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Aeon Amadi
Edimmu Warfighters
Gallente Federation
5565
   |
Posted - 2014.05.04 03:16:00 -
[1] - Quote
Okay, so I was going to wait until I got back to the states before I commented on everything but I've got a few hours until my flight and a ten hour layover later on. Be aware, I'm on a tablet so typing kind of sucks.
I understand you guys are frustrated and it's entirely reasonable. No-one can blame you. However, I heard some crazy stories here at FanFest on how you guys were reacting and I couldn't help but weigh my voice in (because you guys totally care about my grizzly smoker vocals, right?). First off, dude - don't biomass your characters... Nothing about that makes any sense. Project Legion isn't even a working thing, it's a prototype. A prototype that hasn't even been set in stone yet. We could stick with Dust as it is currently, we could migrate to Legion, but either case: deleting r characters is just silly. One way or another your investments are going to stick and/or carry over so it's stupid to just throw that away in a knee jerk reaction. And even if you quit, keep your characters in case you change your mind in the future whenever it's more calm.
Secondly, if you see past the platform change and the trademark/name confusion, this -IS- what we've all been asking for. More meaningful character progression, better graphics, gameplay elements, etc. This is what we've been waiting for all this time and it simply was not possible on the aging PlayStation 3.
Thirdly, guys... Be real with yourselves here. Developers who no longer even work at CCP made promises last year that they couldn't deliver, anger ensues... Now, CCP does everything possible to avoid promising stuff they can't 100% deliver and anger ensues? It doesn't make much sense, it's contradictory to what we've argued so hard about in the past. We need them to be honest like they have, to not promise something if they're not positive they can do it. To be clear, the only thing they've promised is that -IF- we go to Legion, our characters will migrate. They haven't even promised Legion yet.
Fourthly, guys, the PS3 is very old. We already have the PS4, so the console Dust is on is very aged and is not capable of doing what CCP wants to develop and what we want to experience. It takes CCP time to send updates through to the PS3, and as we've experienced they haven't really been free to update quickly (something necessary with Dust's design structure) with that delay. Further more, they never ruled out PlayStation 4. In fact, with both PC and the PS4 operating on x86 architecture and similar specifications, porting a complete product to the PS4 is far easier and more streamlined than with PS3 where everything has to be stripped just to run the game. But in order to do that, we need something that can be rapidly altered to make it work, and be functional as a whole that can be done correctly. Just as well, they can't promise what they can't 100% deliver.
So, maybe that helps - maybe it doesn't. Being here at Fanfest I can see the CPM and community celebrities (yeah, that's right, I'm throwing you forum wizards undder the bus =P) expressing YOUR emotions to the developers and actively working to rectify all of this. Your voices are being signal boosted far more precisely than any other time in the history of Dust.
Anyway, that's all I really had to say. I'm open to any questions and what not if you'd like to know more from the round-tables that weren't answered on the stream, perhaps offer some of my insight and speculation, as long as they're constructive.
Useful Links
//forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=133588
//forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=134182
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DUST Fiend
The Wings of Legion
13926
|
Posted - 2014.05.04 03:18:00 -
[2] - Quote
Preach!
If possible ask them if they have any plans to bring back logistics vehicles, specifically logistics dropships.
LONG LIVE LEGION!
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low genius
The Sound Of Freedom
Dirt Nap Squad.
1641
|
Posted - 2014.05.04 03:21:00 -
[3] - Quote
ccp is dead to me, old friend.
my eve characters are unsubscribed.
by dust character will never again advance.
my plans of playing valkyrie are dashed.
**** ccp.
eatsbabies cienfuegos
steward of the renegade alliance.
|
Aeon Amadi
Edimmu Warfighters
Gallente Federation
5567
|
Posted - 2014.05.04 03:25:00 -
[4] - Quote
low genius wrote:ccp is dead to me, old friend.
my eve characters are unsubscribed.
by dust character will never again advance.
my plans of playing valkyrie are dashed.
**** ccp.
And that's totally cool if you feel that way man, but I'm telling you to at least sleep on it a while and think it through. I'm incredibly excited for what we saw and the Graphics panel really showed some innovative stuff (watching smoke move when rounds get shot through it is killer!). Just don't delete your characters and if at all possible, give some feedback on how Dust's new path can improve.
Useful Links
//forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=133588
//forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=134182
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low genius
The Sound Of Freedom
Dirt Nap Squad.
1641
|
Posted - 2014.05.04 03:26:00 -
[5] - Quote
Aeon Amadi wrote:low genius wrote:ccp is dead to me, old friend.
my eve characters are unsubscribed.
by dust character will never again advance.
my plans of playing valkyrie are dashed.
**** ccp. And that's totally cool if you feel that way man, but I'm telling you to at least sleep on it a while and think it through. I'm incredibly excited for what we saw and the Graphics panel really showed some innovative stuff (watching smoke move when rounds get shot through it is killer!). Just don't delete your characters and if at all possible, give some feedback on how Dust's new path can improve.
ever played an ea game that didn't make you want to throw up?
me neither.
eatsbabies cienfuegos
steward of the renegade alliance.
|
Aeon Amadi
Edimmu Warfighters
Gallente Federation
5567
|
Posted - 2014.05.04 03:35:00 -
[6] - Quote
low genius wrote:Aeon Amadi wrote:low genius wrote:ccp is dead to me, old friend.
my eve characters are unsubscribed.
by dust character will never again advance.
my plans of playing valkyrie are dashed.
**** ccp. And that's totally cool if you feel that way man, but I'm telling you to at least sleep on it a while and think it through. I'm incredibly excited for what we saw and the Graphics panel really showed some innovative stuff (watching smoke move when rounds get shot through it is killer!). Just don't delete your characters and if at all possible, give some feedback on how Dust's new path can improve. ever played an ea game that didn't make you want to throw up? me neither.
Lol, attacking a person's character is kind of low but I guess the name suits you =P
Nah, listen man - it's awesome. It really is. Once the shock kind of settles and everyone gets a better grasp of things, I think you'll all see that the game has progressed by leaps and bounds and was TOTALLY NECESSARY in order for us to -BE- that clone soldier on the frontline instead of just some spreadsheet silhouette who walks around for five minutes before getting aced.
Like, what is it that bothers you specifically?
Useful Links
//forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=133588
//forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=134182
|
Ydubbs81 RND
Ahrendee Mercenaries
Dirt Nap Squad.
2992
|
Posted - 2014.05.04 03:39:00 -
[7] - Quote
The problem is....CCP never had plans on leaving the ps3. How can a company of pc game designers not know that the ps3 was aging. In their own words, they were "laser focused on the ps3".
What does that tell you?
weRideNDie2getha since 2010
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Ydubbs81 RND
Ahrendee Mercenaries
Dirt Nap Squad.
2992
|
Posted - 2014.05.04 03:41:00 -
[8] - Quote
Aeon Amadi wrote:low genius wrote:ccp is dead to me, old friend.
my eve characters are unsubscribed.
by dust character will never again advance.
my plans of playing valkyrie are dashed.
**** ccp. And that's totally cool if you feel that way man, but I'm telling you to at least sleep on it a while and think it through. I'm incredibly excited for what we saw and the Graphics panel really showed some innovative stuff (watching smoke move when rounds get shot through it is killer!). Just don't delete your characters and if at all possible, give some feedback on how Dust's new path can improve.
You are not understanding that we as playstation console players are not going to play pc just for legion. If we were pc gamers, then we wouldn't mind. We would welcome the new change......that's why we wouldn't mind if it went to the ps4.
weRideNDie2getha since 2010
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DUST Fiend
The Wings of Legion
13927
|
Posted - 2014.05.04 03:43:00 -
[9] - Quote
Ydubbs81 RND wrote:The problem is....CCP never had plans on leaving the ps3. How can a company of pc game designers not know that the ps3 was aging. In their own words, they were "laser focused on the ps3".
What does that tell you?
How do you know they never had plans to leave PS3? Because they didn't tell you?
People take things far too literally. So the guy used the wrong words, wow, oh no. At the time, maybe they were. Maybe they weren't. All I know is that the game we were all sold on, is Legion, not DUST. DUST helped to build Legion, and I'm ok with that.
Here's hoping Legion gets the green light because it's the game DUST was always supposed to be.
I also find it funny how in one post, you say they had no plans to leave the PS3, yet in the very next post, you say you expected it to go to the PS4. So, which is it?
LONG LIVE LEGION!
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DeadlyAztec11
Ostrakon Agency
Gallente Federation
5319
|
Posted - 2014.05.04 03:47:00 -
[10] - Quote
The thing I hate about CCP is that they flip flop worse than Mitt Romney... You literally can't rely on them for ANYTHING.
Having an unreliable game developer sucks.
Taco Cat backwards is still Taco Cat a¦Ñ_a¦Ñ
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Aeon Amadi
Edimmu Warfighters
Gallente Federation
5570
|
Posted - 2014.05.04 03:49:00 -
[11] - Quote
Ydubbs81 RND wrote:The problem is....CCP never had plans on leaving the ps3. How can a company of pc game designers not know that the ps3 was aging. In their own words, they were "laser focused on the ps3".
What does that tell you?
Here's the thing man. We have a LOT of new Devs on the crew and they're not "laser focused on the PS3". This is a callback to an older sort of era before the decision was that the hardware limitations just weren't going to cut it. Imo, it should have never even been a PS3 title because of the new technology we have but it's important to remember that they started this game back in 2009, when the PS3 was alive and well.
Legion has only been worked on for a few months. It's the redirection of the new Devs coming in, seeing the starlight that was Dust's original concept and basically making the fundamental decision to focus efforts onto making that a reality rather than struggling o accommodate it on nearly dead hardware. It's a very recent decision and if you backtrack a while you can actually get an idea of when it started happening because all communication, even from some of the CPM, flat out died because they literally could not discuss this stuff at such an early stage. Fact is: It's so new, so fresh, that the previous philosophies were almost entirely over-ridden because they simply were not working for a long term, enjoyable experience.
And yes, the communication about all of this was bad. They should not have announced this at Fanfest because it is so jarring but it's a point of inevitability in that they had to announce it sometime, somehow, and it was going to suck no matter what. The cards just fell the way they did.
Bear in mind, this is all my theory as from what I've learned since being at the round tables and such. No-one outright told me this.
Useful Links
//forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=133588
//forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=134182
|
low genius
The Sound Of Freedom
Dirt Nap Squad.
1646
|
Posted - 2014.05.04 03:51:00 -
[12] - Quote
Aeon Amadi wrote:low genius wrote:Aeon Amadi wrote:low genius wrote:ccp is dead to me, old friend.
my eve characters are unsubscribed.
by dust character will never again advance.
my plans of playing valkyrie are dashed.
**** ccp. And that's totally cool if you feel that way man, but I'm telling you to at least sleep on it a while and think it through. I'm incredibly excited for what we saw and the Graphics panel really showed some innovative stuff (watching smoke move when rounds get shot through it is killer!). Just don't delete your characters and if at all possible, give some feedback on how Dust's new path can improve. ever played an ea game that didn't make you want to throw up? me neither. Lol, attacking a person's character is kind of low but I guess the name suits you =P Nah, listen man - it's awesome. It really is. Once the shock kind of settles and everyone gets a better grasp of things, I think you'll all see that the game has progressed by leaps and bounds and was TOTALLY NECESSARY in order for us to -BE- that clone soldier on the frontline instead of just some spreadsheet silhouette who walks around for five minutes before getting aced. Like, what is it that bothers you specifically?
are the lighting effects really what needs work to make dust a better game?
are the lights reflecting off of the ground what dust needs to be a better game?
what did the demo show that wasn't COMPLETELY aesthetic? they showed nothing. no ewar. no parcour. they even messed up their scripted demo when rouge called the tank pilot 'down' while the tank was still firing.
there was nothing in the keynotes to make us think dust is worth playing for another year.
if ccp's 10 year development plan for dust lasted 10 months, and we spent 18 months in beta... doesn't it stand to reason that legion will suffer the same fate?
eatsbabies cienfuegos
steward of the renegade alliance.
|
Aeon Amadi
Edimmu Warfighters
Gallente Federation
5570
|
Posted - 2014.05.04 03:51:00 -
[13] - Quote
DeadlyAztec11 wrote:The thing I hate about CCP is that they flip flop worse than Mitt Romney... You literally can't rely on them for ANYTHING.
Having an unreliable game developer sucks.
Not the same developers. Brandon Laurino (the dude who promised Macs) has been gone since July.
Useful Links
//forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=133588
//forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=134182
|
Ydubbs81 RND
Ahrendee Mercenaries
Dirt Nap Squad.
2994
|
Posted - 2014.05.04 03:52:00 -
[14] - Quote
DUST Fiend wrote:Ydubbs81 RND wrote:The problem is....CCP never had plans on leaving the ps3. How can a company of pc game designers not know that the ps3 was aging. In their own words, they were "laser focused on the ps3".
What does that tell you? How do you know they never had plans to leave PS3? Because they didn't tell you? People take things far too literally. So the guy used the wrong words, wow, oh no. At the time, maybe they were. Maybe they weren't. All I know is that the game we were all sold on, is Legion, not DUST. DUST helped to build Legion, and I'm ok with that. Here's hoping Legion gets the green light because it's the game DUST was always supposed to be. I also find it funny how in one post, you say they had no plans to leave the PS3, yet in the very next post, you say you expected ("wouldn't mind") it to go to the PS4. So, which is it? If you want a PS4 port, you should be PUSHING for Legion, since it will be easier for them to port AND be higher quality.
Wait...that doesn't make sense to you? I expected it to go to the ps4 but CCP burned my expectations when they said they were laser focused on the ps3. Not sure if I can write that clearer.
I'm not pushing for anything that isn't going to be on the playstation (3 or 4). I'm not a pc gamer...so why would I push it for the pc?? Because it'll be easier to port for ps4 doesn't mean that they will port it to the ps4. If they announced that Legion will be on the ps4, then I would have been glad. But placing it on a platform that I don't play..doesn't benefit me at all.
weRideNDie2getha since 2010
|
low genius
The Sound Of Freedom
Dirt Nap Squad.
1646
|
Posted - 2014.05.04 03:53:00 -
[15] - Quote
Ydubbs81 RND wrote:Aeon Amadi wrote:low genius wrote:ccp is dead to me, old friend.
my eve characters are unsubscribed.
by dust character will never again advance.
my plans of playing valkyrie are dashed.
**** ccp. And that's totally cool if you feel that way man, but I'm telling you to at least sleep on it a while and think it through. I'm incredibly excited for what we saw and the Graphics panel really showed some innovative stuff (watching smoke move when rounds get shot through it is killer!). Just don't delete your characters and if at all possible, give some feedback on how Dust's new path can improve. You are not understanding that we as playstation console players are not going to play pc just for legion. If we were pc gamers, then we wouldn't mind. We would welcome the new change......that's why we wouldn't mind if it went to the ps4.
i would play pc for legion. that's the thing. i don't care where the game is at.
our game is no more. our skillpoints are valueless. our time is wasted.
eatsbabies cienfuegos
steward of the renegade alliance.
|
Joseph Ridgeson
WarRavens
Final Resolution.
1521
|
Posted - 2014.05.04 03:54:00 -
[16] - Quote
No. That is not the point to take away from this FanFest. Allow me to go through how I felt hearing the DUST 514 keynote.
"DUST 514 on the PC? Awesome! That means our game can grow! I wonder what that means for the PS3." Keynote ends. "What? That's it? What about my character, my AUR, my BPO's, my SP?" Dev blog comes out that states Legion is a separate project and DUST 514 will become an arcade shooter. "So the game I have been waiting for is not DUST 514 but this Legion? So did I just wait over 200 dollars and 1,000 hours playing this game with the hope and promise it would be something better?"
Look at every other panel that FanFest had; they were longer, they had more people in the audience, and they had more developers/community managers in them. The DUST 514 Progression and More Sand in the Box were entirely about Legion. Watching the CCP keynote, I got the distinct idea that Hilmar had Rouge come out only because of the storm that was going on. During that, all he said was "we will continue to work on DUST and will see if transferring assets is possible, especially if I get the green light from this man." And that was it.
Simply put, the thing to take away from this FanFest is "CCP has zero respect for the DUST 514 community based on the fact that every presentation was about a separate game and no QA after the keynote to answer some of the most basic questions." You see blogs about the CPM and CSM that state "we have known about this for months and were urging CCP to tell the community sooner"... but that didn't happen.
All that had to change was to have all the features about DUST 514 talked about during the keynote, things to work on, a few buzz words, and bring out NOT Project Legion but "DUST 514 on the PC." There would be some concern over the console only people, which is a real **** move by CCP, but it could have been handled by some calm, rational explanation. But, no. CCP didn't care that the community was left in a frenzy for 24 hours and the only thing to calm us was a "we will see what we can do about asset transfer."
CCP: This is the most despicable thing I have ever seen a company do to its customers.
"People that quote themselves in signatures confuse me." -Joseph Ridgeson
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JIMvc2
UNREAL WARRIORS
133
|
Posted - 2014.05.04 03:54:00 -
[17] - Quote
I wonder who is responsible for creating the Stupidest Topic of Biomass your characters. I bet that Son of A ***** told other idiots to delete there characters for legion but as of right now. If you deleted your character, nice going genius.
If you run proto gear, prepare to suffer the consequences. You've been warned.
|
DUST Fiend
The Wings of Legion
13927
|
Posted - 2014.05.04 03:56:00 -
[18] - Quote
Ydubbs81 RND wrote:Wait...that doesn't make sense to you? I expected it to go to the ps4 but CCP burned my expectations when they said they were laser focused on the ps3. Not sure if I can write that clearer.
I'm not pushing for anything that isn't going to be on the playstation (3 or 4). I'm not a pc gamer...so why would I push it for the pc?? Because it'll be easier to port for ps4 doesn't mean that they will port it to the ps4. If they announced that Legion will be on the ps4, then I would have been glad. But placing it on a platform that I don't play..doesn't benefit me at all.
Porting a PS3 version to the PS4 would have resulted either in a very low quality PS4 game, or a clear divide between those who played on the PS3, and those who played on the PS4
It definitely sucks that this is the way it has to go, but you have more hope for a good, quality PS4 port from a PC version than you ever did from a PS3 version.
LONG LIVE LEGION!
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Aeon Amadi
Edimmu Warfighters
Gallente Federation
5570
|
Posted - 2014.05.04 03:56:00 -
[19] - Quote
low genius wrote:Aeon Amadi wrote:low genius wrote:Aeon Amadi wrote:low genius wrote:ccp is dead to me, old friend.
my eve characters are unsubscribed.
by dust character will never again advance.
my plans of playing valkyrie are dashed.
**** ccp. And that's totally cool if you feel that way man, but I'm telling you to at least sleep on it a while and think it through. I'm incredibly excited for what we saw and the Graphics panel really showed some innovative stuff (watching smoke move when rounds get shot through it is killer!). Just don't delete your characters and if at all possible, give some feedback on how Dust's new path can improve. ever played an ea game that didn't make you want to throw up? me neither. Lol, attacking a person's character is kind of low but I guess the name suits you =P Nah, listen man - it's awesome. It really is. Once the shock kind of settles and everyone gets a better grasp of things, I think you'll all see that the game has progressed by leaps and bounds and was TOTALLY NECESSARY in order for us to -BE- that clone soldier on the frontline instead of just some spreadsheet silhouette who walks around for five minutes before getting aced. Like, what is it that bothers you specifically? are the lighting effects really what needs work to make dust a better game? are the lights reflecting off of the ground what dust needs to be a better game? what did the demo show that wasn't COMPLETELY aesthetic? they showed nothing. no ewar. no parcour. they even messed up their scripted demo when rouge called the tank pilot 'down' while the tank was still firing. there was nothing in the keynotes to make us think dust is worth playing for another year. if ccp's 10 year development plan for dust lasted 10 months, and we spent 18 months in beta... doesn't it stand to reason that legion will suffer the same fate?
COX Z had a glorious layout of the gameplay changes and how they're implementing character progression. It's just conceptual at the moment, but I feel it's far better in the long haul. Things like ditching skill levels in favor of single-cost unlocks, role-based progressions with meaningful skill trees to associate with them and the nyxxing of power levels (advanced/proto nonsense). There's a lot more than graphical bits but the graphical bits do play a lot more of a role like thick fog that lessens your vision and more deadly weather aspects like meteor showers.
Useful Links
//forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=133588
//forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=134182
|
JIMvc2
UNREAL WARRIORS
133
|
Posted - 2014.05.04 03:56:00 -
[20] - Quote
Joseph Ridgeson wrote:No. That is not the point to take away from this FanFest. Allow me to go through how I felt hearing the DUST 514 keynote.
"DUST 514 on the PC? Awesome! That means our game can grow! I wonder what that means for the PS3." Keynote ends. "What? That's it? What about my character, my AUR, my BPO's, my SP?" Dev blog comes out that states Legion is a separate project and DUST 514 will become an arcade shooter. "So the game I have been waiting for is not DUST 514 but this Legion? So did I just wait over 200 dollars and 1,000 hours playing this game with the hope and promise it would be something better?"
Look at every other panel that FanFest had; they were longer, they had more people in the audience, and they had more developers/community managers in them. The DUST 514 Progression and More Sand in the Box were entirely about Legion. Watching the CCP keynote, I got the distinct idea that Hilmar had Rouge come out only because of the storm that was going on. During that, all he said was "we will continue to work on DUST and will see if transferring assets is possible, especially if I get the green light from this man." And that was it.
Simply put, the thing to take away from this FanFest is "CCP has zero respect for the DUST 514 community based on the fact that every presentation was about a separate game and no QA after the keynote to answer some of the most basic questions." You see blogs about the CPM and CSM that state "we have known about this for months and were urging CCP to tell the community sooner"... but that didn't happen.
All that had to change was to have all the features about DUST 514 talked about during the keynote, things to work on, a few buzz words, and bring out NOT Project Legion but "DUST 514 on the PC." There would be some concern over the console only people, which is a real **** move by CCP, but it could have been handled by some calm, rational explanation. But, no. CCP didn't care that the community was left in a frenzy for 24 hours and the only thing to calm us was a "we will see what we can do about asset transfer."
CCP: This is the most despicable thing I have ever seen a company do to its customers.
You should see my topic CCP Read this. You will be shocked that this isnt the first time ccp has fuckws up the community.
If you run proto gear, prepare to suffer the consequences. You've been warned.
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Nstomper
Ikomari-Onu Enforcement
Caldari State
530
|
Posted - 2014.05.04 03:59:00 -
[21] - Quote
Quote:We already have the PS4
we all wanted ccp to move dust on to ps4 which means we wanted a change but of course ccp were the ones who said " we have no plans for it to be on ps4"which in reality was one of the dumbest things they could have said. |
pyramidhead 420
Carbon 7
Iron Oxide.
484
|
Posted - 2014.05.04 03:59:00 -
[22] - Quote
you riding that jock hard. did they slip a roofy in your drink or do you just love Icelandic ****? |
Ydubbs81 RND
Ahrendee Mercenaries
Dirt Nap Squad.
2998
|
Posted - 2014.05.04 04:01:00 -
[23] - Quote
Aeon Amadi wrote:Ydubbs81 RND wrote:The problem is....CCP never had plans on leaving the ps3. How can a company of pc game designers not know that the ps3 was aging. In their own words, they were "laser focused on the ps3".
What does that tell you? Here's the thing man. We have a LOT of new Devs on the crew and they're not "laser focused on the PS3". This is a callback to an older sort of era before the decision was that the hardware limitations just weren't going to cut it. Imo, it should have never even been a PS3 title because of the new technology we have but it's important to remember that they started this game back in 2009, when the PS3 was alive and well. Legion has only been worked on for a few months. It's the redirection of the new Devs coming in, seeing the starlight that was Dust's original concept and basically making the fundamental decision to focus efforts onto making that a reality rather than struggling o accommodate it on nearly dead hardware. It's a very recent decision and if you backtrack a while you can actually get an idea of when it started happening because all communication, even from some of the CPM, flat out died because they literally could not discuss this stuff at such an early stage. Fact is: It's so new, so fresh, that the previous philosophies were almost entirely over-ridden because they simply were not working for a long term, enjoyable experience. And yes, the communication about all of this was bad. They should not have announced this at Fanfest because it is so jarring but it's a point of inevitability in that they had to announce it sometime, somehow, and it was going to suck no matter what. The cards just fell the way they did. Bear in mind, this is all my theory as from what I've learned since being at the round tables and such. No-one outright told me this.
Maybe you've misunderstood me.....Legion (like probably EVERY single game) will be better on the pc because the restrictions are not the same. I totally get that...but how does that benefit the playstation console gamer?
This isn't one of those romance movies where the guy is happy for the girl he wants to be with even if she's with another man (if that's what makes her happy). Playstation console gamers feel burned. This isn't even a title like BF where you have BF2 or BF3. There is no persistence in those games, so you expect those games to die for the new one. If they change the platform...it's ok because you weren't expecting a long term commitment.
But this game was supposed to be persistent and everyone was looking and thinking long term. Spending real money on a free game in support of the game, spending real time on the game, etc. Some of these guys just pub but have no idea the level of commitment that a pc active corp has to have in this game. And now for what?? We are playstation console gamers...not pc gamers. We just got shafted
weRideNDie2getha since 2010
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LEHON Xeon
Ahrendee Mercenaries
Dirt Nap Squad.
612
|
Posted - 2014.05.04 04:02:00 -
[24] - Quote
Ydubbs81 RND wrote:DUST Fiend wrote:Ydubbs81 RND wrote:The problem is....CCP never had plans on leaving the ps3. How can a company of pc game designers not know that the ps3 was aging. In their own words, they were "laser focused on the ps3".
What does that tell you? How do you know they never had plans to leave PS3? Because they didn't tell you? People take things far too literally. So the guy used the wrong words, wow, oh no. At the time, maybe they were. Maybe they weren't. All I know is that the game we were all sold on, is Legion, not DUST. DUST helped to build Legion, and I'm ok with that. Here's hoping Legion gets the green light because it's the game DUST was always supposed to be. I also find it funny how in one post, you say they had no plans to leave the PS3, yet in the very next post, you say you expected ("wouldn't mind") it to go to the PS4. So, which is it? If you want a PS4 port, you should be PUSHING for Legion, since it will be easier for them to port AND be higher quality. Wait...that doesn't make sense to you? I expected it to go to the ps4 but CCP burned my expectations when they said they were laser focused on the ps3. Not sure if I can write that clearer. I'm not pushing for anything that isn't going to be on the playstation (3 or 4). I'm not a pc gamer...so why would I push it for the pc?? Because it'll be easier to port for ps4 doesn't mean that they will port it to the ps4. If they announced that Legion will be on the ps4, then I would have been glad. But placing it on a platform that I don't play..doesn't benefit me at all.
Right on Dubbs. Besides, I completely fail to comprehend how people can keep sweeping under the rug the fact that CCP specifically lied to their player base while purposefully encouraging them to purchase boosters for a now dead game. I could even be much more understanding of it if they provided a 100% guarantee of full character transfers to Legion, but that isn't there. What burned me wasn't CCP moving it to an upgraded platform (whether it would've been PC or PS4), it was them giving out completely false pretenses to the entire player base. Originally I was giving serious thought to continuing with Legion on PC, but I will not be a part of a company that purposefully lies to increase profit margins on something that they will shortly eliminate completely.
Now a very angry and Bitter Vet. CCP, you have further solidified my views that corporations are corrupt POS's.
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JIMvc2
UNREAL WARRIORS
133
|
Posted - 2014.05.04 04:02:00 -
[25] - Quote
DUST Fiend wrote:JIMvc2 wrote:I wonder who is responsible for creating the Stupidest Topic of Biomass your characters. I bet that Son of A ***** told other idiots to delete there characters for legion but as of right now. If you deleted your character, nice going genius. You can actually contact CCP Support and they will restore your character, or so says CPM Nova Knife. Just be polite.
I didnt delete my. Im saying that for those of you who deleted your character are screwed.
If you run proto gear, prepare to suffer the consequences. You've been warned.
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low genius
The Sound Of Freedom
Dirt Nap Squad.
1646
|
Posted - 2014.05.04 04:02:00 -
[26] - Quote
JIMvc2 wrote:I wonder who is responsible for creating the Stupidest Topic of Biomass your characters. I bet that Son of A ***** told other idiots to delete there characters for legion but as of right now. If you deleted your character, nice going genius.
i didn't biomass my characters, but i'm not willing to take the time to log in.
i didn't start the biomass thread
eatsbabies cienfuegos
steward of the renegade alliance.
|
Aeon Amadi
Edimmu Warfighters
Gallente Federation
5570
|
Posted - 2014.05.04 04:03:00 -
[27] - Quote
Ydubbs81 RND wrote:DUST Fiend wrote:Ydubbs81 RND wrote:The problem is....CCP never had plans on leaving the ps3. How can a company of pc game designers not know that the ps3 was aging. In their own words, they were "laser focused on the ps3".
What does that tell you? How do you know they never had plans to leave PS3? Because they didn't tell you? People take things far too literally. So the guy used the wrong words, wow, oh no. At the time, maybe they were. Maybe they weren't. All I know is that the game we were all sold on, is Legion, not DUST. DUST helped to build Legion, and I'm ok with that. Here's hoping Legion gets the green light because it's the game DUST was always supposed to be. I also find it funny how in one post, you say they had no plans to leave the PS3, yet in the very next post, you say you expected ("wouldn't mind") it to go to the PS4. So, which is it? If you want a PS4 port, you should be PUSHING for Legion, since it will be easier for them to port AND be higher quality. Wait...that doesn't make sense to you? I expected it to go to the ps4 but CCP burned my expectations when they said they were laser focused on the ps3. Not sure if I can write that clearer. I'm not pushing for anything that isn't going to be on the playstation (3 or 4). I'm not a pc gamer...so why would I push it for the pc?? Because it'll be easier to port for ps4 doesn't mean that they will port it to the ps4. If they announced that Legion will be on the ps4, then I would have been glad. But placing it on a platform that I don't play..doesn't benefit me at all.
That's just the thing though man. They WILL NOT announce it unless they are POSITIVE they can do it. And in order to do it, they need more than just a tech demo and so far it's still up in the air as to whether or not that's the case. Beyond that, All these rumors that Sony is backing out are just plain dumb because they have Valkyrie in line for the PS4 and Morpheus. They never ruled out PS4, they never said it would never occur, just that right now they have a prototype (and they're not bullfighting about it being a prototype, it's pretty darn flippant) and they want to make sure it works before they make any kind of promises they can't keep.
Useful Links
//forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=133588
//forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=134182
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DUST Fiend
The Wings of Legion
13932
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Posted - 2014.05.04 04:04:00 -
[28] - Quote
JIMvc2 wrote:DUST Fiend wrote:JIMvc2 wrote:I wonder who is responsible for creating the Stupidest Topic of Biomass your characters. I bet that Son of A ***** told other idiots to delete there characters for legion but as of right now. If you deleted your character, nice going genius. You can actually contact CCP Support and they will restore your character, or so says CPM Nova Knife. Just be polite. I didnt delete my. Im saying that for those of you who deleted your character are screwed.
Replace "you" with "they" in my post
My bad.
LONG LIVE LEGION!
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Ydubbs81 RND
Ahrendee Mercenaries
Dirt Nap Squad.
2998
|
Posted - 2014.05.04 04:06:00 -
[29] - Quote
low genius wrote:Ydubbs81 RND wrote:Aeon Amadi wrote:low genius wrote:ccp is dead to me, old friend.
my eve characters are unsubscribed.
by dust character will never again advance.
my plans of playing valkyrie are dashed.
**** ccp. And that's totally cool if you feel that way man, but I'm telling you to at least sleep on it a while and think it through. I'm incredibly excited for what we saw and the Graphics panel really showed some innovative stuff (watching smoke move when rounds get shot through it is killer!). Just don't delete your characters and if at all possible, give some feedback on how Dust's new path can improve. You are not understanding that we as playstation console players are not going to play pc just for legion. If we were pc gamers, then we wouldn't mind. We would welcome the new change......that's why we wouldn't mind if it went to the ps4. i would play pc for legion. that's the thing. i don't care where the game is at. our game is no more. our skillpoints are valueless. our time is wasted.
if you are going to play pc....I really don't see it being a huge issue. Your sp will be meaningless but your knowledge of the game is something newberries won't have. You will just have to grind again..that's all. May be more skills or maybe the skills may be different.
But CCP has said that they will be transferring characters if it is possible, so you should be fine. On the other hand...die hard playstation console gamers like myself have a real big issue.
weRideNDie2getha since 2010
|
Ydubbs81 RND
Ahrendee Mercenaries
Dirt Nap Squad.
2998
|
Posted - 2014.05.04 04:08:00 -
[30] - Quote
Aeon Amadi wrote:Ydubbs81 RND wrote:DUST Fiend wrote:Ydubbs81 RND wrote:The problem is....CCP never had plans on leaving the ps3. How can a company of pc game designers not know that the ps3 was aging. In their own words, they were "laser focused on the ps3".
What does that tell you? How do you know they never had plans to leave PS3? Because they didn't tell you? People take things far too literally. So the guy used the wrong words, wow, oh no. At the time, maybe they were. Maybe they weren't. All I know is that the game we were all sold on, is Legion, not DUST. DUST helped to build Legion, and I'm ok with that. Here's hoping Legion gets the green light because it's the game DUST was always supposed to be. I also find it funny how in one post, you say they had no plans to leave the PS3, yet in the very next post, you say you expected ("wouldn't mind") it to go to the PS4. So, which is it? If you want a PS4 port, you should be PUSHING for Legion, since it will be easier for them to port AND be higher quality. Wait...that doesn't make sense to you? I expected it to go to the ps4 but CCP burned my expectations when they said they were laser focused on the ps3. Not sure if I can write that clearer. I'm not pushing for anything that isn't going to be on the playstation (3 or 4). I'm not a pc gamer...so why would I push it for the pc?? Because it'll be easier to port for ps4 doesn't mean that they will port it to the ps4. If they announced that Legion will be on the ps4, then I would have been glad. But placing it on a platform that I don't play..doesn't benefit me at all. That's just the thing though man. They WILL NOT announce it unless they are POSITIVE they can do it. And in order to do it, they need more than just a tech demo and so far it's still up in the air as to whether or not that's the case. Beyond that, All these rumors that Sony is backing out are just plain dumb because they have Valkyrie in line for the PS4 and Morpheus. They never ruled out PS4, they never said it would never occur, just that right now they have a prototype (and they're not bullfighting about it being a prototype, it's pretty darn flippant) and they want to make sure it works before they make any kind of promises they can't keep.
So, you're saying that I should have hope in CCP?
weRideNDie2getha since 2010
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Aeon Amadi
Edimmu Warfighters
Gallente Federation
5570
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Posted - 2014.05.04 04:09:00 -
[31] - Quote
Ydubbs81 RND wrote:Aeon Amadi wrote:Ydubbs81 RND wrote:The problem is....CCP never had plans on leaving the ps3. How can a company of pc game designers not know that the ps3 was aging. In their own words, they were "laser focused on the ps3".
What does that tell you? Here's the thing man. We have a LOT of new Devs on the crew and they're not "laser focused on the PS3". This is a callback to an older sort of era before the decision was that the hardware limitations just weren't going to cut it. Imo, it should have never even been a PS3 title because of the new technology we have but it's important to remember that they started this game back in 2009, when the PS3 was alive and well. Legion has only been worked on for a few months. It's the redirection of the new Devs coming in, seeing the starlight that was Dust's original concept and basically making the fundamental decision to focus efforts onto making that a reality rather than struggling o accommodate it on nearly dead hardware. It's a very recent decision and if you backtrack a while you can actually get an idea of when it started happening because all communication, even from some of the CPM, flat out died because they literally could not discuss this stuff at such an early stage. Fact is: It's so new, so fresh, that the previous philosophies were almost entirely over-ridden because they simply were not working for a long term, enjoyable experience. And yes, the communication about all of this was bad. They should not have announced this at Fanfest because it is so jarring but it's a point of inevitability in that they had to announce it sometime, somehow, and it was going to suck no matter what. The cards just fell the way they did. Bear in mind, this is all my theory as from what I've learned since being at the round tables and such. No-one outright told me this. Maybe you've misunderstood me.....Legion (like probably EVERY single game) will be better on the pc because the restrictions are not the same. I totally get that...but how does that benefit the playstation console gamer? This isn't one of those romance movies where the guy is happy for the girl he wants to be with even if she's with another man (if that's what makes her happy). Playstation console gamers feel burned. This isn't even a title like BF where you have BF2 or BF3. There is no persistence in those games, so you expect those games to die for the new one. If they change the platform...it's ok because you weren't expecting a long term commitment. But this game was supposed to be persistent and everyone was looking and thinking long term. Spending real money on a free game in support of the game, spending real time on the game, etc. Some of these guys just pub but have no idea the level of commitment that a pc active corp has to have in this game. And now for what?? We are playstation console gamers...not pc gamers. We just got shafted
And you're absolutely correct about that but it's important to be (brace for it) laser focused on explaining to CCP that progression to PS4 is a worthwhile investment, but to be patient and understanding that they will not say anything until they know they can commit to it. They're not making the same mistakes that were made in 2013, they're moving forward. So, as I said on Facebook, continue working on feedback to the innovation they're submitting, let the CPM worry about getting them to be more active in the community, and constructively suggest and advise that the console community does want this title available to them.
Useful Links
//forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=133588
//forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=134182
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low genius
The Sound Of Freedom
Dirt Nap Squad.
1646
|
Posted - 2014.05.04 04:10:00 -
[32] - Quote
Like, what is it that bothers you specifically?[/quote]
COX Z had a glorious layout of the gameplay changes and how they're implementing character progression. It's just conceptual at the moment, but I feel it's far better in the long haul. Things like ditching skill levels in favor of single-cost unlocks, role-based progressions with meaningful skill trees to associate with them and the nyxxing of power levels (advanced/proto nonsense). There's a lot more than graphical bits but the graphical bits do play a lot more of a role like thick fog that lessens your vision and more deadly weather aspects like meteor showers. [/quote]
i played battlefield 3. i understand the concept. i just couldn't believe they were selling me dust/battlefield 3 at a fanfest.
what part of fanfest makes you think dust is worth playing for another year? so you can play the legion beta for 18 months?
eatsbabies cienfuegos
steward of the renegade alliance.
|
Aeon Amadi
Edimmu Warfighters
Gallente Federation
5570
|
Posted - 2014.05.04 04:12:00 -
[33] - Quote
LEHON Xeon wrote:Ydubbs81 RND wrote:DUST Fiend wrote:Ydubbs81 RND wrote:The problem is....CCP never had plans on leaving the ps3. How can a company of pc game designers not know that the ps3 was aging. In their own words, they were "laser focused on the ps3".
What does that tell you? How do you know they never had plans to leave PS3? Because they didn't tell you? People take things far too literally. So the guy used the wrong words, wow, oh no. At the time, maybe they were. Maybe they weren't. All I know is that the game we were all sold on, is Legion, not DUST. DUST helped to build Legion, and I'm ok with that. Here's hoping Legion gets the green light because it's the game DUST was always supposed to be. I also find it funny how in one post, you say they had no plans to leave the PS3, yet in the very next post, you say you expected ("wouldn't mind") it to go to the PS4. So, which is it? If you want a PS4 port, you should be PUSHING for Legion, since it will be easier for them to port AND be higher quality. Wait...that doesn't make sense to you? I expected it to go to the ps4 but CCP burned my expectations when they said they were laser focused on the ps3. Not sure if I can write that clearer. I'm not pushing for anything that isn't going to be on the playstation (3 or 4). I'm not a pc gamer...so why would I push it for the pc?? Because it'll be easier to port for ps4 doesn't mean that they will port it to the ps4. If they announced that Legion will be on the ps4, then I would have been glad. But placing it on a platform that I don't play..doesn't benefit me at all. Right on Dubbs. Besides, I completely fail to comprehend how people can keep sweeping under the rug the fact that CCP specifically lied to their player base while purposefully encouraging them to purchase boosters for a now dead game. I could even be much more understanding of it if they provided a 100% guarantee of full character transfers to Legion, but that isn't there. What burned me wasn't CCP moving it to an upgraded platform (whether it would've been PC or PS4), it was them giving out completely false pretenses to the entire player base. Originally I was giving serious thought to continuing with Legion on PC, but I will not be a part of a company that purposefully lies to increase profit margins on something that they will shortly eliminate completely.
But that's just it: they DID announce a full character transfer. The specifics might be a bit different but the impact your character made, your identity and your level of progression are all on board for migration. They have publicly said that this is their top priority, with their second being your aurum investment.
Useful Links
//forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=133588
//forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=134182
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Aeon Amadi
Edimmu Warfighters
Gallente Federation
5570
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Posted - 2014.05.04 04:14:00 -
[34] - Quote
low genius wrote:
Like, what is it that bothers you specifically?
COX Z had a glorious layout of the gameplay changes and how they're implementing character progression. It's just conceptual at the moment, but I feel it's far better in the long haul. Things like ditching skill levels in favor of single-cost unlocks, role-based progressions with meaningful skill trees to associate with them and the nyxxing of power levels (advanced/proto nonsense). There's a lot more than graphical bits but the graphical bits do play a lot more of a role like thick fog that lessens your vision and more deadly weather aspects like meteor showers. [/quote]
i played battlefield 3. i understand the concept. i just couldn't believe they were selling me dust/battlefield 3 at a fanfest.
what part of fanfest makes you think dust is worth playing for another year? so you can play the legion beta for 18 months?[/quote]
Everything, man. The character progression is just incredible from what we were shown, the graphics, all of it man.
Useful Links
//forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=133588
//forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=134182
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low genius
The Sound Of Freedom
Dirt Nap Squad.
1646
|
Posted - 2014.05.04 04:15:00 -
[35] - Quote
But that's just it: they DID announce a full character transfer. The specifics might be a bit different but the impact your character made, your identity and your level of progression are all on board for migration. They have publicly said that this is their top priority, with their second being your aurum investment.
yeah, that's not what they said. they said 'applicable skills and items'.
guess who gets to decide what's 'applicable'. some former ea developer.
eatsbabies cienfuegos
steward of the renegade alliance.
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low genius
The Sound Of Freedom
Dirt Nap Squad.
1646
|
Posted - 2014.05.04 04:16:00 -
[36] - Quote
Aeon Amadi wrote:low genius wrote:
Like, what is it that bothers you specifically?
COX Z had a glorious layout of the gameplay changes and how they're implementing character progression. It's just conceptual at the moment, but I feel it's far better in the long haul. Things like ditching skill levels in favor of single-cost unlocks, role-based progressions with meaningful skill trees to associate with them and the nyxxing of power levels (advanced/proto nonsense). There's a lot more than graphical bits but the graphical bits do play a lot more of a role like thick fog that lessens your vision and more deadly weather aspects like meteor showers.
i played battlefield 3. i understand the concept. i just couldn't believe they were selling me dust/battlefield 3 at a fanfest.
what part of fanfest makes you think dust is worth playing for another year? so you can play the legion beta for 18 months?[/quote]
Everything, man. The character progression is just incredible from what we were shown, the graphics, all of it man.[/quote]
so, the same things they promised in 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012, and 2013? those are the things that seem worth it?
eatsbabies cienfuegos
steward of the renegade alliance.
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LEHON Xeon
Ahrendee Mercenaries
Dirt Nap Squad.
613
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Posted - 2014.05.04 04:18:00 -
[37] - Quote
Aeon Amadi wrote:LEHON Xeon wrote:Ydubbs81 RND wrote:DUST Fiend wrote:Ydubbs81 RND wrote:The problem is....CCP never had plans on leaving the ps3. How can a company of pc game designers not know that the ps3 was aging. In their own words, they were "laser focused on the ps3".
What does that tell you? How do you know they never had plans to leave PS3? Because they didn't tell you? People take things far too literally. So the guy used the wrong words, wow, oh no. At the time, maybe they were. Maybe they weren't. All I know is that the game we were all sold on, is Legion, not DUST. DUST helped to build Legion, and I'm ok with that. Here's hoping Legion gets the green light because it's the game DUST was always supposed to be. I also find it funny how in one post, you say they had no plans to leave the PS3, yet in the very next post, you say you expected ("wouldn't mind") it to go to the PS4. So, which is it? If you want a PS4 port, you should be PUSHING for Legion, since it will be easier for them to port AND be higher quality. Wait...that doesn't make sense to you? I expected it to go to the ps4 but CCP burned my expectations when they said they were laser focused on the ps3. Not sure if I can write that clearer. I'm not pushing for anything that isn't going to be on the playstation (3 or 4). I'm not a pc gamer...so why would I push it for the pc?? Because it'll be easier to port for ps4 doesn't mean that they will port it to the ps4. If they announced that Legion will be on the ps4, then I would have been glad. But placing it on a platform that I don't play..doesn't benefit me at all. Right on Dubbs. Besides, I completely fail to comprehend how people can keep sweeping under the rug the fact that CCP specifically lied to their player base while purposefully encouraging them to purchase boosters for a now dead game. I could even be much more understanding of it if they provided a 100% guarantee of full character transfers to Legion, but that isn't there. What burned me wasn't CCP moving it to an upgraded platform (whether it would've been PC or PS4), it was them giving out completely false pretenses to the entire player base. Originally I was giving serious thought to continuing with Legion on PC, but I will not be a part of a company that purposefully lies to increase profit margins on something that they will shortly eliminate completely. But that's just it: they DID announce a full character transfer. The specifics might be a bit different but the impact your character made, your identity and your level of progression are all on board for migration. They have publicly said that this is their top priority, with their second being your aurum investment.
I've watched CCP announce a whole lot of stuff since the year I've been in here and I've watched them fail to deliver on a majority of it, and that's not just content updates either. A lot of it had to do with technical issues just like a character transfer.
Ok, even if they did move everything over, it's like someone said under another thread. Do people seriously think they're going to let the guys with 40 and 50m SP stand? We'd have an automatic 3-5 year advantage against anyone new who came in right out of the gate. Yeah, people can say we have that right now, and we do, but from what I heard about Legion having much slower skill progression and accumulation, that gulf that exists there will only get larger.
Now a very angry and Bitter Vet. CCP, you have further solidified my views that corporations are corrupt POS's.
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Aeon Amadi
Edimmu Warfighters
Gallente Federation
5571
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Posted - 2014.05.04 04:32:00 -
[38] - Quote
low genius wrote:
But that's just it: they DID announce a full character transfer. The specifics might be a bit different but the impact your character made, your identity and your level of progression are all on board for migration. They have publicly said that this is their top priority, with their second being your aurum investment.
yeah, that's not what they said. they said 'applicable skills and items'.
guess who gets to decide what's 'applicable'. some former ea developer.
I'm a former fast food worker. Doesn't affect my current cooking skills at all and it surely doesn't affect my ability to draw up amazing stuff for the tattoo industry. Previous work, especially simple affiliation, does not dictate expertise or skill. People are angry, that's fine - I get it, it's cool. Preaching to the choir. But it had to happen eventually and ultimately it's the best decision I've heard yet. People are blind to the fact that they're delivering on what we wanted because of a platform change, and yes some will be alienated from it... but it's still Dropsuits shooting face in New Eden. It's what we wanted, and it was CCP's call on how to make it a reality.
Useful Links
//forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=133588
//forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=134182
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Flint Beastgood III
GunFall Mobilization
581
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Posted - 2014.05.04 04:34:00 -
[39] - Quote
DUST Fiend wrote:Ydubbs81 RND wrote:Wait...that doesn't make sense to you? I expected it to go to the ps4 but CCP burned my expectations when they said they were laser focused on the ps3. Not sure if I can write that clearer.
I'm not pushing for anything that isn't going to be on the playstation (3 or 4). I'm not a pc gamer...so why would I push it for the pc?? Because it'll be easier to port for ps4 doesn't mean that they will port it to the ps4. If they announced that Legion will be on the ps4, then I would have been glad. But placing it on a platform that I don't play..doesn't benefit me at all. Porting a PS3 version to the PS4 would have resulted either in a very low quality PS4 game, or a clear divide between those who played on the PS3, and those who played on the PS4 It definitely sucks that this is the way it has to go, but you have more hope for a good, quality PS4 port from a PC version than you ever did from a PS3 version.
Yep.
MAG - dead.
SOCOM: Confrontation - dead.
CoD & BF franchises - cash cows for the sheep.
Gimme 'The Division' & 'MGO'!
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Lucrezia LeGrand
Sentinels of New Eden
523
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Posted - 2014.05.04 04:36:00 -
[40] - Quote
DUST Fiend wrote:All I know is that the game we were all sold on, is Legion, not DUST. DUST helped to build Legion, and I'm ok with that.
No, we were promised Legion, but we were sold Dust. That is very different, and one of the reasons why a lot of us are upset.
Thale groupie (not the gun, but the man).
My other car is Utena.
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Ludvig Enraga
KILL-EM-QUICK
RISE of LEGION
1058
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Posted - 2014.05.04 04:40:00 -
[41] - Quote
Aeon Amadi wrote:Okay, so I was going to wait until I got back to the states before I commented on everything but I've got a few hours until my flight and a ten hour layover later on. Be aware, I'm on a tablet so typing kind of sucks.
I understand you guys are frustrated and it's entirely reasonable. No-one can blame you. However, I heard some crazy stories here at FanFest on how you guys were reacting and I couldn't help but weigh my voice in (because you guys totally care about my grizzly smoker vocals, right?). First off, dude - don't biomass your characters... Nothing about that makes any sense. Project Legion isn't even a working thing, it's a prototype. A prototype that hasn't even been set in stone yet. We could stick with Dust as it is currently, we could migrate to Legion, but either case: deleting r characters is just silly. One way or another your investments are going to stick and/or carry over so it's stupid to just throw that away in a knee jerk reaction. And even if you quit, keep your characters in case you change your mind in the future whenever it's more calm.
Secondly, if you see past the platform change and the trademark/name confusion, this -IS- what we've all been asking for. More meaningful character progression, better graphics, gameplay elements, etc. This is what we've been waiting for all this time and it simply was not possible on the aging PlayStation 3.
Thirdly, guys... Be real with yourselves here. Developers who no longer even work at CCP made promises last year that they couldn't deliver, anger ensues... Now, CCP does everything possible to avoid promising stuff they can't 100% deliver and anger ensues? It doesn't make much sense, it's contradictory to what we've argued so hard about in the past. We need them to be honest like they have, to not promise something if they're not positive they can do it. To be clear, the only thing they've promised is that -IF- we go to Legion, our characters will migrate. They haven't even promised Legion yet.
Fourthly, guys, the PS3 is very old. We already have the PS4, so the console Dust is on is very aged and is not capable of doing what CCP wants to develop and what we want to experience. It takes CCP time to send updates through to the PS3, and as we've experienced they haven't really been free to update quickly (something necessary with Dust's design structure) with that delay. Further more, they never ruled out PlayStation 4. In fact, with both PC and the PS4 operating on x86 architecture and similar specifications, porting a complete product to the PS4 is far easier and more streamlined than with PS3 where everything has to be stripped just to run the game. But in order to do that, we need something that can be rapidly altered to make it work, and be functional as a whole that can be done correctly. Just as well, they can't promise what they can't 100% deliver.
So, maybe that helps - maybe it doesn't. Being here at Fanfest I can see the CPM and community celebrities (yeah, that's right, I'm throwing you forum wizards undder the bus =P) expressing YOUR emotions to the developers and actively working to rectify all of this. Your voices are being signal boosted far more precisely than any other time in the history of Dust.
Anyway, that's all I really had to say. I'm open to any questions and what not if you'd like to know more from the round-tables that weren't answered on the stream, perhaps offer some of my insight and speculation, as long as they're constructive.
What a load of BS. PC offers nothing that's better than PS except for graphics which most ppl here don't give a damn about. I love your logic: "CCP hired a bunch of incompetent ppl that held positions high enough to talk on the behalf of CCP but it's not CCP's fault that a) they chose dated hardware and promised to stick with it b) made all the improbable promises c) had garbage pile execution or even total abandonment of things that could have been done and had been done with ease by other developers on PS3 YEARS AGO d) jumping ship now after milking the community dry.
PLC, NK, Scout - before 1.8.
That's right, I stack that OP Sh!t.
|
DUST Fiend
The Wings of Legion
13938
|
Posted - 2014.05.04 04:43:00 -
[42] - Quote
Lucrezia LeGrand wrote:DUST Fiend wrote:All I know is that the game we were all sold on, is Legion, not DUST. DUST helped to build Legion, and I'm ok with that. No, we were promised Legion, but we were sold Dust. That is very different, and one of the reasons why a lot of us are upset.
Well you have to admit to technical limitations.
There is still hope for a PS4 port. I don't know what to tell you guys. Would you really rather DUST just disappears into irrelevance on the PS3, rather than becoming what it was always supposed to be, with an actual possibility of a quality port to the PS4? The PS3 version was never going to reasonably be ported, it just wasn't going to happen.
This is a matter of realistic expectations, of what can ACTUALLY be done. Either we settle for a barely mediocre niche game with slight ties to EVE, or we push forward, and have the game this was always supposed to be.
LONG LIVE LEGION!
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Tomoko Kawase
Subdreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
14
|
Posted - 2014.05.04 04:45:00 -
[43] - Quote
Ludvig Enraga wrote:What a load of BS. PC offers nothing that's better than PS except for graphics which most ppl here don't give a damn about. I love your logic: "CCP hired a bunch of incompetent ppl that held positions high enough to talk on the behalf of CCP but it's not CCP's fault that a) they chose dated hardware and promised to stick with it b) made all the improbable promises c) had garbage pile execution or even total abandonment of things that could have been done and had been done with ease by other developers on PS3 YEARS AGO d) jumping ship now after milking the community dry.
I don't even have words.
I can only imagine a child wrote this.
DUST was an interesting concept that began in 2009. It's clear that the game was a mistake and Legion looks like a promising way to salvage the wreckage. If you can't understand how a PC is more powerful than a PS3 in 2014, then I'm really sorry. It doesn't just provide better graphics.
|
Cinnamon267
186
|
Posted - 2014.05.04 04:51:00 -
[44] - Quote
low genius wrote:Aeon Amadi wrote:low genius wrote:ccp is dead to me, old friend.
my eve characters are unsubscribed.
by dust character will never again advance.
my plans of playing valkyrie are dashed.
**** ccp. And that's totally cool if you feel that way man, but I'm telling you to at least sleep on it a while and think it through. I'm incredibly excited for what we saw and the Graphics panel really showed some innovative stuff (watching smoke move when rounds get shot through it is killer!). Just don't delete your characters and if at all possible, give some feedback on how Dust's new path can improve. ever played an ea game that didn't make you want to throw up?.
Dead space 1 and 2 are pretty dang great. Same with the Bad Company games. People also best off profusely over the first dragon age. Plenty of good games have come out under EA. Stop being dramatic. Makes you sound insanely irrational.
Ydubbs81 RND wrote:The problem is....CCP never had plans on leaving the ps3. How can a company of pc game designers not know that the ps3 was aging. In their own words, they were "laser focused on the ps3".
What does that tell you?
Uh, they always had plans to leave the PS3. If you think this game was always going to exist on PS3 you're detached from reality.
https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=40778 |
Lucrezia LeGrand
Sentinels of New Eden
524
|
Posted - 2014.05.04 04:54:00 -
[45] - Quote
DUST Fiend wrote:Lucrezia LeGrand wrote:DUST Fiend wrote:All I know is that the game we were all sold on, is Legion, not DUST. DUST helped to build Legion, and I'm ok with that. No, we were promised Legion, but we were sold Dust. That is very different, and one of the reasons why a lot of us are upset. Well you have to admit to technical limitations. There is still hope for a PS4 port. I don't know what to tell you guys. Would you really rather DUST just disappears into irrelevance on the PS3, rather than becoming what it was always supposed to be, with an actual possibility of a quality port to the PS4? The PS3 version was never going to reasonably be ported, it just wasn't going to happen. This is a matter of realistic expectations, of what can ACTUALLY be done. Either we settle for a barely mediocre niche game with slight ties to EVE, or we push forward, and have the game this was always supposed to be.
Everyone wanted a better version of Dust. But we're upset because
1) CCP had the nerve to tell us about Legion the way they did, with no word on what would happen to Dust, and with no word on whether console players would get the chance to experience "the better Dust"
2) Kept all of this information hidden instead of being open with the community like they claimed to be. "oh hai guys and gals. We're glad you like Dust. Btw, we're going to try to create the uber version of Dust on PC because ps3 is kicking our butts. We're still going to be adding new stuff to Dust (don't forget pilot suits!) so we can see what works and what doesn't work on uber Dust and because we love our players. Stay tuned because your feedback will shape the future and see ya on the ps4!" Nope. none of that.
3) Tons of promotions to encourage us to spend Aurum when Legion was already several months into development, and Dust was already considered dead.
4) for a company named Crowd Control (the CC in CCP) they did very little of that. Instead they locked threads, banned players, and waited too long of a time to answer too few of our questions.
you know, bad news is bad. it always sucks. but you would be surprised how well people take bad news in stride if they are told straight forward, with no bs. I want a better Dust. Heck, if I could run it, I would have played Legion, but after this I'm very skeptical about all things CCP.
Thale groupie (not the gun, but the man).
My other car is Utena.
|
The Noob Destroyer
Pradox One
Proficiency V.
655
|
Posted - 2014.05.04 04:57:00 -
[46] - Quote
Aeon Amadi wrote:Okay, so I was going to wait until I got back to the states before I commented on everything but I've got a few hours until my flight and a ten hour layover later on. Be aware, I'm on a tablet so typing kind of sucks.
I understand you guys are frustrated and it's entirely reasonable. No-one can blame you. However, I heard some crazy stories here at FanFest on how you guys were reacting and I couldn't help but weigh my voice in (because you guys totally care about my grizzly smoker vocals, right?). First off, dude - don't biomass your characters... Nothing about that makes any sense. Project Legion isn't even a working thing, it's a prototype. A prototype that hasn't even been set in stone yet. We could stick with Dust as it is currently, we could migrate to Legion, but either case: deleting r characters is just silly. One way or another your investments are going to stick and/or carry over so it's stupid to just throw that away in a knee jerk reaction. And even if you quit, keep your characters in case you change your mind in the future whenever it's more calm.
Secondly, if you see past the platform change and the trademark/name confusion, this -IS- what we've all been asking for. More meaningful character progression, better graphics, gameplay elements, etc. This is what we've been waiting for all this time and it simply was not possible on the aging PlayStation 3.
Thirdly, guys... Be real with yourselves here. Developers who no longer even work at CCP made promises last year that they couldn't deliver, anger ensues... Now, CCP does everything possible to avoid promising stuff they can't 100% deliver and anger ensues? It doesn't make much sense, it's contradictory to what we've argued so hard about in the past. We need them to be honest like they have, to not promise something if they're not positive they can do it. To be clear, the only thing they've promised is that -IF- we go to Legion, our characters will migrate. They haven't even promised Legion yet.
Fourthly, guys, the PS3 is very old. We already have the PS4, so the console Dust is on is very aged and is not capable of doing what CCP wants to develop and what we want to experience. It takes CCP time to send updates through to the PS3, and as we've experienced they haven't really been free to update quickly (something necessary with Dust's design structure) with that delay. Further more, they never ruled out PlayStation 4. In fact, with both PC and the PS4 operating on x86 architecture and similar specifications, porting a complete product to the PS4 is far easier and more streamlined than with PS3 where everything has to be stripped just to run the game. But in order to do that, we need something that can be rapidly altered to make it work, and be functional as a whole that can be done correctly. Just as well, they can't promise what they can't 100% deliver.
So, maybe that helps - maybe it doesn't. Being here at Fanfest I can see the CPM and community celebrities (yeah, that's right, I'm throwing you forum wizards undder the bus =P) expressing YOUR emotions to the developers and actively working to rectify all of this. Your voices are being signal boosted far more precisely than any other time in the history of Dust.
Anyway, that's all I really had to say. I'm open to any questions and what not if you'd like to know more from the round-tables that weren't answered on the stream, perhaps offer some of my insight and speculation, as long as they're constructive.
stop trying to undue all the chaos I have created.
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DUST Fiend
The Wings of Legion
13941
|
Posted - 2014.05.04 05:00:00 -
[47] - Quote
I'm waaaaaay too tired to give you a proper response right now man, but I feel your pain. I'm in no way defending CCP's actions leading up to this point, I'm merely agreeing with Legion as being the best possible step forward.
It's gonna take a long time to heal this wound, I just hope that in time, we can all come to a compromise that works for as many people as possible. I want to see you all in Legion, kicking the **** out of my ****** little corp and giving me a run for my money. I don't want to see anyone get burned, but at the same time, I want this game to succeed.
Sleep is needed, I'll try to respond better tomorrow
o7
LONG LIVE LEGION!
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Lucrezia LeGrand
Sentinels of New Eden
526
|
Posted - 2014.05.04 05:05:00 -
[48] - Quote
DUST Fiend wrote:I'm waaaaaay too tired to give you a proper response right now man, but I feel your pain. I'm in no way defending CCP's actions leading up to this point, I'm merely agreeing with Legion as being the best possible step forward.
It's gonna take a long time to heal this wound, I just hope that in time, we can all come to a compromise that works for as many people as possible. I want to see you all in Legion, kicking the **** out of my ****** little corp and giving me a run for my money. I don't want to see anyone get burned, but at the same time, I want this game to succeed.
Sleep is needed, I'll try to respond better tomorrow
o7
lol, I would have to be good first if I wanted to kick the **** out of your corp, so don't worry about that. Yeah, it is a bummer how this turned out. Especially since right before Legion there were several movements to try and make the community less toxic. Guess those attempts are out the window now.
I suppose if there's any good that came from this, is that a lot of the forum users can find a common ground to stand on and look away from past grievances. Too bad that common ground is "ccp screwed up".
Thale groupie (not the gun, but the man).
My other car is Utena.
|
low genius
The Sound Of Freedom
Dirt Nap Squad.
1658
|
Posted - 2014.05.04 05:08:00 -
[49] - Quote
Aeon Amadi wrote:low genius wrote:
But that's just it: they DID announce a full character transfer. The specifics might be a bit different but the impact your character made, your identity and your level of progression are all on board for migration. They have publicly said that this is their top priority, with their second being your aurum investment.
yeah, that's not what they said. they said 'applicable skills and items'.
guess who gets to decide what's 'applicable'. some former ea developer.
I'm a former fast food worker. Doesn't affect my current cooking skills at all and it surely doesn't affect my ability to draw up amazing stuff for the tattoo industry. Previous work, especially simple affiliation, does not dictate expertise or skill. People are angry, that's fine - I get it, it's cool. Preaching to the choir. But it had to happen eventually and ultimately it's the best decision I've heard yet. People are blind to the fact that they're delivering on what we wanted because of a platform change, and yes some will be alienated from it... but it's still Dropsuits shooting face in New Eden. It's what we wanted, and it was CCP's call on how to make it a reality.
the platform makes absolutely no difference to me. i bought a computer to play eve.
dust has no development plan, and it's a far cry from what we were promised. now they're reselling us the same ideas under a different title name. if you watch the 2011 dust fanfest keynote, and the 2014 'dust' fanfest keynote, you know what the difference is? the 2011 keynote is longer, and has more information, and has a better plan.
eatsbabies cienfuegos
steward of the renegade alliance.
|
danie braz
Krusual Covert Operators
Minmatar Republic
12
|
Posted - 2014.05.04 05:10:00 -
[50] - Quote
DUST Fiend wrote:Ydubbs81 RND wrote:The problem is....CCP never had plans on leaving the ps3. How can a company of pc game designers not know that the ps3 was aging. In their own words, they were "laser focused on the ps3".
What does that tell you? How do you know they never had plans to leave PS3? Because they didn't tell you? People take things far too literally. So the guy used the wrong words, wow, oh no. At the time, maybe they were. Maybe they weren't. All I know is that the game we were all sold on, is Legion, not DUST. DUST helped to build Legion, and I'm ok with that. Here's hoping Legion gets the green light because it's the game DUST was always supposed to be. I also find it funny how in one post, you say they had no plans to leave the PS3, yet in the very next post, you say you expected ("wouldn't mind") it to go to the PS4. So, which is it? If you want a PS4 port, you should be PUSHING for Legion, since it will be easier for them to port AND be higher quality.
Never mind |
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|
mollerz
3428
|
Posted - 2014.05.04 05:12:00 -
[51] - Quote
If someone has to explain to you why CCP has been so utterly wrong, then I'm happy to watch all you guppies continually get ripped off.
I'm off their merry-go-round. Some people are perfectly happy going in circles. Some people never learn their lessons. Integrity and reputation are extremely valuable to some, not others.
Aeon- I get that you went to iceland. But you are being a patsy.
You gotta hustle if you wanna make a dolla
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tastzlike chicken
ROGUE SPADES
232
|
Posted - 2014.05.04 05:40:00 -
[52] - Quote
Aeon,
I appreciate the content of your post and your obvious concern for the game.
From what was said (and not said) initially at Fanfest and in print -it came across very much like:
Dust 514 on the PS3 would not be getting any major updates. It sounded very much like they would continue their bug hunts and make minor tweaks to improve on what was already there....with half the staff of what was present previously. Which immediately brings to mind the speed of their previous efforts. Potentially distressing, no? In the meantime,all the energy and focus on meaningful development (of the game we have been hoping for) will be on the PC build. Some articles gave the impression that this minimal level of support for DUST might continue for 6 months...maybe 12; -which kinda sounds like an expiration date.
It wasn't until after the shitstorm that reassurances and backtracking started coming through and frankly, they sounded like damage control and therefore are still easily dismissed as insincere. - All the while the forums were pretty vacant of blues.
The forums also quickly figured out that this plan had been rolling forward for some months now. And all the months of waiting to hear about a major DUST 514 build for the PS3 (which you have to admit was the expectation) were met with the rather curt intro of the PC vision.
The "craziness" you heard about did not develop in a vacuum. A lot of the more extreme reactions could have easily have been avoided by an earlier announcement tailored very much like the one that you just posted. Surely, CCP could have come up with a Devblog message just like yours in a timely manner. After all, how long did it take you to write yours?
I understand that the PS3 is a dead end and that the PC development will allow for the game we've all been hearing about. It also does not rule out a port to the PS4. I agree with the move as do many others here but many of the players don't have a gaming PC and jumped on the CCP ship enthusiastically to support a console shooter -they are a little more inconsolable at the moment.
The major cause of the crazy stories you heard was due to the inept handling of the announcement and the disingenuous verbage we've been subjected to. That is the most charitable characterization I can come up with. In any case I've already written much longer posts about my major source of ire.
From a customer relations and PR perspective this was handled in a rather disgusting way.
I clearly can't speak for everyone but many of us already understood the points that you made in your post; -those aren't the things that angered and disappointed people like me. Coming off the tail end of a bunch of in game Aurum item "specials" and aurum associated events did not help things at all.
We as a community should have been informed earlier.
The "buy, buy, buy" campaigns leading up to this announcement did not help matters.
The tone and content (or lack of content) of the presentations were odd
The attempt at distinguishing Legion from Dust 514 seemed like lawyering.
In any case, the points you make are valid. However, I would point out that if your post came from CCP it would come across like a sort of strawman. -An attempt at redirecting the attention away from what was stirring up the really deeply rooted anger and resentment.
I hope none of this came across as directed at you.
o7
Edit Honestly, after backing up through the post list I could have just reference most of what 'fuegos wrote.
Quod gratis asseritur, gratis negatur
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mollerz
3429
|
Posted - 2014.05.04 05:48:00 -
[53] - Quote
tastzlike chicken wrote:Aeon,
I appreciate the content of your post and ..SNIP
o7 to you man. You won.
Aeon, you should be happy someone went through the trouble to frame the issue for you. I wouldn't have bothered.
You gotta hustle if you wanna make a dolla
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tastzlike chicken
ROGUE SPADES
232
|
Posted - 2014.05.04 05:48:00 -
[54] - Quote
low genius wrote:Aeon Amadi wrote:low genius wrote:Aeon Amadi wrote:low genius wrote:ccp is dead to me, old friend.
my eve characters are unsubscribed.
by dust character will never again advance.
my plans of playing valkyrie are dashed.
**** ccp. And that's totally cool if you feel that way man, but I'm telling you to at least sleep on it a while and think it through. I'm incredibly excited for what we saw and the Graphics panel really showed some innovative stuff (watching smoke move when rounds get shot through it is killer!). Just don't delete your characters and if at all possible, give some feedback on how Dust's new path can improve. ever played an ea game that didn't make you want to throw up? me neither. Lol, attacking a person's character is kind of low but I guess the name suits you =P Nah, listen man - it's awesome. It really is. Once the shock kind of settles and everyone gets a better grasp of things, I think you'll all see that the game has progressed by leaps and bounds and was TOTALLY NECESSARY in order for us to -BE- that clone soldier on the frontline instead of just some spreadsheet silhouette who walks around for five minutes before getting aced. Like, what is it that bothers you specifically? are the lighting effects really what needs work to make dust a better game? are the lights reflecting off of the ground what dust needs to be a better game? what did the demo show that wasn't COMPLETELY aesthetic? they showed nothing. no ewar. no parcour. they even messed up their scripted demo when rouge called the tank pilot 'down' while the tank was still firing. there was nothing in the keynotes to make us think dust is worth playing for another year. if ccp's 10 year development plan for dust lasted 10 months, and we spent 18 months in beta... doesn't it stand to reason that legion will suffer the same fate?
You forgot the burning trees!
Quod gratis asseritur, gratis negatur
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Aeon Amadi
Edimmu Warfighters
Gallente Federation
5576
|
Posted - 2014.05.04 06:02:00 -
[55] - Quote
Let me repeat some things as your responses are becoming repetitive of a common theme.
This dev team guiding Dust to where it needs to be? Not the same team as back in 2013. Most of those devs are gone for whatever speculatory reason, and with them any promises they over-hyped. All of this stuff about "Oh, they promised us MTACs soon not TMtm" or what have you. It's pretty much clear, and has been for a while, that those promises were from someone who clearly overestimated their capabilities and we now have a much more competent, focused team with a clear and set goal that is 100% unmistakable, even though it may not be for consoles just yet, and that is to make Dust what it was promised.
Yes, it's a real in. Yes, it's a rehash. Yes, it has all the bells and whistles, but more importantly it has a STAGGERING increase in quality from what we have now. I mean, FFS you can't even hear anything behind you in Dust because of an animation optimization to make the game run better - that's not good, that's very very bad and those compromises are what was holding Dust back. So, yes, it's not promising new content but it is functional from what we've seen and largely capable.
And as far as all the sales? Back in 1.4 they had a sale on contact grenades. Why? Because they were selling like hotcakes. Why? Because they were broken, but inevitably marketing was doing their job just without context. It's a completely separate issue though and has nothing to do with anything related to Fanfest other than a sense of betrayal but the community was going to feel that no matter what, to be quite frank.
Focus on the future, not the past. Legion is leaps and bounds ahead of what we have and it's time to shift our feedback to making it stellar, while hitting up the low hanging fruit in Dust.
Useful Links
//forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=133588
//forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=134182
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mollerz
3430
|
Posted - 2014.05.04 06:07:00 -
[56] - Quote
I think Aeon needs a few days away from the CCP Icelandic cult cooties so he can sit down and process this clusterfuck without the starstruck "experience" he just had.
You gotta hustle if you wanna make a dolla
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DUST Fiend
The Wings of Legion
13954
|
Posted - 2014.05.04 06:35:00 -
[57] - Quote
mollerz wrote:I think Aeon needs a few days away from the CCP Icelandic cult cooties so he can sit down and process this clusterfuck without the starstruck "experience" he just had.
The butthurt is immensely strong in this one.
LONG LIVE LEGION!
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RemingtonBeaver
Molon Labe.
General Tso's Alliance
876
|
Posted - 2014.05.04 06:43:00 -
[58] - Quote
DUST Fiend wrote:mollerz wrote:I think Aeon needs a few days away from the CCP Icelandic cult cooties so he can sit down and process this clusterfuck without the starstruck "experience" he just had.
The butthurt is immensely strong in this one.
Clever, you come up with that all by yourself?
tastzlike chicken should be drowning in likes right now.
@CCP Rouge: You don't sh*t where you eat. Idiot.
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tastzlike chicken
ROGUE SPADES
235
|
Posted - 2014.05.04 06:45:00 -
[59] - Quote
Aeon Amadi wrote:Let me repeat some things as your responses are becoming repetitive of a common theme.
This dev team guiding Dust to where it needs to be? Not the same team as back in 2013. Most of those devs are gone for whatever speculatory reason, and with them any promises they over-hyped. All of this stuff about "Oh, they promised us MTACs soon not TMtm" or what have you. It's pretty much clear, and has been for a while, that those promises were from someone who clearly overestimated their capabilities and we now have a much more competent, focused team with a clear and set goal that is 100% unmistakable, even though it may not be for consoles just yet, and that is to make Dust what it was promised.
Yes, it's a real in. Yes, it's a rehash. Yes, it has all the bells and whistles, but more importantly it has a STAGGERING increase in quality from what we have now. I mean, FFS you can't even hear anything behind you in Dust because of an animation optimization to make the game run better - that's not good, that's very very bad and those compromises are what was holding Dust back. So, yes, it's not promising new content but it is functional from what we've seen and largely capable.
And as far as all the sales? Back in 1.4 they had a sale on contact grenades. Why? Because they were selling like hotcakes. Why? Because they were broken, but inevitably marketing was doing their job just without context. It's a completely separate issue though and has nothing to do with anything related to Fanfest other than a sense of betrayal but the community was going to feel that no matter what, to be quite frank.
Focus on the future, not the past. Legion is leaps and bounds ahead of what we have and it's time to shift our feedback to making it stellar, while hitting up the low hanging fruit in Dust.
Aeon....
The angst/rage/emotions are because of:
Perceptions
You can argue how the realities of the project have changed all you want; it doesn't matter. CCP did a tragic job at managing expectations and public/consumer relations.
CCP is a business. They are a multimillion dollar multinational corporation. They are the largest IT firm in Iceland. They are responsible for ...what? 0.2%of Icelands GDP -by themselves. They have access to the resources to have handled this whole fiasco properly. But they didn't....Why not?
That question in this context properly calls into question their philosophy, ethics, corporate integrity, and leadership.
Besides being generally pissed off about a perceived bait and switch I believe that THIS is what people are truly angry about even if they don't articulate it. The whole "this is a different group of people" canard contributes nothing to the discussion of the points i tried to make earlier. It's an answer to a completely different question.
Quod gratis asseritur, gratis negatur
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DUST Fiend
The Wings of Legion
13959
|
Posted - 2014.05.04 06:47:00 -
[60] - Quote
RemingtonBeaver wrote:DUST Fiend wrote:mollerz wrote:I think Aeon needs a few days away from the CCP Icelandic cult cooties so he can sit down and process this clusterfuck without the starstruck "experience" he just had.
The butthurt is immensely strong in this one. Clever, you come up with that all by yourself? tastzlike chicken should be drowning in likes right now.
I did, it took me all year. I was planning and doing calculations and running the numbers. It all just culminated right there. It was really my crowning achievement. You can't see it, but all my likes actually just came from that one post.
It was nothing short of astonishing.
LONG LIVE LEGION!
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|
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tastzlike chicken
ROGUE SPADES
235
|
Posted - 2014.05.04 06:53:00 -
[61] - Quote
I'm going to get banned aren't I?
Quod gratis asseritur, gratis negatur
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mollerz
3433
|
Posted - 2014.05.04 06:59:00 -
[62] - Quote
DUST Fiend wrote:mollerz wrote:I think Aeon needs a few days away from the CCP Icelandic cult cooties so he can sit down and process this clusterfuck without the starstruck "experience" he just had.
The butthurt is immensely strong in this one.
Did you sell your account already, Dust Fiend?
I've always been cool to you, and you have accomplished an amazing 180 in your view of this whole thing since the dust news dropped. I'm pretty confused as to why you'd mock me given Aeon's disconnect from the situation.
You gotta hustle if you wanna make a dolla
|
DUST Fiend
The Wings of Legion
13961
|
Posted - 2014.05.04 07:15:00 -
[63] - Quote
mollerz wrote:DUST Fiend wrote:mollerz wrote:I think Aeon needs a few days away from the CCP Icelandic cult cooties so he can sit down and process this clusterfuck without the starstruck "experience" he just had.
The butthurt is immensely strong in this one. Did you sell your account already, Dust Fiend? I've always been cool to you, and you have accomplished an amazing 180 in your view of this whole thing since the dust news dropped. I'm pretty confused as to why you'd mock me given Aeon's disconnect from the situation.
I have a habit of knee jerk reactions, it's a problem lol.
As I've said and will continue to say, how they handled this whole reveal was nothing short of a spectacular fail, but I respect CCP for owning up to their mistake that is DUST on the PS3. I was this close to quitting the game for good because I knew that DUST would never become what it was originally envisioned to be, on the PS3.
I've just decided that I can sit here and be negative, or I can be positive. I'd rather look the future than wallow in the past. Worst case scenario, I just forget CCP and go play other games. There are plenty out there.
You win some and you lose some, that's just life.
LONG LIVE LEGION!
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Mobius Wyvern
Ahrendee Mercenaries
Dirt Nap Squad.
5148
|
Posted - 2014.05.04 07:17:00 -
[64] - Quote
DUST Fiend wrote:mollerz wrote:DUST Fiend wrote:mollerz wrote:I think Aeon needs a few days away from the CCP Icelandic cult cooties so he can sit down and process this clusterfuck without the starstruck "experience" he just had.
The butthurt is immensely strong in this one. Did you sell your account already, Dust Fiend? I've always been cool to you, and you have accomplished an amazing 180 in your view of this whole thing since the dust news dropped. I'm pretty confused as to why you'd mock me given Aeon's disconnect from the situation. I have a habit of knee jerk reactions, it's a problem lol. As I've said and will continue to say, how they handled this whole reveal was nothing short of a spectacular fail, but I respect CCP for owning up to their mistake that is DUST on the PS3. I was this close to quitting the game for good because I knew that DUST would never become what it was originally envisioned to be, on the PS3. I've just decided that I can sit here and be negative, or I can be positive. I'd rather look the future than wallow in the past. Worst case scenario, I just forget CCP and go play other games. There are plenty out there. You win some and you lose some, that's just life.
Well said, my friend!
We all agree - and it seems even CCP agrees now - that the reveal of Legion was a monumental ****-up. It's good to see them acknowledging that and trying to remedy it.
Amidst the blue skies
A link from past to future
The sheltering wings of the protector
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Cosgar
9255
|
Posted - 2014.05.04 07:21:00 -
[65] - Quote
CCP was already dead to me months before. But what royally pisses me off is that this kind of underhanded dealing might be the norm for games with open betas and even kickstarters with little to no penalty.
This community is the nail in Dust 514's coffin, waiting to be hammered in.
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John Surratt
Sanmatar Kelkoons
Minmatar Republic
51
|
Posted - 2014.05.04 07:22:00 -
[66] - Quote
Ludvig Enraga wrote:
What a load of BS. PC offers nothing that's better than PS except for graphics which most ppl here don't give a damn about. I love your logic: "CCP hired a bunch of incompetent ppl that held positions high enough to talk on the behalf of CCP but it's not CCP's fault that a) they chose dated hardware and promised to stick with it b) made all the improbable promises c) had garbage pile execution or even total abandonment of things that could have been done and had been done with ease by other developers on PS3 YEARS AGO d) jumping ship now after milking the community dry.
. . and that's where you are wrong. The largest benefit for a gaming on PC is not graphics, but the fact that the development environment and the ability to push content changes is so much easier on a PC vs a console. Face it, having to have Sony vet all your changes. . not to mention the fact that once a console is built it stays the same until end of life, is a huge stumbling block for continuous development.
Also, DUST was started back in '09. Beta started in 2011. PS4 development kits didn't ship 'till 2012. Do the math.
Fault CCP for complete tone deafness and pants on head stupidity for they way they have handled this change, I certainly do. But don't blame them for not developing a game for hardware that didn't exist during the initial beta, or change mid design and throw out their entire body of code (and yes coding for a PS3 and a PS4 is completely different) for a un-manufactured, un-shipped console.
On the one hand, porting to PS4 from PC will be alot easier than PS3 to PS4. On the other hand moving the game to PS4 puts PS4 Legion players on the same chopping block as DUST is now. . consoles will age and die.
Face it, this generation of Xbawks and PS is likely the last hurrah for a "dedicated" gaming machine. Quotes are due to the face that Console companies are trying to make them do everything a PC can do, minus using Office, ie video steaming, home entertainment, music.. blah blah.
Also, blame the initial team and last EP of DUST for all the undelivered promises. I am still waiting on the promised RTS elements. . .Rouge, d__k though he may be for delivering that keynote, has been given a pretty sh__ty task, which is to take this steaming pile of mediocrity and turn it into what it is supposed to be.
. . Also, just for all the PS3 only players. I bought a PS3 for two games. Kingdoms of Amalur, and DUST 514. Tell me I don't feel f__ked. . . after $250 for PS3 and accessories, $100 for a wireless headset (use wired for PC), $50-ish in BPO's & Aurum, $60+ for KoA & DLC. . . Could have gotten a damn good motherboard & a fat stack of memory for htat price and had a pretty damn good PC rig. . . I guess it (PS3) will replace my PS2 for a DVD player in the bedroom if/after Legion ships. |
Cosgar
9255
|
Posted - 2014.05.04 07:32:00 -
[67] - Quote
tastzlike chicken wrote:I'm going to get banned aren't I?
Does it really matter?
This community is the nail in Dust 514's coffin, waiting to be hammered in.
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Piraten Hovnoret
Molon Labe.
General Tso's Alliance
561
|
Posted - 2014.05.04 07:35:00 -
[68] - Quote
Bla bla bla
This is nothing but panic due to the fact that aurum and other in game sales will crash and burn due to this.
You are also forgetting al the fancy words about a 10 year plan etc.
now they are saying we have a 10 year plan on this other game that is what you al have been asking for.
Oh and buy the way thanks for al the fish.
No bro try to smoth things over al you want,
A dry hump is always a dry hump
Regards
War never changes
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Aleph Rynedee
Science For Death
Final Resolution.
90
|
Posted - 2014.05.04 07:51:00 -
[69] - Quote
Ydubbs81 RND wrote:
But this game was supposed to be persistent and everyone was looking and thinking long term.
This is where I feel foolish. I have 4.8m SP unallocated (21m lifetime) and was in a weeks long debate on whether it would be better used on a second logi suit (then the debate would have morphed into which race), EWAR (my only problem was the math, millions of SP defeated by a few thousand SP) or weapons (I have the bare minimum: AR5, Grenade3 and MD3). I was waiting to see where Dust was headed before committing such a substantial percentage of my SP.
The lack of communication since 1.8 should have been a clue (also the dev blog about the guy who makes the fanfest videos should be included in the clue category) that the winds were changing. Like most, I was shocked on Friday morning, the things left unsaid were louder than their message, but reflecting on it I'm not surprised. I just wish I'd gotten some use out of that SP (chased some flavor of the months like the rail rifle, that bastard child of a sniper rifle and smg) while there were still a good number of competitive mercy populating New Eden. It would've been fun lumbering around like a coked up Tony Montana spewing prodigious amounts of projectiles down range in a fit of rage.
It remains to be seen if my corp will remain active, I might get some use out those SPs yet. |
emtbraincase
Falconpunch Hatesurfers
127
|
Posted - 2014.05.04 08:08:00 -
[70] - Quote
I don't give a flying rats butthole if Legion is the most glorious piece of artwork to ever grace the human race with it's wonderful aestheticss and immersing gameplay.....It is a PC game and I play consoles.
CCP stole my/our money through bonus events they knew had absolutely no more relevance, and then had the balls to say that they did it for the dust community by giving us what we wanted. At no time in any of our desires did the term"personal computer" or "PC" ever come up except to say that Thankfully Dust isn't on a PC. |
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mollerz
3437
|
Posted - 2014.05.04 08:08:00 -
[71] - Quote
DUST Fiend wrote:
I have a habit of knee jerk reactions, it's a problem lol.
As I've said and will continue to say, how they handled this whole reveal was nothing short of a spectacular fail, but I respect CCP for owning up to their mistake that is DUST on the PS3. I was this close to quitting the game for good because I knew that DUST would never become what it was originally envisioned to be, on the PS3.
I've just decided that I can sit here and be negative, or I can be positive. I'd rather look the future than wallow in the past. Worst case scenario, I just forget CCP and go play other games. There are plenty out there.
You win some and you lose some, that's just life.
You talk exactly like a victim.
You gotta hustle if you wanna make a dolla
|
Bendtner92
Imperfects
Negative-Feedback
2021
|
Posted - 2014.05.04 08:11:00 -
[72] - Quote
Why would we care about what you have to say just because you went to FF? It's not like we're confused about what's going to happen? We're simply just mad at the way CCP is handling their players.
It's very good for you and all the others that are interested in moving over to PC with Project Legion. I mean it, that's all good for you and you certainly deserve to have everything transfered over from Dust, but Rouge has only been saying "identity, player name, applicable skills yada yada yada", so that's very far from a true confirmation and he's also only saying these things because he has the entire Dust community raging at him at the moment. If you really think they're going to let some players get all of their SP transfered etc giving these players a huge advantage over their EVE players, you know the ones they just showed this weekend are the ones they really care about, you're going to be sorely mistaken.
Furthermore, only very little of the Dust players are going to be interested in moving over (which is good for them), while he just crapped on all the others that are console players only. It's pretty clear they don't care about these players anymore and have only been (and will keep doing) milking them for the past many months. There will be no futher meaningful Dust development (confirmed by Rouge himself fyi) and they are NOT interested in current gen consoles at the moment.
Yes, Dust won't see any progress on a bad console as the PS3, I know that, everyone else knows that, but crapping on most of your players that's been sticking with them on this terrible game by going to PC instead of PS4 is just disrespectful to your players. You keep saying PS4 isn't ruled out for sometime in the far future, but honestly I don't care about that. They've chosen to go to PC first leaving their current players behind and because of that I really hope the terrible Shanghai studio (because you know it's going to be same bad devs developing Legion right?) fucks Legion up. The Dust players are not interested in waiting 3-4+ years to see Legion on the PS4 only to be 2nd grade citizens behind CCP's beloved EVE players.
Winner of the EU Squad Cup & the closed beta Tester's Tournament.
Go Go Power Rangers!
R.I.P MAG.
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DeeJay One
Guardian Solutions
DARKSTAR ARMY
300
|
Posted - 2014.05.04 08:34:00 -
[73] - Quote
Aeon, you don't get it do you?
I'm not mad that Legion is coming to PC, I'm mad how CCP handled Dust at Fanfest. There was zero mention of Dust on all of the presentations. They have no roadmap on keeping Dust alive until Legion comes. Rouge and Praetorian put all their cards on an alpha, giving the current Dust community nothing. They were making stuff up on the go as to character transfer. All the presentations were labeled "Dust 514" but all of them were about Project Legion. That's like you'd go to watch the EVE keynote and the entire keynote was about Valkyrie and no real EVE keynote was coming.
They make talk about keeping Dust alive, but the fact is they didn't have anything prepared for Fanfest which would assure us of that. Rouge himself told us to wait a few weeks (weeks!) before we get more information on that - this means they did nothing but Legion in the last months, not even thinking about Dust... |
Ludvig Enraga
KILL-EM-QUICK
RISE of LEGION
1059
|
Posted - 2014.05.04 08:42:00 -
[74] - Quote
Tomoko Kawase wrote:Ludvig Enraga wrote:What a load of BS. PC offers nothing that's better than PS except for graphics which most ppl here don't give a damn about. I love your logic: "CCP hired a bunch of incompetent ppl that held positions high enough to talk on the behalf of CCP but it's not CCP's fault that a) they chose dated hardware and promised to stick with it b) made all the improbable promises c) had garbage pile execution or even total abandonment of things that could have been done and had been done with ease by other developers on PS3 YEARS AGO d) jumping ship now after milking the community dry. I don't even have words. I can only imagine a child wrote this. DUST was an interesting concept that began in 2009. It's clear that the game was a mistake and Legion looks like a promising way to salvage the wreckage. If you can't understand how a PC is more powerful than a PS3 in 2014, then I'm really sorry. It doesn't just provide better graphics.
huh? a very eloquent explanation! if you have something of substance to say, say it. Please, don't wright "I am sorry but it's just not true". If you are not able to argument your position to speak lest you look like a child.
PLC, NK, Scout - before 1.8.
That's right, I stack that OP Sh!t.
|
Ludvig Enraga
KILL-EM-QUICK
RISE of LEGION
1060
|
Posted - 2014.05.04 08:53:00 -
[75] - Quote
Aeon Amadi wrote:low genius wrote:
Like, what is it that bothers you specifically?
COX Z had a glorious layout of the gameplay changes and how they're implementing character progression. It's just conceptual at the moment, but I feel it's far better in the long haul. Things like ditching skill levels in favor of single-cost unlocks, role-based progressions with meaningful skill trees to associate with them and the nyxxing of power levels (advanced/proto nonsense). There's a lot more than graphical bits but the graphical bits do play a lot more of a role like thick fog that lessens your vision and more deadly weather aspects like meteor showers.
i played battlefield 3. i understand the concept. i just couldn't believe they were selling me dust/battlefield 3 at a fanfest.
what part of fanfest makes you think dust is worth playing for another year? so you can play the legion beta for 18 months?[/quote]
Everything, man. The character progression is just incredible from what we were shown, the graphics, all of it man.[/quote]
LMAO at 'incredible character progression' - what was stopping them from implementing it in Dust? Just give some sort of respec that lets you allocate you relative progression into your new character development axis - there you can have your 'incredible character progression' right here and now. The 'amazing graphics' is just the same DUST with particle effects and lighting turned on high on the developer's desktop. - there is no new game in this at all. This literally was just an outtake of a developers desktop version of Dust. If ppl don't see this, they are blind.
PLC, NK, Scout - before 1.8.
That's right, I stack that OP Sh!t.
|
Ludvig Enraga
KILL-EM-QUICK
RISE of LEGION
1061
|
Posted - 2014.05.04 09:06:00 -
[76] - Quote
Aeon Amadi wrote:Let me repeat some things as your responses are becoming repetitive of a common theme.
This dev team guiding Dust to where it needs to be? Not the same team as back in 2013. Most of those devs are gone for whatever speculatory reason, and with them any promises they over-hyped. All of this stuff about "Oh, they promised us MTACs soon not TMtm" or what have you. It's pretty much clear, and has been for a while, that those promises were from someone who clearly overestimated their capabilities and we now have a much more competent, focused team with a clear and set goal that is 100% unmistakable, even though it may not be for consoles just yet, and that is to make Dust what it was promised.
Yes, it's a real in. Yes, it's a rehash. Yes, it has all the bells and whistles, but more importantly it has a STAGGERING increase in quality from what we have now. I mean, FFS you can't even hear anything behind you in Dust because of an animation optimization to make the game run better - that's not good, that's very very bad and those compromises are what was holding Dust back. So, yes, it's not promising new content but it is functional from what we've seen and largely capable.
And as far as all the sales? Back in 1.4 they had a sale on contact grenades. Why? Because they were selling like hotcakes. Why? Because they were broken, but inevitably marketing was doing their job just without context. It's a completely separate issue though and has nothing to do with anything related to Fanfest other than a sense of betrayal but the community was going to feel that no matter what, to be quite frank.
Focus on the future, not the past. Legion is leaps and bounds ahead of what we have and it's time to shift our feedback to making it stellar, while hitting up the low hanging fruit in Dust.
wtf does any of this have to do with DEVS? They are underpaid Chinese programmers from Shanghai that the game was outsourced to. The decisions have not been made by those 'developers'. Please, don't mislead ppl. They have been made by CCP leadership. If you think it was Rouge that just made this decision - you are naive. He is a new comer to the company, not the head of CCP.
PLC, NK, Scout - before 1.8.
That's right, I stack that OP Sh!t.
|
Aeon Amadi
Edimmu Warfighters
Gallente Federation
5581
|
Posted - 2014.05.04 09:23:00 -
[77] - Quote
DeeJay One wrote:Aeon, you don't get it do you?
I'm not mad that Legion is coming to PC, I'm mad how CCP handled Dust at Fanfest. There was zero mention of Dust on all of the presentations. They have no roadmap on keeping Dust alive until Legion comes. Rouge and Praetorian put all their cards on an alpha, giving the current Dust community nothing. They were making stuff up on the go as to character transfer. All the presentations were labeled "Dust 514" but all of them were about Project Legion. That's like you'd go to watch the EVE keynote and the entire keynote was about Valkyrie and no real EVE keynote was coming.
They may talk about keeping Dust alive, but the fact is they didn't have anything prepared for Fanfest which would assure us of that. Rouge himself told us to wait a few weeks (weeks!) before we get more information on that - this means they did nothing but Legion in the last months, not even thinking about Dust...
Oh, I get it full and well because it's being repeated by everyone in every amount of flowery language that somehow led it different. It's pretty clear, ifs simple, CCP screwed up their presentation and console players feel alienated with more or less all players feeling betrayed. I TOTALLY GET THAT. But, we've got to move forward. We can't get stuck up on 100% development on the PS3 because it is an aging console that never should have had Dust in the first place.
And no, they didn't just "make up" the character transfer bit as they went along. There's more that goes on then people realize and it's certainly easy to assume things from the stream or recorded videos but I'm telling you that it's not the case.
Likely my final comment here as many people are just repeating the same thing at this point. That and I have a plane to catch.
Useful Links
//forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=133588
//forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=134182
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Gemini Cuspid
Amarr Templars
Amarr Empire
21
|
Posted - 2014.05.04 10:13:00 -
[78] - Quote
Aeon Amadi wrote:DeeJay One wrote:Aeon, you don't get it do you?
I'm not mad that Legion is coming to PC, I'm mad how CCP handled Dust at Fanfest. There was zero mention of Dust on all of the presentations. They have no roadmap on keeping Dust alive until Legion comes. Rouge and Praetorian put all their cards on an alpha, giving the current Dust community nothing. They were making stuff up on the go as to character transfer. All the presentations were labeled "Dust 514" but all of them were about Project Legion. That's like you'd go to watch the EVE keynote and the entire keynote was about Valkyrie and no real EVE keynote was coming.
They may talk about keeping Dust alive, but the fact is they didn't have anything prepared for Fanfest which would assure us of that. Rouge himself told us to wait a few weeks (weeks!) before we get more information on that - this means they did nothing but Legion in the last months, not even thinking about Dust... Oh, I get it full and well because it's being repeated by everyone in every amount of flowery language that somehow led it different. It's pretty clear, ifs simple, CCP screwed up their presentation and console players feel alienated with more or less all players feeling betrayed. I TOTALLY GET THAT. But, we've got to move forward. We can't get stuck up on 100% development on the PS3 because it is an aging console that never should have had Dust in the first place. And no, they didn't just "make up" the character transfer bit as they went along. There's more that goes on then people realize and it's certainly easy to assume things from the stream or recorded videos but I'm telling you that it's not the case. Likely my final comment here as many people are just repeating the same thing at this point. That and I have a plane to catch.
This is the problem overall with anyone IN GENERAL defending Legion: DUST IS ASSOCIATED WITH LEGION UNTIL RELEASE. That's the problem and it's a huge problem. This isn't like "oh hey guys we're working on Dust 2"; the community could eat that news and be satisfied because it happens in gaming history. Titles get released and can end up being franchises.
My point is Dust514 made itself to be this next big, original concept. That's a problem because it's not like Dark Souls where everyone didn't realize how great it was until it became hard to find and ended up getting re-released because no one at the corporate level believed it what a gem it really was! It's the exact 180 where CCP stood with Dust; they made it out to be something it wasn't.
What's worse you announce a project, albeit a project but then the community goes "oh yay CCP is making another game conceptually like Dust because Dust was sooo successful...oh wait". See that's what I think pisses more people off without them realizing it because even breaching an idea like Legion is like saying "hey guess what guys screw you all". It's like an ex-g/f who breaks up with you and calls you the next morning saying she had herpes; from a PR point a view this was a horrible choice by CCP and, worse yet, anyone on the PS3 community would've told you that they've been burned enough by FPS studios whether it was MAG before and Dust now; they have faith but no belief in their prayers being answered and this stuff only verifies it more.
Legion would've been more welcome IF Dust was not only more functional of a game but did the basic and core mechanics properly. If Dust was a successful game players on the PS3 would've said "who cares about Legion because Dust is a great game why would I even buy Legion if they offered it on the PS3/4". That's where the sense of animosity lives and why players are vilifying CCP.
I play on the PC and the PS3 and the communities are very different. I had someone come into my workplace and he wrote in his applicate "I Light To Wurk and Talkative". Yes...that was his sentence he wrote down word for word. That's about how ******** CCP has handled everything. Frankly whoever their PR person is, they're doing a pretty bad job as well as a whole set of others.
For PC gamers the best lesson in how CCP could've handled this they need only have copied what Square-Enix did with FF14; it was rated as one of the worse releases of an mmo in recent history. But they, SE, believed in the game and did everything to fix it and the people they selected did deliver on everything. And they went on to make another blockbuster in Laura Croft. I bring it up because its not impossible for CCP to have done the same; frankly someone already laid the foundation on how to recover from making bad games. They just chose to ignore it and that's unforgivable. |
Shion Typhon
Intara Direct Action
Caldari State
611
|
Posted - 2014.05.04 10:46:00 -
[79] - Quote
I'm sorry, there's so many different arguments to be had here its hard to decide which one. Let me just focus on my largest piece of skepticism.
On a purely technical level going to PC is the right move, it is the most expansive easily evolving system to run a big persistent game on. I played Planetside 2 on PC and I can't imagine playing it on a PS4. (That said I can understand why console owners want a side-by-side platform model).
HOWEVER ...
Dust was developed by a bunch of incompetents, forget the platform and it's shortcomings, this is on top of that. The game is NOT good, it sucks gigantic donkey dongers, and most of this is due to game design choices, not memory limits.
So here we have the same studio that made Dust being responsible for Legion. I have no faith that these people are going to deliver anything but Dust HD with all the same fail but now with burning trees. Alternatively, it's a completely different game that fails in a hundred different ways because none of its developers understand FPSes.
They have the same number of people (or less with part of the studio maintaining Dust on life support). They have a cobbled together tech demo and haven't decided on how the game will work exactly (Vision). Then they are promising to go from concept to full game in a year(ish).
WHAT COULD POSSIBLY GO WRONG!!!!
Sure, the idea of Legion is great but so was Dust. Historical evidence suggests 90% chance of abject failure, 10% chance of success. So what I'm basically saying is that you guys need to manage your expectations into the pavement like a jumper from the 30th floor.
Don't sit in Dust for a year grinding SP in the idiotic hope that the mothership will arrive to beam you aboard and tell you that you've chosen to fight the Kodan Armada. Assume failure, go play 3-4 other real FPSes to give yourself some perspective, don't give them any money, then come back in a year when/if it's released and make a judgement if this new game deserves your time. |
Karl Koekwaus
220
|
Posted - 2014.05.04 11:02:00 -
[80] - Quote
Aeon Amadi wrote:DeeJay One wrote:Aeon, you don't get it do you?
I'm not mad that Legion is coming to PC, I'm mad how CCP handled Dust at Fanfest. There was zero mention of Dust on all of the presentations. They have no roadmap on keeping Dust alive until Legion comes. Rouge and Praetorian put all their cards on an alpha, giving the current Dust community nothing. They were making stuff up on the go as to character transfer. All the presentations were labeled "Dust 514" but all of them were about Project Legion. That's like you'd go to watch the EVE keynote and the entire keynote was about Valkyrie and no real EVE keynote was coming.
They may talk about keeping Dust alive, but the fact is they didn't have anything prepared for Fanfest which would assure us of that. Rouge himself told us to wait a few weeks (weeks!) before we get more information on that - this means they did nothing but Legion in the last months, not even thinking about Dust... Oh, I get it full and well because it's being repeated by everyone in every amount of flowery language that somehow led it different. It's pretty clear, ifs simple, CCP screwed up their presentation and console players feel alienated with more or less all players feeling betrayed. I TOTALLY GET THAT. But, we've got to move forward. We can't get stuck up on 100% development on the PS3 because it is an aging console that never should have had Dust in the first place. And no, they didn't just "make up" the character transfer bit as they went along. There's more that goes on then people realize and it's certainly easy to assume things from the stream or recorded videos but I'm telling you that it's not the case. Likely my final comment here as many people are just repeating the same thing at this point. That and I have a plane to catch.
I'm going to like every single on of your posts in this thread, because it is exactly how I think about it too. I don't get why people want the game on a $400 Console, but not on a $400 PC though. Just for some arbitrary rule they set for themselves that they're 'console' gamers and should not get a PC.
http://www.digitaltrends.com/computing/how-to-build-your-own-steam-box/#!H9yx6 PC gaming, for Console prices.
Micheal Jackson died for my sins
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Lucrezia LeGrand
Sentinels of New Eden
534
|
Posted - 2014.05.04 18:24:00 -
[81] - Quote
Karl Koekwaus wrote:Aeon Amadi wrote:DeeJay One wrote:Aeon, you don't get it do you?
I'm not mad that Legion is coming to PC, I'm mad how CCP handled Dust at Fanfest. There was zero mention of Dust on all of the presentations. They have no roadmap on keeping Dust alive until Legion comes. Rouge and Praetorian put all their cards on an alpha, giving the current Dust community nothing. They were making stuff up on the go as to character transfer. All the presentations were labeled "Dust 514" but all of them were about Project Legion. That's like you'd go to watch the EVE keynote and the entire keynote was about Valkyrie and no real EVE keynote was coming.
They may talk about keeping Dust alive, but the fact is they didn't have anything prepared for Fanfest which would assure us of that. Rouge himself told us to wait a few weeks (weeks!) before we get more information on that - this means they did nothing but Legion in the last months, not even thinking about Dust... Oh, I get it full and well because it's being repeated by everyone in every amount of flowery language that somehow led it different. It's pretty clear, ifs simple, CCP screwed up their presentation and console players feel alienated with more or less all players feeling betrayed. I TOTALLY GET THAT. But, we've got to move forward. We can't get stuck up on 100% development on the PS3 because it is an aging console that never should have had Dust in the first place. And no, they didn't just "make up" the character transfer bit as they went along. There's more that goes on then people realize and it's certainly easy to assume things from the stream or recorded videos but I'm telling you that it's not the case. Likely my final comment here as many people are just repeating the same thing at this point. That and I have a plane to catch. I'm going to like every single on of your posts in this thread, because it is exactly how I think about it too. I don't get why people want the game on a $400 Console, but not on a $400 PC though. Just for some arbitrary rule they set for themselves that they're 'console' gamers and should not get a PC. http://www.digitaltrends.com/computing/how-to-build-your-own-steam-box/#!H9yx6 PC gaming, for Console prices.
jeez, how many times do people have to hear this. We DO want legion on PC. We would have been happy with Dust on PC. But we also want it on PS4 because we're console gamers and not all of us want to spend the time or have the know-how to try and build a nice fancy computer when we can just buy a PS4 and sleep well knowing we will have NO compatibility issues with all PS4 games from now to kingdom come! I don't want to be worrying if the next version of the next hyped game will have to be run on medium settings because I don't have a fast enough graphics card.
It has nothing to do with some "arbitrary" rule. Btw, we're cool with there being a PC port of the game we love because "more players!!!" but we don't want to be left out of the loop because "oh sorry, no console." Also, my money is limited. I would rather buy a 400 ps4 than an 800 dollar pc, especially since I have a laptop that does everything I need from a PC right now.
Thale groupie (not the gun, but the man).
My other car is Utena.
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Aeon Amadi
Edimmu Warfighters
Gallente Federation
5596
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Posted - 2014.05.05 23:50:00 -
[82] - Quote
Bendtner92 wrote:
Yes, Dust won't see any progress on a bad console as the PS3, I know that, everyone else knows that, but crapping on most of your players that's been sticking with them on this terrible game by going to PC instead of PS4 is just disrespectful to your players. You keep saying PS4 isn't ruled out for sometime in the far future, but honestly I don't care about that. They've chosen to go to PC first leaving their current players behind and because of that I really hope the terrible Shanghai studio (because you know it's going to be same bad devs developing Legion right?) fucks Legion up. The Dust players are not interested in waiting 3-4+ years to see Legion on the PS4 only to be 2nd grade citizens behind CCP's beloved EVE players.
It doesn't make any sense at all to start with PS4 first when it's on similar architecture as the PC, especially given the level of accessibility but it doesn't even matter: Who cares which one comes first as long as the game is functional, awesome and applied to as many potential players as possible? Do you think they sat down with a bunch of PS3's, jacked some keyboards into them and designed Dust 514 on a PS3, for PS3? No, that's not how things work. And assuming that Eve players have some kind of priority simply because it's coming on the PC first is the diarrhea of arguments, dude, just saying. Like, tin foil hattery extreme.
I said it before, I'll say it again: Last year they made a bunch of promises they couldn't deliver, people got angry. Parts of that team (including Brandon Laurino who said "soon not TM") were let go and replaced with people that weren't going to make that mistake. Instead, they opt to not promise anything unless they're 100% sure it can happen...... and people get angry. It's a huge contradiction to be angry about both.
Lucrezia LeGrand wrote:
jeez, how many times do people have to hear this. We DO want legion on PC. We would have been happy with Dust on PC. But we also want it on PS4 because we're console gamers and not all of us want to spend the time or have the know-how to try and build a nice fancy computer when we can just buy a PS4 and sleep well knowing we will have NO compatibility issues with all PS4 games from now to kingdom come! I don't want to be worrying if the next version of the next hyped game will have to be run on medium settings because I don't have a fast enough graphics card.
It has nothing to do with some "arbitrary" rule. Btw, we're cool with there being a PC port of the game we love because "more players!!!" but we don't want to be left out of the loop because "oh sorry, no console." Also, my money is limited. I would rather buy a 400 ps4 than an 800 dollar pc, especially since I have a laptop that does everything I need from a PC right now.
They never, ever, EVER said "no console" and people are propagating that as a rumor or are knowingly trolling. Read above. If anything, going to PC just makes it easier to step into the PS4 because all they have to do is tune some dials as opposed to strip everything down to it's basest fabric just so that it can run on the PS3. It doesn't make sense to go to PS4 -first- for a variety of reasons. Like I said above, PC is more accessible and considering that there are 60-80 million PC gamers out there (some articles suggest 100+) as opposed to the 8-10 million PS4's, I think it's pretty obvious who you'd want to be beta testing this thing to make sure it works.
EDIT: Let alone the fact that any updates/patches have to go through Sony - which drastically slows down how fast changes can be made.
Useful Links
//forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=133588
//forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=134182
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Kigurosaka Laaksonen
DUST University
Ivy League
966
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Posted - 2014.05.06 00:09:00 -
[83] - Quote
Aeon Amadi wrote:More meaningful character progression...
This character progression looks less like EVE. Something I'm not a fan of.
DUST 514 Recruit Code - https://dust514.com/recruit/zluCyb/
EVE Buddy Invite - Too damn long. Ask me for it.
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low genius
The Sound Of Freedom
Dirt Nap Squad.
1765
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Posted - 2014.05.06 00:10:00 -
[84] - Quote
Kigurosaka Laaksonen wrote:Aeon Amadi wrote:More meaningful character progression... This character progression looks less like EVE. Something I'm not a fan of.
it looks like battlefield bad company.
eatsbabies cienfuegos
steward of the renegade alliance.
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Aeon Amadi
Edimmu Warfighters
Gallente Federation
5598
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Posted - 2014.05.06 00:18:00 -
[85] - Quote
Kigurosaka Laaksonen wrote:Aeon Amadi wrote:More meaningful character progression... This character progression looks less like EVE. Something I'm not a fan of.
IMO, it's a lot better than this '1-5' stuff, mostly since a lot of the skills had no effect or had a near useless effect despite extremely high SP costs (5% reduction on PG for a scrambler pistol, for instance). That and nyxxing the power levels needed to happen ages ago (they're actually doing this with modules/turrets now in Eve Online) since advanced/prototype gear just ruins the game. It's more focused on specialization and generalization rather than "I've been here longer than you so I'm better." We've wanted tieracide for a while and by removing those sort of aspects, protostomping is a non-factor.
Useful Links
//forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=133588
//forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=134182
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Michael Arck
Onuoto Uakan Huogaatsu
Lokun Listamenn
4294
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Posted - 2014.05.06 00:27:00 -
[86] - Quote
First of all, nice constructive OP.
And also, I give you much credit for that post. I have been peeved by the community lately. Since I joined these forums, I've seen nothing but QQs every step of the way.
I myself was a bit taken back by the Dust keynote at first. I couldn't believe it but then being me, I looked on the brighter side. I saw the "MQ" screen, if you will, and then it just hit me. They could do it ten times better on PC.
Then when they launched in game, seeing the environment that had that same gray, grainy, dark and desolate feel to it of a sci fi shooter, I knew I wanted to be a part of it and play it. It reminded me of when I first signed up for Dust and how the environment imposed upon me a feeling that I can't exactly put into words to describe. But it matched the lore I read about New Eden perfectly.
Of course I can be mad at CCP. But I choose not to. Cause when it gets down to it, Dust is a memorable experience and one of my favorite FPS titles that I've played. If putting it on PC means that their vision can be more realized and fleshed out, then by all means I will support it.
Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu.
Are you OUKH?
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Soozu
5o1st
192
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Posted - 2014.05.06 00:47:00 -
[87] - Quote
Ydubbs81 RND wrote:Aeon Amadi wrote:Ydubbs81 RND wrote:DUST Fiend wrote:Ydubbs81 RND wrote:The problem is....CCP never had plans on leaving the ps3. How can a company of pc game designers not know that the ps3 was aging. In their own words, they were "laser focused on the ps3".
What does that tell you? How do you know they never had plans to leave PS3? Because they didn't tell you? People take things far too literally. So the guy used the wrong words, wow, oh no. At the time, maybe they were. Maybe they weren't. All I know is that the game we were all sold on, is Legion, not DUST. DUST helped to build Legion, and I'm ok with that. Here's hoping Legion gets the green light because it's the game DUST was always supposed to be. I also find it funny how in one post, you say they had no plans to leave the PS3, yet in the very next post, you say you expected ("wouldn't mind") it to go to the PS4. So, which is it? If you want a PS4 port, you should be PUSHING for Legion, since it will be easier for them to port AND be higher quality. Wait...that doesn't make sense to you? I expected it to go to the ps4 but CCP burned my expectations when they said they were laser focused on the ps3. Not sure if I can write that clearer. I'm not pushing for anything that isn't going to be on the playstation (3 or 4). I'm not a pc gamer...so why would I push it for the pc?? Because it'll be easier to port for ps4 doesn't mean that they will port it to the ps4. If they announced that Legion will be on the ps4, then I would have been glad. But placing it on a platform that I don't play..doesn't benefit me at all. That's just the thing though man. They WILL NOT announce it unless they are POSITIVE they can do it. And in order to do it, they need more than just a tech demo and so far it's still up in the air as to whether or not that's the case. Beyond that, All these rumors that Sony is backing out are just plain dumb because they have Valkyrie in line for the PS4 and Morpheus. They never ruled out PS4, they never said it would never occur, just that right now they have a prototype (and they're not bullfighting about it being a prototype, it's pretty darn flippant) and they want to make sure it works before they make any kind of promises they can't keep. So, you're saying that I should have hope in CCP?
He's running a personal PR campaign, trying to flip the script.
"they want to make sure it works before they make any kind of promises they can't keep"
That whole paragraph suggests CCP has learned some valuable lesson recently and they are now a much better company. Elsewhere he blames employees who no longer work there. It is almost genius his timing and tactic, this horrible thing that we're screwing you on.... its a good thing a good thing a good thing. We didn't take your time or money on false pretense ... nope |
Hairy Butter
Fairy Fleet
98
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Posted - 2014.05.06 01:08:00 -
[88] - Quote
The main problem with Dust is framerate and resolution, the game is awesome fun.. no way we would ever get 1080p+ and 60fps on ps3, having people use all their time to try to optimize it for an inferior platform was horrible, Dust does so many things right that it was sad to have it on ps3 at this point. Good thing it will soon be on a less restrained platform.
It is kinda funny to have all these people whining about how horrible game dust is, then why be so emotionally attached to it? Because it gave us things other games did not, I got bored with Titanfall in a week, and went back to playing Dust, because for some ******* reason it was just more fun.
Current Dust build with 1080p and 60fps (and with better matchmaking + player market for faction gear) would be the best lobby shooter on the market. |
Aeon Amadi
Edimmu Warfighters
Gallente Federation
5601
|
Posted - 2014.05.06 02:25:00 -
[89] - Quote
Soozu wrote:
He's running a personal PR campaign, trying to flip the script.
"they want to make sure it works before they make any kind of promises they can't keep"
That whole paragraph suggests CCP has learned some valuable lesson recently and they are now a much better company. Elsewhere he blames employees who no longer work there. It is almost genius his timing and tactic, this horrible thing that we're screwing you on.... its a good thing a good thing a good thing. We didn't take your time or money on false pretense ... nope
Lmfao, sure - you can take it like that but here's the facts: The guy who promised MTACs, Speeders, Fighters, Titan Insertion and all that jazz? He's gone. You don't think there's a reason for that? Pure coincidence?
They -are- a much better company because they hired more than a dozen positions recently, with CCP Rouge and CCP Z being two -amazing- additions to the team that have completely polarized those previous intentions in favor of something awesome. Setting aside the console vs PC war, what we saw was gorgeous and the presentation discussed everything we've been asking for. What's not to love?
Even if you want to use the time/money argument, you really can't because they've already said that Character Transfer is a green light. Your time won't be meaningless, your money likely refunded or transmuted into something of similar value. So what's the problem?
Useful Links
//forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=133588
//forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=134182
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DUST Fiend
The Wings of Legion
14080
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Posted - 2014.05.06 02:31:00 -
[90] - Quote
Aeon Amadi wrote:Soozu wrote:
He's running a personal PR campaign, trying to flip the script.
"they want to make sure it works before they make any kind of promises they can't keep"
That whole paragraph suggests CCP has learned some valuable lesson recently and they are now a much better company. Elsewhere he blames employees who no longer work there. It is almost genius his timing and tactic, this horrible thing that we're screwing you on.... its a good thing a good thing a good thing. We didn't take your time or money on false pretense ... nope
Lmfao, sure - you can take it like that but here's the facts: The guy who promised MTACs, Speeders, Fighters, Titan Insertion and all that jazz? He's gone. You don't think there's a reason for that? Pure coincidence? They -are- a much better company because they hired more than a dozen positions recently, with CCP Rouge and CCP Z being two -amazing- additions to the team that have completely polarized those previous intentions in favor of something awesome. Setting aside the console vs PC war, what we saw was gorgeous and the presentation discussed everything we've been asking for. What's not to love? Even if you want to use the time/money argument, you really can't because they've already said that Character Transfer is a green light. Your time won't be meaningless, your money likely refunded or transmuted into something of similar value. So what's the problem?
I will still push for MTACs in the distant future, because...I mean come on..how badass is that?
But, we have MUCH bigger fish to fry before that should even be considered as anything more than a concept.
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Skylight Atoma
The Phoenix Federation
Caps and Mercs
6
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Posted - 2014.05.06 04:17:00 -
[91] - Quote
Sorry for a long post and some personal rants. I would rather just add to a thread than making my own that would just take up more space.
As an EVE player it's important to me to feel involved with CCP's design process and to see their thought process behind their changes to the game. I'm 100% looking forward to Legion. Being primarily a PC gamer I don't share the same concerns as primarily console gamers and I was hoping the day would come that DUST went to the PC.
The problem for me is how little CCP DUST seems to take our feedback seriously (and apparently the CSM as well, referencing Logibro's blog about the announcement of Legion) AND how little they converse with us in spite of the mantra "we want to develop this game with you."
Some examples
- The reign of the so-called "NASCAR tanks." Patches up to 1.7 were more frequent, and while I'm not saying it was bad on CCP to have 3+ months between 1.7 and 1.8, I can't remember any dev reply to the constant complaining of nearly invincible tanks. I know people who quit over this (some people will quit over the smallest things, but I digress) and there was no recognition of us telling CCP that tanks were taking the fun out of the game and that it was almost impossible to kill them without spamming your own tanks. I knew things would change eventually, but as an infantry player I pretty much stopped playing pub matches after awhile. They didn't even address tanks when 1.8 came out, that came with a smaller patch some time after.
- Leading up to the 1.8 patch there was a lot of negative feedback with the Amarr Scout suit, even before the announcements of the new racial suits dev blog. Not only are the bonuses underwhelming (and I don't just mean in comparison to other scout suits), it is slower than a Minmatar Assault suit. While it is a scout suit and still benefits from a lower scan profile, it is by far the weakest one for combat since the STRAFE speed is slower than a minmatar assault suit, and strafing is the primary way a scout stays alive in a firefight. In principle, why should a light suit be slower than a medium suit before modules like armor plates?
^ I think it's useful to compare this to the negative feedback of the caldari assault bonuses. That can be chalked up to a difference in design preference, whereas I can't think of a situation where an Amarr Scout suits excels in any gameplay other than cross-country running, but even then the base stamina is so high on all scout suits that you shouldn't ever run into stamina issues because installations are close enough on most maps. Players have made the argument "just put some kinetic catalyzers to make it faster than a minmatar assault", but why should you be forced to use modules (one that isn't that cheap in terms of SP either) just to be at a point where you should have already been at compared to similar suits, and still be at a disadvantage in other areas that matter more?
- The pre-reqs for assault/logi suits used to be medium frames 5, then shortly after release it was changed to 3. It took almost 1 year for players who were required to spend 1mil SP to get a racial medium suit from 3 -> 5 so they could get into assault/logi suits to get that wasted SP back. Apparently the CPM had to do a lot of convincing just to get a dropsuit respec with 1.8, and there was no reason given about WHY it was just a dropsuit respec when there was considerable support asking for a full infantry respec as well. That announcement was tagged onto the end of a dev blog and to me it was worded as if it were an afterthought or out of reluctance.
- You have the CPM telling CCP not to announce Legion at fanfest because it will be a train wreck, yet they do so anyways and (putting on tinfoil hat) have a bunch of events and AUR promotions leading up to fanfest. (No i'm not one of those people saying "money is bad" but it makes you wonder what they are thinking with this strategy)
- The Legion keynote was exciting yet underwhelming, and next to nothing was said about DUST when it was titled as a DUST keynote. I get that Legion is the future, but even Saberwing said something long the lines of "wait a few weeks and we might tell you some plans for DUST." Either these people are people are god awful at PR, or they don't want to tell us things that they know will cause more people to leave DUST. I really don't like to just state the extremes of situations, but I'm struggling to find middle ground with what we are being given.
WIthout being too doom and gloom, I see this division of CCP going on with their own vision of the game, yet disregarding their player base while telling us we have a say in the future of the game. I invested into DUST to have it become the dream that was shown as Legion, not DUST as it is now. Now that I know DUST will not be changing a whole lot fundamentally to resemble Legion, and have been shown that our opinions don't matter a whole lot, I don't want to support DUST anymore. I'm sad and frustrated because I have personally invested a lot into this project between buying AUR, the 10th anniversary edition, and a PS3 primarily for DUST. |
Kigurosaka Laaksonen
DUST University
Ivy League
970
|
Posted - 2014.05.06 12:35:00 -
[92] - Quote
Aeon Amadi wrote:Kigurosaka Laaksonen wrote:Aeon Amadi wrote:More meaningful character progression... This character progression looks less like EVE. Something I'm not a fan of. IMO, it's a lot better than this '1-5' stuff, mostly since a lot of the skills had no effect or had a near useless effect despite extremely high SP costs (5% reduction on PG for a scrambler pistol, for instance). That and nyxxing the power levels needed to happen ages ago (they're actually doing this with modules/turrets now in Eve Online) since advanced/prototype gear just ruins the game. It's more focused on specialization and generalization rather than "I've been here longer than you so I'm better." We've wanted tieracide for a while and by removing those sort of aspects, protostomping is a non-factor.
Our interpretations of EVE-like are different, then.
The problem with DUST's 1-5 is that it's half assed. EVE's 1-5 works great. With incredibly few exceptions (Tactical Shield Manipulation may or may not ever be worth training to 5, depending on who you speak to) there's a reason and a benefit for taking any level to 5. Whether or not it's worth the time spent on taking it to 5 is another story.
'nyxxing the power levels' - I completely agree this MLT / STD / ADV / PRO and basic / enhanced / complex tiers are garbage. Then you mention that module tiericide is planned for EVE's future. Let's be clear. The MLT - PRO tier system is DUST is nothing like the current modules in EVE. DUST's tiers are garbage. EVE's system might not be incredibly flexible in the choice it offers, but it still offers choice, and module tiericide will improve that. One of the KEY differences is that DUST is tiered by skill level. Within the Tech 1 group in EVE (M0 - M4) the skill reqs don't change.
By making DUST more like EVE, protostomping is a non-factor.
DUST 514 Recruit Code - https://dust514.com/recruit/zluCyb/
EVE Buddy Invite - Too damn long. Ask me for it.
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meri jin
Goonfeet
Special Planetary Emergency Response Group
961
|
Posted - 2014.05.06 13:16:00 -
[93] - Quote
@Aeon Amadi
I can't find panels related to Project Legion from the FanFest. Are they even there? Did really no one recorded?
R.I.P. Dust514 02 May 2014
EVE United
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Asha Starwind
888
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Posted - 2014.05.06 13:40:00 -
[94] - Quote
Just wanted to point out that one of the dev's let it slip (I say this because that particular post/thread has seem to have vanished), to paraphrase "...that Legion receiving a no-go at this stage is highly unlikely...". Saying that legion may not be even a thing means you are either na+»ve or blindly ignorant or both, I mean why else would they reveal and do this to the community.
If someone wants to dig up that post or remembers it, I believe the OP asked in the event that legion receives the red light what happens to DUST.
But yeah legion at this point should not be considered as an 'if' let alone an 'IF.'
[center] [/center]
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Shion Typhon
Intara Direct Action
Caldari State
637
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Posted - 2014.05.06 13:40:00 -
[95] - Quote
Kigurosaka Laaksonen wrote:
Let's be clear. The MLT - PRO tier system is DUST is nothing like the current modules in EVE. DUST's tiers are garbage. EVE's system might not be incredibly flexible in the choice it offers, but it still offers choice, and module tiericide will improve that. One of the KEY differences is that DUST is tiered by skill level. Within the Tech 1 group in EVE (M0 - M4) the skill reqs don't change.
.
Holy f%#Gé¼ING mother of god! The first person I have seen post on these forms that gets it.
+1 sir |
Gaurdian Satyr
Glitched Connection
257
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Posted - 2014.05.06 13:50:00 -
[96] - Quote
The only, ONLY, comment o have to say is about the console points
In still see people on the regular Xbox (remember the black one? Before 360)
Ive seen people on PS2 online
Just because its a older console doesnt mean its a dead unused console
The game can still THRIVE on PS3
But CCP wants to keep putting out crap code so the PS3 cant handle it all
They will start frying PS3s with their code
They just to get someone that can...organize?....their code so that it can work
CCP makes me physically ill
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Gaurdian Satyr
Glitched Connection
257
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Posted - 2014.05.06 13:52:00 -
[97] - Quote
meri jin wrote:@Aeon Amadi
I can't find panels related to Project Legion from the FanFest. Are they even there? Did really no one recorded?
Look at the dust keynote...its ALL legion
CCP makes me physically ill
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Aeon Amadi
Edimmu Warfighters
Gallente Federation
5613
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Posted - 2014.05.06 16:48:00 -
[98] - Quote
Gaurdian Satyr wrote:meri jin wrote:@Aeon Amadi
I can't find panels related to Project Legion from the FanFest. Are they even there? Did really no one recorded? Look at the dust keynote...its ALL legion
Well, yeah, it's the next evolution for Dust 514. It's a name to separate Dust 514 on the PS3 and Legion on the PC. Either way it's still dropsuits shooting other dropsuits in New Eden. So what's the premise here?
Useful Links
//forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=133588
//forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=134182
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Joel II X
Dah Gods O Bacon
2504
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Posted - 2014.05.06 16:57:00 -
[99] - Quote
Yeah, I tried going back yesterday, but I quit 5 minutes into the match. Mostly because of RND tank spam, but whatever.
I'm keeping my character in hopes that I might transfer over to Legion and if it moves to the PS4.
I want to play it, but I'm not going to go out of my way to do it like I did with Dust... sorta. Not really.
CCP needed to be honest with the community first and foremost. They've failed to that simple task. That's why everybody is mad. I'm not mad, I'm just slightly disappointed. |
Aeon Amadi
Edimmu Warfighters
Gallente Federation
5622
|
Posted - 2014.05.06 18:01:00 -
[100] - Quote
Joel II X wrote:Yeah, I tried going back yesterday, but I quit 5 minutes into the match. Mostly because of RND tank spam, but whatever.
I'm keeping my character in hopes that I might transfer over to Legion and if it moves to the PS4.
I want to play it, but I'm not going to go out of my way to do it like I did with Dust... sorta. Not really.
CCP needed to be honest with the community first and foremost. They've failed to that simple task. That's why everybody is mad. I'm not mad, I'm just slightly disappointed.
Totally not self aggrandizing but here's an article I wrote before I went to fanfest: http://dustnews24.com/2014/04/15/fanfest-2014-the-future-of-dust-514/
Useful Links
//forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=133588
//forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=134182
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DAMIOS82
WarRavens
Final Resolution.
93
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Posted - 2014.05.07 19:17:00 -
[101] - Quote
As a PC elite, i'm all for it going to the PC, not only is it long over due, but imo it is indeed the better platform to start of with. The sky is the limit on pc, both graphic wise and memory wise, thus giving the game a better chance to evolve. I also do believe once beta is done it should be ported to ps4 or ps5 by that time for the console gamers, but first pc.
My concerns however is that i've been playing since beta and went thru that process of the game changing every week. Now it took them two years to implement the suits, the skill tree changed i think 3 times in those 2 years, vehicle's became less and less, and my inventory is so full that it lags my game. And when i look at legion, yes the graphics are better, yes we finally have the market and pve and yes we will have better maps. But to me it just looks like all ccp has done is run around the same circle in the last two years, meaning nothing really new is there. They fire people and the next lot comes in with there own idea's over the same concepts. So in my eyes all they have done is put some of the stuff in, that was meant to be there since early beta.
When we port over to Legion (for me the sooner they start with alpha/beta testing, the better) is the game finally going to evolve into what we all want it to be or are they going to continue going over the same things, but nothing really changing the game.
In other words once we are playing legion, will we offcourse in time, see forests, city's, more and better vehicle's, etc. or is the next two years going to be with every expansion; 'yeah guys we changed the skill tree again' and the next time again the same story, etc. That is my concern, am i with so many others going to waist another two years on a game that does not evolve. |
Aeon Amadi
Edimmu Warfighters
Gallente Federation
5625
|
Posted - 2014.05.08 00:21:00 -
[102] - Quote
DAMIOS82 wrote:As a PC elite, i'm all for it going to the PC, not only is it long over due, but imo it is indeed the better platform to start of with. The sky is the limit on pc, both graphic wise and memory wise, thus giving the game a better chance to evolve. I also do believe once beta is done it should be ported to ps4 or ps5 by that time for the console gamers, but first pc.
My concerns however is that i've been playing since beta and went thru that process of the game changing every week. Now it took them two years to implement the suits, the skill tree changed i think 3 times in those 2 years, vehicle's became less and less, and my inventory is so full that it lags my game. And when i look at legion, yes the graphics are better, yes we finally have the market and pve and yes we will have better maps. But to me it just looks like all ccp has done is run around the same circle in the last two years, meaning nothing really new is there. They fire people and the next lot comes in with there own idea's over the same concepts. So in my eyes all they have done is put some of the stuff in, that was meant to be there since early beta.
When we port over to Legion (for me the sooner they start with alpha/beta testing, the better) is the game finally going to evolve into what we all want it to be or are they going to continue going over the same things, but nothing really changing the game.
In other words once we are playing legion, will we offcourse in time, see forests, city's, more and better vehicle's, etc. or is the next two years going to be with every expansion; 'yeah guys we changed the skill tree again' and the next time again the same story, etc. That is my concern, am i with so many others going to waist another two years on a game that does not evolve.
Bear in mind the stuff we saw at Fanfest was created in three weeks (the gameplay video). Just as well, it being on PC means they don't have to submit anything to Sony's QA which was a multi-week process, with Legion it'd be streamlined and they could make rapid iterations and see the cause/effect much quicker, allowing them to respond faster as well.
All in all it's just... better overall.
Useful Links
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DAMIOS82
WarRavens
Final Resolution.
95
|
Posted - 2014.05.08 02:18:00 -
[103] - Quote
I really hope so. I've watched a few more fanfest streams and it does all look promising. |
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