorruptibles 4838	Posted - 2014.11.17 02:02:00 - [10] - Quote Grease Spillett wrote: If you are assault stay outside? A big problem with this "advice" from HMG sentinels is that a lot of skirm and dom objectives are located inside. So basically, you are saying "Assaults, don't push the objective." Which is kind of bullshit, don't you think? My advice to you, playa...

Zatara Rought Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 4556	Posted - 2014.11.17 02:09:00 - [11] - Quote Ripley Riley wrote: Grease Spillett wrote: If you are assault stay outside? A big problem with this "advice" from HMG sentinels is that a lot of skirm and dom objectives are located inside. So basically, you are saying "Assaults, don't push the objective." Which is kind of bullshit, don't you think? Jesus I'm starting to think you read my mind. B3RT > PFBHz > TEAM > MHPD > IMPS > FA They call me ~Princess Zatata~ Skype: Zatara.Rought Twitter: @ZataraRought
Fizzer XCIV Heaven's Lost Property 1116	Posted - 2014.11.17 02:09:00 - [12] - Quote First of all, yes. We won't ever get to a set game balance. Perfect balance is impossible, and CCP has to shake up the meta from time to time regardless of how well balanced we ever become. And this is perfectly fine in the living, breathing world of New Eden. A lot of long-term games work this way. And I believe the HMG is hated because, by what I've seen and heard, it is relentlessly spammed in PC and FW matches. And this is spilling into pubs a little bit. That and Sentinels are #2 on the FotM list after Scouts. After the last few scout nerfs, they may have switched places... Please, make my Opus pretty...
Zatara Rought Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 4556	Posted - 2014.11.17 02:10:00 - [13] - Quote castba wrote: Jacques Cayton II wrote: I love the hmg but its beimg spammed so it will receive a nerf and thats why if it should receive ome just the heat build up should increase nothing else Good Lord, if there is a heat increase on the burst it will be useless. Could do with a very slight damage increase (0.5 Hp) IMO. Standard Hmg heat increase? Sure. Assault? Leave as is. I think he's only talking about the regular variant. Honestly the assault needs a tighter dispersion so that it can do it's intended job at the ranges it should. B3RT > PFBHz > TEAM > MHPD > IMPS > FA They call me ~Princess Zatata~ Skype: Zatara.Rought Twitter: @ZataraRought
Ripley Riley Incorruptibles 4840	Posted - 2014.11.17 02:11:00 - [14] - Quote Zatara Rought wrote: Jesus I'm starting to think you read my mind. I can, but I stopped recently... ***** kittened up. My advice to you, playa...
Grease Spillett Bloodline Rebellion Capital Punishment. 543	Posted - 2014.11.17 02:12:00 - [15] - Quote Ripley Riley wrote: Grease Spillett wrote: If you are assault stay outside? A big problem with this "advice" from HMG sentinels is that a lot of skirm and dom objectives are located inside. So basically, you are saying "Assaults, don't push the objective." Which is kind of bullshit, don't you think? Grenades into a breaching motion. Multiple assaults could be used to take those heavies down. But not a lot of people are good at that stuff. or have a squad to support that kind of move. So no I'm saying play to your strength. And outside mid to long range is your role as assault. close to mid is heavy and scout. you know? Next time you see me, bring more friends. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gBM5hM5LdDw
Ripley Riley Incorruptibles 4840	Posted - 2014.11.17 02:14:00 - [16] - Quote Grease Spillett wrote: Grenades into a breaching motion. If sentinels didn't get an innate resistance to splash damage this might be more viable. Also, shield sentinels giggle as grenades tickle them. They giggle like drunken sumo wrestlers. My advice to you, playa...
Grease Spillett Bloodline Rebellion Capital Punishment. 543	Posted - 2014.11.17 02:16:00 - [17] - Quote Ripley Riley wrote: Grease Spillett wrote: Grenades into a breaching motion. If sentinels didn't get an innate resistance to splash damage this might be more viable. Slight nade buff should be ******* high on CCP to do list. They are nowhere near what they should be and I think everyone would agree. Next time you see me, bring more friends. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gBM5hM5LdDw
Blueprint For Murder Immortal Guides 300	Posted - 2014.11.17 02:17:00 - [18] - Quote They just reduced the effect to counter you guys and use REs in general you guys are getting nerfed. I vote turn speed so the class requires support and is not an effective solo unit. The Impossible Dream-Wizard Talk @MMoMerc
Ripley Riley Incorruptibles 4840	Posted - 2014.11.17 02:18:00 - [19] - Quote Grease Spillett wrote: Slight nade buff should be ******* high on CCP to do list. They are nowhere near what they should be and I think everyone would agree. A grenade buff would indirectly buff any dropsuit that could carry a grenade; assault, scout (because they totally need that...), logi. we are trying to balance sentinels, not buff everyone. Instead, half or remove the splash damage resistance from sentinels. My advice to you, playa...
Grease Spillett Bloodline Rebellion Capital Punishment. 545	Posted - 2014.11.17 02:23:00 - [20] - Quote Ripley Riley wrote: Grease Spillett wrote: Slight nade buff should be ******* high on CCP to do list. They are nowhere near what they should be and I think everyone would agree. A grenade buff would indirectly buff any dropsuit that could carry a grenade; assault, scout (because they totally need that...), logi. we are trying to balance sentinels, not buff everyone. Instead, half or remove the splash damage resistance from sentinels. I think they are balanced. A sentinel should be the highest killer on the field in cqc. I kill them all the time when they run point to point so I just avoid areas where they work best. There's no reason to nerf them? I watch them die like idiots for almost a year. I don't mind them being good at something. I think its unfair to nerf anything because it works. But if you call for a nerf that's what you get. Next time you see me, bring more friends. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gBM5hM5LdDw

Fizzer XCIV Heaven's Lost Property 1117	Posted - 2014.11.17 02:23:00 - [21] - Quote Grease Spillett wrote: Ripley Riley wrote: Grease Spillett wrote: If you are assault stay outside? A big problem with this "advice" from HMG sentinels is that a lot of skirm and dom objectives are located inside. So basically, you are saying "Assaults, don't push the objective." Which is kind of bullshit, don't you think? Grenades into a breaching motion. Multiple assaults could be used to take those heavies down. But not a lot of people are good at that stuff. or have a squad to support that kind of move. So no I'm saying play to your strength. And outside mid to long range is your role as assault. close to mid is heavy and scout. you know? So what are the AR and CR wielding Assaults supposed to do then? Not play? And ranges aren't dictated by class at all... what makes you get that idea? Ranges are dictated by weapon choice. Please, make my Opus pretty...
Henrietta Unknown Kirjuun Heiian 483	Posted - 2014.11.17 02:26:00 - [22] - Quote Trying to win a Domination or even Skirmish in pubs and FW is pointless if no matter how much you provide for the team, they can't keep the hack because they can't counter the Sentinel/Logi Spam. And even if I were to RE a bunch, they'd kill me, and the dead would return from the bajillion other uplinks around. I hear the situation is worse in PC. Broken mechanics. Give the Magsex some love.
Grease Spillett Bloodline Rebellion Capital Punishment. 545	Posted - 2014.11.17 02:27:00 - [23] - Quote Fizzer XCIV wrote: Grease Spillett wrote: Ripley Riley wrote: Grease Spillett wrote: If you are assault stay outside? A big problem with this "advice" from HMG sentinels is that a lot of skirm and dom objectives are located inside. So basically, you are saying "Assaults, don't push the objective." Which is kind of bullshit, don't you think? Grenades into a breaching motion. Multiple assaults could be used to take those heavies down. But not a lot of people are good at that stuff. or have a squad to support that kind of move. So no I'm saying play to your strength. And outside mid to long range is your role as assault. close to mid is heavy and scout. you know? So what are the AR and CR wielding Assaults supposed to do then? Not play? And ranges aren't dictated by class at all... what makes you get that idea? Ranges are dictated by weapon choice. If you choose combat rifle your awesome vs 2 types of heavies right? and vice versa for rail rifle or ar? At a distance of about 30-60 meters they aren't even competitive HMG. So honestly blame map design not weapons or suits. They are pretty well balanced. Next time you see me, bring more friends. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gBM5hM5LdDw
Grease Spillett Bloodline Rebellion Capital Punishment. 546	Posted - 2014.11.17 02:29:00 - [24] - Quote Henrietta Unknown wrote: Trying to win a Domination or even Skirmish in pubs and FW is pointless if no matter how much you provide for the team, they can't keep the hack because they can't counter the Sentinel/Logi Spam. And even if I were to RE a bunch, they'd kill me, and the dead would return from the bajillion other uplinks around. I hear the situation is worse in PC. Broken mechanics. Lol nerf them and you'll gripe about assault spam or scout spam. I would much rather gripe about something that was designed to do a job doing its job. OH wait that's what the nerf hmg issue is. That bad boy was so horrible for so long. I feel for every heavy that played during those days. Next time you see me, bring more friends. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gBM5hM5LdDw
MINA Longstrike Kirjuun Heiian 1627	Posted - 2014.11.17 02:32:00 - [25] - Quote 720 dps +/- 15% (612 vs shield, 828 vs armor) with zero skillpoint investment and no damage mods, with skillpoint investment it only gets better and better. It is an incredibly 'low skill' requirement weapon that does disproportionate amounts of damage. Practically anything within 30m of a HMG dies in less than two seconds of fire unless they get INCREDIBLY lucky. Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu. Kirjuun Heiian. I have a few alts.
Ripley Riley Incorruptibles 4843	Posted - 2014.11.17 02:33:00 - [26] - Quote Grease Spillett wrote: I think they are balanced. A sentinel should be the highest killer on the field in cqc. I kill them all the time when they run point to point so I just avoid areas where they work best. There's no reason to nerf them? I watch them die like idiots for almost a year. I don't mind them being good at something. I think its unfair to nerf anything because it works. But if you call for a nerf that's what you get. Why are they deemed the most potent CQC dropsuit? That would give them the most durability and highest killing potential... Pick one. Again with the "avoid areas where they work best" nonsense. The areas they work best also happen to around the VICTORY objectives so this is not a valid argument. As for killing them when they run point to point, vehicles can provide easy transport for sentinels so that can be a non-factor in squads. Past performance (good or bad) of an item should not dictate how well it is allowed to perform in the present. If sentinels are overperforming other dropsuits by leaps and bounds then they need to be balanced in some way; turn speed reduction with an HMG, reduce/remove the splash damage resistance, whatever. Hardcore sentinel mercs can either start offering up ways to balance their profession or let CCP decide their fate without input. My advice to you, playa...
Lupus Wolf Minmatar Republic 40	Posted - 2014.11.17 02:33:00 - [27] - Quote Grease Spillett wrote: I really don't get it?? I run hmg from time to time it does just like I would expect a massive close quarters machine gun would. If you are assault stay outside?? If you are a scout shotgun the guy he cant see you when you're dampened. I don't understand people at all. I guess we really won't ever get to a set game. CCP are you really always going to nerf/buff? Because ADS has been nerfed, RR has been nerfed, cloak has been nerfed, something else needs to be nerfed for the cycle to continue. Sky whale mating rituals!! Go home Damage Indicator, you're drunk Good, good... let the nanites flow through you
Grease Spillett Bloodline Rebellion Capital Punishment. 546	Posted - 2014.11.17 02:34:00 - [28] - Quote Ripley Riley wrote: Grease Spillett wrote: I think they are balanced. A sentinel should be the highest killer on the field in cqc. I kill them all the time when they run point to point so I just avoid areas where they work best. There's no reason to nerf them? I watch them die like idiots for almost a year. I don't mind them being good at something. I think its unfair to nerf anything because it works. But if you call for a nerf that's what you get. Why are they deemed the most potent CQC dropsuit? That would give them the most durability and highest killing potential... Pick one. Again with the "avoid areas where they work best" nonsense. The areas they work best also happen to around the VICTORY objectives so this is not a valid argument. As for killing them when they run point to point, vehicles can provide easy transport for sentinels so that can be a non-factor in squads. Past performance (good or bad) of an item should not dictate how well it is allowed to perform in the present. If sentinels are overperforming other dropsuits by leaps and bounds then they need to be balanced in some way; turn speed reduction with an HMG, reduce/remove the splash damage resistance, whatever. Hardcore sentinel mercs can either start offering up ways to balance their profession or let CCP decide their fate without input. Next time you see me, bring more friends. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gBM5hM5LdDw
DDx77 The Exemplars Top Men. 25	Posted - 2014.11.17 02:43:00 - [29] - Quote Only thing I hate is the range, I know that may sound dumb but I think it should be reduced. You can hold down points and area deny almost everything. Combined with your hp it is the best weapon in the game It should kill everything cqc
Vitantur Nothus Nos Nothi 289	Posted - 2014.11.17 02:46:00 - [30] - Quote Grease Spillett wrote: Ripley Riley wrote: Grease Spillett wrote: Grenades into a breaching motion. If sentinels didn't get an innate resistance to splash damage this might be more viable. Slight nade buff should be ******* high on CCP to do list. They are nowhere near what they should be and I think everyone would agree. This, and perhaps a reduction to sentinel explosive resistance.



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