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Scrambler rifle again with the too strong bs.

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TheD1CK Dead Man's Game 1202	Posted - 2014.08.30 16:02:00 - [31] - Quote xSir Campsalotx wrote: How is this even up for debate? Scrambler has horrible damage profile 120/80 against half the suits in the game, overheats, needs to cool down between bursts, and is horrible against strafey scouts or assualts for that matter. Not to mention is the only semi Assualt Rifle besides the Gal Tac which is rarely used and even that one doesn't have overheat. On the dispersion point you overlook a simple fact scrambler rifles yes start off with decent Hipfire but Gal ARs and CRs can get tighter dispersion through the use of the sharpshooter skill. CR has 95/110 damage profile so it is effective against both shield and armor. Even the 110/90 Gal Ar profile is much more balanced. And on that note, It is the ONLY semi-auto Rifle bar the TAC AR Will we ever see a TAC CR/RR ? Innapropriate Irrelevence... Welcome to the Dust Forum, hang around to see why everyone else left :/
Ludvig Enraga KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 1118	Posted - 2014.08.30 16:13:00 - [32] - Quote everyone on Niyan San using it now. Nuff said. PLC, NK, Scout - before 1.8. That's right, I stack that OP Sh!t.
Groz'zar Kazoku Sacred Initiative of Combat Killers IMMORTAL REGIME 89	Posted - 2014.08.30 16:14:00 - [33] - Quote Uhhh everyone on that always use the same weapon each game. it changes but they seem to do it for ***** and giggles. so that post was pointless.
Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 2189	Posted - 2014.08.30 16:23:00 - [34] - Quote Groz'zar Kazoku wrote: Uhhh everyone on that always use the same weapon each game. it changes but they seem to do it for ***** and giggles. so that post was pointless. At least to me personally the three times I fought them. one time it was all cloaks and nova knives x.x that was a damn slaughter. using pub matches as your benchmark is another mistake your making Minmatar is Winmatar Creed of the Minja - "I'm a leaf on the wind"
Groz'zar Kazoku Sacred Initiative of Combat Killers IMMORTAL REGIME 89	Posted - 2014.08.30 16:28:00 - [35] - Quote I wasn't.... They guy before me said they all used it. I was pointing out it seems like they do weapon rotations.
Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 2190	Posted - 2014.08.30 16:30:00 - [36] - Quote Groz'zar Kazoku wrote: A. Because CR rapes anyones face point blank out to 20M+ B. Because RR has longer range game and better dispersion then the scrambler or magic bullets as some say. C. because point blank shotguns destroy people still. D. Nova knives even have good odds of getting you with the strafe suits. E. your only looking at DPS. F. your a noob that pretends to be intelligent and fails. G. I stopped caring about your opinion when it was all about DPS for five posts. Blowing off all other facts. A. Because the Scramvbler rifle SMG combo is better then the combat rifle at all ranges B. Because RR is so easily countered due to its low RoF C. because point scramblers destroy point blank shotguns D. Nova knives arnt viable in PC E. im only looking at compettive metagame and not pub matches F. I have a decade of experiance with game design G. your the type of person who will not awknolegde any position that doesnt directly confirm or contribute to your own reguardless of evedence or positions presented Minmatar is Winmatar Creed of the Minja - "I'm a leaf on the wind"
Jack 3enimble Vengeance Unbound Dark Taboo 263	Posted - 2014.08.30 16:40:00 - [37] - Quote xSir Campsalotx wrote: Oh so that's why all you see in competitive PC is scramblers... Oh no wait CRs are still king in the AR department no way? When I ask other corp mates why they don't use the scrambler they say "overheat" and unreliable in a pinch. This is solely because ever AR plays the same, you put a mag in with x shots you can fire x times and switch to your choice of sidearm, except in the case of the scrambler you fire your first 15-17shots and your forced to switch weapons (which is lowering dps), cool off (which severely lowers dps) or overheat (usually ending in death) Because the scrambler takes skill to use. If you can count to 20 and are not a cockeyed idiot you'll poop on all suits, including poor set up sentinels. I'm not saying I'm very skilled but in PC I run my scrambler most of the times to gank the scouts and mediums. I find the ScR to be the better weapon when facing combat rifles. Cooldown speed is very high let go for 1 Second and fire 5 more rounds.
Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 2191	Posted - 2014.08.30 17:25:00 - [38] - Quote my arguments have included 1) it has a 50% or more dps advantage 2) its firing mechanism makes it harder to dodge do to lack of predictable RoF spread 3) its amazing at both CqC and long range 4) comboed with the SMG it has no inherant weakness and doesnt suffer against armor based suits like it should 5) it dominates the metagame rendering nearly every other playstyle and combo obsolete OP has put forth the following arguments without countering the above arguments 1) Nuh-unh its definatly not 2) i see people in pubs using all sorts of things 3) im not good with the scrambler rifle Minmatar is Winmatar Creed of the Minja - "I'm a leaf on the wind"
Monty Mole Clone Shiv M 198	Posted - 2014.08.30 17:31:00 - [39] - Quote Ghosts Chance wrote: it dominates the metagame rendering nearly every other playstyle and combo obsolete im sorry but this is just to hilarious prove it with numbers from ccp going all the way back to when it was introduced lets just burn this motherfucker down
taxi bastard Vengeance Unbound Dark Taboo 232	Posted - 2014.08.30 17:35:00 - [40] - Quote can't see why anyone would have a complaint about bring the ROF inline with what is feasibly possible by a person? unless of course your using a modded controller?

Derpty Derp Dead Man's Game 358	Posted - 2014.08.30 17:36:00 - [41] - Quote Okay so... The scrambler rifle is OP... The combat rifle is OP... The rail rifle is OP (and stupidly easy to use.)... Hows about instead of asking for a big fat nerf, we just agree to buff the range on my tac AR, anyone? : )
Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 2194	Posted - 2014.08.30 17:39:00 - [42] - Quote Monty Mole Clone wrote: Ghosts Chance wrote: it dominates the metagame rendering nearly every other playstyle and combo obsolete im sorry but this is just to hilarious prove it with numbers from ccp going all the way back to when it was introduced the current meta consists of the following gal/amaar scout with scrambler smg - trumps other scouts fairs well against logis/mediums weak against heavys gal/amaar shotgun scouts - anti heavy gal amaar scrambler smg assaults assault combat rifle logis - lolreps/lol scans (minmatar/gal) bust HMG/boundles heavys - anti scout/medium everything not on this list is at a distint disadvantage at the moment. Skill with other setups can mitigate that disadvantage to a degree but assuming equal skill this is what the meta currently looks like there will be variations of course but the team that most closly follows this list wins assuming equil skill Minmatar is Winmatar Creed of the Minja - "I'm a leaf on the wind"
Monty Mole Clone Shiv M 198	Posted - 2014.08.30 17:39:00 - [43] - Quote taxi bastard wrote: can't see why anyone would have a complaint about bring the ROF inline with what is feasibly possible by a person? unless of course your using a modded controller? why does it always have to come down to modded controller argument, im certain that people out there can approach its rpm for short spurts. i dont think im that far off myself lets just burn this motherfucker down
Groz'zar Kazoku Sacred Initiative of Combat Killers IMMORTAL REGIME 89	Posted - 2014.08.30 17:39:00 - [44] - Quote I am not talking to him anymore. he puts half truths and the facts that make him look good. He left out over half the points I made and replaced them with insults to me. Hes dead to me as far as posts from him go.
Monty Mole Clone Shiv M 198	Posted - 2014.08.30 17:43:00 - [45] - Quote Groz'zar Kazoku wrote: I am not talking to him anymore. he puts half truths and the facts that make him look good. He left out over half the points I made and replaced them with insults to me. Hes dead to me as far as posts from him go. just swap to the combat rifles when they change the damage profile to -20 +20 lets just burn this motherfucker down
Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 2213	Posted - 2014.08.30 17:48:00 - [46] - Quote CR has 18 bursts before it has to reload TAR has 18 shots before it has to reload ScR has anywhere from 18-28 before overheating, which goes for about the same time elapsed as the reload on the other two semi-auto weapons. Lets see what else the ScR has compared to the CR and TAR The CR has a fire rate, if you count the burst as one shot, of 400. The TAR used to have 400, i believe it got buffed to 520? (fact check required) The ScR has charge shot capabilities, and greater range than the other 2 ScR has better hip fire than the TAR and about equal to the CR CR requires a nano hive for ammunition, due to low ammo capacity, but makes up for it with low fitting requirements. The TAR is middle ground, requiring fewer restocks per match, but has the worst range as well as the second worst fittings The damage per trigger pull is about equivalent for all of these rifles, but the ScR has the fewest downsides The ScR needs-TAR-like hip fire (terrible), a higher zoom and more reliable scope, a RoF cap at somewhere between 400 and 520, and the fitting req's need to be looked at (hopefully toned down at least a bit) "Minmitar Scout" and "Masochist" are synonyms. FA's Shotgunning T-Dome Champ Give the Minja active dampening!--By Bor
taxi bastard Vengeance Unbound Dark Taboo 232	Posted - 2014.08.30 17:51:00 - [47] - Quote Monty Mole Clone wrote: taxi bastard wrote: can't see why anyone would have a complaint about bring the ROF inline with what is feasibly possible by a person? unless of course your using a modded controller? why does it always have to come down to modded controller argument, im certain that people out there can approach its rpm for short spurts. i dont think im that far off myself if your approaching that ...do you mean 5% or 25% off because that is a large amount of DPS difference. if of course people are genuinely close to the DPS numbers without a modded contoroller then its a weapon which needs to be looked at.
manboar thunder fist Dead Man's Game 78	Posted - 2014.08.30 17:53:00 - [48] - Quote 300 more dps is a figure achieved with maximum rpm which as stated before isn't humanly possible... The overheat effect also means that more than 2 people can't be killed in succession... And that's basic suits not these 1000 Hp assaults or 700hp scouts. Realistically my combat rifle is way more effective. Not to mention rail rifles are te most popular gun right now and every rooftop is full of them. They do huge damage over a really long range which is unparalleled.. And they suffer no drawbacks at short range... IMO a cal assault with a kaalkiota is way more dangerous than an imperial ak.o with viziam NERF SCOUTS, NERF TANKS, NERF AV, NERF ASSAULTS, NERF LOGIS, NERF HEAVIES nerf life
Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 2194	Posted - 2014.08.30 17:56:00 - [49] - Quote his entire argument boils down to its overheat wich is mitigated by counting and swapping to your smg sidearm at that point its no longer a "short burst high dps weapon with overheat drawback" as the overheat is no longer a facter and swapping to the smg finisher mitigates the whole delay between firing bursts thing as your putting out consistant high dps all the way untill reload. 6-8 shot burst - target is now at 50% to 25% armor spray with smg for kill rifle is now cooled down repeat untill you have to reload thats how fights with a scrambler rifle work out, notice how "overheat and hurt yourself" or "stop shooting" isnt on that list? thats becuase you never overheat this way, and untill you have to reload you never stop shooting your weapons and can put out dps that entire time. essentialy your only semi valid argument rests on lack of blayer skill as a mechanism to balance, but player skill completly removes this weakness from the scrambler rifle especially combined with the SMG as a sidearm Minmatar is Winmatar Creed of the Minja - "I'm a leaf on the wind"
Monty Mole Clone Shiv M 198	Posted - 2014.08.30 18:00:00 - [50] - Quote taxi bastard wrote: Monty Mole Clone wrote: taxi bastard wrote: can't see why anyone would have a complaint about bring the ROF inline with what is feasibly possible by a person? unless of course your using a modded controller? why does it always have to come down to modded controller argument, im certain that people out there can approach its rpm for short spurts. i dont think im that far off myself if your approaching that ...do you mean 5% or 25% off because that is a large amount of DPS difference. if of course people are genuinely close to the DPS numbers without a modded contoroller then its a weapon which needs to be looked at. i look at the dps as a trade of for the fact you can only shoot for short periods followed by what is in comparison to the other rifles longer down times. working as intended i say lets just burn this motherfucker down

Cpt McReady Amarr Templars Amarr Empire 9	Posted - 2014.08.30 18:05:00 - [51] - Quote Ghosts Chance wrote: Groz'zar Kazoku wrote: What part of short bursts of high damage don't you get? The CR also melts me faster then I can react at times. So your argument is kinda flimsy. I die more to a CR then I ever do to scrambler users. hell I find most scrambler users at the moment to be rather scrubby. I die more to AR users. So do they need a nerf since you know we die to them so much something must be off. Also currently there are more scrubsusing the scrmabler then actually people that enjoy it because of that FOTOM crap or whatever it is. arguments based in math are the oposite of flimsey what part of 300more DPS then every other rifle including the max of the burst combat rifle is flimsy? they need a nerf because of the dps, not because of people dieing to them so much i thought i made that clear when my entire argument was focused on the dps and firing mechanics. interesting... fun fact, current CR and TAC deal similar amount of DPS ... your argument is invalid
Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 2195	Posted - 2014.08.30 18:08:00 - [52] - Quote Cpt McReady wrote: Ghosts Chance wrote: Groz'zar Kazoku wrote: What part of short bursts of high damage don't you get? The CR also melts me faster then I can react at times. So your argument is kinda flimsy. I die more to a CR then I ever do to scrambler users. hell I find most scrambler users at the moment to be rather scrubby. I die more to AR users. So do they need a nerf since you know we die to them so much something must be off. Also currently there are more scrubsusing the scrmabler then actually people that enjoy it because of that FOTOM crap or whatever it is. arguments based in math are the oposite of flimsey what part of 300more DPS then every other rifle including the max of the burst combat rifle is flimsy? they need a nerf because of the dps, not because of people dieing to them so much i thought i made that clear when my entire argument was focused on the dps and firing mechanics. interesting... fun fact, current CR and TAC deal similar amount of DPS ... your argument is invalid your doing the math wrong, the current CR and tac deal similar DPS as the other rifles Minmatar is Winmatar Creed of the Minja - "I'm a leaf on the wind"
Groz'zar Kazoku Sacred Initiative of Combat Killers IMMORTAL REGIME 91	Posted - 2014.08.30 18:11:00 - [53] - Quote LIke I said he says what makes him look good. he won't even see all the facts. the down times because of the heat make it only good on the only suits that give it bonuses go figure. :O suits that were made to make them good make them good.
Cpt McReady Amarr Templars Amarr Empire 9	Posted - 2014.08.30 18:13:00 - [54] - Quote Ghosts Chance wrote: Cpt McReady wrote: Ghosts Chance wrote: Groz'zar Kazoku wrote: What part of short bursts of high damage don't you get? The CR also melts me faster then I can react at times. So your argument is kinda flimsy. I die more to a CR then I ever do to scrambler users. hell I find most scrambler users at the moment to be rather scrubby. I die more to AR users. So do they need a nerf since you know we die to them so much something must be off. Also currently there are more scrubsusing the scrmabler then actually people that enjoy it because of that FOTOM crap or whatever it is. arguments based in math are the oposite of flimsey what part of 300more DPS then every other rifle including the max of the burst combat rifle is flimsy? they need a nerf because of the dps, not because of people dieing to them so much i thought i made that clear when my entire argument was focused on the dps and firing mechanics. interesting... fun fact, current CR and TAC deal similar amount of DPS ... your argument is invalid your doing the math wrong, the current CR and tac deal similar DPS as the other rifles math lol well if you had played some PC you would see that everyone is armor tanked and is using the CR or HMG. the SR has no advantage in dps there. and even in pubs, the majority is HMG/CR armor tanked... play the game dude.
Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 2195	Posted - 2014.08.30 18:15:00 - [55] - Quote Groz'zar Kazoku wrote: LIke I said he says what makes him look good. he won't even see all the facts. the down times because of the heat make it only good on the only suits that give it bonuses go figure. :O suits that were made to make them good make them good. smg removes downtime its simply a nonfactor as with it you can fire the scrambler and smg in an infinate loop without overheating or having downtime untill you have to reload. a single 8 shot burst is all you need in that setup and it doesnt cause overheat or downtime to do so its more the combo of scrambler AND smg thats overpowered then the scrambler rifle alone and a nerf to the smg wont mitigate that only a nerf to the ROF of the scrambler rifle will Minmatar is Winmatar Creed of the Minja - "I'm a leaf on the wind"
Groz'zar Kazoku Sacred Initiative of Combat Killers IMMORTAL REGIME 91	Posted - 2014.08.30 18:19:00 - [56] - Quote How about you **** off with the smg talk because the my 10% armor damage profile weapon kills armor!?!?!? omg no one knew that. but you can also do the same thing with the magsec or the bolt pistol with skill. oh also if you have skill the flaylock is pretty wicked against armor with its 20% bonus damage. we know it does. that is a ANTI-ARMOR weapon. we are not infants. we can read and we know. We are talking about the scrambler. You are using it more as a shield burst. then swapping to the SMG to do the majority of the damage. This is why people think the smg is currently in need of a nerf.
Monty Mole Clone Shiv M 198	Posted - 2014.08.30 18:23:00 - [57] - Quote Ghosts Chance wrote: its more the combo of scrambler AND smg thats overpowered then the scrambler rifle alone and a nerf to the smg wont mitigate that only a nerf to the ROF of the scrambler rifle will really m8, people using a bit intelligence to mitigate a primary weapons weakness makes it op, do you have to do this when using assault, rail or combat rifles i dont think so lets just burn this motherfucker down
Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 2195	Posted - 2014.08.30 18:28:00 - [58] - Quote Monty Mole Clone wrote: Ghosts Chance wrote: its more the combo of scrambler AND smg thats overpowered then the scrambler rifle alone and a nerf to the smg wont mitigate that only a nerf to the ROF of the scrambler rifle will really m8, people using a bit intelligence to mitigate a primary weapons weakness makes it op, do you have to do this when using assault, rail or combat rifles i dont think so you cant do it with rail or combat rifles as the ion pistol is trash and the scrambler pistol cant hack it as an opener and yes you should be doing it with the plasma rifle as well though its pointless as you should be running a scrabler or combat rifle instead Minmatar is Winmatar Creed of the Minja - "I'm a leaf on the wind"
Groz'zar Kazoku Sacred Initiative of Combat Killers IMMORTAL REGIME 94	Posted - 2014.08.30 18:31:00 - [59] - Quote I am hearing more about you inability to use weapons then problems. I have seen videos recent ones with people going 30/4 with Ion pistols only. is it op? no. its just skill making up for weapon weaknesses. your argument about nerfing one weapon based off it being used with another is just pure stupidity. if thats the case we need to nerf all the assault bonuses, the weapons used on them, and the smg so the heavies and scouts are the only ones that can kill. -rolls his eyes and says all of that with heavy sarcasm.-
Michael Arck 5315	Posted - 2014.08.30 18:32:00 - [60] - Quote Its getting nerfed. Thats the inevitable truth. Its DPS is much too high. Archistrategos *Where the fear has gone there will be nothing....only I will remain*



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