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Echo 1991 WarRavens Final Resolution. 361	Posted - 2014.07.22 00:38:00 - [31] - Quote KING CHECKMATE wrote: Echo 1991 wrote: Quote: Are you prehaps complaining about the HMG? Currently the Highest Achievable DPS from the HMG is 800 DPS at the Far flung range of 30m. After that it's effectiveness drops rapidly until it's effective range at about 45m. Now this sounds very powerful, but there are a few considerations to be made. Firstly EVERY rifle in the game vastly outranges it, even the Assault Rifle. Provided you put enough distance between you there is nothing he can do. Secomdly the HMG has poor accuracy even after 20m you begin to loose DPS because your spread is so wide, by the time you reach further than 30m the only way to reliably submit damage is to stop, crouch and ADS making you an even easier target. In short if you are having trouble with Heavies you either need to 1. Not engage them in the tight spaces they are designed for Why do people always come up with the same old rubbish about not getting in range of their HMG? its all well and good on an open map but when you assault a point and need to get in there what are ya gonna do against that heavy? i mean really? aside from getting the jump on said heavy you would have to hope that all your bullets successfully hit in order to kill them and if they manage to turn around quick enough you will most likely die. Heavies are too good at what they do and have very few counters. Apart from a shotty RE guy or another heavy it is incredibly hard to kill a heavy in a one on one fight at most objectives because they are mainly small rooms with a hack panel. How can you stay out of the optimal if you need to get in there? You just cant. Counters to HEavy in CQ: Stealth (scouts) , GRENADES , Shotguns, Plasma Cannon , Remote Explosives ,Teamwork Counters to heavy in open Fields: WEll pretty much any weapon that outranges their HMG's. Counter to heavies with Light weapons: Getting close and using High RoF weapons,SG,Grenades,or Other Heavies Counter to Heavy on LAV: AV weaponry. Extra notes:Bunny hop, Precision enhancers,Active scanners and strafing can make your job a lot easier. WARNING: You still need skill to drop an enemy with almost DOUBLE your EHP and an HMG, but hey! if you dont have it you an always Use a Heavy yourself and pray you can kill a real heavy with it. i said a shotty scout with REs, grenades are useless against heavies as they dont do a lot of damage. obviously outranging the hmg means you should win that fight. heavies with light weapons arent much of a problem its fairly easy to outstrafe them. AV weaponry isnt a counter to the heavy its a counter to the vehicle he/she is using.
Echo 1991 WarRavens Final Resolution. 361	Posted - 2014.07.22 00:41:00 - [32] - Quote Monkey MAC wrote: Echo 1991 wrote: Quote: Are you prehaps complaining about the HMG? Currently the Highest Achievable DPS from the HMG is 800 DPS at the Far flung range of 30m. After that it's effectiveness drops rapidly until it's effective range at about 45m. Now this sounds very powerful, but there are a few considerations to be made. Firstly EVERY rifle in the game vastly outranges it, even the Assault Rifle. Provided you put enough distance between you there is nothing he can do. Secomdly the HMG has poor accuracy even after 20m you begin to loose DPS because your spread is so wide, by the time you reach further than 30m the only way to reliably submit damage is to stop, crouch and ADS making you an even easier target. In short if you are having trouble with Heavies you either need to 1. Not engage them in the tight spaces they are designed for Why do people always come up with the same old rubbish about not getting in range of their HMG? its all well and good on an open map but when you assault a point and need to get in there what are ya gonna do against that heavy? i mean really? aside from getting the jump on said heavy you would have to hope that all your bullets successfully hit in order to kill them and if they manage to turn around quick enough you will most likely die. Heavies are too good at what they do and have very few counters. Apart from a shotty RE guy or another heavy it is incredibly hard to kill a heavy in a one on one fight at most objectives because they are mainly small rooms with a hack panel. How can you stay out of the optimal if you need to get in there? You just cant. That's exactly how it's meant to be though, if heavies with HMG weren't good in close, confined spaces why have them at all. If you know there is a heavy round the corner use a Mass Driver, or a plasma cannon, or ram a tank up his backside. Use scouts with Breach Shotguns and Cloaks, use grenades, use Forge guns, use Remote Explosives, use an Assault with 2/3 logis on his back. So in reality it's not a problem with the Heavy suit is it? It is down to the fact the HMG has somewhere it is good, very good amd you can't beat by just running round the corner, chop-strafing and using a damage modded rifle. It's called tactics and there are plenty of options available, stop trying to be the one man army all the time. so in a close quaters battle you recommend a forge gun? And it should take the combined efforts of 4 people to down one heavy? Are you serious? Grenades are absolute garbage against heavies they take less than 400 damage to their armour hardly gonna stop the guy.
ShamelessALT Ametat Security Amarr Empire 6	Posted - 2014.07.22 01:07:00 - [33] - Quote Adipem Nothi wrote: You guys ready to admit that there's a problem yet? Ill admit there is a problem... it's called whinny little cloaked wallhacking scouts wailing about the one suit they have to shoot more then once with their shotgun If you strike me down, I shall become more powerful then you can possibly imagine...
castba Merc-0107 521	Posted - 2014.07.22 01:28:00 - [34] - Quote Adipem Nothi wrote: Xocoyol Zaraoul wrote: Out of curiosity, in a team of 16 people, how many would you find it acceptable to have heavy suits? Your ideal number is? Assuming suits were balanced ... I imagine it would be somewhere under the current 8-10 :-) You see 8-10 heavies per team on Manus Peak and Line Harvest?
Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 3127	Posted - 2014.07.22 01:53:00 - [35] - Quote castba wrote: Adipem Nothi wrote: Xocoyol Zaraoul wrote: Out of curiosity, in a team of 16 people, how many would you find it acceptable to have heavy suits? Your ideal number is? Assuming suits were balanced ... I imagine it would be somewhere under the current 8-10 :-) You see 8-10 heavies per team on Manus Peak and Line Harvest? 8-10 heavies on any map is indicative of a problem. Shoot scout with yes... - Ripley Riley
KING CHECKMATE Opus Arcana Covert Intervention 5438	Posted - 2014.07.22 01:58:00 - [36] - Quote Adipem Nothi wrote: Thank you guys for all those excuses, explanations, illustrations and advise; all very nice, really. Now to get back to the point of this thread ... Been seeing alot of Heavy Spam. I'm sure you have too. By spam, I mean 50% or more of the mercs I encountered today (friendly and hostile) were waddling around in Heavy Frames. Why do you guys make of this? I try not to QQ and get to it. If Enemy Spams Heavies, i Use Scout with SG. If they spam Scouts, i Use Heavy. If they spam med frames, i laugh and proceed to take out my Neo gal Commando G-1 With Toxin AR and Mass driver and go 35-0... Its all about adapting my friend.... On a more direct answer: ''Why do you guys make of this?'' I get Medium Frames are trying to get more kills in a diffucult world of Powerful Sentinels and invisible scouts and since running in a 300 (-) EHP scout is too difficult for their FOTM weak a***es, then they choose to go full tanked Sentinel in an LAV. Simple. Stealth Storm
Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 1605	Posted - 2014.07.22 02:43:00 - [37] - Quote NO! scount op nurf naow it kil my hevy soot nub scount nead nurf hevy is skillllzzz cod optix leet 1337 corners trixshot pro yo "Minmitar Scout" and "Masochist" are synonyms. Kills-Archduke Ferd1nand
Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 1605	Posted - 2014.07.22 02:44:00 - [38] - Quote Jack 3enimble wrote: Adipem Nothi wrote: You guys ready to admit that there's a problem yet? IMHO here's the "problem". You see more heavies because CCP introduced 3 new heavy frames. So everyone that wanted to play a heavy but not with a Amarr frame plays heavy now with 3 of the new suits. That's why there is a scout "spam" aswell, people tend to flock to what is new especially after the respect that was given and the million clone challenge. That way people got experimental with the heavy frame. ("ah what the hell I have 600k sp laying around, let me try it out") Note that most of the heavies you see are adv. The heavy spam was there already just now magnified because of 3 new suits. Remember the heavy event or the introduction of the research lab map. Just my 2 cents. They're adv because it doesn't matter what level you use, its still OP "Minmitar Scout" and "Masochist" are synonyms. Kills-Archduke Ferd1nand
Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 1605	Posted - 2014.07.22 02:45:00 - [39] - Quote ShamelessALT wrote: Adipem Nothi wrote: You guys ready to admit that there's a problem yet? Ill admit there is a problem... it's called whinny little cloaked wallhacking scouts wailing about the one suit they have to shoot more then once with their shotgun The sheer idiocy of this post.... "Minmitar Scout" and "Masochist" are synonyms. Kills-Archduke Ferd1nand
Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 1605	Posted - 2014.07.22 02:48:00 - [40] - Quote Adipem Nothi wrote: Thank you guys for all those excuses, explanations, illustrations and advise; all very nice, really. Now to get back to the point of this thread ... Been seeing alot of Heavy Spam. I'm sure you have too. By spam, I mean 50% or more of the mercs I encountered today (friendly and hostile) were waddling around in Heavy Frames. Why do you guys make of this? This is how most (pub) matches I'm in go-- 1.) Enemy spawns in scouts with shotguns or ACR's 2.) I SG all the scouts with shotguns and ACR's 3.) Enemy switches to HMG heavys 4.) I get fed up with dying after connecting 4 shotgun rounds and being hit while behind cover and start using remotes because i run out of ammo with my SG 5.) HMG heavies come and complain on the forums that remotes are OP "Minmitar Scout" and "Masochist" are synonyms. Kills-Archduke Ferd1nand

Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 1608	Posted - 2014.07.22 02:53:00 - [41] - Quote What happens when heavies are OP: Velociraptor antirrhopus wrote: RayRay James wrote: When I can kill a sentinel / HMG with a Sevr / Exile there is no problem Move along. Get your useful asses in my pro-Sentinel thread before CCP nerfs us: https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=168709&find=unread What happens when scouts are OP: Scout community: Hmm, maybe if we severely nerfed armor tanking on a scout so that it becomes a more skill oriented class again, it would be great. Scout spam is no fun. What happens when tanks are OP: Tanker community: Nooooooo don't nerf us we can still be killed by 6 people with proto swarm launchers if we go AFK! Thats how OP AV is right now!! Just some funny observations I've made. EDIt: Also just set a new record for PLAK "Minmitar Scout" and "Masochist" are synonyms. Kills-Archduke Ferd1nand
Bojo The Mighty Spaceman Drug Cartel-Uno 4300	Posted - 2014.07.22 02:54:00 - [42] - Quote Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p wrote: 5.) HMG heavies come and complain on the forums that remotes are OP So true: 6/8 of suits can use them lol Smell the burning flesh. Taste the tangy sulfur air. Volcano Season - Moltar's Haiku : SGC2C
Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 1608	Posted - 2014.07.22 02:56:00 - [43] - Quote Bojo The Mighty wrote: Gavr1lo Pr1nc1p wrote: 5.) HMG heavies come and complain on the forums that remotes are OP So true: 6/8 of suits can use them lol The funny thing is, I almost exclusively run remotes on my frontline fit, yet if i get one kill with them on my minja, the tears come flowing. "Minmitar Scout" and "Masochist" are synonyms. Kills-Archduke Ferd1nand
RYN0CER0S Rise Of Old Dudes 593	Posted - 2014.07.22 02:56:00 - [44] - Quote I remember when people used to know how to cook grenades... You NEVER see that anymore - especially in pubs. Then again, you weren't penalized for getting better grenades, either. Anyways, when Assaults are put back on the level with Heavies and Scouts, then we can decide what's actually 'spam'. There is no 'spam' in survivability. People, like myself, will go to Assaults because going slow as **** all the time sucks. I've been a Heavy for about a year, acquiring all other other classes/roles along the way, but lately I've had more fun in a Brick Scout with SMGs or Commandos with AR+TAR because my Assaults all suck when compared to everything else. It is (read: should be) meant to be the go-to Frontline Slayer - not relegated to the back of the field, running for cover. Or, they could just make characteristics other than HP and DPS viable. PSN: The_Rynoceros Console Master Race "It's better to burn out, than fade away." ~Def Leppard
Michael Arck 4941	Posted - 2014.07.22 02:59:00 - [45] - Quote Lol at OP claiming to see on average 8 to 10 heavies per team. Archistrategos *Where the fear has gone there will be nothing....only I will remain*
Llast 326 An Arkhos 3982	Posted - 2014.07.22 03:12:00 - [46] - Quote Personally I do see this as a problem If you are okay with this then I think you may want to reassess how this game is played. KRRROOOOOOM
Killar-12 The Exemplars Top Men. 3004	Posted - 2014.07.22 03:21:00 - [47] - Quote Would we like to talk about Scout Spam? or will we ignore that too, Heavies and Scouts are fine, Assaults need a buff, and the non-min logis need help I am an Idiot, and so are you!
Bojo The Mighty Spaceman Drug Cartel-Uno 4308	Posted - 2014.07.22 03:23:00 - [48] - Quote Killar-12 wrote: Would we like to talk about Scout Spam? or will we ignore that too, Heavies and Scouts are fine, Assaults need a buff, and the non-min logis need help We openly admit our issue and have done a run through with Rattati and he has come up with the solution and posted it. Scout spam really can't be further discussed because it has been. Our issue is that particular heavies, not all I know very many chill heavies, refuse to believe they are part of a problem....for this reason the Heavy CPU/PG nerf is still under discussion whilst scout eWar changes are pretty much set in stone. Assault buff is unanimous and I can't speak of the logis. Just as long as the dice keep rollin, the hoes keep hoein, and the money keeps flowin!
Killar-12 The Exemplars Top Men. 3004	Posted - 2014.07.22 03:25:00 - [49] - Quote I've got Scouts, Assaults, Logis, Commandos and Sentinels Proto, the Assault, Some Logis and the Commandos need some love, otherwise some minor tweaks will be fine, I run Scout and Heavy and still manage to grab 20 kills fairly often. I am an Idiot, and so are you!
Bojo The Mighty Spaceman Drug Cartel-Uno 4308	Posted - 2014.07.22 03:28:00 - [50] - Quote Killar-12 wrote: I've got Scouts, Assaults, Logis, Commandos and Sentinels Proto, the Assault, Some Logis and the Commandos need some love, otherwise some minor tweaks will be fine, I run Scout and Heavy and still manage to grab 20 kills fairly often. Really commandos need hugs? I honestly think they are fine as is. They have bite to them and definite weaknesses. Just as long as the dice keep rollin, the hoes keep hoein, and the money keeps flowin!

Patrick57 Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 7818	Posted - 2014.07.22 03:38:00 - [51] - Quote Monkey MAC wrote: Are you complaing about the EHP? The maximum achievable Tank is currently about 1600 EHP, this may seem like a lot, but for perspective a Standard Assault Rifle carries 1,800dmg per clip which it dispenses in less than 4 seconds. Now you also have to consider this 'Extreme EHP' comes at some sacrifices, mostly Gùå Largest Hitbox Gùå Slowest Speed Gùå Lack of Equipment So what exactly is the problem here? Are you prehaps complaining about the HMG? Currently the Highest Achievable DPS from the HMG is 800 DPS at the Far flung range of 30m. After that it's effectiveness drops rapidly until it's effective range at about 45m. Now this sounds very powerful, but there are a few considerations to be made. Firstly EVERY rifle in the game vastly outranges it, even the Assault Rifle. Provided you put enough distance between you there is nothing he can do. Secomdly the HMG has poor accuracy even after 20m you begin to loose DPS because your spread is so wide, by the time you reach further than 30m the only way to reliably submit damage is to stop, crouch and ADS making you an even easier target. In short if you are having trouble with Heavies you either need to 1. Not engage them in the tight spaces they are designed for 2. Get good I'll let you figure out which one aplies here. What about maps that are based in / around a complex? How can you counter 8-10 Heavies in the middle of the city if you aren't a Heavy yourself? Don't give me the "shotgun scout with REs, duh" excuse. Only the most talented Scouts can take out 3-4 Heavies in a row, without dying, and any Heavy with eyes can see a Scout coming at them, and if they're shot in the back they just turn around, backpedal, and strafe a bit to avoid the shots. I ran around as a ~500ish HP Proto Gal Scout all Friday and Saturday, with a Duvolle AR, and I saw at least 6 heavies 4/5 matches (although, to be fair, I played against Alex-ZX a lot XD). Something needs to be done about spam, although that does lead to an inevitable nerf (or, possibly an indirect nerf, like changing maps to be more open, but that's highly unlikely). Also, about your AR damage vs Heavy HP: The Duvolle AR does 453.2 DPS, far lower than an HMG, and still has a low range. When caught in a Heavy's optimal (which I often was - this goes back to the spam, combined with the AR's low range), I had no chance. Their large HP combined with their huge DPS and my low HP / DPS made me completely useless. But, I digress. The point is, the spam is outrageous, and nearly impossible to counter inside city maps, which are a good portion of all the maps. Also, I am a Heavy and Scout, and I'd be perfectly fine with a Heavy nerf. King Thunderbolt is my number one fan. :D TFR
Dimitri Rascolovitch The Immortal Knights 170	Posted - 2014.07.22 04:16:00 - [52] - Quote as much as it doesnt matter to you guys, yall cant call me being a heavy a FOTM action, as i started this game as a heavy back in 1.3 where the FOTM was full proto Callogi with a duvole AR and damage mods ...Yeah, i use a heavy machine gun, and I think i do a Damn good job at it. i eat babies forum warrior Lv0
mollerz 4259	Posted - 2014.07.22 04:53:00 - [53] - Quote The bullshit where heavies use LAVs needs to be fixed. I've suggested it before- LAVs need to move exponentially slower as more heavies get in. I made a thread about this back int he day, and the cry baby whining I got from the heavy community in return made me want to go stick my head in a nursery full of colicky babies. Also, backpedal speeds need to be significantly reduced. I saw a nyan chan heavy doing a two step that would make a prohibition era hooker blush. That should't be possible. Do you want awesome change? Do you want dust to rock like never before? Then vote Appia for CPM1
Jotun Izalaru Goonfeet 182	Posted - 2014.07.22 04:57:00 - [54] - Quote mollerz wrote: The bullshit where heavies use LAVs needs to be fixed. I've suggested it before- LAVs need to move exponentially slower as more heavies get in. I made a thread about this back int he day, and the cry baby whining I got from the heavy community in return made me want to go stick my head in a nursery full of colicky babies. Also, backpedal speeds need to be significantly reduced. I saw a nyan chan heavy doing a two step that would make a prohibition era hooker blush. That should't be possible. non-forward speed in general has always needed a knock down ever since it was settled at 90%. Which was in improvement over the I think 110 percent that CCP made it accidentally immediately before that.
Bojo The Mighty Spaceman Drug Cartel-Uno 4327	Posted - 2014.07.22 05:20:00 - [55] - Quote mollerz wrote: The bullshit where heavies use LAVs needs to be fixed. I've suggested it before- LAVs need to move exponentially slower as more heavies get in. I made a thread about this back int he day, and the cry baby whining I got from the heavy community in return made me want to go stick my head in a nursery full of colicky babies. Also, backpedal speeds need to be significantly reduced. I saw a nyan chan heavy doing a two step that would make a prohibition era hooker blush. That should't be possible. Whoa there mollerz! As a professional LAV driver, the golden motto is "Your LAV has as much health as you do" so it's common practice to drive and operate turrets in Heavy Frames. We do not hop out with HMGs, we are far nicer and use 20 GJ Railguns! Just as long as the dice keep rollin, the hoes keep hoein, and the money keeps flowin!
calvin b Sinq Laison Gendarmes Gallente Federation 1774	Posted - 2014.07.22 05:40:00 - [56] - Quote Its easy to kill heavies just do not think you can when you are 10M from them. If you find yourself there just accept your fate and try and take them with you. Closed Beta Vet and Retired Heavy. Assaults 07
BigStuarty New Age Empire. General Tso's Alliance 26	Posted - 2014.07.22 10:53:00 - [57] - Quote I believe Heavies are fine and work as intended , I don't expect to run run into 1 and survive mano-vs mano. I have only 2 issues , the HMG range is a little to far and tacnet doesn't show them all the time. I don't expect a heavy to pop out of nowhere, I haven't numbered cruched but I do have a precision enhancer (complex) fitted so even if the heavy does have a dampener he should be a bright red blob. That aside they normally run as a pack and the RE specialists must have field days with them. I loathe REs and still trying to figure out how a scout jumps past me drops a RE and detonates out of harms way in less that a second, Is that myself using a PS3 controller automatically at a disadvantage ??? Though I do salute them and the ability to do it just pick on the heavies not me lol
Monkey MAC Rough Riders.. 3122	Posted - 2014.07.22 10:55:00 - [58] - Quote Echo 1991 wrote: Monkey MAC wrote: Echo 1991 wrote: Quote: Are you prehaps complaining about the HMG? Currently the Highest Achievable DPS from the HMG is 800 DPS at the Far flung range of 30m. After that it's effectiveness drops rapidly until it's effective range at about 45m. Now this sounds very powerful, but there are a few considerations to be made. Firstly EVERY rifle in the game vastly outranges it, even the Assault Rifle. Provided you put enough distance between you there is nothing he can do. Secomdly the HMG has poor accuracy even after 20m you begin to loose DPS because your spread is so wide, by the time you reach further than 30m the only way to reliably submit damage is to stop, crouch and ADS making you an even easier target. In short if you are having trouble with Heavies you either need to 1. Not engage them in the tight spaces they are designed for Why do people always come up with the same old rubbish about not getting in range of their HMG? its all well and good on an open map but when you assault a point and need to get in there what are ya gonna do against that heavy? i mean really? aside from getting the jump on said heavy you would have to hope that all your bullets successfully hit in order to kill them and if they manage to turn around quick enough you will most likely die. Heavies are too good at what they do and have very few counters. Apart from a shotty RE guy or another heavy it is incredibly hard to kill a heavy in a one on one fight at most objectives because they are mainly small rooms with a hack panel. How can you stay out of the optimal if you need to get in there? You just cant. That's exactly how it's meant to be though, if heavies with HMG weren't good in close, confined spaces why have them at all. If you know there is a heavy round the corner use a Mass Driver, or a plasma cannon, or ram a tank up his backside. Use scouts with Breach Shotguns and Cloaks, use grenades, use Forge guns, use Remote Explosives, use an Assault with 2/3 logis on his back. So in reality it's not a problem with the Heavy suit is it? It is down to the fact the HMG has somewhere it is good, very good amd you can't beat by just running round the corner, chop-strafing and using a damage modded rifle. It's called tactics and there are plenty of options available, stop trying to be the one man army all the time. so in a close quaters battle you recommend a forge gun? And it should take the combined efforts of 4 people to down one heavy? Are you serious? Grenades are absolute garbage against heavies they take less than 400 damage to their armour hardly gonna stop the guy. I've done it before, most heavies don't reach max tank so a single shot from a mlt forge gun, will OHK most of them. I'm not saying you HAVE to use 3/4 people, but if you have the resources I don't see why not. Grenades and Mass Drivers work well, finally wave some bait in front of them and they will waddle straight into traps looking for eaay kills. It's not a case of Spam, it's people using a suit in an environment it was built for. If you have a problem with how that works I suggest you start finding your own way to counter them. Heavies don't need a nerf just because they manage to do their job. They call me the Monkey - I like to jump off sh** and piss RE's all over your tank! Monkey Mac - Forum Warrior Lvl 3
Monkey MAC Rough Riders.. 3122	Posted - 2014.07.22 11:07:00 - [59] - Quote Patrick57 wrote: Monkey MAC wrote: Are you complaing about the EHP? The maximum achievable Tank is currently about 1600 EHP, this may seem like a lot, but for perspective a Standard Assault Rifle carries 1,800dmg per clip which it dispenses in less than 4 seconds. Now you also have to consider this 'Extreme EHP' comes at some sacrifices, mostly Gùå Largest Hitbox Gùå Slowest Speed Gùå Lack of Equipment So what exactly is the problem here? Are you prehaps complaining about the HMG? Currently the Highest Achievable DPS from the HMG is 800 DPS at the Far flung range of 30m. After that it's effectiveness drops rapidly until it's effective range at about 45m. Now this sounds very powerful, but there are a few considerations to be made. Firstly EVERY rifle in the game vastly outranges it, even the Assault Rifle. Provided you put enough distance between you there is nothing he can do. Secomdly the HMG has poor accuracy even after 20m you begin to loose DPS because your spread is so wide, by the time you reach further than 30m the only way to reliably submit damage is to stop, crouch and ADS making you an even easier target. In short if you are having trouble with Heavies you either need to 1. Not engage them in the tight spaces they are designed for 2. Get good I'll let you figure out which one aplies here. What about maps that are based in / around a complex? How can you counter 8-10 Heavies in the middle of the city if you aren't a Heavy yourself? Don't give me the "shotgun scout with REs, duh" excuse. Only the most talented Scouts can take out 3-4 Heavies in a row, without dying, and any Heavy with eyes can see a Scout coming at them, and if they're shot in the back they just turn around, backpedal, and strafe a bit to avoid the shots. I ran around as a ~500ish HP Proto Gal Scout all Friday and Saturday, with a Duvolle AR, and I saw at least 6 heavies 4/5 matches (although, to be fair, I played against Alex-ZX a lot XD). Something needs to be done about spam, although that does lead to an inevitable nerf (or, possibly an indirect nerf, like changing maps to be more open, but that's highly unlikely). Also, about your AR damage vs Heavy HP: The Duvolle AR does 453.2 DPS, far lower than an HMG, and still has a low range. When caught in a Heavy's optimal (which I often was - this goes back to the spam, combined with the AR's low range), I had no chance. Their large HP combined with their huge DPS and my low HP / DPS made me completely useless. But, I digress. The point is, the spam is outrageous, and nearly impossible to counter inside city maps, which are a good portion of all the maps. Also, I am a Heavy and Scout, and I'd be perfectly fine with a Heavy nerf. So you were caught in his Optimal and? Youd didn't expect to die? I know this is gonna seem odd, but have you ever ran from a heavy inside his optimal? Take a look at this graph. https://docs.google.com/document/d/1oQQ9DSTVq-tvOhZDXICz63PmZcHcvJqntya_ It shows that even the Breach Assault Rifle will out DPS the HMG after 45m with greater than 300 DPS. Unfortunately the HMG itself is not on the graph but I would appreciate someome adding it in. They call me the Monkey - I like to jump off sh** and piss RE's all over your tank! Monkey Mac - Forum Warrior Lvl 3
TheD1CK Dead Man's Game Dark Taboo 1126	Posted - 2014.07.22 11:17:00 - [60] - Quote The issue is how the Sentinel is used (abused) and his scrub Logi fiends. Most games are locked-down by Heavy/Logi.. scrubs treating pubs like a PC,,, damn tryhards And then I recieve 'colourful' mail for tossing RE's at the scrubs who thought camping an enclosed area was a bright idea.. then they QQ that RE's are OP yet in reality if they had the sense to engage you they would likely get the kill. CCP - please note - 50 ticket ambush is HELL without tanks, please re-instate Duna2002 so the Boundless HMG spam stops. - Nerfing remotes will take away the most effective way to flush out the rats. - Rep and uplink WP needs adjusting so the spamlogi's actually bother to re-supply rather than farm WP I'm going to stop myself here.. Heavy spam is affecting my clones Rage Regulators This forum is more toxic to our playerbase than All the stompers combined Get good at playing before you talk crap



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