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Scrambler rifle again with the too strong bs.

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Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 2188	Posted - 2014.08.30 14:22:00 - [1] - Quote so the scrambler rifle is bad because of an overheat effect that only bad players and those not used the to weapon succumb to? Minmatar is Winmatar Creed of the Minja - "I'm a leaf on the wind"
Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 2188	Posted - 2014.08.30 14:40:00 - [2] - Quote Groz'zar Kazoku wrote: That quote means next to nothing to me. please state your argument clearly. Also if your referring to the fact some less then respectful people are using turbo controllers to reach beyond the human norm for firing. that is a separate mater that needs handling and in no way means the scrambler needs a nerf. you do not nerf things based off cheating. My average RPS is somewher around 8-10 depending on my day. 10 is if somehow the stars aline and the gods smile upon me. becaues normaly 8-9 is my max with it. I have never gotten the full 11 rounds out really. I might in a panic fire but almost without fail it will overheat and lock the hell up. the real issue is that even within the bounds of human limitations the weapon has a 150-200 dps advantage over every other gun including the burst combat rifle. the burst combat rifle has a cap of 400 bursts per minuite wich is 50 under the human limitations (ish) and has to be timed absolutly perfectly to achieve that due to the firing animation so it doesnt have the same OP flavor. the scrabler however doesnt have a firing animation and can be fires at insane speeds as even if the human limitation is around 450 RPM thats calculated as an average and in short bursts even a human can break that barrier for gains of 300DPS over other rifles. in short its OP becuase it can achieve a 300 DPS advantage over every rifle in the game even without a turbo controller Minmatar is Winmatar Creed of the Minja - "I'm a leaf on the wind"
Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 2188	Posted - 2014.08.30 14:49:00 - [3] - Quote Groz'zar Kazoku wrote: What part of short bursts of high damage don't you get? The CR also melts me faster then I can react at times. So your argument is kinda flimsy. I die more to a CR then I ever do to scrambler users. hell I find most scrambler users at the moment to be rather scrubby. I die more to AR users. So do they need a nerf since you know we die to them so much something must be off. Also currently there are more scrubsusing the scrmabler then actually people that enjoy it because of that FOTOM crap or whatever it is. arguments based in math are the oposite of flimsey what part of 300more DPS then every other rifle including the max of the burst combat rifle is flimsy? they need a nerf because of the dps, not because of people dieing to them so much i thought i made that clear when my entire argument was focused on the dps and firing mechanics. Minmatar is Winmatar Creed of the Minja - "I'm a leaf on the wind"
Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 2188	Posted - 2014.08.30 15:09:00 - [4] - Quote Gelhad Thremyr wrote: Ghosts Chance wrote: Groz'zar Kazoku wrote: What part of short bursts of high damage don't you get? The CR also melts me faster then I can react at times. So your argument is kinda flimsy. I die more to a CR then I ever do to scrambler users. hell I find most scrambler users at the moment to be rather scrubby. I die more to AR users. So do they need a nerf since you know we die to them so much something must be off. Also currently there are more scrubsusing the scrmabler then actually people that enjoy it because of that FOTOM crap or whatever it is. arguments based in math are the oposite of flimsey what part of 300more DPS then every other rifle including the max of the burst combat rifle is flimsy? they need a nerf because of the dps, not because of people dieing to them so much i thought i made that clear when my entire argument was focused on the dps and firing mechanics. They dont need a nerf i hqve been using itsince its introduction without moded controller and even at lvl5 amar suit i cant even come close to the scout and shotgun kill ratio, this is in part cause i use the ds3 and i still lock up and die sometimes in the heat of the moment. I do see and acknowledge a problem with modded controllers as was reported in the forum, there are flawed mechanics that need to be per shot and the max rof of the weapon should be slightly lower cause it would not affect me that much using manual firing. I also am at a disadvantage against mouse and keyboard that strafe with basic rifles. Hell i get two shot dow by a militia shotgun now with the dmg mod even at 1100 ehp ! So dont bring the nerf bat on that one its not prevalent that much anyway ! if you want to compair the scout shotgun with the scrambler you have to compair it to the scout/scrambler combo its an absolute hard counter to every other scout, you basically cant play scout with a good scout/scrambler on the other team are you saying having a 300dps advantage over plasma rifle rail rifle combat rifle isnt something that needs to be adressed? (and im not refering to modded controllers here, im talking within human ability with practice) Minmatar is Winmatar Creed of the Minja - "I'm a leaf on the wind"
Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 2188	Posted - 2014.08.30 15:14:00 - [5] - Quote Groz'zar Kazoku wrote: Because oh mathy one. Take for instance how we have to take 2-3+ breaks depending on suit level and weapon skill level on one clip. meaning there are somewhere between 2-6s of down time. then 2s or reload with no mistakes. If you make a mistake well it can be between 2-15s of cool down. Also if mistakes are made 50 damage is taken. Also in some good fights you need to overheat to finish them before they finish you. Because having that HMG spin up and turn at you is doom. So stop acting like DPS math is all that is involved in "balance". because the "balance" you want will not balance the game it will ruin it. Your not taking into account down time. The risks vs reward of the playstyle or anything really besides RPS and damage. if you do that then a lot of weapons need a nerf when in reality it doesn't. its called having an SMG as a sidearm, shoot untill close to overheat and swap to SMG as finisher, you do so much dps with the scrambler that they have next to no HP left for the SMG to finish off. you dont need to take breaks or reload... just unleash insane dps and swap before overheat and its a win as long as your not an idiot. with the scrambler you can even eat down an armor stacked suit to half or 1/3ed armor HP within that 1 second burst of DPS and just swap instead of giving a break for it to cool down. your not taking into account that there is no downtime Minmatar is Winmatar Creed of the Minja - "I'm a leaf on the wind"
Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 2188	Posted - 2014.08.30 15:15:00 - [6] - Quote Groz'zar Kazoku wrote: omfg moron stop taking just the damage and RPS. Look at the long picture and the risk reward as well. stop being a moron with math for a miniute and check more then just the damage output for the first second to second and a half. I asked nicely now I am just gonna be blunt. Stop and look at the whole weapon not just the trigger and holes it makes. TL:DR of this thread "Im bad with the weapon so it clearly isnt OP" Minmatar is Winmatar Creed of the Minja - "I'm a leaf on the wind"
Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 2188	Posted - 2014.08.30 15:18:00 - [7] - Quote Jack 3enimble wrote: Mejt0 wrote: Its more of modded controllers, not gun itself. ScR have advantage. High damage over short time, but after this you have to wait. Other guns have stable dps output. About RR. It kick isnt drawback. People are using RR in CQC better than AR can. Because at base no profiency the RR is better than the AR. Newer players look at damage, so stock the RR is better than the AR. An AR with sharpshooter and prof 3 on the other hand will poop on a RR prof 3 CQC 9 out 10 times, when they're both medium frames this is correct, the RR is absolutly terrible in CQC in competitive play compaired to all 3 of the other rifles Minmatar is Winmatar Creed of the Minja - "I'm a leaf on the wind"
Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 2188	Posted - 2014.08.30 15:26:00 - [8] - Quote Unfortunatly it apears that you do not have the skills to play this weapon competitivly and therefore any insight you have into the workings of this weapon in competitive gameplay is muddled by that inability to make it perform at its best leaving you with the false impression that it is "balanced" Minmatar is Winmatar Creed of the Minja - "I'm a leaf on the wind"
Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 2188	Posted - 2014.08.30 15:40:00 - [9] - Quote Groz'zar Kazoku wrote: Who are you talking to? you didn't quote anyone so it could be one of a few people. Also balance is more complex then just DPS. if it was that simple games would have perfect gun balance right off the bat. Well if I had a gun that did the dps of the CR but did it all in splash that is balanced then? because by your logic it is. i was refering to you sir. i have over a decade experiance with tweaking the inner workings and balancing/destabalising games im well aware of the many faucetts of balance within games. a weapon is overpowered when it oversteps its intended design and renders other previously valid options invalid creating a vacume in gameplay that shifts the common stratagy heavily in its favor the the exclusion of all else. this is what we are currently seeing with the scrambler rifle its current DPS advantage alows it to open so strongly that the fight is over in that first second of gameplay, the utility of this makes any CQC fight for medium/scout frames so heavily dominated by the scrambler rifle that it renders any other stratagy obsolete. in addition to that its long range damage application makes it ideal for long range combat as well. its not simply about numbers, its about gameplay, design and how fights play out.. it renders everything except for a scrambler rifle scout obsolete it renders every weapon on a medium frame obsolete due to those mediums no longer being able to compete with the only option scouts now have. so we now only have 3 archtypes in competitive gameplay scrabler smg scout scrambler/smg medium hmg sentinal when high level gameplay is dominated by so few options we call that imbalance, not because we are trying to balance things amungst themselves but because idealy in any game you want to see variety, and when one stratagy completly removes variety from gameplay it is deemed "overpowered" not because it is powerful but because it removes options and therefore playstyles from the game wich from a balance perspective is a sign of an unhealthy metagame. in a game with so many options having the primary stratagys refined to such a small amount of variation is a bad thing and isnt the intended design of the game as a whole. Minmatar is Winmatar Creed of the Minja - "I'm a leaf on the wind"
Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 2188	Posted - 2014.08.30 15:54:00 - [10] - Quote xSir Campsalotx wrote: How is this even up for debate? Scrambler has horrible damage profile 120/80 against half the suits in the game, overheats, needs to cool down between bursts, and is horrible against strafey scouts or assualts for that matter. Not to mention is the only semi Assualt Rifle besides the Gal Tac which is rarely used and even that one doesn't have overheat. On the dispersion point you overlook a simple fact scrambler rifles yes start off with decent Hipfire but Gal ARs and CRs can get tighter dispersion through the use of the sharpshooter skill. CR has 95/110 damage profile so it is effective against both shield and armor. Even the 110/90 Gal Ar profile is much more balanced. you diddnt factor in proficiancy skills into your damage profiles sir Minmatar is Winmatar Creed of the Minja - "I'm a leaf on the wind"

Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 2189	Posted - 2014.08.30 16:23:00 - [11] - Quote Groz'zar Kazoku wrote: Uhhh everyone on that always use the same weapon each game. it changes but they seem to do it for ***** and giggles. so that post was pointless. At least to me personally the three times I fought them. one time it was all cloaks and nova knives x.x that was a damn slaughter. using pub matches as your benchmark is another mistake your making Minmatar is Winmatar Creed of the Minja - "I'm a leaf on the wind"
Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 2190	Posted - 2014.08.30 16:30:00 - [12] - Quote Groz'zar Kazoku wrote: A. Because CR rapes anyones face point blank out to 20M+ B. Because RR has longer range game and better dispersion then the scrambler or magic bullets as some say. C. because point blank shotguns destroy people still. D. Nova knives even have good odds of getting you with the strafe suits. E. your only looking at DPS. F. your a noob that pretends to be intelligent and fails. G. I stopped caring about your opinion when it was all about DPS for five posts. Blowing off all other facts. A. Because the Scramvbler rifle SMG combo is better then the combat rifle at all ranges B. Because RR is so easily countered due to its low RoF C. because point scramblers destroy point blank shotguns D. Nova knives arnt viable in PC E. im only looking at compettive metagame and not pub matches F. I have a decade of experiance with game design G. your the type of person who will not awknolegde any position that doesnt directly confirm or contribute to your own reguardless of evedence or positions presented Minmatar is Winmatar Creed of the Minja - "I'm a leaf on the wind"
Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 2191	Posted - 2014.08.30 17:25:00 - [13] - Quote my arguments have included 1) it has a 50% or more dps advantage 2) its firing mechanism makes it harder to dodge do to lack of predictable RoF spread 3) its amazing at both CqC and long range 4) comboed with the SMG it has no inherant weakness and doesnt suffer against armor based suits like it should 5) it dominates the metagame rendering nearly every other playstyle and combo obsolete OP has put forth the following arguments without countering the above arguments 1) Nuh-unh its definatly not 2) i see people in pubs using all sorts of things 3) im not good with the scrambler rifle Minmatar is Winmatar Creed of the Minja - "I'm a leaf on the wind"
Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 2194	Posted - 2014.08.30 17:39:00 - [14] - Quote Monty Mole Clone wrote: Ghosts Chance wrote: it dominates the metagame rendering nearly every other playstyle and combo obsolete im sorry but this is just to hilarious prove it with numbers from ccp going all the way back to when it was introduced the current meta consists of the following gal/amaar scout with scrambler smg - trumps other scouts fairs well against logis/mediums weak against heavys gal/amaar shotgun scouts - anti heavy gal amaar scrambler smg assaults assault combat rifle logis - lolreps/lol scans (minmatar/gal) bust HMG/boundles heavys - anti scout/medium everything not on this list is at a distint disadvantage at the moment. Skill with other setups can mitigate that disadvantage to a degree but assuming equal skill this is what the meta currently looks like there will be variations of course but the team that most closly follows this list wins assuming equil skill Minmatar is Winmatar Creed of the Minja - "I'm a leaf on the wind"
Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 2194	Posted - 2014.08.30 17:56:00 - [15] - Quote his entire argument boils down to its overheat wich is mitigated by counting and swapping to your smg sidearm at that point its no longer a "short burst high dps weapon with overheat drawback" as the overheat is no longer a facter and swapping to the smg finisher mitigates the whole delay between firing bursts thing as your putting out consistant high dps all the way untill reload. 6-8 shot burst - target is now at 50% to 25% armor spray with smg for kill rifle is now cooled down repeat untill you have to reload thats how fights with a scrambler rifle work out, notice how "overheat and hurt yourself" or "stop shooting" isnt on that list? thats becuase you never overheat this way, and untill you have to reload you never stop shooting your weapons and can put out dps that entire time. essentialy your only semi valid argument rests on lack of blayer skill as a mechanism to balance, but player skill completly removes this weakness from the scrambler rifle especially combined with the SMG as a sidearm Minmatar is Winmatar Creed of the Minja - "I'm a leaf on the wind"
Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 2195	Posted - 2014.08.30 18:08:00 - [16] - Quote Cpt McReady wrote: Ghosts Chance wrote: Groz'zar Kazoku wrote: What part of short bursts of high damage don't you get? The CR also melts me faster then I can react at times. So your argument is kinda flimsy. I die more to a CR then I ever do to scrambler users. hell I find most scrambler users at the moment to be rather scrubby. I die more to AR users. So do they need a nerf since you know we die to them so much something must be off. Also currently there are more scrubsusing the scrmabler then actually people that enjoy it because of that FOTOM crap or whatever it is. arguments based in math are the oposite of flimsey what part of 300more DPS then every other rifle including the max of the burst combat rifle is flimsy? they need a nerf because of the dps, not because of people dieing to them so much i thought i made that clear when my entire argument was focused on the dps and firing mechanics. interesting... fun fact, current CR and TAC deal similar amount of DPS ... your argument is invalid your doing the math wrong, the current CR and tac deal similar DPS as the other rifles Minmatar is Winmatar Creed of the Minja - "I'm a leaf on the wind"
Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 2195	Posted - 2014.08.30 18:15:00 - [17] - Quote Groz'zar Kazoku wrote: LIke I said he says what makes him look good. he won't even see all the facts. the down times because of the heat make it only good on the only suits that give it bonuses go figure. :O suits that were made to make them good make them good. smg removes downtime its simply a nonfactor as with it you can fire the scrambler and smg in an infinate loop without overheating or having downtime untill you have to reload. a single 8 shot burst is all you need in that setup and it doesnt cause overheat or downtime to do so its more the combo of scrambler AND smg thats overpowered then the scrambler rifle alone and a nerf to the smg wont mitigate that only a nerf to the ROF of the scrambler rifle will Minmatar is Winmatar Creed of the Minja - "I'm a leaf on the wind"
Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 2195	Posted - 2014.08.30 18:28:00 - [18] - Quote Monty Mole Clone wrote: Ghosts Chance wrote: its more the combo of scrambler AND smg thats overpowered then the scrambler rifle alone and a nerf to the smg wont mitigate that only a nerf to the ROF of the scrambler rifle will really m8, people using a bit intelligence to mitigate a primary weapons weakness makes it op, do you have to do this when using assault, rail or combat rifles i dont think so you cant do it with rail or combat rifles as the ion pistol is trash and the scrambler pistol cant hack it as an opener and yes you should be doing it with the plasma rifle as well though its pointless as you should be running a scrabler or combat rifle instead Minmatar is Winmatar Creed of the Minja - "I'm a leaf on the wind"
Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 2197	Posted - 2014.08.30 18:55:00 - [19] - Quote Groz'zar Kazoku wrote: I am hearing more about you inability to use weapons then problems. I have seen videos recent ones with people going 30/4 with Ion pistols only. is it op? no. its just skill making up for weapon weaknesses. your argument about nerfing one weapon based off it being used with another is just pure stupidity. if thats the case we need to nerf all the assault bonuses, the weapons used on them, and the smg so the heavies and scouts are the only ones that can kill. -rolls his eyes and says all of that with heavy sarcasm.- your the one who cant seem to shoot a scrmbler rifle without overheating... you seem to think that its 150-200dps advantage is somehow mitigated by overheat simply becuase you havnt figured out how to not let it overheat yet. Minmatar is Winmatar Creed of the Minja - "I'm a leaf on the wind"
Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 2197	Posted - 2014.08.30 19:14:00 - [20] - Quote Monty Mole Clone wrote: Ghosts Chance wrote: Groz'zar Kazoku wrote: I am hearing more about you inability to use weapons then problems. I have seen videos recent ones with people going 30/4 with Ion pistols only. is it op? no. its just skill making up for weapon weaknesses. your argument about nerfing one weapon based off it being used with another is just pure stupidity. if thats the case we need to nerf all the assault bonuses, the weapons used on them, and the smg so the heavies and scouts are the only ones that can kill. -rolls his eyes and says all of that with heavy sarcasm.- your the one who cant seem to shoot a scrmbler rifle without overheating... you seem to think that its 150-200dps advantage is somehow mitigated by overheat simply becuase you havnt figured out how to not let it overheat yet. you do realise ghost that if your not heating up the weapon as fast as you can your not doing this terrible dps everybody is banging on about dont you heat is on a time formula not a per shot basis weather you fire 8 shots or 11 its the same amount of heat cost its the same formula the laser rifle uses Minmatar is Winmatar Creed of the Minja - "I'm a leaf on the wind"

Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 2200	Posted - 2014.08.30 19:33:00 - [21] - Quote Monty Mole Clone wrote: Ghosts Chance wrote: Monty Mole Clone wrote: Ghosts Chance wrote: Groz'zar Kazoku wrote: I am hearing more about you inability to use weapons then problems. I have seen videos recent ones with people going 30/4 with Ion pistols only. is it op? no. its just skill making up for weapon weaknesses. your argument about nerfing one weapon based off it being used with another is just pure stupidity. if thats the case we need to nerf all the assault bonuses, the weapons used on them, and the smg so the heavies and scouts are the only ones that can kill. -rolls his eyes and says all of that with heavy sarcasm.- your the one who cant seem to shoot a scrmbler rifle without overheating... you seem to think that its 150-200dps advantage is somehow mitigated by overheat simply becuase you havnt figured out how to not let it overheat yet. you do realise ghost that if your not heating up the weapon as fast as you can your not doing this terrible dps everybody is banging on about dont you heat is on a time formula not a per shot basis weather you fire 8 shots or 11 its the same amount of heat cost its the same formula the laser rifle uses i know what the formula is, but to get the highest amount of damage you have to heat the weapon up, or tap fire for low dps till the end of the clip, ergo if you dont heat up and take the cooldown penalty your not doing good dps are you step 1 shoot 8 shots do insane dps step 2 swap to sidearm for finisher theres no heat in the dps equasion Minmatar is Winmatar Creed of the Minja - "I'm a leaf on the wind"
Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 2201	Posted - 2014.08.30 19:55:00 - [22] - Quote Zindorak wrote: Spectre-M wrote: Please stop comparing weapon combos to single weapons. It's just absurd. The only thing that's needs changing with handheld weapons is for heat (ScR HMG) and kick (all) to be based on shots, not seconds. This would remove the turbos as well as make kick and heat an actual drawback. Right now kick is minimal and heat only occurs on the ScR, LR and HMG. AR needs a little buff. I don't see how the per shot mechanic wasn't done along time ago, except of course the LR as it's a beam. Yea I like the AR but it's just bad right now technically the inclusion of any sidearm tips the balance. and yes a scrambler rifle/sidearm combo making everything else obsolete is the definition of imbalance and im compairing the combo of scrambler sidearm to all other rifles+ sidearm Minmatar is Winmatar Creed of the Minja - "I'm a leaf on the wind"
Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 2201	Posted - 2014.08.30 20:29:00 - [23] - Quote Mejt0 wrote: Lest talk about few things. 1. ScR + smg. You can do this only to x meters. Smg have short range. Also switching guns lowers your dps output. 2. ScR dps. Decent human will make 8-10shoots/sec. Dont count ScR dps with flat 705/60 math. 3. If its so much greater that other rifles, how is it that almost nobody uses it? CR/RR dominate around rifles. How is that ,,FOTM,, chasers dont use it? Exactly. Its not that good as you think. its so good that its forcing a metagame shift to stacking as much armor as you possably can weather people are activly using it as their dominant rifle or not its forcing a limited number of viable options the scrabler rifle is the cause of that shift. and its why armor tanked suits are the only viable option right now, im assuming people are running combat rifles as a means to combat the bricked armor tanking but hold back the scrambler rifle to counter anyone not following that trend, limiting the viable options to gallente and amaar to retain enough armor to place themselves with enough armor to survive the initial scrambler burst stacking armor like that provides the best chance of beating the scrambler player while using the ombat rifle gives the best advantage against armor. the scrambler rifle is the sole reason armor so so dominant, its the sole reason theres so few competitive options Minmatar is Winmatar Creed of the Minja - "I'm a leaf on the wind"
Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 2201	Posted - 2014.08.30 20:49:00 - [24] - Quote ratamaq doc wrote: I wondered, but didn't realize you were the same person. main got banned for trolling to hard :P Minmatar is Winmatar Creed of the Minja - "I'm a leaf on the wind"
Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 2201	Posted - 2014.08.30 21:05:00 - [25] - Quote ratamaq doc wrote: Ghosts Chance wrote: ratamaq doc wrote: I wondered, but didn't realize you were the same person. main got banned for trolling to hard :P What is your suggestion for fixing? lowering the rate of fire wouldnt kill it but would remove the nessesity for stacking so much armor changing its damage profile to 110-90 may alieviate the need to stack so much armor as well without hurting its anti-shield properties either way its dps needs to be brought down so that it doesnt have that 150 dps advantage. all in all i dont see it being balanced out with a single change, its going to require a combo effort in both changing the weapon slightly AND making shield modules more valueble. the problem is that its such a good counter to shields that it removes them from validity just from exsisting while at the same time theres not an equal counter to armor (not that there should be) granted if there were an equal counter to armor in the way that the scrambler counters shields we would indeed see balance relativly quickly as it would make armor and shields equally invalid, but this of course would just bring back pure brick tanking with players aiming to maximize both shield HP and armor HP. another option would be to buff the HP of shields to make them able to withstand scrambler more and making shield tanking an excelent counter to combat rifles. its a tricky thing it really is, and CCP is really between a rock and a hard place ATM becuase its not easy to balance all this for competitive play. balancing this problem out is probably the most difficult balancing act the game can have becuase a step in the wrong direction invalidates at least half of all options. Minmatar is Winmatar Creed of the Minja - "I'm a leaf on the wind"
Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 2201	Posted - 2014.08.30 21:06:00 - [26] - Quote Vitharr Foebane wrote: Ghosts Chance wrote: Zindorak wrote: Spectre-M wrote: Please stop comparing weapon combos to single weapons. It's just absurd. The only thing that's needs changing with handheld weapons is for heat (ScR HMG) and kick (all) to be based on shots, not seconds. This would remove the turbos as well as make kick and heat an actual drawback. Right now kick is minimal and heat only occurs on the ScR, LR and HMG. AR needs a little buff. I don't see how the per shot mechanic wasn't done along time ago, except of course the LR as it's a beam. Yea I like the AR but it's just bad right now technically the inclusion of any sidearm tips the balance. and yes a scrambler rifle/sidearm combo making everything else obsolete is the definition of imbalance and im compairing the combo of scrambler sidearm to all other rifles+ sidearm by your logic is the ScP OP? After all once you drop their shields you can just swap to a SMG 300RPM prevents that it just cant put out the dps to make it work while the scrambler rifle can Minmatar is Winmatar Creed of the Minja - "I'm a leaf on the wind"
Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 2202	Posted - 2014.08.30 21:28:00 - [27] - Quote Vitharr Foebane wrote: but in skilled hands it can are you factoring in the 450% headshot bonus? after all you are using a lot of sparkly what ifs in your ScR "logic" if by sparkly what ifs you mean "what if i spam 8 shots then swap" and "what if i hit the target" then sure im using sparkly what ifs... headshots do indeed bring it more in line but the pistol lacks the utility of long range combat. ScP/SMG combo is VERY effective in pub matches for the same reasons but the lack of utility prevents it from excelling in PC the same way its big brother does not to mention the extra added utility of the charge shot Minmatar is Winmatar Creed of the Minja - "I'm a leaf on the wind"
Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 2203	Posted - 2014.08.30 22:10:00 - [28] - Quote Vitharr Foebane wrote: Ghosts Chance wrote: Vitharr Foebane wrote: but in skilled hands it can are you factoring in the 450% headshot bonus? after all you are using a lot of sparkly what ifs in your ScR "logic" if by sparkly what ifs you mean "what if i spam 8 shots then swap" and "what if i hit the target" then sure im using sparkly what ifs... headshots do indeed bring it more in line but the pistol lacks the utility of long range combat. ScP/SMG combo is VERY effective in pub matches for the same reasons but the lack of utility prevents it from excelling in PC the same way its big brother does not to mention the extra added utility of the charge shot landing consecutive headshots with the scrambler pistol is also exceedingly more difficult then landing bodyshots with a scrambler rifle. it would require perfect play to beat its older brother but would lose out on a single missed shot But that is what we are comparing yes? "Perfect Play" nope were complaining on the grounds of "equal skill" not perfect play. Minmatar is Winmatar Creed of the Minja - "I'm a leaf on the wind"
Ghosts Chance Inf4m0us 2203	Posted - 2014.08.30 22:18:00 - [29] - Quote xSir Campsalotx wrote: Ghosts Chance wrote: xSir Campsalotx wrote: How is this even up for debate? Scrambler has horrible damage profile 120/80 against half the suits in the game, overheats, needs to cool down between bursts, and is horrible against strafey scouts or assualts for that matter. Not to mention is the only semi Assualt Rifle besides the Gal Tac which is rarely used and even that one doesn't have overheat. On the dispersion point you overlook a simple fact scrambler rifles yes start off with decent Hipfire but Gal ARs and CRs can get tighter dispersion through the use of the sharpshooter skill. CR has 95/110 damage profile so it is effective against both shield and armor. Even the 110/90 Gal Ar profile is much more balanced. you diddnt factor in proficiancy skills into your damage profiles sir Because not everyone has the same profs so I went with the unbiased base stats also the scrambler rifle and mass driver are currently the best anti scout weapons in the game, so saying that its bad against strafe scouts is kind of a stretch Minmatar is Winmatar Creed of the Minja - "I'm a leaf on the wind"

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