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JonnyAugust Imperfects Negative-Feedback 333	Posted - 2014.05.04 15:05:00 - [1] - Quote Of the players. For the players... Or not. The audacity to consider their self-importance so great as to throw all loyal Dust fans under the bus and allow us to waste real life money on a game they knew was going to die months before even some Devs knew. Their involvement in the development of this game has been detrimental at best since the beginning as they help sowed the seeds of its demise. The cancelation of DUST PS3 development is not only CCPs failure but also CPM0s failure. Nova Knife attests that he was so mad when he heard the knews that we all heard at fanfest. So mad he did absolutely nothing to save the friends and fellow players of DUST for months. He coward in the shadows afraid to lose his position of being lap dog to CCP. It's easy for him to talk a big game now and pretend to side with all of us when in reality he is no better than the developers that threw us under the bus. I find the complete lack of character disgusting, no one had the guts to stand up and say enough is enough or resign to make a point. They chose to obey rather than represent us. I am more disappointed with the CPM than CCP because I can understand at least that CCP operates as a business for profit reasons. CPM was here to help us, the players and CCP to realize the dream that was DUST514.
Rahl Draak Fraternity of St. Venefice Amarr Empire 82	Posted - 2014.05.04 15:08:00 - [2] - Quote .....playing the smallest, saddest song...on the world's smallest violin.................just for you.
Joseph Ridgeson warravens Final Resolution. 1555	Posted - 2014.05.04 15:09:00 - [3] - Quote NDA. Legally binding contract is terrifying. Sure you can say "they should have broken it because this was important!" but the world can't work that way. Lawful Neutral... The fact of Legion is not terrible. It hurts but it isn't terrible. The lack of information and zero respect that CCP have given to us, customers, is shockingly terrible.
Gaelon Thrace Villore Sec Ops Gallente Federation 362	Posted - 2014.05.04 15:09:00 - [4] - Quote You have absolutely no idea what you're talking about.
Iron Wolf Saber Den of Swords 14683	Posted - 2014.05.04 15:10:00 - [5] - Quote The lack of information is disturbing with this one. Twitter, Dev Trackers, IRC, pod casts, and some social circles are your best friends. Can't be arsed to do a summary though Ill let a blue explain it all. Ill put it this way 100% of your claims are generated by your own fear and not facts and rather the lack of facts that most of which are still fomulating. There are facts out there pay attention to those in the comming weeks before you decide to throw everything under the bus. CPM 0 Secretary Omni-Soldier, Forum Warrior, Annoying Artist \\= Advanced Caldari Assault // Unlocked
ResistanceGTA D.A.R.K L.E.G.I.O.N D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 995	Posted - 2014.05.04 15:12:00 - [6] - Quote At least the CPM told CCP they were being beyond f*cking stupid telling us on Fanfest, and warned them not to do so. I'm really curious what moron thought it was a good idea. I'm assuming that's NDA too though... xSivartx is my Heavy. There are many like him, but he is my own... So, other Logi's back off, those are my Warpoints!
knight of 6 SVER True Blood General Tso's Alliance 1894	Posted - 2014.05.04 15:14:00 - [7] - Quote dude they were under a legal contract not to say anything. also they don't work for the players they act as a sounding board for ccp. Ko6 scout,
Soldner VonKuechle SAM-MIK General Tso's Alliance 735	Posted - 2014.05.04 15:16:00 - [8] - Quote Joseph Ridgeson wrote: NDA. Legally binding contract is terrifying. Sure you can say "they should have broken it because this was important!" but the world can't work that way. Lawful Neutral... The fact of Legion is not terrible. It hurts but it isn't terrible. The lack of information and zero respect that CCP have given to us, customers, is shockingly terrible. Those who've never dealt with CAs/NDAs are lucky. They fckuing suck. On the plus side it makes me very attractive to be a corporate espionage target. The frenchy resigning from CPM proves they work :/ And let the Forums continue to BURN.
Flambario Steelhammer United Pwnage Service RISE of LEGION 15	Posted - 2014.05.04 17:04:00 - [9] - Quote Since there are CPM that will not make the move. I would like to get the names. At lease one of them should step up and tell everybody I'm quiting because the lack of development after 1.8! You can not NDA that you know nothing.
ZDub 303 TeamPlayers Dirt Nap Squad. 2700	Posted - 2014.05.04 17:08:00 - [10] - Quote What do you think the CPM should have done JohnnyAugust? I'm genuinely curious what you think the CPM could have done differently that they did not. '#PCMasterRace 5/2/2014 - Best day in Dust's history CCP Rouge - The Hero of Dust

One Eyed King Land of the BIind 1352	Posted - 2014.05.04 17:08:00 - [11] - Quote They aren't devs, just unpaid consultants essentially. This is all on CCP. I can't imagine trying to be a CPM through this, I would like to imagine I would have resigned in protest, but its easy for me to say so from looking from the outside. That doesn't detract from the fact that this whole mess is detestable and was avoidable. Just don't be silly enough to believe the CPM could have stopped it if they wanted to. Nos Nothi for Life
Garrett Blacknova Codex Troopers 5287	Posted - 2014.05.04 17:14:00 - [12] - Quote I've dealt with NDAs before. If this was me, I would have been saying "screw NDA, tell the players or I will" as soon as they started pushing AUR sales onto us while KNOWING the game was about to see a MASSIVE change that negates many people's spending.
Mary Lilac Namtar Elite Gallente Federation 13	Posted - 2014.05.04 17:20:00 - [13] - Quote ZDub 303 wrote: What do you think the CPM should have done JohnnyAugust? I'm genuinely curious what you think the CPM could have done differently that they did not. Easy, they should have all stepped down. This is the only possible course of action they could have taken because: A. It would not break the NDA and B. IT would be an unmistakable signal to the playerbase that something was wrong. Instead they did nothing, and became complicit in the theft of real life money that has been perpetrated over the last 6 months. CPM are just as much thieves in their in-action as the developers who misrepresented the future of the game to increase profits. 1-800-345-SONY. PRESS 2 THEN 2. GET YOUR REFUND. RE-POST THIS IN YOUR SIG. Be polite, they want to refund you!
KING SALASI MAJOR DISTRIBUTION 237	Posted - 2014.05.04 17:22:00 - [14] - Quote Lol CPM could have gotten around the NDA but they choose not to. They could've contacted any gaming news media and spilled the beans it's called an unnamed source lol.
Cotsy The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY 101	Posted - 2014.05.04 17:26:00 - [15] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: The lack of information is disturbing with this one. Twitter, Dev Trackers, IRC, pod casts, and some social circles are your best friends. Can't be arsed to do a summary though Ill let a blue explain it all. Ill put it this way 100% of your claims are generated by your own fear and not facts and rather the lack of facts that most of which are still fomulating. There are facts out there pay attention to those in the comming weeks before you decide to throw everything under the bus. I don't know the quote about dust 514 being a plane about to crash and its due to a bad engine, and dust is dead came from they can't change the engine of a failing plane mid flight.
I-Shayz-I I-----I 3269	Posted - 2014.05.04 17:28:00 - [16] - Quote Garrett Blacknova wrote: I've dealt with NDAs before. If this was me, I would have been saying "screw NDA, tell the players or I will" as soon as they started pushing AUR sales onto us while KNOWING the game was about to see a MASSIVE change that negates many people's spending. If I had been on the CPM I would have already known that the DEVs have good intentions for us players heading towards Legion. I would have also known that Legion is hardly anything but a concept at this point, and that anything they release at Fanfest could possibly never happen. And finally I would also know that Dust 514 will still be worked on and updated for months to come because of the way I would see the dedication to Dust that the DEVs still have. However, CCP probably didn't expect a reaction like this. They revealed it in a way that was supposed to make us surprised and excited, but they worded it and explained it in a way that made many players very angry. They also did it without any explanation as to the things that us players wanted to know in the first place, and without a reassuring gesture. Miscommunication, not being prepared for all possible outcomes, and not communicating effectively led to what has happened. Let's just be glad they actually gave us some more detailed answers within a few hours rather than days or weeks.
ZDub 303 TeamPlayers Dirt Nap Squad. 2702	Posted - 2014.05.04 17:31:00 - [17] - Quote Mary Lilac wrote: ZDub 303 wrote: What do you think the CPM should have done JohnnyAugust? I'm genuinely curious what you think the CPM could have done differently that they did not. Easy, they should have all stepped down. This is the only possible course of action they could have taken because: A. It would not break the NDA and B. IT would be an unmistakable signal to the playerbase that something was wrong. Instead they did nothing, and became complicit in the theft of real life money that has been perpetrated over the last 6 months. CPM are just as much thieves in their in-action as the developers who misrepresented the future of the game to increase profits. I don't understand why they should step down. This is literally the best thing that CCP could have done regarding the ground combat side of new eden, as CPM at least they could help voice community concerns and make the transition smoother. Their purpose was to help facilitate the relationship between CPM and CCP Shanghai, I don't see how acting like 13 year olds and ragequitting would have done any good. That CCP Shanghai waited until Fanfest to say anything is not the fault of the CPM, they tried their best to get CCP to say something earlier. That CCP is running events for their own free to play product is just business. If you spent money on Dust only because you were hoping it would become Legion is no fault of anyone but yourself. You buy products in a free to play game because of it what it is now not what it might become in 3-4 years. Projecting your own hurt feelings onto the CPM is unproductive and childish. '#PCMasterRace 5/2/2014 - Best day in Dust's history CCP Rouge - The Hero of Dust
DeeJay One Guardian Solutions DARKSTAR ARMY 301	Posted - 2014.05.04 17:32:00 - [18] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: 100% of your claims are generated by your own fear and not facts and rather the lack of facts that most of which are still fomulating. There are facts out there pay attention to those in the comming weeks before you decide to throw everything under the bus. That's exactly the problem - we weren't provided any facts, just a lot of maybe's, and that's after the outrage started. The facts should be there from day 1, waiting "a few weeks" (which in CCP speak means at least two months) is irresponsible. That's like saying "you will be fired, but we still don't know when, maybe tomorrow, maybe next month, but we already have the papers we only need to fill in the date" - would you stay at such a workplace or GTFO from there?
Ducttape Tinker Krusual Covert Operators Minmatar Republic 111	Posted - 2014.05.04 17:34:00 - [19] - Quote Hell how i want see CCP building in fire, like really. "Just return back to see how this dust falling in to rust."
Mobius Wyvern Ahrendee Mercenaries Dirt Nap Squad. 5150	Posted - 2014.05.04 17:37:00 - [20] - Quote Mary Lilac wrote: ZDub 303 wrote: What do you think the CPM should have done JohnnyAugust? I'm genuinely curious what you think the CPM could have done differently that they did not. Easy, they should have all stepped down. This is the only possible course of action they could have taken because: A. It would not break the NDA and B. IT would be an unmistakable signal to the playerbase that something was wrong. Instead they did nothing, and became complicit in the theft of real life money that has been perpetrated over the last 6 months. CPM are just as much thieves in their in-action as the developers who misrepresented the future of the game to increase profits. grinds the palms of his hands into this face yet again Can you all stop? Seriously? Are there any adults on these forums? I was under the impression that teenagers were in the minority here. Yes, okay, the reveal of Legion was about as bad a ****-up as BP's public relations after the Gulf oil spill, and I don't feel like I'm exaggerating when I say that. There is no conspiracy. There is no evil plot. It's time to stop the rumormongering and get back to reality. I would be less inclined to respect CPM0 if they all just left because they didn't like CCP's plan for the reveal. I'm glad they stayed where they were and kept trying to convince CCP to change their minds. Bailing out is a cheap move. Amidst the blue skies A link from past to future The sheltering wings of the protector

Garrett Blacknova Codex Troopers 5289	Posted - 2014.05.04 20:23:00 - [21] - Quote I-Shayz-I wrote: Garrett Blacknova wrote: I've dealt with NDAs before. If this was me, I would have been saying "screw NDA, tell the players or I will" as soon as they started pushing AUR sales onto us while KNOWING the game was about to see a MASSIVE change that negates many people's spending. If I had been on the CPM I would have already known that the DEVs have good intentions for us players heading towards Legion. If you had been on CPM, you would also already have known that pushing Aurum sales while DUST is being abandoned was a horrible decision. I'm not saying they were wrong because they didn't INSTANTLY tell us about this the moment they heard Legion was being worked on. I'm saying they were wrong because THEY KNEW CCP WERE SCREWING CUSTOMERS. Up until the announcement, we were ALL being led to believe that DUST was going to continue on its 10 year plan and was in the process of moving to PS4. NOT moving to PC, which many players DON'T have up to date for gaming, but PS4, which a fair number of DUST players have bought, some specifically because we were looking forward to the next-gen version ON THE CONSOLE WE HAD BEEN TOLD IT WAS COMING TO. Letting our characters continue on a new game is small comfort when we've already invested time and money into the wrong platform UNDER THE ADVICE OF CCP, and getting upset with people who SHOULD have warned us earlier is perfectly understandable. When they not only knew in advance, AND knew about the sales when they were happening, it was offensive and wrong for them not to leak that information. Quote: I would have also known that Legion is hardly anything but a concept at this point, and that anything they release at Fanfest could possibly never happen. And this makes it even more baffling that they've transferred THE MAJORITY OF DUST'S DEV TEAM TO THE PROJECT instead of keeping the game running properly with competent support. Quote: And finally I would also know that Dust 514 will still be worked on and updated for months to come because of the way I would see the dedication to Dust that the DEVs still have. Most of which "updates" and "work" will be minor bug fixes and cleaning up the messes that have been months overdue for such treatment, and a large part of the delays is probably THE FACT THAT MOST OF THE TEAM ISN'T WORKING ON THE GAME ANY MORE. Quote: However, CCP probably didn't expect a reaction like this. They revealed it in a way that was supposed to make us surprised and excited, but they worded it and explained it in a way that made many players very angry. They also did it without any explanation as to the things that us players wanted to know in the first place, and without a reassuring gesture. Miscommunication, not being prepared for all possible outcomes, and not communicating effectively led to what has happened. Let's just be glad they actually gave us some more detailed answers within a few hours rather than days or weeks. They released it in the most incompetent way they possibly could have. They gouged paying customers in a manner that can only be seen as deliberate if you're willing to assume they have any competence as a business. I mean, I suppose there is a plausible-ish argument that every single staff member at CCP is completely insane. I seriously doubt it, even with this and Incarna to support the theory.
Mobius Wyvern Ahrendee Mercenaries Dirt Nap Squad. 5163	Posted - 2014.05.04 20:26:00 - [22] - Quote Dust is not being abandoned. As far as the announcement, not a single person on any side of the "discussion" will argue that that was the worst possible ****-up they could have made in announcing the project. The complete lack of other information for several hours afterward was even worse, as it just poured more fuel on the rage. Amidst the blue skies A link from past to future The sheltering wings of the protector
Kelestia Colvolian DUST'S Rouge Wedding 94	Posted - 2014.05.04 20:48:00 - [23] - Quote Mobius Wyvern wrote: grinds the palms of his hands into this face yet again Can you all stop? Seriously? Are there any adults on these forums? I was under the impression that teenagers were in the minority here. Yes, okay, the reveal of Legion was about as bad a **-up as BP's public relations after the Gulf oil spill, and I don't feel like I'm exaggerating when I say that. There is no conspiracy. There is no evil plot. It's time to stop the rumormongering and get back to reality. I would be less inclined to respect CPM0 if they all just left because they didn't like CCP's plan for the reveal. I'm glad they stayed where they were and kept trying to convince CCP to change their minds. Bailing out is a cheap move. This is some of the biggest bollocks I've read on the forums this weekend. There was conspiracy, there was an evil plot. That is the whole f* point, for f's sake! Read Ripard Teg's blog post: http://jestertrek.blogspot.co.uk/2014/05/fanfest-day-two-red-wedding.html Ripard was on the CSM, the EVE version of the CPM and he makes it plain that everyone at CCP knew for "months and months" that DUST was going to be abandoned. We were kept in the dark the whole time so that CCP could continue to make money from us. There's your f** evil plot right there. I wouldn't expect the CPM to break their NDAs but they should have resigned en masse when it became clear that CCP was intent on this path of fraud. That would have been the sign to us that there was something rotten in the state of Iceland. But the CPM did nothing. They just sat there. And even now, that class-A prick, Iron Wolf Sabre, continues to mock us and take the . CCP and the CPM were both well out of order during this entire process. And until people realise and hold them 100% accountable for their f* ups and outright frauds, we're all going to sleepwalk into exactly the same bollocks with Legion.
Iron Wolf Saber Den of Swords 14691	Posted - 2014.05.04 22:16:00 - [24] - Quote I would like to add that in retrospec resigning back then as a whole would have probably been the most shelfish thing the cpm could have done. Took a bit of convincing internally to keep what we could onboard. Caz was an unfourtunate loss I would have loved to continued to work with him on the transition. CPM 0 Secretary Omni-Soldier, Forum Warrior, Annoying Artist \\= Advanced Caldari Assault // Unlocked
Mojo XXXIII Abandoned Privilege Top Men. 177	Posted - 2014.05.04 22:18:00 - [25] - Quote At the very least, if nothing else, resigning would have shown the community that you had some integrity.
Iron Wolf Saber Den of Swords 14692	Posted - 2014.05.04 22:21:00 - [26] - Quote Mojo XXXIII wrote: At the very least, if nothing else, resigning would have shown the community that you had some integrity. its debatable. Integredity is doing the right thing when nobody is looking. In analogy the cpm is holding on the rope between the community and a bottomless pit and I can never forgive myself if I let go of that rope of my own voilation. As ex military I have seen far too many folks ways of life ending because the lack of integredity; sometimes a job, sometimes a limb, somtimes a life all because they or somone else did not do that one extra step; not standing that post; and not seeing something through to completion. Skipping steps; quitting post, and abandoning supervision is simply not my style. CPM 0 Secretary Omni-Soldier, Forum Warrior, Annoying Artist \\= Advanced Caldari Assault // Unlocked
Guilbert 515 United Pwnage Service RISE of LEGION 114	Posted - 2014.05.04 22:29:00 - [27] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Mojo XXXIII wrote: At the very least, if nothing else, resigning would have shown the community that you had some integrity. its debatable. Integredity is doing the right thing when nobody is looking. In analogy the cpm is holding on the rope between the community and a bottomless pit and I can never forgive myself if I let go of that rope of my own voilation. As ex military I have seen far too many folks ways of life ending because the lack of integredity; sometimes a job, sometimes a limb, somtimes a life all because they or somone else did not do that one extra step; not standing that post; and not seeing something through to completion. Skipping steps; quitting post, and abandoning supervision is simply not my style. Sorry to say, you were never holding our rope, the only rope you were holding was your own. How can i say that? Look around! Theres noone left, your the only one clinging to that rope! Open your eyes and look at the corpses on the ground, those people left behind, the entire console community. "Please fix drop uplink spam"
Spike Slania Horizons' Edge 73	Posted - 2014.05.04 22:33:00 - [28] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Mojo XXXIII wrote: At the very least, if nothing else, resigning would have shown the community that you had some integrity. its debatable. Integredity is doing the right thing when nobody is looking. In analogy the cpm is holding on the rope between the community and a bottomless pit and I can never forgive myself if I let go of that rope of my own voilation. As ex military I have seen far too many folks ways of life ending because the lack of integredity; sometimes a job, sometimes a limb, somtimes a life all because they or somone else did not do that one extra step; not standing that post; and not seeing something through to completion. Skipping steps; quitting post, and abandoning supervision is simply not my style. You know, I might not been active enough on the forums to know the whole deal with the cpm0, I know pretty much no one on the forums likes Iron Wolf Saber, but I'm here seeing you active on the forums, but personally I never actually see you or anyone else from the cpm in public games. I just find that weird personally, the people representing us I don't even see playing, granted I never ran into any CCP ether.
Mojo XXXIII Abandoned Privilege Top Men. 182	Posted - 2014.05.04 22:34:00 - [29] - Quote Bullshit. Integrity is the quality of being honest and having strong moral principles. CPM was supposed to represent the community. You guys knew this course was wrong and yet you all rolled over for CCP and allowed it to happen, and did nothing to warn us. A lie of ommission is still a lie. Your complacency in this matter makes you all just as guilty as CCP. Even a corrupt politician woukd have the decency to resign in the face of such a public scandal.
Soldner VonKuechle SAM-MIK General Tso's Alliance 746	Posted - 2014.05.04 22:36:00 - [30] - Quote Mojo XXXIII wrote: Bullshit. Integrity is the quality of being honest and having strong moral principles. CPM was supposed to represent the community. You guys knew this course was wrong and yet you all rolled over for CCP and allowed it to happen, and did nothing to warn us. A lie of ommission is still a lie. Your complacency in this matter makes you all just as guilty as CCP. Even a corrupt politician woukd have the decency to resign in the face of such a public scandal. Like i said somewhere earlier, Caz has more of my respect for his actions than IWS will EVER get back for his. And let the Forums continue to BURN.



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