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Aeon Amadi
Fatal Absolution
General Tso's Alliance
6679
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Posted - 2014.10.14 11:18:00 -
[1] - Quote
Been something I've been badgering the guys on Skype about. While I love the idea of Legion, it kind of angers me that we're pouring so much effort into a game that would be Dust 514 as it was intended (let alone without being green lit) and abandoning the game that is actually pulling revenue, at least as far as active development goes.
Considering the sheer lack of communication and status updates about Legion, I'm starting to get the impression that it didn't get green lit/is still up in the air... Which, I can't help but wonder what you do with an entire development team that went off to make a game without 100% authorization from the higher ups.
Do they drop Legion all together and essentially have wasted an entire year of development to come back to Dust 514?
Do they take the White Wolf - World of Darkness route and just fade away..?
Inquiring minds need to know where all the money is going from these BPOs that are suddenly being sold.
{ | bittervetmode = 1
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== Description ==
This player has reached their breaking point
[[Category: Angry]]
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Echo 1991
WarRavens
Capital Punishment.
498
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Posted - 2014.10.14 11:23:00 -
[2] - Quote
I really hope it isn't going to development hell. |
Aeon Amadi
Fatal Absolution
General Tso's Alliance
6679
|
Posted - 2014.10.14 11:27:00 -
[3] - Quote
Echo 1991 wrote:I really hope it isn't going to development hell.
Do we have any reason to believe that it hasn't..?
{ | bittervetmode = 1
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== Description ==
This player has reached their breaking point
[[Category: Angry]]
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Echo 1991
WarRavens
Capital Punishment.
498
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Posted - 2014.10.14 11:30:00 -
[4] - Quote
Nope. Just wishful thinking. |
Izlare Lenix
Vengeance Unbound
Dark Taboo
1048
|
Posted - 2014.10.14 11:35:00 -
[5] - Quote
If Legion dies so will my enjoyment of the FPS genre. The fact that Destiny is supposed to be the "Pinnacle" of FPSs proves just how sad the whole genre is now.
At least Dust/Legion are unique with real loss and risk/reward.
Gun control is not about guns...it's about control.
The only way to ensure freedom is by having the means to defend it.
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Blueprint For Murder
Immortal Guides
112
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Posted - 2014.10.14 11:40:00 -
[6] - Quote
They said items, sp, and isk would be transferable so I am not worried. While the new features that will be added in legion are epic the most important thing is re-branding even if it was Dust 2 with some proper marketing. They have the best fps here and once everyone hears some buzz it is going to blow up. I would be a little disappointed if it was not on ps4 I need a reason to buy one.
New, delicious, Soylent green the miracle food of high-energy plankton gathered from the oceans of the world.
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Aeon Amadi
Fatal Absolution
General Tso's Alliance
6679
|
Posted - 2014.10.14 11:54:00 -
[7] - Quote
Blueprint For Murder wrote:They said items, sp, and isk would be transferable so I am not worried. While the new features that will be added in legion are epic the most important thing is re-branding even if it was Dust 2 with some proper marketing. They have the best fps here and once everyone hears some buzz it is going to blow up. I would be a little disappointed if it was not on ps4 I need a reason to buy one.
Did you even read the OP O.o??
{ | bittervetmode = 1
I }
== Description ==
This player has reached their breaking point
[[Category: Angry]]
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Mobius Wyvern
Onslaught Inc
RISE of LEGION
5330
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Posted - 2014.10.14 12:03:00 -
[8] - Quote
Aeon Amadi wrote:Blueprint For Murder wrote:They said items, sp, and isk would be transferable so I am not worried. While the new features that will be added in legion are epic the most important thing is re-branding even if it was Dust 2 with some proper marketing. They have the best fps here and once everyone hears some buzz it is going to blow up. I would be a little disappointed if it was not on ps4 I need a reason to buy one.
Did you even read the OP O.o??
Yeah, nothing's getting transferred if neither game exists anymore.
Notice even that though Dust 514 was on the schedule for EVE Vegas this year, Project Legion isn't mentioned on this year's schedule at all. To look at that schedule, you would think EVE Online and EVE: Valkyrie were the only games CCP has made.
Either there's a lot of not good things going on at CCP Shanghai right now, or someone there is dumb enough to think it's a good idea to once again not say a single thing about development until FanFest.
I'd actually prefer the former, because I think the latter would make me punch somebody.
Amidst the blue skies
A link from past to future
The sheltering wings of the protector
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Stefan Stahl
Seituoda Taskforce Command
764
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Posted - 2014.10.14 12:11:00 -
[9] - Quote
Aeon Amadi wrote:Inquiring minds need to know where all the money is going from these BPOs that are suddenly being sold. I'm with you here (and the rest of your post - cut for brevity). Our holy savior Rattati probably can't turn CCP into a functioning company and make it communicate its mid-term plans to its customers single-handedly, but in his position he has every interest to communicate where Dust is heading.
If we're supposed to spend money on Dust we need to know what the state of affairs is going to be in 6-12 months time - and for that we'll need a commitment that hopefully doesn't contain the expression "laser focused". If we want any words from CCP regarding the future, I guess that is the best avenue to make them say something.
Personally, my money is on Legion being scrapped, its assets being deleted (no more RAM on that PS3, sorry) and then all future efforts directed towards Eve and Valkyrie until the latter is scrapped too. I can't make an estimate on how long Rattati can make them keep the Dust servers up. I honestly have no idea whether Dust in it's current form is profitable at all. |
Ripley Riley
Incorruptibles
3666
|
Posted - 2014.10.14 12:13:00 -
[10] - Quote
Aeon Amadi wrote:Been something I've been badgering the guys on Skype about. While I love the idea of Legion, it kind of angers me that we're pouring so much effort into a game that would be Dust 514 as it was intended (let alone without being green lit) and abandoning the game that is actually pulling revenue, at least as far as active development goes. My guess is CCP determined Legion would be, in the end, more profitable than Dust 514 would be.
It is a question of RoI (return on investment). CCP can put the revenue generated by Dust 514 into Dust 514 to generate ($X) or they can put the money into Legion development and receive ($X+1). Like any for-profit business they chose the route that they believe will make them more money.
Aeon Amadi wrote:Considering the sheer lack of communication and status updates about Legion, I'm starting to get the impression that it didn't get green lit/is still up in the air... Which, I can't help but wonder what you do with an entire development team that went off to make a game without 100% authorization from the higher ups. CPM1 continues to tell us that Legion is in development and that they are beating down CCP's door trying to get them to talk to us about it  CCP is ignoring them and choosing to remain perfectly silent. That does not make me more confident in Legion's development.
If we learn anything it will be during fanfest 2015.
Aeon Amadi wrote:Do they drop Legion all together and essentially have wasted an entire year of development to come back to Dust 514?
Do they take the White Wolf - World of Darkness route and just fade away..? Doubtful. They would have announced it in a similar fashion to how they announced WoW was dead. Plus the CPM1 says development on Legion is ongoing.
Aeon Amadi wrote:Inquiring minds need to know where all the money is going from these BPOs that are suddenly being sold. CCP. That's where the money is going. As a consumer, that's all we get to know. If you want to know more then buy some CCP stock and become a shareholder. Then they might tell you a bit more about where their R&D money is flowing.
Edit: CCP may be privately owned. In that case, find a way to become an investor  Otherwise, just accept that CCP doesn't have to tell you what they are doing with their money.
My advice to you, playa...
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Aeon Amadi
Fatal Absolution
General Tso's Alliance
6680
|
Posted - 2014.10.14 12:29:00 -
[11] - Quote
Ripley Riley wrote:-Snip-
You have to kind of wonder why the bloody hell any of us should even buy the BPOs/Boosters anymore when we don't know that the revenue is being put into anything that contributes to the longevity of the game we're playing, be it on the PS3 or on the PC.
And as far as the CPM whispering sweet nothings in our ear about Project Legion - bear in mind that the CPM 0 for the longest time had a rather hopeful outlook on their faces up until the Project Legion announcement at Fanfest; when the curtain was pulled to reveal the nebulous concept that, "Hey, we've -TECHNICALLY- been doing development!". So, I'd take that as a grain of salt because (like just about everything else) there's very little to show for it as proof.
To be completely honest, if I were an investor, I'd be kinda pissed at the whole situation. As a consumer, I have to think like an investor at times and this is one of them. Why should I invest in something that I have no idea is being put to good use, despite simply being told (repeatedly I might add) that it -is- being put to good use?
Just assume for a second that Project Legion -did not- get green lit... That development for both Legion and Dust 514 has been cancelled. What good does it do to spend money on it? That's the assumption I have until I see something concrete.
{ | bittervetmode = 1
I }
== Description ==
This player has reached their breaking point
[[Category: Angry]]
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Stefan Stahl
Seituoda Taskforce Command
765
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Posted - 2014.10.14 12:38:00 -
[12] - Quote
Aeon Amadi wrote:As a consumer, I have to think like an investor at times and this is one of them. Normally as a customer we buy a product and then we're happy with that. That isn't an investment, of course. In this case however we're buying digital products that are being supplied to us as a service. Now we're talking about an investment. Spend money now, receive service later. Depending on the money-to-service rate that we as customers find acceptable we need to worry about the mid-term future of the game to make judgments on whether we want to invest. These new BPOs are really pulling this issues to the surface.
If I was very certain that this game still exists in 2 years time I'd have no trouble spending comparatively much money on Dust. As it is I have to consider the possibility that CCP announces the end of Dust in the near future and that I won't get my money's worth. |
Ripley Riley
Incorruptibles
3668
|
Posted - 2014.10.14 12:39:00 -
[13] - Quote
Aeon Amadi wrote:You have to kind of wonder why the bloody hell any of us should even buy the BPOs/Boosters anymore when we don't know that the revenue is being put into anything that contributes to the longevity of the game we're playing, be it on the PS3 or on the PC. Then don't spend money on a game with the mindset that it must exist 1 year from now. Ask yourself, "Will spending $X on this game provide me enjoyment for at least 30 days?" If the answer is yes, then buy whatever it is. If it is no, then don't.
Take this advice and you will enjoy gaming a great deal more.
Aeon Amadi wrote:And as far as the CPM whispering sweet nothings in our ear about Project Legion - bear in mind that the CPM 0 for the longest time had a rather hopeful outlook on their faces up until the Project Legion announcement at Fanfest; when the curtain was pulled to reveal the nebulous concept that, "Hey, we've -TECHNICALLY- been doing development!". So, I'd take that as a grain of salt because (like just about everything else) there's very little to show for it as proof. Familiarize yourself with this legal concept.
Aeon Amadi wrote:To be completely honest, if I were an investor, I'd be kinda pissed at the whole situation. As a consumer, I have to think like an investor at times and this is one of them. Why should I invest in something that I have no idea is being put to good use, despite simply being told (repeatedly I might add) that it -is- being put to good use? See above: "Will spending $X on this game provide me enjoyment for at least 30 days?"
Aeon Amadi wrote:Just assume for a second that Project Legion -did not- get green lit... That development for both Legion and Dust 514 has been cancelled. What good does it do to spend money on it? That's the assumption I have until I see something concrete. Spending money on it should add something resembling entertainment to your life. Stop caring about what CCP does with the that money and start caring about if your purchase will add enjoyment to your weekends.
My advice to you, playa...
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Aeon Amadi
Fatal Absolution
General Tso's Alliance
6680
|
Posted - 2014.10.14 12:41:00 -
[14] - Quote
Ripley Riley wrote:Aeon Amadi wrote:You have to kind of wonder why the bloody hell any of us should even buy the BPOs/Boosters anymore when we don't know that the revenue is being put into anything that contributes to the longevity of the game we're playing, be it on the PS3 or on the PC. Then don't spend money on a game with the mindset that it must exist 1 year from now. Ask yourself, "Will spending $X on this game provide me enjoyment for at least 30 days?" If the answer is yes, then buy whatever it is. If it is no, then don't. Take this advice and you will enjoy gaming a great deal more. Aeon Amadi wrote:And as far as the CPM whispering sweet nothings in our ear about Project Legion - bear in mind that the CPM 0 for the longest time had a rather hopeful outlook on their faces up until the Project Legion announcement at Fanfest; when the curtain was pulled to reveal the nebulous concept that, "Hey, we've -TECHNICALLY- been doing development!". So, I'd take that as a grain of salt because (like just about everything else) there's very little to show for it as proof. Familiarize yourself with this legal concept.Aeon Amadi wrote:To be completely honest, if I were an investor, I'd be kinda pissed at the whole situation. As a consumer, I have to think like an investor at times and this is one of them. Why should I invest in something that I have no idea is being put to good use, despite simply being told (repeatedly I might add) that it -is- being put to good use?]/quote]See above: "Will spending $X on this game provide me enjoyment for at least 30 days?"
[quote=Aeon Amadi]Just assume for a second that Project Legion -did not- get green lit... That development for both Legion and Dust 514 has been cancelled. What good does it do to spend money on it? That's the assumption I have until I see something concrete. Spending money on it should add something resembling entertainment to your life. Stop caring about what CCP does with the that money and start caring about if your purchase will add enjoyment to your weekends.
Well if we're expected to take that advice, let's all just go play more worthy games and let this one die off in peace, lol.
{ | bittervetmode = 1
I }
== Description ==
This player has reached their breaking point
[[Category: Angry]]
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Ripley Riley
Incorruptibles
3668
|
Posted - 2014.10.14 12:42:00 -
[15] - Quote
Aeon Amadi wrote:Well if we're expected to take that advice, let's all just go play more worthy games and let this one die off in peace, lol. If you really feel that way then head off to greener pastures  I'm still having fun playing Dust 514 and I want to see where this Legion thing is going, so I'm going to stick around.
My advice to you, playa...
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Aeon Amadi
Fatal Absolution
General Tso's Alliance
6680
|
Posted - 2014.10.14 12:45:00 -
[16] - Quote
Ripley Riley wrote:Aeon Amadi wrote:Well if we're expected to take that advice, let's all just go play more worthy games and let this one die off in peace, lol. If you really feel that way then head off to greener pastures I'm still having fun playing Dust 514 and I want to see where this Legion thing is going, so I'm going to stick around.
And if it doesn't go anywhere?
{ | bittervetmode = 1
I }
== Description ==
This player has reached their breaking point
[[Category: Angry]]
|
Ripley Riley
Incorruptibles
3668
|
Posted - 2014.10.14 12:49:00 -
[17] - Quote
Aeon Amadi wrote:And if it doesn't go anywhere? Since I've been basing my purchases on enjoyment rather than being a puesdo-investor, it's not a loss. I got to play a fun sci-fi FPS set in New Eden.
I tried Destiny, it was mediocre at best and didn't really grab me. Borderlands 2 was my favorite FPS prior to Dust so I might play it again. The BL Pre-sequel doesn't advance the story so I won't be buying it. I recently got a PSVita and I've been playing some old PSone games on it; Tactics Ogres, FF Tactics, Castlevania SotN, and a few others.
Also, I might try Eve Online again. I played it years ago and got bored with high sec. I'll probably start a new account and immediately fly to low sec and attempt to get myself rekt.
My advice to you, playa...
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postapo wastelander
Wasteland Desert Rangers
206
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Posted - 2014.10.14 12:51:00 -
[18] - Quote
Izlare Lenix wrote:If Legion dies so will my enjoyment of the FPS genre. The fact that Destiny is supposed to be the "Pinnacle" of FPSs proves just how sad the whole genre is now.
At least Dust/Legion are unique with real loss and risk/reward.
Nope boyo pinnacle was MAG with 256 players online 
"Ultimate Loggi since 2012 and Pirmatar Yaaaaaargh."
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Iron Wolf Saber
Den of Swords
17220
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Posted - 2014.10.14 12:57:00 -
[19] - Quote
postapo wastelander wrote:Izlare Lenix wrote:If Legion dies so will my enjoyment of the FPS genre. The fact that Destiny is supposed to be the "Pinnacle" of FPSs proves just how sad the whole genre is now.
At least Dust/Legion are unique with real loss and risk/reward. Nope boyo pinnacle was MAG with 256 players online
PS2 had trumped that card at launch. though lately its hard to find anything larger than a dust 514 squad to go kill in that game.
CPM 1
Omni-Soldier, Forum Warrior
\\= Prototype Assault Rifles =// Unlocked
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postapo wastelander
Wasteland Desert Rangers
207
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Posted - 2014.10.14 13:01:00 -
[20] - Quote
Iron Wolf Saber wrote:postapo wastelander wrote:Izlare Lenix wrote:If Legion dies so will my enjoyment of the FPS genre. The fact that Destiny is supposed to be the "Pinnacle" of FPSs proves just how sad the whole genre is now.
At least Dust/Legion are unique with real loss and risk/reward. Nope boyo pinnacle was MAG with 256 players online PS2 had trumped that card at launch. though lately its hard to find anything larger than a dust 514 squad to go kill in that game.
Honestly nope, in MAG there was healhty push bz game to playing cooperatively.
PL2 most strategic level is just Zerging the base.
(trust me i played that game for really long time)
"Ultimate Loggi since 2012 and Pirmatar Yaaaaaargh."
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Ripley Riley
Incorruptibles
3668
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Posted - 2014.10.14 13:03:00 -
[21] - Quote
postapo wastelander wrote:Honestly nope, in MAG there was healhty push bz game to playing cooperatively. PL2 most strategic level is just Zerging the base. (trust me i played that game for really long time) The largest PS2 battle was something approaching 2,000 players. It was fighting over one base and lasted around 40 minutes. There are videos of it on Youtube...
Now I'm not a mathematician but ~2,000 > 256
My advice to you, playa...
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postapo wastelander
Wasteland Desert Rangers
207
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Posted - 2014.10.14 13:09:00 -
[22] - Quote
Ripley Riley wrote:postapo wastelander wrote:Honestly nope, in MAG there was healhty push bz game to playing cooperatively. PL2 most strategic level is just Zerging the base. (trust me i played that game for really long time) The largest PS2 battle was something approaching 2,000 players. It was fighting over one base and lasted around 40 minutes. There are videos of it on Youtube... Now I'm not a mathematician but ~2,000 > 256
Oki once again.
Coop and strategy (MAG) against Zergin' (Pl2)
I go for Coop
Whats mean MAG with its 256 players with coop means bigger to me, that Skyrim siyed maps where is zerg king.
BTW honestly do you need play advocate with completely different game just for "DUST Win".
I was great fan of PL2, but win nothing new i went back to Dust because i like this game.
Its just sad how i sad many times before, there is not bigger playercount support.
Just imagine zippers server with dust on it.
Something like MAG domination modes, where you unlocking points after points till you dont explode contenders base.
Its should be awesome.
I dont know if im too old and i like something what is not mainstream like just kill, but honestly bigger push for more cooperative mode can be great here.
"Ultimate Loggi since 2012 and Pirmatar Yaaaaaargh."
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Ripley Riley
Incorruptibles
3668
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Posted - 2014.10.14 13:13:00 -
[23] - Quote
postapo wastelander wrote:Oki once again. Coop and strategy (MAG) against Zergin' (Pl2) I go for Coop
Pay close attention. Here was the original comment IWS made...
Iron Wolf Saber wrote:postapo wastelander wrote:Nope boyo pinnacle was MAG with 256 players online PS2 had trumped that card at launch. though lately its hard to find anything larger than a dust 514 squad to go kill in that game. He was replying to the size of battles in MAG vs. PS2. I don't think he said anything about the quality of game play in one or the other Just that PS2 had bigger fights than MAG.
Now that we have cleared that up, I'll stop derailing the thread.
My advice to you, playa...
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Echo 1991
WarRavens
Capital Punishment.
498
|
Posted - 2014.10.14 13:13:00 -
[24] - Quote
Planet side 2 is OK. Not really much happening other than bum rushing points. |
postapo wastelander
Wasteland Desert Rangers
207
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Posted - 2014.10.14 13:20:00 -
[25] - Quote
Ripley Riley wrote:postapo wastelander wrote:Oki once again. Coop and strategy (MAG) against Zergin' (Pl2) I go for Coop Pay close attention. Here was the original comment IWS made... Iron Wolf Saber wrote:postapo wastelander wrote:Nope boyo pinnacle was MAG with 256 players online PS2 had trumped that card at launch. though lately its hard to find anything larger than a dust 514 squad to go kill in that game. He was replying to the size of battles in MAG vs. PS2. I don't think he said anything about the quality of game play in one or the other Just that PS2 had bigger fights than MAG. Now that we have cleared that up, I'll stop derailing the thread.
Bigger fight just from count of numbers, oki i agree i put just small info.
Oki once more with bigger info.
Pinacle of gaming on Ps3 was for me MAG it great balance in playability, playercount and healthy push for cooperation between sqads.
Is that better now?!
I like Dust because it have that skill deep system and i think with bigger player counts and with more modes (like MAG domination was) it should be THAT pinnacle, about what OP takls
"Ultimate Loggi since 2012 and Pirmatar Yaaaaaargh."
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postapo wastelander
Wasteland Desert Rangers
207
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Posted - 2014.10.14 13:21:00 -
[26] - Quote
Echo 1991 wrote:Planet side 2 is OK. Not really much happening other than bum rushing points.
Thats basicaly about what i talking, there is no push for more cooperation and strategy basicaly this is a king there.
"Ultimate Loggi since 2012 and Pirmatar Yaaaaaargh."
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Hansei Kaizen
The Jackson Five
229
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Posted - 2014.10.14 13:36:00 -
[27] - Quote
Yeah, I have that gut feeling that Legion is going down too. But I am a sad panda for saying it.
It would be a terrible waste of cool ideas, assets and experience. There is some commitment to the Dust/Legion side of the franchise showing in the trailers and comments on fanfest. But there is less than a bit of hope now for me that Legion is getting some development boost and all of fanfest wasnt just lip service.
I really hope I am wrong though, and all this silence was just a symptom of "must work faster, no time for community-management".
The answer to your complaint is PvE. Always.
NPE status: (Gò»°Gûí°n+ëGò»n+¦ Gö+GöüGö+
Casual solo
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Ripley Riley
Incorruptibles
3670
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Posted - 2014.10.14 13:39:00 -
[28] - Quote
Hansei Kaizen wrote:I really hope I am wrong though, and all this silence was just a symptom of "must work faster, no time for community-management". If I had to venture a guess, I would say that CCP is remaining quiet about Legion because they do not want to overpromise ("laser focus") like they did in the early days of Dust 514.
They would rather underpromise, then overperform than overpromise, then underperform.
Again, just my guess.
My advice to you, playa...
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postapo wastelander
Wasteland Desert Rangers
209
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Posted - 2014.10.14 13:41:00 -
[29] - Quote
Hansei Kaizen wrote:Yeah, I have that gut feeling that Legion is going down too. But I am a sad panda for saying it.
It would be a terrible waste of cool ideas, assets and experience. There is some commitment to the Dust/Legion side of the franchise showing in the trailers and comments on fanfest. But there is less than a bit of hope now for me that Legion is getting some development boost and all of fanfest wasnt just lip service.
I really hope I am wrong though, and all this silence was just a symptom of "must work faster, no time for community-management".
Honestly i will be more for "Love4Dust" than for Legion, from one and honest reason.
I'll not be in Legion and i basicaly want to see more content what was showed us before here in Dust
"Ultimate Loggi since 2012 and Pirmatar Yaaaaaargh."
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Kevall Longstride
DUST University
Ivy League
1727
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Posted - 2014.10.14 13:43:00 -
[30] - Quote
Well, this threads quite the ray of wholesome sunshine ain't it? 
First things first.
'CPM1 tells us that Legion is still under development'
We say this because we've not heard anything to the contrary. If we had, we'd be unable say so because of the NDA. That being said, I'd like to think you'd trust us to not outright lie about something like that, merely not comment about it. When we stop talking about it is what you should look for.
We haven't stopped talking about it.
'Why should we buy the BPO?'
First of all, you're under no obligation to do so, it's entirely your own choice. Now I'm biased to a certain degree as my personal spending on the game is apparently in the top tier, therefore I'm more inclined to spend money on the game anyway. That said, with the NDA, I have a privileged awareness of some matters ahead of the playerbase.
I've purchased ALL the new BPO, including the nova knifes which I've never used in the game ever and I feel no sense of conflict in encouraging others to do so as well.
Read into that what you will but I'm a happy dust player and I don't see that changing anytime soon. o7
CPM 1 member
CEO of DUST University
Vist dustcpm.com
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